Tablets

Speculating a major revision of the iPad

Patrick Gray discusses the criticism surrounding Apple's iPad releases, which include feature bumps rather than major updates. What would a major revision of the iPad look like?

Apple has taken some justifiable criticism as of late that each new device release is more of a refinement than a "magical and revolutionary" device. In the iPad line, the tablet has largely maintained its form factor, and each subsequent release adds some processing horsepower or screen resolution, making for more of a feature bump than major update. Even the long-anticipated iPad Mini was anticlimactic, delivering the long-expected smaller iPad but largely maintaining the same styling and features and forgoing the obvious addition of a high-resolution screen for a refresh down the road. If Apple were to embark on a major revision of the iPad, what might it look like?

X's and I's unite

One frequent area of speculation is that Apple would unify its desktop OS X and handheld iOS operating systems. Recent rumors even suggest Apple abandoning Intel processors in its desktops and laptops and adopting an ARM-based processor across all its devices. For those unfamiliar with the nuances of the platforms, ARM was designed from the ground up for low-power devices, making it ideal for smartphones, tablets, and laptops. Conversely, Intel's processors were originally designed for desktop usage, where power consumption was not even a consideration in the initial iterations of the processor.

While it might sound far-fetched to run a mobile processor and operating system on a desktop, Apple's initial Macintosh computers grew up on a similar processor architecture in the guise of Motorola and PowerPC chips, and the success of the MacBook Air and Windows-based ultrabooks shows a strong demand for longevity and portability.

Moving its desktops to ARM and a lighter-weight OS could push laptop runtimes into the dozens of hours, while maintaining the horsepower to run most common applications. It would also blur the lines among tablet, laptop, and desktop in a way that Microsoft is driving toward with Windows RT but far more rapidly since legacy support has rarely concerned Apple. If your desktop, laptop, and tablet lines all run the same OS, dropping your next iPad into a docking station and working with keyboard, mouse, and touch, then grabbing the device and using it as a traditional tablet seems like an obvious and compelling feature. This also delivers an obvious end run around Microsoft, who is still struggling to articulate its computing vision and has millions of users (and recurring revenue) tied to legacy applications and support.

Pushing hardware forward

With battery life being the primary design consideration for most tablets, we're not likely to see any major form factor changes in the devices themselves. However, I believe Apple has a trick up its sleeve with the new Lightning interface. Most of the noise around the Lightning interface has been about the challenges of purchasing new cables and adapters, but this interface is way more than charging. Lightning offers a high-speed digital interface, which makes a variety of Apple-branded ancillary hardware possible. With the combination of Apple's desktop and mobile OSs, a one-cable docking station or television interface puts significantly more capability into a device, while pushing piles of $40 adapters for everything from televisions to cameras.

With the success of pen-driven Android devices, we might also see a future iPad with pen input capability.  We can now touch and talk to our devices; being able to take notes and draw easily and naturally would further ingrain an Apple device into one's daily work and personal life.

I'm not privy to any insider information, but the increasingly organized competition in the tablet space seems to finally be affecting Apple. The iPad Mini is itself an acknowledgement that Apple needs to aim for a lower price point, and pricing pressure will only increase if the best Apple can do on each subsequent release is offer more processing power and a new way to charge the battery.

About

Patrick Gray works for a global Fortune 500 consulting and IT services company and is the author of Breakthrough IT: Supercharging Organizational Value through Technology as well as the companion e-book The Breakthrough CIO's Companion. He has spent ...

53 comments
ExploreMN
ExploreMN

Because of the inherent design of iOS, they have very little room for growth and innovation. Perhaps they can steal more ideas from Android like adding the ability to have widgets or more of a home screen than just a static row of icons...maybe some live wallpaper, but that's about it. Apple is so far behind the times they will have a very hard time catching up. It's just a pity that the average dumb masses are still impressed by shiny brushed aluminum like an infant is dangling set of shiny keys.

bernlin2000
bernlin2000

...that this is what happens when a major visionary dies and the person who takes his place isn't a visionary in the same sense. Cook has been content to iterate new features rather than shake things up, and that doesn't follow the model that Apple has been cultivating for some time now. Continuing down this path will allow competitors to catch up and cause Apple to fall into the middle of the pack, the very place Jobs wanted to avoid. Cook should know full well that Google and the rest of the "non-Mac" gang won't shed much of a tear if Apple falls behind.

