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March 2, 2002 at 8:25 am #2120249
How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
Lockedby nonamecharlie · about 22 years, 1 month ago
Looking to switch jobs. I thought I had decent resume but looking at what is required nowadays..basic laundry lists of required skills.
” Must know Novell, NDS, Active Directory, NT, Perl scripting, C++, Oracle ERP, CISCO switches. Required CNE, MSCE, CCNP. Linux and J2EE skills a plus.”
I am confident in my ability to master all those, just not in 1 lifetime.
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March 2, 2002 at 9:02 am #3422057
yup
by road-dog · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
I’ve noticed the trend also, but from the other side. Historically, I’ve been a layer 3 and below black belt. Nowdays, that that isn’t enough.
Clients want the whole kit and kaboodle in one guy. I’ve learned Microsoft in self defense to grow intothe req’s that I’m seeing.
What happened to the days when client/server and networking/telecom were separate?
I’ve had to put CCIE on hold for a year to tweak servers.
And yes, we need more of the fairer sex in this field. It’s looking toomuch like a Star Trek convention….
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March 3, 2002 at 7:29 am #3421901
Avenue best to pursue
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to yup
Well, I do meet the fairer sex from time to time but they aren’t really all that fair(are you picking up what I’m throwing down?). So I might as well talk about table saws and Trucks.
Star Trek was fun to watch but it was just a TV show. William Shatner is much more fun to watch on those Price Line commercials.
Do I learn Unix? Go for CCNA? Get my CCA? Commit to CNE? Dabble in C++/Java just to be on the safe side? And what the world is Blue Martini?
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March 3, 2002 at 12:41 pm #3421850
Life is too short
by road-dog · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to Avenue best to pursue
Decide what you like best. Build your core competencies around that facet of this industry. When you feel like you?ve gotten as good at that as you need to be for that next year or so, then branch out to your second and third priority facets. If youfind that you need to side track on occasion, that?s fine. Specialization is for insects.
Technology is moving too quickly to keep abreast of all things at all times.
Stick to what you like as much as you can….This has worked for me.
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March 2, 2002 at 10:20 am #3422041
Brain Relief Valve.
by admin · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
I swear that when it’s full you put something else in & it spits something else out. Some days it pays more to remember how to find information quickly than to remember it all.
As for the laundry list, one of the things that may be behind this, at least for some companies, is not mastery, but a dedication and commitment that is a bit above your standard vocationally retrained out of work person forced to get off
of government benefits. If you can prove you have what it takes, some companieswill swap time in the field and even help you get the certs you need.🙂
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March 3, 2002 at 7:18 am #3421903
Unrealistic reqs. on nonsuperman folk
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to Brain Relief Valve.
I wasn’t being facetious when I made that laundry list. It’s just that one person cannot be all those things..programmer, network analyst, system engineer, database administrator..those are all different disciplines. Each of them requiring a different sort of brain. Yes, they all are IT but a podiatrist can’t fix a migraine.
It is not about the certification but ensuing frustration that the more you learn, the less you know.
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March 4, 2002 at 12:16 am #3572702
But the Podiatrist could benefit from
by admin · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to Unrealistic reqs. on nonsuperman folk
learning some things about migranes. To me it is not frustrating, but rather exciting that the more you learn the less you know. I think this is the point where we begin understanding that infinity goes in all directions.
Having said that, in the reality of getting a job, I know of HR departments that essentially put up near impossible standards so that they can pick and choose who they really want to help “bend” into the criteria. With all the laws regarding hiring, this has been one way thatsome companies still screen people out who may have quite similar non superhuman qualities to the person that actually gets the job.I guess I see in the real world, that most applicants as well as the people that land these jobs often fall short and I’m ok with myself falling short too. I also think that while this field is too complex for one person to intimately know everything, that there is still a place for generalists who cross disciplines and creatively enter new territories.
This sounded more like the laundry list to me…. an MD who would send you to a specialist for the migraine or the podiatry. I could obviously have been mistaken though.
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March 5, 2002 at 4:19 am #3437152
If you have the list you stil deselected
by slaptop · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to But the Podiatrist could benefit from
I’ve done just about everything at all levels on all platforms/networks.
Guess what…..when I applied and told them what I’ve achieved and knowledge I’ve amassed….first they didn’t believe me..when I proved I have the knowledge, they asked me….how old are you…when I told them 47 (thats how old you’d need to be to cram it all in) they informed me they wanted a “dynamic” ‘player’ who’d fit in well with the team.
