Odd situation here. Our offices sit in two different buildings, about 25 feet from each other (if that). Our Internet and telephone connection are via Charter. A wireless router sits in one building, and the phones and Internet connection are used in the other building.
Every afternoon, and I do mean every afternoon, the phones and computers furthest from the building in which the router sits lose connection.
I'm thinking add a booster in our building. Am I thinking correctly?
We don't own either building and so are very limited as to what we can do with things. We haven't the funds to hardwire.
The router in place is:
Linksys WRT 300N Wireless-N Broadband Router
Handy dandy tips, hints, suggestions will be entertained and rewarded. Thanks folks!
etu
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Question
0
Votes
Boost wireless signal from one building to another.
Moderator
Updated - 6th May 2009
Answers (13)
0
Votes
a wireless bridge/AP should work
some Wireless access points can also act as a bridge.
oops -- just get a repeater
oops -- just get a repeater
Updated - 6th May 2009
0
Votes
of course, you can also try
boosting the power on the router that you have. Go into the settings and see what power rating it is set at, and crank it up a few notches. On the ones that I have seen, it is usually set to 4 or 5 of 10 by default
6th May 2009
0
Votes
afternoon delight
Anything going on in either location at the same time as said outages?
How old of equipment are we talking about.Things do wear out
Any relation to daytime temperatures getting to the equipment at this time of day?
How old of equipment are we talking about.Things do wear out
Any relation to daytime temperatures getting to the equipment at this time of day?
6th May 2009
Replies
urban industrial/residential zone. Have no clue what goes on anywhere but here. Equipment new-ish. A year or so old. Temperature seems to have nothing to do with. Full range of temps winter through summer here. Everyday, in the afternoon, no matter temp, rain, snow...
Everything internal to one building except whatever Charter's external box contains.
Everything internal to one building except whatever Charter's external box contains.
boxfiddler
6th May 2009
That is the way to go, and linksys has a low cost solution that I used for years at my last job.
http://reviews.cnet.com/wireless-access-points/wet54g-wireless-g-ethernet/4505-3265_7-30460920.html
I then got a cable and external antenna (from Dlink) to get the antenna outside of the building so the walls would not interfere with the signal. (was a metal building I was sending to). This bridge then plugs into your switch, and the users don't know the difference.
http://reviews.cnet.com/wireless-access-points/wet54g-wireless-g-ethernet/4505-3265_7-30460920.html
I then got a cable and external antenna (from Dlink) to get the antenna outside of the building so the walls would not interfere with the signal. (was a metal building I was sending to). This bridge then plugs into your switch, and the users don't know the difference.
jdclyde
6th May 2009
We got no steeenkeen switches. Hell, at the moment we're not even p2p networked. Makes backup a pima.
boxfiddler
6th May 2009
0
Votes
how-to
Here is a Cisco/Linksys troubleshooting guide for lost connections.
http://linksys.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/linksys.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=3759
http://linksys.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/linksys.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=3759
6th May 2009
0
Votes
Heat issue? Old reciever?
I don't see anything about time of day that COULD effect your signal strength.
If the transmitter or the receiver are getting worn, they can overheat and drop connection. Of course you have a spare one on hand for WHEN one goes down, right? Put that in place at one end, and let it go a few days. If it doesn't change, put the other one back and change the other end.
The only other thing I would look at is where are the wireless compared to lunch rooms? Would microwaves cooking lunch cause interference?
If the transmitter or the receiver are getting worn, they can overheat and drop connection. Of course you have a spare one on hand for WHEN one goes down, right? Put that in place at one end, and let it go a few days. If it doesn't change, put the other one back and change the other end.
The only other thing I would look at is where are the wireless compared to lunch rooms? Would microwaves cooking lunch cause interference?
Updated - 6th May 2009
Replies
could be from a neighboring building. If it happens about the same time everyday, it may be a daily event causing disruptions (in the building or a neighboring one).
it may be overcome by a stronger signal (no HW purchase) or by a bridge/Ap installation.
Aside from that, the source of the interference would need to be found.
it may be overcome by a stronger signal (no HW purchase) or by a bridge/Ap installation.
Aside from that, the source of the interference would need to be found.
The Scummy One
6th May 2009
would do wonders for screwing everyone up.
jdclyde
7th May 2009
likely not just at late portios of the day
The Scummy One
7th May 2009
There's got to some industrial or commercial something going on somewhere that's part of the problem.
boxfiddler
7th May 2009
Get the app and run it in the morning when things are good to get a baseline. Then run it again when things start going south. You will either find another network on the same channel or eliminate rogue networks as a possible cause.
