Linux·4,557 discussions

Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

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If so, is it a work system or a home system?

This will be broken down into two groups. The home use vs the work use. Please put replies in the correct section.

If you have a work system, what applications do you use and what is the primary reason you have a computer? Is the linux box standard or are you the exception?

If you have a home system, what applications do you use and what is the primary reason you have a computer? Homework for the kids? Games? Graphics?

Is this on a newer or older system?
Have you had hardware issues?
Any other problems?

Looking to do this at home as a pilot program, and then duplicate this at work if successful.

Thanks for sharing your experiences!

jd

Topic

Work Systems

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

please post work system replies under this.

Thanks.

Linux at work

In reply to Work Systems

Hey,

I use a linux desktop at work. Since my job involves a lot of network troubleshooting and scripting, I prefer to use linux. Tell you the truth it’s doing great for me…But it does not replace windows…I still do my reports on MS word and my spreadsheets on excel and I organize my life on outlook, linux has a very specific purpose for me, and it does a great job.

How big a part does it play in your day?

In reply to Linux at work

half? More? Less?

Why not use open office or something like that for your reports and such? Have you tried and they didn’t work for you?

Everyone else on windows boxes?

at least half

In reply to How big a part does it play in your day?

I work on linux at least half the day. I don’t use open office because of compatibility issues with formatting etc. When passing reports to coworkers or taking reports from them there is no room for format incompatibilities. I tried to use openoffice but found out opening word documents messes the format.
I use linux for network troubleshooting and scripting. I also use it as a file server (samba) for sharing all reports/documents/scripts etc. it works great.

The issue as i have mentioned is compatibility with windows format. Most coworkers, especially non IT and management level use MS Windows. The network is Active Directory based and it is difficult for me to imagine it otherwise.

Linux simply doesn’t scale. It is impossible to implement the security permissions available on a Windows infrastructure. I’m talking about file/print permissions, group management, policy deployment etc.

Bottom line, we are a 2500+ employee company, with a 50 IT staff team. 5 of us use linux on a daily basis, but again, not as a replacement for Windows, others use Windows exclusively, all interactive scripts are done using .NET. Linux based servers are the DNS, Web, Proxy everything else is Windows.

Maturity

In reply to at least half

I tend to agree, I have worked in mixed window/linux environments. Linux just isn’t as mature as windows is. I’m not saying that it isn’t as good or as stable as windows. But, I don’t think it has come of age in terms of an office environment. in terms of a standalone operation like a register or a firewall etc. I think it works great, it just isn’t ready for the desktop.

SA-

I wonder

In reply to Maturity

do you say this because of compatablity problems with the MS Office products?

Keep in mind that MS intentionally makes it so their files are incompatable with other office products whether for windows or ANY other platform.

Is there a different issue you had in mind? I really am interested in hearing all the real world problems that real people had with using a linux desktop.

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to I wonder

it goes beyond just filetypes. DNS, LDAP, Distribute authenticatin etc, some special DHCP options like 184. how about finding a tool to centralize administration of Virus software, or how about Network Shares, The tools just aren’t there yet. If you want to go 50/50 We could develop the tools in a year or so.

djameson

In reply to I wonder

but with a linux only solution,
you don’t need the virus software.
the network shares, built right into the kernel.

it’s only if you insist on using windows that you run into glitches.

and there are a number of linux based network antivirus systems to protect windows from viruses.

samba is an option to get windows and linux communicating, using widows limited capacity for networking. ( linux networking is far greater than windows, it’s windows lack of recognition for networking protocols that predate windows that causes the problems )

This is Jack’s disagreement.

In reply to Maturity

Linux is unix. The operating environment, including style of interface, filesystem structure, and so on, are all very much based on the extremely mature, well-tested, robust unix operating environment. It’s about three or four times as mature as Windows, measured chronologically.

As far as the GUI is concerned, you’re still talking about roughly twice as much time evolving as Windows.

It’s easier to get things done in Linux than in Windows, when you know what you’re doing. The fact that people used to Windows and unable or unwilling to learn a new trick (being “old dogs” long accustomed to Windows) find Linux a difficult adaptation, and the fact that the initial learning curve for Linux can be steeper than that for Windows, doesn’t alter how effective and useful it is as an office desktop machine. It’s very mature, with a prodigious range of available professional-grade “office productivity” applications available.

It’s not for everyone, though, just as Windows isn’t for everyone. The fact that it’s not for you doesn’t make it immature.

scaling

In reply to at least half

I can only assume you haven’t used network management systems on Linux that cover the scalability issues to which you refer. Tools like LDAP cover that nicely. Any networking effects you can achieve on Windows, you can achieve on Linux (even security problems, but Windows security issues take a whole lot of work to duplicate in Linux and often involve using MS applications with WINE).

Compatibility concerns are, of course, perfectly valid.

BSD

In reply to Linux at work

I run 2 BSD Boxes at different locations. I have a windows desktop, but For troubleshooting, sniffing etc. It makes more sense to have a ~linux box. It isn’t my desktop, but I always have 3-10 ssh sessions running all the time.

is it

In reply to BSD

a coincidence that bsd and lsd both came out of berkely in the 60’s?

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to is it

I think they got the acronyms wrong.

nawww

In reply to Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

they were on lsd when they wrote bsd.

Testing/Proof of Concept Only

In reply to Work Systems

Mandriva, currently a base LAMP install.

Looking to test a program for a small coffee/espresso shop to do accounting, import legacy Quickbooks data, accept Qb formatted data from a Royal cash register, hopefully also write the checks in VesaCheck format, all under linux.

Probably will be testing for some other SMB use next month.

This is my setup I can blow up and not care about. piii 833, 256 mb ram, 10 gb HD.

Day-to-day stuff is on a old Compaq Presario with external drive array under Windows 2000. Actually, testing patch managers with that one at present.

More great hardware beggin for linux

In reply to Work Systems

IBM 4694-244 POS Cash Register System

They show up on eBay in the $225 range, and rather than the Win98 OS that came with them, I would think that Linux would be preferable.

(Usual driver and peripheral issues apply.)

wouldn’t

In reply to More great hardware beggin for linux

be to hard.

got one kicking around?

if it’s cot a cd drive you can find out what devices are not recognised by booting onto a livecd.
if no errors come up.
install.

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to wouldn’t

No, not yet. Wish I did.

If not, it couldn’t be too hard to open up the case and dangle a CD-R off the side.

Notes say: IBM 4694 Computer Base
AMD-K6tm, 266 Mhz, 3.2 GB HDD, 128 MB RAM

then

In reply to Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

add the cdrom and install distro of your choice.
the hardware will work.

Hardware compatibility

In reply to Work Systems

Linux still has a way to go until it will match ms ease of use – and this is fundamental to acceptance on the desktop. I introduced a client to Fedora 3 and she liked it a lot but I couldn’t get a Casio exilim to work so I re-installed win xp.

What surprised me was she breathed a sigh of relief and admitted that she liked some of the linux features but found the system more ‘scary’ than windows xp.

here is how to get your Casio Exilim working in Linux

In reply to Hardware compatibility

http://pubwww.fhzh.ch/~mgloor/casio-exilim.html

Home Systems

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

please post home system replies under this.

Thanks.

