Questions

MSE on W7 Starter?

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0 Votes
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MSE on W7 Starter?

Who Am I Really
I'm in a situation of rebuilding an acer w7 netbook for someone who got royally hosed by IE targeted Malware

starting with a factory reset from the recovery partition

next is getting the win crapdates installed and putting security in place


is MSE possible?
is MSE of any Use?
etc.

I can't find the relevant info on the MSE page

all it says is:
- w-XP 32
- w-vista 32/64
- w7 32/64

no indication as to whether it will work with w7 starter or not.
  • +
    0 Votes
    OH Smeg

    But I seem to remember something from somewhere that MSE wasn't designed to work with Windows 7 Starter.

    I may be wrong but that is what I dimly remember.

    Col

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    I don't normally do any work on / with vista or w7
    as I run a specialty operation and actually can't use any versions past XP
    the HW & SW is not compatible at all with vista / w7

    but it's hard to say no, to:
    (puppy dog eyes) "can you fix it?"

    and since the system has a recovery partition,
    - I figured "simple task, right?"
    - - Hah!
    - it took 45 minutes just to complete the factory restore (poor thing was working its guts out)

    they had AVG but it obviously didn't do the job

    I though of MSE because for a while, MS was always pushing it whenever you visited one of their pages

    +
    0 Votes
    santeewelding

    Except for time downloading, since it's free.

    If it's not compatible, a klaxon will sound and a warning will issue for you to take cover.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    it has the trial of Mc(Bloat, 8+ High Priority Processes)Afee

    if I remove it the only way to get it back is to start from scratch again from the recovery partition

    and problem is installing AV while another AV is installed / running

    if it's not compatible, any suggestions?

    they had AVG but still got hosed so I'm not recommending AVG again

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    0 Votes
    seanferd

    Not every AV can catch everything all the time.

    And the trial will die eventually, so what about an adjunct to an AV like MBAM paid version?

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    the owner of this netbook,
    got it for free from the ISP
    with a 2 or 3 year subscription / contract

    with no prior experience, and someone else "Helped out" by installing AVG Free

    having been in computers since before the first virus and being around while the DOS viruses were to be feared
    I never once got a virus on any of my systems

    from the 80386 to the current system I use

    the office where I work uses Mc(bloat)Afee VSE on the workstations and I've never once in the last 7 years seen "On My workstations" the OAS window pop up on a real virus / malware etc.

    only on the EICAR test
    - which I use to show people what the VSE OAS dialog looks like

    and on "PUPs", which were a couple of Steve Gibson's old tools I still had on a USB stick:
    - LeakTest.exe
    - DCOMBOB.exe


    I will be giving some "Web Safety" instruction,
    combined with
    setting up Firefox and adding to it:
    - NoScript
    - AdBlock Plus
    - FlashBlock

    +
    0 Votes
    seanferd

    So, the AV isn't just a trial version then, but a subscription? Ah.

    Never really cared for McAfee myself, either. I wonder if is improving at all under Intel.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    the Mc(Bloat)Afee has a 60 day trial before you have to pay them for it to continue using it,
    if you don't pay them it deactivates itself, quits updating, and doesn't give warnings etc.
    until you pay them or remove it an install something else
    you'll no longer have a functioning AV at the end of the 60days

    same goes for the MSO 2007 60 day trial installation

    this system is packed with pre-installed OEM crud designed to get your money

    +
    0 Votes
    Sue T

    I've been using AVG and installing it on alot of home user computers for years and never got a virus. I would be more inclined to say the user wasn't making sure it was updated and or was just not using any common sense. Also, last I read IE is more secure than Firefox, as I tell my users - nothing is totally secure and you always need to use common sense. And especially, if a window pops up saying you have been infected, if that window isn't showing the name of your anti virus then for goodness sakes do not click on it. have a great day.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    Thanks for the reply:

    My original question was about using MSE on win7 Starter, not AVG


    as to whether or not IE is safer than Firefox
    is subjective to how they are configured

    However, last time I checked:

    Firefox with:
    > NoScript
    > AdBlock Plus
    > FlashBlock

    is better than IE in "strangled for security mode"

