Discussion on:

Add a self-made Start button to the Windows 8 desktop

The W8 version of a start screen is much more difficult to use with a mouse. It requires more time, more clks and more mouse movements to do the same thing one can do in W7.
I have not used W8 on a touchscreen, but I would guess that a W7 menu would not be easy to use with fingers. A system that had a start BUTTON on the desktop which opened a W7 start MENU so that one could STAY on the desktop, or go to the corner and clk the Metro start BUTTON to get to the Metro menu would have been accepted in a heartbeat. IMHO.

1. The idea of getting a W7 start BUTTON back means getting a W7 start MENU. A W7 start button to get to the Metro "all programs" apps screen is very minor progress. It is still the metro start menu, though it does eliminate 2 mouse clicks and mouse movement if that is the screen that u want. I believe ppl's objection is not that the BUTTON is missing but that the MENU is missing.

2. One cannot organize shortcuts of an app in a folder on the Metro app screen - like MSOffice. All the sub-apps (word, excel, etc.) r all under the title of Microsoft Office which u must find and move to first, then u must find the app u want. because of the tiles and the text placement they r visually much less readable and require scrolling the screen - this requires much more time & mouse movement than a W7 start menu.

So if u can give us a REAL W7 MENU with that start button, millions of ppl will be very happy.

I'm happy you agree Windows 8 is design for touch, so if you don't have a multi touch touchpad, a touch mouse or a touch screen, Microsoft is happy to give you or your enterprise support on Windows 7 until 2020!

I've been adapting to the Windows 8 way of doing things and your articles have been a great help. One of my pains has been getting to the Metro interface (Start screen) or Apps to open what I need; which is due to mainly using Win8 is a VM, which sometimes makes getting to the corner harder and negates the use of many of the key shortcuts.

As far as Windows user interfaces, I amazed myself on my Win7 home computer the other evening when I accidently found the WindowsKey+Tab comibnation. I had been Alt-Tabbing for so long, I never bothered to look into what Win7 offered, beyond what I could see from my day to day use.

Can you change them in W8? This is an interesting hack, but the Apps screen displayed in the last image wouldn't have enough room to display more than perhaps a third of all the apps I currently have (and use!) on my XP and W7 systems. I'd need to ditch the icons and reduce the spacing between the app names to make this work for me.

If you are just interested in having a Start Menu (list of apps) on the task bar, check out this link. Works for me. http://www.forumswindows8.com/tutorials/how-create-start-menu-toolbar-desktop-taskbar-windows-8-a-5397.htm

Free program that puts the start menu where it should be.

Windows 7 has that classic Start menu. Just stay with that.

here's how I checked to see if it's available from MS

www.microsoft. com - - click on the hot link 'Store' -- click on the hot link 'Windows'

and you get a full page ad about Win 8 with a line 'Like Windows 7 only better' with all the prices.

Hover over the hot link on the left that says 'Windows' and you get the choice of two links "Windows 8' or 'Windows 8 Pro' - nowhere in the store is there Windows 7 available for sale or download.

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msstore/en_US/pd/ThemeID.27509700/productID.216645600

It is such a sad commentary on Microsoft that users have to resort to third-party developers and/or Registry file hacks to restore in Windows-8 what never should have been removed from Windows-7. The arrogance of Microsoft to assume that no one needs or wants the Start button from the desktop is beyond the pale.

However, with history as a guide arrogant behavior is often very harshly punished. Just review what has happened to huge corporations in the past who got arrogant and took the "customer be damned" attitude. Not a pretty sight.

I use 8Start on my XP installs which is even better than a start button. I know it works on Vista and 7, not sure about Win8, if not maybe soon. All my systems are dual boot XP/Kubuntu.

Just spwend the $5 and But Stardock's Stast8. This is probably the closest you will get to a Win 7 menu in Win 8 without the tinkering.

while i understand the tentative outrage from those who refuse to change, why is it so much easier to use a start buttoin than a short cut on your desktop or task bar? i dont like it much either but i got used to it quickly. of those i support and those i know, few are using 8 anyway. my sis who is quite savy (works in GIS for 911), she had the same response, "wtf?". but once i mentioned to her that she really doesnt use that many programs and most of them are on her desktop or taskbar anyway, she quieted down quickly, tho still hasnt made the move on her work machine (and i understand why as some of her programs are quite specific in what os they will work under and how). my cousin who is not savy at all recenlty bought a new 8 machine for her work and needed an emergency tutoring session. but similarly, once i showed her how to place what she needed where she could easily start them (more easily even than the old start menu), as well as clean up the start menu, she was happy as a clam. for the rest of my support clientelle, they would also refuse to change so it's irrelevant as they will be sticking w/ xp or 7 anyway. and even if they did, their short cut array is so disorganised on the desktop that the organisation of the new start menu wont be any more difficult to navigate when they do move ahead.

