I love working in the Help Desk, and most things that are a part of that. I have talked many users down off of the ledge.
I hate telling people Help Desk because they give me a disparaging look. I do so many different things they have no idea!
Now, the next person who tells me, "I know this because my (significant person in their lives) is an (engineer/programmer/sysadmin)" will drive me to the ledge!
I can't even count how many arguments I have had with the engineer/programmer/sysadmin significant-other about the solution to the problem. I am always right, I know my systems and my job, and they HATE that.
Not all help desk techs deserve the bad rap...
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You might want to think about what you are saying there, it makes you sound like some sort of pratt, or worse still gives the impression that you think others are. Maybe the latter is what they hate....
I don't disparage those on help desk, people who claim to be always right, that's a different mineral altogther.
You might want to think about what you are saying there, it makes you sound like some sort of pratt, or worse still gives the impression that you think others are. Maybe the latter is what they hate....
I don't disparage those on help desk, people who claim to be always right, that's a different mineral altogther.
Here's a quote that sums up what I, a MS SQL Server DBA and former Unisys DMSII DBA, have to say:
We obey no one. We are the Superior Beings!
Supreme Dalek
We obey no one. We are the Superior Beings!
Supreme Dalek
Currently I'm an IT Manager, but I worked my way up from Component Level Tech., Help Desk, Network Engineer, Web Designer, Technical Lead, Project Coordinator, Sr. Project Manager to finally... IT Manager.
Do I remember Ohms Law, SQL statements, subnetting and Risk Analysis? Yes. Do I miss any of them? No.
I've run into this lack of respect when entering new teams but find that once your team realizes that you were once in their shoes...and worked your way to many levels beyond...that its all good.
Do I remember Ohms Law, SQL statements, subnetting and Risk Analysis? Yes. Do I miss any of them? No.
I've run into this lack of respect when entering new teams but find that once your team realizes that you were once in their shoes...and worked your way to many levels beyond...that its all good.
I think I would qualify the list as "Prestige within the IT community".
Most people outside of IT don't know the difference between a Systems Analyst and a DBA.
When non-IT people have a problem with their computer, they generally don't know who to turn to. They just put in a ticket.
For the most part, they hold the CIO or the Director of IT in higher esteem because he or she is ultimately responsible for getting it fixed.
Most people outside of IT don't know the difference between a Systems Analyst and a DBA.
When non-IT people have a problem with their computer, they generally don't know who to turn to. They just put in a ticket.
For the most part, they hold the CIO or the Director of IT in higher esteem because he or she is ultimately responsible for getting it fixed.
Hello JJ Fitz.
You are right. DBA, systems analyst, manager and project lead are roles only the most knowledgeable user would understand but IT professionals should understand. Users have a pretty good idea who programs their games, answers their call for help, blocks the Internet, fixes their computer and generates their reports.
You are right. DBA, systems analyst, manager and project lead are roles only the most knowledgeable user would understand but IT professionals should understand. Users have a pretty good idea who programs their games, answers their call for help, blocks the Internet, fixes their computer and generates their reports.
The system architect? According to the Matrix anyway. I mean look at all that buggy code the programmers came up with - cats crossing your path twice indeed .. rubbish.
I guess qa is at the bottom of the list... Poor qa testers....
All the mentioned jobs are important because they are delivering their products to the end clients, the users. But who trains the users to use all this lovely new software/hardware? A Trainer. So often ignored in a rollout or project the first contact and realtime use will be dictated by a Trainer. Next time would all the other most important jobs and professions remember that the Trainer can make or break a project by their enthusiasm, or lack of it, knowledge, support they get and dare I say, the amount they are paid.
If you were to buy a fantastic luxury car and have it delivered by a the cheapest method you can, by a driver not supported in knowing when, to whom and how, with no knowledge of the product and it's developments, then you would not be pleased. This so often happens.
Remember who first speaks to the real users .......
If you were to buy a fantastic luxury car and have it delivered by a the cheapest method you can, by a driver not supported in knowing when, to whom and how, with no knowledge of the product and it's developments, then you would not be pleased. This so often happens.
Remember who first speaks to the real users .......