    I try to tell people that:
    - if a site can't give you at least it's text & maybe images without scripting it or using flash,
    then move on because it's not worthy of your attention until you know it's a legitimate site,

    and there's just no excuse to stick normal text inside scripts,

    Sure go ahead and script the formatting if you want, but don't stick the actual text content inside the scripts or flash so that I can't see it without punching a hole in my security
    that's bad web design etiquette

    I also try to tell people:
    that when visiting an unknown site not to go off allowing everything right away;

    ie.
    to visit and participate on TR I only need to "allow" the base .com.com domain and the site functions so I can participate,
    same goes for ZDNet, I only need to "allow" zdnet.com and the site is functional

    and the last time I checked
    you can't selectively allow like that with IE, because the "allow scripts" popups don't tell you where the scripts are coming from

    and in order to make IE "Safer" you have to use custom "internet options" settings because the default settings are wide open to: "Hey come get me I'm visiting your site with IE"
    that will toast you every time

    I've configured IE6, IE7, and IE8, with custom security settings and it's nearly unusable and becomes more unusable with each version

    try just this sample of what I change in IE:

    open internet options and change the security settings for the internet zone to "High"
    and only restore the "file download" option back to "enabled"

    next go to the advanced tab and remove the ticks for:
    - install on demand (ie)
    - install on demand (other)
    - enable third party browser extensions
    ...
    - play animations in web pages
    - play sounds in web pages
    - play videos in web pages

    then tick the following:
    - check for servers certificate revocation
    - check for signatures on downloaded programs
    - do not save encrypted pages to disk
    - empty Temporary Internet Files folder when browser is closed

    and untick:
    - use profile assistant

    next go to this page:
    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/913086

    and see how many
    yes / OK clicks
    you have to make before the page is loaded
    in IE

    whereas visiting the page in Firefox
    the text and links load but the scripting is blocked and the page and links are still usable

    in IE6 with the complete lock down settings that I use:
    it's a minimum of 7 clicks just to display the KB913086 page
    plus another 5 or 6 to use any of the links to the ISO files

    in IE7 with the complete lock down settings that I use:
    it's a minimum of 12 clicks just to display that page
    plus another 10 - 12 to open in a new tab of the links to the ISO files

    haven't bothered to test that page with IE8 "locked down" as I don't have an IE8 installation to test with
    I did however configure the IE8 on the system referred to in the question
    _ _

    as to AVG
    I tested it once back when it was 8.5x,
    and it reduced the system performance by at least 50%
    of the "no AV installed" config.
    which I ran for over a year because it was an isolated stand alone not connected to anything but line power workstation

    also, before the AVG installation,
    - I grabbed my old 1995 version of McAfee CD and pulled the EICAR test file from the documentation,
    and then;
    - I put the EICAR test file in various folders all over all the disks in the system
    as well as on various different removable media

    - most times when visiting a folder containing EICAR, the EICAR test file was ignored
    - about one in four times visiting an EICAR containing folder, it would popup saying it had found the EICAR test file and removed it
    - on demand scan of the system didn't find all the EICAR files, in fact it only found a small hand full of the 100 or so copies I scattered on the OS and data drives
    - and it didn't find the EICAR file on the removable media every time either


    Firefox Bare install is not as "secure" as when the security add-ons are installed

    but, there are more "IE targeted" malware etc. on sites than there are for Firefox
    plus there's not really any effective ways to make bandwidth robbing ads on pages to vanish with IE

    I have a Yahoo email account and with Firefox and:
    - NoScript
    - AdBlock Plus
    - FlashBlock

    I never see the ads and the network status indicator isn't constantly lit up like a search and rescue helicopter
    the inbox loads and the activity lights go out

    using IE for Yahoo mail the network status lights never go out because the ads are delivered on a revolver script constantly pulling content from ad servers and flipping the pages

    so there's my reasons for doing what I do and the way I choose to do it.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    MSE is installed and working
    on this win7 starter netbook
    (and I'm sending this post from it)

    main good news:
    -61 processes has been reduced to 57 after replacing the Mc(bloat)Afee trial with MSE

    Now on to the web safety training

    +
    0 Votes
    Sue T

    to mine was very good. It was really great of you to take the time to write all of that up and I am sure alot of people will find it very useful. Glad MSE worked for you. Have a great day and keep up the great work.