Horus418
Horus418

On my customers PC's/Laptops I find cr4pware, in Apple stores I find cr4pware. The only difference is that the cr4pware in a PC can be removed easily, Apple is cr4pware and as such needs to be taken back to the 'iRip you rip off' store and a refund taken. P.S. Don't worry you can always get you hands on OSX, in what ever animal guise it is in now, and install it onto your now faster, more reliable, cheaper PC. Personally avoid OSX get into Linux or Windows and stop being an obstructive teenager. In other words GROW UP AND LOOK AFTER YOUR MONEY!

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

They will continue to introduce THEIR substandard versions of everyone else's products, pretend they invented it and call others copycats. Clever marketing and dumb consumers have see Apple's products dominate a market where they have offered lackluster, low quality and proprietary devices up against, robust, powerful and worthy tools. People will buy anything that is sold to them properly, whether it's better, they need it or not. People WANT to be told what they need to buy, it's just a fact or consumer driven societies. iPods were absolute rubbish compared to competitors products that had been out for years already. Apple's marketing behemoth painted the marketplace as being full of copycats and all the morons who don't know any better parroted it until others were left behind. How do you take out a product that has regular BATTERIES that you can but at any store, cheap. How do you make a proprietary, poor quality compression format into the world's most popular format, when the competitors offer that plus worthy formats like FLAC and WAV? Marketing and ignorant consumers who are begging to be told what to buy. How do you succeed with a phone that does half of what competitor's products do, then make it a leading product, despite 4 upgrades just to make it SIMILAR in capabilities as others? Marketing and ignorant consumers who are begging to be told what to buy. Will people ever catch on and see the scam for what it is? Highly doubtful, there are STILL people out there who think BOSE actually makes good audio products. WalMart is still in business! As long as there are uninformed consumers who just want to follow market hype, created solely by the device manufacturers, companies with money will succeed in dominating a market with substandard crap and good marketing.

the_tech_mule
the_tech_mule

A little crossover is fine between the two OSes, but to think that there is one OS that will serve both the desktop and tablet market is a mistake. Bringing key features from one into the other is fine and creating a common usage metaphor is alright but the tasks are different, which means that core functionality is different. Now, you could theoretically creating an adaptive OS that will change with the environment (e.g., touch vs mouse-driven). That could be potentially good on a touch enabled laptop or a tablet with a keyboard (e.g., Surface). There are challenges to that and the potential for failure would be high. As far as abandoning Intel for ARM on the Mac, that would be a huge mistake IMO. Yes, Apple has been able to successfully make that transition twice (Motorola 68K -> PowerPC -> Intel), but ARM is not a desktop processor and the Intel architecture still has a lot of life in it. What professional Mac users often require is compute power for video, image editing, modelling, etc. Unless Apple is going to abandon the high-end market and just focus on consumer-level Macs, moving from Intel would be a huge mistake there.

jeb.hoge
jeb.hoge

1. They've thrown significant legal and financial muscle into asserting that the iPad/iPhone design is theirs alone and unassailable. Any real changes to the layout (including ditching the Home button) is a loss of face and potentially money thrown out the window. Just adding a little bit of screen dimension to the iPhone 5 was a Big Deal Indeed. 2. Jobs famously said "If you see a stylus, they blew it." Now, I know that the Lord of Apple is gone, and I know that third-party stylii for iPads sell well (I see plenty of them in our office), but I imagine that Apple would struggle mightily against going against his Word as it was written. After all, if Steve was wrong about that, what else was he wrong about? 3. Android Nexus devices are eating Apple's lunch when it comes to cost value. Apple lives by its early adopters who'll throw full price (plus) at devices the day that they come out because those are the buzz builders, but the argument about no one else making devices that perform like iOS devices collapsed a while ago and those early adopters and Apple cognoscenti have gotten burned a couple of times in recent memory. Being told something is "revolutionary" doesn't work so well anymore, especially if you're trying to get people excited over things that their friends with Nexus 4s or Galaxy 3s were showing off last year, like NFC or new homescreen widgets. I think that the best Apple can do now is incremental or invisible updates. Max out battery life and resolution, refine Siri and iTunes, and try to sneak the price down.

lookingforward
lookingforward

Apple will never beat the thousands of Android ideas which are simple incremental improvements on a basic theme (e.g. docking a phone to use as a desktop was developed years ago, also see Ubuntu's ideas). Apple have always taken a rarely used ideas (tablets, smartphones even iPods) that have failed because of poor implementation and made them work the way people want them to, so a new iPad, Macbook or iPhone will not keep Apple truly great - where are the new products that will take up new places in our lives?

kjjerome
kjjerome

Let's invent! It is time for the Ipad to produce rather than consume, it needs for SIRI to be more productive and connectivity across all platforms. How about a camera that senses eye movement combined with voice... what could be easier!

laseray
laseray

Basically what is talked about in the article are things that vendors using Android and Linux are already starting to do. Combining laptop/desktop, and mobile via docking stations and a single OS that can convert on-the-fly are already partly available, just not by Apple or Microsoft.

