Discussion on:

10 things you'll miss when you upgrade to Vista (and how to get some of them back)

Very good summary for DRM and microsoft becoming the moral monopoly.

I think the article should get a new name ... not 10 things .. 1 .. the one thing you will miss, Freedom.

Microsoft has decided everyone is illegal, so we don't get the freedom to chose how we will work with the products we have legally purchased.

Microsoft is also forcing you to buy only devices that are DRM certified. Oh wait there's that word "forced" again ... You don't *have* to go buy a DRM enabled Plasma Screen TV, but if you don't, your movie will not display on that screen, or will display in lower quality than it was intended to be.

The Saturn ION moved the speedometer to the center of the dashboard (over the radio). I love Saturn, but didn't want to relearn how to drive. This move probably makes it easier to manufacture cars for left-lane countries. What if they changed the steering wheel so that it would turn left when you spin it clockwise? This is "Change".

Change for change's sake brings us back as a society.

Choosing Linux or Vista is just a business decision. When seen that way, it gets harder and harder not to choose Free/OpenSource systems.

But we do agree on one thing. "Great article, well written."

I believe the problem is on a different layer.
ok, so 90% of bussines desktops run win2k or winxp (how many without SP??).
Now look at the Vista we all would like to have, the robust one, the OS that runs independently of the bad software and mixed hardware, the OS that behaves like an OS and not like an OS plus everything else. imagine heaven... then imagine your 30 pc's client network, they need to buy two new computers, and you present them a budget for those new xpto Vista pc, ops !!! in heaven you would have to present a budget with 32 new computers, maybe even a new server, new software, and everything else because the perfect Vista would not work with the old OS's and ERP software and....
that's the kind of marketing mistake that kills a company's. So I believe people at Microsoft (the thechies at least) also want a better OS, the one we all dream of, but they have to sell a product (that's what a company should be doing to survive) that doens't kill the bussiness.
Do users need this new OS? on an enterprise enviroment i don't believe they do. how many of your users really use more than 10% of Microsoft Office potencial?
Is it time for Linux? yes, but then again the eternal problem. You can only manage to be very good at a small amount of issues, and you can have "some" knoledge of all the other subjects in IT world. So we've (at least in Portugal) a huge number of small IT bussiness doing desktop and server management based on windows. It's a risk to open your services (with a staff of 2,3 or maybe 4 persons) to another OS (OS's if you consider each distro a different OS) and maintain your service level.
the ones that reach this opint and survive will be prepared for one of the two possible scenarios:
- Vista gets to be a floop at the enterprise level and it's time for Ubuntu and this way you can maintain old customers running windows and be there for the ones looking at linux
- Vista keeps things like they're now, and you maintain windows clients and open small accounts for linux driven bussiness.
So the ones not working 18 hours a day, can start helping people at ubuntu (not a passion, but the last distro i've tried) making an unified linux distro so we can have a option to present to our customers.

Just think that in 86 Bill told us that 265kb would be enough for any computer in the world. It was just 20 years ago. So, no way i'm doing 6-7 years plan!! :-D

Yeah, when you buy a new car, lets see they move the steering wheel to the trunk, the gas pedal is now on the dash board, and the brake is in the ashtray. The CD's you were able to play in your OLD car no longer work in the new one. Very poor analogy on your part comparing automobiles to Vista. Vista currently is CRAP, and M$$$$ knows it but really could care less what any of us think.

Look .... I hate microsoft as much if not more than the next guy.. I probably hate them *much more* than the next guy..

But even I have to admit there are some things in the *idea* of vista that are worth it. ie their UAC.

UAC seems to be much more like root only access in Redhat, if you attempted to access something that only an admin was allowed, you would be prompted for the superuser's password (gui) or denied if not running as root or at least running the command through sudo (non-GUI).

That is a big step in the right direction ... I think vista *can* work, its the re-invention of the wheel that Microsoft has done without giving us an understanding that I think is causing the greater problem.

Vista shouldn't be on such a push to be everywhere now, its not ready to replace XP .. the software we run on our PC's is not ready for vista, the GUI-ness of the interface is not ready for meager pc's, and the interface's command placements, as I'm sure people can start to agree on, is in need of a sanity check for how things are accessed ...

