Questions

Once in a while

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Once in a while

santeewelding
I encounter a one who has no clue to computer security. This, though they are involved increasingly and critically in important social, financial, and other ways.

I am not asking about standard technical arrangements. I am asking in my meager understanding of it all for how to lay it out in order to bring them along.

What I need from you is how to slam them up against a wall.

Like, saying, you are, "A babe in the wood. You are such a babe, that what I tell you will go over your head, and you not caring or knowing."

Further, something on the order of, "I am not your keeper."

Trouble is, I am. So are you.

How do you do it? How do you do it in your surreptitious way, and remain true and effective?

Could be said, don't you think, about a whole lot in life -- particularly to the younger, and, some older.
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People pick and internally justify security that aligns with their conveniences.

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santeewelding
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Does, or ought, it extend to the general case of people secure in their persons, houses, effects -- as well as "papers"?

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After protracted rumination, I bow to advice from a newly-joined organization. I can only express what works for me. It is a too-heady place, where one assumes to know what will work for others.

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AnsuGisalas
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certainly.

Ought? Probably not.

Difference is, we have these stories, the old kind - kid goes into the forest, talks to a stranger - and the next thing is they're seeing someone's gut from the inside. You know - educational ones. We have them still, but with more mundane faces on them. We "know" what we can expect to get away with in our neighbourhoods, and what we can't... we've heard it told in so many ways.

Not so much for computers... yet. Where are the writers when we need them? Where's "Hantzel and Grendel in the big Web?"
<font color="FFFFFF">yes, I know it's gretchen, usually</font>

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OH Smeg
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I have just finished cleaning a system after it's user opened a New Years Card which seems to have been the start of loosing his AV Program and most of the Malware Scanners.

As he does On Line Banking I had to take it part way seriously even though I have told him on numerous occasions that he shouldn't opening things just because they are there. I've also told him that some of the Web Sites that he visits are a Major Risk to Security but he constantly tells me it's a Computer and it's safe.

I constantly tell him that there are only 2 type of Computer Users those who have lost all of their Data and those who will loose all of their Data.

He's now wondering how he's going to pay me for this bit of work from New Years Eve till God only knows when. But it struck Home to him when I suggested that it may be a very good idea to ring his bank and suspend his current Password till he can attend a branch and reset it.

Now instead of him ignoring everything I say he's panicking and ringing every few hours asking what's happened so far. What's the Infection and can I clean it?

At least now he's beginning to see the need for security but I'm not sure that's it's an improvement.

Col

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santeewelding
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I don't ask the doc, "why" and "how". The doc doesn't have to offer, "You could stop smoking, you know."

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boxfiddler Moderator
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surreptitious. In your face is my thing. If they don't listen, I quit wasting 'my time'. Got tired a long time ago of getting the same computer back from the same people with the same problems.

Get it together, or go the f*** away. That's my motto, as to this kind of thing, anyhoo.

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santeewelding
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In your own face, too, I trow.

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seanferd
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Even people who know they are clueless and claim such (though they might find themselves slightly less clueless than they believe for five minutes of minor investigation every day) won't take instruction - they are used to doing things the same broken way they have always done.

Those who know better than you - lost cause, until something major proves them wrong, maybe.

It has taken me many years to get some folks to stop using the Admin account for normal use, even when some group members were on board. (It only takes one Admin account to trash it for everyone.)

I think my return question would be: What most motivates this person in regards to the situation? Fear? Curiosity? "Not having problems"?

Appeal to he person's motivations. Still, it might take forever.

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santeewelding
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Habituation, I think.

Notice that I used the word "computer" just once with respect to security. It was a relevant peg, given this place, on which to hang the question.

The question also holds for ideas, notions, habituations, proclivities,..in a general case. If you have ever tried to change your own, faced with writing on the wall, you get a sense of how deep it goes. Appealing to and jettisoning your own motivations ain't easy. It can be like selling your children.

Crisis might help. "Writing on the wall" is crisis anticipated (viz., national budgetary habituation). The writing is up to you. If you can't do it for yourself, how do you manage to do it for someone else?

Like you said: bit of a poser.

Admin account for self.