JonathanPDX
JonathanPDX

Add the ability to use a REAL stylus, not those mushy sponge things. Give users the ability to store data without going through iPuke...I mean iTunes. They're not going to try to bring back iLost, are they? (iMaps, iWherethehellam, crApple Maps)

HammerOfDog
HammerOfDog

The next generation Apple tablet.. The MAXiPad

PensivePeter
PensivePeter

...how about an iPad running Windows 8? That would be novel....and certainly a big jump

Tony Hopkinson
Tony Hopkinson

Of course there's going to be a major revision. How else are they going to sell you another one fairly soon?

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

They may implement interface styling that Android uses, however they will be the boasted pioneers that Android copied. It's like a merry go round with them, the saddest part is that so many consumers are stupid enough that they buy into it and then parrot the same lies. Just look how defensive some of these guys get when you speak out against Apple, it turns into vile flame throwing match with absolutely no context to support their defense. Oh well nothing new, fanbois will be fanbois whether validly reasoned or not. If they gained benefits from Apple products, besides [i]almost[/i] being able to do what everyone else does (three revisions on), it would be different, but as they get less than others offer but still purport their devices as superior, it's mind boggling how easily sold some consumers are.

non-biased
non-biased

Based on your recommendations on what Apple could steal from Android you obviously don't get the appeal of iOS. You like your widgets and live wallpaper, good for you and I am glad there is an OS that provides if for you but that doesn't mean that adding them to iOS would be an improvement for those that use iOS. We don't all have to want and like what you do. To each their own.

non-biased
non-biased

I constantly see articles and comments talking about how Apple has lost it and can't innovate since Jobs passed but there is something seriously wrong with this thought process. It is presented as if they are failing because they don't have some new revolutionary product every year. It has never been this way. Even under Jobs with their greatest successes, iPod, iPhone and iPad, they were each 3 or more years apart. Now that Jobs is gone they are all of the sudden supposed to do it every year?

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

Who dies before Jobs? When Jobs was in charge, they brought out a phone that did half of what competitors did. They pretended it was the latest and greatest and others were copycats...copycats with more functionality and time on the market that is. When Jobs was in charge, they brought out a music player that did half of what competitors did. They pretended it was the latest and greatest and that others were copycats...copycats with more functionality and time on the market that is. The only "model" that Apple has been cultivating is the masses of idiots who buy into marketing because they don't know any better. They figure it must be true of Apple would get sued....if they have millions to invest in themselves while cases are dragged through an endlessly delayed court system. Apple is a follower, not a leader by any meaning of the term. They created nothing! Better phones were on the market long before iPhone. WAAAAY better digital music players were on the market years before the iPod. They simply can't afford to out market Apple, who then lies like a rug and makes an open and shared format into a low quality and very limited, proprietary marketplace, which others can't join unless they live and breathe Apple. I am not sure what "visionary" you are referring to, besides the guy who ran Apple on the basis of marketing and telling same the same lies over and over again until follower started to believe it. Some people buy into the hocus-pocus so much they consider him a visionary.

non-biased
non-biased

It's unhealthy to have so much hatred let alone for something inanimate.

non-biased
non-biased

"People will buy anything that is sold to them properly..." You must not be selling properly because nobody seems to be buying your line of small minded hater crap.

Gisabun
Gisabun

If Apple can save money [and not give the consumer the same discount] thenm they'll do it. Today's iPads will be paperweights - either from a dead battery or if Apple switches to a different CPU platform. They did it when they killed the PowerPC chip [but fewer laptops used it].

oNutz
oNutz

I actually own a pretty good ( non-mushy ) stylus. But as a proffesional animator and painter I find that my finger really is the ultimate drawing tool for this device, and rarely use the stylus.