So why not have a year or so between the release and mainstream push for everyone to upgrade to Vista?

Within that time, Microsoft will have worked out some of the kinks I would hope, and people would have had time to add some beef to their pc's, and perhaps microsoft would have even found a way to code better and make the required processing power less steep.

Microsoft has released the "next" os for them, and its compatibility for its past is non-existant, so the rest of the world needs time to catch up... vista shouldn't be forced on anyone (ie. oem installs on new pc's) give the world a year microsoft ... take that time MS, to go back and see how some of the changes are really asinine and counter productive, see how applications that need to work aren't and try to help those companies come to a better understanding of how to work with you ...

(oh but that's right you don't want competition, so maybe this is exactly what you meant to do then)

"UAC seems to be much more like root only access in Redhat, if you attempted to access something that only an admin was allowed, you would be prompted for the superuser's password (gui) or denied if not running as root or at least running the command through sudo (non-GUI)."

If you stop logging in as administrator all the time and use a restrictive account, setup proper ACLs etc. then what is the difference between WinXP and Vista on that front? There are nice free little runas (admin) tools that will allow you to allow one-time admin privileges just like Vista.

In my experience, WinXP is lovely and secure IF (and only if) you set it up properly...

only problem with non-admin login is again the issue that programs not written 100% compliant to the XP standard, which is now locked out if not... will not run or cause other problems.

case in point is Quicken/Quickbooks. The story is here on TR somewhere.. the 2006 and older version won't work on Vista because they try to use the registry in a way that microsoft said was contrary to XP provisions. While allowed in XP, the same behavior was formally prohibited with Vista .. and now people have to switch to the newest version of Quickbooks to continue working with their data.

Older versions of Corel products have had issues in the past, installing and running from none admin accounts. I know this was the case in 7 or 8 .. but this should not be an issue in more recent releases.. the difference in blame in this case... is that XP has been out for 5 years, and only now is Intuit/Quicken actually writing code to be compliant.. Fault - Intuit.

Now were this an issue of a user being on a verison of quick books from 2000 ... and intuits' 2006 was vista ready, then I'd lay blame on the user ... for not having upgraded at least once in five years..

otherwise, if that user gets a discount to the current version that's whats needed. Now anyone that's just recently purchased 2006 version of quickbooks.. I would expect them to get a FREE upgrade (or 9.95 for delivery fee) to their vista compatible 2007 product.

I would have thought that using the runas command, or third-party tools that do the same thing through a GUI, would work in all cases.
I've been using runas and sanur since Win2k without problems.

If the Vista OS is helpful or offers more functionality or security; it would be worth it; otherwise, it is just eye candy for the masses! $$$$$$$$$

And so Microsoft continues its historic drive towards protecting yourself from yourself. Every iteration of the NT kernel adds layers to administrative access, sets more restrictive defaults and compounds the insult of presuming that I'm a software pirate.

You're right about the learning curve. Rather than continue with the absurdity that is Windows, I'll be spending my time learning the ins and outs of Ubunto. So far, I haven't found anything to complain about there.

Your first paragraph hit the nail squarely on the head. Microsoft condescends to it's customers and presumes them to be thieves. I for one have been, and continue to be, insulted, and more than a little annoyed.

This weekend I installed Vista Ultimate (bought and paid for) on some brand new hardware. I foolishly activated too soon (before changing the clock setting), and then, since there was over a years difference in clock time (The OS thought it was January of 2006 - WTF?), I had to REactivate. That's twice
Being in a rush also kept me from updating my new systems BIOS before installing Vista, but doing so afterwards FORCED a third activation, and this time I got the THIRD DEGREE. "How many computers have you installed the software on?" came the accusing question. Ehh.. "ONE ?!!!".
It seems that updating one's BIOS forces Vista to reinstall all of the drivers, thereby convincing this new wonder OS that it is now running on a completely different machine.
This has NEVER been an issue before.

And that is merely the beginning of the issues I have thus far discovered. (Anybody else out there HATE "Access Denied" messages?!?)

Vista is certainly slick, but it's a long way from user friendly. It's also overpriced, especially in light of all of the legacy software it refuses to run, and the lack of sufficient driver support for existing hardware.

