Is Windows Genuine Advantage is that anti piracy or is just spyware you be the judge. Its not okay for Sony to put a rootkit in your computer but Microsoft can by usine Window Genuine Advantage? Spyware weather you call it by another name is still spying.
Microsoft is not telling you the whole story if you look on the internet you find buches of website that already cracke the code and telling you a different side of the story on what it does. Would you want your computer reporting back to Microsoft what it doing? Techreplubic members what is your take on it.
Discussion on:
Windows Genuine Advantage is anti piracy or spware you be the judge.
View:
Show:
front line in the Windows Intel fight to get everyone to accept compulsory Secure Computing whereby your system will NOT be allowed on the network, be it internal or the Internet, unless it is registered as being legal hardware with legal software in the centralised database.
They announced this intent about eight years ago and the hardware and software has been moving down that path since. The use of the CPU and / or the hard drive seriel number in the authentication process was but one phase of this push.
They announced this intent about eight years ago and the hardware and software has been moving down that path since. The use of the CPU and / or the hard drive seriel number in the authentication process was but one phase of this push.
They may be working the bugs out for when the Windows Live paradigm shift comes, which would need a Trusted Computing Platform first. When most of the "service" comes from a central server, ensuring that Microsoft can correctly identify its paid users becomes even more critical. It's harder to pirate an entire operating system than it is to have a small subset of the code on your PC and then fool the server into giving you "services" you haven't paid for. The entire Genuine Advantage program may be less about ensuring today's profits than it is about locking in tomorrow's. The fact that the program helps them today may be nothing more than a nice side effect for them.
"in the Windows Intel fight to get everyone to accept compulsory Secure Computing"
The first issue to solve in secure comouting is not to check wheter software is paid for or not. First issue is to create a secure PC in the first place, that means secure OS and applications.
Unsecure SW, and an unsecure PC on any net, is unsecure whether it is paid for, borrowed, pirated, or free.
The first issue to solve in secure comouting is not to check wheter software is paid for or not. First issue is to create a secure PC in the first place, that means secure OS and applications.
Unsecure SW, and an unsecure PC on any net, is unsecure whether it is paid for, borrowed, pirated, or free.
For MS and Intel as they force everybody to upgrade all their computer hardware. If you want a secure computing environment and the only way to get is to have a specific set of hardware and software and the system is NOT compatible with anything else, and refuses to accept anything from a non-secure system, then your only option is to buy the new hardware and software. And once committed to it, you have to continue with the updates and upgrades they put out, regardless of the cost.
Now the biggest problem that Wintel (the MS Intel combine) has, is that Secure Computing will not work if the company concerned needs to interact with another company. Modern business means heavy Internet usage for e-commerce, e-communications, exchanging orders, sales, invoices, banking, e-mails over the Internet. Thus the aim to get the Internet Secure Computing stable, thus the need to get all the users buying in to the system.
They have some major issues to overcome here.
1. The Internet is deliberately designed to be an open communications system that will survive extreme infrastructure damage and still oeprate.
2. Most home users use older equipment to access the Internet.
3. Any corporate network can be made totally secure from EXTERNAL attack using existing hardware and software, this has been possible for over a decade. NB Nothing can protect you fully from an Internal attack.
The real questions are how far will users and business allow themselves to be pushed by MS and Intel so that Wintel can sew up their profit base? Will they spend the money to properly establish secure gateways or spend the money on the Wintel option?
Back in the 1990's I worked with a secure gateway that was well designed, included features that stopped intrusions, viruses, and trojans dead in their tracks. The price to be paid was that proprietary program files like .pdf, flash movies, Java pages etc were not visible through the gateway as the anti-virus software could not open, read and verify the code was NOT malicious. So some users complained - the answer they got was "get back to work, no work required web site use that crap." Oh, almost forgot, all e-mail attachments had to be in industry standard open code formats like .txt, .rtf, .jpg etc.
The gateway had full redundancy and everything got scanned twice, by two different styles of software as it transited the gateway. Costly to set up, easy to maintain, and Dept of Defence approved.
The only virii that ever hit their internal network were quickly shutdown and traced to people who brought disks in from infected machines at home.
Now the biggest problem that Wintel (the MS Intel combine) has, is that Secure Computing will not work if the company concerned needs to interact with another company. Modern business means heavy Internet usage for e-commerce, e-communications, exchanging orders, sales, invoices, banking, e-mails over the Internet. Thus the aim to get the Internet Secure Computing stable, thus the need to get all the users buying in to the system.
They have some major issues to overcome here.
1. The Internet is deliberately designed to be an open communications system that will survive extreme infrastructure damage and still oeprate.
2. Most home users use older equipment to access the Internet.
3. Any corporate network can be made totally secure from EXTERNAL attack using existing hardware and software, this has been possible for over a decade. NB Nothing can protect you fully from an Internal attack.
The real questions are how far will users and business allow themselves to be pushed by MS and Intel so that Wintel can sew up their profit base? Will they spend the money to properly establish secure gateways or spend the money on the Wintel option?
Back in the 1990's I worked with a secure gateway that was well designed, included features that stopped intrusions, viruses, and trojans dead in their tracks. The price to be paid was that proprietary program files like .pdf, flash movies, Java pages etc were not visible through the gateway as the anti-virus software could not open, read and verify the code was NOT malicious. So some users complained - the answer they got was "get back to work, no work required web site use that crap." Oh, almost forgot, all e-mail attachments had to be in industry standard open code formats like .txt, .rtf, .jpg etc.
The gateway had full redundancy and everything got scanned twice, by two different styles of software as it transited the gateway. Costly to set up, easy to maintain, and Dept of Defence approved.
The only virii that ever hit their internal network were quickly shutdown and traced to people who brought disks in from infected machines at home.
Are you saying that if my Dell HD crashes, and I replace the HD, that I must also by a new XP Pro software package as well or I have broken the law?
Dr. Chevalier
132121@charter.net
Dr. Chevalier
132121@charter.net
You bought the license the first time and received a code for the software that you had to register in order to use it. That same number will be called in again when a significant number of changes have been made to your system.
A new hard drive no longer contains the validation code in the registry, so naturally, the OS must be re-registered with Micro$oft.
I change out hard drives often and make a lot of hardware changes that require registration. So far, no problem with the tech support people at Micro$oft.
A new hard drive no longer contains the validation code in the registry, so naturally, the OS must be re-registered with Micro$oft.
I change out hard drives often and make a lot of hardware changes that require registration. So far, no problem with the tech support people at Micro$oft.
Windows XP was originally launched with the idea that people would change (upgrade) parts of their systems over time. It was determined that if you changed 4 items in your system (6 if you had a network card installed) it would then need to be reactivated. They eventually made it where this applied in a 120 day period, since some people complained about testing equipment, etc.
