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17 Votes
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Actually
jasongw 5th Nov
As a 3 year Mac owner, I GUARANTEE you they'll NEVER say that the OS never crashes, because it crashes frequently. They'll NEVER say that apps never crash, because they'll have become all too familiar with the spinning rainbow pinwheel of doom. And the only reason they'll claim to never have a malware issue is because they don't have a tool installed to detect that malware, because there are so few of any quality.

Sorry, kiddies. I've been an IT guy for 16 years, and I've done most of my non-essential work on a mac for the past three years. It crashes, it has bugs, and the apps, yes, crash--frequently.

I replaced OSX Mountain Lion on my MacBook Pro with Windows 8 RTM as soon as it was available on Technet, and I'm glad I did--it's hands down the superior OS, and lacks nothing more substantial than the back-catalog of apps in the store--expected for a brand new store. It'll not only have caught up with, but surpassed the OSX store inside of a year, and Windows 8 will have outsold every Mac EVER sold inside that time, too--probably sooner.
"My Mac never crashes".

But before I address that, take any computer that's been in use and abuse for a few years. Then put a new, out of box high priced machine in that user's hands and ask him how it compares. "doesn't crash"? "Easier to use"? "Faster?" Yup, that's what you'll hear.

But remember all the pre-OSX forums where the MacWhinies were constantly butting in with their "get a mac" reply to every question? Insisting that their macs were more intuitive, never crashed, was simple to configure?

Then comes OSX, and Apple abandons the whole mess, hardware and software, leaving its users with the choice of accepting the gospel and upgrading, or withering away unsupported into obsolescence. And the forums were loaded with Mac users saying how wonderful OSX was, and how it was such a relief to not having their machines crash all the time.

What? I thought they didn't crash before...what happened? Oh, the "never crash" was just for show.

I worked in an office with a heavy Mac population then, and what a nightmare...those 'wonderful' machines that 'never crashed' sure did a good imitation of it. Constantly locking up, refusing to print or open an application. But they had a cute smiley face icon that made it all OK to the born again mac fans.

Since then I've seen plenty of macs crash in other environments, despite the fact that they're generally almost new because the Apple junkies line up around the block every time there's a new model.

When the office closed, I had a dozen pre-OSX macs in working order, that I couldn't even give away to those mac junkies...finally I ended up taking them to the dumpcycler.
-4 Votes
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Sanity!
0 Votes
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Netware to NT shares conversion was one of the longest-running projects here but it's been gone for well over a decade. Novell now owns Suse right?
six years or so ago, the company I worked for bought a nice big 24" iMac for the Marketing team because "you can't do serious graphics work on a PC"
They installed the Adobe Creative Suite, got the IS department to get the machine online and connected to the company (Windows Server based) share drives.
Then the complaints started:
Why can't we access the Exchange server from the iMac? (Um, because Office for Mac had a terrible email client?)
Why can't we print directly to the office colour copier and access all the cool stapling and folding function? (Um, because, as a commercial unit, Canon had never written drivers for OS X?)
Why? Why? Why?
And the answer was always, after researching a solution, "Sorry, it just doesn't work."

So what's IS (Information Services) to do? Write their own printer driver?

Yes, connectivity has gotten better, but you can't always work around some issues, and you also can't help some people on the Mac side of the fence see past THEIR own prejudices (Seriously: otherwise intelligent people were telling me only a Mac could run the graphics packages they wanted - and they didn't even demand Quark!)
Ultimately, that machine was set up with an icon on the desktop that opened a remote desktop connection to a Windows virtual machine on the server that then connected to Exchange. Files could be output to PDF, copied to the VM, and printed to the copier from there...
the hours wasted, trying to support that machine...
I was a news photographer/photojournalist for 10 yrs and migrated into graphic design for another 7 and counting, while I'm moving further into IT now. Anyone who tells you (or ever said) "you can't do serious graphics work on a PC" is 100% full of **** and should be shot I mean fired immediately. ALL adobe products have ALWAYS been available - day 1 - for the PC, where they work better (right-click context menus, 96 dpi native resolution vs. macs paltry 72, hahahaha, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.) as well as faster (dollar for dollar) because of the same or equivalent or better hardware (unavailable for the mac). And Quark REALLY sucks - Adobe InDesign is far, far, far superior. As in FAR. A lot of marketing people (I was one of those for a few years myself) are from schools that were mac shops and they got used to the wacked way of doing (some) things, and aren't even aware of other things they could have been doing on a real computer. They are typically so ignorant of tech that they aren't even aware of just how ignorant they are, and it's difficult to convince the kool-aid drinkers to let tech-people choose the tech and adapt to the superior tools. The best thing to do is ignore their ridiculous requests, they'll be upset for a few days of transition to real systems, and then they'll thank you and ask for advice on their personal systems as the deprogramming takes hold. You're welcome.
5 Votes
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A typical and all-too-familiar story! Yet another waste of valuable IT Department time and money, but some of these polka dot bowtie-wearing clowns will just never learn...
2 Votes
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Our experince with the MAC's has been very similar. It has gotten better but in fact we were forced to limit the proliferation based on the useability withoin our environment.
We have some VERY good Apple techs amongst our various IT teams. Those folks are also users of the technology, and most of them have multiple technologies on their desks in order to support the Enterprise. (yes capital E, it is a real thing)
When we jumped into Apple in the Enterprise (back then) we were bleeding edge, and now we're there again with iOS...
Back then we found help, and support where we could find it... thats why I'm here.
Didn't expect to find a cage-match where two OS' enter and one OS leave.
It's just so... childish, and unprofessional.
Thanks for your thoughtful, considered, and experiential (most of all) contribution.
3 Votes
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Wow, comments in a pro-Apple article are polirised. Big surprise!