BOTH

In reply to Home Systems

I have installed SUSE desktops on a few client networks to find nothing buy VERY happy users, no more MS hassles! They are used for most basic Office work, Docs, databases, email etc.

At home, I have two NIX boxes, both bought by companies I supported, one Novell Linux desktop and the other SUSE, mainly used for administering their networks. I like them both but the SUSE is a little more robust.

As for myself, I am quite lucky to have the most stable and quickest notebook I have ever picked up. I run W2KPro, on a PIII with 640MC RAM. I am the only user and it NEVER crashes or hangs, boots and reboots in less than a minute, shuts down in about 4-5 seconds etc. But again, it’s a one-off that others don’t use and isn’t used for networking into the client site.

I use it for all of my publicity work, print and graphics creation, SOME games )web design, interfacing to my sound desk (yes I run Cakewalk on it too, gave up on Pro-Tools, too limited) only 32 meg graphics cipset, and just about everything else is done on it. I don’t even use my P4 desktop with the 256 Graphics card unless I feel like playing some really GP demanding game.

So as for your question, I mainly use Linux for work, ALWAYS Firefox! I have installed it across several medium sized networks and it is rock solid. Come to think of it, I bill far less hours than I used to, maybe I should switch them all back to XP ‘Doze desktops with IE on them. 🙂

I thought

In reply to BOTH

that your laptop died on you at one point? Was that the same one or did you replace it?

XP running on your P4?

I have a few systems all ready to roll on making into desktops, was just wondering of the people out here how many are using a *nix desktop for business and how it was going.

Will be setting up some keyas(sp?) points for the shop workers to access HR documents anytime they want so that HR doesn’t have to spend so much time hand feeding information out to people. They can just look it up themselves.

These will definitly be linux boxes!

YEs several times

In reply to I thought

My notebook has had thee LCD’s (one or two dead pixels and I get a new one), three system boards (if my heaphone jack cuts out/in due to a sloppy jack I get a new one and had a problem with unequal balance in the sound card (obviously I really picky there), have had teh keyboard replaced twice because the onsite tech didn’t enable th etrackpoint in teh BIOS (LOL)but that’s about it.

As far as performance and daily use, it’s rock solid and rocket fast.

YEs the PIV is WinXp, 3.0 Gig, w/512 MB Ram, but my notebook STILL outperforms it. I found downloading the Intel Application accelerator from Intel’s site is REALLY helpful!

IBM writes a solid BIOS, they have great driver reliability and support though.

I’v e had mine about 4 years, I extended the initial warranty, to 3 yr, onsite but STILL have an option to get another 1 or 2 yr, onsite (1yr/$130 Canadian CHEAPO!). That gives me BUSINESS level quality care, next day onsite service, no questions asked, here’s your new part!

SO from my bank of PC’s, mostly collecting dust nowdays, the IBM Thinkpad (even with W2K)is my baby. Plus I have a free Satellite account from my ISP, so it’s hard not to just have it everywhere I go now.

As for the linux, I have rolled out Suse to several hundred desktops, mainly Open Office use some graohics and web dev stuff, accounting software (Samco) and Browsing email etc.

It is so cheap, there’s a list of progs in the toolbar that allow you to download about 2000 apps for free as you need them, no mroe buying software. Users have NO problems as it’s GUI is just like Windoze, never have any servie calls though, as I said maybe I will ‘upgrade them’ back to windows to get some more bllable hours out of them! 🙂

Best of luck with your rollout, just remember when it comes to Linux these days, it’s almost as well supported as anything and is not the alien, geek field it once was.

Thanks for the feed back!

In reply to YEs several times

all the hype and marketing just can’t replace talking to real people doing real work.

Now I am twice as geeked to get a home system up and going. Will be something to do while the kids are gone to keep me busy.

Testing only

In reply to Home Systems

I mainly use mobile computers (notebooks, tablets, etc.) and have found linux to be unsuitable under these situations. The myriad of devices I connect to and the difficulty in working with wireless have made it not worth the effort yet.

As for my desktop, dual boot XP & FC3. I have grown with linux from the RH7 days. While I have tried Mandrake, SUSE, and Debian, I am most comfortable with RH/FC.

If ever linux were to conqure (sp) the wireless realm, I would probably make the switch and not look back.

how much time in each?

In reply to Testing only

for your desktop, what is on the XP that you can’t find on the FC3 that brings you back? Is there a reason or just habit?

You don’t dual boot the mobiles?

Time

In reply to how much time in each?

70/30 if you are looking for a split (ms/lin).

Linux is still lacking some refinement. Like I said earlier, the biggest shortcoming is wireless support.

linux wireless

In reply to Time

I’ll agree with that: there’s not enough wireless support for Linux. That’s not a Linux problem, so much as a wireless card vendor problem. That doesn’t change the fact, though, that it’s the user’s problem as well.

There are two important things to note, though:

1. Almost every card out there can be supported on Linux with already existing drivers. You’d need to use wrapper software (the ndiswrapper module is the most common example, and what I’m using) with Windows drivers in many cases, though, which adds some difficulty to implementation for those who are not very skilled with Linux.

2. Once you’ve got a card running on Windows, you’ll have either the same functionality available to you, or [b]better[/b] functionality, depending on the drivers you had to use. If you use Windows drivers with a wrapper, you’ll have exactly the same available card functionality as you’d have under Windows. If you use a card for which there are Linux-native drivers, you’ll almost certainly have even more functionality than you would under Windows.

The fact that many wireless adapters aren’t natively supported under Linux is a source of frustration for many Linux users who miss the additional functionality that some few cards enjoy in Linux. It also presents something of a barrier for habitual Windows users looking to migrate to Linux, which is unfortunate.

And there’s the problem ….

In reply to linux wireless

As far as desktop support goes, Linux is certainly getting there but limited native driver support in areas like wireless, digital cameras etc cotinues to be a MASSIVE inhibitor to widespread support. Your comment ending … for those not very skilled with Linux .. is spot on. Using a windows wrapper that is difficult to configure and use just does not enter the mind of the average (or even failry gifted) home user.

actually . . .

In reply to And there’s the problem ….

It’s not difficult to configure and use ndiswrapper at all. It’s just not something many people are familiar with, so it seems difficult before they begin, and as a result they tend to give up before they start. I pretty much went from zero to expert in two hours with ndiswrapper.

Keep in mind, also, that most people that complain about the difficulty of drivers under Linux are comparing pre-installed Windows with all drivers in place to Linux they’re trying to install themselves.

It’s more the impression of difficulty than actual difficulty that is a “MASSIVE” inhibitor.

yup, but

In reply to And there’s the problem ….

that can be put on the hardware manufacturers.
they refuse to write drivers for linux.

so the linux community has to buy the hardware, then write drivers by probing the hardware and seeing what the signals are then building the code needed to make use of it correctly.

figure from release of hardware to stable driver is usually 6 months.
wireless, because of the number of different protocols used, is a bit harder.

go figger, blame the os for the hardware manufacturers problem.

Wireless Linux on the Notebook

In reply to Testing only

Consulting with a coffee shop that is thinking of offering free wireless. The owner has heard horror stories about wireless linux.

Sibce this will be a free hot spot (pick up your ticket with ssid, login and password, and you are on your own) any truth to this?