My opinion? Wait. Maybe forever.

that they actually thought a pirate would be calling them in the first place ... much less three times in a row! That is how stupid this whole process is. Not only do they assume the average user is a thief, they designed the system so sloppily that even typical, normal processes like adjusting the clock or BIOS trigger a reinstallation?!?!? How bad is that, eh?

This kind of assininity (sp?) almost guarantees a huge black-market opportunity for pirates and work-around artists. When things work properly (ie, transparently to the user) do you get on the phone and complain about this and that and the other?? No! You get on with your business. But when you are hounded and/or blocked at every turn what do you do? You start looking around for someone to help you get your system working so you CAN get back to your business.

This whole piracy issue is smoke and mirrors. Every system sold comes with an OS. Why would anyone want to buy a second OS when they already received one with the system? The present multi-digit registration system is more than adequate to deter 99% of casual piracy. And the professional thieves, if indeed there are any [that speak English natively], would only be highly amused by these shenanigans anyhow.

More likely, the real truth of the matter is that, in order to continue the insane profits, Micro$oft has to find ways to force everyone to buy something from them every few years and Vista is clearly proof of this. In fact the next step is already out ... renting the operating system and the applications (ie, Office) on a daily or monthly basis. This practice is already in place in several undeveloped countries where it is being tested and refined before unleashing it on the rest of the world.

My understanding is that Microsoft KNOWS that the average user is not the problem. The major portion of that problem lies off-shore, and NOTHING that Redmond has done in the area of "Activation" is going to prevent it from continuing to happen.
Why then, you have to ask yourself, would this corporate giant insist on continuing to inflame it's customer base? Why persist in creating active hostility towards itself?
When you figure that one out, please let me know.
I'd also be interested in knowing just who it was that appointed MS the keeper of digital rights, who gave them the authority to override the Supreme Court's "Fair Use" decisions, and why is no one standing up for the RIGHTS of the little guy (thee and me)?
Obviously Bill Gates is not starving, nor are there too many Hollywood Stars on the breadline, or in the soup kitchen.
If you ask me, it's all very strange indeed.

There is a very important dimension to all of this. Who is to suppose that within a few iterations of MS Windows we will have any access to any features at all. Admin rights may be revoked except to MS Professionals, or we may find it so hard to access anything that we don't have the knowledge anymore, or gradually lose it. At that point we really are in the muck. It seems enormously important to have open source systems that we all understand enough to be able to obtain the same level of functionality as MS products.

I'm not being funny, but most distopian visions (including huxley, orwell and even terminator!) plausibly describe access to advanced technology and information in the hands of a protected group/elite. I bet this could happen faster than we imagine.

And finally, comparatively less important, it seems that we just aren't the ones deciding what should happen with our computer systems. Perhaps nothing new, but it's still not ideal, is it. We reduce ourselves to dogs slavering and whimpering as the master approaches with another pan-full of nameless matter for our pleasure. I don't like this cage.

I agree with you completely.
On the UP side however, is the fact that we all still have access to, and the use of, ALL previous MS systems. (Supported or otherwise.)
The machine I updated this past weekend was my secondary computer. I still run, and will continue to run XP Pro on my main computer. Given my 'druthers, I'd much prefer the look, professionalism and non-condescension of Windows 2000, mixed with the reliability of XP Pro.
Vistas completely scalable non-raster graphics are beautiful to look at, but looks alone do not an OS make.

(edited for clarity)

To many hoops and changes and my XP works great. No reason to fix what is not broken. We are not talking 98 or 2000 here but XP, a very stable system. Change for the sake of change is not logical.

I installed Vista on my home PC this weekend. It broke my scanner, iTunes (video portion), and all my software that recorded streaming audio. The new GUI is slick, but all that motion is making me seasick. I spent $160 for a new GUI and a system that gives me less than what I had under XP? Very depressing.

Agree. Just ourchased a new notebook. Yes the eye candy is different, but I don't see any noticeable difference in speed or functionality. Frankly, it seems harder to find the functions I easily had on XP.

10 things you'll misss when you switch to linux.... or maybe not

1 Internet Explorer. Unless you already use firefox, or Opera or Mozilla...

2 V.I.S. (Virus Installation Subsystem) All those handy functions that allow the latest macro virus to read you address book and mail copies of itself to all you contacts.