So, does this mean that Testers and the whole QA department dont get respected at all? Not in the top 10? Well, there goes the saying - 'Teachers and Testers have the most thankless job of all'
Btw, I have seen many guys with big and impressive IT titles but lacking in knowledge. And I have seen some geeks doing excellent job being happy with normal title and many times its paychecks that matters.
The very best DBAs have three standard responses to any question they are asked. Yes, yes you can't have that because it will foul up everything for everyone else. No, no you're not having that and asking every week for it isn't going to make it happen as you know for a fact it will mess up everything for everyone else and make the entire database unreadable. Depends, ok you might have a good idea here, lets work on it and come up with a plan that means it will work and allow everyone else to keep on working.
IT Consultant, Software Consultant, Network Consultant and more! The word "consultant" USED to carry a lot of prestige until everyone suddenly became a "consultant". Now it's just a title given to someone when nothing else fits.
I have found, just recently at my job, that when the chips are down (and budgets too) that employers look for someone that can fill combination roles. I am due to be tapped for a Programmer/Analyst position. I like the challenge of designing a system, then working on the code for it. When a person can fill multiple roles and also work well with others to leverage the best of abilities on a team, they tend to get noticed when given the chance to showcase - which I have done recently.
I can be harder for IT Pros who are in a distributed department, like mine. I am at a satellite location and was overlooked for many years. When the right managers found out what I was capable of, I took the opportunity to shine and showcase my abilities. It really doesn't matter what job you do, it has more to do with knowing what you are capable of, constantly updating your abilities and being truthful when you are asked questions like "can this be done?" That is when you get the admiration and prestige no matter where you work or what your job title is.
I can be harder for IT Pros who are in a distributed department, like mine. I am at a satellite location and was overlooked for many years. When the right managers found out what I was capable of, I took the opportunity to shine and showcase my abilities. It really doesn't matter what job you do, it has more to do with knowing what you are capable of, constantly updating your abilities and being truthful when you are asked questions like "can this be done?" That is when you get the admiration and prestige no matter where you work or what your job title is.
You have a great attitude. There are people who can put Gear A on Shaft B 40 hours a week and love it. I don't think most IT professionals fit into that category though. They would be bored in the first hour. Changing jobs and roles is challenging and increases your value to an employer. If you can do more than one job you have a bit of immunity when the pink slips fly. Self esteem and prestige will follow.
My experience over 42 years of professional IT work -- in sometimes less than professional environments, dysfunctional, actually -- is that it used to be decades ago is what counted was your technical skills and what you could do. Innovative sophisticated problem solving skills which could "save" an organization might not have been publically acknowledged, but there was an underlying honor and respect.
In the last decade, particularly, things have really gone downhill, seriously degraded and gone sideways: Those who have a high degree of technological skills who can do marvelous amazing things are treated with utter contempt by narcissistic sociopathic ethically challenged management and their sychophantic lackies. If you haven't learned to lie successfully by the age of five (as outlined by the study by those fun guys at the University of Toronto), you have no place in the modern IT venue populated with those who are immoral, unethical and illegal: You are doomed. It is just business and you are an object to be manipulated for whatever some dimwitted manager wants it to be according to his or her pathetic agenda.
The end justifies the means, don't get caught and don't try to get something for nothing: Get everything for nothing. We have problems here -- shrinking budgets, people demanding higher up the food chain, wanting to know JUST HOW IT IS GOING TO PROVE ITS WORTH! Ah, all these pressures. So little time. So much to do. All those empty promises of glorious projects which keep changing direction as gutless weaklings sit down with customers and Agile Program on the fly without thought of design nor -- as it turns out -- any documentation for the final product. Throw out process and ignore ITIL, because it doesn't fit the vision of being fleet of foot, shuffling the truth at pretigious speeds to produce more glossy but empty applications.
I don't suppose that it will all come crashing down one day. The clients and users have gotten used to the mediocre with things that just don't work right, crashing at unexpected times and those updates which have to be withdrawn because everything stops working. Expensive in-house solutions which could be bought off the shelf for pennies on the dollar are ignored in what amounts to management empire building for a comfortable tomorrow based on deception.
