These are the goals of the Paul Revere Society
1. Support Traditional Marriage
2. Close the Borders now.
3. Deport all illegal immigrants now.
4. Eliminate bilingual education in all states.
5. Require health tests for all recent foreign born
Some say that the borders are arbitrary, English is only one of many languages in our new "Multicultural America," and that we share no common history or values.
6. Make tax cuts permanent.
7. End Affirmative Action
8. Tort Reform - Stop Class Action Lawyers.
If we as Americans stood together and accomplished these goals we would go along way in making this a vestige of Freedom and true Democracy for every American. One thing I would add and that would be stop foreign aid until we have paid off the American Debt.
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As a caveat to your last point - STOP all funds to the United Nations as well.
These points alone would allow us to balance the national budget in less than 3 years.
These points alone would allow us to balance the national budget in less than 3 years.
I personally have problems with items 6, 7, and 8.
Along with your last statement.
Tax cuts should be rescinded and not reinstated until Congress and the President balance the budget. Further, I feel that the pre Bush tax cut tax rates should stay in effect until the deposit is paid off in full.
Affirmative action is still needed. Perhaps some of the rules and regulations need reform, but that is no reason to through out the baby with the bath water.
There are still far too many companies that hire and promote non minorities at a much higher rate than minorities.
There is still significant discrimination in housing and education.
Yes, those willing and able to put forth a significant amount of extra effort can overcome the barriers. But, until the barriers of prejudice are gone, we still need some form of affirmative action.
As to class action lawsuits and related litigation, I hesitate to ponder the horrors that would befall the average citizen and consumer if consumers did not have the hammer of class action suites to keep companies in check.
Sure, the system can be abused. Some sensible reform may be wise. But elimination, no way!
The US consumer is a lemming like creature attracted to the lowest priced goods and services. Manufacturing companies are driven by short term profits. Without class action, far too many manufactures would cut costs in ways that would harm people.
As to foreign aid, have you looked at just how small a percentage of the US budget foreign aid is?
Stopping all foreign aid would not even make a down payment on the occupation of Iraq let alone make a dent in the budget deposit.
Chas
Along with your last statement.
Tax cuts should be rescinded and not reinstated until Congress and the President balance the budget. Further, I feel that the pre Bush tax cut tax rates should stay in effect until the deposit is paid off in full.
Affirmative action is still needed. Perhaps some of the rules and regulations need reform, but that is no reason to through out the baby with the bath water.
There are still far too many companies that hire and promote non minorities at a much higher rate than minorities.
There is still significant discrimination in housing and education.
Yes, those willing and able to put forth a significant amount of extra effort can overcome the barriers. But, until the barriers of prejudice are gone, we still need some form of affirmative action.
As to class action lawsuits and related litigation, I hesitate to ponder the horrors that would befall the average citizen and consumer if consumers did not have the hammer of class action suites to keep companies in check.
Sure, the system can be abused. Some sensible reform may be wise. But elimination, no way!
The US consumer is a lemming like creature attracted to the lowest priced goods and services. Manufacturing companies are driven by short term profits. Without class action, far too many manufactures would cut costs in ways that would harm people.
As to foreign aid, have you looked at just how small a percentage of the US budget foreign aid is?
Stopping all foreign aid would not even make a down payment on the occupation of Iraq let alone make a dent in the budget deposit.
Chas
What do you mean (or what do they mean) by this?
Traditions change.
(Besides, I don't live close enough to a river to pound the laundry against the rock.)
Your friend,
Maureen
Traditions change.
(Besides, I don't live close enough to a river to pound the laundry against the rock.)
Your friend,
Maureen
A traditional Marriage is defined as ONE woman and ONE man who are married to one another. That?s it ? no other combinations or choices.
The government shouldn't be in the marriage business at all. Period.
I guess I'm not PRS membership material.
I guess I'm not PRS membership material.
You will never pay off the "American Debt" for while this Earth revolves there will always be an England and it is to this great country that you will FOREVER be in debt.
What do we owe England....a few shiploads of tea?
Hail to the king! England is lucky that a few folks got together on the other side of the pond, became a much greater nation than england EVER was or will be, and bailed their limey butts out in 2 world wars (and probably a third world war.....we'll wait and see I guess) Neil...I know you will have fun with this one!
Your yankee friend.....Scott!
Hail to the king! England is lucky that a few folks got together on the other side of the pond, became a much greater nation than england EVER was or will be, and bailed their limey butts out in 2 world wars (and probably a third world war.....we'll wait and see I guess) Neil...I know you will have fun with this one!
Your yankee friend.....Scott!
Then you should thank France for WWI and the Soviet Union for WWII.
As for WWI, the US had to buy and borrow modern arms from France and Britain before they could fight - machine guns, tanks and airplanes. They did not participate in many "key" battles.
As for bailing the UK out of WWII, it was clear that after the fall of France and the Battle of Britain(both of which happened well before the US joined the war) that Germany didn't have a serious plan for conquering Britain. Once Germany turned their attention to Russia, Britain was fairly safe from invasion. Demands on the German army for more troops and supplies for Russia meant that Britain would win out in Africa. Lend Lease destroyers did help Britain - but they were no bargoon. America benefitted from sitting on the sidelines, but still found itself unprepared for war in 1941.
James
As for WWI, the US had to buy and borrow modern arms from France and Britain before they could fight - machine guns, tanks and airplanes. They did not participate in many "key" battles.
As for bailing the UK out of WWII, it was clear that after the fall of France and the Battle of Britain(both of which happened well before the US joined the war) that Germany didn't have a serious plan for conquering Britain. Once Germany turned their attention to Russia, Britain was fairly safe from invasion. Demands on the German army for more troops and supplies for Russia meant that Britain would win out in Africa. Lend Lease destroyers did help Britain - but they were no bargoon. America benefitted from sitting on the sidelines, but still found itself unprepared for war in 1941.
James
we do get fairly one sided stories on WW2 that minimizes the contributions of the allies and almost makes it seem as if we rescued everyone singlehandedly....I know that we lost an average of 1500 men per week in both ww1 and ww2, I also know that london lost 1% of its population during the 9 or so months of the blitz from what I have heard....those are big numbers.....I am not sure what the story is regarding the French....I do acknowledge that this war was faught on their soil....and that is something we here may not yet ( and hopefully won't) understand. We were an important part of the history of modern europe though.....a fact that should not be taken for granted in my opinion....
One point on thanking Russia. I will not accuse you of a lack of understanding on Russias part in the war.....It was a distraction for Hitler, that could well have cost him the war......I just hate to thank someone responsible for more senseless slaughter of innocent human life than anyone else in modern history including Hitler....
One point on thanking Russia. I will not accuse you of a lack of understanding on Russias part in the war.....It was a distraction for Hitler, that could well have cost him the war......I just hate to thank someone responsible for more senseless slaughter of innocent human life than anyone else in modern history including Hitler....
I would refer you to http://europeanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/blww1castable.htm for WWI Casualties - the French lost 1.38 million in 4 years of fighting, the Americans lost 117,000 in a year. These numbers do not include wounded(the numbers are at the site). Consider as well that France had a fraction of the population that the US had - I recall from a posting last week that 6 out of 10 French men aged 18-28 were either killed or seriously mamed in WWI. Think of the impact on the US if they had lost 60% of the men in uniform.
As for the Americans impact on major battles...take a look at the list - Somme, Ypres, Passchendale, Vimy Ridge - none of them American Battles. The Americans did releive the stressed allied forces and did participate in offensives like the Meuse and Argonne. But its hardly bailing out the French and English who fought some tougher harder campaigns at the same time.
As for WWII http://www.valourandhorror.com/DB/BACK/Casualties.htm
The Russians lost 13 million - think of it! Whereas the US lost 295,000. Granted many of those lost were because of poor preparation, suicide tactics etc, but Stalin fought with what he had on hand - and that was people. The size and scale of the battles on the Eastern front was far larger than anything that happened in Europe. So far from being a distraction, it was the main event. You can argue that without the western allies, Stalin might have defeated Hitler on his own, granted that it would have taken longer and been bloodier.
