IT Employment

When a co-worker attempts a coup

What do you do when a co-worker is planning a coup over your boss? This is the situation that faces one employee.

In the movie The Caine Mutiny, there is a character named Lt. Thomas "Tom" Keefer, who is played by Fred MacMurray. Keefer is always in Lt. Steve Maryk's (Van Johnson) ear about how they need to overthrow their crazy-ass ship commander, Lt. Cmdr. Philip Francis Queeg (Humphrey Bogart). After Keefer starts the wheels in motion, however, he pulls his support out, fearing career repercussions.

That scenario is a lot different from the normal workplace, in that lives depended on the actions of the superior in that situation. But sometimes the machinations and politics behind the dissatisfaction with a boss can be comparable.

Case in point: I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, and she told me that one of her co-workers was taking steps to overthrow their boss. The "insurgent" is taking action with the excuse that their boss is incompetent. She's gone to HR and unrolled a plan for reorg that would "benefit the company," although it's obvious that the changes will really only benefit the person proposing them.

My friend disagrees with the assessment about their boss. She believes the boss is quite competent, just not as forceful as the employee would like him to be. My friend thinks the insurgent is just ambitious and is looking for a way to climb the corporate ladder at someone else's expense.

I question the fact that someone in HR wouldn't first recommend that the employee go to her manager with the ideas. But from what I hear, HR seems to be sold on the idea.

This is a sticky situation to say the least. What should my friend do? Alienate her small team by going to the boss and tipping him off? Should she voice her opinion to the mutineers that she doesn't agree (which is what she did)?

About

Toni Bowers is Managing Editor of TechRepublic and is the award-winning blogger of the Career Management blog. She has edited newsletters, books, and web sites pertaining to software, IT career, and IT management issues.

50 comments
bishopca
bishopca

I heard someone say, that a person said that someone in HR seems to be talking about going with this plan... Anyone every go to first grade? Remember the exercise where you whisper in each other's ear and the message gets completely turned around? You will never solve a problem with defining first. Yes, I know you think the action you took last week solved an undefined problem - start reading this comment again at the beginning.

robert.kowalke
robert.kowalke

I don't mind the reorg idea although what gets that person off is probably acting like an insurgent. Ideas that are fairly rationale should be considered. HR should be supporting the org chart though and not getting in the business of FEMA'ng the current org chart. FEMA'ng meaning alternate government organization usurping current government. People need to get these ideas out in the open for debate. It's easy to attack behind the scenes, but like the recent congressman on the 35 articles of impeachment, it is something else entirely to put the ideas/thoughts/recommendations out there for all to see and respond to. The worker should learn to be a good follower because it sounds like that worker will suck as a leader since they are not very good at following other leadership. Training is in store for that follower! lol

jsbell
jsbell

I've been through this. In the earliest phase of the battle, we had a boss whom everyone regarded as less than ideal. A partner of the firm told me that sometimes in this business you need to stab somebody in the back. He was offering me the post. I declined, on principle. I do not stab people in the back. Years later, this boss was replaced by someone much more competent. However, there was an insurgent. The new boss later regretted hiring the insurgent, because this person initiated a behind-the-scenes coup that ultimately got the new boss fired, out of the blue, for no apparent reason, causing him much unnecessary grief and anxiety. We had been a family, a team, and we were on track to accomplishing the extraordinary goals of the firm's visionary leadership (the partner who suggested I do the back stabbing thing). But we were taking too long, and when the insurgent became boss, things changed dramatically. It became like living in an Agatha Christie novel. One by one, we were keel-hulled, debased, degraded, put in fear, until we were too few in number to fight the ultimate weapon, outsourcing. The sad, funny thing is, I know from inside sources that the outside firm they brought in to replace us all hasn't a clue how to do what the leading partner wants to do. They have lost competency and energy and time to market, such that it will be some time before they recover, if at all, from this purely political exercise. I wish them well, but life does not have to be like that. My advice? If HR is buying into the insurgency, and you think it will make things worse, you should probably just start looking for another job. Unless HR and the mutineers are an aberration, the tide is going against you, and you should contemplate leaving while you still have your dignity. If you think its worth the fight, do your homework, and be sure you can make the case that your present boss's vision is what the company needs to succeed. Then dig in. They're using real bullets out there.