Michael Kassner
7th May 2009
Now this depends on the other business and the amount of clients that are connecting to another network. The simple broadcast isn't going to be the issue, but the amount of traffic that is jumping across wirelessly. If there is a business nearby that has heavy traffic in the afternoon then this would definatly explain their timming issue.
ericswain@...
7th May 2009
0
Votes
These bridges you guys are talking about.
Wireless in wireless out?
I hate networking...
I hate networking...
6th May 2009
Replies
why I need a device with an ethernet port?
boxfiddler
6th May 2009
I started browsing it and noticed that the Linksys bridge for G networks will do wireless bridging. Looking at D-Link and Linksys, I am not finding that ability for Wireless N
I'll look around a bit more.
I'll look around a bit more.
The Scummy One
6th May 2009
they only offer range expanders for 802.11 G
N is backward compatible, so you may need to go with a G extender, but the drawback is, everything will slow down.
It may be better to move the AP, or find out what is causing the disruptions. Heck, could it be when lots of people are leaving for the day and blocking a good portion of the signal?
Also, have you looked at the router to pump up the power for extended range?
They probably havent made them because of low projections for sales. These units are targeting homes, and 802.11N gets great coverage for most homes. It looks like commercial products may be needed
N is backward compatible, so you may need to go with a G extender, but the drawback is, everything will slow down.
It may be better to move the AP, or find out what is causing the disruptions. Heck, could it be when lots of people are leaving for the day and blocking a good portion of the signal?
Also, have you looked at the router to pump up the power for extended range?
They probably havent made them because of low projections for sales. These units are targeting homes, and 802.11N gets great coverage for most homes. It looks like commercial products may be needed
The Scummy One
6th May 2009
Whoever set it up put a password on it. I think I know who and have emailed him.
Geeminy.
Have I said that I hate networking?
Geeminy.
Have I said that I hate networking?
boxfiddler
6th May 2009
DLink has a RangeBooster Wireless N device -- it is just a router -- lol
Dont see anything there either -- I am doubting anything less than commercial products at this point.
Dont see anything there either -- I am doubting anything less than commercial products at this point.
The Scummy One
6th May 2009
0
Votes
A couple of ideas here
6th May 2009
0
Votes
Tips
1. Find a nice location wherein your Wireless Router should be in place with no humidity disruption and sometimes it should not be touched by anyone. hehe 
2. Sometimes move the antenna of your Wireless Router and direct it to a nice direction. It happened ones when someone bring his own laptop in the office and he notice that he can't connect to the internet using wireless connection. What I did was, I just moved the antenna on right position. And so it was, he already got his connection.
3. Lengthen the signal of your Wireless Router.
I hope some of my tips would help.
Thanks.
-Arjay
2. Sometimes move the antenna of your Wireless Router and direct it to a nice direction. It happened ones when someone bring his own laptop in the office and he notice that he can't connect to the internet using wireless connection. What I did was, I just moved the antenna on right position. And so it was, he already got his connection.
3. Lengthen the signal of your Wireless Router.
I hope some of my tips would help.
Thanks.
-Arjay
6th May 2009
0
Votes
Some more questions
I'd appreciate more details before suggesting anything.
1. I'm not clear how your network is setup. If there are no connections between buildings how is the wireless router connected to the Internet?
2. How many users are you talking about?
3. What are the buildings made of and is there anything in between the two buildings (trees, powerlines etc.)?
4. What kind of traffic would be sent across the wireless connection (any streaming media)?
5. Are there any windows facing each other where you could have directional antennas pointed at each other?
6. Are there any other wireless networks in the immediate vicinity?
7. More detail, please?
"Every afternoon, and I do mean every afternoon, the phones and computers furthest from the building in which the router sits lose connection."
What I don't understand is the phones and computers furthest from the router are in the building with the Internet connection according to your first statement. So why are they connecting to the wireless router if it's in the other building?
Also the fact that it's a repetitive problem and if the devices that are dropping are indeed connected to the wireless router, it (as The Scummy One mentioned) suggests that some sort of RF interference is being activated at that time and causing the problem.
1. I'm not clear how your network is setup. If there are no connections between buildings how is the wireless router connected to the Internet?
2. How many users are you talking about?
3. What are the buildings made of and is there anything in between the two buildings (trees, powerlines etc.)?
4. What kind of traffic would be sent across the wireless connection (any streaming media)?
5. Are there any windows facing each other where you could have directional antennas pointed at each other?
6. Are there any other wireless networks in the immediate vicinity?
7. More detail, please?
"Every afternoon, and I do mean every afternoon, the phones and computers furthest from the building in which the router sits lose connection."