  • +
    0 Votes
    OH Smeg

    But I seem to remember something from somewhere that MSE wasn't designed to work with Windows 7 Starter.

    I may be wrong but that is what I dimly remember.

    Col

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    I don't normally do any work on / with vista or w7
    as I run a specialty operation and actually can't use any versions past XP
    the HW & SW is not compatible at all with vista / w7

    but it's hard to say no, to:
    (puppy dog eyes) "can you fix it?"

    and since the system has a recovery partition,
    - I figured "simple task, right?"
    - - Hah!
    - it took 45 minutes just to complete the factory restore (poor thing was working its guts out)

    they had AVG but it obviously didn't do the job

    I though of MSE because for a while, MS was always pushing it whenever you visited one of their pages

    +
    0 Votes
    santeewelding

    Except for time downloading, since it's free.

    If it's not compatible, a klaxon will sound and a warning will issue for you to take cover.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    it has the trial of Mc(Bloat, 8+ High Priority Processes)Afee

    if I remove it the only way to get it back is to start from scratch again from the recovery partition

    and problem is installing AV while another AV is installed / running

    if it's not compatible, any suggestions?

    they had AVG but still got hosed so I'm not recommending AVG again

    +
    0 Votes
    seanferd

    Not every AV can catch everything all the time.

    And the trial will die eventually, so what about an adjunct to an AV like MBAM paid version?

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    the owner of this netbook,
    got it for free from the ISP
    with a 2 or 3 year subscription / contract

    with no prior experience, and someone else "Helped out" by installing AVG Free

    having been in computers since before the first virus and being around while the DOS viruses were to be feared
    I never once got a virus on any of my systems

    from the 80386 to the current system I use

    the office where I work uses Mc(bloat)Afee VSE on the workstations and I've never once in the last 7 years seen "On My workstations" the OAS window pop up on a real virus / malware etc.

    only on the EICAR test
    - which I use to show people what the VSE OAS dialog looks like

    and on "PUPs", which were a couple of Steve Gibson's old tools I still had on a USB stick:
    - LeakTest.exe
    - DCOMBOB.exe


    I will be giving some "Web Safety" instruction,
    combined with
    setting up Firefox and adding to it:
    - NoScript
    - AdBlock Plus
    - FlashBlock

    +
    0 Votes
    seanferd

    So, the AV isn't just a trial version then, but a subscription? Ah.

    Never really cared for McAfee myself, either. I wonder if is improving at all under Intel.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    the Mc(Bloat)Afee has a 60 day trial before you have to pay them for it to continue using it,
    if you don't pay them it deactivates itself, quits updating, and doesn't give warnings etc.
    until you pay them or remove it an install something else
    you'll no longer have a functioning AV at the end of the 60days

    same goes for the MSO 2007 60 day trial installation

    this system is packed with pre-installed OEM crud designed to get your money

    +
    0 Votes
    Sue T

    I've been using AVG and installing it on alot of home user computers for years and never got a virus. I would be more inclined to say the user wasn't making sure it was updated and or was just not using any common sense. Also, last I read IE is more secure than Firefox, as I tell my users - nothing is totally secure and you always need to use common sense. And especially, if a window pops up saying you have been infected, if that window isn't showing the name of your anti virus then for goodness sakes do not click on it. have a great day.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    Thanks for the reply:

    My original question was about using MSE on win7 Starter, not AVG


    as to whether or not IE is safer than Firefox
    is subjective to how they are configured

    However, last time I checked:

    Firefox with:
    > NoScript
    > AdBlock Plus
    > FlashBlock

    is better than IE in "strangled for security mode"

    I try to tell people that:
    - if a site can't give you at least it's text & maybe images without scripting it or using flash,
    then move on because it's not worthy of your attention until you know it's a legitimate site,

    and there's just no excuse to stick normal text inside scripts,

    Sure go ahead and script the formatting if you want, but don't stick the actual text content inside the scripts or flash so that I can't see it without punching a hole in my security
    that's bad web design etiquette