Not really

In reply to Wireless Linux on the Notebook

ndiswrapper makes everything pretty seamless. While on some cards there are issues with things like changing channels or using WEP, for the most part it will work in an open environment like that.

egg-zackly

In reply to Not really

“Channels” and WEP problems are even less of an issue than it would seem from your phrasing, based on my first- and second-hand experience, and based on what I’ve read.

Getting ndiswrapper set up might be a little confusing for a new user, of course. Aside from that, though, it’s mostly pretty straightforward.

It’s only partially true.

In reply to Wireless Linux on the Notebook

For an open, encryption-free wireless environment, wireless Linux works fine. Ndiswrapper or Linuxant Driverloader will do the job well.

Only if you set up an encrypted network (WEP or WPA) at the coffee shop might you see a problem. WEP works flawlessly with some Linux versions, but not with others. And currently WPA support in Linux lags way behind. Eventually these kinks will be ironed out (hopefully).

More Coffee

In reply to It’s only partially true.

Plans are now for 64-bit WEP, and some MAC-address blocking if only because one of the tenants from the floor above has announced that he plans (planned?) to use our network as his own. (Not that he ever offered to pay anything, mind you.)

While this is VERY off-topic, I might note that his “plans” are an unintended consequence of the older downtown building having given “conduit rights” to the ILEC to the exclusion of everyone else, including cable TV. We can ADSL, 128k ISDN or get a fractional T-1 loop to the ground floor, but it is painfully expensive as you go up the building.

More off-topic: The shop owner actually makes a game of calling the ILEC’s customer service people and demanding to know when they are going to provide cable TV since they are keeping the cable companies out. Listening to him is a great break in the workday.

ok

In reply to More Coffee

http://www.geocities.com/jaqui_greenlees/images/coffee.gif

and for his next call here:

http://www.geocities.com/jaqui_greenlees/images/popcorn1.gif

64-bit wep is pointless

In reply to More Coffee

It is like trying to stop a charing bull with a piece of paper. 128 bit WEP is better and WPA is better than that.

What you should do is this…MAC filter for your clients or create an autheticating network of some kind.

the way to handle it

In reply to More Coffee

Actually, what should be done is this:

Set up a cheap server (Pentium 233MHz should do beautifully) with Linux to monitor and log network activity. Tell the guy upstairs that unauthorized connections will be logged and passed on to the relevant authorities. Refer him to stories in the news of people being prosecuted for unauthorized access to wireless networks.

If you’re running a hotspot, you don’t want to deal with WEP keys. Trust me on this.

Yes, Mandrake 10.1 Discovery

In reply to Home Systems

Stable as a rock, I’m quite happy with it.

I started with Mandrake 9.1, then went to 10.0 Community, and finally to 10.1 Discovery.

I’ve gotten a few friends curious about it, and a few may convert over the coming months.

The big “safety net” for me when I first installed it was it automatically set up a dual-boot situation for me, so if anything went sideways I could still retain Windows capability. It worked.

Home Systems

In reply to Home Systems

I run:
1 XP home P4ht laptop
2 XP Pro desktops (Athlon XP’s) of which 1 is a dual book with Debian Sarge.

I use them for what ever i’m doing at the time, e.g. surfing, bringing work home etc. and i use all for the same kind of work, although i find Linux a helluah lot easier to work with than XP.

Question

In reply to Home Systems

If your finding the linux easier to work with, why are you still primarily running XP?

Is it habit?
Just haven’t had time to make the switch?
Is there something that brings you back to the XP that you can’t do on the linux?

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to Question

I run dual boot on my home desktop and my notebook, with XP Pro/FC4 32-bit on the desktop and XP Pro x64/FC4_x64 on the notebook. Although Linux still leaves a bit to be desired with wireless support, ndiswrapper/wpa_supplicant works quite well after configuration.

The main reasons I keep XP are (1) I haven’t found a good Linux replacement for Quicken and Turbotax, (2) so far I prefer Photoshop over GIMP, and (3) there needs to be more work done as far as solid write capability for NTFS systems so I can support the other XP boxes on my home network.

Grub Dual-Booting

In reply to Home Systems

I’m runnin’ Windows XP, as well as Gentoo Linux. Grub is helping to make that managable. I also have Cygwin installed.

See, i get a good app on Windows XP during my casual time. I test it out in cygwin (if possible), and if i like it, i move it over to my Linux.

Home system

In reply to Home Systems

I can not run Linux at work, 95% of my customers run Windows, and company I am working for run Windows as well. But at home…
My wife use Mac, she finds it safer, troublefree and then Windows and easier then Linux. I run Slackware for soul and Mandrake for work I do at home. My daughter run Mandrake and I have a Windows based PC like a playstation for my yangers.
On my opinion Linux is ready for the desktops at work or at home.

Ubuntu

In reply to Home Systems

I have an PII 450 Ubuntu system I use for web and mail. My Windows box is nothing but a gaming platform anymore.

SUSE at Home

In reply to Home Systems

I run SUSE 9.2 at home – Dual boot with Win 98SE (!)I find it stable, useable, and fun, but what is stopping me moving competley is that I cannot run some of my well used Windows software- Macromedia MX, a DTP, Adobe Elements, and a few others. I know that I need to make the time to learn the Linux software, that will probably (definitely) do the same as the Win software, but it takes time to learn.

My biggest problem is installing new software. This really has to change. Getting caught in the endless loop of library problems is no way to encourage new users.

I will continue to use Linux as much as I can, but it does have a very steep learnign curve.

BTW my SUSE refuses to run Firefox, so I use teh new Opera v8 whcih is great!

Ed

Don’t know why!

In reply to SUSE at Home

Do you mean you can’t install Firefox or it crashes or what?

I used Firefox in SuSE 9.2 with no problem at all.

But if you think SuSE is good for a home user (and it is), try Xandros. Simplicity itself!

Firefox crashes

In reply to Don’t know why!

Firefox runs OK, but if I try to use any of the options in the set up dailogue box, it simply quietly crashes!

library problems

In reply to SUSE at Home

I never have library problems. Library issues are the fault of your software management system, not the operating system. If you’re having such problems, you might want to look into other software management tools than whatever you’re using.

Since you’re on SuSE, I imagine you’re probably using YaST2 for software management. I understand SuSE is offering an adaptation of apt-rpm. That might be more helpful to you, but I can’t swear to it. I’ve been using apt on Debian for a long time, and that’s pretty much all I use these days (well, apt and aptitude, which do the same things), but I haven’t ever used any other distribution’s adaptations of the apt system.

Once you get past the learning curve, you’ll likely find that Linux is actually easier to use for almost all tasks than Windows. That was certainly my experience. It just takes a little getting-used-to.

I can’t imagine why you wouldn’t be able to make Firefox work. I haven’t used SuSE in a while, I’m afraid.

SUSE and apt-rpm

In reply to library problems

I had no idea that SUSE were offering this. I will try to find out more. Any ideas where to start, or shall I simply go to the SUSE site?

SuSE advice

In reply to SUSE and apt-rpm

I recommend joining a LUG for help with SuSE Linux. You can find LUGs by geographic location at the following URL, and joining the mailing list might be the smartest thing you’ve ever done related to computers.

http://www.linux.org/groups/

LUG mailing lists are invaluable resources for help with Linux-related issues. Most lists are quite good, and on good lists people are friendly and helpful (at least until they get to know you). Be respectful, of course, and don’t start your questions with ranting complaints, or you might not be received as well as you’d hope. Just let ’em know you’re new to LUG mailing lists, and they’re likely to cut you slack and give advice when needed on not only how to get Linux working, but how to get good help on the list, too.