GAProgrammer
GAProgrammer

that putting ARM in their core machines will drive business and personal software developers even further away from developing for the Macs than they are now. It's tough enough getting mainstream software for the Mac, but putting the ARM architecture in would make it even worse.

kjjerome
kjjerome

Pensive it could only be done with Intel. Funny thing with Arm is that they don't have the power that is needed, yet and if they did, they too would have to worry about Intels problem of the power envelope and heat of which Intel has solved with Haswell!. Oh, to the author of this article, Intel is much closer to the low powered chips that can run both Android (via Motorola phones) or Microsoft with "Haswell" and "Atoms". How long will it take Arm to make a chip that could be put in a MacAir that could do the same?

GAProgrammer
GAProgrammer

because they are seen as "trendy", people buy them even with these minor revisions. However, over time, trends change and Applpe needs some mjor changes to stay "trendy".

non-biased
non-biased

One is no better than the other no matter the topic. Both can only view the topic through their bias. I would assume you are calling me out as a fanboy right? I am a fan but by no means a fanboy. I can acknowledge when Apple is at fault but I won't just sit back and ignore hater comments either. As far as who copies who and who claims credit, I pretty much ignore most of that. They all copy from each other and they all, at least from time to time, claim credit for something they shouldn't. As far as so many consumers being stupid enough to believe it, that sword cuts both ways. There are just as many people that believe the hype from either side yet some have to believe it's only Apple customers so that they can sleep at night but that’s just because they are viewing it through their bias. Again you are going on about how the competition can do so much more yet ignore the absolute most important aspect of a device like these, the user experience. I am not claiming that iOS is the superior OS or that it's the best experience for everyone, that would be stupid to claim any one option is best for everyone. I am saying that it doesn't matter who can do more or what if two key factors aren't met. First, those additional feature, are they of any interest or use to the person looking to buy the device? They may be of great importance to you and a must but of zero benefit or even a negative to somebody else. A very basic example would be NFC. This may be something that you use multiple times a day and would be a great lose if you didn't have it but for me I have yet to run into a situation where it would have been of use to me so it would be of zero value and potentially a negative as it's another unneeded (by me) feature that could cause issues (component or software) with the phone. Second, the user experience. Some will prefer Android or WP while others will prefer iOS or BB, there is not right or wrong answer as we are not all the same. If the person buying the phone prefers one OS over the other they will then have to determine if the user experience is more important that possible features that another might offer. A device running OS A might have the least amount of features but the buyer enjoys the experience of it over OS B enough that it outweighs the benefits of the additional features offered in OS B are not enough of a benefit if at all to choose it. I use and prefer iOS devices as they fit my wants and needs. I have used Android in the past, though not a lot, and do believe it is a great OS but it is not the OS for me. Many believe that Android is for the technical and iOS is for the none technical but we shouldn’t try to stereo type. Of all the most technical people I know (I manage a hardware and software engineering firm dealing daily with both our engineers and customer’s engineers) they are almost all using iOS while the vast majority of none technical people I know are running Android. Everyone’s personal experiences will vary so this isn’t to imply that is what everyone should see. From speaking with the technical people I know that use iOS almost all of them said that while they have the ability to customize and tweak Android as much as possible they get enough of that with work and don’t want to deal with it on their phones and tablets.

Tony Hopkinson
Tony Hopkinson

I agree you are not biased, prejudiced would seem to be a more accurate description...

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

First of all you need to understand the words you type. I have very valid reasons that are FACTS which differentiate these products and I have described them to you. There are valid reasons why I feel the way I do. That is NOT "small minded, hater crap" on the other hand... You have offered NOTHING at all, NOT ONE TINY SMIDGEON of info as to what you feel makes iToys superior, besides the typical, uneducated fanboy BS. What this results in is your defending an inferior product with no validity behind what you say, making everything you say "small minded hater crap" When you understand and start conversing or debating a point with valid support, besides "I know you are but what am I?" replies, perhaps your voice will finally have some weight behind it. As for selling.I'm not trying to sell anything. Certainly not to you, but I HAVE offered support for my opinion, which you have failed to do yourself. When I sell in the US, it's an easy market where people will buy anything you throw at them. Most people in the music industry feel the same way, which is another reason production value and engineering is so pathetic now. If I was selling you something, you wouldn't even realize it but you'd buy it all the same. If you feel you are so different/more astute than other Americans that you WOULDN'T buy in, why do you buy into Apple, the biggest trend based marketer in electronics the world has ever seen? I know, 'Because it's better! I can't tell you why but millions of others agree so it must be true!'

JCitizen
JCitizen

It makes perfectly good sense why they would go this direction. Apple has always been a hardware based company - unlike Microsoft - so this gives them the opportunity to make even more ludicrous profit, and have complete control of their resources and supply chain.