    I also try to tell people:
    that when visiting an unknown site not to go off allowing everything right away;

    ie.
    to visit and participate on TR I only need to "allow" the base .com.com domain and the site functions so I can participate,
    same goes for ZDNet, I only need to "allow" zdnet.com and the site is functional

    and the last time I checked
    you can't selectively allow like that with IE, because the "allow scripts" popups don't tell you where the scripts are coming from

    and in order to make IE "Safer" you have to use custom "internet options" settings because the default settings are wide open to: "Hey come get me I'm visiting your site with IE"
    that will toast you every time

    I've configured IE6, IE7, and IE8, with custom security settings and it's nearly unusable and becomes more unusable with each version

    try just this sample of what I change in IE:

    open internet options and change the security settings for the internet zone to "High"
    and only restore the "file download" option back to "enabled"

    next go to the advanced tab and remove the ticks for:
    - install on demand (ie)
    - install on demand (other)
    - enable third party browser extensions
    ...
    - play animations in web pages
    - play sounds in web pages
    - play videos in web pages

    then tick the following:
    - check for servers certificate revocation
    - check for signatures on downloaded programs
    - do not save encrypted pages to disk
    - empty Temporary Internet Files folder when browser is closed

    and untick:
    - use profile assistant

    next go to this page:
    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/913086

    and see how many
    yes / OK clicks
    you have to make before the page is loaded
    in IE

    whereas visiting the page in Firefox
    the text and links load but the scripting is blocked and the page and links are still usable

    in IE6 with the complete lock down settings that I use:
    it's a minimum of 7 clicks just to display the KB913086 page
    plus another 5 or 6 to use any of the links to the ISO files

    in IE7 with the complete lock down settings that I use:
    it's a minimum of 12 clicks just to display that page
    plus another 10 - 12 to open in a new tab of the links to the ISO files

    haven't bothered to test that page with IE8 "locked down" as I don't have an IE8 installation to test with
    I did however configure the IE8 on the system referred to in the question
    _ _

    as to AVG
    I tested it once back when it was 8.5x,
    and it reduced the system performance by at least 50%
    of the "no AV installed" config.
    which I ran for over a year because it was an isolated stand alone not connected to anything but line power workstation

    also, before the AVG installation,
    - I grabbed my old 1995 version of McAfee CD and pulled the EICAR test file from the documentation,
    and then;
    - I put the EICAR test file in various folders all over all the disks in the system
    as well as on various different removable media

    - most times when visiting a folder containing EICAR, the EICAR test file was ignored
    - about one in four times visiting an EICAR containing folder, it would popup saying it had found the EICAR test file and removed it
    - on demand scan of the system didn't find all the EICAR files, in fact it only found a small hand full of the 100 or so copies I scattered on the OS and data drives
    - and it didn't find the EICAR file on the removable media every time either


    Firefox Bare install is not as "secure" as when the security add-ons are installed

    but, there are more "IE targeted" malware etc. on sites than there are for Firefox
    plus there's not really any effective ways to make bandwidth robbing ads on pages to vanish with IE

    I have a Yahoo email account and with Firefox and:
    - NoScript
    - AdBlock Plus
    - FlashBlock

    I never see the ads and the network status indicator isn't constantly lit up like a search and rescue helicopter
    the inbox loads and the activity lights go out

    using IE for Yahoo mail the network status lights never go out because the ads are delivered on a revolver script constantly pulling content from ad servers and flipping the pages

    so there's my reasons for doing what I do and the way I choose to do it.

    +
    0 Votes
    Who Am I Really

    MSE is installed and working
    on this win7 starter netbook
    (and I'm sending this post from it)

    main good news:
    -61 processes has been reduced to 57 after replacing the Mc(bloat)Afee trial with MSE

    Now on to the web safety training

    +
    0 Votes
    Sue T

    to mine was very good. It was really great of you to take the time to write all of that up and I am sure alot of people will find it very useful. Glad MSE worked for you. Have a great day and keep up the great work.