This is what we are moving to at my work, I don't see the point in overpaying for Windows 7 when Windows 8 Pro is so inexpensive. I mean even a new license can be had for $69.99 by installing without a license key, then clicking Get Genuine in the activation window.

Additionally, Windows 8 has many great features, is more stable than 7 and is faster. So, while I don't like the Metro UI, it isn't a deal breaker as there is a solution for that. And even with the costs of Start8, Windows 8 is far less expensive than 7 is.

I am sorry but all these articles about getting the start button back or fixing Windows 8 limitation is truly ridiculous. People need to stand up to the corporation and let them know who the real boss. I have been using Microsoft Windows since Windows 3.11, and I have never been more disappointed with the company. I am one of those people who never bothered to adapt Vista, and whole heartedly accepted Windows 7 as a acceptable update to Windows from XP.
Windows 8 removed quite a few things that I loved in Windows 7 that forced me to upgrade from XP.
I am getting Windows 8 for free from my university and I am still unhappy because they are forcing me to comply to their new interface with no option to turn off unwanted features and get back lost features. I am also a Mac User and I refused to upgrade to Mountain Lion from Lion due to the fact that they removed features I liked and also returned features that took away with the update.
What I am trying to say is we the consumers need to start fighting with our wallets, and not become mindless drones like the ones you see throwing their cash away at Apple for inferior products.

It's not getting to the Apps Screen that's the issue. Press Windows+W and you're virtually there.

It's what you see when you get to the Apps Screen!

I want an old style drop-down menu. I must have about 100 - 200 apps on my computer, most of them never addressed by me. These never-used apps are probably links to the app-maker's site or to a help menu for the product. There's no reason to get rid of them; and there is always the chance I might actually need one at some time in the future.

BUT I DON'T WANT THEM TO HAVE EQUAL TIME ON THE DISPLAY!
(shouting intentional)

When I click on the programs menu - the way I had it set up - I got less than a full-screen's work of apps and app-folders listed. Because that is essentially what I had. And it was the app-folders that saved the day and made my computer workable.

The folder structure is still the easiest and most manageable method for handling abundance of data.

I had a DVD copier app, but it didn't have the company's name in the title nor did it have the word "DVD" in its name. In Win 7, that wasn't an issue. I could have name the folder DVD or I could simply scan the short main app list and recognized the company.

In Win 8, it has become a huge issue. Smeared across my screen is every app on my machine. Yes, they seem to be organized, but a horizontal (sort of) -- vertical (sort of) distribution of data is unscanable. Let me say that again. The Win 8 presentation of apps present does not lend itself to quick product locating. Because keywords are neither vertically nor horizontally aligned, the eyes must make too many movements to find an object it is looking for by mere scanning. The searcher must peruse. That's a short fancy word that means "examine carefully." And perusing is the very opposite of what I want to do when I am in the middle of a music editing job and I need an app that properly stitches two segments together. (Oh, yes, Audacity!)

I can't speak for every "complainer" here, but I bet most of them don't mean what you appear to think they mean.

They aren't searching for the Apps. They are searching for an App!. And they want to be able to get there quickly.

They want a menu structure.

There is a reason the history of desktop computers is rooted in menus. And it isn't because there was no alternative. I've programmed for about forty years, and the reason for menu-driven processes is that they are easy for the user.

Touch-driven and voice-driven processes conflict with menus, because menus have to be dropped. And it is why so many of us had problems using software like Dragon - moving around the menus.

And name-driven processes are insanity. The value of a computer is its handling of large amounts of data -- most of which we do not know the exact name of. That means we need to know where we put it and that means an organizing principle that follows a menu structure. Pictures in this folder. Family pictures in this subfolder. Games in that folder. And so on.

That is one of the fundamental differences between PCs and Macs. PC users do more; they need a logic that allows this to happen. Mac users do less (really, I've watched them). And they're happy (about half the time) with what they need to do to find something they forgot the name of. Count the number of applications on a typical PC and compare that to those on a typical Mac and you will see why PCs need to have a menu-access structure.

I cannot understand why so many people find Windows 8 so difficult to use. For me it is so easy, I must be very lucky not to have a complicated brain that expert computer users need to compete basic tasks.