More recently, however, I found out this had changed at an MS event. The MS rep said that they now say once you activated the copy of Windows, it is now bound to that motherboard forever. If the board proves defective, it may allow a second activation, but only (during the warranty)if it is replaced by the OEM that installed it. The big names all have corporate keys, so that does not matter to them to put a fresh copy on, but the little guys may not have any option but to "eat the cost," if MS will not. Seems unfair if someone sells you a motherboard and it fails 3-6 months down the line, you would have to buy a new copy of Windows if you did not buy it with the board.
This is bad for small OEMs, businesses, and consumers who like to build their own equipment to their own specs. Now, everytime you upgrade your motherboard, you have a new system, requiring a new copy of the same Windows you had previously. It doesn't matter that the old motherboard will never be used again (or that you would put Win 98 on it, then give it to your grandmother for email) They want a new license for the "new" computer you just assembled.
We were told by the rep that this allows us (system builders) the chance to sell another license, and what did anyone expect when they were already paying half the price of the retail version. (That $150 piece of cardboard)
I am an Action Pack subscriber, and this was never mentioned to me, but I was wondering why MS would not (flat out told me NO) activate my software.
They originally said that the AP software was for testing and evaluation in your business. While I did install on some systems to use, I kept some of the licenses for testing on various systems, which I changed. Now I found that I have licenses bound to what is now old hardware, that I can't use on newer platforms to see if they are viable alternatives. They did not even send me new keys to use when I renewed my subscription earlier this year, just took the same $300 they did last year. They also dropped the $100 discount for renewals.
Obviously I am not happy with MS, but why alienate the people you need to evangelize your software? Between this and the WGA fiasco, who really wants to have a Windows PC if they have to jump through hoops to maintain it? Rumor is that this only applies to people who buy OEM copies, not retail. Since I do not know anyone who actually owns a retail copy of the full version of XP Pro, I can't confirm this. Anyone out there know for sure?
WGA is just plain spyware MS forced down users throats. This was not a critical update that should be installed ASAP, it was a piece of software that if given the choice, most users would not install. This would mean that MS would not have had as large a "beta test pool" to work with before rolling it out as mandatory. It did nothing to repair a flaw in the OS, it just phones home everyday (or 14 days, now) to say, "Yes, everything is fine here, no piracy detected." It records your IP address, so with the push by the government to have ISPs track users IPs for months to years, it would not be difficult for MS to come back on someone now (or later) for "piracy" violations. If MS would do this, how much longer before they just decide to force down a patch to give them all the info of a user or system? Could this already be something being implemented in Vista? Sounds like paranoia, but could it happen before anyone found out? Do not forget what they did to DR-DOS years ago. Where do we as a community draw the line and say enough? Could it be time to have the world move to Linux? Stay tuned for the next exciting chapter.
OK, I will get off the soapbox now to allow others to agree or disagree at their whim. I'll just get an icy cold one and see what anyone else has to say. Thanks for letting me vent
More recently, however, I found out this had changed at an MS event. The MS rep said that they now say once you activated the copy of Windows, it is now bound to that motherboard forever. If the board proves defective, it may allow a second activation, but only (during the warranty)if it is replaced by the OEM that installed it. The big names all have corporate keys, so that does not matter to them to put a fresh copy on, but the little guys may not have any option but to "eat the cost," if MS will not. Seems unfair if someone sells you a motherboard and it fails 3-6 months down the line, you would have to buy a new copy of Windows if you did not buy it with the board.
This is bad for small OEMs, businesses, and consumers who like to build their own equipment to their own specs. Now, everytime you upgrade your motherboard, you have a new system, requiring a new copy of the same Windows you had previously. It doesn't matter that the old motherboard will never be used again (or that you would put Win 98 on it, then give it to your grandmother for email) They want a new license for the "new" computer you just assembled.
We were told by the rep that this allows us (system builders) the chance to sell another license, and what did anyone expect when they were already paying half the price of the retail version. (That $150 piece of cardboard)
I am an Action Pack subscriber, and this was never mentioned to me, but I was wondering why MS would not (flat out told me NO) activate my software.
They originally said that the AP software was for testing and evaluation in your business. While I did install on some systems to use, I kept some of the licenses for testing on various systems, which I changed. Now I found that I have licenses bound to what is now old hardware, that I can't use on newer platforms to see if they are viable alternatives. They did not even send me new keys to use when I renewed my subscription earlier this year, just took the same $300 they did last year. They also dropped the $100 discount for renewals.
Obviously I am not happy with MS, but why alienate the people you need to evangelize your software? Between this and the WGA fiasco, who really wants to have a Windows PC if they have to jump through hoops to maintain it? Rumor is that this only applies to people who buy OEM copies, not retail. Since I do not know anyone who actually owns a retail copy of the full version of XP Pro, I can't confirm this. Anyone out there know for sure?
WGA is just plain spyware MS forced down users throats. This was not a critical update that should be installed ASAP, it was a piece of software that if given the choice, most users would not install. This would mean that MS would not have had as large a "beta test pool" to work with before rolling it out as mandatory. It did nothing to repair a flaw in the OS, it just phones home everyday (or 14 days, now) to say, "Yes, everything is fine here, no piracy detected." It records your IP address, so with the push by the government to have ISPs track users IPs for months to years, it would not be difficult for MS to come back on someone now (or later) for "piracy" violations. If MS would do this, how much longer before they just decide to force down a patch to give them all the info of a user or system? Could this already be something being implemented in Vista? Sounds like paranoia, but could it happen before anyone found out? Do not forget what they did to DR-DOS years ago. Where do we as a community draw the line and say enough? Could it be time to have the world move to Linux? Stay tuned for the next exciting chapter.
OK, I will get off the soapbox now to allow others to agree or disagree at their whim. I'll just get an icy cold one and see what anyone else has to say. Thanks for letting me vent
people for your jurisdiction. Under the law here, NSW Australia, I have a copy of MS Win XP I can lawfully put it on any machine I damn well please as long as I have it on only one machine at a time. If they refuse to activate then they have to prive that I'm running it on more than one machine and take me to court or end up paying big fines under the consumer laws.
Here in AU we are a small market so there was no attempt to change the EULA for us here MS just expected US Law to apply but it didn't so that OEM Copies had to be supported by MS and not the system builder like they are in the US.
Even with the Acton Pack here things are different to the US as we can install the software on whatever we like for testing purposes or to use in our companies business transactions and the Action Pack that we get here may be different to what is supplied in the US as here we don't have to activate the products like an OEM Copy would require. The contents of our Action Packs are Volume License so there is no activation required.