Be willing to look stuff up for yourself on Google and with manpages as a first step. If/when you don’t find what you seek, [b]then[/b] ask the list, and give an idea of what you’ve tried. One of the most impressive ways a LUG can help you is in teaching you how to find information for yourself related to Linux problems.

Both?

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

since my “office” is a home office, and I ue linux mine fits into both groupings.
the only hardware issues I’ve had are related to sound card, with newer hardware.

for work purposes I use kylix, for application development.
I use kate to script web apps.
apache, php, and both postgresql and mysql

I use enlightenment mostly for my gui, but have 8 gui’s installed, to make sure apps actually work right in them.
my default browser is usually mozilla suite, in gui. but I test with as many browsers as possible when it’s a web app.

I often am browsing online in lynx.

I run multiple systems with multiboot on each, for the hardware and os testing of applications.
( yup, I have 6 different systems here, all with at least 4 os options on them [ no windows option at all ] )

all systems are work and home systems.
whichever I’m on is the one I’m online with, for whatever reason, be it work or personal. ( gotta like being the boss..of one person show. 😉 )

Home system = Work system

In reply to Both?

I’m a freelance IT consultant, mainly training people in network administration and tcp/ip. Most of the trainings are UNIX/linux, but i’m also an MCT and triple MCSE.
At home (=work) i have nothing from MS. My main workstation now is a Ubuntu, but i also have a Fedora Core 4, an OpenBSD and a Solaris 10. The two linux desktops change distro frequently.
Applications : (Gnome), Firefox, Thunderbird, The Gimp, OpenOffice.org, Ethereal, xpdf, and lotsa commandline. I don’t play computergames.
Until 2003 i was running mainly Windows2000 and OS/2, i removed my last Microsoft partition in april 2004.
I choose linux/bsd/solaris because it just works, whereas with MS software one has to spend lots of time troubleshooting, antivirussing, antispywaring etc…

How long after first install

In reply to Home system = Work system

did it take for you to notice you had no need to boot over to the Windows partition anymore?

What were the hold outs that kept you going back the longest?

What hardware do you run? PII, PIII, P4, Amd? What is now your preference?

re: How long after first install

In reply to How long after first install

I don’t remember my first linux install. Must’ve been redhat 5.2 or something…I kept going back a while for DVD-burning, and some older applications that only worked in Microsoft’s OS.
Anyway, I kept the MS Windows partition for about a year, without using it. I have four P4 machines.

My preference ? For servers that would be Solaris or OpenBSD, for clients…doesn’t matter much, i like Fedora Core 4. This ubuntu thing is kinda cool, but it has some glitches (firefox crashes, thunderbird crashes…)that annoy me. I don’t have any of those problems with Fedora.

For organizations ? Go for Novell Suse!! (OK, i am biased here, because i will be teaching 8 weeks of Novell Suse administration this fall.)

PS I hate all the spam from techrepublic that clutters my inbox now, when subscribing i clearly unchecked the newsletter subscription. Now i unsubscribed again, so please (and hopefully) you’ll stop sending me email now!

Give filter account

In reply to re: How long after first install

My TR account gets filtered through a gmail account, so it doesn’t matter how much goes in.

Funny, I have never gotten anything from TR that I haven’t asked for thought. Just some anoying peer mail from scammers for a while there.
[b]
Paul, make a discussion under the “ideas” heading and one of the guys will take care of any problem your having! They keep a close watch on that heading. Just be nice and they will treat you like royalty! Good luck.

What is slowest desktop system?

In reply to Both?

What is the oldest, slowest system you have running a linux desktop? How much difference do you see between that and your top dog?

Were the sound cards Sound blaster? Off brand? On-board?

you’ll laugh

In reply to What is slowest desktop system?

but my oldest and slowest system is an i386, with 64mb ram.
my primary testing machine.
I insist on anything being able to run on os minimums, and that means a 386.

besides the fact we are talking 33mhz to 2.2Ghz so performance difference is extreme. 😉
the lowest system that is reasonably expected to be in use ( I think ) is a 600mhz p3 or equivalent.
the performance difference in load times is actually minimal, for me. maybe one second longer on older system, to load the gui and restore session. loading an app is even less difference.

the sound cards that caused problems wre all onboard, and offbrand systems.

the only one that is still spotty in support is the sis7012 ob sound chipset. ( kernel patch is intel 810 chipset code patched to run this chipset. )
it’s does work, but have had occasional sound failures with it.

the only time I’ve ever had a complete system failure with linux was using an older distro and working on crashing it for 6 months. I’ve had the sound card fail only with non name brand ob chipsets. if it’s a separate card and name brand it never fails.

System minimums

In reply to you’ll laugh

My primary system I use at home for just about everything is a PII 400 with 512 ram. The faster systems are all toys for my boys to play with.

That pII does every business application I need for work/home/school. (running Win2K).

And the crazy thing is when my work bought it for me back in 98, it cost $1600. Now THAT is funny!

You can run the GUI on a 386? And bigger question, you got 64 megs into a 386? Bet that memory cost you a fortune! I remember having a screaming 16 megs in my 486!

yup

In reply to System minimums

you can run the xserver on a 386, and a full gui on top of it, as long as the gui is not kde or gnome.

blackbox is the one I have on the 386.

huh? cost for ancient ram?? what cost??
the dumpster divers find computers constantly.
I could expand to 1500 p3 workstation network with a per station cost of $20.00 🙂
I think I have about 500 megs of old simm ram chips kicking around right now, with modules ranging from 1mb to 16 mb.

making friends with homless in a city can save lots of money for toys. 😉 as the braindead yuppies that toss out old stuff cause it’s a year old will pay full price for hardware, and you can buy the hardware off the homeless dumpster divers for cheap. ( they get food and drug money, smokes, booze… they are happy. )

486 browsing machine

In reply to yup

I will need to set up a few systems. We are talking between a 486 and a PI.

All it will do is run a GUI so shop rats can browse documents on the intranet and look at PDF’s.

Blackbox would be a good choice for a gui?
How about browser?
How much memory will they NEED? I think they have 32 M right now.

I am a server guy when it comes to *nix, mainly SCO and Redhat. And yes, they all run off the command line so the GUI is a new beast to me and don’t know which way to go to start.

Yes, this will have to end up being a blog project as it goes along.

Think I will end up with Suse as the distro because if this project comes off I will want to try to move EVERYTHING over to this.

Old 486 and GUI

In reply to 486 browsing machine

I’d choose FVWM or TWM for a GUI. They are both pretty light weight and are powerful.

Lynx for the browser or perhaps a light weight older GUI browser. Firefox, might work, but I haven’t honestly tried.

I’d try to get 64mb in their just for sanity, but 32mb will work just fine in most cases.

If you are moving to Suse, keep in mind things tend to be in slightly different places and it has a very European feel to it. Not that it is a bad distro, just different.

How about viewing PDF’s?

In reply to 486 browsing machine

What do you recommend for this?

Or forms are primarily in this format, and on the PC’s we use the acrobat reader.

Haven’t even LOOKED at that part yet.