GoodOh
GoodOh

Did they Caine Mutiny people bring in the Supply Corps to cut the Captain off at the knees? NO. The agitator here has presented a plan to HR who has accepted it. Seems that HR are keen to dis-empower the alleged incompetent boss. The agitator is not going one-on-one with the boss. If she accumulated a bunch of other subordinates of this boss together and confronted the boss with a threat to resign en mass (or some other direct action) then we have a mutiny. So the analogy used at the start of the discussion is inappropriate. This could be seen as a diplomatic coup. And let's face it. The boss is sufficiently poorly thought of by some subordinates and by HR that it seems to have a chance of success. If the boss is also so disconnected and disrespected that the reorg could be progressed by HR without anyone whose job it is to tell the boss then the boss is a "dead man walking" anyway. If HR and Senior Management are going to reorg this boss out of job I'm going to suggest that Toni's friend's judgement on this boss is shared by so few important people Toni's friend needs to reconsider if maybe it's the friend who has it wrong. Anyway the writing and the presentation has so blurred the picture and mangled the story (of which we have been presented so little information we could never reach a meaningful judgement in any case) that all I would respond to Toni and her friend is "Take a deep breath, sit down and tell me all about it." At the end of a longer and better explanation and discussing why HR is joining in and why the senior people who need to approve the reorg might be going to join in 'kick the boss' then I'd suggest that Toni's friend is probably (on what has been presented) not equipped to play at this 'big boy' level where the game is played rough and consider a career option that puts the friend in a gentler environment where gentle sensibilities are not offended by the business world 'red in tooth and claw'.

mikifinaz1
mikifinaz1

Run fast as you can away from this situation.

Top.Gun
Top.Gun

I hate office politics. I would just do my job as always and try not to get involved. But, if this coup starts coming your way don't forget the old saying: look out for # 1 or else you'll be up to your neck in # 2.

guillenkma
guillenkma

Coup or coup d'????tat is defined as a sudden and decisive action in politics, esp. one resulting in a change of government illegally or by force. If a worker is attempting to "wrestle up" support, it is not a coup but rather a covert and subversive action. It MAY result in a coup but will likely be unsuccessful and WILL result in increasing distrust, creating lack of unity and decresing productivity. ALL BAD THINGS. Just STOP IT, do your work and don't play into the attempted action. It IS self defeating and will probably go by the wayside along with the employee (s) responsible.

scahill
scahill

I've seen it happen, not once but twice by the SAME person. Always the same tactic. Went above the head of his immediate boss, got his boss sacked and took over himself. Surrounded himself with his protective exclusion zone of sycophantic creeps and disposed of those whose faces he didn't like. I was a victim of this lowlife 4 years ago and honestly hope that what goes around comes around, and that he gets his deserving come-uppance for his underhand behaviour. I was an innocent victim of this person and have the ulcer to prove it. That's why I feel so strongly after all this time. It makes you wonder what motivates people like this to behave in such a manner, and how they can sleep at night.

reisen55
reisen55

I worked in a dedicated IT shop that one total idiot in-house. He was argumentative with clients (yelled at them), argumentative with the company (used to yell out load in public areas that the company itself was stupid - executive vice presidents overheard his remarks) and was far from a team player. He defended his dedicated floor as his own divine turf and any assistance for other tasks was argued about. True. He also played endless games of solitaire he was so angry at his job, user group and co-workers. He refused to change his attitude even as we attempted to tell him he was putting his job in jeopardy. Ultimately, one day he verbally attacked me in front of our entire group, and I had to lay him out on the floor in the coffee room. Then, I went to our boss and told him that my attempts at diplomacy failed. Within 24 hours, he was fired and walked out of the building, and later got into a Yahoo blog war with his colleagues on the message board area. Dealing with idiots not only involves management, but co-workers too.