However I think that in the US this is different and not only applies to Windows but to all MS OEM Software so in the event of a M'Board failing out of Guarantee they should provide new copies of Windows and Office as well as any other installed MS OEM software. To me this is nothing more than a Money Grab by MS but as that doesn't apply to me personally I can't complain.
MS does some silly things they wanted me to remove any reference to the Anti Piracy section of MS on my Companies Web Page while the Legal section where only too happy for me to do this and they even supplied my with a Sample EULA to use. Someone in marketing saw this as unwanted and demanded that I remove it via a phone call so I just rang the person that I spoke to in the Legal Department and asked what I should do. That problem disappeared straight away. However the References to Linux and other non MS OS's that I have on my Web Site where defiantly not acceptable to MS in any form even though they didn't offer a product to compete where these where used in large clusters at the time. Both the Technical and Legal sides of MS didn't see a problem but someone at marketing did and I was raked over the coals for allowing anything but MS to be displayed on my Companies Web Page. I asked for a written notification which at first the person was quite happy to do until he realised that I intended forwarding it on to the ACCC with a complaint then that was forgotten about. But if I was working in the US I would have had to have removed the Linux Page.
The Consumer Protection Laws in the US are no where near as strong as they are here so the OEM builders get a harder life than we do here. Most people think that I dislike MS because I don't like their products but the real reason is that I dislike MS because I work with them way too much and can't stand constantly jumping through hoops to keep them happy as a Volume License Deal can change in such a short time that it isn't funny and what happened on the last job no longer applies when I'm quoting for a new job 3 weeks latter.
MS Licensing is my biggest Bug Bear it nearly drives me crazy the way that they keep changing things as we go along. Things can change between the time a Quote is issued and the work started and even when you buy a Volume License you get the CD/s supplied and have to wait for a Product Key to be E-Mailed to you which generally arrived 7 to 10 working days after the install media so you can order something like a 25 Site License for XP Pro and Office and then wait around 2 to 3 weeks before you can begin the installation on the hardware that you have already built by this time. This system isn't geared to speed of deployment but only to suit MS needs. Whats even worse is if you are using a Volume License of say Windows and Office you get the product Keys E-Mailed to you in different E-Mails generally the Office Side of the Business is faster so you get that Key first and then have to wait for the Windows Key to arrive before you can start to create the original HDD that you are going to Clone from for the entire installation. Whist something as small as a 25 Site License you need 3 product Keys 1 for XP Pro 1 for the Server Version that you are using and 1 for Office and then any other MS Software that you may require for that business. It makes things hard to deal with and the deployment of a new system slower than it need be.
Col
Even with the Acton Pack here things are different to the US as we can install the software on whatever we like for testing purposes or to use in our companies business transactions and the Action Pack that we get here may be different to what is supplied in the US as here we don't have to activate the products like an OEM Copy would require. The contents of our Action Packs are Volume License so there is no activation required.
However I think that in the US this is different and not only applies to Windows but to all MS OEM Software so in the event of a M'Board failing out of Guarantee they should provide new copies of Windows and Office as well as any other installed MS OEM software. To me this is nothing more than a Money Grab by MS but as that doesn't apply to me personally I can't complain.
MS does some silly things they wanted me to remove any reference to the Anti Piracy section of MS on my Companies Web Page while the Legal section where only too happy for me to do this and they even supplied my with a Sample EULA to use. Someone in marketing saw this as unwanted and demanded that I remove it via a phone call so I just rang the person that I spoke to in the Legal Department and asked what I should do. That problem disappeared straight away. However the References to Linux and other non MS OS's that I have on my Web Site where defiantly not acceptable to MS in any form even though they didn't offer a product to compete where these where used in large clusters at the time. Both the Technical and Legal sides of MS didn't see a problem but someone at marketing did and I was raked over the coals for allowing anything but MS to be displayed on my Companies Web Page. I asked for a written notification which at first the person was quite happy to do until he realised that I intended forwarding it on to the ACCC with a complaint then that was forgotten about. But if I was working in the US I would have had to have removed the Linux Page.
The Consumer Protection Laws in the US are no where near as strong as they are here so the OEM builders get a harder life than we do here. Most people think that I dislike MS because I don't like their products but the real reason is that I dislike MS because I work with them way too much and can't stand constantly jumping through hoops to keep them happy as a Volume License Deal can change in such a short time that it isn't funny and what happened on the last job no longer applies when I'm quoting for a new job 3 weeks latter.
MS Licensing is my biggest Bug Bear it nearly drives me crazy the way that they keep changing things as we go along. Things can change between the time a Quote is issued and the work started and even when you buy a Volume License you get the CD/s supplied and have to wait for a Product Key to be E-Mailed to you which generally arrived 7 to 10 working days after the install media so you can order something like a 25 Site License for XP Pro and Office and then wait around 2 to 3 weeks before you can begin the installation on the hardware that you have already built by this time. This system isn't geared to speed of deployment but only to suit MS needs. Whats even worse is if you are using a Volume License of say Windows and Office you get the product Keys E-Mailed to you in different E-Mails generally the Office Side of the Business is faster so you get that Key first and then have to wait for the Windows Key to arrive before you can start to create the original HDD that you are going to Clone from for the entire installation. Whist something as small as a 25 Site License you need 3 product Keys 1 for XP Pro 1 for the Server Version that you are using and 1 for Office and then any other MS Software that you may require for that business. It makes things hard to deal with and the deployment of a new system slower than it need be.
Col
with the local legal people. I also know that the USA consumer laws are NOT standardised, the dederal laws are aminimum that apply and the states can build on them. The MS EULA is clearly written with the US federal laws in mind, but many of the US states have state consumer laws, that also apply, that are as strong, and some stronger, than the Aus consumer laws.
In any case, I would never accept the manufacturer's word on what is the legal situation on something, I would check with my local legal experts. MS has lost some state level court cases on their enforcement of the EULA as they were against state law. But none of that has any effect on their predatory marketting practices.
You do know that Bill Gates shaped his marketting practices on those of his marketing hero, Thomas Edison. Both have gone out of their way to steal other's ideas, and bully people to using their products, etc.
In any case, I would never accept the manufacturer's word on what is the legal situation on something, I would check with my local legal experts. MS has lost some state level court cases on their enforcement of the EULA as they were against state law. But none of that has any effect on their predatory marketting practices.
You do know that Bill Gates shaped his marketting practices on those of his marketing hero, Thomas Edison. Both have gone out of their way to steal other's ideas, and bully people to using their products, etc.
I agree with you its going to be like that movie 1984 what would life be in the future and the low man on the totem pole get screwed, like in the movie only high up could turn off the propaganda monitors where as the low man on the totem pole couldn't
Peace be with you all.
Peace be with you all.
