Well, this is very interesting, intriguing and weird!
I think having lots of shortcuts and speed dials everywhere around us may degrade our ability to invent shortcuts for our daily tasks over time. Plus, as you said, stuffing plenty of irrelevant info into our heads might be problematic. When an average person sleeps, their brain filters out whatever is useless to it. However, just how much can the brain filter out?!
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Try to have a conversation with someone who plays Farmville or Pogo games all day.........their brains are melted.
This explains why although I delete repeated requests for farm equipment/animals, artillery/fake money, and freaky animated stuffed animals. I continue to receive these stupid requests. It's brain damage!
I think it depends on the person. Some can manage smoking cannabis and using the computer all day long. Its more of a genetic thing that a theory that can be applied across the board.
Even more amazing when one can find a show that doesn't leave the viewer feeling dumber for having watched. Everybody love Raymond, Simpsons/Friends reruns and Star Trek TFG when my TV provider doesn't have the license to show the game? Oh Boy!!
The real contrast for me was living without TV for a few months then with it again. It is literally a subscription for advertising. Your paying for the privileged of watching advertising content.. which.. sometimes has segments of shows or movies inbetween the six or so add blocks in an hour.
I will at least say that children's TV has improved, much of the toddler programming is educational.
The real contrast for me was living without TV for a few months then with it again. It is literally a subscription for advertising. Your paying for the privileged of watching advertising content.. which.. sometimes has segments of shows or movies inbetween the six or so add blocks in an hour.
I will at least say that children's TV has improved, much of the toddler programming is educational.
I'm in complete agreement with you about television and its mindless drivel. A few years ago I read about a study that said people who sit on their couch staring at the wall or reading a book burn more calories than the same person sitting in the same spot watching tv. Television is capitalism's best tool for feeding the insatiable human desire for more and more (of whatever). If I just had more of this or another one of those I'd be a:
A.Better
B.More popular
C.More attractive
D.More well liked
E.More powerful
person, mate, parent, employee, neighbor, etc.
Since the birth of commerical internet, it's become another tool to assist the human in completing the above purchasing process without ever leaving the house.
Something to consider is that by the time this study was conducted, there were more households with computers bought by non-technical consumers whose only goal was to "surf the internet", exchange emails and shop. I know some very intelligent smokers(most(but not all, so don't flame me) being Linux users) and I've worked in public facing help desk environments where my faith in an intelligent human race has diminished considerably. But it's created active conversation around the office this morning.
Thanks!
A.Better
B.More popular
C.More attractive
D.More well liked
E.More powerful
person, mate, parent, employee, neighbor, etc.
Since the birth of commerical internet, it's become another tool to assist the human in completing the above purchasing process without ever leaving the house.
Something to consider is that by the time this study was conducted, there were more households with computers bought by non-technical consumers whose only goal was to "surf the internet", exchange emails and shop. I know some very intelligent smokers(most(but not all, so don't flame me) being Linux users) and I've worked in public facing help desk environments where my faith in an intelligent human race has diminished considerably. But it's created active conversation around the office this morning.
Thanks!
Especially since marijuana does not effect IQ in anyway shape or manner.
I could see that while a person is stoned they may not score (or care) as well, but really what a load of crap to make the contrast.
I could see that while a person is stoned they may not score (or care) as well, but really what a load of crap to make the contrast.
There is no denying that the spell-checker has wrecked our ability to spell correctly or to edit effectively.
Perhaps a better testament would be a recent conversation I had with an iphone equipped college graduate salesman. Said salesman could not calculate .50 cents * 22 business days to determine how much money would be saved in a month by bringing one's lunch, instead of eating food off the dollar menu - without consulting his trusty iphone calculator app.
Sad.
Perhaps a better testament would be a recent conversation I had with an iphone equipped college graduate salesman. Said salesman could not calculate .50 cents * 22 business days to determine how much money would be saved in a month by bringing one's lunch, instead of eating food off the dollar menu - without consulting his trusty iphone calculator app.
Sad.
you meant 50 cents, not ".50 cents", i.e. half a cent, but I see your mistake more often in older writing than in newer, so I do not blame the computer.
Hm. This ability wouldn't be necessary should English be a phonetic language, and a lot of intellectual resource may be used for better tasks.