What I don't understand is the phones and computers furthest from the router are in the building with the Internet connection according to your first statement. So why are they connecting to the wireless router if it's in the other building?
Also the fact that it's a repetitive problem and if the devices that are dropping are indeed connected to the wireless router, it (as The Scummy One mentioned) suggests that some sort of RF interference is being activated at that time and causing the problem.
Updated - 7th May 2009
Replies
Building A is where their internal equipment is located, also. Two boxes, one of which is a modem. Router is in Building A, also. Picks up signal from modem, somehow. I can't get to the modem to check it out. (This is on my list of things to change, btw.) All equipment is located quite close to the floor.
Computer usage is in Building B, 2nd floor (no doubt at least part of the problem is in 1st floor level Bldg. A to 2nd floor Bldg. B). 4 laptops, 2 desktops, in 3 different rooms. Each room increasingly distant from Building A. I wouldn't think any room is more than 100 feet from router. Even my desktop suffers from a loss of signal strength in the afternoon and it is near a window closest to Building B.
The distance between Building A and Building B is at the most 25'. Likely less. No trees, or anything else for that matter, between buildings. Both buildings are brick, quite old, with plaster walls. I'm not going to be able to hard wire the office building, though that is what I'd prefer.
There are windows facing each other. My first step on Friday is to move the router to a window in Building A. And try to get into it to see what it's settings are.
I have no idea what other wireless networks may exist in the vicinity. Streaming media is not quite irrelevant. Sometimes, seminars are attended via the web. Not often, but seminar speakers do occasionally need to stream through the connection.
Computers are not, as yet, networked. They will be, once I get this problem ironed out.
etu
Computer usage is in Building B, 2nd floor (no doubt at least part of the problem is in 1st floor level Bldg. A to 2nd floor Bldg. B). 4 laptops, 2 desktops, in 3 different rooms. Each room increasingly distant from Building A. I wouldn't think any room is more than 100 feet from router. Even my desktop suffers from a loss of signal strength in the afternoon and it is near a window closest to Building B.
The distance between Building A and Building B is at the most 25'. Likely less. No trees, or anything else for that matter, between buildings. Both buildings are brick, quite old, with plaster walls. I'm not going to be able to hard wire the office building, though that is what I'd prefer.
There are windows facing each other. My first step on Friday is to move the router to a window in Building A. And try to get into it to see what it's settings are.
I have no idea what other wireless networks may exist in the vicinity. Streaming media is not quite irrelevant. Sometimes, seminars are attended via the web. Not often, but seminar speakers do occasionally need to stream through the connection.
Computers are not, as yet, networked. They will be, once I get this problem ironed out.
etu
boxfiddler
7th May 2009
Great information.
Now I get the picture. Actually all the users are networked via the wireless router. They may not be talking to each other, but they are on the same subnet and so on.
You can check for other Wi-Fi networks in the area, by looking at your Wi-Fi client application and seeing if any other networks show up. There is a freeware progam called NetStumbler that will do the same thing. It's actually a great way to determine signal strength as well:
http://www.netstumbler.com/downloads/
That's the first step. Next it's going to be important to get into the router and as you mentioned determine how the router is attached to Charter's gateway modem.
If you can't get the password, it will be a matter of resetting the router to default condition. The reason for this is if there is indeed interference, you may have to change the broadcast channel to avoid the interference.
You are most likely correct about the height difference having an affect. Besides going through brick, I'd bet that there is a lot of steel that is blocking the signal as well.
For your Friday test, you may want to make a simple parabolic antenna for the existing router. It will really help focus the RF towards your building. Check out the link, these antennas do help a great deal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0uYtm-b3O4
You have lots of options to make this work better. How much money is available? Since you are concerned about Web casts, that would in my opinion rule out a repeater. As using a repeater cuts your available throughput bandwidth in half and that would be divided amongst all of the active users.
The final setup depends on knowing more about what you have right now. Sorry for asking so many questions.
Now I get the picture. Actually all the users are networked via the wireless router. They may not be talking to each other, but they are on the same subnet and so on.
You can check for other Wi-Fi networks in the area, by looking at your Wi-Fi client application and seeing if any other networks show up. There is a freeware progam called NetStumbler that will do the same thing. It's actually a great way to determine signal strength as well:
http://www.netstumbler.com/downloads/
That's the first step. Next it's going to be important to get into the router and as you mentioned determine how the router is attached to Charter's gateway modem.
If you can't get the password, it will be a matter of resetting the router to default condition. The reason for this is if there is indeed interference, you may have to change the broadcast channel to avoid the interference.