Specific enough on this area. It could even mean replacing something as simple as a broken mouse could require an entire New MS product Lineup.
With OEM MS Software the EULA specifically says For Use With Original Hardware Only so you can draw the line where you think that Original Hardware means that a replacement Software Package is required. Then if you are using the Pro Version it says Licensed for use with 2 CPU's which according to the Legal People that I've spoken to can mean on 1 Dual Processor M'Board or on 2 Single Processor M'Boards it depends on the Law in your area. Either way I'm not interested in testing it either way.
According to MS currently they only apply this in AU to a CPU & M'Board Replacement where there is a significant Performance Increase achieved by replacing the CPU and M'Board. That was directly from the Legal Department at a MS Partners Meeting a few years ago. If you have to replace a CPU/M'Board and there isn't a significant Performance Increase involved or you do an insurance Job and use the lowest speed components currently available you can use the original OEM Software from MS. Upgrades where performance is increased dramatically should require a new set of OEM MS Software according to MS though to be honest they where not bothering with this the last time that I went to one of their Partner Meetings in May. They where also pushing the idea that I could sell OEM product if one piece of hardware was purchased so with the purchase of a $6.00 mouse I could sell several Thousand $ of MS OEM Software quite legally.
I gave up trying to make any sense of the MS Licensing Policy a long time ago and just do as they insist though to be fair I'm mostly using Volume License product that doesn't require Activation and most times doesn't have WGA installed at the moment.
Also if a computer is stolen and there is a valid Police Report here at least I can install the original software on a replacement computer and any insurance jobs that I undertake always use the original Software even if there is no possibility of using the original COA on the case. Apparently the Insurance Companies will not come at the cost of replacement MS Software and MS accepts this.
Now I've got a headache from putting all that down as MS Licensing is a Nightmare to work through with so many inconsistencies I think that I'll go and have to 44 Gallon drum of Valium IV now to calm me down and I'm going to need years of Therapy just for posting this.
There are 2 things that you never question MS Licensing and Why Windows Works the way that it does as you can have 2 identical Boxes that work completely differently though they are the exact same hardware and software installed if you try to make sense it will drive you crazy!
Col
With OEM MS Software the EULA specifically says For Use With Original Hardware Only so you can draw the line where you think that Original Hardware means that a replacement Software Package is required. Then if you are using the Pro Version it says Licensed for use with 2 CPU's which according to the Legal People that I've spoken to can mean on 1 Dual Processor M'Board or on 2 Single Processor M'Boards it depends on the Law in your area. Either way I'm not interested in testing it either way.
According to MS currently they only apply this in AU to a CPU & M'Board Replacement where there is a significant Performance Increase achieved by replacing the CPU and M'Board. That was directly from the Legal Department at a MS Partners Meeting a few years ago. If you have to replace a CPU/M'Board and there isn't a significant Performance Increase involved or you do an insurance Job and use the lowest speed components currently available you can use the original OEM Software from MS. Upgrades where performance is increased dramatically should require a new set of OEM MS Software according to MS though to be honest they where not bothering with this the last time that I went to one of their Partner Meetings in May. They where also pushing the idea that I could sell OEM product if one piece of hardware was purchased so with the purchase of a $6.00 mouse I could sell several Thousand $ of MS OEM Software quite legally.
I gave up trying to make any sense of the MS Licensing Policy a long time ago and just do as they insist though to be fair I'm mostly using Volume License product that doesn't require Activation and most times doesn't have WGA installed at the moment.
Also if a computer is stolen and there is a valid Police Report here at least I can install the original software on a replacement computer and any insurance jobs that I undertake always use the original Software even if there is no possibility of using the original COA on the case. Apparently the Insurance Companies will not come at the cost of replacement MS Software and MS accepts this.
Now I've got a headache from putting all that down as MS Licensing is a Nightmare to work through with so many inconsistencies I think that I'll go and have to 44 Gallon drum of Valium IV now to calm me down and I'm going to need years of Therapy just for posting this.
There are 2 things that you never question MS Licensing and Why Windows Works the way that it does as you can have 2 identical Boxes that work completely differently though they are the exact same hardware and software installed if you try to make sense it will drive you crazy!
Col
in many states of Australia the consumer laws are such that the EULA can not replace the consumer laws and the laws put limits on what the company's can do and not allow you to do.
Some years ago I checked with the NSW Dept of Fair Trading, they look administer the consumer laws down here, and the legal view, according to them, is that once you buy a legal licence to use the software then you can lawfully use that on ANY computer that you have, however you may only have each licence on only one computer at any one time, except where you have used one copy to do the installs on several machines and you have a legal licence for each machine. In effect an audit will count the number of machines with the licence, check for that number of licences of that software, but usually won't check against the licence numbers on the machines.
Kind of blows away a lot of that EULA crap.
Some years ago I checked with the NSW Dept of Fair Trading, they look administer the consumer laws down here, and the legal view, according to them, is that once you buy a legal licence to use the software then you can lawfully use that on ANY computer that you have, however you may only have each licence on only one computer at any one time, except where you have used one copy to do the installs on several machines and you have a legal licence for each machine. In effect an audit will count the number of machines with the licence, check for that number of licences of that software, but usually won't check against the licence numbers on the machines.
Kind of blows away a lot of that EULA crap.
I use Linux. Well, actually, learning it. Perhaps if we give this system enough support and backing, we can make Microsoft irrelevant. I am sick to death of the whole EULA thing, the registration keys, the draconian policies. In the end, using microsoft is a faustian deal. I lost access to my Windows XP profile and never got it back. Now, I back up off-machine to a non-profile folder on an external drive, then burn to cd.
You have to call into support and get a new installation code - which they will provide you after you explain your situation. This is inconvenient as it adds 20+ minutes to the installation of any program with a similar feature (e.g., MS Office).
I do not think so. What you need to watch is hardware manufactures who sell you a PC that comes with a version of Windows that only works on one PC. You loose the original PC due to theft, fire or whatever and you buy another PC then you have to get another copy of windows. Of cause they do not advertise this feature of their systems as people would be reluctant to pay for such an arrangement.
I was refering to is that the early version of the activation software required you to reactivate if you changed your graphics card or added a second hard drive or made similar important hardware changes. They got so many complaints they issued a patch the reduced the impact of this.
However, WGA is showing itself to be far more intrusive and more of a problem. Before I finally blew away XP and installed SimplyMEPIS linux it got so bad that everytime I got any security updates from MS, for the legal copy XP I had (since resold it), I had to contact MS direct and get a NEW validation code for my system before it worked again.
I eventually found at the problem was that WGA kept seeing my system as a pirate because I had Auto Updates turned off, Remote Access by MS turned off, and did not allow it to contact MS except when I wanted to run the updates software.