mastertexan
mastertexan

I think I'd have to tell the manager. At the very least, go home and type, yes type, a letter or a memo to the manager and drop it in the company mail. This way you've given him a heads up but you've not done it openly so the mutineer shouldn't suspect it was you.

hog43
hog43

Answer: No. Michael Scott's boss called him immediately after she found out about Dwight's idea and told him to get his office under control. Dwight had to do Michael's laundry indefinitely.

sfogel
sfogel

I worked for a large corporate restaurant chain for many years and got to see that the HR department is there more to cover the company than help to make employees/managers feel good about their jobs. If the boss is a friend or a good person that you dont want to see treated badly then perhaps an anonymous note (since the high school games are already in play) would be the best way to alert him/her to the situation without having to declare a side. I, personally, would not want to work for a company that does not follow chain of command policies and would even consider taking an employees accusations over a manager that they have already supposedly vested in. Any company that does not stand behind their appointed management over someone who is at a lower command is not a company that i would feel comfortable working for.

tungstendiadem
tungstendiadem

The boss in question clearly does not have support within Human Resources. The mutineers do. The employee needs to strike while the iron is hot. Escalate the matter to senior management. Approach the situation from an objective position acknowledge the merits of the mutineers position while providing defensible argument in favor of keeping the boss. After the arguement plays out it is clear that the mutineers should win (clearly the unit members favor this course of action), however take the lead and replace the leader of the coup with yourself sending a clear message to the subordinates that while harmonious operations are desirable and managers can be replaced in favor of realizing them, people who undermine their superiors and act in insubordination will not be rewarded for destabilizing the work environment.

Dr_Zinj
Dr_Zinj

Actually the scenario in Mutiney isn't that different from the workplace. Lives do depend on the actions of the superior (manager and management), as well as the actions of the workers. People become mentally ill, go postal, etc. based on actions taken within offices. And adverse personnel actions are like boulders thrown in water, it makes waves that wash many shores in that it effects the families of the people who work there. I come from a military background, so I tend to err on the side of loyalty. Unless your boss is a blithering idiot or has committed a crime, you really owe him or her a heads up on the situation. If that's a problem, then see HR and discuss it with them. The problem with doing nothing is you're agreeing with whatever happens. You may be next; in which case proceeding to get a new job is the logical progression. Me, in the couple of cases where I've had an idiot, clueless boss, I've always found it better to seek a new job. The environment that allows the continued employment of an idiot is condusive to creating and maintaining more idiots usually can't be fixed from within that environment, it takes upper level management; and certainly not a healthy place to work.

mjd420nova
mjd420nova

Office politics is always the game that those who are incompetent will play. If you are a good worker, meets deadlines and gets the day to day work done without complaint, then you have nothing to fear. The boss that uses his/her power to further enhance their own position within the company will sooner or later step on the toes of a higher up manager or overstep their position and wind up getting their necks in a noose. Bide your time, refrain from the petty complaining to HR as they report to that same boss and they may see you as a threat and find a way or reason to terminate you or even make the job so unbearable that you quit. Any position has two representations to the management, either as an asset or a liablity. You can choose which you will be and that maynot be seen the same as the boss perceives it. Remember, the bosses are in the job to advance thier position regardless of how many pee-ons they have to step on while climbing higher on the ladder.

jdclyde
jdclyde

I would not want to be caught on the side of the mutineers, because I would not want to have to always watch my back for more of the same. Never trust a weasel.