Tony Hopkinson
Tony Hopkinson

And there's me thinking they were, at their own expense filling a gaping hole in our lives out of the goodness of their hearts.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

As your reply is incorrect in so many ways, factual, incorrect ways, not opinionated ways, it's hard to even begin to take you seriously. YOU brought up the whole haters vs fanboys commentary. I don't HATE Apple, as you suggested. You are taking what you have seen other people say or do and applying it to how I feel about it, which is false from all angles. Please describe the difference between a fan and a fanboy, besides one specifying gender. They all copy from each other. Yes, when they ALL have similar products. When Apple offers less but claims others, with more, have copied them, they are sniffing too much glue, a little is good but not too much, glue is bad, m'kay? You are completely wrong in your assertion that marketing hasn' tmade Apple consumers in to sheep. That is a very specific and one way street, other products gain popularity on their merits, Apple has no such claim as they simply don't do what others can. As far as competition, it's not a matter of preference. Specifically again, the iPod. A music player has to do one thing, reproduce music. The quality of that reproduction is VERY measurable and VERY comparable to determine superiority in such devices. When a music player is measurably inferior at reproducing music, compared to others, it means it is a substandard device. Has nothing at all to do with preferences in any way. Next thing you are going to try and convince me of, is that a $499 Samsung stereo system from Best Buy is just as good as a Cambridge Tube amp, because more people bought it. Consumers are NOT always right, in fact they are wrong more often than right. WHY? Marketing. I know all the audio marketing scams and have heard people come into stores parroting what they want, while completely ignorant of the fact that the specs they are comparing are unregulated, completely made up and not actual measurements etc. Consumers are lead to believe that Wattage and frequency response reporting is equal among all brands and products, when in fact they are the most unregulated and ridiculous measurements of an audio product ever created. To compare specs in such a case is exactly why so many consumers spend big money on total garbage and keep such companies alive. According to 'consumer specs', BOSE speakers are better than Totem, Focal etc. which is an absolute joke. According to consumers, in the 80's and due to marketing prowess, BOSE managed to make their speakers appear to be superior. Through spending tens of thousands on in store displays, refusing dealers to offer side by side testing and by clever marketing, there are STILL people who think BOSE makes a good product. In reality they are the biggest swindle in the market, even worse than the guys who sell no name speakers in parking lots out of white vans. Marketing completely absorbs markets, creates trends and people FOLLOW because they want to believe what they are told. If you actually feel that consumers drive markets in the 20th and 21st centuries, you know absolutely nothing at all about marketing. Markets drive consumers and will do so until consumers actually educate themselves instead of reading forums, reviews and blogs to form opinions based on opinions. Again you go on comparing features and saying that one feature might not benefit another user. I am NOT talking about features, I am talking about benefits which benefit all users, not things one guy might use and the other not so much. Having two headphone jacks might not benefit all users, it's a feature with limited benefit. Having ear bud headphones vs headband style might not benefit all consumers as some have different preferences. If you suggest sound quality and freedom or power choice and file choice does not benefit ALL users, you have done too much acid though. Again I refer to the 3-legged race horse or car with half an engine. These aren't preferences for specific consumers, these are serious product flaws that restrict the ability of the product to perform. You just don't get it and I don't think you ever will. Your arguments apply when defending against haters on a blog or fanboy forum, which is not the case here. I don't oppose Apple, I just oppose their marketing of inferior products as superior and how Apple fans jump in line like lemmings, without a clue. They are buying PURELY out of their adoration for a brand or a trend, not the quality or performance of the product they are buying. Again you rabble on about OS preferences, but that's not the discussion I am having with you. All the user features in the world don't matter when a product simply doesn't do it's main job better than any others. iPods are HORRIBLE sounding music players, they have poor DAC converters, no sound control and only play the lowest quality format of music. Their ability to reproduce sound is abysmal, yet their key job is to reproduce sound. Other players in the past had phenomenal audio quality, offer so much more flexibility for the listener and played music all day, if not you just had to throw another battery in to keep going. iPods don't even scratch the surface of the quality and performance of older players that were trended away with Apple's marketing and completely moronic consumers that don't know their arse from their elbow. iPhones actually have one of the worst "PHONES" on the market. Terrible quality sound, useless speakerphone, terrible menu access to navigate call history etc. To anyone that is used to using a REAL phone, a business phone, even a Nokia mobile from the early 90's, iPhones are completely useless as 'phones' but offer good web access, a HALF DECENT camera (finally) and too many apps for their own good, most of which do the same thing. Sound quality, signal strength and battery life is a complete joke compared to others. But they are sold on user features, which are great for casual users but useless for business enterprise. However, many businesses still invest in them because other people do and in my line of work I can attest that most business owners have no business even being in business, they are easily fooled, don't look out for their company's best interests and will spend money on trend based solutions for their companies. So STOP going on and on about personal preferences, which has NOTHING to do with quality or performance at all. My comment right from the beginning is: Apple's mobile devices are substandard for their purpose. Apple successfully sells substandard products purely due to marketing. If they actually said, we limit the sound quality, we limit file use, we limit battery and connectivity options but it's a cool experience. Would people still buy them? Perhaps a few but not most...until others jumped on board and then the lemmings line up User experience means NOTHING compared to the base functions of a device being substandard to others.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