In effect by retaining control of my own PC MS saw me as a pirate regardless of having a valide code and software.
However, WGA is showing itself to be far more intrusive and more of a problem. Before I finally blew away XP and installed SimplyMEPIS linux it got so bad that everytime I got any security updates from MS, for the legal copy XP I had (since resold it), I had to contact MS direct and get a NEW validation code for my system before it worked again.
I eventually found at the problem was that WGA kept seeing my system as a pirate because I had Auto Updates turned off, Remote Access by MS turned off, and did not allow it to contact MS except when I wanted to run the updates software.
In effect by retaining control of my own PC MS saw me as a pirate regardless of having a valide code and software.
So..... having auto updates off etc makes you a pirate?
.....yet M$ and every expert tells you to have auto updates on?
Forgive my simple mind, but this makes most M$ customers (including major corporations, who are its bread and butter), pirates.
..... or am I bad at logic?
I visualise an image here of an entity called Microsoft aiming an HUGE gun/missile/whatever at their foot and pulling a trigger.
: edited for typing error
.....yet M$ and every expert tells you to have auto updates on?
Forgive my simple mind, but this makes most M$ customers (including major corporations, who are its bread and butter), pirates.
..... or am I bad at logic?
I visualise an image here of an entity called Microsoft aiming an HUGE gun/missile/whatever at their foot and pulling a trigger.
: edited for typing error
Most people I know dealing with this at the corporate level see it as a major headache. I can't allow WGA and auto updates to be left turned on. My internet access is via a rural dial-up service, commonly connected at 28.8 kbps to 38.2 kbps that disconnects every 6 hours (ISP aspect)- at one point I had 4 XP systems on this and with autoupdates and the bloody thing did almost nothing but talk to MS all day every day. Turn the suckers off and only gove for critical security updates and its liviable. Since I went to SimplyMEPIS its bloody incrediable how good the Internet acces is now, no time wasted sucking MS crap.
I've been reading this portion of the thread and I thought... Hmmm. When I go to the car dealership to get a new car, I don't ask him to transfer the engine into my new car.
Microsoft is basically doing the same thing. They want the OS license to go with the device that it was originally installed on. I presume that you notice that most OEM's are now placing the OS license sticker on the side of the case? Have you also noticed that you can't remove that sticker without tearing it to shreads? And in the end, this makes sense to me. If I buy a computer and use it for 3 years, then I donate that computer to a charitble organization, I don't expect that organization to also have to go out and separately license the system. I would have already purchased a new OS licens with the new PC, why do I need an extra laying around? How many Dells, HPs, Sonys, Toshibas, etc... have you purchased in the last 10 years that didn't include an OS license in the purchase price?
I generally agree that this is unfair for the people who are into system tweaking or have mobo/cpu failures, but who is MS really going after here? MS is going after the large scale software pirates. They are trying to ensure that OEM's don't purchase huge volumes of licenses that "fell off the truck" and have them dumped on the market. I think that MS is basically insuring that OEMs don't try to go to an "alternate source" for the OS.
This isn't about little bobbie messing around in his basement, this is about massive software piracy, mostly in Asia. Last I heard, there were an estimated 10+ million unlicensed Windows systems in China alone. This accounts for billions in lost profits for the legal copyright holder of the software.
Microsoft is basically doing the same thing. They want the OS license to go with the device that it was originally installed on. I presume that you notice that most OEM's are now placing the OS license sticker on the side of the case? Have you also noticed that you can't remove that sticker without tearing it to shreads? And in the end, this makes sense to me. If I buy a computer and use it for 3 years, then I donate that computer to a charitble organization, I don't expect that organization to also have to go out and separately license the system. I would have already purchased a new OS licens with the new PC, why do I need an extra laying around? How many Dells, HPs, Sonys, Toshibas, etc... have you purchased in the last 10 years that didn't include an OS license in the purchase price?
I generally agree that this is unfair for the people who are into system tweaking or have mobo/cpu failures, but who is MS really going after here? MS is going after the large scale software pirates. They are trying to ensure that OEM's don't purchase huge volumes of licenses that "fell off the truck" and have them dumped on the market. I think that MS is basically insuring that OEMs don't try to go to an "alternate source" for the OS.
This isn't about little bobbie messing around in his basement, this is about massive software piracy, mostly in Asia. Last I heard, there were an estimated 10+ million unlicensed Windows systems in China alone. This accounts for billions in lost profits for the legal copyright holder of the software.
and it is NOT required for the car to do its basic turn on. If I want to move that accessory to another car later I should be able to.
But even with your analgy of it being the engine, if I buy a car with a special fine tuned 2.6 litre engine and the body wears out and the only replacement has a 1.8 litre engine, then I should be able to move the engine over if I want to and it is emchanically possible to do so.
There is NO requirement for me, as a home user to stick the Win licence on the PC, I can store it beside it. Even the HP lap top I bought with Win XP pre installed does not have the sticker on it, but on the disk that came with it.
Re the piracy in Asia, MS can't be too worried about it because they aren't doing much to chase the Asian pirates. Also the activation key process was supposed to, and should, deal with that - so why add the WGA crap. All they do is annoy people and cost them more sales when they annoy someone too much.
But even with your analgy of it being the engine, if I buy a car with a special fine tuned 2.6 litre engine and the body wears out and the only replacement has a 1.8 litre engine, then I should be able to move the engine over if I want to and it is emchanically possible to do so.
There is NO requirement for me, as a home user to stick the Win licence on the PC, I can store it beside it. Even the HP lap top I bought with Win XP pre installed does not have the sticker on it, but on the disk that came with it.
Re the piracy in Asia, MS can't be too worried about it because they aren't doing much to chase the Asian pirates. Also the activation key process was supposed to, and should, deal with that - so why add the WGA crap. All they do is annoy people and cost them more sales when they annoy someone too much.
That is not a good comparison. If I buy a car it has an engine but if I want to change the engine or add a new carburator I can still use the car without approval and if I want to put that engine in another car I can still use it without paying for it again. Yet that engine is not in both cars at the same time.
I bought the liscense to use their product it should not matter what computer I have it on just that I have it on one.
I bought the liscense to use their product it should not matter what computer I have it on just that I have it on one.
You go and buy a new car and something breaks in it while it is UG you do not expect to have to pay for a new car when yours is mealy repaired for free do you?
Recently I had a 6 month old build have a M'Board failure while the M'Board was replaced UG with the same model why should I have to provide all new OEM MS Software which costs a lot more than the M'Board originally cost? If you look at the price of building a computer you'll find most of it is in MS Licensing Fees for a bottom of the range computer. Even a Mid Sized computer will come close to 50% of the cost as MS OEM License Fees. For example the above mentioned computer was a Insurance Job so I was only required to replace the destroyed Hardware which was the tower and the parts came to $780.00 AU but if I was to supply new MS OEM Software with just Office and XP Pro installed you can add another $700.00 AU for 2 CD's and a bit of cardboard.
