Discussion on:

Windows 8 navigation tips that will help you forget the Start Menu

I have been using windows 8 since March and by now am quite used to accessing all the options using the Windows key and/or the mouse.
If I need to work with apps from the desktop I use the Windows + D key that is as fast as moving the mouse and clicking on Start or an Icon.
If I want to brose the Internet, check the weather, the stock market or the news, I like the live tiles and being able to access them directly from Start.

If all 3 were visible, maybe an [hr] breaking them up, would be fine. It would be the same as windows 7.
But it's hard to explain to someone over the phone, where to click after typing "dpi".

In 7 it was just.
"Click your start menu"
"type D P I"
"Yes, that's a D, like Dog, P like Pie, and I like Idiot" (jk)
"now press enter"

"Pick the option that says smaller and click ok."
"Restart your computer."


I get this call about once a week, that's why it sticks in my mind.

The new start/user interface is a CF. Why change something that truly has worked great since...2001?
And both Win7 and Win8, once you peel away the "fancy" shell, a lot of the dialog boxes are just like out of XP. If doing a revamp, why not go all the way?
And don't get me started on the "ribbons" in Office 2010. Once you eventually find your command, the dialog box that opens up is, again, from XP. It has just been made far too confusing.
And, I really like Windows, I have very little problems with either XP or Win7. But a redesign just for its own sake? Maybe it will attract "fresh" users...

Why do you think it's easier to type in what I'm looking for instead of just double-clicking on an icon on the desktop? And what were they thinking when they buried the Shut Down button? EVERYTHING in Windows 8 takes MORE clicks, MORE work than in Windows 7 and XP. The truth is, they want to force everyone into a tablet world whether we fit in that frame or not.

I just upgraded an XP system. It now boots in a fraction of the time. As soon as my upgrade was complete, I had a big Desktop tile looking at me. If I click on it, I'm on the desktop.
Now on my XP, all my well used programs were icon shortcuts on the desktop and also on the bottom bar. On my Win 8, I looked for those Apps and created little tiles and also put them on the bottom bar on my Desktop. So now I can click on the application tile and it opens in desktop or I can click on Desktop tile and go to desktop and click on the icon on the bottom bar. Pretty much the same as XP. Now power off is even simpler. In XP, you have to click on start, then turn off computer, then turn off or restart. In Windows 8 you mouse over to the right corner, click on power and then click on power off. I think that is actually one less step.

You're missing the point. No one is complaining about less time to boot. The complaints focus on "change for the sake of change", hence the metaphor "new dog on the block searching for a fire hydrant to pee on (the odour left behind announcing his arrival to others)

Using some of your examples:
- in Win 7 to power off...click Start; click Shutdown = 2 clicks. What could be simpler?
- in XP, all your well-used programs were icon shortcuts on your desktop. I like a clean desktop so mine aren't. What problem does Microsoft or you, for that matter, have with "choice" vs change for the sake of change.
- if you like to create "little tiles" all over your desktop, go for it! I'm not interested in creating "little tiles" and resent being forced into doing so. I am quite capable of clicking Start --> Programs --> (select the program) = 3 Clicks.

Furthermore, how many tiles do you want to create for one program. For example, System Mechanic Pro has two main programs - SMP and Drive Scrubber. Do I create 2 tiles for the desktop? How about Norton's Internet Security? There is "Update", "Quick Scan", "Full Scan", etc. There's another 5 or 6 tiles.

Do you now get the point because I have numerous other examples if you don't! If you want to be a sheep for MS, I'm happy for you. But give me a choice and let everyone be happy with real improvements, not cosmetic ones and certainly not one that is geared towards a small minority called "tablet users".

I am sorry I didn't see this sooner, I hope you are still around.
1. On my Win 7, to shutdown, you must click on start, turn off and then you get a window that asks you to choose between Restart and Turn off. That is 3 steps. on Window 8 you mouse over to the right corner and choose power and turn off, which is two steps and it doesn't grind forever to actually turn off.

2. With my antivirus programs and I have tried several. You click on one icon and then get a window that tells you your choices. Just one click.

3. Individual programs may require some adjustment, but the only advantage to the Start is that fact that you can pin programs there also or have it display recently used programs. So if you need that, then you can use an add on program to get that back.

Overall for me, it looks very similar to the way I have my XP and Win 7 set up, but much faster, so I don't see the big deal.

P.S. I just read that if you mouse over to the left side, you get your Start back, but I have not tried it yet.

"1. On my Win 7, to shutdown, you must click on start, turn off and then you get a window that asks you to choose between Restart and Turn off."

I support over 100 W7 systems. On all of them, to shut down I click teh Start button and then the Shutdown button. It sounds like you're clicking the menu button with the triangle icon located to the right of the Shutdown button.