Wow for someone not interested in debating Apple products, who's not even interested in the topic of debate, you sure do debate it a lot. Without reading through even more of your senseless drivel, providing valid reasons for not seeing value in a technology is not being a hater. I HAVE Mac products at home, I do graphic design and find MAC used to have the best workstations for video editing, sound engineering etc due to processor speed for rendering. I am not an Apple hater, nor am I am fanboy of any other technology, as I haven't even mentioned another brand either. ANYONE, who understands technology and does their homework would quickly see what a trend driven market Apple has started. They certainly didn't get there by providing superior technology as their technology failed to even match what was already available. "They all copy from each other..." So you are suggesting that other companies copied Apple products, and added even more robust features that Apple later brought out and dummed down before claiming others copied them. LOL, if you only knew what you were talking about.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

Weak. No relevant reply, no ability to counter what you read, just flame the poster and look stupid, uneducated and incapable instead. I have no rage boiling over in me, I think you take far too much out of what you propose not to have read. Bashing a company I hate? I already said I have Apple computers at home and prefer them for specific reasons. Yet another of your false assertions gone awry. If anyone here is boiling over, it is yourself, with a complete lack of any substantial reasoning to support a product, you have only offered blind defense without substantiating your comments. THAT is true fanboy commentary, whether you are our of the closet or not, you are clearly an Apple fanboy and will defend them even when you have no reason for defense. It is clear that you have had debates with small minded opposers of Apple and probably stood aside Apple fanboys at the time, you clearly don't have the skills to support your preference by yourself. Laugh all you like, the ones who produce low end substandard products that you defend so hideously are the ones who are really laughing. I didn't waste MY money, so I guess can laugh too. Speaking of money, I have a 3-legged race horse for sale, it's a lot better than any of the 4 legged horses others have had for years. It only eats special oats from MY farm, it needs a jockey that I will provide and the special saddles can only be bought at my stable, others just won't fit it. I't's not actually a very good horse, compared to others, but I'll sell it to you at top dollar because sooner or later all the others will be racing with three legs too, by then my 3 -legged horse will be even faster because of my special oats though, it's a dead ringer. I'm eventually going to let others grow my special oats but MY 3-legged horse will STILL be faster and win more races than theirs because I came up with the idea for a 3-legged horse when everyone else's had 4. Soon, everyone else will be buying 3-legged horses because they prefer them to 4-legged ones. They aren't stupid though, because they FEEL like they have a winner! Surely you want to be cool like all the other 3-legged horse owners too, don't you? THAT'S why you don't have a leg to stand on with your senseless defense.

non-biased
non-biased

or at least as much of them as I can waste my time with. It's good to start the day with a laugh. The rage that boils over in people like you that have nothing better to do in their life that troll forums bashing a company that they hate is so funny to watch. Apparently Apple is living rent free as they used to say.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

There are trolls, there are losers, there are Lobo's and there there are guys like this....

non-biased
non-biased

I said it didn't mean it would be an improvement, I did not say that it could not be an improvement. I specifically said that we do not all have to want and like the same. Once again, just because somebody likes something doesn't mean that it will improve something else for everybody.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