Then there is the fact that MS chases up resellers who trade in used computers and on sell them. If they have a MS COA on the side that doesn't matter they have to provide Install Media with the Second Hand Computer or MS will take them to Court for selling Pirate Software even though in just about every case every Home User loses their install Media almost straight away and it's never seen again. But if you are selling a secondhand computer with Windows 98SE and Office 97 on it you have to have the Install Media of you can be facing a massive fine which is settled out of court and then MS sends an Enforcement Alert to all it's partners naming the company involved and it's principals for breaching MS EULA.
To me this is MS wanting it's Cake and Eating it as well. These computers have a Genuine License attached to them but because the owner has lost the install media it's impossible to on sell these units. As a OEM System Builder here I have to supply Install Media with every computer that I sell which I don't have a problem with but then I go out to a business and pull a new IBM/Toshiba/whatever NB out of a Box and proceed to set it up on the existing Network and I don't see any Install Media not even a Hidden Partition to reinstall from but as an Optional Extra the customer can buy the install media from the supplier and at the end of the Tax Cycle of that machine it can't be on sold because it has no Install Media which was never supplied. Now how can that in any way be considered as fair?
Or even better any company with a Volume License doesn't get COA's to stick on the case they get 1 CD to install from and then mostly Clone the HDD to all the computers on that network when it's originally installed so when those Computers reach the end of the Tax Cycle they are Auctioned off but the buyer can not use the installed OS or on sell the computers as they stand because there is no Install Media supplied with each computer. Remember that in a case like this they all have the same Product Key and MS only ever supplies 1 Install set of Media so if the License is tied to that Hardware for Life how can you be charged for selling Pirate Software on Licensed Products?
Then there is the case recently where a company was importing Genuine copies of MS product from Singapore and selling them in AU they to got hit for Privacy even though there was no evidence given that this was not Genuine MS Product which it was but because it wasn't purchased from a company in AU it was considered as Pirate.
Now for the funny bit when I buy a Volume License here I get the Install Media supplied from one of the 2 companies who sell it and the product Key is supplied from MS Singapore. Try to make sense of that as I can't!
Col
Recently I had a 6 month old build have a M'Board failure while the M'Board was replaced UG with the same model why should I have to provide all new OEM MS Software which costs a lot more than the M'Board originally cost? If you look at the price of building a computer you'll find most of it is in MS Licensing Fees for a bottom of the range computer. Even a Mid Sized computer will come close to 50% of the cost as MS OEM License Fees. For example the above mentioned computer was a Insurance Job so I was only required to replace the destroyed Hardware which was the tower and the parts came to $780.00 AU but if I was to supply new MS OEM Software with just Office and XP Pro installed you can add another $700.00 AU for 2 CD's and a bit of cardboard.
Then there is the fact that MS chases up resellers who trade in used computers and on sell them. If they have a MS COA on the side that doesn't matter they have to provide Install Media with the Second Hand Computer or MS will take them to Court for selling Pirate Software even though in just about every case every Home User loses their install Media almost straight away and it's never seen again. But if you are selling a secondhand computer with Windows 98SE and Office 97 on it you have to have the Install Media of you can be facing a massive fine which is settled out of court and then MS sends an Enforcement Alert to all it's partners naming the company involved and it's principals for breaching MS EULA.
To me this is MS wanting it's Cake and Eating it as well. These computers have a Genuine License attached to them but because the owner has lost the install media it's impossible to on sell these units. As a OEM System Builder here I have to supply Install Media with every computer that I sell which I don't have a problem with but then I go out to a business and pull a new IBM/Toshiba/whatever NB out of a Box and proceed to set it up on the existing Network and I don't see any Install Media not even a Hidden Partition to reinstall from but as an Optional Extra the customer can buy the install media from the supplier and at the end of the Tax Cycle of that machine it can't be on sold because it has no Install Media which was never supplied. Now how can that in any way be considered as fair?
Or even better any company with a Volume License doesn't get COA's to stick on the case they get 1 CD to install from and then mostly Clone the HDD to all the computers on that network when it's originally installed so when those Computers reach the end of the Tax Cycle they are Auctioned off but the buyer can not use the installed OS or on sell the computers as they stand because there is no Install Media supplied with each computer. Remember that in a case like this they all have the same Product Key and MS only ever supplies 1 Install set of Media so if the License is tied to that Hardware for Life how can you be charged for selling Pirate Software on Licensed Products?
Then there is the case recently where a company was importing Genuine copies of MS product from Singapore and selling them in AU they to got hit for Privacy even though there was no evidence given that this was not Genuine MS Product which it was but because it wasn't purchased from a company in AU it was considered as Pirate.
Now for the funny bit when I buy a Volume License here I get the Install Media supplied from one of the 2 companies who sell it and the product Key is supplied from MS Singapore. Try to make sense of that as I can't!
Col
With Volume Licenses it required changing the Product Keys Again downloads & installs the same item every month when it comes time for the MS Update Week of Hell!
For home users it allows them access to something that most would never want so they install it because they think that they are getting something for free which of course they are not but most Home Owners like the idea.
Most IT Professionals see it as a nuisance and just another Hoop that we are forced to jump through to keep MS happy.
Life wasn't meant to be easy but to make things really hard you need MS to screw things up totally.
Col
For home users it allows them access to something that most would never want so they install it because they think that they are getting something for free which of course they are not but most Home Owners like the idea.
Most IT Professionals see it as a nuisance and just another Hoop that we are forced to jump through to keep MS happy.
Life wasn't meant to be easy but to make things really hard you need MS to screw things up totally.
Col
I just got to thinking about it. around 80%-90% You just got me thinking about it, and of the support calls I have made in the past year, around 80 to 90 percent have been related to license protection systems (ie the anti-piracy mechanisms were preventing us from using legally purchased software). In one case we suffered an 8 hour outage on a particular system, that we had to rebuild from scratch when the license service took a nosedive. THe applications themselve run fine, perform flawlesly, and need no attention, save for the cop0y protection systems. That just doesn't seem right...
As I said just another Hoop to jump through before you can do your actual work. 
Col
Col
I see WGA as a great attack vector. Wait until the warning start coming out about the flaws in WGA and the issues associated with it being installed on the client...
The remote plug and play fiasco will look like childs play.
WGA is spyware and will push corporations away from MS products very quickly...
The remote plug and play fiasco will look like childs play.
WGA is spyware and will push corporations away from MS products very quickly...
I have read your posts before. You are just an anti-Microsoft cry baby who has something negitive to say about Microsoft every day.