There is definitely a position in-between "BYOD is here, embrace it or get fired" and "Ain't no Mac going near my network". Both stances make sense, it just depends on your perspective. If you prefer Macs of course you'd prefer to use them at work. But if you support an all-Windows network it is a huge PITA to start integrating something different (it doesn't matter if it is a Mac or something different, and it also doesn't matter if that something different is superior). The fact is we spend a lot of time standardising hardware and software, then documenting it, training in it etc. When you introduce a new system you introduce all sorts of problems you've already solved.

As a simple example, I have a client that have all Windows PCs, and one user that brings in her own Mac. I didn't even know about this until I had an email from her co-worker complaining that her email signature looks awful. The email signature gets created automatically in a log in script. Because she didn't have one she took a screenshot of a modified one. I took a look and saw why she went this way - although our standard signature looked fine on her mail client, and even copied into the signature area fine, as soon as you clicked away then back to view the signature again it got horribly mangled. And the Mac mail client gives no toolbar for modifying the signature. I reckon it took me an hour of modifying the signature on a PC then emailing it back to the Mac and trying again to get it looking reasonable.

Perhaps you'll say the HTML in the signature was crappy. Perhaps there is a way to edit the HTML signature in the Mac mail client. Perhaps there's even an easy way to push the signature out to the Mac during log on. I don't know... but none of that matters. The point is this was a solved-problem, and by introducing a new variable into the equation there was new work that had to be done to make it work. And there are hundreds of these sorts of potential issues in even a small company. Change costs.
9 Votes
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Yes, you don't need to remind me. Apple doesn't support double click or right click. in fact, there is no right click button on the mouse.
Reminds me of going to a country where they drive on the wrong side of the road.
In our apps, the right click drop down menu is intrinsic to the user interface.
And don't get me started on iTunes. It is the most maddeningly frustrating program to come down the pike.
-10 Votes
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Your ignorance should frighten you.
john@... 5th Nov - Below your threshold / Read Anyway
I can only assume you're too embarrassed to ask a Mac user what you're missing. Let me tell you the Apple magic mouse knows exactly where all five fingers are and is sophisticated beyond your imagining.
3 Votes
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Wow
jasongw 5th Nov
Exaggerate much?
2 Votes
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I can almost smell your arogance.
Yes, I sounded arrogant but Baruch Atta was annoying me and now jstachow is going on about iOS which has nothing to do with the article! I thought this forum was for techies?

Charlie,
There's a little app that can display the workings of the magic mouse and it shows the position of all five of your fingers on the top surface. This means it's a multi-touch device and it's capable of recognising multiple gestures to perform various tasks, including the beloved 'right click' which will indeed pop up a contextual menu as expected (when you click down on the right side) So everything you would expect from last century's MS mouse is comfortingly available.

But it does so much more, for instance swiping two fingers to the left or right will go backwards and forwards a page in your web browser.
Dragging one finger will scroll a window just like the scroll wheel back in the day but it also works sideways and it has a feeling of inertia which depends on the speed of your finger. All these functions are configured from the mouse control panel so can be configured to suit all kinds of folks.
I'm at the point where I'm already juggling enough keyboard shortcuts to have to add mouse gestures to my limited mental RAM.