(zis abiliti udn't bi nesesari shud Inglish bi a fonetic languidj , end a lot of intelectuel risors mei bi iuzd for beter tascs)
(?ɪs əˈbɪlɪti ˈwʊdnt bɪ ˈnɛsəˌsɛri ʃʊd ˈɪŋglɪʃ bɪ ə fəˈnɛtɪk ˈl?ŋgwɪdʒ , ?nd ə lɒt ɒv ˌɪntlˈɛktʃuəl ˈrisɔrs meɪ bɪ yuzd fɔr ˈbɛtər tɑsks) (unfortunatelly, using IPA notation doesn't work well on this site)
(zis abiliti udn't bi nesesari shud Inglish bi a fonetic languidj , end a lot of intelectuel risors mei bi iuzd for beter tascs)
(?ɪs əˈbɪlɪti ˈwʊdnt bɪ ˈnɛsəˌsɛri ʃʊd ˈɪŋglɪʃ bɪ ə fəˈnɛtɪk ˈl?ŋgwɪdʒ , ?nd ə lɒt ɒv ˌɪntlˈɛktʃuəl ˈrisɔrs meɪ bɪ yuzd fɔr ˈbɛtər tɑsks) (unfortunatelly, using IPA notation doesn't work well on this site)
My 17 year old can barely read a common clock. By the time she started school they didn't have to learn that anymore (everything was digital). Although I kept traditional clocks in the house and my other 2 kids can read them, she was told at school she didn't "have" to know that. Last year they stopped teaching cursive writing in schools stating that since "we all" just send texts and make phone calls to communicate we don't need to know that anymore either.
Scary stuff
Scary stuff
I am constantly puzzled for what passes as education in the USA. It seems they are forever dumbing down the population. I think this is more a problem for IQ than anything else. Given your war mongering government I guess it wants canon fodder and not intelligent, questioning citizens. A lot of you confuse 'then' with 'than', two very different words. No wonder so few from the US of A can spell, now they can't even tell the time. Hollywood and TV don't make any thing that might tax the American mind, we find your entertainment so dull and mindless!! I wouldn't blame technology or dope, I'd blame the government and the corporations who run the government. Most of your lesser educated even believe you have a genuine democracy, that's the funniest part!
Believe that what they see from a distance is representative of an entire population.
It worked for Asama.
Look what he achieved not yet found though he has to be tethered to a Dialysis Machine every couple of days.
I think I said something similar to Maxwell a few years ago now something along the Lines that Hollywood and US TV is doing a massive disservice to the US Population.
No I certainly do not think that is how most in the US live but unfortunately it is portrayed that way by people with vested interests.
Col
Look what he achieved not yet found though he has to be tethered to a Dialysis Machine every couple of days.
I think I said something similar to Maxwell a few years ago now something along the Lines that Hollywood and US TV is doing a massive disservice to the US Population.
No I certainly do not think that is how most in the US live but unfortunately it is portrayed that way by people with vested interests.
Col
About the disservice being done. But I'm not seeing more of an agenda from Hollywood other than making as much money as possible.
Any other vested interests are cutting their own political throats with such portrayals. They just don't realize that eventually their audience will wake up and realize "Hey, he's talking about ME!"
Any other vested interests are cutting their own political throats with such portrayals. They just don't realize that eventually their audience will wake up and realize "Hey, he's talking about ME!"
Viewers like portrayals of TV characters who are dumber than they are -- it simultaneously makes them feel superior and reduces their social pressure to perform.
Unh? Wossat? What were we talking about?
Of course computers are not having any impact on my IQ. I still have full grasp of my wossernames.
Of course computers are not having any impact on my IQ. I still have full grasp of my wossernames.
You still know enough that you need to wipe the Drool from your Chin.
I have just grown a beard so I don't need to remember important things like that. Not to mention that I wear weird Patterns to hide the drool stains.
Now where did I put my Car Keys. Seems like I've been looking for them for about 50 years now.
Col
I have just grown a beard so I don't need to remember important things like that. Not to mention that I wear weird Patterns to hide the drool stains.
Now where did I put my Car Keys. Seems like I've been looking for them for about 50 years now.
Col
OH after lots of Goggling I found out that they live in the Kitchen.
So it's not possible that my keys are there because I'm not allowed in the Kitchen.
Col
So it's not possible that my keys are there because I'm not allowed in the Kitchen.
Col
I find this hard to believe. Esp for those of use who've been using computers for nearly our entire lives!
Shouldn't have have meant I wouldn't make the top 10% in my graduating class?
Shouldn't have have meant I wouldn't make the top 10% in my graduating class?
What a stupid and absurd survey. The very meaning of making life easy it is not detrimental to our IQ it leaves room for more development of much more complex task, like lifting the toilet seat when you use it XD. What is hurting our IQ is not the use of the computer it is the content in which we engage in on a daily basis. I start my coding development routine and end up listening to music and watching youtube videos for about 30 minutes before I start. So the computer? No, the content? YES Absolutely!! Tools to make life easy are good and it does not hurt you in one bit I think, but if you continue to pay much more attention to what your friend is saying on Facebook then what NY Times has to say about global warming then we have a problem.