3 Most malware ( because the linux security model keeps the various services running under unpriviledged user ids, most security threats are trivial.)

4 the registry. With few exceptions, linux uses plain text configuration files. In most cases application failure due to configuration errors can be solved by renaming or removing the user's personalized configuration for the application.

5 defragging the hard drive. Linux "sees" the hard drive as a random access device, not a circular piece of tape.

6 Microsoft support ( hours of scouring the microsoft KB site in search of useful answers that are not circular references?

7 ever increasing minimum hardware requirements

8 The globally unique ID

9 invasive product registration procedures

10 The Microsoft tax

This isn't really a comeback - but I'm sick of people touting Linux as the be-all and end-all solution to every computer problem. Yes, some Linux distros are fantastic. Most still need a lot of work and I look forward to the day that they are a feasible replacement to Windows for the average, everyday user.

1.) An entirely graphic system, no code or text based configuration required.

2.) Being able to turn to your friend and say "How did you work around this..." because they still use Windows or a Mac.

3.) Logical menu setup (Fedora, in particular, is all over the place)

4.) Powerful, easy to use Office software (As nice as OpenOffice.Org is, it is nowhere near Microsoft Office yet. Mind you, I do really like their Writer package)

5.) A powerful graphics program (As with Ooo, Gimp really doesn't cut it yet.)

6.) Warantees and a physical place you can take your computer to when you have troubles.

7.) Good games

8.) Instant compatibility with the majority of computers provided and used in workspaces, at internet cafes etc.

9.) Having your software pre-installed and ready to go when you buy your computer from a retailer.

10.) The ability to get software at a store, dealing face-to-face with people, as opposed to downloading over the internet (which many average users cannot afford to do).

However, at the rate at which it's advancing, I say give it a few years - less than five - and my list will be cut down to seven. Five years and it will be less than that. Ten years? My list might be the same, but comparing Windows' shortcomings to Linux.

You wrote:

"An entirely graphic system, no code or text based configuration required."

This sounds kind of like the person who drives the Porche 911 who has never changed a spark plug. Or the person who tells you hunting is barbaric and then orders a double Big Mac.

Are you proposing a GUI to do the simplest damn things out there? Besides that being able to edit and modify things at the kernel level is one of the differences between the closed/open source models. Not everything can have a GUI and that is a good thing.

Same lazy attitude regarding your buying a computer with pre-installed OS. And who can't afford to download a free .iso file from the web that can afford a new computer with pre-installed OS???

Gee? Maybe it's the graphics bloat pulling down the system that needs to be restarted all the time? Maybe it's a dumb filesystem interface that forces us to reboot the machine because `a file is still in use' or `a service needs to be shut down', etc?

One thing that Windows seriously needs to do in order to be worthwhile is dump the garbage user interfaces and go for uptime, so that once people remove a lot of bugs from their code, or memory leaks aren't as big of a deal, Windows won't have to be rebooted nigh weekly for trivial updates and garbage.

Hmmm... maybe doing this will make other things like viruses be easier to unroot too, ya think?

> 1.) An entirely graphic system, no code or text based configuration required.

You like dealing with setup dialogs? I hated them when I had to work as student IT at my school, because frankly I discovered all of the `automated' means of installing things to be too much of a PITA and all over the place to actually help IT pro's.

> 2.) Being able to turn to your friend and say "How did you work around this..." because they still use Windows or a Mac.

???? Obviously you need to read through documentation or ask others for help. That's how _real_ people get stuff done with opensource software -- not hole themselves up in a box and wait for their friends to come by and then ask them for help (esp when the help may be a YMMV type of thing), but instead ask someone who actually might know how to use the system for help.

> 3.) Logical menu setup (Fedora, in particular, is all over the place)

That's Gnome and Fedora, both of which are pieces of trash. Try PCBSD with their custom KDE menus, or XFCE4 with its cleanliness, etc, etc -- you may be surprised.

Oh -- did I mention you have choices on Unix?

> 4.) Powerful, easy to use Office software (As nice as OpenOffice.Org is, it is nowhere near Microsoft Office yet. Mind you, I do really like their Writer package)

True, this is lacking. If you really need M$ Office, Mac OSX or Wine be thine path. Or maybe grow up and use a real documentation language like TeTeX (I don't know how many times I wanted to shoot myself because M$ Word corrupted my ~2MB document and I had to go back and start from scratch because it was toast).