I would argue that Hitler was more concerned with Russia than western Europe. He attacked western europe because they stood up for Poland, and because Hitler and Stalin had a "peace treaty", he considered France the more immediate threat. He didn't want to be at war with England - there was some evidence he tried to treaty with England after the fall of France - let us keep France and we will leave Britain alone - meaning he already had his eye eastward for his "lebensrum" - living space. The conflict between Hitler and Stalin was inevitable, the peace treaty a holding device.
Its arguable whether Hitler or Stalin killed more civilians. Stalin starved millions pre-war, Hitler killed many through gas chambers, and in an attempt to pacify occupied Russia through terror. Hitler murdered approximately 6 million jews and close to that many slavs, poles, gypsies and others in an attempt to "clean out" eastern europe. The numbers are fuzzier for Stalin.
James
As for the Americans impact on major battles...take a look at the list - Somme, Ypres, Passchendale, Vimy Ridge - none of them American Battles. The Americans did releive the stressed allied forces and did participate in offensives like the Meuse and Argonne. But its hardly bailing out the French and English who fought some tougher harder campaigns at the same time.
As for WWII http://www.valourandhorror.com/DB/BACK/Casualties.htm
The Russians lost 13 million - think of it! Whereas the US lost 295,000. Granted many of those lost were because of poor preparation, suicide tactics etc, but Stalin fought with what he had on hand - and that was people. The size and scale of the battles on the Eastern front was far larger than anything that happened in Europe. So far from being a distraction, it was the main event. You can argue that without the western allies, Stalin might have defeated Hitler on his own, granted that it would have taken longer and been bloodier.
I would argue that Hitler was more concerned with Russia than western Europe. He attacked western europe because they stood up for Poland, and because Hitler and Stalin had a "peace treaty", he considered France the more immediate threat. He didn't want to be at war with England - there was some evidence he tried to treaty with England after the fall of France - let us keep France and we will leave Britain alone - meaning he already had his eye eastward for his "lebensrum" - living space. The conflict between Hitler and Stalin was inevitable, the peace treaty a holding device.
Its arguable whether Hitler or Stalin killed more civilians. Stalin starved millions pre-war, Hitler killed many through gas chambers, and in an attempt to pacify occupied Russia through terror. Hitler murdered approximately 6 million jews and close to that many slavs, poles, gypsies and others in an attempt to "clean out" eastern europe. The numbers are fuzzier for Stalin.
James
Hiding evidence and "erasing" people from existence...once Stalin eliminated people, groups ...etc...he would go after all records of their exsistence to eliminate them to from what I understand....I am no expert though....I do watch different documentaries on it from time to time though........
Scott
Scott
He wanted people to know what he had done - he was proud of it. So they kept pretty meticulous records. He arrogantly thought he'd never lose or be captured or come to trial, so he didn't bother about "evidence".
The numbers estimates vary widely - Stalin is attributed to between 8 and 20 million Deaths in hir reign of terror. Many died of starvation(Ukraine) or in the great purge(most of Stalin's competent generals pre WWII).
Hitler killed 12 million alone in concentration camps, and millions more civilians in Eastern Europe. This doesn't count the POWs that each side allowed to starve to death.
So - depending on your sources, they are both responsible for a horrendous number of deaths - hard to determine which one is worse.
James
The numbers estimates vary widely - Stalin is attributed to between 8 and 20 million Deaths in hir reign of terror. Many died of starvation(Ukraine) or in the great purge(most of Stalin's competent generals pre WWII).
Hitler killed 12 million alone in concentration camps, and millions more civilians in Eastern Europe. This doesn't count the POWs that each side allowed to starve to death.
So - depending on your sources, they are both responsible for a horrendous number of deaths - hard to determine which one is worse.
James
You bring up something on Hitler that caught my attention. I was watching a program on the History Channel that had to do with Hitler and his second lost book that was never published. It really outlined what he really wanted to do. The book was pretty straight forward. He believed that the Arayan nation was the only legitmate race in Germany and in the world and wanted to expand his Arayan nation. He stated that in order to expand Germany's Arayan nation, Germany need to aquire more land. According to his book, he planned to control Western Europe, which included France, Belgium, THe Netherlands, etc. He never included Britain. He figured he would have a "treaty" with Britain in which they would keep their colonies and pocessions at the time. Hitler was also signing a treaty with Facist Italy, where Italy would control the Meditterean. The US in Hitler's eyes was never a threat. A couple decades before WWII started, many Germans or Arayans were migrating to the US. He saw those that migrated to the US and North America as a strong people because of the sucesses they made after setting there. But Hitler changed his mind about the US after he saw the intermingling with German immigrants and other nationalities, mostly Jewish. His plan was to take over Western Europe, then conquer Russia, then focus on the US. His plans didn't call for attacking the US until around 1943 or 44. Obviously we got into the war sooner. The program was quite interesting. I will find some links and post them if I can find them later. I mostly typing this from memory of the show.
I think we disagree on this as there were several major battles in the WWI that the Doughboys took it to the enemy. I key indicator of the American influence on the war was the fact that we entered the war in 1917 and it ended a little over a year later.
I will disagree with your comments on the Second World War as well but perhaps we could take it to a different discussion.
I will disagree with your comments on the Second World War as well but perhaps we could take it to a different discussion.
I love history and especially history of that time period. I agree with what you said completely.
I think we should all take credit for defeating Hitler. As for the effort put in by the UK and US and other allies, it's interesting to look at the D-Day statistics.
Men landed
Gold 24,970 UK
Sword 28,845
Juno 21,400 Canadian
Utah 23,250 US
Omaha 34,250
Honours about even.The US had about 15,00 airborne troops and we had 7,500. US casualties were much higher because the airborne troops had a higher percentage of casualties and because of the problems at Omaha.
I think I will grudgingly concede that you "helped" but not that you saved our a$$es$!
I get so much more reasonable when I get home.
Neil
Men landed
Gold 24,970 UK
Sword 28,845
Juno 21,400 Canadian
Utah 23,250 US
Omaha 34,250
Honours about even.The US had about 15,00 airborne troops and we had 7,500. US casualties were much higher because the airborne troops had a higher percentage of casualties and because of the problems at Omaha.
I think I will grudgingly concede that you "helped" but not that you saved our a$$es$!
I get so much more reasonable when I get home.
Neil
It was not the only contribution....but it was allies standing side by side......against a mutual threat.....
That post was written by a colleague and (supposed) mate who borrowed my workstation to run up some stats programs but decided to blacken my name. He's a Rugby player, thinks your national sport is for wussies - all that padding - and is pretty right-wing from my point of view but you all would reckon he's a pinko communist whatever.
Me - I'm mostly Welsh so I consider the English to be immigrants and invaders and I'd like to send them home to Jutland, Norway, etc.
I think that WW1 and WW2 are best only remembered for who died and on that basis, the Russians saved both our butts in WW2. If Hitler had had the sense to avoid a war on two fronts then we'd ALL be speaking German.
However, on a lighter note, I give you the words of my late father and the first "Yank" he met. Dad was a sargeant in the RAF from 1938 through to the end of the war.
"Well, son, it was like this, see. He came swaggering into the Holly Bush like he owned the f**king place and made a bee-line straight for your mam. "I'm going to give you a Christmas kiss", says he. So I steps in and taps him on the shoulder and tells him "You try to kiss my wife and you kiss my fist". I was on a charge the next day but it was worth it. Three of the b*ggers we put away.
Me - I'm mostly Welsh so I consider the English to be immigrants and invaders and I'd like to send them home to Jutland, Norway, etc.
I think that WW1 and WW2 are best only remembered for who died and on that basis, the Russians saved both our butts in WW2. If Hitler had had the sense to avoid a war on two fronts then we'd ALL be speaking German.
However, on a lighter note, I give you the words of my late father and the first "Yank" he met. Dad was a sargeant in the RAF from 1938 through to the end of the war.