"I don't use iPods and am not hear to debate them but lets address one of your points. " And seeing as you have failed to offer one shred of anything relevant, on topic r factual, why are you here then? And why would you expect ME to move on if you aren't even here to debate on the topic of debate? That leaves only one possibility left. Troll. So troll boy/girl: How is in irreplaceable, limited use battery NOT better than batteries which are inexpensive and easily changed? If you say it's your personal preference to be limited by the technology you buy and you feel THAT makes it better, then you are absolutely mad or simply a troll. Again you go on about not using the technology and not being here to debate it. Well this is a debate on Apples technology, why the hell are you here and why the hell would you bother debating it if that's not why you are here? Only one answer to that. Troll. If your experience is listening to music and you only know of one way to listen to music, how can you propose it's the best way to listen to music? You have nothing to base such a decision on. Your passive aggressive commentary doesn't make you right, it makes you a troll. Spec sheets don't sell anything to anybody, especially when they are engrossed in the media's spin instead, in which case spec sheets prove otherwise, at least for anyone who actually does their homework before spending their money. Those that don't are sheep, follow for the sake of following. The fact that YOU don't understand how flawed a technology is, doesn't exactly support your case, However it's clear to all that your only reason for posting is to troll, you already stated you weren't here to discuss the topic. Spec....sheets...dont...sell...products...to...the ...average...consumer.... Well it's a good thing I never said ANYTHING AT ALL about spec sheets and their sales ability then. Troll. In fact, anyone that actually knows me here also knows VERY well that I don't think features sell products, which is a proven fact, BENEFITS sell products. With FAR greater benefits to find in any other music player than the iPod, it simply proves that Apple is focused on trend based sales. If you knew ANYTHING about sales, you would comprehend that, troll. So instead of worrying about what I think and say, in a topic that you have no interest in discussing, yet do so all the same. Why don't you run along to the gamer's forums and troll there instead, where like minded, uneducated kiddies can at least look up to your mindless drivel.

non-biased
non-biased

I don't use iPods and am not hear to debate them but lets address one of your points. You are of the opinion that operating on a AAA battery is better that having a built in rechargeable battery, you are more than welcome to that opinion. What you are not welcome to is determining that your opinion is actually a fact. Many people hate dealing with batteries and nothing you say will change that. Again, I don't use iPods and am not hear to debate them. You have made up your mind that nothing Apple does is any good and totally dismiss that it can all come down to users enjoying their experience with iPods better than with other devices regardless of the spec sheet. Spec sheets don't sell products to the average consumer. I stated that there was no point in debating the issue with you because you have made up your mind and nothing will change that, nothing you posted refutes what I said. Once again slowly so you can get it, spec....sheets....don't...sell...products...to...the...average...consumer,...it's...the...experience...that...sells...them.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

Small minded hatred? I can list countless FACTS where both iPhone and iPod falls short of competitors products. So far I see nothing but iToy fanbois supporting a product with no substantial reasoning at all. bobjones2007, who you have now decided to speak for, has absolutely no defense to offer, because it doesn't exist. Your simplified dismissal also illustrates that you will shoot down comments with absolutely no hope of being able to support your views either. So lets start with their first farce, the iPod. MP3 players from Samsung (Yepp for example) had very powerful, clean amplifier circuits that drove full frequency response to whatever headphones you could find to properly reproduce it. They ran from a single AAA battery, that lasted about 10 hrs and was replaced in seconds. A 4-pack of rechargables meant you could run constantly and always have music. The Yepp, as with most others, would playback REAL file formats, FLAC, WAV etc. with bitrates as high as you wanted 1400kbps etc. and would let you manage and transfer files in true USB stick fashion, on ANY computer without installing proprietary software. iPod has a limited life, non replaceable battery. When the battery dies you have to recharge the whole device and face downtime in the process. As with any rechargeable system, the battery eventually lose life and you either have to have a new one installed at the Apple store or go out and buy a new player, which was most common because they faced manufacturer driven obsolescence. IPods then insist that you install Apple's proprietary software in order to manage your music, making it only accessible to those who share similar devices. You can't just plug in someone's USB port and trade a bunch of music back and forth with drag and drop simplicity. Then iPod's insist that you listen to very low quality, poorly compressed music that is incredibly lossy, flat and lifeless due to their focus on MP3 formatting. THEN iPod provides you with substandard playback quality, poor DAC converters and no frequency adjustments, perpetuating the lifeless sound of iPods. Due to intense marketing efforts and side deals with every electronics manufacturer they can find, iPod becomes a proprietary yet popular format for kiddies who want to be like everyone else in school and music is now dummed down and lost for real listeners. So that's how Apple's marketing has made a substandard and comparatively useless music player into the most popular music player, not by pioneering or doing something others didn't but by trend marketing. So how about you put your money where your big mouth is and actually support your defense of the low end garbage that you call me a hater for taking to task? I know you can't so you'll flame me instead, as that is all you have to hang on to. Instead of playing the teeny-bopper trend defense, how about some solid facts that you feel make iPods a better music player than others that were on the market years prior to iPods? Shall we then move on to iPhones?

non-biased
non-biased

You don't want proof. Your small minded hatred is so ingrain that there is no point in attempting to debate with you as it would be a complete waste of time, you can not acknowledge facts only spin that backs up your hatred. Did Steve Jobs or Tim Cook bully you as a child or something? I can't imagine any other reason for such hatred for a company.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

With alternate proof to the contrary like that I'm almost ready to retract my comments!