Ghostview and acrobat

In reply to 486 browsing machine

For the most part you can use ghostview to view PDF and PS files. However, sometimes the PDF files will only open in Acrobat.

It will work in Linux via a RPM or tar.gz you can pick it up at: http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2_allversions.html

for the gui

In reply to 486 browsing machine

you can use any but gnome and kde.

those 2 are pretty hefty and really want 128mb ram for decent functionality.

mwm and lestif use the ancient motif style widget set, so they are very lightweight in system requirements, not very attractive.

32 mb ram is os minimum, with 2.4 kernel and older, the 2.6 really wants 128 mb ram, but will barely function on 64.

I’ve never had a pdf not open in ghostview, or other included apps. I’ve never been forced into installing adobe reader to view one.

browser, most filesystem browsers will view all file formats in them.

web browsing with light weight gui you will probably find that lynx or links are better. both are console mode, but links has the option of including graphics and does have a gui port.

a good option for filesystem browser is midnight commander, for use in gui use the gnome version, which has a gtk based graphic interface.
mc will read almost all file types, it will allow viewing contents of archives, without extrcting. and will open appropriate application to view a pdf.

for older machines, you may find that using an older version of linux will give better results in operations, but then you run into small functionality issues with security updates not being available.

wander into local computer book store, find an old copy of a learning linux book, they usually have red hat 5 on cdrom. perfect for older hardware.

suse uses a scsi interface in the kernel, some older machines may not support that. ( my athlon xp 2200+ locks up when it’s loaded. )

definately try livecd version of suse on all machines you’ll be concidering using suse on, if it doesn’t run then that machine has a conflict with the suse kernel. ( the scsi is often to blame, but I’ve seen solaris lock up with the uhci usb module, when every distro I’ve used uses the uhci usb module no problem. )

Puppy Linux might be what you are looking for

In reply to 486 browsing machine

Puppy Linux will run on almost any machine.

Don’t need a hard drive, boot from CD, JumpDrive, ZipDrive, Hard Drive, Lan.

Link: http://www.goosee.com/puppy/

I hope this helps.

application choices

In reply to 486 browsing machine

For window managers, what you choose really depends on what functionality you want out of it as much as on what hardware you’re using. If you want a one-trick pony kind of kiosk setup on old hardware, I’d recommend something like fvwm that doesn’t rely on a taskbar and hardly touches system resources. It makes it difficult for the casual user to figure out how to screw up your setup, too. If you want something that looks and acts a little bit like Windows, again on older hardware, I’d recommend something like IceWM. IceWM is very familiar to anyone that has used Windows 95, Windows 98, or Windows NT 4. It’s also in the same class as fvwm, in terms of resource use. Blackbox and Fluxbox are very lightweight, but they both use a taskbar and are very unfamiliar to Windows users (though not as unfamiliar as something like WindowMaker, which is what I use on my own systems).

For PDF viewing, I just use xpdf. It’s a simple application, whose purpose is just viewing PDFs. It’s not resource hungry, and I’ve never had a problem with it opening a PDF. Also, OpenOffice.org is not only capable of viewing PDFs, but can also create them, so if you’re going to have OpenOffice.org on your system anyway you might consider using that for viewing PDFs as well. In addition to that, there are PDF-viewing plugins for web browsers that would allow you to view them in your browser.

Minimum systems for Linux.

In reply to you’ll laugh

I have run SuSe pro on a 200 Mhz MMX P1 with 128 meg of slow RAM ( all the bits from a computer recycling place, you know you have to sort through trashcans for a 32 meg video card!)
It didn’t seem to be much slower than an overclocked 2.4 ghz P-IV with 512 meg DDR ram.
But hit was triple boot 98se/xp/suse, so it may not be a fair comparison.
Usually I suggest that prople switch to Linux rather then buying a new PC for XP.
As a rule of thumb, Linux runs on PCs that are only fit for the skip (Including KDE desktop, which actually works on a 4 meg video card, which struggles to run 98se.)
If you have ever run win 3.1 and dos, Linux seems very easy, its much easier than the CP/m that we used to run at work. And its much more difficult for amybody to mess up a linux desktop system.
It seems to run very well on a 1ghz AMD.
Normal AGP x8 video cards seem to have no problems, Suse finds them and sets them up, Windows demands an installation CD.

a laptop

In reply to What is slowest desktop system?

My slowest Linux “desktop” system is actually a laptop. In fact, it’s a Thinkpad 600E, with a 366MHz Pentium processor and 128MB of RAM. It’s quite possible to get a slower machine running Linux acceptably, but this laptop is worth mentioning because it does everything I want the way I want it, and it still outperforms a 2.4GHz P4 system running Windows XP Pro.

Both

In reply to Both?

“If so, is it a work system or a home system?”

I use Linux for both home and work. I typically use FC3 at home and at work it ranges from Ubuntu, Slackware, and FC3. It really depends on what I am doing. My students that are interested in Linux ALWAYS have multiple installed to see what flavors fit them. I usually have to help them out with building the “harder” distros, but once they get the hang of it, they usually migrate to either FC3 (for wireless and home use) or Slackware/Gentoo for more build it yourself experience.

“This will be broken down into two groups. The home use vs the work use. Please put replies in the correct section.”

I fit in the both section 😉

“If you have a work system, what applications do you use and what is the primary reason you have a computer? Is the linux box standard or are you the exception?”

Work – Open Office, Webmin, Apache, DHCP, BIND, etc, etc…I teach my students how to setup and secure a server.

Home – Mostly desktop stuff, but some server stuff (like apache). I have a crappy older computer as a firewall and IPSec “server.”

“If you have a home system, what applications do you use and what is the primary reason you have a computer? Homework for the kids? Games? Graphics?”

Hmmmm…I use it for everything. I do play games (I love Neverwinter Nights and WoW). I also do work on it. I’m not a graphical guy, but as I understand it Gimp is almost as good as photoshop. I also use my home computer(s) as a test bed for my students sometimes (they can poke and prod all they want)

“Is this on a newer or older system?”

Yes. I have a laptop a P3 800 (I think), a Athlon 3200, a P4 1ghz, and soon to live a brand spanking new Athlon X2 (though I haven’t bought it yet).
“Have you had hardware issues?”
Linux tends to do pretty well on dual core, but I’ve found Slackware complains a little….Wireless is also in need of help. That is why I am using IPSec at home. WEP (while crappy) just won’t work right in Linux.

“Any other problems?”
Typically FC supports bleeding edge hardware FAR better than any distro. I wish that driver makers would come out with drivers FOR Linux, rather than having to kludge something together (eg ndiswrapper).

“Looking to do this at home as a pilot program, and then duplicate this at work if successful.”

Go for it. If you are using an ATI or NVidia graphics card make sure to go to rpm.livna.org and update your driver that way. Why? It is as simple as yum or apt-get. You don’t have to recompile your kernel and it just works! Also if you plan on using wireless stay away from D-Link and find a card that uses and Ornico chipset…

Don’t forget that video driver link in your blog

In reply to Both

I was wondering why you hadn’t been by yet.

I think that this is getting me lots of good information I can use to help support my project by showing what works and doesn’t work for other people that have USED the products instead of just buying into they HYPE and FUD.