"Well, son, it was like this, see. He came swaggering into the Holly Bush like he owned the f**king place and made a bee-line straight for your mam. "I'm going to give you a Christmas kiss", says he. So I steps in and taps him on the shoulder and tells him "You try to kiss my wife and you kiss my fist". I was on a charge the next day but it was worth it. Three of the b*ggers we put away.
guy, then I would probably move to the other side of the pond myself.....but.....our a$$#*les get more attention than our gentleman do.
As much as I love the Brit?s I don?t see how you might say that we will always be in your debt? Is this tongue in cheek or are you serious. Please explain.
That post - like the earlier "pot-stirring" one was written by a colleague and (supposed) mate who decided to blacken my name.
Should you want to address anything to him, his names Luke, he's a serious Rugby player and thinks your national sport is for wussies - all that padding. He's gone home for the day but he'll read anything tomorrow.
He's what we'd call a s**t-stirrer in England.
Me - I'm mostly Welsh so I consider the English to be immigrants and invaders and I'd like to send them home to Jutland, Norway, etc.
As for being in our debt - well, we gave you most of the basic building blocks of your governmental, judicial and economic systems - complete with all the faults. We gave you a big chunk of your culture and lots of our best people. But, hey, I said "gave" - so no debt. What you've done with them all since is entirely home made.
You have given us back lots of good stuff over the years - Micro$oft, McDonalds, Dallas and spin-offs, chewing gum, SUVs (on our roads!!), war in Iraq, the list is endless.
Should you want to address anything to him, his names Luke, he's a serious Rugby player and thinks your national sport is for wussies - all that padding. He's gone home for the day but he'll read anything tomorrow.
He's what we'd call a s**t-stirrer in England.
Me - I'm mostly Welsh so I consider the English to be immigrants and invaders and I'd like to send them home to Jutland, Norway, etc.
As for being in our debt - well, we gave you most of the basic building blocks of your governmental, judicial and economic systems - complete with all the faults. We gave you a big chunk of your culture and lots of our best people. But, hey, I said "gave" - so no debt. What you've done with them all since is entirely home made.
You have given us back lots of good stuff over the years - Micro$oft, McDonalds, Dallas and spin-offs, chewing gum, SUVs (on our roads!!), war in Iraq, the list is endless.
Actually I would agree with your friend that American football is for girly-men whereas Rugby is a real mans sport. Love it! I enjoy Australian rules football as well but it?s harder to get here in the US.
I love the British. I had actually dreamed of moving to North England or Scotland for a time but I couldn?t convince my wife to go. I am fascinated by British culture and cuisine. I am making a Christmas pudding this year but I am finding some of the ingredients hard to find.
I am reading the Sharpe series by Bernard Cornwell and I am fascinated by English history. One question that eludes me though ? (please forgive my ignorance) what is the difference between ?English? and ?British??
I love the British. I had actually dreamed of moving to North England or Scotland for a time but I couldn?t convince my wife to go. I am fascinated by British culture and cuisine. I am making a Christmas pudding this year but I am finding some of the ingredients hard to find.
I am reading the Sharpe series by Bernard Cornwell and I am fascinated by English history. One question that eludes me though ? (please forgive my ignorance) what is the difference between ?English? and ?British??
Major fun about nationality, here. So from the top...
The country is the United Kingdom - all of whose inhabitants are British - and this is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland which has the English, Scots, Welsh and Ulstermen. The complete set of islands make up Great Britain - hence the name British - which strictly speaking includes Ireland but they are their own sovereign country, now, so they can get a bit upset.
Me, I'm English born although of mostly Welsh ancestry and I feel English first and don't really label myself "British" although if someone else wants to label me thus, then OK. Some people feel British first and some people see themselves as European, then British, then whatever.
I'm probably closer to "pure blood" than most Englishmen - being Celt - as the number of invaders we've had from the Romans up to the Normans means that everyone is a pretty mix!
National pride is something not too many of us get serious about - except in sports - and if someone burnt the Union Jack in front of me then I'd laugh at them wasting their money.
WE ARE BETTER THAN THE FRENCH! We've spent that last several hundred years either saving or kicking thir a$$e$.
Go for it with the Sharpe books a lovely collection of stories of the last time we gave the French a kicking. They have made a superb TV series of them all (if you can suspend belief with about 500 extras only for Waterloo) but I don't suppose that you can see them over the pond. They are avilable on DVD from Amazon, though, but maybe not in your TV format.
Neil (in his armchair, sipping a margarita)
The country is the United Kingdom - all of whose inhabitants are British - and this is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland which has the English, Scots, Welsh and Ulstermen. The complete set of islands make up Great Britain - hence the name British - which strictly speaking includes Ireland but they are their own sovereign country, now, so they can get a bit upset.
Me, I'm English born although of mostly Welsh ancestry and I feel English first and don't really label myself "British" although if someone else wants to label me thus, then OK. Some people feel British first and some people see themselves as European, then British, then whatever.
I'm probably closer to "pure blood" than most Englishmen - being Celt - as the number of invaders we've had from the Romans up to the Normans means that everyone is a pretty mix!
National pride is something not too many of us get serious about - except in sports - and if someone burnt the Union Jack in front of me then I'd laugh at them wasting their money.
WE ARE BETTER THAN THE FRENCH! We've spent that last several hundred years either saving or kicking thir a$$e$.
Go for it with the Sharpe books a lovely collection of stories of the last time we gave the French a kicking. They have made a superb TV series of them all (if you can suspend belief with about 500 extras only for Waterloo) but I don't suppose that you can see them over the pond. They are avilable on DVD from Amazon, though, but maybe not in your TV format.
Neil (in his armchair, sipping a margarita)
Whatever the heck pure blood is - right now yours is tainted with tequila. So you are part Mexican then?
Truthfully, I was very distressed when I read that the Paul Revere group wants to close Borders. I don't understand why - it is a fairly decent bookselling chain, and as far as I know has done nothing to offend anyone. I would miss the one in Fort Lee, NJ were they to close up shop.
The competition between England and Spain (when they were both powers of the western world) has been over and several centuries now. But here in the US the one remnant of that competition yet resides in the bilingual controversy. When I speak Spanish (or anything else )and am told "This is America -speak English!" I have the greatest fun reminding the "eejit" that Puerto Rico is a territory of the US, and when Puerto Ricans started coming over to the mainland there had to be a bilingual policy as she is a territory.
My riposte usually gets results such as stammers and yammers.I then return to my conversation - in Spanish. The fact that other immigrants from Spanish-speaking nations have benefitted from this policy is not their fault.
Maureen
Truthfully, I was very distressed when I read that the Paul Revere group wants to close Borders. I don't understand why - it is a fairly decent bookselling chain, and as far as I know has done nothing to offend anyone. I would miss the one in Fort Lee, NJ were they to close up shop.
The competition between England and Spain (when they were both powers of the western world) has been over and several centuries now. But here in the US the one remnant of that competition yet resides in the bilingual controversy. When I speak Spanish (or anything else )and am told "This is America -speak English!" I have the greatest fun reminding the "eejit" that Puerto Rico is a territory of the US, and when Puerto Ricans started coming over to the mainland there had to be a bilingual policy as she is a territory.
My riposte usually gets results such as stammers and yammers.I then return to my conversation - in Spanish. The fact that other immigrants from Spanish-speaking nations have benefitted from this policy is not their fault.
Maureen
The official language of this country has always been English (if not a bastardized form of it as my British friends will point out). Point being is that in the immortal words of Bill Murray in ?Stripes? ?We are mutts?. Americans come from all walks, nationalities, creeds and races. One of the things that has bound us together is a common tongue. When people immigrated to the US they had to learn English in order to fit in and survive. Their children born in the US grew up and were encouraged to speak English first and their parent?s language second. If we digress (in the name of tolerance and political correctness) to a multilingual culture we will no longer hold as tightly together and will loose our national identity or that which makes us uniquely American.
As for Borders book store ? I prefer Barnes and Nobles. Well, truth be known I discovered the Seattle Public Library for my fiction. What fantastic ideas ? One can check out a book free of charge, read it and then return it for another. Will Wonders never cease!
