Yes, but that is NOTHING new... it has always been a young man's game. We didn't discover this just in the last year... I'm pretty sure when I graduated from college back in the late '77 I was the cocky young thing that everyone hated. The really ugly problem today, especially pervasive in the IT industry, is that the "old" guys just don't have it... If I was a carpenter or plumber and had to compete with the young, faster men I'd be outdated... but there is no excuse for that in the IT industry where experience is valued and no physical skills are required to stay current and "hot" in your IT area. I'm wondering what we use as an excuse in the IT industry... I've been rejected by more 30-something hiring managers in the last year because I didn't fit the "age" part of their hiring demographic. Shame, I could have probably saved them a lot of stressful Fridays and Mondays when that "young buck" they hired couldn't make it in because of -yourexcusehere-.... Thank goodness I finally got in with a company rich enought to actually appreciate experience (thank you mucho, HP!) - not that I mean I am getting paid what I am worth. But I am getting paid a reasonable, average salary and in the worst "economy" we have seen in 50+ years, THAT (and having a job) feels pretty good. Oh, Toni, on a personal note I stll love that red hair! Best regards...BetterinBoise