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

I never said people buy on spec alone, only the uninformed rely on spec sheets. The BENEFITS I've listed are numerous, people buy BENEFITS. Return customers are due to Apple's proprietary systems, people HAVE to return just to change a bloody battery or buy a connector cable or anything else if they want to be cool like all the other kids in the office. Here's the bottom line: FACT: iPods don't do anything that other units did LONG before iPods ever came out. If you like the features in iPods, who in their right mind would not want those features with much better sound, even MORE capability, ditch the proprietary product and spend even less? I said who in their RIGHT MIND.. You are trying to say people buy cars with 3 wheels and half an engine because they want to. Compared to a 4 wheel car with a complete engine for less money. Try and make some sense anyway. I know what you are desperately trying to say "People will buy what they personally prefer, just because YOU don't prefer it doesn't mean it's better." In this case you are wrong. Other players HAD better sound, it is FACT and measurable. Other players HAD more capabilities, it is FACT and measurable. Other players HAD greater convenience, it is FACT and measurable. Other players HAD more expandability and offered more freedom for the user, it is FACT and is measurable. The value their customer's FEEL is absolute horsecrap. Value is MEASURABLE, it's not just a feeling. Apple products are poorly made from cheap components. FACT and measurable. From a pure VALUE for MONEY perspective, Apple does not stand anywhere near the top of the market. As for perceived user value, that is the FEELING you are getting at, and the only reason anyone would feel value in a substandard product that is overpriced, proprietary, poor sounding and limited in capability is because of trend marketing. They THINK they have value, though by every measurable factor, they have NOT got good value. So fam boys will always BELIEVE they have a superior product simply because they don't know better, why don't they know better? Marketing. I think you'll learn what marketing is about one day but it has clearly avoided your comprehension for now.

non-biased
non-biased

You can't refute what I said. People don't buy on spec sheets alone, they buy on what they like the best. You want to believe that it's simply people believing misinformation but you are wrong. I would give that to you if it weren't for the fact that they have such a high rate of return customers. You have your opinions but that does not make them facts. Try opening your eyes and realizing that not everyone wants the same things you want. Just because you think Apple products are ridiculously priced doesn't change the value that their customers feel they get out of their purchases. Even if they cost twice what they do now if the person actually buying the device believes they got a good value then it doesn't matter what a troll like you thinks.

aidemzo_adanac
aidemzo_adanac

Practice what you preach, learn to format a paragraph or at least a full sentence and you'll be worth discussing something with. As your comments sit, you are simply someone that shot his/her mouth off with no valid reason or anything to substantiate said blowing off of mouth. I explained HOW Apple has successfully lead people along with misinformation, so much so that the trend has blinded most consumers of the reality behind what they purchase, for ridiculous prices I may add. Your response to facts was simply to start flaming me, telling me who I am and what people thought, as if I was actually talking to you or something. When called to task, you sidle and backpeddle into some BS about being misunderstood? Of course while slinging crap at the same time. Give your head a good shake and find a new bridge to troll.

non-biased
non-biased

I will admit that I did not go back to reread your post and didn't bother getting through more that a few lines of this response because it's not worth the effort. I didn't offer anything to back up why I feel Apple products are superior because I NEVER SAID THEY WERE. Yes, I prefer what Apple products I have over the competition because they are a superior fit for what I want but once again for you slow people I NEVER SAID THEY WERE SUPERIOR. It's people like you that get your patties in a wad because people make difference choices than you make. It's time to grow up and realize that we don't all have the same wants and needs. I see the occasion feature in another device that I would like to have but when comparing the overall package it's not a better fit for me. Doesn't mean that either is superior to the other because in reality there is no device in any category that is superior for everyone. You appear to base all your decisions simply off the spec sheet but in the real world that is not was sell products to the average consumer, you know that group that buys these devices by the tens of millions, they buy based on experience. You pick what you want and I will pick what I want but don't ever assume that your opinion is anymore important or correct than anybody else's.

Tony Hopkinson
Tony Hopkinson

Marked all three posts down, but didn't have the bottle to post why.