As for Borders book store ? I prefer Barnes and Nobles. Well, truth be known I discovered the Seattle Public Library for my fiction. What fantastic ideas ? One can check out a book free of charge, read it and then return it for another. Will Wonders never cease!
That actually clears up a lot. When I am reading the Sharpe books there is often a reference to banter between someone from Wales or Scotland, or Northumberland.
I am reading Sharpe?s Trafalgar now and it very accurately describes the bloody carnage that took place during the naval campaign of Lord Horatio Nelson.
I am reading Sharpe?s Trafalgar now and it very accurately describes the bloody carnage that took place during the naval campaign of Lord Horatio Nelson.
Freedom means more than being free to support your point of view. Its freedom of speech, even when that speech isn't what you want to hear. Its freedom of religion, even when that religion supports things that run counter to your religious values.
Democracy means respecting the will of the people. You seem to think the majority supports you. But the people who put in some of the masures above that you oppose also think they have the support of the majority.
Let me go through the list:
1. Support Traditional Marriage. So if we support the idea that marriage is a good thing, and you don't deny non-christians the right to marry in their faith, why would you deny people of different sexual orientations to marry, in a civil ceremeony or in a church thats upports them. Certainly a married gay couple is more stable than an unmarried one.
2. Close the borders now. The border patrol has been trying that for years. It costs a fortune and they still get through. Is it illegal immigrants you fear, or is it immigrants of any non-english background.
3. Deport all illegal immigrants now. This is the law - what do you propose doing? Hiring more enforcement? I do think that some illegal immigrants may have a refugee case, but hey.
4. Eliminate bilingual education. What happened to states rights? If a state wants to offer it, and the citizens of a state want to pay for it - why not? Here in Canada, we have lots of english speaking parents sending their english speaking kids to french immersion. Their choice.
5. Health tests for all recent foreign born. What are they getting at? Canadian babies have a lower infant mortality rate than US babies, so should Caanda require health tests such as you propose?
6. Make tax cuts permanent. If I had a preference, I wouldn't pay any tax. But as I approve of some government services, and as the government has a debt, I wouldn't put tax relief ahead of debt reduction. Think of yourself as the government - should you not pay off your mortgage and your credit cards before you go from a full time job to a part time one?
7. End Affirmative Action. I am heartened to see that America has made great strides in race relations. But do you think that there is equal opportunity for all? Thats the acid test. I don't like the idea of descriminating to balance descrimination, but until the playing field is more level....
8. Tort reform. Now here is where we can easily agree. We have a less litigious society in Canada. And it means that our costs for insurance etc are alot less. And thats a good thing. But reform doesn't necessarily require demolition. Surely some class action suits are justified - if you were a victim of corporate pollution, which a company did in order to inprove profits, would you not want a share of those profits if you suffered health problems? I would suggest that things need to be moderated, but not eliminated.
As for foreign aid, I heard a statistic this morning that the US and other western countries made a committment in 1970 to end world poverty by spending 0.7 % of their gross domestic product in foreign aid. Of the countries that made that committment, the US has the worst record - as a percentage of GDP they pay the least. Do you actually think it will pay off the debt?
James
Democracy means respecting the will of the people. You seem to think the majority supports you. But the people who put in some of the masures above that you oppose also think they have the support of the majority.
Let me go through the list:
1. Support Traditional Marriage. So if we support the idea that marriage is a good thing, and you don't deny non-christians the right to marry in their faith, why would you deny people of different sexual orientations to marry, in a civil ceremeony or in a church thats upports them. Certainly a married gay couple is more stable than an unmarried one.
2. Close the borders now. The border patrol has been trying that for years. It costs a fortune and they still get through. Is it illegal immigrants you fear, or is it immigrants of any non-english background.
3. Deport all illegal immigrants now. This is the law - what do you propose doing? Hiring more enforcement? I do think that some illegal immigrants may have a refugee case, but hey.
4. Eliminate bilingual education. What happened to states rights? If a state wants to offer it, and the citizens of a state want to pay for it - why not? Here in Canada, we have lots of english speaking parents sending their english speaking kids to french immersion. Their choice.
5. Health tests for all recent foreign born. What are they getting at? Canadian babies have a lower infant mortality rate than US babies, so should Caanda require health tests such as you propose?
6. Make tax cuts permanent. If I had a preference, I wouldn't pay any tax. But as I approve of some government services, and as the government has a debt, I wouldn't put tax relief ahead of debt reduction. Think of yourself as the government - should you not pay off your mortgage and your credit cards before you go from a full time job to a part time one?
7. End Affirmative Action. I am heartened to see that America has made great strides in race relations. But do you think that there is equal opportunity for all? Thats the acid test. I don't like the idea of descriminating to balance descrimination, but until the playing field is more level....
8. Tort reform. Now here is where we can easily agree. We have a less litigious society in Canada. And it means that our costs for insurance etc are alot less. And thats a good thing. But reform doesn't necessarily require demolition. Surely some class action suits are justified - if you were a victim of corporate pollution, which a company did in order to inprove profits, would you not want a share of those profits if you suffered health problems? I would suggest that things need to be moderated, but not eliminated.
As for foreign aid, I heard a statistic this morning that the US and other western countries made a committment in 1970 to end world poverty by spending 0.7 % of their gross domestic product in foreign aid. Of the countries that made that committment, the US has the worst record - as a percentage of GDP they pay the least. Do you actually think it will pay off the debt?
James
1. The talk of traditional marriage is rediculous. If your marriage will work the two people involved have to make it work, no other factors can destroy that, and if it does then it wasnt a good decision in the first place, take responsibilty. Currently there is too much adultery, spousal abuse, childish divorces that cant let go of a failed marriage. By believing in that traditional marrige will save our society is like ducking and covering during a nuclear attack.
2. I like my freedom and I wont part with it. I wont be carrying a passport or questioned whenever I go places, to appease some sort of false sense of security. When it is your time to go, its your time, life and death cant be stopped. We have only been attacked on our soil, what three times? To me thats a great track record, how many other countries can make that boast?
3. Deport them you say? How much would you pay for your produce? How many Americans will go into a field and pick these crops for less than a dollar an hour? So shall we pay them 8.50 an hour plus benefits? Are you going to pay $5 a pound for an apple?Are we going to ban all American companies from having their manufacturing plants in all other countries only to cost millions to investors and to the entire stockmarket as the companies go bankrupt forcing Americans here to get laid off? Our dollar, trade, and businesses assist in balancing world economy, we screw them, they screw us its that simple. What about tourism? Think it will survive the just stay in our shell? We were founded on the melting pot theory for a reason, all cultures contribute into the evolution of our society. there maybe some bad apples but there are quite a few that make major contributions whether noticed or not. I like diversity it what makes us strong. I like seeing other colors in people.
4. As for eliminating bilingual education but to graduate high school, or any degree needs a foriegn language, all other countries must learn multiple languages, not just one, they got it right. Also how do expect we create diplomats to talk to other countries? Should we all just buy language for dummies books for those who want to become diplomats, or special forces to beable to communicate to others when trying to find, oh I dont know Bin Ladden? So the world should just learn to speak English? How arrogant and ignorant
5. Health tests? If you went to a bar would you ask or provide your I'm free of aids card? I'm sure you will get quite lucky with that line. If you dont want to be apart of others culture than hide away like an agoraphobic. So each time you are stuck in customs will you wait for hours for a medical test thats public information? Nothing can guarantee a germ free society.
6. I believe in certain tax cuts but nothing should be cast in stone when it comes to our economy, because it is in a constant state of flux. If our leaders are soo brilliant as they are labled then they could make the right decisions at the right time, afterall thats the point of making good decisions, not a template. But I do agree that something needs to be done.
7. I wish we could remove it however racism is alive and well not only in America but all over the world. Being white and a male I am privledged over a black person, asian, or a woman for that matter. Many so called white geniuses have destroyed our economy because they were more qualified. I believe in the right person for the job, but until we get past these antiquated stereotypes can we evolve.