First will be a few desktops, and then it will be time to try a laptop. Should be done with divorce by then and get myself a new laptop for myself for Christmas so my thinkpad PIII 800 can be turned into a linux box. come to think of it, the NEW system should be the one to become a linux box as the thinkpad is already configured for the windows stuff I need! Now we are cooking with fire!

rpm.livna.org = Life saver

In reply to Don’t forget that video driver link in your blog

I’m a busy beaver! I’ve got a lot to do, so I’ve been too busy to post! I do love this discussion though…I like to see what people have to say about Linux…

It saves SO much time to just yum the driver. Why NVidia and ATI don’t do it this way, I’ll never know.

Also, let me plug Cedega/WineX for the DirectX9 stuff you might have to run. While it isn’t perfect, it only costs $15 and is pretty good.

Both @ office as well as home

In reply to Both?

I use linux desktop at office as well as at my home. For office its used as file/web/proxy server. At home its just a testing machine used only for experiments.

Peeyush Maurya
http://www.linux-faqs.com/HOWTO/

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I run mandrake linux on my laptop and desktop at home computer. Had lots of problem with laptop temp control and wireless configuration. Manadrake seems to be working good. Also I have sharp zaurus pda thats awsome.

Home XP, Office – W2K

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I’ll bet you thought I was going to try to thread-jack this puppy and go off-topic on Windows, now didn’t you?

Actually I have high hopes for this thread. I’m hoping that there’ll be some consensus about which version of Linux is the best and easiest to use. Maybe after you *n*xers agree on that, I’m hoping one of you will write and get TR to publish a step by step guide entitled something like “Building Your First Linux Box – Written in Language a Windows Guru Can Understand.”

Questions to be answered would include:
1) Do I buy or download my first Linux version?
2) Which version?
3) If I download, how many CDs will the install media take?
4) What are minimum system requirements? (I keep reading the old x86 doorstop with 64 MB and 30 MB hard drive will run Linux. True?)
5) How soon from the time I start the install until I’m surfing the Web on my very first Linux box?

Help this old Winders-dude learn what all the open source fuss is about.

mandrake

In reply to Home XP, Office – W2K

I have had mandrake(open source 2 disks) up in 2 hrs on a 1.0 Ghz with 512 Mb of Ram. If you have DHCP you can be up and surfin in 20 minutes. The trick with good performance from a UNIX box is the same as a windows box throw more memory at it, If Windows could use memory the same way a unix box does there would be nothing to slow them down.

Personally the only near linux I run is Mac OSX it is running on a FreeBSD 4.X kernel. I run BSD 5.2 in the background then load the MAC Kernel on top of that it’s in some blog somewhere. It works great, I can keep my BSD up to date and use all the ports that you could ever want, and still get the pretty gui of mac. I’m a windows man too, and up til MAC OSX I wouldn’t have recommended MAC

Join A “LUG”

In reply to Home XP, Office – W2K

I actually BOUGHT [b]Linux Administaration for Dummies[/b], and it does explain things in a method that is understandable. (really, I am NOT trying to imply ANYTHING! Like I said, I have the book myself.) They also have DESKTOP books.

Check out a LUG. (Linux Users Group).

http://www.linux.org/groups/

They are all over the place and usually meet once a month. This will give a new comer some real world contacts to help them get started. If you tell them you are a windows dude looking to make the switch you will be taking right in with open arms. Many of the members bring copies of the latest versions right to the meetings and hand them out.

As for answers. First version, if new to computers all together go and buy a set. Someone in your boat knows how to make disks from downloaded images.

Which version? First decide desktop or server and then go from there. Go to http://www.distrowatch.com for what the market share is of each version and reviews of them all.

How many CD’s? Depends on if you just want the binaries of if you want to be able to look at the source or not. Plan on three.

Min sys req. For someone just starting out, use something that is current. While you are learning linux the last thing you need is hardware conflicts. Save that for later.

Time from install completion to surfing? About 10 seconds.

Hope this helps. And yes, I did laugh as soon as I saw you posted that!

I’ll blog this up

In reply to Home XP, Office – W2K

I’ll try to have this blogged up either today or Tuesday.

Blogged, plus more!

In reply to I’ll blog this up

http://techrepublic.com.com/5247-6257-0.html?tag=header

link fix

In reply to Blogged, plus more!

http://techrepublic.com.com/5247-6257-0.html?id=4093177

your link only opened whoever clicked it’s blog. 😉

Been seeing that a lot with TR links lately

In reply to link fix

If I don’t do a refresh of the page, the address doesn’t show up correctly. (both IE AND FF)

hmmmm….Link Fixed (I think)

In reply to Blogged, plus more!

http://techrepublic.com.com/5254-6257-0.html?forumID=99&threadID=173917&messageID=1807228&id=4093177

First-tyme Linux

In reply to Home XP, Office – W2K

1) You can either order the disks or download them, or pick them up as an add-on to a book. For example, the book “Linux for Dummies” comes with a set of disks, Red Hat last time I checked. The Linux Bible comes with both Red Hat and the “live” distribution Knoppix.

To download a distro, you can either use Bittorrent or a straightforward download. ISO mirrors include Linuxquestions.org and sorceforge.net.

Technically speaking you aren’t “buying” a Linux licence, but rather either support or the cost of burning and mailing the physical disks.

2) Version… There’s two definitions I think you could be driving at: distributions, and the distributions’ versions. I found Mandrake (now Mandriva) quite easy to use, it automatically sectored my hard drive and set up the boot as a Dual Boot, leaving me with the option of booting into Linux or into Windows. Handy at tax time, as nobody has a Linux tax preparation program.

Another newbie-friendly distribution is Linspire, and there are PLENTY of others. If you want to start a fight on a Linux forum, just claim that such-and-such a distribution is The Best There Ever Was. ^_^

I recommend trying first a Live Distribution, like Knoppix. They fit on a single CD, and rather than installing on your hard drive, run off your CD drive. When you remove the disk from your CD drive, Presto! the next time you boot your computer, you have a Windows machine again. You don’t need to (although you CAN) install the Live Distro on your hard drive at all. That way you can “test-drive” your hardware without worrying about mucking up your Windows setup.

3) Number of disks: your milage will vary depending on which distribution, and which version of which distribution, you choose. Live distros by definition fit on a single CD-RW. Mandrake 10.1 Discovery fits on 3 disks, which includes enough software choices to turn your humble home computer into a full-fledged Internet, e-mail and file server with office productivity software and games as well, but will only install those you need for your particular situation (i.e., if you just want to surf the net it’ll ignore the various types of server software).

4) How much resources: If it’s got at least 128 MB of RAM, it should have enough to run any type of Linux install, typically with the KDE or Gnome Graphical User Interface (GUI). For older machines with 64-MB or less, you may want one of the less resource-hogging GUI’s like IceWM or XFCE4.

I’ve seen people claim to use 386’s and 486’s as firewalls, printer servers, etc., using distros like damnsmalllinux. I strongly suspect they’re running it off the command line, rather than trying to use a GUI.

The trick is: YOU DO NOT *NEED* TO INSTALL a graphical user interface. You can run the system from the shell command line.

5) Time to surfing the net: With Knoppix, the time it takes to boot up, plus the time it takes to entering in the info to connect to your ISP. With a full installation, possibly a couple of hours until it installs all the software on your system.