> 5.) A powerful graphics program (As with Ooo, Gimp really doesn't cut it yet.)

Gimp does many things that Photoshop does too -- the interface is just a bit wonky.

Oh, and Disney was nice enough to help ensure that Photoshop and other Adobe products worked well with Wine, so guess what? You got it -- Wine works well with Adobe stuff.

> 6.) Warantees and a physical place you can take your computer to when you have troubles.

HAHAHAHAHAH. It's called manufacturer's warranties which DO NOT COVER SOFTWARE.

Most decent professionals do NOT need a particular operating system preinstalled on a machine in order to troubleshoot or assist with an issue. If they don't have the proper tools, they shouldn't deserve your business.

Besides, do you really want to turn in your PC to Geeksquad for help :)?

> 7.) Good games

Define `good'. Oh yeah, Wine + CEDEGA does games too, and a lot are already ported to Unix..

> 8.) Instant compatibility with the majority of computers provided and used in workspaces, at internet cafes etc.

Define `compatibility'. The Internet doesn't require a particular configuration, apart from Windows domain junk (which is just masked LDAP capability, which is stupid to have if you want other machines to be capable of connecting to your hotspot, cafe, etc), and besides Unix does a better job at networking than Windows does. Hence, that's why Unix PC's and Unix based appliances are running the a lot of the Internet backbone and are acting as gateway servers into corporations. The only other means that competes with Unix in this regard is Cisco, Juniper, etc with their network appliances -- and guess what? JunOS runs FreeBSD, and Cisco is going to be running Linux soon. Surprised? I think not...

Oh, and as for hardware compatibility -- many hardware products that are still functional from operating system to operating system on Windows are deprecated on purpose because companies refuse to support drivers and apps for their devices. Well, guess what folks? If it's supported on Unix, the EOL for the device is much higher because people are expected to use devices for a much longer period of time than with Windows. Cool, eh?

Saves you $50~$300+ on purchasing new hardware for fully functional printers, scanners, USB devices, etc.

> 9.) Having your software pre-installed and ready to go when you buy your computer from a retailer.

Oh, I love having bloat preinstalled when I buy a PC. Norton, games, Nero, blah -- wewt -- bloat for the lose as they say.

> 10.) The ability to get software at a store, dealing face-to-face with people, as opposed to downloading over the internet (which many average users cannot afford to do).

Packaging and installation is a shortcoming of Unix, but it's a shortcoming that Windows suffers as well.

As least I can do...

yum install `blah'
apt-get install `blah'
pkg_add `blah'

... instead of having to hunt through a bunch of websites looking for software that I *think* works for my operating system, that is indeed safe for use because no one piggybacked a trojan or spyware into the app in the downloaded copy I get. YAY!

> However, at the rate at which it's advancing, I say give it a few years - less than five - and my list will be cut down to seven. Five years and it will be less than that. Ten years? My list might be the same, but comparing Windows' shortcomings to Linux.

Your list wreaks of lack of experience and knowledge. Please try some more things before writing things off as impossible.

I do the same thing in XP with my Desktop toolbar. I hide the Desktop then drag the Desktop Toolbar to the Desktop. It's just more compact, cleaner looking. However, I can't do this in Vista (Ultimate). Doesn't work anymore
I did try your tip, but that did not work. I right then left clicked dragged the Quick Launch folder from the Start menu Search results (and tried the Desktop folder too) to the edge of my desktop (and all around the desktop)but neither turned into Toolbars. Just the option to Move, Copy or Create a Shortcut. What did I do wrong?

More power for the illiterate! Menus you don?t have to read, just remember what the icon looked like! Run your mouse around the screen and click until the right action happens, just like a video game! How Fun! Never have t o read anything again!!

This new thinking, if you want to call it that, is dumbing down the computer user to the point that it is no longer a ?professional? tool. The problem is you can change the menus all you want, but as soon as a new version comes out, they like to change the pictures on the icons. What the heck do they mean now?

I like the idea of making the computer usable for everyone, but come on! The professional has long gone from the software, don?t call it that any more.