8. As for class action lawyers I feel that in some instances they maintain the balance to scare major corporations from completely taking advantage of the workers. I am against lawsuits like sueing a neighbor for not fencing their pool when your child drowns. If you had the time to have the child its your responsibility to take care of it and blaming another is so wrong. Also getting into a fight and suing for millions or thousands, end frivolous lawsiuts and that begins with the judges excercising common sense vs. someone getting hurt seriously due to a car wreck.
This idea of a Paul Revere society is stupid, racist, and unrealistic. The point of a democracy is to protect the little guy who cant stand up for themselves not pander to the majority, without it their is no freedom from persecution, life or liberty, nor hte pursuit of happiness. If we abandon these founding principles we forfit our right as Americans. I normally agree with you on many things but this? You have got to be kidding me.
2. I like my freedom and I wont part with it. I wont be carrying a passport or questioned whenever I go places, to appease some sort of false sense of security. When it is your time to go, its your time, life and death cant be stopped. We have only been attacked on our soil, what three times? To me thats a great track record, how many other countries can make that boast?
3. Deport them you say? How much would you pay for your produce? How many Americans will go into a field and pick these crops for less than a dollar an hour? So shall we pay them 8.50 an hour plus benefits? Are you going to pay $5 a pound for an apple?Are we going to ban all American companies from having their manufacturing plants in all other countries only to cost millions to investors and to the entire stockmarket as the companies go bankrupt forcing Americans here to get laid off? Our dollar, trade, and businesses assist in balancing world economy, we screw them, they screw us its that simple. What about tourism? Think it will survive the just stay in our shell? We were founded on the melting pot theory for a reason, all cultures contribute into the evolution of our society. there maybe some bad apples but there are quite a few that make major contributions whether noticed or not. I like diversity it what makes us strong. I like seeing other colors in people.
4. As for eliminating bilingual education but to graduate high school, or any degree needs a foriegn language, all other countries must learn multiple languages, not just one, they got it right. Also how do expect we create diplomats to talk to other countries? Should we all just buy language for dummies books for those who want to become diplomats, or special forces to beable to communicate to others when trying to find, oh I dont know Bin Ladden? So the world should just learn to speak English? How arrogant and ignorant
5. Health tests? If you went to a bar would you ask or provide your I'm free of aids card? I'm sure you will get quite lucky with that line. If you dont want to be apart of others culture than hide away like an agoraphobic. So each time you are stuck in customs will you wait for hours for a medical test thats public information? Nothing can guarantee a germ free society.
6. I believe in certain tax cuts but nothing should be cast in stone when it comes to our economy, because it is in a constant state of flux. If our leaders are soo brilliant as they are labled then they could make the right decisions at the right time, afterall thats the point of making good decisions, not a template. But I do agree that something needs to be done.
7. I wish we could remove it however racism is alive and well not only in America but all over the world. Being white and a male I am privledged over a black person, asian, or a woman for that matter. Many so called white geniuses have destroyed our economy because they were more qualified. I believe in the right person for the job, but until we get past these antiquated stereotypes can we evolve.
8. As for class action lawyers I feel that in some instances they maintain the balance to scare major corporations from completely taking advantage of the workers. I am against lawsuits like sueing a neighbor for not fencing their pool when your child drowns. If you had the time to have the child its your responsibility to take care of it and blaming another is so wrong. Also getting into a fight and suing for millions or thousands, end frivolous lawsiuts and that begins with the judges excercising common sense vs. someone getting hurt seriously due to a car wreck.
This idea of a Paul Revere society is stupid, racist, and unrealistic. The point of a democracy is to protect the little guy who cant stand up for themselves not pander to the majority, without it their is no freedom from persecution, life or liberty, nor hte pursuit of happiness. If we abandon these founding principles we forfit our right as Americans. I normally agree with you on many things but this? You have got to be kidding me.
The point of a democracy is to allow all people involved in that democracy to have a voice. However, since in democracies we vote, then the majority does rule. Right now it seems more and more that we bow to all the right wing and left wing elements because they have lots of access to the media. Their views generate a lot of money for the media thus that is why you see a lot about some very radical views. However, when these views go to a vote, they are often turned down. We need to find the place near the middle where even the little guy does not feel extremely alienated. Discussion needs to happen in depth on all of these issues but absolute stances cannot be tolerated.
We are a society of diverse cultures. I like it. Instead of shouting at each other that "It is my way of the highway" which tears down America, we should be finding our common ground. I know what that common ground is...We all love this place called America because of the privliges and freedoms we have. Sappy?? Maybe. But just look at how we banded together after 9/11. The love showed through.
It is my greatest hope that cooler heads will prevail in the issues laid out here.
--Lori
We are a society of diverse cultures. I like it. Instead of shouting at each other that "It is my way of the highway" which tears down America, we should be finding our common ground. I know what that common ground is...We all love this place called America because of the privliges and freedoms we have. Sappy?? Maybe. But just look at how we banded together after 9/11. The love showed through.
It is my greatest hope that cooler heads will prevail in the issues laid out here.
--Lori
I will discuss your points one by one:
1) ?The talk of traditional marriage is ridiculous?.
I would say that talk of non-traditional marriage is ridiculous. When I refer to traditional marriage I am speaking about a marriage between one man and one woman. This is NOT a solely Christian concept. I think Jews and Muslims would agree with me with my definition. Your argument is not logical nor to the point. How do failed marriages and spousal abuse abdicate gay marriage? It?s absurd. Marriage is the foundation of the family and the family is the foundation of this country. If we destroy the underpinnings of the family we destroy the foundation of this country.
2) Now perhaps I was not as clear as I should have been but I fail to understand how your statement about carrying ID around with you everywhere you go has to do with closing the borders? For that matter I think you have to have ID for anything these days. Want to drive? You?ve got to have a license. Want to open a checking account? You?ve got to have ID. Now as for people checking your ID all the time I don?t see that happening. I agree that the average citizen should expect a certain amount of privacy and should only be asked for ID when he or she is suspected with some malfeasance. As for being attacked on our soil ? Ask those people who lost family members during the 9/11 attacks whether three times is a great track record.
3) What I am advocating is the deportation of all illegal immigrants who knowingly and unlawfully entered this country. If you are worried about a cheap labor force we can focus our efforts on rewarding those immigrants who do come here legally and thereby set the standard for others to follow. I must say that I am confused about your argument. On the one hand you say that tort lawyers are a check against big business and protect the little guy and then on the other you advocate a virtual slave labor force that is paid a substandard wage so we can keep the price of our produce low. I agree with you that this country is a homogenous conglomeration of multiple cultures, races and creeds and we have benefited from them all. Strong border control has nothing to do with race relations or changes legal immigration.
4) I should have stated this differently. What this means is that regular classes should be taught in English only. This is not referring to language classes.
5) Communicable diseases have increased dramatically in the United States since NAFTA. TB for starters is rampant in certain migrant worker communities. Aids is like any other communicable disease and as a nation we can and should attempt to protect our citizens from external threats such as disease carrying agents. I don?t think this is unreasonable.
6) I have said before that I believe that the money I earn is mine and if the government is going to take it they should be accountable for it?s proper use. There are several well renowned economists who agree with the Presidents decision to free up more wealth for the economy to grow through these hard times. Please do not berate me with this tax cuts for the wealthy because that is utter tosh. I am not wealthy and I was affected by the Presidents tax cuts and so were a lot of liberals out there who won?t admit as much.
7) Affirmative action didn?t work in the first place. At best it pandered to minority groups and at worst it caused this nation to fall into a lull of mediocrity where the lowest common denominator was the rule of the day. Any consideration of race or color is racism. You agree with me that affirmative action was at it?s very core racist so how can you defend something that is inherently wrong? I believe that questions of race or gender should be irrelevant to the point of illegality. What this means is that if you are applying for s scholarship or a bank loan or a job and someone asks for you race or gender then that person has broken the law. We should be a nation a race blind people and we can only accomplish this by teaching our children that one?s color or gender is irrelevant.