A confusing product like Windows 8 is what you end up with when you involve too many focus groups on a single project. As a system builder I won't touch it, till I'm forced to. I am stocked-up on enough Win7 OEM install packs to last me through 2014.

First off, no one should ever have to go to this much trouble just to create a start button, that should never have been removed in the first place. And Greg while you are at it, don't forget to include the other article links on how to create a shutdown icon and a stand-by icon as well. MS should include a free download for StarDock's, Start-8 product, until they can issue a major update to Win8, to replace the missing start menu code. All these years we have been trained to expect more in each new version of Windows, not less? This offer would be limited to the desktop and laptop users who were mislead into buying what they thought was Windows on their new PC's.

Windows 8 should never have been marketed for desktops and laptop computers in its current configuration. Even naming it Windows 8 is a misnomer and is simply using the Windows brand recognition to market a product that is not designed for productive use, on either desktop or laptop computers. Windows 8 should have been marketed as Windows Metro For Tablet Computers. A separate full version, without the start menu code missing, should have been marketed separately as Windows 8. They could also charge the regular higher prices for the full featured version as well. Gee it took a system builder to figure that one out. Another advantage of marketing two separate product lines, is that the stock holders are protected, in the event the new tablet product line tanks. By combining all of their code eggs into one big basket, if it sinks, so does the mother-ship. Not so smart product marketing on MS's part. I think that Windows 8 when all is settled and done will make the "New Coca Cola" and Windows ME look like marketing genius.

Microsoft's board needs to get the guts to fire/retire most of the executives running MS and get some fresh blood into the company before the stock ends up tanking. They also need to hire some experienced product marketing people.

Again, I am wondering with most people who whining about the start button in Windows 8
My personal opinion is: If you are always looking for a Start button in Windows 8, why do upgrade to W8 in the first place? I guess it's better you stick with Windows 7, because Windows 8 just a bit enhancement from 7 (additionally some features on Task Manager, which is rarely used in day to day activities)
Why nobody shouting at the time Microsoft replacing XP to Vista or Windows 7? Because of the basic interface since Windows 1.xx?

I tried all the third party start button, it's all very good, except, of course you have to wait a bit longer on start up time, around 3-5 seconds longer
The Windows 8 Start screen is beautiful... my critic is only about flexibility to change the color for individual tile and change its size to our like, because I find it a little to big

Bottom line is: If you don't like to eat burgers, then let it be and don't buy burgers... But please don't criticizer all the time

I find this is more appropriate

can you figure out now how to make the import pictures app give the options that were available in W7?

Windows 8 is like the old story about the bad tailor. The bad suit looks fine as long as you keep one knee bent, shove one arm forward,hold the other arm behind your back, and hop around. Go through enough contortions and you might even make WIndows 8 look okay.
After two decades of making a living with only Windows apps I guess it is time for me to move on.

Seroiously, if you don't like it don't use it. Did we all go out and buy Vista, no becasue it was awful. Windows 7 is still great and still supported so why are you all crying about Windows 8 being crap, you'd think it was the end of the world. I'm using Windows 8 on a tablet, a desktop and a laptop and to be honest it's not that much of an issue. I just cick the start button and type the name of the app I want when I'm on my PC or laptop and use the touch on teh tablet, it's not difficult people.

If you're unhappy vote with your money and don't buy it, go with Mac OS, if you have 3 times the money to spend on hardware or Linux if you don't need MS office.

Well, I'm not sure where to start. I've had my Windows 8 Laptop for less than a month. It's OK. Not a big thrill like with XP or Win 7. I run a little IT biz here in Texas. I have customers returning Windows 8 to the store and when hearing that Win 7 isn't available unless they order it... are either buying Macs or ordering WIN 7. I spent an hour reading MS blogs offering everything from excuses to cram it in your face reasons for the new WIN 8. They have made several fatal errors. They think most people are using Laptops or tablets at work and home. Fools. I bet their design staff is using Mac Pros at MS. Ever try to design a floor plan with your finger? Or a flux capacitor? Yes, if they are web designers, executives, managers etc. However, the laptops they use are Macs. Publishers use Macs, Writers use Macs, Musicians use Macs. Hollywood loves Macs. The people who use Windows Laptops are usually buying a 2nd or third pc and you folls just stabbed 90% of them in the back. I'm sorry your phone su*ked so bad we all bought Iphones.
The real customer that uses Windows, have a desktop PC first and foremost. When MS loses corporate to Linux or Mac, the dominoes are all going to fall quickly. Nice call MS. Idiots. You missed your target audience, you missed their age demographics and you flubbed the chance to make a good OS. The good OS you had 7, you yanked the rug from under. MS needs to grownup. The commercials they are running make WIN 8 look like a toy. We MCPs were counting on you guys to give us a stable mature platform to blow Apple out of the saddle. But you gave us a cheap looking token of what we deserve. Thanks for giving me the push to get with the future, Apple.