***

I strongly recommend that if you have ANY problems, you surf over to Linuxquestions.org and do a little bit of searching. You’ll probably find that someone had a similar problem to yours, and got a solution.

Good luck, and enjoy Linux!

live cd..

In reply to Home XP, Office – W2K

every distro has one.
mandriva’s is called move
knoppix, gnoppix are both debian based
suse has one.
linspire, used to be lindows.
xandros, is designed to be linspire like, give you the shroom treatment. 😉
( ms guru special, point and click limited use extremely windows like )

full mandriva, red hat download, 3 cdroms.
( one dvd if that option suits )
full install, of approximately 5 gigs of apps from 3 cdroms, on a p4 /athlon xp in the 2ghz with 256 mb ram, is 2 hours, rebooting after the install into newly installed os, online. yes, set the internet to network connection and dhcp ( most common connection types ) then reboot from installation program, you are online before you finish bootup sequence.

mandriva has full configuration after install, but before reboot, including default display settings, booloader options.

after fighting red hat for 7 hours, I’ll never actually use them again. ( to change from one distro to red had, competely rebilding partition table, 7 hours…14 full installs, finally get a bootable system..1 hour, back to old distro, bootable, everything running…no more red hat for me )

Linux at Home

In reply to live cd..

I actually loaded Linux SuSE 9.2 on an extra box at home because we have a server at work that runs SuSE 8.1. What I am finding about Linux is, you really need the time to tinker with it. If you are looking for something that will work right out of the box, Linux probably isn’t the choice. I was able to do most of the complicated IMO, stuff quite easily. I downloaded a mini installation iso, then ftp the remainder and was yes, up and surfing in no time, but the simple task of adding a network printer has consumed an enormous amout of time. This could be directly related to the distro I choose, but even so, when you have to download new versions of Samba, CUPS and so on, it can get to be an issue. I am by no means finished with Linux. Just pondering at this point the amount of time needed to get 1 box running

Network printer issues?

In reply to Linux at Home

Is it an off brand? Did you not have the driver? Usually CUPS is quite good at dealing with networked printers as long as you have the proper driver.

Sure, wonky ports can be a firewall issue, but for the most part no biggie.

Network printer issues

In reply to Network printer issues?

Nope, not an off brand. HP Deskjet 3840. Must be the wonky ports issue, cause everything looks great on the printer side, but somehow the job never gets to the printer. I haven’t given up yet, but am getting close *G*

Not aquanted with that model

In reply to Network printer issues

but MANY HP printers don’t like to work over a network AT ALL.

I think HP wants you to get the big networked printers or get a printer for each system.

Looking that the HP site, they don’t mention Linux at all. Didn’t see much on network setup either.

Have you called HP? On a new printer they will answer your questions and help you out.

I don’t know that model either

In reply to Network printer issues

Why don’t you create a samba share for the printer?

How?

In reply to I don’t know that model either

This issue interests me greatly.

I run various flavours of Windows, plus RedHat (unimpressed), Mandrake, (better) SuSE, (good) and Xandros (dogs danglies!). I tried Ubuntu too, but consider it a work in progress compared to Xandros.

As part of an upgrade I’m trying to perform, I investigated possible home printer options that would run on Linux and Windows. Ideally, the printer would be capable of home photograph quality and be able to print CD’s directly, along with the normal text chores that we have come to expect.

Epson produce a suitable machine, but on e-mailing their technical support, was told, they have no plans to support or release Linux drivers. My own (cheap) Lexmark machine that is past retirement date, refuses to run in any Linux variant.

So, is it possible to set it up as a share, without needing drivers within Linux?

If it can, this of course could be the answer to the new printer I want to purchase.

If you don’t have the driver you may be hosed

In reply to I don’t know that model either

However, I’ll bet money there is an open source driver for the printer somewhere in the ether. You just need to dig it up. I would also bet that a similar driver that is availble will work just fine.

The problem with manufactures is that they don’t understand Linux and don’t understand why you could possibly need a driver 😉

On that note: Go for a supported product by the vendor. Why? Let the vendors that don’t make Linux drivers know they are morons.

is it

In reply to Network printer issues

a psc? ( aka all in one? )
then you need the hpoj package to drive it properly.
( hp supplied drivers for thier all in ones for linux, won’t hurt if you have it and are using an hp printer )

cups is a networked print server, so unless you told cups that it’s not allowed to connect to the network, only use loopback for printeing as soon as it’s installed ( the printer ) then any system running cups should be able to find and use the printer.

Home & home office

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I’ve started using Linux with the eventual hope to move away from MS.

From all I’ve gleened thus far- Linux has all you’d need to run it at home w/o very much trouble at all- if you have wired cable for internet.

Dial-up support is sketchy as most internal or on-board telephone modems were optimized for MS only (though you can get them to work w/tweaks it’s not a skill of most new users). The workaround to this is to search for a Linux known- to- work external modem.

On the business side, I’d say the hardest thing would be interoperability between the MS programs that Windows users would have & what you would have on a plain-jane Linux install.

Xandros OCE is a good starter distribution (distro) & has just about anything you could want in included software. Open Office can work with MS Office documents, Gimp is a Linux alternative to Photoshop, Gaim is the Linux program for IM. Skype has been released for Linux, as well. There are also Linux programs like CrossOverOffice which allows for the install of MS Office on a Linux system.

I don’t personally use these programs to interact in an office environment so I can only speak to their use as stand-alone programs on my own in-house system. All work fine.

For my personal likes, I’d say it has to be BeatrIX Linux ( http://www.watsky.net ). Here’s why:

small, uses little resources, & is very fast & lean. You can run the liveCD & then decide if you’d like it as an install or dual-boot w/MS.

BeatrIX is Debian Linux-based. You can, after installing, run apt-get to then install Synaptic “package manager”- which essentially sets you up with a graphical “software shopping center” that allows you to peruse & to try/add all sorts of neat software.

You end up with only the programs you need & nothing else. I installed it to a 4GB old drive I had onto an Epia mini-itx 5000 w/512mb sdram. It’s fast!

I added Synaptic & then installed Mplayer & Xmms for my own use. Fabulous!

Tracy ;^)

Wireless?

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I would like to add a side branch in regard to Linux wireless. What cards are used? What Linux flavors have been used successfully with wireless? What tools have worked well with wireless?

As wireless seems to be the achilees heel for Linux, please share your successes.

wireless = ndiswrapper and Orinoco cards

In reply to Wireless?

If you have a D-Link card, buy a new one…not only are they junk, but they have various driver issues in both Windows and Linux.

For a list of cards check
http://www.linux-wlan.org/docs/wlan_adapters.html.gz

The prism chipset (save for d-link) seems to be fine as well as the Orinoco chipset. Keep in mind the wireless card will work in Linux, but it will use the Windows driver. So if it has crappy drivers (like D-Link) you’re not gonna have a good time.

NDISwrapper seems to be the most supported way to make wireless work in Linux. It isn’t hard, but there are still things to work out.

As far as I know any modern distro will support NDISwrapper. However, I highly suggest Fedora Core 3 or 4, SuSe, Ubuntu, Gentoo (which is VERY good with wireless), or perhaps Debian (although I’m not sure where they are on their wireless support anymore).

I’ll post a ndiswrapper setup tutorial in my blog..

Not only Wireless; Modems!

In reply to Wireless?

