General discussion


Car Bombings

By Oz_Media ·
EVRY day we see more and more car bombings killing more and more people in Iraq. Certainly there are also people being shot by indurgent, raodside bombs and even suicide bombers.

One thing I thought last night when seeing how more people had died in a car bombing, WHY are there cars driving around in downtown Iraq?

Why haven't they COMPLETELY blocked off the city center and controlled who enters the city in a car and who doesn't?

Not in the sense of border patrols but just NO CARS IN DOWNTOWN BAGHDAD. People can walk, ride bicycles or roller skates or whatever but NO cars.

They even do this in downtown Vancouver on major event nights, Grey Cup, Stanley Cup , Fireworks etc. It is SHUT DOWN.

I haven't studied a street map of downtown Baghdad yet but I am sure it would at least reduce car bombings by removing a tool. Local deliveries etc. can be authorized at checkpoints right before entering the city, dogs can sniff bombs in a controlled envionment. It also reduces the amount of 'general' traffic that would go unnoticed.

Yss, it will inconvenience Iraqi's, they are also in the middle of a war which I am sure is a BIT of an inconvenience in iteself. I considered the freedom issue, this may be seen as removing freedoms, but they don't HAVE any freedoms YET, they are occupied by another country's military.

So I wonder why they would allow public trafic near police recruiting centers, government buildings etc.

I think they are trying to impose on them as little as possible but this is just allowing too much freedom of movement and leading to more lives lost. Just like protecting the president, they have to realize reedom of movement needs to be controlled.

Shut down traffic in downtown Baghdad, get rid of the cars, get rid of the car bombs.

I understand that there are issues elsewhere and cars in the middle east can't be stopped all together, but in key areas where attacks have ben continuous and constant, shut down th roads, regulate and control exactly who drives where and when, for what reason etc.

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Oddly Enough

by admin In reply to Fair enough

This in response to one of your earlier posts ... I find myself feeling very insecure in my own country with Bush at the helm. I say this because I tend to side with the republicans on most issues in the past. This president is bull headed and oblivious to what is going on around him ... my husband and I have decided to leave the states as even if he is removed from office, the mess that has been started is going to take years to clean up and it's going to get worse before it gets better ... so OZ when that opportunity to kick the man in the junk comes around ... I'll be in line right behind you for what this man has done in the 4 years he's been allowed to serve as our leader will be the United States undoing.


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Still With You

by rickkellogg In reply to Fair enough

One of the advantages these terrorists have over us is that only they know where they will strike next. So securing an area around a Police Station or Recruiting Office may secure that area. However, the people doing the bombing would quickly switch their targets to another area less secure.

My point is also pretty simple. Focus on training the Iraqi people and allow them to handle their own security. They have ways of finding things out that we as an occupying force will never master.

Again this is a Manpower problem. While we are training these Iraqi Police and Army over 100,000 so far, this process itself does furter tax our already limited resources.

I am confident in the command both here, and there, and am pretty certain the stratigist in the military have mapped out this process to the best of their ability ,with the resources they have to work with. The unfortunate trade off in this type of operation is that we will continue to suffer losses as we have until such time as the Iraqi Forces assume complete control of each area of the country.

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by Oz_Media In reply to Fair enough

I don't wanna get into a shouting match or something with you but your post shows you haven't understood my point AT ALL. Not at all, in fact your first paragraph tells me you and I are NOT talking about the same thing at all.

Why would securing a small area be efective if they are just going to move elsewhere and repeat the car bombs? This is your complaint.

Let Iraqi's BUILD thier OWN security and police force for this type of action. This is your resolution.

I AGREE! 100%

The car bombing CONCENTRATED on police recruiting centers is stopping the Iraqi's from forming a stable working police department, so that they will NEVER be able to stabilize thier OWN country unless they can train recruits.
This is the problem.

CLOSING off THAT SPECIFIC area to vehicle traffic, even if only at specific times of day when recruits are being accepted, lining up in the street etc. would completely ELIMINATE the ability to park a car bomb beside a lineup.
This is the solution.

For you to continually just say that concentrating on securing a certain area is not effective and that Iraq needs to build it's OWN force to police these issues is just completely disregarding what I am saying as it is impossible without first securing Iraq's own forces.

YES, the car bombs will go elsewhere, that's the WHOLE POINT, they will not be killing recruits en mass while lining up to enlist.

If the local US army recuiting office in your town was constantly car bombed, wouldn't eliminating cars and even monitorig foot traffic in that area be a good beginning?