lacyda3rd
lacyda3rd

All this on the basis of incompetence? Is the "incompentence" causing the company to loss money, clients, and productivity or is this just an subjective opinion by a few. I feel that it is wrong for employees to determine the demise of a superior manager. This does not exemplify a team atmosphere. A person's performance and competency should be up to their superior since they were involved in hiring them in the first place. Would one excecute a coup on your own parent because it was felt that they did not parent right? Or for that matter would one try to excercise a coup over your Pastor or Minister because you simply did not like what they preached though there was nothing wrong with it in the first place? Such actions should not be displayed in the workplace. There are certain protocols and steps that should be taken than just undermining tactics for personal gain. Sorry, did mean to come off strong but this is what I sense of the situation.

bboyd
bboyd

Record, note and CYA. Next order of business is a personal choice. This is an opportunity to take advantage of or a time to prepare a resume. Do you want to work for the offending party? If so take whatever comes and do not interfere. Doubt that is the desired outcome. So take the action up with...the bosses supervisor. The entanglement of the boss and insurgent is one that is best not becoming a middle man to. If the Boss is a personal friend a warning would be useful if you understand that it will elicit a positive reaction, not just a reaction. Anger does not provide solutions. The voiced opinion is good, but you need to provide a solid opinion not just emotional hand wringing. I personally hate office politics so good luck. Remember that mutineers hang more often than sail off to become wealthy pirates.

david.shane
david.shane

But that doesn't mean you have to play. Sometimes just doing your job and going home at the end of the day is the bast thing to do. You can never know who will end up being the boss at the end of this kind of struggle. And if not at the end of this struggle, what about at the end of the next? If this person fails to execute on their machinations this time, there must be a next time. Why risk offending anyone? The manager, the ambitious one and the HR staff are all adults. Even though they probably don't act like it. Responses like "I have a deadline to meet" or "I'm sorry but I have a personal matter to take care of so I need to finish this task" come to mind. And remember the 80-20 rule. 20 percent of the people do 80 percent of the work. If you're a 20 percenter, like me, you're job is pretty safe. Because no matter what happens, you're the one keeping the other 80 percent in their jobs. And at the end of the day you must be loyal to yourself first. If you don't take care of yourself, you can't help anyone else. The downside of being a 20 percenter is that the 80 percenters get the promotions, the bonuses and the recognition, we get the job done.

pwoodctfl
pwoodctfl

If this person hasn't talked to anyone else other than the coup orchestrator....she has only the point of view that the orchestrator wants to promote. Yes, the issue may be in HR, but not necessarily in the way the orchestrator wants it to be. The co-worker may be interpreting the fact that she wasn't thrown bodily out of the office as agreement, when it was more of a tactic by HR to elicit all the information about the situation and then take the matter back to the manager. If there really is a change contemplated, then something will have to be discussed with someone at sometime, so the best course is to wait and see. The co-worker may be blowing hot air and for all you know the manager is fully aware....and amused by the situation. If not, there will be plenty of time to explore options later.

sithomas
sithomas

Agreed. The act of 'confiding' in other people is intended to gain support. The side effect of which is to cause productivity problems in the workplace, and could lead to disciplinary action against all involved. It has already caused morale problems and is therefore bad for the company in the short term. Stay out of it, maintain your dignity and concentrate on your work.

larrybell_2000
larrybell_2000

Well in my unscientific count (I didn't actually count), the results from the preceding discussions are as follows: 49.4% Stay out of it 49.4% Tell the boss who is subject of the coup .2% Try to talk the mutineer out of his/her actions I think I would vote for the stay out of it, or stay out of it with an anonymous letter to the victim of the mutiny. Maybe the best solution can be found at this link: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Three_wise_monkeys_figure.JPG

Stewart Miller
Stewart Miller

These peoples are psychopaths. They have no morals and no conscious. It's always amazing how many people will suck up to these bullies, but it is a sure bet they will. You got to ask yourself what kind of company supports this kind of stuff and why they promot the mutineer.

tungstendiadem
tungstendiadem

If it helps people like that tend to make bad policy decisions and deliberately target for removal anyone whose competence remotely threatens their security in their position, and generally a sign of poor oversight in the organization and opportunity for competitors to capitalize on the firms weaknesses... at least in theory.