You are most likely correct about the height difference having an affect. Besides going through brick, I'd bet that there is a lot of steel that is blocking the signal as well.
For your Friday test, you may want to make a simple parabolic antenna for the existing router. It will really help focus the RF towards your building. Check out the link, these antennas do help a great deal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0uYtm-b3O4
You have lots of options to make this work better. How much money is available? Since you are concerned about Web casts, that would in my opinion rule out a repeater. As using a repeater cuts your available throughput bandwidth in half and that would be divided amongst all of the active users.
The final setup depends on knowing more about what you have right now. Sorry for asking so many questions.
Michael Kassner
7th May 2009
But I'll revisit this Friday after I've run through the variety of suggestions offered here.
Little to no money available. Didn't know that about a repeater, thanks.
Little to no money available. Didn't know that about a repeater, thanks.
boxfiddler
7th May 2009
Or place anything metal behind the router so it bounces the signal towards the other building.
Michael Kassner
7th May 2009
Nice mike. In that way, the signal might take effect bouncing the signal towards building 2. Also please increase or lengthen the speed of his connection so that it can reach on the other building.
arjaym
7th May 2009
0
Votes
one more piece of advice
I know you have gotten 6 trillion pieces of advice but I will just throw one more piece out there. First thinks first I am sure you have tried all the easy stuff first (moving the router place to place making sure there are no microwaves or cell phones interrupting the signal etc.) I am sure you are aware that you can actually change the antennas on your router. Do some research on your router and see if you can switch out to a stronger signaled atenna. you have a wireless N which I think opperates at about 1500 ft (at least the Blekins do or claim they do) see if you can't get a stronger atenna. OR go to cisco.com and get one of these bad boys... http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps6216/index.html
7th May 2009
0
Votes
Limited Solutions but they do exist
I would have to say that most of what I would say here has been brought up by others but when you look at what you are trying to accomplish you have to stop and plan your best avenue for execution. Setting up a wireless network isn't in its self difficult as long as you have to proper tools to do your job. If you don't then creativity defiantly has to take a part in what you are trying to accomplish.
1. Do a complete walk around the facilities with either a wi/fi finder such as this one from I/O Gear for $12.95 http://www.iogear.com/product/GWF001/
or with your laptop if available and search for any other wireless networks in the area.
2. If no other networks are found this doesn't exactly rule out your interference problem as this may simply mean that the SSID is not being broadcast so you may want to start by resetting your router, this can be done with a simple paperclip in the reset button on the back for about 20 seconds then pull the power cable out while the button is still pushed in then place the cable back in.
3. plug a laptop into the back of the routers switch then open up a web browser and log into the router by typing in the following into the router http://192.168.1.1
Then log in using:
User: (leave blank)
Pass: admin1234
4. Go to the Wireless section in the configuration and choose a different broadcast ID, standard should be set to 11 change this to 6, hit save and close. Now check to see if the clients pick up the SSID and are able to log-in.
5. If an issue still exists then check the placement of the antennas, try to place them close to a window that has line of site to your other building. Remember that these antennas are not directional so you don't have to be exact.
6. If the placement doesn't help, turn one of your antennas into a parabolic antenna by using cardboard and tin foil. Create an arch that sits behind one of the antennas that has line of site and position it as best you can to the other building.
7. Now here comes the part that incurs a fee. Purchase a High Gain Antenna price ranges from $19.99 - $59.99, what?s the difference? Well the amount of decibel output is what, something with a 7db gain should allow you to have a stronger signal over the length you are wanting to cover.
8. If you are still having issues after this fact you might want to look at maybe replacing the router all together as there may be something wrong with the equipment, I mean it may not be that cut and dry but then again it very well may be.
Conclusion, although there is a science to building a wireless network, it can at times take some creative thinking to make things work the way you want them to. Your best bet is to take it all in one thing at a time, write down what changes you did so you know what worked and what didn't. Don't be afraid to ask for help as we have all been there at one point or another.
1. Do a complete walk around the facilities with either a wi/fi finder such as this one from I/O Gear for $12.95 http://www.iogear.com/product/GWF001/
or with your laptop if available and search for any other wireless networks in the area.
2. If no other networks are found this doesn't exactly rule out your interference problem as this may simply mean that the SSID is not being broadcast so you may want to start by resetting your router, this can be done with a simple paperclip in the reset button on the back for about 20 seconds then pull the power cable out while the button is still pushed in then place the cable back in.