During a concert, there are a group of security we post nicknamed GAB's, short for Got Anything Better, they control who gets backstage and who doesn't in order to protect the stage, equipment and artists. GAB's have heard EVERY story known to man, thus the term, Got Anything Better, because people will say anything to get backstage.

There are fights in the audience, fights in the parking lots, stabbings, shootings even, people getting run down in the street outside, overdoses and all kinds of horrible things go on around a concert. The artists, crew, stage, equipment and trucks are safe and the show continues bcause of the GAB's.

So why not post a few GAB's next time there are a few hundred hopeful recruits willing to sign up for the most dangerous job in Iraq? Put a barricade at a two block perimiter, allow AUTHORIZED foot traffic ONLY in that area.

The recruits can enlist, get trained (again with scheduled closing of the area) and be put into effect policing Baghdad. As it is they aren't even getting in the front door, how do you expect that they will be able to police thier own nation without any police?

If your response is going to be that they will just take car bombings somewhere else and that it is up to Iraqi's to police thier own city, please don't bother, I don't think I could take it again.

NOW as far as your number of 100,000 recruits so far. I have seen this number is WAY overinflated and was just an initial number of recruits enlisting. Apparently more than 40% of them are no onger in th eforce, either for failing a physical, having ties to terrorists, too young etc. So that would mean that the mumber is closer to 60,000.

Iraq doesn't have this grand force building up as Republuicans report, from what I have read and seen online and in tyhe news, it is FAR weaker, the recruits ar not dead set on ending terrorism and fighting for freedom as they are made out to be, most just want a paycheck from Iraq's most dangerous job.

It is also THESE men in particular that get killed 20, 40 more at a time with car bombs parked outside the recruiting centers.

They cannot build a force without protection.


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Iraqi Police

by go_browns_01 In reply to Fair enough

It's interesting that the U.S. is putting so much confidence in the Iraqi Police force. What is it they are suppose to do?

This was in an article about the retaking of the city of Tal Afar -
"A U.S. Army colonel handed out $200 bonuses -- the equivalent of about a month's salary -- to the 83 Tall Afar police officers who fought with the Americans; 517 others either deserted or joined the insurgents, U.S. military officers said. The Iraqis who switched sides included the police chief and his deputy, both of whom were detained by U.S. forces."

Is it acceptable to rely on only 14% of the police force to stay while the rest change sides?

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Today's reminder

by Oz_Media In reply to Car Bombings

"Two car bombs rocked central Baghdad on Monday morning, killing 21 people and wounding 85 others near the Green Zone, where many Iraqi ministry buildings and the U.S. and British embassies are situated.

The initial bomb targeted a recruiting center for the Iraqi national guard, an Iraqi police official said. The Health Ministry said 16 people died and 76 were wounded."

The Green zone, embassies and recruiting stations. WHY are there cars allowed to even go NEAR this area during such violent times? It isn't imperative, it isn't going to reduce the ability to receive supplies, it IS going to stop people CAR bombing these buildings anyway, perhaps mortar and other fire but not the same destructive power as a car bomb parked right outside.

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I think the US military should start using bullets with Pig blood on them

by Garion11 In reply to Today's reminder

Watch all the insurgents go back to their caves.

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Good point

by Oz_Media In reply to I think the US military s ...

I guess most former homes are caves now aren't they, whether insurgent's homes or not.

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What are you saying?

by Garion11 In reply to Good point

Can you please be clearer in your comments? Are you asking a question at the end of the first part of the sentence? "I guess most former homes are caves now aren't they, << Question or comment? Please clarify.

"Whether insurgent's homes or not" Please answer me first then we can continue this discussion...mmmKK thx.

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It was actually just a joke

by Oz_Media In reply to What are you saying?

I read our post right after reading on how the COW had destroyed several civillian homes while clearing out an area in Falluja. Apparently seven homes of confirmed 'normal' citizens were air struck and more than 7 children in them were killed.

So yes, I was agreeing that if they WERE sent home, it probably IS a cave now, instead of a home.

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by Garion11 In reply to It was actually just a jo ...

Were you sure it wasn't an insurgent's bomb? They are not killing their own citizens are they? *GASP* And you knew they were normal citizens how? Did the 7 children have AK-47s?? Cause I watch Arab TV and they are proud of the fact that their children are born with a gun and a grenade in their hands.

Yes, it is funny indeed.

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