So I didn’t get the job. Do you think they wanted a game playing kid who somehow knew everything but also fitted into a “dynamic” team who knew nothing?
So I have to dumb down my CV but still put all the acronyms in and take 20 years off the experience level. -
March 5, 2002 at 4:37 am #3437141
What a riot!
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to If you have the list you stil deselected
Gee, were you able to have a life in the process? I could master all those requirements but I would never see daylight as IT people are usually placed in the dungeon.
Well, in their defense, a good fit is important. I’ve seen enormously talented people done in by their inability to work with others. Difficult people (not saying you, of course) can really drag down a department.
I bet you were over qualified and they thought you would leave all the team members behind in the dust!
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March 5, 2002 at 10:14 am #3436949
I COULD do that too!
by road-dog · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to What a riot!
….if I were to lock myself in a small room with a bed, a computer and a library. I would need a 55 gallon drum of coffee per week, keep slipping pizzas under the door. see you in about 3 years.
I know a guy that can go to sleep with a documentation CD in his pillowcase and wake up smarter. That kills me.
I have test anxiety so bad that I make hundreds of flash cards, cram until I look like the unabomber, and stare at the ceiling all night the evening before a test. I usually do quite well on the tests, but I cannot help it.
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March 5, 2002 at 1:07 pm #3436866
Good Points
by fluxit · about 22 years ago
In reply to What a riot!
More often than not difficult people are not the IT people.
Certs and Education are just filter items. When you don’t have them they can’t pay you as much. When you have them you are over qual’d and they can’t pay you what you are worth.
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March 5, 2002 at 7:30 am #3437038
Infinity Goes Both Ways
by admin · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to If you have the list you stil deselected
Yes, well, that’s true too. Some HR departments require dumbing down. My first job out of college I didn’t get after being told that they had hired all the people they needed. I immediately re-applied for the same job without listing my degree and went to work immediately for them. I actually remember being scared to death that they would find out and after a while they called me into the office with frowns – I thought I was had – but what they wanted to tell me, it turned out, was that somehowthey had found out that I was a teamster member (Inactive- I had joined for a job before college in another state) and wanted to make sure that I understood that they would allow no “Union Talk” or “Organizing Employees” from me! I even eventually ran into the same woman in HR that did the original interview and she obviously didn’t remember… sooooo… yep. I guess the trick is to find out what each company needs. 🙂
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March 5, 2002 at 9:57 am #3436959
Isn’t Illegal to ask for someones age
by uncle ramus · about 22 years, 1 month ago
In reply to If you have the list you stil deselected
I thought it was illegal to ask for someones age in an interview. Correct me if I am wrong but you may have some legal recourse.
Uncle Ramus
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March 6, 2002 at 2:26 am #3436028
AGE…
by fluxit · about 22 years ago
In reply to Isn’t Illegal to ask for someones age
Age has little to do with the job other than if you are of legal age to work or retire. I am not an attorney but if posed this this type of question in an interview ask them, “How does this relate to executing the job?” or throw in some humor like Reagan did in his debates. Say something like, “Well I was hoping that age was not going to be an issue and I certainly would not want to exploit my competitions (inexperience/senility as the case may be) for employment purposes.”
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March 6, 2002 at 3:56 am #3435997
Age math
by generalist · about 22 years ago
In reply to If you have the list you stil deselected
“Wanted: Person with thirty years of experience on multiple platforms/languages that haven’t been around for more than 5 years. People over 30 need not apply.”
While I haven’t seen any ads using the above phrasing, I believe that you could construct such an ad based on the requirements some companies appear to have. What they are looking for is a JOAT geek that has been working with computers since age 3 and lacks anything that might be considered a social life. Such a person would be willing to pay to work with all the hardware/software because it is their life.
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March 6, 2002 at 12:47 pm #3438236
No age discrimination, just looks count
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years ago
In reply to Age math
I don’t think age matters as much as looking the part. If you look like a computer geek or a middle-aged guru, I think you are in the door. Of course geek speak helps too. Even if you are really blowing hot air, enough acronyms and you can confuse people into hiring you.
The added touch is the PDA belt clip.
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March 7, 2002 at 6:09 am #3436252
Uh, OK
by road-dog · about 22 years ago
In reply to No age discrimination, just looks count
You mean that if I show up for an interview with a Star Trek uniform or other such birth control apparel I’m in, right??
I have been doing this all SO wrong.