I know it might take longer if you've been computing for a long time.
think back to the creation of digital watches, there are so many kids today that can't tell time on a standard clock face. They don't even know that the short hand is hours and the long hand is minutes. IF they can figure it out, its usually not instant recognition when they see the hands, it's a much slower thought process to figure out time by viewing each hand independently.
Now look at spelling today, I can't believe how many adults can't even spell the simplest words as they rely on spell check so often they forgot to spell. (Note:any spelling errors here will merely be a result of my crappy typing skills, I have an above average spelling ability)
Then look at simple skills such as cursive handwriting. I FORCE myself to write and print calligraphy once in a while just to work my motor skills and control of a pen. It's amazing how rusty you get when you don't keep it up.
On the other side, I used to smoke a heap of dope (I'm in BC too, GOOD dope), I've toured and managed bands and was quick to join in on festivities, with little care except to stay away from heroin. I never had issue with such basic functions as we see today with computer reliance, there is no doubt that computers feed us lots of info and we learn in different ways, but such basic motor skills are completely lost these days. As civilization has evolved over centuries there are lots of things we once could manage that we no longer can. Just as kids that spend too much time on they computer these days can't play sports like we used to, they don't learn and practice basic skills and focus on a completely different skill set of information gathering, texting etc. Many kids (and adults) don't develop ANY social skills anymore.
They rely on on line social networking and texting and have no idea how to actually function in live social settings, making the newer generation a socially inept, awkward society.
To suggest that you don't see these obvious changes in society simply proves the point of the original survey.
think back to the creation of digital watches, there are so many kids today that can't tell time on a standard clock face. They don't even know that the short hand is hours and the long hand is minutes. IF they can figure it out, its usually not instant recognition when they see the hands, it's a much slower thought process to figure out time by viewing each hand independently.
Now look at spelling today, I can't believe how many adults can't even spell the simplest words as they rely on spell check so often they forgot to spell. (Note:any spelling errors here will merely be a result of my crappy typing skills, I have an above average spelling ability)
Then look at simple skills such as cursive handwriting. I FORCE myself to write and print calligraphy once in a while just to work my motor skills and control of a pen. It's amazing how rusty you get when you don't keep it up.
On the other side, I used to smoke a heap of dope (I'm in BC too, GOOD dope), I've toured and managed bands and was quick to join in on festivities, with little care except to stay away from heroin. I never had issue with such basic functions as we see today with computer reliance, there is no doubt that computers feed us lots of info and we learn in different ways, but such basic motor skills are completely lost these days. As civilization has evolved over centuries there are lots of things we once could manage that we no longer can. Just as kids that spend too much time on they computer these days can't play sports like we used to, they don't learn and practice basic skills and focus on a completely different skill set of information gathering, texting etc. Many kids (and adults) don't develop ANY social skills anymore.
They rely on on line social networking and texting and have no idea how to actually function in live social settings, making the newer generation a socially inept, awkward society.
To suggest that you don't see these obvious changes in society simply proves the point of the original survey.
I'm not so sure it's *IQ* points that a really dropping.
Just our ability, nay, our willingness to think for ourselves is leaving this society.
I remember reading a story in jr high about the future... all kids were home-schooled. And the 2 the story focused on had found books.. real books. It was hard to read and they were funny b/c the words didn't move across the screen for them. They stood still, and...oh no, pages!! TO TURN?!?
I hope we don't get that far.
Just our ability, nay, our willingness to think for ourselves is leaving this society.
I remember reading a story in jr high about the future... all kids were home-schooled. And the 2 the story focused on had found books.. real books. It was hard to read and they were funny b/c the words didn't move across the screen for them. They stood still, and...oh no, pages!! TO TURN?!?
I hope we don't get that far.
... but the TR site STILL hasn't implemented a brainwave interface, and I'm too lazy to type.
IQ tests use 'norms' for the testing. For example, it is normal to spell a word but not normal to use text lingo. So, maybe the people are not loosing intelligence, but it is the test is not suited for them. The same can be seen with inner city kids that take a standard IQ test. They may score low on the test, but through observation people can see they are not unintelligent. You wouldn't give an IQ test tailored for American children to British children.
Also, I saw a study a while back that said spanking your child lowers their IQ (I'm not familiar with the whole study, but when I read the excerpt it seemed that no tests were done early in the child?s life, until maybe 5). Well, what if the people that resort to spanking have lower IQs to start and thus pass that on to their children? In a lot of studies, more than just the study results need to be examined.