If you don't like Microsoft...good stay the hell away from it. But your opinions are ALL one sided, so therefore are not worth anything...
If you don't like Microsoft...good stay the hell away from it. But your opinions are ALL one sided, so therefore are not worth anything...
perhaps that might be a clue that that particular thing isn't very good?
As far as one-sided posts go, if I ever need an example of one in the future, I'll refer them to your post.
Stay the hell away from Microsoft? No problem. That's why this post comes to you from an OpenSuSE 10.1 box. Try it--you might like it. Or is that what you're afraid of?
As far as one-sided posts go, if I ever need an example of one in the future, I'll refer them to your post.
Stay the hell away from Microsoft? No problem. That's why this post comes to you from an OpenSuSE 10.1 box. Try it--you might like it. Or is that what you're afraid of?
I agree with on your topic that why I started the original thread and was wondering where I can get open suse 10.1 at. I know novell got a suse 9.0 maybe newer version out since I last check but if you know of a sight where I can get it would greatly apreaciated since I can't find it in my neck of the woods. Thanks
These
http://en.opensuse.org/Welcome_to_openSUSE.org
http://www.novell.com/linux/
http://www.linuxiso.org/
for starters. Also a Google plus your location should find a local supplier who can sell it to you as a retail package if you want the extras.
http://en.opensuse.org/Welcome_to_openSUSE.org
http://www.novell.com/linux/
http://www.linuxiso.org/
for starters. Also a Google plus your location should find a local supplier who can sell it to you as a retail package if you want the extras.
Yes, the Novell site has it available for download, the full Open Suse 10.1 distro, 5 CDs + 1 "addons" CD. I also believe you can download them as DVDs as well for those out there with the space, time, and bandwidth.
I really like using it, though I just started, but a serious alternative to MS may be needed. I understand Ubuntu is very good as well. I currently have Suse 10 booting with Xp and Vista on my laptop, so eventually I may be able to help out the less fortunate or a company with whatever they have running. Who knows, maybe I'll manage to install OS X on here sometime, lol. Being in IT means being ready for almost anything.
I really like using it, though I just started, but a serious alternative to MS may be needed. I understand Ubuntu is very good as well. I currently have Suse 10 booting with Xp and Vista on my laptop, so eventually I may be able to help out the less fortunate or a company with whatever they have running. Who knows, maybe I'll manage to install OS X on here sometime, lol. Being in IT means being ready for almost anything.
it is Debian based as well and uses the Ubuntu repository, so it has a bit more than Ubuntu.
If you've got a decent Internet connection, save yourself the trouble of downloading all the ISO's and use the net install option. That way you only download what you're going to use, and if you want to install things in the future, you won't have to hunt down your media.
SuSE, like most Linux distributions, cannot play MP3's, DVD's, or most other media that uses proprietary codecs. This is not Linux's fault, it is the reality of living in a world of patents and copyrights gone mad. There are plenty of sites that will tell you how to rectify this (in fact, there's even a step-by-step guide on openSuSE's website), but doing this falls into a new category of acts: ethical but illegal. It's not a very hard process.
If this is a showstopper for you, Linspire and XandrOS sell Linux distributions that include everything necessary out-of-the-box. They're not free, but they're not very expensive compared to Windows. The reason they're not free is because licensing the necessary components costs money. I haven't used Linspire, but XandrOS has a very Windows XP-like look and feel, and it's Debian-based, so you can let apt-get spoil you with thousands and thousands of apps.
Mandriva does, too, but I don't trust any company that fires their own founder.
SuSE, like most Linux distributions, cannot play MP3's, DVD's, or most other media that uses proprietary codecs. This is not Linux's fault, it is the reality of living in a world of patents and copyrights gone mad. There are plenty of sites that will tell you how to rectify this (in fact, there's even a step-by-step guide on openSuSE's website), but doing this falls into a new category of acts: ethical but illegal. It's not a very hard process.
If this is a showstopper for you, Linspire and XandrOS sell Linux distributions that include everything necessary out-of-the-box. They're not free, but they're not very expensive compared to Windows. The reason they're not free is because licensing the necessary components costs money. I haven't used Linspire, but XandrOS has a very Windows XP-like look and feel, and it's Debian-based, so you can let apt-get spoil you with thousands and thousands of apps.
Mandriva does, too, but I don't trust any company that fires their own founder.
Show me one good thing about a spyware and people will stop talking negatively about Microsoft. Any program that is put onto your computer and takes information off to be retured back to the creator is a spyware. thats illegal in America.
Although it is another hassle, it is not a good enough reason for a corp to change out every OS, especially large companies. Not to mention the costs in training involved. No, it is doubtful for everyone to move from MS because of this.
However, I do expect that more people will be looking at alternative OS's over the next few years. This may or may not play a role in it, but there is a widening trend for people moving away from MS (at least people I talk to).
However, I do expect that more people will be looking at alternative OS's over the next few years. This may or may not play a role in it, but there is a widening trend for people moving away from MS (at least people I talk to).
I think this is the straw that broke the camel's back.
The training costs with Vista (esp with UAC and the various GUI wonkiness) will be about the same as moving to another OS or thin clients.
I think we'll see a corporate push towards thin clients. While, until recently, I was very anti-thin client, I think the new thin clients are far more efficient and networks are more able to handle the load.
I also think that most corporations and small businesses, once they find out what WGA really is, will be very upset...and rightly so.
I also agree with the trend to move away from MS. While 10 years ago you'd hear, "you'll never get fired for buying Microsoft," now you hear, "What are the alternatives."
Like I've said before, MS is acting EXACTLY how IBM acted in the mid to late 80's.
The training costs with Vista (esp with UAC and the various GUI wonkiness) will be about the same as moving to another OS or thin clients.
I think we'll see a corporate push towards thin clients. While, until recently, I was very anti-thin client, I think the new thin clients are far more efficient and networks are more able to handle the load.
I also think that most corporations and small businesses, once they find out what WGA really is, will be very upset...and rightly so.
I also agree with the trend to move away from MS. While 10 years ago you'd hear, "you'll never get fired for buying Microsoft," now you hear, "What are the alternatives."
Like I've said before, MS is acting EXACTLY how IBM acted in the mid to late 80's.
The differences between Win 98 and Win 2K are so minor that there was no real need to get extra training, but from them to Win XP the gap is alrge, from Win XP to Vista it is going to be as big as the gap to Linux or Unix. However, the training cost that frightens most corporate executives is for the general staff member having to change their applications like Word, Excel etc.
This need not be a problem. All they need do is load Linux install WINE or Crossover, then instal their existing MS Office appplications. No training costs as the majority of staff are still using the same apps as they see every day. But you also get a security improvement at the same time.