Shopping list:
1) pocket protector
2) eyewear by Coca Cola
3) tape for glasses
4) highwater pants
5) belt clip for laptop.Oh I am SO in there!!! 😉
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March 7, 2002 at 6:36 am #3436239
I didn’t say look like Erkel!
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years ago
In reply to No age discrimination, just looks count
🙂
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April 10, 2002 at 8:38 am #3661760
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March 5, 2002 at 12:48 pm #3436884
JURASSIC 500…
by fluxit · about 22 years ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
Once I spoke with a partner in a CPA firm who claimed he could do it all in accounting. Yet when client needs were not inline with his specialty he referred them to other CPAs. He could not appraise equipment and do business valuations, as he was not certified to do those things. This went even further as he knew everything about business because he saw it all. Yet he was often lost in business issues and spoke in circular language with hollow enthusiasm.
This mindset carries into other companies, as other CPA’s tend to have a near similar way of thinking. CPA’s often are critical decision makers when hiring IT people and are just as unrealistic. I have attempted to impart that IT is a team of not just computer geeks.
Also because of the rapid growth of information technologies, a high degree of dinosaurs are in industry. It amazes me when I hear people remarks they want nothing to do with information technology. These people need to be flushed out of the system and that may take 2 or more generations.
I am actually considering getting out of IT even though I like it because of the unrealistic expectations such as these of employers. I have begun building a business of my own and encourage you to do the same.
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March 6, 2002 at 1:01 am #3436095
Own business is scary but IT stinks
by nonamecharlie · about 22 years ago
In reply to JURASSIC 500…
The driving force behind my question is probably burnout. I like IT. I’ll miss it but … there has to be a better way.
Have my own side/hobby business as well..it’s a challenge but its limit is only my own hang ups.
Like to know how you arecoping with your.
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March 6, 2002 at 1:33 pm #3438229
Self employment…
by fluxit · about 22 years ago
In reply to Own business is scary but IT stinks
I too am really burnt on IT. Not because of my own drive but because people have burnt me out with thier silly antics. Going to work is like dealing with the keystone cops – a bunch idiots bumbling their where along.
There are many things we are great at and many
things people need. I have developed several concepts, formed a company, and I have begun to pursue something in which I leverage others labor. It can be done on my off time.At 40 I have decided to focus more on my personal life and have fun. I may not make the money but that is okay. Eventually I want to be in a self employed status.
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March 5, 2002 at 12:55 pm #3436874
LIVE LIFE first
by fluxit · about 22 years ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
Start your own company and design to support a life style you desire. You have the requiste IT skills to leverage technology effectively and reduce your cost. do something you like. It does have to be in IT.
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March 5, 2002 at 9:18 pm #3438696
Faustus
by ferocious · about 22 years ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
If you ever read the story of Dr. Faustus, who had every pHD and sold his soul to the devil since he had done everything else, then equate that with unrealistic expectations. In my life, I have been a water chemist, truck driver, landscaper, PC technician, MCSE, fence builder, house renovator, network technician…though not all at once. Focus on your strengths to get the job and supplement them with what you believe will benefit the company first and you second.
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March 7, 2002 at 5:23 am #3436272
Pick and Pray
by green team · about 22 years ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
I’m pretty convinced that you’ve got to pick a discipline, stick with it, and pray for the best. A jack of all trades and master of none can leave gaping security holes, poor (or no) documentation, and every other potential pain in the butt you canthink of behind him that someone else will have to come in and clean up.
If you aren’t getting the results you want then learn new skills or bail out of the industry. You can’t fight it. Once ‘they’ know you’re in IT you are fair game for any question under the sun having to do with any electrical device you can think of. Sometimes that sucks. A company posting a job description that diverse has no clue.
I personnally have no desire to keep up with the technology the rest of my life- too much stress.
I recommend starting to sew your own parachute. Do your job the best you can and start putting together other options and streams of income on the side. If you don’t, you will be a very weary individual 10 years from now.
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March 10, 2002 at 7:44 am #3436530
Usually, they settle for less
by caginay · about 22 years ago
In reply to How much info can you stuff in 1 brain?
Even though we see job ads with qualification listings that could be a small booklet, generally it’s best to apply anyways.
Let them decide that you are not qualified not you.
Some cases they list the canidate they hope to get but also settle forwhat is realistic out of the resumes they get.
I’d apply anyway, not getting hopes up too high but also leaving that door open ..(Just in Case…….)
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