tungstendiadem
tungstendiadem

I am sure he hated working for a bunch of people he thought were nerds. He got what he had coming to him. You hit him?

tungstendiadem
tungstendiadem

It is always good to put any sort of potentially volatile communication in writing. It is more discrete and you can keep a record of it for yourself. Suppose you get blamed in the eyes of the manager as the bearer of bad news; some ostriches like their heads burried. Any way the situation turns out you still have a record of your communications regarding it, and avoided unnecessary attention. Good call.

coreycotton
coreycotton

I personally encourage you to expand your horizons beyond being a DBA. It seems rather clear that the leader of the coup is an opportunist. It is best for the company's sake (HR's sake) not to ignore this fact. Reminds me of the film "The Bank Job"... http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi4103405849/

sfogel
sfogel

That is probably the best advice anyone could have given.

GoodOh
GoodOh

I'm sorry but ''If you are a good worker, meets deadlines and gets the day to day work done without complaint, then you have nothing to fear." is the funniest thing I've heard for months. If only the world was really like that but you'd have to be exceptionally naive to actually believe it.

bettesrr
bettesrr

Block or stop the weasel one voice at a time, if necessary. If we are doing what is right for ourselves, our colleagues, and the company when we are caught as mutineers, then we courageously stand tall and continue to fight for righteousness. Is class action=mutiny? This is an interesting concept I am sure every corporate legal and human resources executive is aware. Remember according to law, if we (an employee) know someone is talking about, planning or doing activities to conspiracy against and upset the financial or functioning of the company, we are as guilty as the person doing the conspiring. So, really it is not about picking sides.

IC-IT
IC-IT

Never trust a weasel. Never weasel a trust.

bettesrr
bettesrr

Recently, due to various reasons of legal lawful protection, every employee has an obligation to be familiar with, understand, and observe Sabranes Oxley (SOX) and other documentation and security laws. There are no excuses for being around and knowing something without proper reporting. Without reporting, according to the law, one is just as guilty as if s/he had set it up. With this in mind, I refuse to give energy to those who do not follow company protocol in reporting (whatever that may be). For example, avenues to report any number of issues anonymously to the appropriate authority, i.e., security, facilities, human resources (they are to follow these unbiased laws also), and networking. For me, there is no excuse to know something that would potentially upset the company, and not report it appropriately. Thanks for the time to answer an eye opening question. Smiling regards, Bette Rose

JamesRL
JamesRL

First off, I would never assume that HR agrees with the proposal. HR reports to higher management, and it is more likely that they are drawing out the mutineer or playing along to get more information than agreeing. Going to the boss is risky, since if you do, you will be swept up onto a side in the battle, and if you aren't prepared to support the boss unconditionally, you will piss off both sides. As a manager, I can't keep my head down, but as a staff member, I would hope to. I can't conceive of one of the many places I've worked where this would be warmly accepted by senior management - the best the mutineers could get is the manager and themselves fired. James James

mdbizzarri
mdbizzarri

I think your friend should stick with her boss and/or her gut. Unfortunately the mutineer put everyone in a position to make one of 4 choices: Boss, mutineer, do nothing, get a new job. The first two choices are the hard road, and show one's fortitude, and loyalty. The other two are the easy road, and for people who are not looking to be in management. This is the classic example of fight or flight, in modern times. Someone will claim the position, and there will be victories, and casualties. Makes everyone fight a bit harder, since they have careers now on the line.