8) Torte Lawyers are thieves and should be imprisoned. Torte law is extortion at is basest form. Think about it. I as a torte lawyer go out and recruit ten thousand ?victims? and get them to join my class action law suit and select me as their representative. I file suite against some company on behalf of these ?poor unfortunate souls? and then settle with the companies lawyers for say $1200 for each client. I get 30% right off the top which is 3.6 million. Each person gets $1164. So who wins here?
The Paul Revere society could most appropriately be described as a being for traditional American values and common sense. To advocate racial blindness is not racism but its antithesis.
1) ?The talk of traditional marriage is ridiculous?.
I would say that talk of non-traditional marriage is ridiculous. When I refer to traditional marriage I am speaking about a marriage between one man and one woman. This is NOT a solely Christian concept. I think Jews and Muslims would agree with me with my definition. Your argument is not logical nor to the point. How do failed marriages and spousal abuse abdicate gay marriage? It?s absurd. Marriage is the foundation of the family and the family is the foundation of this country. If we destroy the underpinnings of the family we destroy the foundation of this country.
2) Now perhaps I was not as clear as I should have been but I fail to understand how your statement about carrying ID around with you everywhere you go has to do with closing the borders? For that matter I think you have to have ID for anything these days. Want to drive? You?ve got to have a license. Want to open a checking account? You?ve got to have ID. Now as for people checking your ID all the time I don?t see that happening. I agree that the average citizen should expect a certain amount of privacy and should only be asked for ID when he or she is suspected with some malfeasance. As for being attacked on our soil ? Ask those people who lost family members during the 9/11 attacks whether three times is a great track record.
3) What I am advocating is the deportation of all illegal immigrants who knowingly and unlawfully entered this country. If you are worried about a cheap labor force we can focus our efforts on rewarding those immigrants who do come here legally and thereby set the standard for others to follow. I must say that I am confused about your argument. On the one hand you say that tort lawyers are a check against big business and protect the little guy and then on the other you advocate a virtual slave labor force that is paid a substandard wage so we can keep the price of our produce low. I agree with you that this country is a homogenous conglomeration of multiple cultures, races and creeds and we have benefited from them all. Strong border control has nothing to do with race relations or changes legal immigration.
4) I should have stated this differently. What this means is that regular classes should be taught in English only. This is not referring to language classes.
5) Communicable diseases have increased dramatically in the United States since NAFTA. TB for starters is rampant in certain migrant worker communities. Aids is like any other communicable disease and as a nation we can and should attempt to protect our citizens from external threats such as disease carrying agents. I don?t think this is unreasonable.
6) I have said before that I believe that the money I earn is mine and if the government is going to take it they should be accountable for it?s proper use. There are several well renowned economists who agree with the Presidents decision to free up more wealth for the economy to grow through these hard times. Please do not berate me with this tax cuts for the wealthy because that is utter tosh. I am not wealthy and I was affected by the Presidents tax cuts and so were a lot of liberals out there who won?t admit as much.
7) Affirmative action didn?t work in the first place. At best it pandered to minority groups and at worst it caused this nation to fall into a lull of mediocrity where the lowest common denominator was the rule of the day. Any consideration of race or color is racism. You agree with me that affirmative action was at it?s very core racist so how can you defend something that is inherently wrong? I believe that questions of race or gender should be irrelevant to the point of illegality. What this means is that if you are applying for s scholarship or a bank loan or a job and someone asks for you race or gender then that person has broken the law. We should be a nation a race blind people and we can only accomplish this by teaching our children that one?s color or gender is irrelevant.
8) Torte Lawyers are thieves and should be imprisoned. Torte law is extortion at is basest form. Think about it. I as a torte lawyer go out and recruit ten thousand ?victims? and get them to join my class action law suit and select me as their representative. I file suite against some company on behalf of these ?poor unfortunate souls? and then settle with the companies lawyers for say $1200 for each client. I get 30% right off the top which is 3.6 million. Each person gets $1164. So who wins here?
The Paul Revere society could most appropriately be described as a being for traditional American values and common sense. To advocate racial blindness is not racism but its antithesis.
1. You and I will probably never agree on this issue because your foundation of your argument is based off religion. Regardless of the moralistic rules of any religion we are supposed to have a separation of church and state which we dont. All religions impart a moralistic wisdom that that makes a better world and not so better world all the time, nothing is perfect, especially religion since its concept is created and governed by man. Religion to me is against homosexuality because it is self defeating that homosexuality doesnt repopulate the society. History has shown that if the population of said religion doesnt reproduce the religion will die out due to small numbers being replaced by a larger more excepted one. To me the fight over this right to marriage is to grant gay people the same economic benefits that anyone else should get ie insurance and tax breaks. Just because they are different doesnt negate their right to equality. If the church or other religions want to ban this then it is their right, but not their right to force a judge from performing his duty under religious law. To me equating marriage as the backbone is a false statement, your choice to love and do right is and single parents have a stronger commitment to their children than a married couple, because they dont have much to fall back on. We can argue till we are blue in the face, but that is my stance and I respect yours despite my aversion.
2. My stance on the I.D. thing is a fear of attack that we have be more stringent on a daily basis that will cascade from stricter borders. I am for more safety but that's the price we pay for our free society. Yes we need i.d.s but I dont want it to get out of hand, which it has that possibility. Do I want more security yes, but lets not act like a red scare. As for the attack issue, any loss of life whether civilian or military is horrible and just think how the world lost out on many lives that could have impacted everyones lives only to be cut short. You or I will never know their smile, laugh, insight etc... but that's life and tradedy happens every second around the world whether noticed or not. i do not make light of these losses, but certain people are pushing peoples fear buttons to facilitate their own personal adgendas. Everyone now is tuaght to fear the other that they will attack, hurt, or cheat you. its wise to be wary but shutting the world out will not furhter produce understanding nor evolution is my point. Learn from our mistakes and dont start new ones out of fear and ignorance. We both as well as many strive for this perfection that our loved ones and others that we do not know will never experience this horror. But many nations have had this reality ten fold to our total attacks.
3. There is no perfect answer to this solution but we as a nation as well as lets say Mexico have benefitted from this odd alliance to help stablized our economies. The point I was talking about is this: Is the reason for this issue about national security, providing jobs for Americans, or an excuse to facilitae racism to remove those who are not white, merley browns? I hate that these people get paid slave wages, but once here they have an oppronuity to do other things and become more. There is no morality in business, its all profit and exploitation and we all hide behind the facade of professionalism while ruining others lives for said profit. I want change but arbitrarily deporting these people who stimulate our economy by investing in America is rewarded harshly, beacuse its been allowed for decades not recently, all eyes have been turned away as long as it benefits us. How sad in a moralistic society we have. We send manufacturing plants to their country because we can get cheap labor not pay them career wages to stabalize their economy or offer medical benefits as Americans do and as long as our products ar echeaper we buy them not boycott these companies. European countries dont have the problem we do in immigration because they make it easy for others to profit form their land and they dont have too many problems. Bottom line is what in it for us rather than the melting pot theory. I do differ that isolationalism is counter productive and tourism will drop off if we maintain that only America for Americans. Profit comes from many places and I like visitors or others that become Americans and embrace our freedom which we are trying to influence in other countries to model themselves after us.
4. Touche. I agree that English needs to be taught as a first language but I really dont see it as a big deal, only fear of other cultures influence. To me I just dont see European societies falling or disappearing at merging cultures especially when our entire culture is made up of every culture and nothing that is uniquely born here albeit the sum of all.
5. I agree that improvements are needed to better protect us since our medical situation is rather sub par controlled by profit, not need. My point is, to what end will we take this "fear"? Since you are a religious person, I take it, then God has a plan. Be smart not foolish, but you can see if people are lead to believe that the illness factors are because of foreigners and not poor self judgements to their own health than it could be bad. Improve awareness, invest in more avalibilty to care for these factors then.
6. I agree with your stance on this I just point out that there cant be a set standard, freedom and prosperity has a price and I for one dont mind paying for it. We both agree that change and a better solution is needed, what that is I couldnt fathom.