On Windows 7 you can just hit shutdown. In my case I have to click because what I do on Windows 7 is Hybrid Sleep.

I was doing the comment from XP and looking at that. I knew I did the same steps on Windows 7, but forgot that it is because of my sleep choice.

It still holds that mousing to the right and clicking on Power and shutdown is only two steps for those that think it is three steps and that it is a big deal are wrong.

Even with the tips in this article, Windows 7 is start far more usable for traditional desktop users and power users. I am a power user, I work with several windows simultaneously across multiple monitors. I can do that on Windows 8 classic desktop, but I can't do that with native apps. Native apps force you to run them at full screen, I never run anything at full screen.

And the tip about using the windows key, most power users will try Windows 8 in a virtual environment where the windows key is not applicable, as well as having to move the mouse down to the bottom left corner pixel to get the start menu. That doesn't work well in virtual either. Let's face it, Windows 8 is a tablet OS, not a desktop OS. I have already heard that 90% of enterprises are skipping it. What does that tell you Microsoft?

I hope they right this wrong in Windows 9, if there ever is a Windows 9.

Well, a WannaBe at least. One to two iterations late to the game.

Since I am using windows 8 love all of your tips latest 100shortcuts come in handy
getting to learn them little by little seems we use win key for almost everything sure this key will wear out fast.
Many do not like 8 not as bad as they seem just have to give it a shot

Asking us to forget the "start menu" is like asking someone to forget one of their kids. They are trying to reinvent the wheel (start menu) and it isn't working well so far. I have had the Win8 RC for a while. It has some good features (I really like the Google Chrome tile and the features available only to 8 users), but in a production environment this product requires training for a new OS. The total cost of ownership of this product is going to be high. The only calls I really get are from home users wanting to know "is it better than 7", or "we just bought it can you HELP US!", not business customers.

All the years of mouse dexterity training down the drain :[

As a tech, I know there would be hell to pay for any IT guy that installs this on a business network. ESPECIALLY to your execs! As usual I was all set to not like a new Microsoft OS until at least service pack 1 but I just installed it to my personal laptop and admittedly I really like the features and structure once i caught on. I admit it is more fluff than actual meat and potatoes. As far as power users, you should go into desktop mode and load up the taskbar with your fav programs and work the conventional way, and then hop into metro when using the apps which are pretty cool. I love the reading mode of the news apps.

Fantastic OS for touch-enabled devices. How many of those do you have in your corporate environment? The removal of the start menu really hurts corporate adoption, as a result a large percentage of environments have no plans to implement it. One more iteration with the start menu would have been smarter. The touch-enabled laptops would come out, and then when everyone's used to touching their screen the start-menu would hardly be missed. Give it 2 years and the corporate market will have more touch-enabled devices, maybe then we'll see higher adoption rates.

Microsoft acts as if users have no choice but to use the Windows 8 desktop. Alas, no. To my mind the sane business decision would be to have user selectable desktop of Windows 7 like and Metro Windows 8 type. It could be selectable by keyboard or run like a virtual machine, without all the VM overhead. That way users would have had time to learn how to remain productive with the new desktop shell and not suffer a learning curve and lost productivity while they do.
There is still a lot of confusion about the touch screen interface. A large majority of users don't have a touch screen laptop or desktop. That my be reversed in 5 to 7 years, but it isn't true now. The perception exists that without a touchscreen a person is stuck in a productivity degraded mode. That is a problem for Microsoft at least as much as it is for their customer base.

Microsoft reminds me of Lily Tomlin's Ernestine character. To paraphrase the inimitable Ms. Tomline ""We don't care; we don't have to. We're the Microsoft company." If they don't wake up fast that line may be as anachronistic as the original telephone company line.

It's not uncommon for me to look for the shortcut/program I want because I don't recall what it's called. Sometimes I know the action I want to take, but the program that gives me that capability is not named similar to the function. If I pin everything I ever use that follows this logic I might have a few layers of shortcuts on the taskbar... I will be loading a start menu replacement program.

This is completely ass-backwards. With Windows 7 if I want to start a calculator, or Wordpad, or Paint, I just click on Start->All Programs->Accessories menu. Now you're saying with Windows 8 I would need to grab the keyboard, then type in the name of the program? How is this an improvement over simply being able to click on what I want? Not to mention that that same "search" feature won't work with my emails and other documents, like it does now?

Windows 7 is cleaner, neater, and faster. I don't have to have a million things pinned to my task bar, or icons all over the desktop. They're right there in my start menu where they should be, when I need them. Not to mention that some of our enterprise apps don't support pinning to the task bar anyway, and with it's myriad other issues, Windows 8 will never work on our corporate environment. Although I suppose our cleaning ladies would enjoy billing us for 50 extra boxes of monitor wipes each month... :-/