Respect? Forget it.
Some day, business and government (a specialized supposedly non profit business) will wake up and dispense with all these magnificent development and support structures in favor of off-the-shelf products used like utilities like (the telephone used to be) cell phones and i-pods with Google and whatever else. Outsourcing will escalate as it has been. IT jobs in all but third and fourth world countries will disappear in favor of outsourcing to third and fourth world business, with their sweatshops not unlike garment manufacturers. Will children under 8 be answering the phones from remote parts of the world with an accent which is undecipherable? We may have already harbingers of the future.
I would say -- and this is just me, understand -- that if you have any respect in IT, enjoy it while you can, but after all that it is said and done it makes you money to support yourself. Anything beyond that wondrous moment is inconsequential in spite of Maslow's pyramid of needs, because respect is quite a distant second in needs to feeding yourself. My advice is to get a life outside work and use serious emotional insulation from your work environment. You'll live longer (and, probably, more happily and 'successfully' whatever that means to you).
In the last decade, particularly, things have really gone downhill, seriously degraded and gone sideways: Those who have a high degree of technological skills who can do marvelous amazing things are treated with utter contempt by narcissistic sociopathic ethically challenged management and their sychophantic lackies. If you haven't learned to lie successfully by the age of five (as outlined by the study by those fun guys at the University of Toronto), you have no place in the modern IT venue populated with those who are immoral, unethical and illegal: You are doomed. It is just business and you are an object to be manipulated for whatever some dimwitted manager wants it to be according to his or her pathetic agenda.
The end justifies the means, don't get caught and don't try to get something for nothing: Get everything for nothing. We have problems here -- shrinking budgets, people demanding higher up the food chain, wanting to know JUST HOW IT IS GOING TO PROVE ITS WORTH! Ah, all these pressures. So little time. So much to do. All those empty promises of glorious projects which keep changing direction as gutless weaklings sit down with customers and Agile Program on the fly without thought of design nor -- as it turns out -- any documentation for the final product. Throw out process and ignore ITIL, because it doesn't fit the vision of being fleet of foot, shuffling the truth at pretigious speeds to produce more glossy but empty applications.
I don't suppose that it will all come crashing down one day. The clients and users have gotten used to the mediocre with things that just don't work right, crashing at unexpected times and those updates which have to be withdrawn because everything stops working. Expensive in-house solutions which could be bought off the shelf for pennies on the dollar are ignored in what amounts to management empire building for a comfortable tomorrow based on deception.
Respect? Forget it.
Some day, business and government (a specialized supposedly non profit business) will wake up and dispense with all these magnificent development and support structures in favor of off-the-shelf products used like utilities like (the telephone used to be) cell phones and i-pods with Google and whatever else. Outsourcing will escalate as it has been. IT jobs in all but third and fourth world countries will disappear in favor of outsourcing to third and fourth world business, with their sweatshops not unlike garment manufacturers. Will children under 8 be answering the phones from remote parts of the world with an accent which is undecipherable? We may have already harbingers of the future.
I would say -- and this is just me, understand -- that if you have any respect in IT, enjoy it while you can, but after all that it is said and done it makes you money to support yourself. Anything beyond that wondrous moment is inconsequential in spite of Maslow's pyramid of needs, because respect is quite a distant second in needs to feeding yourself. My advice is to get a life outside work and use serious emotional insulation from your work environment. You'll live longer (and, probably, more happily and 'successfully' whatever that means to you).
Since I've been in this field for sometime, 1 through 3 seems be dead on from my experience. I've held several titles in the other categories, and your statements (rank) gave me a chuckle. This is a keeper. Thanks Alan.
You just made my day! I am glad to read that you 'get it' and appreciate the lighter side of the article.
A really GOOD network admin absolutely sits ABOVE the IT Manager, and frequently sits above the System Engineer, potentially on par with analysts, programmers and DBAs. A good network engineer is responsible for the firewall, for appliances that round-robin, load balance and provide high availability, for network monitoring and security. The ability to do stateful packet inspection of all traffic on the LAN is awesome power that even analysts, programmers and DBAs don't want to cross. I mean, when you get down to it, the physical transport layer is where you get to ask, "who owns barter-town" and it is easiest to say, "embargo on". This is where hacks, exploits and malware begin. This is the expertise by which Anonymous launches attacks. I think you've seriously undervalued the informal prestige of working at the network layer. I think the trick is that it is comprised of some of the most complex systems in the enterprise, and a lot of people working at this level aren't very good.