Just wondering, do you have your keyboard and mouse labeled so you know what they are? Or your phone, pens, rulers, calculator and fridge? Or do you know what they look like and you are able to recognise variations to them? Item (or icon) recognition is an essential skill, and in many cases far more useful than being able to read.

Providing IT support in a Public Library, I see my fair share of computers set up in languages other than English. I've managed to troubleshoot wireless network problems with most of these thanks to my knowledge of what each icon looks like and means. Far easier for me than learning how to read 12 different languages.

You know what I think about Vista? I think I am tired of hearing about it. Vista is Defective By Design, it's not an "upgrade" by any measure, and I wish the trade press would stop working as an extension of the Microsoft marketing department.

If it's from Microsoft or Apple, it's not news: both companies long ago abandoned technological innovation in favor of marketing blitzes and legal bullying. The trade press should show them both nothing but contempt, and focus instead on the real innovators, and on products that are genuine upgrades.

So shut up about Vista, already. It's not news.

Once comfortable in an environment there are always growing pains when moving to a new one. Face the natural discomfort head-on and give the changes a shot before trying to turn Vista into XP/2000/95. Microsoft did not make these changes just for the hell of it or to piss off end users. Considerable time, effort, and money were invested in usability studies to create something better with the end user in mind. Take that with a grain of salt, naturally, but at least give the changes a try for a while. Chances are that once you're accustomed to them, you will actually LIKE them.
When I see a user's desktop littered with one-hundred-fifty shortcuts to programs that are also in the start menu, I just have to shake my head and sigh. Windows 3.1 hasn't been around for years, and yet some people (and installation programs should be blamed for this!) still use their desktop like the old Program Manager. Check out the start menu, Sassafrass! You can even organize it however you want.
Before you bemoan a loss of features and go to great lengths to "get some of them back," resist the urge and try living differently for a couple weeks. You'll probably find yourself getting along just fine and maybe even find that the changes are improvements.

It's not so much that we( or maybe just me) regard the changes as ill conceived but, for my part, the level of training that we will have to dispence to the user communitity to get them up to speed.

I work in a distribution center where things change slower then anywhere else I can imagine. My end user group is not the most computer-literate. Having finally, recently, got them up to speed on win2k( yes, finally...go ahead an laugh!!!) to have to skip a generation of evolution in the 'Look-and-Feel' of an OS is going to be time consuming for this 3 person department.

Can we pay for training on the new UI? Sure, that would be nice. But, as I've said, we're a DC and getting groups of people to take training with out over burdening a department would be a tad difficult. Not to say anything about convincing individuals( or managers) of the necessity.

I like the analogy given somewhere in the prior posts about the hammer. The computer is just that - a hammer or tool to work with. We've had the claw hammer for generations and has the hammer maker changed it? Well, in minute ways - yes. But an overhaul like Vista from XP? The new hammer, for what ever it's improvements might be, would not sell.

That argument, of course, opens the door to why this market is so different from the other markets. Because, unlike most other markets there is just one hammer maker from the laman-worker bee perspective. Be that as it may( and an argument for another thread of the hundreds ) I don't like what I've heard, read, or seen for myself so far about the modifications to the OS. I would rather they fix the kernel and secure the current OS rather dump it for, from what I can tell so far, primarily UI changes.

Give an example of the above. Xp to Vista is not like going from 2k to XP. XP had so many improvements in areas that 2K lacked it was, by my reckoning, a much needed change. Now, XP is stable, functional, understandable, and most of all, a 'little' more secure then 2k was. What does Vista have that XP doesn't? Or that XP can't get with third party products? Nothing that I can tell.

M$ makes changes only to make money. That is the function of business. Changes lead to new requirements in hardware and software ... and the upgrade train moves on.

And frankly, what is really "new"?

Transparency and fancy graphics?

Transparency has been standard equipment on nVidia-equipped H-P systems for at least a year. The rest is just new pretty pictures and icons (ie, new pretty pictures for the PSP crowd that will shortly be replacing you).

Enhanced security?

If you call locking the user down tighter and tighter "enhanced security", then I guess you're correct. It is true that younger workers are a wee bit stupider (preferring pretty pictures to words like my kindergartener does) but is that any reason to cater to them? I wonder.

