but i got it. i tried again the code of tony and would you believe it never caught the radio button. (i had all of the radio buttons not in the form but in a group box on the form!)
when i put a radio button directly on the form it (tony's code) worked!! i then found from google a way to scan through the control when it is a groupbox looking for radio buttons.

thanks to both of you. i am slow but verry appreciative.

and as tony pointed this is reallyl the way do this and not with the hack tag.

david