Not missing it. I've always been annoyed by the Start | Programs 'drill down' in prior versions so I launched everything I needed from Quick Launch toolbar. Now I'm launching my favorites apps from the Win8 UI without the useless icon clutter of apps I'll never need. I get it.

How is it that someone will spend an enormous amount of time and effort putting 'Bandaids' on Windows 8 instead of spending a little less time just learning the differences. I find it much easier to use as is.

For those that want the bandaids, you probable created shortcut icons on your previous Desktops instead of enabling the Built-in ones in Settings.
You tech writers should have been teaching how to properly use previous versions of Windows instead of modifying Windows 8 to continue bad habits.

..don't get those people complaining on Win 8, it's a good system and the diff from erlier versions is meaninless. Same story was going for years about Win 7, too. Today everyone knows Windows 7 is the best OS ever. So is Windows 8 going to be after SP1. Wait, and you'll see it.....did you forget about DOS , black screen and command line....?? or what....!!!

Everyone seems to be annoyed and confused about the (Metro) interface. It is not your desktop - it is your START screen. Easily enter your Desktop by selecting its Icon on the Start screen or press the Windows Logo key and the letter D.

If there are frequently used apps on the Start screen that you want on your Desktop then simply Pin them to the Task Bar.

My opinion: If you can't cope with Windows 8 - DON'T - get your inner child an Etch-a-Sketch.

Greg Shultz is a great contributor to this forum and an excellent teacher of the Windows internals but if your goal is just a Start Button for Windows 8 download a copy of Classic Shell,
http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/
or StartW8
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/System-Tweak/StartW8.shtml
But if your goal is to learn Windows 8 internals, this is a good exercise.

hope they fix the start button just like win 7 in win 8 by releasing service pack or any other form of update from MS.

There isn't an SP 1 yet, and I'm not aware of it being developed.

I have just ordered two new systems (1 x Desktop and 1 x Laptop)....

For the laptop I tried in stores but no salesperson was interested so I went onto the net until I did find what I wanted and also got WIN7 pro and that was a Lenovo E520 ver well specked at a very favorable price.

Next for a high end specked Desktop I went to a custom builder of power computers after doing my research and again got what I wanted, with WIN7 PRO and MS Office 2012 PRO also a a very favorable price. They worked with me to gain some savings and decreasing the price at the same time increasing the power of the system.

So why do people insist on going to RETAIL who are only pushing the main OEM (HP, Compaq, Acer, Toshiba, Samsung, Sony) These sales people only know what the are told by the big suppliers. 1 x Asus P8Z77-V Intel Z77 ATX Ivy Bridge Socket 1155, 1 x Intel Core i7 3770K 3.5Ghz Socket 1155 Box Unlocked, 1 x G.SKILL Ripjaws X 16GB (2x8GB) DDR3 1600MHz (PC3 12800) High Per, 1 x Corsair Force GS Series 3 480GB SSD with SandForce SF-2200 Series controllers and fast Toggle NAND SATA3 6Gb/s R/W: 555/525 MB/s (MLC), 2 x Western Digital Caviar Blue WD10EZEX 64MB 1TB, COOLER MASTER HAF XM MID TOWER 200mm USB3.0 with add Fans, along with Key/mouse WIN7 Office 2012

I am very happy total for both systems with WHAT I WANTED was NZ$5500.

Although I have a Windows Phone 7 device and I like the metro interface, many people have expressed the same way as I think, Metro IS for tablets and phones, I have tested Windows 8 and the lack of Start Menu and the Metro interface don't encourage me to upgrade my OS...
I'll pass on Windows 8, and hope Microsoft understand the need for the little button and correct that mistake on the next windows.

I am starting to feel the same about MS windows as much as I hate to clean real windows
That is why many of my friends have moved to MAC's and some have started to look at Linux.
I for one have moved to only using Linux for all my needs at home and office. I only VM XP to use occasionally a few needed windows only apps but not too often need to do that lately.
And unless something requires me in the future weather XP is supported or not I will not upgrade to a later version of windows to use for those windows apps. I do run a VM for all the later version only to be familiar with in case I need to test something, support, etc.
People like improvement, mostly to something that was broken to be fixed, or a simple feature added, but not radical changes to how they are use to using an application, trying to force one to use desktops the same way the need to use a tablet is not the answer.