I think a lot of this is organizational - it depends on your team. At Intel we had a lead network engineer who was a God among IT workers. His systems walked on water and made everthing more pleasant for the entire tema. Our DBA couldn't write a stored procedure that could select * from escape where table = wet paper bag. The respect level was appropriately adjusted.
I've never had a lot of respect for project leads. It seems like the place where people with substandard tech skills hide and instead focus on soft administration and policy issues that require good organizational and people skills but not a lot of tech savvy. I mean, they do their part - and they're generally well connected organizationally - but they're more like leeche, er... pilot-fish, in the IT industry. At least, that has been my experience.
I think a lot of this is organizational - it depends on your team. At Intel we had a lead network engineer who was a God among IT workers. His systems walked on water and made everthing more pleasant for the entire tema. Our DBA couldn't write a stored procedure that could select * from escape where table = wet paper bag. The respect level was appropriately adjusted.
I've never had a lot of respect for project leads. It seems like the place where people with substandard tech skills hide and instead focus on soft administration and policy issues that require good organizational and people skills but not a lot of tech savvy. I mean, they do their part - and they're generally well connected organizationally - but they're more like leeche, er... pilot-fish, in the IT industry. At least, that has been my experience.
I have read over all the comments and everyone is stuck on their LAN...what about the Internetworking people? Without the CCNA/CCNP, nobody is going anywhere. "I tell ya, I don't get no respect." We'll see how single-minded and open-minded you guys can be after this post.
2
2
" About Alan Norton
Alan has worked at companies like Hughes Aircraft and CSC, where he developed client/server-based applications. Alan is currently semi-retired and starting a new career as a writer for TechRepublic. "
You are going to have a very short tenure as a writer if you let your 'tude infest your writing....
I have worked with many so-called " special;ists " in companies like the ones you describe...
When they try to get back into the job market, they act as if their S**T doesn't stink and that THEY are DOING THE COMPANY A FAVOR by hiring them!
It usually takes about six months to break down this pattern...if the company lasts that long because most of the company loses it's morale and good people start to bail out.
HR and management ( usually ) won't admit the mistake. and become puzzled as to why the company implodes.
Me, when I am working for such a company, I only give ONE warning about the situation...then I polish up the resume and bail out.
It took just two similar incidents in my Engineering career to figure this response out.
I won't tell you who....those companies are no longer in business.
P.S.: mentioning your ME WALL is a symptom of the problem..
Some of the best people I've worked with keep their background low key...and EARN the respect by doing a competent job FIRST.....
Alan has worked at companies like Hughes Aircraft and CSC, where he developed client/server-based applications. Alan is currently semi-retired and starting a new career as a writer for TechRepublic. "
You are going to have a very short tenure as a writer if you let your 'tude infest your writing....
I have worked with many so-called " special;ists " in companies like the ones you describe...
When they try to get back into the job market, they act as if their S**T doesn't stink and that THEY are DOING THE COMPANY A FAVOR by hiring them!
It usually takes about six months to break down this pattern...if the company lasts that long because most of the company loses it's morale and good people start to bail out.
HR and management ( usually ) won't admit the mistake. and become puzzled as to why the company implodes.
Me, when I am working for such a company, I only give ONE warning about the situation...then I polish up the resume and bail out.
It took just two similar incidents in my Engineering career to figure this response out.
I won't tell you who....those companies are no longer in business.
P.S.: mentioning your ME WALL is a symptom of the problem..
Some of the best people I've worked with keep their background low key...and EARN the respect by doing a competent job FIRST.....
But observation and experience. The one constant in my career has been reporting - at times only reporting. And, yes, those client/server systems all had reporting functionality. Perhaps I am letting my 'bias' show by stating that reporting specialists get little or no prestige. I believe it is usually accurate for those unfortunate few who get stuck in that role.