3. plug a laptop into the back of the routers switch then open up a web browser and log into the router by typing in the following into the router http://192.168.1.1
Then log in using:
User: (leave blank)
Pass: admin1234
4. Go to the Wireless section in the configuration and choose a different broadcast ID, standard should be set to 11 change this to 6, hit save and close. Now check to see if the clients pick up the SSID and are able to log-in.
5. If an issue still exists then check the placement of the antennas, try to place them close to a window that has line of site to your other building. Remember that these antennas are not directional so you don't have to be exact.
6. If the placement doesn't help, turn one of your antennas into a parabolic antenna by using cardboard and tin foil. Create an arch that sits behind one of the antennas that has line of site and position it as best you can to the other building.
7. Now here comes the part that incurs a fee. Purchase a High Gain Antenna price ranges from $19.99 - $59.99, what?s the difference? Well the amount of decibel output is what, something with a 7db gain should allow you to have a stronger signal over the length you are wanting to cover.
8. If you are still having issues after this fact you might want to look at maybe replacing the router all together as there may be something wrong with the equipment, I mean it may not be that cut and dry but then again it very well may be.
Conclusion, although there is a science to building a wireless network, it can at times take some creative thinking to make things work the way you want them to. Your best bet is to take it all in one thing at a time, write down what changes you did so you know what worked and what didn't. Don't be afraid to ask for help as we have all been there at one point or another.
7th May 2009
0
Votes
Update.
Moved the router to a window. Acquired the username and password to the router, got in and altered a couple of settings. Have to go download some documentation from Linksys before I fiddle in those settings much more.
Primarily just restored a couple of defaults that looked out of whack... related to Channel.
Currently, my connection is faster than it's ever been, and no one is here right now for me to be able to check theirs.
Monday afternoon, oh about 3ish, I'll have a better idea about whether or not any of this did any good.
I'll be back, either way.
Primarily just restored a couple of defaults that looked out of whack... related to Channel.
Currently, my connection is faster than it's ever been, and no one is here right now for me to be able to check theirs.
Monday afternoon, oh about 3ish, I'll have a better idea about whether or not any of this did any good.
I'll be back, either way.
8th May 2009
Replies
Hopefully you gathered enough information to help you fix your issue. If not post back as I am sure there are other ideas out there that this group may have that you can try.
ericswain@...
11th May 2009
0
Votes
Ok, it's been a week
since I moved the router into a window, and made some internal configuration changes to it.
Nobody griped about complete loss of signal strength, but in the afternoons those computers furthest from the router are still losing signal strength.
Next step is to try that antenna that Michael Kassner posted, above.
And I've been examining the premises while on the balcony smoking. If the antenna doesn't help enough to keep signal strength high in the afternoons, it looks like I can run cat5 from one building to the next using existing electrical and phone lines to help support it.
My question in relation to that is, will exposed to the weather cat5 need to be protected from that weather in some way?
Thanks all.
etu
Nobody griped about complete loss of signal strength, but in the afternoons those computers furthest from the router are still losing signal strength.
Next step is to try that antenna that Michael Kassner posted, above.
And I've been examining the premises while on the balcony smoking. If the antenna doesn't help enough to keep signal strength high in the afternoons, it looks like I can run cat5 from one building to the next using existing electrical and phone lines to help support it.
My question in relation to that is, will exposed to the weather cat5 need to be protected from that weather in some way?
Thanks all.
etu
Updated - 15th May 2009
Replies
Will it need to be protected, the answer in my opinion is yes, unless you like the idea of replacing it from time to time...also from my experience running cat5 along power lines sometimes doesn't work so well b/c it causes loss of signal through the cable, however not always. I would recommend it to make your job easier in the future!
brian@...
15th May 2009
signal interference, too...
Any recs on what I could use to both protect it from the weather and reduce signal interference?
Any recs on what I could use to both protect it from the weather and reduce signal interference?
boxfiddler
15th May 2009
look at this site: http://www.americantechsupply.com/chromatic_out.html
It is showing you Outdoor CAT5/6 Cable, slightly more expensive, but worth it...part number ATSK5E-1KSTP-CMXFT....run it along the telephone line and try to keep it away from the electrical line would be my best guess on that (they may also sell an enclosure option on the site for the cable as well)....sorry about not mentioning it in the last post, I forgot about this stuff (been a long time since I have looked for it)!
It is showing you Outdoor CAT5/6 Cable, slightly more expensive, but worth it...part number ATSK5E-1KSTP-CMXFT....run it along the telephone line and try to keep it away from the electrical line would be my best guess on that (they may also sell an enclosure option on the site for the cable as well)....sorry about not mentioning it in the last post, I forgot about this stuff (been a long time since I have looked for it)!
brian@...
15th May 2009
