Discussion on:

Career-harming scandals: Why do smart people do such dumb things?

that these folks enjoy come about because they possess certain non-conformist behaviors.

http://healthland.time.com/2012/11/19/learning-from-psychopaths-qa-with-psychologist-kevin-dutton/

It would explain a lot...

... required a personal coach so that he could behave appropriately in the office. Apparently, his skill was so great that it was worth investing thousands for this purpose. Must be some awesome skill level that he had!

When we define what is right and wrong from moment to moment and based on a democratic view of what is right for society, it's going to shift. Any individual can come up with their own view of what is morally correct and in these cases these folks believe this is OK behaviour (I do not hold that view by the way).

The only way to cure this is to have a fixed view of what is right and wrong - but then how do we do this without an external view to define that right and wrong (AKA religion and God).

Catch 22. Glad I have a moral base.

Moralality is a compass forever fixed and forever true. It's not a weathervane blowing with the winds.

~Unknown


Unfortunately for many in our society it is the other way around.

Who is "we"? We is an inclusive term. Would be better to say some or most.
I do agree that lack of firm personal convictions make it seem like our country is being managed by a bunch of immature people.

Choose one, choose all. Many people who can do great things are probably thinking so far into left field that they just have no way of relating to reality. This is where Harvard, Yale or any other institution should have course(s) on some form of morality, etc.

A previous boss (area manager) would give his 2 secretaries jobs to do but never say please and thanks. One of my counter parts mentioned to him that he was being rude. His ONLY comment was that "at my level I don't have to say that to those under me". That was countered with "because you are at the level that you don't have to is even more reason to do so". The manager never got it.

As a result the girls did everyone elses expenses first and his last. As a result everyone received their reimbursement before he did.

Be it $240K or $20K at a strip club, most guys would not survive their wife's rath. And before any other guys stand up, pound their chests and point fingers at me (or any other guys with a bit of a moral compass) stop, take a deep breath, count to 10 and think for a moment.

nt

Unfortunately understanding ethics does not equate with acting ethically.

is it any wonder the US business community is the way it is!

I think that this is completely different subject and it refers more to the economy at large than to relationships in a single company.

how they are presented in the media about the things they do and get away with.

America is the only society I've seen that tut-tuts and castrates it's leaders for certain behaviours, and then goes and exercises those same behaviours themselves, or showcases them on main-stream media, etc...

Everyone has their own standards to live by. This type of behaviour was RAMPANT through the 50s to the 90s, mostly in sales with the 'big' companies like pharmaceuticals, energy, banking, etc... Of course, it's mostly seen as a 'man' thing, and is a bit on the decline with the rise of women (and more sense? ) in the executive ranks.

Have you seen how much things COST these days? Our little branch office would have an end-of-year party for it's 12-13 employees, and the costs would EASILY rise above the $30k mark! Stop being so judgmental until you actually have the facts in hand...

That's $2,500 per person. If that involves air fare and a few nights accomodation then I can see that. If not then that's a lot of drinking or a lot of tips to the peelers or both.

Still $20K or $200K at a strip club for a limited number of arrogant twits is not an excuse on company expenses.

It must take a pious ass to know one if the best you can do is "Americans are a hypocritical bunch of cheating bastiches."

You should take your own advice wrt being judgmental.

Why do so many people think Americans are so different from the rest of the world? The biggest difference is that we get far more coverage by a _free_ press than most of the rest of the world.
The behavior of the rich and powerful hasn't changed one iota since we quit swinging by our tail. The difference, again , is a free press. It is everywhere now, 24/7, and the competition for headlines is cutthroat. Anybody with an axe to grind will provide negative news to the press and it will be transmitted to the world as quick as the producer cues the announcer.
All this exposure has created an "anything goes" attitude among those who would ordinarily behave differently, but the rich and powerful have and have always had the attitude that what they can get away with is what's right.
International borders have nothing to do with it.

can we expect from the 'leaders' of an amoral economic/political system, based upon what one's own Holy Bible calls, the root of all evil, the love of money?
Success breeds arrogance, arrogance breeds contempt, contempt breeds foolishness.

It seems that some "smart" people are doing something that is harming people or company, but not beninficial to themselves

We all make our own definitions of morality and all that comes with it. It is from your personal point of view. CHAOS From the best to the worst, every kink, quirk and fetish. Buried in superstition and religion or the complete lack thereof. Each one of us fits into the scale, some near the bottom, some near the top, a big majority in the middle. Do we step on those below us or help them up? Do those above us try to keep us down?? It all goes into making and shaping opinions of others and ourselves.

"I just dont understand how people ..., can be so intelligent on one hand and so clueless on the other". What makes you think they ARE intelligent on the one hand? Stupid is as stupid does. So he's a CEO - that doesn't necessarily = intelligence.