I ended up working a great deal of my career as a systems analyst and programmer because I learned early on where I wanted to be and worked hard to get there. From my experience it is true that those roles garner the most prestige and the most pay.
I ended up working a great deal of my career as a systems analyst and programmer because I learned early on where I wanted to be and worked hard to get there. From my experience it is true that those roles garner the most prestige and the most pay.
That's the picture brought to mind by the use of the word "cleric" to describe them! I don't usually pick on spelling or word usage, but that image was just too funny!
Though it's often just a title to say someone's earning more $$$ than the others, the real architects, whether Enterprise, Solution or Software, I would say come at the top of the list.
As many earlier on have mentioned that honesty is a key to integrity then using a 'stolen' term like architect in your title puts the position in question. They are more like the reclamation 'engineers' that pick up in front of my house every week.
TIC
TIC
.....debugs funky code when the programmer can't find his mistake(s), gets the servers running again when the sys admin can't work out the problems, sorts out the database issues when the DBA is completely bamboozled, manages to sort out the dodgy plant wiring when the field techs give up over the mass of spaghetti and ancient unmarkd cables, makes the third paty apps play nice with the desktop systems when the support guys give up in disgust, keeps the vendors in line, helps the department manager write policy and specs, designs, implements and maintains the network infrastructure and security and keeps interdepartmental issues from becoming flashpoints and eruptive volcanoes of perpetual conflict?
You know. "That guy". As in, "I can't work this out to save me arse......I bet "that guy" can get it to go..........
There aren't a huge number of us, but there are enough that I think we deserve a proper title and a place on the chart. Us sorry bastards upon who's desk the unsolvable problems from every other department ultimately land, and land with a sincere expectation of getting solved.
And we do solve them.
How about a proper title for us, eh?
The rest of you lot out there, you know who you are. Speak up. No shame in asking for a bit of high hand now and again, for what we do.
Cheers!
You know. "That guy". As in, "I can't work this out to save me arse......I bet "that guy" can get it to go..........
There aren't a huge number of us, but there are enough that I think we deserve a proper title and a place on the chart. Us sorry bastards upon who's desk the unsolvable problems from every other department ultimately land, and land with a sincere expectation of getting solved.
And we do solve them.
How about a proper title for us, eh?
The rest of you lot out there, you know who you are. Speak up. No shame in asking for a bit of high hand now and again, for what we do.
Cheers!
I have not been in the IT profession very long, retired from one job were I was in charge of anywere from 10 to 800 people. Was able to build, fix, and maintain computers so was offered a job at a family owned business. In my opinion if you are looking for "prestige" you are in the wrong profession, IT, regardless of what level, are the "unsong heroes" when things are working and the "villians" when they are not. I have an official title "Network System Engineer" but I call myself the repair man because i am the one that keeps things running or fixes them when they break and I take pride in that but do not look for any "recognition". As far as management oh yes you have to learn how to manage, if you do not know your people and know thier strengths and weaknesses it will cause you grief all day long. It is also good to roll up your sleves and get in the trenches with your staff every now an then, most will respect you for it, however what is even more inportant then that is to LISTEN to your staff. just my two cents
My actual title for many years throughout the development of transisters and digital omputers (from analog types) to Digital control systems for industrial plants was "Senior Support Engineer". This sould seem to entail design and development of braziers and jock straps. as Sr I had my choice.
Richard Law (91 years of age).
Richard Law (91 years of age).
Hello Richard.
Both your age and your comment are remarkable. Howard Hughes really was a Support Engineer as anyone who has seen the movie The Aviator would know!
http://www.bikiniscience.com/chronology/1940-1945_SS/JR4310_S/JR4310.html
Both your age and your comment are remarkable. Howard Hughes really was a Support Engineer as anyone who has seen the movie The Aviator would know!
http://www.bikiniscience.com/chronology/1940-1945_SS/JR4310_S/JR4310.html
I assume that clerk was meant. However in many senses the report specialist is in fact a cleric; high priest of useful data. The manager wants a prayer to the system to deliver data that determines the position of the company, the department or the project and in many cases justifies its continued funding. The High Priest formulates this desire into the proper prayer format and makes the burnt sacrifice to the system. In response to a proper prayer, the system delivers data formated in a useful form that can be understood by the least tech savvy management person, translated into the financial, or business adminstrative language that they need to deliver their message.