Functionality?

Hard to buy into this since the level of backwards INcompatibility reaches an all-time new high on this account. Not only will most people have to buy new software (oops, I mean upgrade ... and that is assuming the software company even bothers*), but even their hardware will likely require replacement as the memory reqirements exceed 1GB RAM for reasonable operation; and that is assuming the video card will work and the hard drive will be large enough ... not very good assumptions.

*one tiny example: I have used Borland's Reflex database since before Gates even saw windows running at the Xerox research center. And it was so well-written that it has worked on every M$ OS right up through XP Pro. Guess what? M$ changed a system file somewhere and now when Reflex starts up, it displays the wrong characters (ie, nonsense characters). The program still works. I can load files and print reports (yes, the menus are memorized after all these years) without any problem.

Progress and innovation? I think not.

Yet another attempt to make me upgrade to Office Professional to use Access? Ah, yes. Now we have the true picure.

You seem to have a something against younger people. It's funny you say that the "younger workers are a wee bit stupider[sic]," but I would be willing to bet that it's probably more likely that there are more people in your generation that punch-the-monkey, install twelve browser toolbars, buy herbal v1AgrA and breast augmentation pills from spam e-mail, send money to 419-scam artists in Africa, click that 'yes' button when asked to install adware, and then tell the clerk at the computer store that they think they have a virus and bitch about how Microsoft made Windows ******.
To suggest that the graphical changes made in Vista are just transparent window borders and in any way similar to the nVidia parlor tricks you're referring to is ignorant. Take a deeper look into what's under the hood- that's where the real changes lie. These changes might not make your DOS emulation run any faster, but they open new doors for developers to create more evocative and exciting software for everyone else in the world. Transparent window borders are not even the tip of the iceberg.
While you've been using Reflex and waving that flat file database banner so proudly, the rest of the world has moved on to more efficient and powerful DBMSes (even free ones!). It blows my mind that someone could expect *obsolete* software from the 1980s to still work in an OS several generations later. There comes a point where you just have to let it go. The fact that Reflex still runs is NOT a testament to the quality of the software. Lots of things will still run in the DOS emulator (command prompt)!
Yes, I am sure that someone at Microsoft is intentionally trying to get you and the rest of the cavalcade of Reflex users to ?upgrade to Office Professional to use Access? by making changes in Vista so that garbage characters are displayed. I bet that will generate *millions* of conversions to Office. You know what else still works after all these years? Horses! Ford and GM just come out with new vehicles every year to try to force people into getting rid of their horses when they are perfectly adequate for getting us to work and back. Have any other insight on insidious business practices or conspiracy theories?
Maybe Vista just isn't for you. You have all the freedom in the world to upgrade or not. Just as you have held on to Reflex all these years, why not stick with DOS 6 or Windows 3.1 or 95? If it meets your needs, use it. You won?t even need to upgrade hardware.
As for innovation, I don?t think anyone hell bent on using software from twenty years ago is qualified to make any assertions regarding ?progress and innovation.? So while you?re busy pissing on Microsoft?s parade, dust off and peek outside your Hobbit-hole.

"Take a deeper look into what's under the hood- that's where the real changes lie. These changes might not make your DOS emulation run any faster, but they open new doors for developers to create more evocative and exciting software for everyone else in the world. Transparent window borders are not even the tip of the iceberg."

What kind of new doors are opened for developers that aren't in XP? DirectX10 doesn't count as it isn't out yet and the release date is highly mobile.

What "evocative" software can't be made in XP?

Bravo! and Well Stated.

>>>It blows my mind that someone could expect *obsolete* software from the 1980s to still work in an OS several generations later. There comes a point where you just have to let it go. The fact that Reflex still runs is NOT a testament to the quality of the software. Lots of things will still run in the DOS emulator (command prompt)!

You need to rethink why people have computers. It's supposed to be a time-saver. I had a client who had hundreds of recipes in an old Tandy data base. When support for this DB went away, she had to retype everything to port it over. Many, many wasted hours.

On the other hand, I worked on Unisys mainframes for a Navy project. We ran code that the new programmers just could not understand. It had been designed for a Burroughs Corp punch card system in 1968 before Unisys was even formed. It used a special set of codes to recognize overpunches that were used in those systems to save one byte of memory by placing the negative sign in one of the columns in a numeric field. Crucial back in 1968, not needed now, but still preserved in the EBCDIC character set used by IBM and Unisys mainframes.