This is strictly an academic question. I've never laid hands on a Apple product of any kind, and don't see any in my future.
0 Votes
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On the subject of techies...
I think: Real techies find and use the right technology to do the job.
Good techies know that each day brings new changes and they endeavor to adapt.
Great techies consciously strive to make "change" the thing they do best.
Some phenominal techies have a gift for thinking "outside the box" to affect that change.
But in my experience, all techies share.
I look for answers where ever I think I can find them.
You seem like you may be somewhat knowlegable in MAC and you share that knowlege. Good for you, keep that up. I think that makes you a techie...
Yes, I did read the article, and I did take the conversation beyond the strict scope of MAC versus the Enterprise... Not comfortable for you? I'm sorry.
I turned to this forum because I was looking for advice and consultation from Apple techies that may have experience with iOS and I think I found a few...
So for me it was worth it, but I hate to leave colateral damage in my wake so again, all apologies...
5 Votes
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Mac has 1 finger click and 2 finger click (same as right click). Also if you plug in a mouse with a right mouse button you get a right click.

It doesn't come with a mouse that has a right mouse button, but don't say that it doesn't support a right click.

Also iTunes for windows is a program that needs some love from Apple, but iTunes on the Mac is much better.
Actually try that on an iOS device.
but that doesn't mean it actually does anything when you DO right click. In other words, "support" is probably the wrong word. "Doesn't actually blow up, or do anything else either when you right-click" would be far more accurate. Unless I missed something and it DOES blow up.
0 Votes
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Right mouse button
spawnywhippet Updated - 9th Nov
Like many Mac users, I also use right mouse. Yet the blinding arrogance and hubris of Apple to exclude the right mouse button because they would no longer be differentiated from PC's makes me very annoyed with the polo neck wearing bearded geeks in square glasses.

iTunes on Mac doesn't seem much better than on PC. Both are steaming turds. Ever tried managing an ebook collection of more than 100 books on there? I have 6000, it is utterly impossible.
-1 Votes
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I use right clicks constantly on my Apple mouse. You should open your mind and get over your prejudices.
2 Votes
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Because you don't understand the comment does not make my mind closed, or my experience one o fprejudice. I am actually trying to integrate iOS devices into my company's network and application portfolio.
Please absorb that befor reading on.
using an iOS device (not a MAC, but an Apple iOS device such as an iPAD, or an iPhone) so... using an iOS device, to access my multi-milion dollar ERP ystem, to run the company's multi-billion dollar business...
Stop again and breath....
Using that Apple device to actually execute a menu of processes does not work because the "double-click" function equates to "zoom" on iOS... breath... breath... (should say: think, think)
Granted to use the double-click to execute a function is admittedly "windows behavior" in that one can historically count on a "double-click" to produce that action in the previously Windows dominant market-place...
But If I, as an IT professional, am asked to empower our users, by enabling these new iOS devices on our network, and I want to kepp my job, I must (stop think...) MUST find a way to make them work.
I know you WANT to dissipate some rage at Bill (maybe because of his WILD success in the business world?) at this point, but I'm not him... he doesn't call me at home, I don't get any resiuduals,a nd I can't afford his or Apple's stock...
So breath... and SAVE IT.
All I want to know is: Does anyone have a real (read that word folks, not imagined, or theoretical) real circumvention to the difference between an Apple iOS double-click does, and what the average business application expects it to do.
Somehow (not based on prejudice, but recent experience) I don't think that I'm going to get a rational, technical, response to this real, demonstrable, difference that Apple iOS devices have challenged me with...
But like I said I'll try 1 more time.
... through the original article indicates that iOS devices aren't the topic of discussion... MAC's are. As long as we're being 'specific'. ;^)
Those two words are what led me here.
You are right, this happened to be a "Mac" discussion, but in the "enterprise" space I have found that many of those IT professionals that have dealt with MAC's are also seeing and dealing with their mobile counterparts.
To be honest, like others I've seen post since yesterday, I was assuming this forum would be biased towards technicians... My bad.
Based on the sheer number of eager, yet mindless and irrelevant responses I've recieved, I am about to write Tech Republic off as just another intrenet fly-trap.
...
Just a follow-up though, we've been running MAC's for about 6-8 years in our environment, in the areas where they make sense (creative, marketing, etc...) and very succesfully at that. We relied heavily on forums like Tech Republic and many others to help us get there. Through experience we use MAC's where they are the best tool for the job.
As I think I said earlier, I am amazed by the childish, personal, responses to my post.
Yours, though not very helpful, at least comes from an intelligent point-of-view in that you question the relevance. Kudos.
True the Magic Mouse doesn't have a split down the middle to differentiate the left from right. But provided that the user actually does know their left from their right, they simply depress the corresponding part of the mouse. So to get your context menu, you simply click the top right of the mouse and 'Presto' a context menu appears. Admittedly, you have to set an option in Preferences, but that's not gonna make anyone cry, is it?
"Windows users are typically accustomed to purchasing software applications in a box or surfing a variety of manufacturer Web sites to load programs (hoping they reach the actual intended site and not a fraudulent or phishing source)?"
I haven't bought physical media since 2003. I haven't had a virus since 2001

