Discussion on:

Designing websites without code

One of the most annoying things about web sites designed by other applications is that they usually end up overloaded with excess code, scripts calling other scripts calling other scripts, propriety software required to view, lots of bells and whistles that aren't needed, and all that requires a hell of a lot more bandwidth and time to download than a well written site does. I know an experienced person can go back in and tighten the code etc., but the average person using these programs doesn't know how to make them tighter.

It's applications like this that encourage graphics artists to design pretty web sites without any knowledge or understanding of coding - and often end up with bloated web sites or ones that will only work in something like flash, etc.

Personally, I think anyone who does not learn the basics of coding and doesn't check the finished product for tight code should NEVER be allowed to design a web page or site.

but yeah, these bloated cms systems are being abused, just as jquery is, tables and frames were.

and yup, they fill the site with bad generated code that is excessive in it's data transfer requirements.

and QUALITY website developer would never choose to use such bloated scripts, they are the refuge of the INCOMPETENT.

Typing away....

Right tool for the job everything has its place, so what do you use when you need to build a CMS site?

use the tools that fit the need of the site owner.

have yet to see a site that absolutely required Joomla or Drupal.
there are far more cms scripts than those 2 bloated pigs.

If these were mature tools, they would optimise all code and behaviour in the same way modern compilers do. If they don't perhaps they aren't as mature as their vendors/spruikers think they are.

their comfort zone, they produce absolute garbage.
Write a website without code might be a laudable idea, write one without any knowledge of how the web works is feeble minded drivel encouraged by incompetents who merely want to create yet another artificial abundance of "qualified" developers.
Try scaling the rubbish these things come out with....

I've set up Drupal sites and I've set up WordPress sites, WP can be used pretty easily. But Drupal is a bloody nightmare. You might not be writing code, but it sure helps to know how to read it to get stuff done. For a site that doesn't need people doing things like commenting or posting to forums, you are better off with a system like HomeSite or Expression Web which lets you define templates and generate static pages than Drupal.

J.Ja

Oracle Application Express is more of a no (or minimal) code application framework for secure, scalable db driven web apps that I have grown to appreciate... and it is free. SQL and PL/SQL knowledge is beneficial but not required. I have used this to develop some very complex applications with an intuitive UI, enforced workflow, audit trail, field validations, charts, declarative ajax and much more.

I have used NVU for years and have never had any serious problems with it. With some playing around and learning the options that will be useful for the site being maintained, this program is OUTSTANDING.