Why change a character set? It worked fine in 1968 and also worked fine 25 years later when we upgraded the software.

Just happened by and found the "Vista not developed for you alone, your majesty" thread.

Silly serfs. Of course it was developed just for me.

M$ hopes to entice me to abandon my nice speedy stable XP computers with the prospect of pretty pictures (AeroDoh!) and abbreviated functionality (missing the explorer menu bar anyone?).

Pretty pictures, like Trix, are for kids. You are excused. You may now return to your game box.

P.S. hmcm, few graphics-based DOS business programs even exist much less run from the current DOS prompt. And your poor client did not HAVE to re-key the recipes. Even today there are database programs that read the PRC format; and failing that, there are several Basic programs to convert any DB data file to ASCII or dBase. And mainframes impress me even less. My first "personal" computer was an IBM 360/155 with a whopping 8KB core! My first programming language was APL (with Ken Iverson's kind assistance). Ah. Those were the days.

I am a network administrator. What new features have they incorporated to make my duties easier? As I see it, what they have called improved security is only going to cause me more headaches to get legitimate software running again.

I appreciate innovative, productive changes. That's not what many of these comments have been complaining about. A memory intensive new UI doesn't fit my description of innovative or productive. It only makes our computers run slower so we buy new ones. But to be perfectly honest these aren't even the things that bother me the most.

MS has assumed the only use for audio/video outputs is for duplication so everyone who uses these outputs must therefore be a thief. I use these outputs to make my computer my entertainment system. But I can only do that with Vista if I put up with lower quality output. Do you really think I should think this is an improvement that I will come to like after I get used to it?

What happens when "they" decide that every pen sold will be used for forgery? How about making every hammer out of rubber because we "assume" they will be used for bashing in someone's skull?

What if every printer is forced to print an identifying mark on everything it prints so it can be traced back to the creator? You never know, the person could be printer ransom notes, or printing forged IDs.

The simple solution is to create the best tool you can. Then you punish/prosecute people who abuse those tools. You don't assume everyone is a criminal and disable some of the functionality of the tool. But this is exactly what MS and others are doing when it comes to audio and video equipment.

It's a really sad world when they assume everyone is bad.

messing with the DVD quality is outrageous---Microsoft is not my big brother and they never will be! Go to this extreme and there are other options.

vista is missing the internet games such as checkers, hearts, reversi, spades and backgammon.

can anyone tell me how to install them from the window xp cd or download them.

if you upgrade from window xp the games stay.

thx

Isn't it just so wonderful how M$ foresees the needs of it's important users beforehand? M$ is saving the IT folk's valuable time (normally wasted removing games from the system). And I am sure that an "enhancement package" will be made available at a modest cost for the rest of the rabble.

I personally like Windows Vista and how it looks and feels. I have beta tested it since it first came out and now I own Windows Vista Ultimate myself. Yes, there are programs that still don't run on the new OS but soon more software packages should be Vista Compatible or have patches for you to download so they can be run on the new OS.

sharing your expense account so the rest of us can afford to update our hardware / software / peripherals, etc. to work with the latest version of M$ware we'll eventually be forced to "upgrade" to? Be a pal.

Do I sound a little negative? Perhaps it comes from having to shell out a couple thousand bucks every couple years so Bill can afford $2,000 door knobs. And that is just my personal computers. Heaven knows how much money the company had to shell out for hundreds of systems (which might explain the lack of bonuses this year)!

. . .is that you think too much. Did Bill tell you to think for yourself? Of course not. Bad people! Bad, bad people!

See Grub, he's a good people. "I like it. It's pretty. It will work one day, Bill said so. All I had to do is buy new software. Oh, the old stuff was still working fine, but Bill said it had expired."

I agree with a few other posts. It doesn't matter what you think. Bill, in his infinite wisdom will take administrative rights away because we are to simple minded to manage our own boxes. Just think of the revenue streams for M$$upport when we have to call them to do any administrative task on our box. After all, we don't own our copy of M$$oftware, we payed for the right to use it. M$ still owns it.