In my experience the report specialist needs to have a DBA's understanding of SQL, and the structure of the data; and more than DBA's understanding of the significance of various data elements to the decision makers. They have to have a foot in both worlds, and anyone who has tried to work like that can appreciate how difficult it can be. I have to be a developer, a dba, a manager, and a report specialist in my senior engineer position. It is not easy to switch mindsets every couple of hours to in order to fulfill the current need.
In my experience the report specialist needs to have a DBA's understanding of SQL, and the structure of the data; and more than DBA's understanding of the significance of various data elements to the decision makers. They have to have a foot in both worlds, and anyone who has tried to work like that can appreciate how difficult it can be. I have to be a developer, a dba, a manager, and a report specialist in my senior engineer position. It is not easy to switch mindsets every couple of hours to in order to fulfill the current need.
Someone who faithfully reads and transfers numbers from one place to the other without error. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Clerics
I prefer your analysis though. It's brilliant and so true! Kudos to you for thinking deeper than the surface.
I was a 'glorified cleric' my entire career. In the beginning, circa 1985, I copied numbers to spreadsheets and charts. Later, I did a lot more sophisticated work, including exactly what you mention, to automate both charts and reports. To many though, I was "the keeper of the numbers" - a glorified cleric.
I prefer your analysis though. It's brilliant and so true! Kudos to you for thinking deeper than the surface.
I was a 'glorified cleric' my entire career. In the beginning, circa 1985, I copied numbers to spreadsheets and charts. Later, I did a lot more sophisticated work, including exactly what you mention, to automate both charts and reports. To many though, I was "the keeper of the numbers" - a glorified cleric.
Personally I had never heard cleric used in that sense hence my assumption of a misspelling. However, I am confused by the link you provide as it defines cleric as cler??ic (klrk)
n.
A member of the clergy.
Was that the correct link you intended to provide or am I seeing a different definition due to location. (e.g. US vs UK)
n.
A member of the clergy.
Was that the correct link you intended to provide or am I seeing a different definition due to location. (e.g. US vs UK)
Under Word History it mentions that the clergy in the Middle Ages were the only class who could read and write and were often employed as scribes, secretaries and notaries. It is this vision of a scribe faithfully and tediously copying one book after another that I am referring to.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_did_monks_copy_books
Some images:
http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&complete=0&biw=1023&bih=628&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=monk+cleric+scribe&btnG=Search
And this is a classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IgH2M02xek
Edit: Change Usages to History, capitalized Middle Ages and added the second link
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_did_monks_copy_books
Some images:
http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&complete=0&biw=1023&bih=628&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=monk+cleric+scribe&btnG=Search
And this is a classic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IgH2M02xek
Edit: Change Usages to History, capitalized Middle Ages and added the second link
;-D As soon as you said cleric I had the image of either a Bishop or a pagan High Priest in all of his vestments transmitting the prayers of his congregation to the Deity, in this case represented by the Database Server.
As a Client Services Supervisor (Help Desk Lead) in the International Zone in Baghdad, Iraq, I frequently encountered opposition from Network and System Administrators who thought or at least imagined that I was encroaching on their territory by taking care of client issues that they were "too busy" to handle. In other words, they considered the issues beneath them even though they directly involved server or network related issues. Hats off to those Help Desk Administrators for the help they provide users and the abuse they put up with from below as well as from above.
Think you forgot these elite bad boys (and girls)... They should rank almost at the top especially considering DREs are the continuation of the business in some dire instances!
I can't think of any other positions within IT where multiple expertise and heavy cross skilling is critical/essential, other than maybe strategic level management.
I can't think of any other positions within IT where multiple expertise and heavy cross skilling is critical/essential, other than maybe strategic level management.
In my humble opinion, There is no more prestige in IT. Most of us lost our Deity status long ago when IT classes were offered as elective courses in High School.
CTO and CIO beside and Product Managers but I mostly value programmers I'm programmer too !
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