" Users just need to click an icon to launch the application. While the feature is now old hat for Mac users, Windows users (other than those whove already adopted Windows 8) will be unfamiliar with the practice on a laptop or desktop computer."

WTF? Is the author on drugs? Has there ever been a version of Windows that could not do this? I doubt it.

Written on my Macbook Air (whilst wishing it had a right mouse button, Home and End buttons, backspace button.)
5 Votes
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Clearly
jasongw 5th Nov
The author is an idiot. It's been possible to put applications on the taskbar since Windows 95's Quick Launch feature debuted 17 years ago. In addition, MS has published telemetry studies that demonstrate WHY they got rid of the start menu--because most users don't use it, instead preferring to pin their apps to--GASP!--the taskbar or put icons on the desktop.
Macs are a consumer product and not fit for business in my opinion. Even some of the best designers I know do not use Macs (Photoshop and many of the design applications are the same on Windows as they are on Macs). I think people use Macs (in a lot of organizations) because they get freedom to do whatever they like since most IT departments won't touch them and therfore do not apply any policies or restrictions.

Macs are an excellent product for home use since they are so easy to use and have some features which makes things such as migrating to a new mac and upgrading the OS so simple. Unfortunately they just do not integrate well enough to be supported in the typical corporate environment.
has no place in business...

Lets not get confused by the Mac being different wrt it's coexistence in a Microsoft dominated infrastructure and it's suitability for a business task.
6 Votes
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10 easy steps on how to migrate your users from power tools to a hammer and screwdriver.
0 Votes
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Or...
Mobil-D 5th Nov
10 easy steps on how to migrate your kids from Meccano to Duplo.
1 Vote
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I just had an awesome time learning what "Meccano" is - here in the US it would be similar to Erector sets, but Meccano seems superior via wikipedia anyway. I wants me some......
Unfortunately, you'll have to have the Meccano shipped from the UK or find some very old stuff on eBay. As a kid, all my stuff got bent out of shape and broke during "hacking". But it was great (along with MiniBrix). Course, my vocab was somewhat different and is even today when I look for "spanners" (wrenches) and suchlike.

Gee, that's almost like the difference between Mac and MS. Cloverleaf=Ctrl, etc. PSOD=BSOD, etc. But where do "lost" files go to on a Mac? And how do you make sure all "related" files & directories are removed when you remove a program? Oh yes, don't forget your AppleCare 'cause you'll need it. I supported an iMac ('cause it was "all in one piece") which had a recall on the power supply, premature battery death meant returning the sucker to the dealer, hard-drive gave me my first "click of death" experience and was replaced 3 times with no hope of data retrieval, "SuperDrive" CDs couldn't be read on PCs and also had to be replaced, 3 keyboards, 2 mice, finally went back to corded MS stuff and continual failure to maintain connection to a PPOE connection. I'm not convinced Mac is better even if my brain still succumbs to the urge for "cool" Mac stuff after seeing an ad. The best thing Apple has ever done is find the psychology of convincing purchasers that the equipment was superior (at least until the color or shape changed in 6 months). Can't talk to Mac users about computers at all as they think PC users are idiots. Okay, fine with me. Cuts down on the drivel-time.
4 Votes
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More like
jasongw 5th Nov
10 Easy steps how to give up sex with your partner and go back to masturbation silly
from power tools to a stick and . . . another stick? Of course they can always upgrade to "log" (as long as they didn't try to do anything to or with either stick pursuant to iTunes agreement section Q subsection kitteh-khat of the week number 4 paragraph 1,449,237).
Not everyone contemplating using a Mac in a Win world is supported by a professional IT department. Recently two computer-savvy volunteers in a non-profit environment tried to shift webmaster responsibilities from a Windows user to a Mac user. What they found was that the Mac version of Office does not provide the same functionality as the Windows version. They have been all tied up in workarounds since. And don't tell us to go out and buy better software; this is a volunteer non-profit that needs to use what its volunteers already paid for.
1 Vote
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Smarter
jasongw 5th Nov
To just stick to Windows. The best apps, the best selection of apps, the most capabilities. That's really all there is to it.
0 Votes
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Finally someone that is actually trying to do it and not just sitting at their mac thinking up witty ways to make Steve proud.
You can't be serious surely?
It seems to me this article is either written by someone who doesn't really know Windows or is stretching to include in his tips reasons why Macs are better. I'm not sure why people can't understand that things that are different aren't bad...they are just unfamiliar. Can't you just write a sensible, helpful article about actual tips instead of taking uninformed jabs? Just makes you sound silly.
6 Votes
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Huh?
jebswebs 5th Nov
I've been using all versions of Windows, Mac and Ubuntu for years and found the information in this article to be just plain silly. As others have noted, I wonder if the author has used Windows before.