Now, first finding the printer adding in the start menu is a chore, you have to type for it.
When you pick it, it loads a Metro style that searches for printers, but doesn't let you choose where. Then all you can do is click the printer, and it invariably says failed because, it doesn't let you locate a driver, it just tries and fails.

The Windows 7 trick doesn't work either. Where you share the printer you want from another workstation that functions, and add it from there. Then delete it and add it from the server. (thus it now has the driver that it downloaded from the workstation in the first add process).

In short, they managed to make it even more difficult.

Yes, customers can downgrade to Windows 7, but Microsoft has different terms regarding users downgrade rights and paths. HP recommends customers check with Microsoft for the terms governing their specific operating system edition.

Customers who are able to and choose to downgrade their HP Windows-8 compatible products to Windows 7 will remain protected by HP product warranties. However, HP has not tested all Windows 8 platforms for Windows 7 and we may not have your particular drivers available. If you choose to install a different operating system (OS) and have a problem that requires HP support, you may need to restore the original OS to fully diagnose your problem. Please check with HP Customer Care for questions related to your specific product.

Example:
Your customer's organization needs a new system running on the same platform as its existing systemsWindows 7 Professional.
Downgrade rights offer a practical solution. The customer can:
Purchase a PC with Windows 8 Pro preinstalled.
Downgradeat no additional costto Windows 7 Professional.
Move to Windows 8 Pro at the appropriate time. The system is licensed and ready for conversion.

OEM versions of Windows 8 eligible for downgrade
Windows 8 Pro includes downgrade rights to:

Windows 7 Professional
Windows Vista Business

Dell says customers purchasing a Latitude, OptiPlex, Precision Workstation, Alienware gaming system, or an XPS product through business configuration services with Windows 7 will be fully supported per the terms and conditions in the customer's warranty or service agreement.

Lenovo's Think-branded notebooks and desktops support customers downgrading from Windows 8 Pro to Windows 7 Pro on all but a few select new touch systems where the Windows 7 touch experience would not be as good, the company states.

Acer, which also sells Gateway branded PCs, says that if it offers Windows 7 as a downgrade option, then it will fully support the drivers and hardware. In other words, if Acer doesn't offer a Windows 7 downgrade option for your PC then they won't provide Windows 7 support.

(Expecting Linux trolls to start with their nonsense right now.)

Thanks Greg. I may or may not use it, but good to know it is available.

When I first tried "8" i wasn't a big fan - the missing start button was one of the big reasons. But what Microsoft - in their infinite stupidity - won't provide, others will. I just installed pokki - works like a charm (so far anyways!). I get my "start button" back, access to all my apps including a favorite apps list, control panel, library and more. Until I can afford a touch screen monitor, I learned the keyboard shortcuts (windows + d for the desktop - for instance) and now I find I'm actually enjoying Win 8. With a dual screen setup, I have the tiles UI on the left screen and the desktop on the right screen at all times - the best of both worlds. Personally, I still feel that the new interface has some blatant "issues" and many of the apps are too "simple" and bordering on juvenile, but in that case, I just run the not-tiled version of the program (Skype for instance). Done deal! Eventually, Microsoft will see the error of their ways and give the power users back some of the power they need, such as running multiple Windows on a single desktop at once (all being visible to some extent), Otherwise we probably will end up with just another "ME"

It's about as useful as having every application icon on the desktop. For example there are many icons under "Microsoft Office" in the old hierarchical structure. This and similar groupings allows for a relatively parsimonious display listing and the ability with a couple, no doubt, very arduous mouse clicks to get to the program required. Good research on your part but about as silly as having to type the name of an application.

I have too many friends complaining about these Windows 8 issues. I have to do the work or still hear their moans and groans. I hope this will quiet them down so I will do it. I do not know when I will take the plunge and update...

I have used every Windows version since conception. Each had benefits and problems. Windows 3.x truly had the best human interface for a user that has many different programs and demands icons over program names to manage access. The Windows 3.x's ability to create sub-windows on the desktop to manage applications related by type was an invaluable option. Had this concept been incorporated in Windows 8, The metro interface would then be meaningful. It would provide an uncluttered start screen and the ability to group tiles (Icons) so as to be useful. This would provide easy access by both the tablet user and the desktop user. A win-win situation.

Windows 8 as it stands will not be useful to professional desktop users unless the missing start menu is replaced. Once the start menu and the metro interface are made optional, Windows 8 will be a perfectly usable OS for the desktop user.