Modems also seem to be an on going concern within Linux.

It doesn’t affect me directly, as I use an external Modem/Router into a network card with zero problems, but many people that wish to try Linux get bogged down and disillusioned at being unable to set-up Internet access.

Hardware manufacturers of all types really should wakeup and smell the coffee.

the problem is

In reply to Not only Wireless; Modems!

that most newer modems are “winmodems” and are designed to use windows to drive them.
linmodems.org has a list of supported modems, tools to find out if your modem is actually supported and the kernel patches to drive a winmodem.

problem is, adding the module to the kernel is not for the new user.

Coffee, Part iii

In reply to Not only Wireless; Modems!

“Hardware manufacturers of all types really should wakeup and smell the coffee.”

I think part of the hardware/software/network admin porblems is that they would like to see a religion-less linux, as well as be able to hook to linux withour having to write different installs for various distros.

well, since you mention it..

In reply to Coffee, Part iii

you can write just one install for all distros.
code to meet lsb spec.

since most device drivers are kernel level code, they’ll be stored in /dev
they’ll be used as kernel modules,
the distro-centric stuff is for the user space rather than system space of the os.

hp’s hpoj for thier all in one’s for linux goes into /dev as it’s the driver data for a device.
some network cards came with linux drivers
( I know I have a few copys of linux specific drivers for some cards )

ok, my crystal ball is cloudy

In reply to well, since you mention it..

I was speculating on that part. I have heard that there are file structure differences between Red Hat/Fedora/Debian/Slackware/Mandreake/Gent00 etc (or maybe I was just reading out-of-date threads).

L

it’s not really

In reply to ok, my crystal ball is cloudy

filesystem structural differences so much as storing config data different locations.

the standard for linux is:

http://www.linuxbase.org/

the filesystem:
( with my own interpretation of it for windows users 😉 )

http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-11185-0.html?forumID=90&threadID=177260&start=0

The impression I get

In reply to Coffee, Part iii

whenever I have approached manufacturers for Linux information is, they really don’t want to get involved.

Whether that is because Linux would (currently) be a very small customer base, or perhaps because of a lack of expertise, it’d difficult to say.

But in a way, it’s a “chicken and egg” situation. Until manufacturers bite the bullet and provide support for Linux (even if that just means making sufficient data available for drivers to be written by the community), it will always struggle to become main stream.

When you stop to think about it, is it not a nonsense that Windows drivers have to be reverse engineered, to enable Linux drivers to be written? Surely manufacturers can do better than that!

OK. I’m just one person – a drop in the marketing ocean, but all equipment I now buy, has to be Windows AND Linux compatible. Sadly, there are too few of us!

well I agree in most respects.

In reply to The impression I get

but I don’t care if it works in windows or not.I REQUIRE it to work in linux.
if it don’t I don’t buy it.

if you

In reply to Wireless?

have not bought the wireless card, see if you can find one that uses bluetooth.
the bluez packages for it work well.

I’ve not gone wireless, but I’ve seen it working very well with blue tooth devices.

Running as a HomePC

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

As a Home PC –

Primary reason – To enhance knowledge and having a practical ground with me.
2. For fun playing games,listning music etc.
3. Exploring the net.
4. Little bit of programming.

Mostly used softwares : Mozilla for net access. Kdevelop for practicing “C/++” A little of Openoffice for some documentation.Also some multimedia applications for music/videos.

In community the likehood of linux as Desktop Pc is rare. But it is almost found installed on every pc of a person who has a learning background (Computers)

This is on newer system (Celeron 2.4G/845/80GB)
Have had some hardware issues but resolved sucessfully (Adsl modem/Sound).

Reply To: Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I don’t know if I would go as far as to say “RUN” one, but yes. I use one.

Actually, in my house and at work, where I’m learning it. It’s a little more like this…

Close your eyes and imagine this sight:

(well read it first, then close your eyes)

Either a 10 year old child, or a small chick trying to walk a big huge ass dog and is actually being dragged by the dog instead…

That’s more of me and *nix…

Though I will say that I like Ubuntu as of right now. Very nice.

Soon enough I will start to try Debian as well.

Tried RedHat and Fedora, no like.

Mandrake – as bad as the top two.

Unbuntu is quite nice.

FreeBSD – I couldn’t tell up from down. WAY too much for me too fast.

Learning though. It’s hard when you’ve been retarded by Windoze for so long that trying to switch is a tad bit tricky. I’m teaching my kids Linux first, then Windoze.

My wife hates the idea, but tough. She can marry another G33K then… ;p

nyuck nyuck…

Yes Linux Rocks!

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I have several Linux Desktops.

I got tired of my kids getting spyware, malware, and virus’.

They use Xandros, Mandrake9.2, Ubuntu, Fedora Core3, Vector, and Puppy Linux.

I like Puppy myself, it will run on almost any hardware. It will run on low end machines, no hard drive needed.

The kids play games/music, research homework.

Open office: is real nice, XMMS audio player,works real well for MP3s and OG files, streaming audio,etc…

Gaim: will let you chat using any of your favorite chat clients.

Gcombust: is a real nice CD/DVD burner.

Gimp: can do just about anything with a graphic file that you want.

You pretty much have your choice of desktops, depending which distro that you use.

Every distro has a problem or two, but with a little research in the forums it can be worked out.

I like Linux because I’m more in control of how the computer looks and runs, usually much faster on a lot less machine than Win***s.

Well I hope this helps.

No problems with SuSe linux pro.

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I run triple boot 98se/xp/suse 9.1 pro on a fast AMD PC ( it used to be an overclocked P-iv but that failed!).
1/ Linux loads faster than 98se, but slower than XP.
2/ Linux is easier, faster to install and set up than either 98se or XP.
3/ Linux gives no hardware problems, unlike XP.
4/ If you don’t give root access you can even let kids have their own account. they can’t mess it up like XP or 98se.
5/ Cost..a/ less expensive PCs and b/ My Suse set up would cost well over ?1000 for MS software.
It cost ?52 from http://www.dabs.com
6/ Whilst I see several virus infected e-mails each day in Windows, I have never even seen an Linux one, apart from on a CD that has loads of virus samples, win and linux.
Mike Orton

hey!!

In reply to No problems with SuSe linux pro.

can I get a copy of that linux virus?
even after a decade of using linux I’ve never caught meself a linux virus.

Home System – SuSE 9.1

In reply to Do you run a linux DESKTOP?

I Use an old PII-266 laptop with 256Mb RAM with SuSE 9.1 simply for surfing the web wirelessly. I don’t really use it for anything else at the moment. The biggest pain in the backside was configuring wireless and maintaining connectivity with my router. It was rather a protracted process identifying a chipset that would work with the O/S and then getting hold of a wireless card with that chipset. Now it’s all configured and works fine. It takes a while to boot, but once KDE is up and running it provides me with a quick wireless internet connection I can use anywhere in the house. I am thinking of buying a 64-bit box and banging SuSE 9.3 on it as it sounds like it should be a flying machine, so I can then migrate my data crunching activities from Windows XP.

SuSE 9.2

In reply to Home System – SuSE 9.1

DO you have KDE 3.3 installed? I found it increased onsite boot times a bit.

Check the Novell/Suse site, I THINK they have KDE 3.3 for v.9.1 if you don’talready have it installed.

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