jperick.mbei
jperick.mbei

Yes and no. People who usually choose this route are either cowards, or simply selfish. They are afraid of risks that might come from their actions, and the best--and easiest they can do is indifference. They just sit and wait for the wind to head into one direction. Sadly, such attitudes have only helped deepen workplace corruption, abus of authority, misuse of corpoate resources, and so on. You sit and wait, hoping that someone else will do the dirty work so you can benefit from it. History is saturated with lessons. From the Civil Rights struggle when a small "negro" woman dared to believe in her inner power and to justice. She dared say "Enough is enough. No!" Close to us the Enron demise. Although companies we work for are private corporations, they are not less public. Moreover, most of these companies receive fat federal contracts and/or grants. If you witness a mess and simply manage/choose to close your eyes, mouth, and ears with your two hands, you are not helping your employer. Some of that mess can lead to Enron-like sagas. If the company goes flat, you and your job will, too.

reisen55
reisen55

Pardon me, bad phrase. I did not physically hit him but verbally took him apart in the coffee room, kindly away from my colleagues. Universally, he was hated across the company. By bad mouthing the company in front of and within earshot of EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT, he placed himself in instant jeopardy. And he did cute things like ghost a machine and not put any user data on it before returning it, those little endearing things. He has since been fired from several other jobs too. And he lives about 1/2 mile away from where I live.

tungstendiadem
tungstendiadem

Sometimes the best choice is the one not presented.

david.shane
david.shane

Actually everybody in Toni's senario sound like they need more work to do. The fact is that Toni's friend probably doesn't know everything that's going on. And getting involved will only detract from getting the work done. And isn't getting work done what we're paid to do? Or is it only me?

dklandry
dklandry

This isn't about picking a side its about doing what's right. If you fear repercussion from this person or you have an HR department that jumps on board so quickly then find another company to work for! I'm all for a fair fight and these back stabbing tactics are just pure cowardliness. I'd find a way either publicly or anonymously to let your boss know what's brewing and then let the chips fall where they may. If your boss isn't this incompetent person they will be able to end the coup and send the mutineer packing. If the mutineer wins then its survival of the fittest. Either way its a place I wouldn't want to survive in because its only a matter of time before another mutiny is at hand and you will be the unsuspecting person the target is pointed at. At some point in an adults life you'd think these high school tactics would be outdated!

Stewart Miller
Stewart Miller

By the way, Rosa Parks was not a stand up but a pure set up by her and her office. The same thing happened earlier in Baton Rouge by another but was totally ignored. So to be successful, it takes much orchestration and support. One is not required to correct a wrong if it is going to bring a terrible loss to themselves. On the other hand, if the wrong is going to hurt them also, they are not righting a wrong so much as protecting themselves. If others benefit, all the better. However, when one is dealing with peoples lives such as in an air traffic control situation, it is another matter. However, these whistle blowers get shot too. It takes a lot of support and good orchestration to pull this stuff off when it is deserved.

jperick.mbei
jperick.mbei

Toni, I don't admire your friend's (or your) situation. If any, I only admire it because it allows each of us to assess our own character. We need to remember one thing: While we are employees and have no authority to choose a boss, we are our respective company's primary asset (read The Customer Comes Second: Put Your People First and Watch 'em Kick Butt" of Hal F. Rosenbluth & D. McFerrin Peters [2002]). I am not taking sides here. My concern is this: Do those who suggest standing by and doing nothing, because you are paid to do the work and nothing more (human doing), do these friends know the damage that bad, pooor management has caused--and continued to cause on Corporate America? Corporate America used to be admired for its love of competence. Today, is not promoted the one who is the most talented, dedicated, but the one who supports bad/poor management, becasue the reward of such support is promotion, pay increase, and so on. I wish organizations spent as much time and money on people, as they spend on non-human asset! Senior management does not seem aware of wha treally happens downward. And becasue of this state of affairs, the only re-action, when things go really flat, is for them to re-organize, by moving bad apples to new territories when they just continue their trick. Now, do those who suggest taking sides with the mutineer have the real facts? Might be a two-person affair. If that is the case, not taking sides would be the wisest route to go. But if the manager is indeed incompetent, and so incompetent that the team morale is affected and by the same token productivity, then doing nothing is cowardiness. In either case, taking sides or not taking sides, is making a choice, and will have its consequences. In such situations, like a friend just said, doing what is RIGHT would probably best. It can help both the company and the affected group. At Enron, one brave lady had the courage to do what is right. You, too can. I wish your friend (or yourself) the best of luck! Poppi

