Discussion on:

GE taps lean and green to revitalize US manufacturing with slick refrigerator launch

most of the lean ideals which is attributed to the Japanese culture are actually ideas they came to the US to learn many years ago. We just did not do them and they did. Now we as a culture are realizing that those ideas are good without understanding it was a part of our long forgotten roots.

At $1700 to $3000 price tags, the little people won't be spending their money with those "high-end" appliances. Hopefully, there are enough well-off people who will find the refrigerators attractive, otherwise, it's back to Mexico, where the costs of production might bring down the prices to more affordable levels for the mainstream consumer.

Having said that, it's good to have those jobs come back, but, I'm just laying down the facts for "practicality".

Why do people say "If wages go up, so will product costs"?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJDhS4oUm0M
(there's a fun video to listen to...)

But given corporations sit on trillions (which a quick web search will confirm), that not only proves "trickle down economics" is a lie sold to the masses, but it proves somebody pocketed the difference as selfish profit, and maybe those folks should be sacrificing a little as well. In short, they have redistributed wealth from the wealth-creators (WORKERS) and sent it to themselves.

Especially with pay stagnating or dropping, the mainstream consumer will be on par with the Chinese or Mexican workers in time... oh, but their economies are building - how does 50 cents per hour help them when the same wage would be impossible to live on here?

http://www.realitybase.org/journal/2009/3/10/the-american-dream-died-in-february-1973.html

http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2010/01/vicious-cycle-stagnant-wages


But I digress.

....move their manufacturing to Mexico in the first place? Was it just to jettison their more experienced workers (who had better benefits) and replace them a few years later with a fresh batch of workers? Sorry, not buying into the GE PR machine's message and certainly not buying any GE products either.

I've been in industry for 30 years and I've seen lazy shiftless workers that the union won't let the company fire, absolutely ruin it for everybody. We tried to convince our younger union members that we need to offer the company value so we can not only keep our jobs but get a raise down the road; but they wouldn't listen and acted like the world owed them a job; so guess what? The factory at my last location was busted up and part of it was moved to Arkansas where people are glad to have a job, and the rest of the unskilled labor went to Mexico.

I figure GE has found a way through automation and factory floor engineering to make money off even lazy Americans. The problem becomes, they also need to be educated skilled workers - and our schools are falling down on that job too!

And they aren't lazy...

How do you define "lazy"?

Or "union", for that matter?

And don't worry, nobody owes YOU anything either. Just don't tell your regurgitated shtick to people like the police, firemen, military, EMTs, or anyone else for that matter... especially when you need them... In short, your neo-communist belief is not appreciated in this country.

Lastly, the queen of your beliefs was proven to be an utter hypocrite as well:

http://www.alternet.org/teaparty/149721/ayn_rand_railed_against_government_benefits,_but_grabbed_social_security_and_medicare_when_she_needed_them/?page=1

When are they going to start paying taxes. I paid more last year than GE did, and I'm a retired veteran.

It's the consumers who pay taxes, not businesses. What's wrong with the customers of some business not "paying" taxes, which the customers of other businesses must pay, is that government arbitrarily gives some businesses advantages that other businesses don't receive. That's not capitalism, that's mercantilism, and it's unjust.

...but is it fair that GE should be exempt from paying taxes while hundreds-of-thousands of less politically connected businesses do not?

He says that while it's not the company but its customers who are paying, it's still unjust.

If a business can improve the over-all value offered to consumers by either lowering costs more than quality is reduced while not reducing quality below a minimum that the consumer will accept (if quality is reduced at all), or by increasing quality more than the cost is raised while not raising the cost above what the consumer will accept (assuming the cost is raised at all), or by offering the consumer more or better choices, then outsourcing is a good thing.

We are consumers first. It is our most important role as economic actors. Try not consuming, and you'll die. Try completely not consuming and you'll die within seconds. Our consuming is why we do what we do -- why we work, why we trade, why we forego some consuming now and save so that we can be assured of consuming later, why we invest savings (and that is what creates jobs), and why we give to others we care about (either emotionally or practically). Workers are consumers first. The self-employed are consumers first. Managers and employers are consumers first. Sales people are consumers first. Investors are consumers first. People dependent on government and taxpayer funds are consumers first. So whatever is done that benefits consumers benefits us all.

So, with that in mind, here is my question. If our standard of living has improved over the past 30 years or so as our economy has matured and we have increased international trade and moved away from domestic manufacturing, why do we automatically assume that moving some manufacturing back is a good thing? Note how expensive these refrigerators will be. Part of that is because of the more expensive technology used (which will come down in price as production, competition and technological improvements advance), and part is because the product is initially targeted toward high-end consumers (and that will also change with costs decrease and competition increases). At the same time, much of the high price of the refrigerators is due to being made where capital equipment, buildings, regulations, land and labor are more expensive.

If this project does not offer better returns to investors and better value to consumers than what could be achieved by outsourcing, then this is a publicity stunt. If GE has developed a way to domestically provide the best return and value (i.e., the best improvement in the standard of living for consumers), then that is huge news because of that, and not because manufacturing jobs were "returned" to the U.S.

Ultimately GE has a fiduciary responsibility (i.e., a moral responsibility) to seek ways to maximize returns to its investors, and a practical responsibility to offer value to its customers. That's what matters.

I guess the trees have finally gotten organized to charge us for our use of their waste products... do they threaten an embargo? They gonna keep it in if we don't pay up?

Anyway, our most important economic activity is not consuming goods. Consuming goods is just the way the economy of individuals is interconnected into an economy of nation.

Our most important economic activity (unless we're blue-blooded inheritor class leeches), is to do work. Work creates value, and value is what we exchange for money, which we then exchange for goods and services. No work, no consuming.

Especially your last paragraph, about the value of work. Why should people work harder when the only impetus is the crack of a whip? (And is it really cheaper to put up nets around high-rise buildings to prevent the stock, I mean workers, from killing themselves in our oh-so-compassionate culture...)

After all, as wages stagnate or drop, costs for furthered education rise (as companies now want people with 4-year degrees for $12/hr jobs that would never make use of the skills learned during that tenure)...

Biochemists spend $150k for $60k/yr jobs.

The people who study and work keep seeing losses. How can you justify the devaluation of work while supporting the, let's face it, leeches that "invest" only to demand a return on it, which now even comes at the cost of wages themselves...

GE has a responsibility to its profit margins first and foremost.

We can either have middle class wages, or a 2-tier system. You are advocating the latter. How do you know you will be at the top?

Sure, build the BIG BULKY stuff here that is, in reality, about as LOW TECH as you can get. They only did this because the SHIPPING was killing them. BUt, the HI TECH stuff like the MRI MACHINES - IMMELT MOVED TO CHINA!!! This guy is a friggin LIAR and can not be trusted.