"Some are born great, some achieve greatness and some have greatness thrust upon them"
"The good I would I do not, and the evil I wouldn't that I do"

Ehrm, I was expecting some answers, not just the headline stretched over three passages!

"And, in my opinion, arrogance can only be cured with a tremendous fall from grace."...wrong approach !, I think that the arrogance will be back with those guys in a double force

questions....answers; answers.....questions

well, because we, men, are very simple-minded creatures and we based every activity on three-dimensions paradigm: p-p-m, which power-*****-money (btw sequence in this case doesn't matter)

... economic efficiency and the associated necessary intelligence with a moral standard.
In Europe nobody gives a damn about what people do in privacy - unless it is illegal.

ok so let's say I slept with 15yo hot girl (with her permission) from neighbourhood and I'm 25. Is is moral or immoral? What do think?

following the logic of the article it is a matter of selfperception as being smart or not. When smart people have to have a "higher" moral standard than the average, then is "being smart" obviously a draw-back!
So the more stupid you are (for the purpose of this matter) the more you will get away with a fun and "enviable" living.
We should not forget that to question other people's moral it always needs a certain amount of envy!

Morality is about right and wrong. I don't believe that there is such a thing as "higher" or "lower" morality, there is only one's capacity to split hairs over what is "right" versus what is "wrong" as agreed upon and documented by the majority over time.

No matter what the legal age of consent is, you must first ask if the 15 year old has the capacity to make decisions about what is "right" versus what is "wrong".

Oddly enough most societies would say she does not have that capacity (voting, ability to enter into contract, et-al) but would say she can consent to sex. Thus my working hypothesis is that dirty old men make laws and it is not right to have sex with an individual that can't even vote.

when they are two totally unrelated matters.

...but i also see a razor edge smack-dab in the middle.
If you try to sit on that edge, you will fall only one way, toward good, or toward evil.

I just dreamed that up.

Damn, I'm wise!

I think if you sit on the edge of the razor, you will be split in two, thereby not being whole.

That is precisely the problem. We see these people getting away with it, but instead of rebuking their behavior we wish that we too could behave as a sociopath.
Case in point: Donald Trump acts like a d##k. Instead of banishing the man from polite society we give him his own TV show so we can all watch.
What a bunch of morons!

"we wish that we too could behave as a sociopath"

Crazy, man, really crazy.....

the funny thing about articles like this one is that people behaviors are blocked sometimes and in the case of CEOs may lead to their bad influence on companies they run. The reason is not in the way they behaved but in the way this behavior is blocked. I'm sorry (maybe I am a bit old-fashioned in this matter) but I don't see any connection between being a good CEO and f...ing a maid after working hours at home.

between f...ing the maid on one's personal time and the employee during business hours? Are they not the same behavior? You think that behavior is "right"?

Ask yourself some questions: Is this maid is your employee? What sort of effect it could have to your company if you sleep? (negative or positive). If positive (profitable) so where is the problem, if it is negative then there is certainly a problem. If this maid is your employee then there are always two sides to this problem. One: She might feel offended in a way that you slept with her and you didn't give her a rise or, two, if she considered this as a pleasure then there is a chance that you will stay with her on a very friendly ground and even use her for things like watching for some other employees who might steal in the warehouse and so on. There is no proof that having intimate relationships with employees has a destructive or constructive effect to a company. Sometimes it might raise the ambition or determination in achieving goals such as in production, sales etc. It depends on each of the side's attitude.

would never look to any powerful or financially successful person for a moral compass. Screwing the wrong person and deciding if a merger will be good for the pocketbook are two unrelated matters.

Correct. Many of us don't care too much what persons do as long as it is legal. Moral is an intellectual, indestructible ribbon: You stretch it as far as you believe you need it. Any observer does the same; judgement is injust by default because too often we do not care about the needs and beliefs of others.
On the other hand: You can't do EVERYTHING here, too. Surely not. If corruption is involved, everything gets sticky and tricky. If, as mentioned above, you make it too apparent that you have something others don't but want, normally it is going to get difficult for you. Envy and a rotten kind of self esteem will keep a balance.
So at least _most of the time_ people try to keep distance to other ones' private lifes...

Greetz from Germany

CEOs have a lot of arbitrary power which they should use for the benefit of their shareholders. Unfortunately, some CEOs use their arbitrary power to benefit themselves. Morality is important. If you are screwing your maid, you are probably screwing your shareholders. Shareholders do not want to wait until the CEO gets caught screwing them.

I don't think you got the point in this particular case. I meant where is the connection between f...ing a maid and writing out checks for your employees (example) ? As far as morality is concerned it might pose a sort of a threat to the morality itself (well, you sleeping with a maid and you have a wife but you're married) but still where is the connection between this activity and managing a company. Is it possible that this kind of immoral behaviour may influence everyday operational activities in the company. I don't think so.

Everywhere and anywhere and to anyone. Just hope it does not come your way....