arthur.bonilla
arthur.bonilla

what a great response. We should be working to maxamize and do "our" assigned position to the fullest. I didn't get hired to fix the entity i work at,but to do MY job to it's fullest. But there lies what some miss, That in the performance of YOUR particular job you DO change people around you with your professionalism, knowledge, ability to get the job done. Yes, your not changing the Whole entity but you can make damned sure no one can point in your direction and say it isn't "working in this department either. train your people, guide them correctly, pay them right and watch them grow. At least your section of the company should be bulletproof. I just survived a new employee "Admin officer" off the street try to take over My IT shop, the operations side of the house and she wound up moving on to another office with several EEO complaints hanging over her head, the cogs and wheels turn slow but they do grind.

kcordon
kcordon

Having been a manager that was ousted by a subordinate who was courting the CIO I would like to quote the English philosopher Edmund Burke who said, ?The only thing necessary for the triumph [of evil] is for good men to do nothing.? Not that what this person is doing is Evil, but I still say this.

rackerman
rackerman

I agree with dlandry... H-m-m Great culture to work in. The HR department doesn't even check in with the manager to look at all sides of the issue? What's up with that! Time to move on.

kagan_anna
kagan_anna

Yes, "Do what your own morals and ethics tell you. You won't have regrets about things later, no matter what the results might be." - thank you!

info
info

I know what you are going through, I've been there before. In one case, I was the manager who came back from my Father-in-law's out of state funeral to find my job in play. One of my team told me that he didn't want to be involved. I didn't like it, but I respected his choice to remain neutral. In the other position, I was asked by a friend to help replace the contractor that I was working for as a subcontractor. I told them that I felt an obligation to the people that I worked for and, while I wouldn't tell them anything said up till this point, I would tell my management anything said afterwards. What did I learn from all this? Do what your own morals and ethics tell you. You won't have regrets about things later, no matter what the results might be. Best of luck, just remember that positions come and positions go, but you have to live with yourself every day.

JamesRL
JamesRL

Its not most non-manager's roles or job to "fix the company". You don't have the authority or right to impose YOUR vision on the rest of the company, unless you have the approval from management. You or anyone below a boss should not be lobbying to remove a manager. If someone from HR or senior management asks you, you should be honest and professional and unemotional in your assessment, and focus on contructive points. James

djulson
djulson

Often times, that third party is also going to be the 'lame duck' afterwards. If your friend tells the boss(and the mutineers are not all fired for insubordination), then she will definitely find herself working in a black hole for quite some time. If she goes along with the mutineers, she should definitely be ready to find a new position without the aid of her bosses possibly glowing recommendation. This is a very sticky situation. She did exactly the right thing by not going along with the crowd. I applaud her for that. Now, sit back and see what happens by being the innocent bystander. Best of luck, Dan

MikeZane
MikeZane

There really are two questions that need to be answered. What is best for the company, and what is best for you as an employee. Those two answers combined will determine your next course of action. Do you really love your job and the company you are at so much that you are willing to fight hard to fix that company? Do you feel that the current manager is the right person for that position? Once you make your mind up, no looking back. Marshal your resources and get the job done. I was in a similar position at my office. I will tell you, it did not end well for me. The two who tried to overthrow my boss ended up on her good list and I ended up in the doghouse after trying to help out. I still have a job, but not much of a career. That's just how the chips fall sometimes. Mike

JamesRL
JamesRL

Frankly, there are times to speak up, and times to shut up. Piling on and adding your voice when you weren't either party to start with is rarely constructive and often destructive. The solutions have to come from the main actors. What third parties do is often just raise the tension and make it more difficult to resolve. Sometimes the best course fo action is to do nothing. James

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