7. I do agree with the point that it it an excersize in racism. Its original intention was to level the playing field because their is a massive racial hatred worldwide and pretty titles ect cant change that, however you dont see too many minority management, politians. Do you think a jewish man, black man, or a woman will or could become president today? Its sad to say that no, nor is equal pay a reality today, if not now then when? Until people decide to play nice like we are taught as a child we have to have this bad system, how sad.
8. My stance is that the penalties for said lawsuits need to be governed with common sense not loopholes nor standard templates of punishments. My point is if I have to have an eye removed and a doctor takes the good one than he should pay hefty sum, not a couple thousand for his mistake because a law states a standard in tune with pulling a wrong tooth. Our politians can re-write the laws, but they choose not to allowing rediculous lawsuits like a celebrity striking someone and the victim getting a multimillion dollar settlement. The gets manipulated unjustly and needs reform, but needs checks and balances in place.
We are not so different but differ slightly on certain issues while agreeing on many. we both want a better tommorow but many people are brow beat into belief systems that controll us to not strive or expect that as long as we pay someone to fix the problem, that we dont have a responsibility to force change. Good points.
2. My stance on the I.D. thing is a fear of attack that we have be more stringent on a daily basis that will cascade from stricter borders. I am for more safety but that's the price we pay for our free society. Yes we need i.d.s but I dont want it to get out of hand, which it has that possibility. Do I want more security yes, but lets not act like a red scare. As for the attack issue, any loss of life whether civilian or military is horrible and just think how the world lost out on many lives that could have impacted everyones lives only to be cut short. You or I will never know their smile, laugh, insight etc... but that's life and tradedy happens every second around the world whether noticed or not. i do not make light of these losses, but certain people are pushing peoples fear buttons to facilitate their own personal adgendas. Everyone now is tuaght to fear the other that they will attack, hurt, or cheat you. its wise to be wary but shutting the world out will not furhter produce understanding nor evolution is my point. Learn from our mistakes and dont start new ones out of fear and ignorance. We both as well as many strive for this perfection that our loved ones and others that we do not know will never experience this horror. But many nations have had this reality ten fold to our total attacks.
3. There is no perfect answer to this solution but we as a nation as well as lets say Mexico have benefitted from this odd alliance to help stablized our economies. The point I was talking about is this: Is the reason for this issue about national security, providing jobs for Americans, or an excuse to facilitae racism to remove those who are not white, merley browns? I hate that these people get paid slave wages, but once here they have an oppronuity to do other things and become more. There is no morality in business, its all profit and exploitation and we all hide behind the facade of professionalism while ruining others lives for said profit. I want change but arbitrarily deporting these people who stimulate our economy by investing in America is rewarded harshly, beacuse its been allowed for decades not recently, all eyes have been turned away as long as it benefits us. How sad in a moralistic society we have. We send manufacturing plants to their country because we can get cheap labor not pay them career wages to stabalize their economy or offer medical benefits as Americans do and as long as our products ar echeaper we buy them not boycott these companies. European countries dont have the problem we do in immigration because they make it easy for others to profit form their land and they dont have too many problems. Bottom line is what in it for us rather than the melting pot theory. I do differ that isolationalism is counter productive and tourism will drop off if we maintain that only America for Americans. Profit comes from many places and I like visitors or others that become Americans and embrace our freedom which we are trying to influence in other countries to model themselves after us.
4. Touche. I agree that English needs to be taught as a first language but I really dont see it as a big deal, only fear of other cultures influence. To me I just dont see European societies falling or disappearing at merging cultures especially when our entire culture is made up of every culture and nothing that is uniquely born here albeit the sum of all.
5. I agree that improvements are needed to better protect us since our medical situation is rather sub par controlled by profit, not need. My point is, to what end will we take this "fear"? Since you are a religious person, I take it, then God has a plan. Be smart not foolish, but you can see if people are lead to believe that the illness factors are because of foreigners and not poor self judgements to their own health than it could be bad. Improve awareness, invest in more avalibilty to care for these factors then.
6. I agree with your stance on this I just point out that there cant be a set standard, freedom and prosperity has a price and I for one dont mind paying for it. We both agree that change and a better solution is needed, what that is I couldnt fathom.
7. I do agree with the point that it it an excersize in racism. Its original intention was to level the playing field because their is a massive racial hatred worldwide and pretty titles ect cant change that, however you dont see too many minority management, politians. Do you think a jewish man, black man, or a woman will or could become president today? Its sad to say that no, nor is equal pay a reality today, if not now then when? Until people decide to play nice like we are taught as a child we have to have this bad system, how sad.
8. My stance is that the penalties for said lawsuits need to be governed with common sense not loopholes nor standard templates of punishments. My point is if I have to have an eye removed and a doctor takes the good one than he should pay hefty sum, not a couple thousand for his mistake because a law states a standard in tune with pulling a wrong tooth. Our politians can re-write the laws, but they choose not to allowing rediculous lawsuits like a celebrity striking someone and the victim getting a multimillion dollar settlement. The gets manipulated unjustly and needs reform, but needs checks and balances in place.
We are not so different but differ slightly on certain issues while agreeing on many. we both want a better tommorow but many people are brow beat into belief systems that controll us to not strive or expect that as long as we pay someone to fix the problem, that we dont have a responsibility to force change. Good points.
You are right. We agree on many things and disagree on a few. But then we?re Americans and are allowed to disagree with one another. I thank you for your response as it was thoughtful and articulate.
On #4 (stamping out bilingual ed and the influence of any "other" culture):
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks three languages?
A. Trilingual.
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks two languages?
A. Bilingual.
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks one language?
A. American.
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks three languages?
A. Trilingual.
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks two languages?
A. Bilingual.
Q. What do you call somebody who speaks one language?
A. American.
Such wit! Such flare! It was even maybe a little bit funny. I?ll admit that the original post was not worded properly. I should have said that general classes should be taught in English as this is our officially recognized national language and is one of the bonding factors that hold us together as a nation.
What would Paul Revere have thought of the aims of the society named after him?
Think he along with his kin would have revolted a long time ago but that is another topic all together. They had a fit and fell in it when their tea was taxed but they would have screamed bloody murder if they could see the taxes we pay today.
First of all this is an inappropriate area for posts such as yours as it in no way relates to IT.
Second your post illustrates that bigotry is still all too common. The scary thing is that now thanks to technology the bigots of the world can spread their message of intolerance to millions with just a few mouse clicks.
Third as anyone with half of a brain will tell you Affirmative Action is a thing of the past. All of the laws and bills related to Affirmative Action have expired. The funny thing is that as affirmative action laws expired there was no great outcry amongst the masses but let two consenting adults make the choice to spend their lives together with all the legal rights that they should have and the Jerry Fallwell(Jerry's Kids) devotees come out swinging.
Second your post illustrates that bigotry is still all too common. The scary thing is that now thanks to technology the bigots of the world can spread their message of intolerance to millions with just a few mouse clicks.
Third as anyone with half of a brain will tell you Affirmative Action is a thing of the past. All of the laws and bills related to Affirmative Action have expired. The funny thing is that as affirmative action laws expired there was no great outcry amongst the masses but let two consenting adults make the choice to spend their lives together with all the legal rights that they should have and the Jerry Fallwell(Jerry's Kids) devotees come out swinging.
In most newsgroups(and I've been on newsgroups for 10 years) its considered polite to lurk and understand a bit of the culture before you dive in and post. If you had done that, you would note that a) this kind of posting is common and accepted here and b) you don't happen to be the arbiter of what is and is not appopriate here.
Secondly you use the term bigotry and you yourself proivde a bigoted example to back it up. Good on you! Half a brain - thats really accepting of you....
You will find that you will get more acceptance for your ideas if you show a little respect for your fellow posters.
James
Secondly you use the term bigotry and you yourself proivde a bigoted example to back it up. Good on you! Half a brain - thats really accepting of you....
You will find that you will get more acceptance for your ideas if you show a little respect for your fellow posters.
James
That is bloody brilliant! I have added this new word to my lexicon and will use it as much as possible over the following days and weeks! Netiquette! It rolls off the tongue much the same was as ?twaddle?. Wonderful!