Running MS Office on Linux is more secure than running it on Windows because the majority of security holes are effective due to the fact they have hooks into the kernel that bypass basic security measures in Windows, in Linux they have no hooks into the kernel and that can't bypass the security.
This need not be a problem. All they need do is load Linux install WINE or Crossover, then instal their existing MS Office appplications. No training costs as the majority of staff are still using the same apps as they see every day. But you also get a security improvement at the same time.
Running MS Office on Linux is more secure than running it on Windows because the majority of security holes are effective due to the fact they have hooks into the kernel that bypass basic security measures in Windows, in Linux they have no hooks into the kernel and that can't bypass the security.
its not just Office that people use. And although there are alternatives to most applications for Linux, many would be reluctant to move from MS products, especially with the multitudes of programs that the company uses being windows based.
I do think that MS will lose marketshare over the next few years, and that many people will switch from MS products, but it is unrealistic to believe that everyone will just because of 1 problem. I mean, did Sony lose much around christmas after the rootkit was found? No, their sales were still good, even for DVD's/CD's.
Most people have a wall, and will stick with MS, same with companies. But, I do see more and more jobs requiring Linux exp. recently, so I do believe that many are moving. It will take some time, and people have to get used to the idea to move to a new style OS that is not the same as Windows. Also, more techs need to lead the way for it to happen.
For most of what you say, I would support you, but I dont think that 1 or 2 things will cause most companies to move.
And with the familiar interface for Windows, even with all of the changes, many will be quicker to adopt and learn those changes, than learn a different style OS altogether. In fact, I knew a large company that was still using Win 95 in 02 because all of their apps were tuned to 95 (custom tweaked).
I do think that MS will lose marketshare over the next few years, and that many people will switch from MS products, but it is unrealistic to believe that everyone will just because of 1 problem. I mean, did Sony lose much around christmas after the rootkit was found? No, their sales were still good, even for DVD's/CD's.
Most people have a wall, and will stick with MS, same with companies. But, I do see more and more jobs requiring Linux exp. recently, so I do believe that many are moving. It will take some time, and people have to get used to the idea to move to a new style OS that is not the same as Windows. Also, more techs need to lead the way for it to happen.
For most of what you say, I would support you, but I dont think that 1 or 2 things will cause most companies to move.
And with the familiar interface for Windows, even with all of the changes, many will be quicker to adopt and learn those changes, than learn a different style OS altogether. In fact, I knew a large company that was still using Win 95 in 02 because all of their apps were tuned to 95 (custom tweaked).
Crossover and running their applications on that, get the better use out of modern hardware and still use their Windows based applications.
I admit, I am lazy. that is probably the main reason I still use windows primarily. I can pretty much do anything I want witht he windows file system, and this have complete confidence that I can recover from just about any oops (ironically Knoppix is one of the tools I use for that). I like that I can just run setup, answer a few questions, and (most of the time) the software Installs where I want it to, with the data where I choose it to be, without resorting to reading manuals, editing textfiles, etc...
But for the past several days I have been looking in the corner at an alert from MS about this really important WGA update I really need to install... This just might be the time I switch...
But for the past several days I have been looking in the corner at an alert from MS about this really important WGA update I really need to install... This just might be the time I switch...
I guess the authorities/ personnel responsible for IT management still needs someone to point a finger to..
If you have decided to install Linux and it goes wrong - you would get fired. The organization keeps credit it this goes well.
On the other hand you decide to keep MS and still pay and blame it for bloating, at least the job is safe.. this is mediocre thinking but I have seen this in Action.
If you have decided to install Linux and it goes wrong - you would get fired. The organization keeps credit it this goes well.
On the other hand you decide to keep MS and still pay and blame it for bloating, at least the job is safe.. this is mediocre thinking but I have seen this in Action.
Spyware or not this is an attempt from Microsoft to get info about there users and not about piracy. Whether it?s WGA or some other code Microsoft has been planting it for years inside the windows OS. I have to say that putting this software in Windows to stop piracy is a futile effort. They know just like everyone else that all it?s going to stop is the mom and pop?s from putting it on each others PC. Any experienced PC person will eventually find a crack or a software patch to bypass the software. I?ve seen them posted out there each time MS has changed WGA. From my prospective the only way to stop piracy is to lower the cost and make the software worth the money being spent. Personally for myself I will never buy another MS product unless it comes with a new PC. The upgrade cost of the software is not worth the product but that a whole other issue. I really think MS should just pull WGA and be done with it.
Yeah, real convincing logic there. Your voting record likely leans to the left as well. How you manage to compare Sony's completely under the radar Rootkit to Microsoft WGA that was announced quite a while before it became mandatory, is moronic, and childish at best. Come up with a real discussion point. You are one of those types that uses a hit on MS to start a conversation. What a joke.
Across the board, it certainly seems that more times than not, the people complaining about WGA are those that have illegal copies running. What the heck is the problem with MS enforcing licensing? They are certainly entitled to it. You can make all the arguments you like about how they don't need the money and they're just picking on the poor, or whatever other fallacious complaint dimwits like you come up with.
The fact is its malcontents that hate MS (more specifically Bill G.) and are just coming up with another soap box issue to raise a stink about. This post is no better than that other rediculous "Vaporware" post Mr. Retardo made. Again, get a life and a real topic of conversation, cause posts like this only bring out the MS haters, or the haters of MS haters (like me). And never promote any real conversation. Save the inflamatory post for a reply to a topic.
What a joke of a post...
Across the board, it certainly seems that more times than not, the people complaining about WGA are those that have illegal copies running. What the heck is the problem with MS enforcing licensing? They are certainly entitled to it. You can make all the arguments you like about how they don't need the money and they're just picking on the poor, or whatever other fallacious complaint dimwits like you come up with.
The fact is its malcontents that hate MS (more specifically Bill G.) and are just coming up with another soap box issue to raise a stink about. This post is no better than that other rediculous "Vaporware" post Mr. Retardo made. Again, get a life and a real topic of conversation, cause posts like this only bring out the MS haters, or the haters of MS haters (like me). And never promote any real conversation. Save the inflamatory post for a reply to a topic.
What a joke of a post...
Does kicking and screaming make you feel like less of a 3 year old? Are you the authority figure of ALL of the post here? Your are nothing more than one of those idiots who says something either stupid or childish in a post to attract attention. As for WGA, it is wrong for MS to put code on your pc for purposes other than anti piracy. Would you want cell phone telling others what you said during a conversation with your boyfriend... It is the same thing. Moron...
a scratch rashbaby.
Some of you folks use the logic of illegal mexicans===NONE.
Some of you folks use the logic of illegal mexicans===NONE.
- Keyboard Shortcuts:
- Prev
- Next
- Toggle