(12 years in K-12 ed showing)
Bob
We should then start smoking computers and using the marijuana for performing complicated calculations...
Hey Toni,
I was wondering if you could cite your source. I find this hard to believe and I think that the data must somehow be flawed. I find that the average geek is more intelligent than the average stoner. Perhaps this is not a consequence of their choices.
I was wondering if you could cite your source. I find this hard to believe and I think that the data must somehow be flawed. I find that the average geek is more intelligent than the average stoner. Perhaps this is not a consequence of their choices.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4471607.stm
http://articles.sfgate.com/2005-05-04/business/17372212_1_medicinal-marijuana-e-mails-text-messages
Haven't tracked down the original paper and I don't even know if it has been formally published.
http://articles.sfgate.com/2005-05-04/business/17372212_1_medicinal-marijuana-e-mails-text-messages
Haven't tracked down the original paper and I don't even know if it has been formally published.
Those using only computers were bereft of their IQ-enhancing pot.
Bingo. Correlation does not imply causation. It could be the other way around: those with higher IQ choose pot because they have to escape the ceaseless hum of their own brains, while those with lower IQ need the help of their devices. Or it could be merely a coincidence, or a sampling error, or a misapplication of the results.
Then if you feel like stopping, turn your PC on.....
If you feel yourself to be getting dumber, go back to the weed...
If you feel yourself to be getting dumber, go back to the weed...
Even when I was young and doing LSD etc. I was much sharper than I am now when it came to math, penmanship etc. I've always been able to spell so I don't know if there's been a change there but I don't use spell checker, as everyone here knows all too well.
I cetainly saw no loss of brain activity from my sordid past, but I practice basic skills such as memory systems (not just Oulook reminders etc). Today's youth seems to have issues telling time or remembering what days they don't have to go to school unless they have Outlook or an iPhone to reach for.
It's like my nephew, he can't use a knife AND fork at the same time, he was never pushed to and now looks like an idiot when we go out to eat. Without practicing basic motor and memory skills, you simply lose them.
I cetainly saw no loss of brain activity from my sordid past, but I practice basic skills such as memory systems (not just Oulook reminders etc). Today's youth seems to have issues telling time or remembering what days they don't have to go to school unless they have Outlook or an iPhone to reach for.
It's like my nephew, he can't use a knife AND fork at the same time, he was never pushed to and now looks like an idiot when we go out to eat. Without practicing basic motor and memory skills, you simply lose them.
The GUI reinforces "discovery".. don't remember the thing.. only how to find it in the given limited environment.
The CLI reinforces "rote" memory.. The system "help" is available as are command "--help" details but generally, your going to remember what you repeat frequently. Just like anywhere else in life; practice makes it stick.
I wonder if the study recorded a difference between CLI/terminal use and GUI use.
The CLI reinforces "rote" memory.. The system "help" is available as are command "--help" details but generally, your going to remember what you repeat frequently. Just like anywhere else in life; practice makes it stick.
I wonder if the study recorded a difference between CLI/terminal use and GUI use.
they spoke of distractions...
So, yeah, on one hand, a dopehead sitting in pristine all-beige room (norwegian wood), with no gadgets to distract.
On the other hand, a person frantically multitouching away on his tablet while simultaneously trying to order his laptop around using voice recognition, and peeking at his crackberry too...
Who's less distracted?
So, yeah, on one hand, a dopehead sitting in pristine all-beige room (norwegian wood), with no gadgets to distract.
On the other hand, a person frantically multitouching away on his tablet while simultaneously trying to order his laptop around using voice recognition, and peeking at his crackberry too...
Who's less distracted?
Windows, MAC, Linux .....
I've seen lot's of comment comparing these technically (sic) but has anybody looked at the relative effects on our intellect?
I've seen lot's of comment comparing these technically (sic) but has anybody looked at the relative effects on our intellect?
.. but.. normally based on personal preferences or the argument of the day.. hm.. not sure if it's been approached scientifically.
I think you hit on the fundamental question here... is the effect related to the GUI? I assume the study only considered computers sporting a GUI... and the one thing all GUIs have in common?
The MOUSE!
After all they are pan-dimensional beings, running experiments on us while leading us to believe we are superior and in charge of the experiment...
Insidious. Can the mind of man ever be the same again?
The MOUSE!
After all they are pan-dimensional beings, running experiments on us while leading us to believe we are superior and in charge of the experiment...
Insidious. Can the mind of man ever be the same again?
Well, if you'd stop squirming and let us fasten this thing around your head.. we could open it up and have a look..
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