Lets disect this question post bit by bit.
I am not a lurker and resent being referred to as such. If you took a little time to look at my profile you would be able to quickly ascertain that fact (10k v 5k). How long you have been in newsgroups is really quite irrelevant to subject at hand.
(In most newsgroups(and I've been on newsgroups for 10 years) its considered polite to lurk and understand a bit of the culture before you dive in and post. If you had done that, you would note that a) this kind of posting is common and accepted here and )
You are right that I am not the arbiter of what is appropriate here. What I am for the record is an African-American female in a non-traditional career who is extremely offended by the statements made by the orginal poster. I am further offended that those statements would be embraced by other individuals.
(you don't happen to be the arbiter of what is and is not appopriate here.)
I would like to know how the term with half of a brain is bigotry. There are a lot of minority groups out there but I have yet to meet one which falls into that category. I fear that by your definition we would all be bigots.
I am not looking for acceptance of my ideas. Fitting in or blending in with the group has never been a personal aspiration of mine nor a realistic goal.
(You will find that you will get more acceptance for your ideas if you show a little respect for your fellow posters.)
This is how genocide starts. Individuals spout ideas and rhetoric which can only be classified as racist. People who know it's wrong allow them to spread their hatred by remaining silent. I refuse to sit idly by as statements like this are posted. And if you choose to do so you are just as guilty as the person who made the statements. It is the same thing as when someone tells a racist joke and you don't think it is funny but you don't tell the person that it is offensive either.
I realize that I am in the minority here in more ways than one but am at a loss as to how you could be offended by my post but not by the content of the original post.
I am not a lurker and resent being referred to as such. If you took a little time to look at my profile you would be able to quickly ascertain that fact (10k v 5k). How long you have been in newsgroups is really quite irrelevant to subject at hand.
(In most newsgroups(and I've been on newsgroups for 10 years) its considered polite to lurk and understand a bit of the culture before you dive in and post. If you had done that, you would note that a) this kind of posting is common and accepted here and )
You are right that I am not the arbiter of what is appropriate here. What I am for the record is an African-American female in a non-traditional career who is extremely offended by the statements made by the orginal poster. I am further offended that those statements would be embraced by other individuals.
(you don't happen to be the arbiter of what is and is not appopriate here.)
I would like to know how the term with half of a brain is bigotry. There are a lot of minority groups out there but I have yet to meet one which falls into that category. I fear that by your definition we would all be bigots.
I am not looking for acceptance of my ideas. Fitting in or blending in with the group has never been a personal aspiration of mine nor a realistic goal.
(You will find that you will get more acceptance for your ideas if you show a little respect for your fellow posters.)
This is how genocide starts. Individuals spout ideas and rhetoric which can only be classified as racist. People who know it's wrong allow them to spread their hatred by remaining silent. I refuse to sit idly by as statements like this are posted. And if you choose to do so you are just as guilty as the person who made the statements. It is the same thing as when someone tells a racist joke and you don't think it is funny but you don't tell the person that it is offensive either.
I realize that I am in the minority here in more ways than one but am at a loss as to how you could be offended by my post but not by the content of the original post.
I've been a watcher on TR post since March and finally reckoned that I could poke in the occasional pointed stick recently.
This corner of TR's forums has a relatively number of *very* regular contributors and most of the posts follow a standard pattern of people taking extreme positions and then - mostly - beating each other up. This is their playground and if you don't like the rules of the game, then go away!
To suggest, as you do, that "this is how genocide starts" is hyperbole beyond all imagining.
Neil
This corner of TR's forums has a relatively number of *very* regular contributors and most of the posts follow a standard pattern of people taking extreme positions and then - mostly - beating each other up. This is their playground and if you don't like the rules of the game, then go away!
To suggest, as you do, that "this is how genocide starts" is hyperbole beyond all imagining.
Neil
You may have been posting in the Q&A section, as do I (and this is my second ID if you are keeping score of points, I don't really), but you have not been diving into these discussions. And these types of discussion have been common here.
I don't particularly care about your race, colour or sex. I don't agree with the original poster either, but I didn't resort to ad hominem attack by calling him a half brain. What I meant by bigotry is that you asserted that the person who doesn't agree with you must be stupid. Thats the height of conceit and arrogance. I don't agree with many of the posts here, but that doesn't mean I consider those of opposing views to be "half brained". Shall I define bigot from dictionary.com: One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.
I would say that "half brain" is bigoted statement by that yardstick.
I'm not asking you to look for acceptance - I suggested that ideas matter, and if you tone down the rhetoric, those who might be inclined to support you or who sit on the fence might hear the thought and not just the noise. You do your own arguments a disservice.
Trust me, I am not in any way starting genocide. Racist is a strong word. I've also not only interrupted racist jokes, but taken HR action against what I have seen in the workplace.
I am not offended that you attacked the orginal poster, it was the tone and tenor of your argument, and your argument that this discussion should not take place here. Tech Republic has not moderated this forum or placed limits on free speech here. They certainly have the right - so in the absense of that - the group itself can police itself.
I don't defend the aims and goals of the Paul Revere society, but I defend the rights of Protius to espouse them, as long as he is not advocating violence. I also defend your right to attack his views. But I merely suggest that unless your goal is simply to vent your spleen, if your goal is to persaude others of the justice of your cause, you might stick a little closer to the high road. There is no point in wrestling in the mud with a pig - you get covered in mud and pig sh$t and the pig enjoys it.
And I don't know if it was your intent to infer that I am racist, by inaction -don't even go there.
james
I don't particularly care about your race, colour or sex. I don't agree with the original poster either, but I didn't resort to ad hominem attack by calling him a half brain. What I meant by bigotry is that you asserted that the person who doesn't agree with you must be stupid. Thats the height of conceit and arrogance. I don't agree with many of the posts here, but that doesn't mean I consider those of opposing views to be "half brained". Shall I define bigot from dictionary.com: One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.
I would say that "half brain" is bigoted statement by that yardstick.
I'm not asking you to look for acceptance - I suggested that ideas matter, and if you tone down the rhetoric, those who might be inclined to support you or who sit on the fence might hear the thought and not just the noise. You do your own arguments a disservice.
Trust me, I am not in any way starting genocide. Racist is a strong word. I've also not only interrupted racist jokes, but taken HR action against what I have seen in the workplace.
I am not offended that you attacked the orginal poster, it was the tone and tenor of your argument, and your argument that this discussion should not take place here. Tech Republic has not moderated this forum or placed limits on free speech here. They certainly have the right - so in the absense of that - the group itself can police itself.
I don't defend the aims and goals of the Paul Revere society, but I defend the rights of Protius to espouse them, as long as he is not advocating violence. I also defend your right to attack his views. But I merely suggest that unless your goal is simply to vent your spleen, if your goal is to persaude others of the justice of your cause, you might stick a little closer to the high road. There is no point in wrestling in the mud with a pig - you get covered in mud and pig sh$t and the pig enjoys it.
And I don't know if it was your intent to infer that I am racist, by inaction -don't even go there.
james
That's MISTER PIG!!!! Sorry I got lost in the moment for a second. Hakuna Matata! I guess I would be the pig in this analogy but trust me when I say I don't wallow in my own feces. I concur with you totally and I said as much. I guess I would like to hear from the rest of you as well because I don?t think that I am way out of line here. Perhaps I should start another thread on Affirmative Action being a racist enterprise.
One thing that I want to make abundantly clear (and those of you who have read my posts before can attest to this) is that I am a Christian (firstly), an American secondly and a human being thirdly. I advocate violence or repression to no one.
One thing that I want to make abundantly clear (and those of you who have read my posts before can attest to this) is that I am a Christian (firstly), an American secondly and a human being thirdly. I advocate violence or repression to no one.
I probably failed to communicate effectivly. I was trying to be funny with the pig remark as I thought you were. No harm done. I wasn't offended in the least and I hope you weren't either. I'm not sure what ROFL means but I hope it was a good thing. ;o)I had to look it up. ROFL Roll on the floor laughing. Good! I am glad someone thinks I am funny!
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