For most businesses, they will simply install MS Office for Mac - and this is not purchased in the App Store - and use all of the applications in that suite just like they do on Windows. No need to fuss with Mac Mail, Contacts, or iCal. No business would ever deploy iWork as it is underpowered.

There are a number of browsers that can be use which will work exactly the same in both Mac and Win environments; no need to fuss there. File managers in both OSs (Windows Explorer and Finder) stink equally and just take some time getting used to.

The author of this article appears to be describing the Mac OSX on a MacBook and not an desktop iMac which has no native touchpad.
1 Vote
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...people are actually moaning and complaining about how hard moving to windows 8 will be, yet will put up with this - i don't think so!
Switching from one form of tyranny to another is not a positive move. Being subjected to vendor lock-in of Apple is no better than that of Microsoft. Both create artificial dependency on systems that claim to be so much better than they are. Linux is here to stay and it is grabbing more of the users, with Android tablets and smartphones, networking equipment, being the OS of the majority of Internet servers, and the choice of major web companies (Google, FaceBook, etc.). It is the OS that both Apple and Microsoft fear and hate because it so threatens their monopolies.
-1 Votes
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Thank you!
sherril@... Updated - 5th Nov
I recently switched from Windows 7 to Mac Mountain Lion for home use. This article was very relevant for me and I am looking for more articles like this to help me transition. I run Parallels Desktop for Windows applications that I can't live without. My mouse has right click ability (System preferences/mouse/check secondary click). My decision to switch was based on being the family/friends guru for computer problems and the Windows side constantly had problems compared to NO problems with the Mac users. I tried Windows 8 and hated it, it looks and feels like Microsoft has turned their desktop into an iPhone. Upgrading to Mountain Lion through the Mac store cost 19.95 compared to $$$ for a Windows upgrade. A do-it-yourself memory upgrade from 4GB to 12GB took less than 5 minutes and cost 50.00. I love my iMac, iPhone, and iPad (and Prius, lol)!
-1 Votes
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$$$?
JustinDYoung 5th Nov
So going from Win XP to Win 8 and it only costing $39 over $20 for what really was a security patch in OS X was $$$ in your books?

Wow.

I think once folks get over the "oh my golly-gosh! This Win8 looks nothing like my Windows (XP, 7) they'll understand why it was done"

Anyhow, BYOD shops can change to the Mac. Though they'll still be actively running WinApps or a VM of Windows due to the lack of network/policy tools for the Mac. So Redmond will still get their $$. Infact they'll get more due to the licn for VDA.

It really is the best of both worlds for Apple and M$. Why would M$ care if you are using a Mac, they just want you to also use Windows... which you will... if you are a business user & Apple just wants you to buy their hardware... which you will because they do make a mean machine.
"mean" means what you think it means. Apple stuffs run-of-the-mill hardware from 2-years ago into shiny plastic and tells their customers it's "cutting edge tech" and then charges them a premium for stuff REAL techies (who build their own machines) replaced last year for the real newest versions for half as much money. Macs are all hype and nothing more.
3 Votes
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And...
learn4ever Updated - 5th Nov
... that post gets me another step closer to writing off TechRepublic as no longer relevant for the enterprise administrator. I'm close to closing my membership (of 10 years). I was thinking the target audience here was administrators, but I think that has changed.
As a charity, we work on a very tight budget, and the kind Mr Gates let's us have lots of stuff very cheaply. Every now and then we take on a newbie who asks if they can have a Mac instead of a PC, when we've stopped laughing, we say; "OK, if you want to pay for it, and all of the apps, and the support out of your salary, yeah, you can have a Mac". They all go quiet then
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