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Gas Prices

By rkuhn ·
You know, I really just want to puke.

After reading the following two articles, I have come to the conclusion that the granola eating, hairy armpit, tree hugging crowd along with the professors, '60's flower power, and theoretical BS crowd just don't get it.

http://biz.yahoo.com/nytimes/080620/1194786578804.html?.v=19

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080619/sc_nm/fuel_efficiency_dc

I would agree as I think most would that we have to end our dependence on oil. For security reasons, for environmental reasons, for lots of reasons.

But what these people just don't get is that the rapid and largely unexplained raise in oil (gas, heating, electric...this is just the beginning) is killing the lower income crowd.

You know, as a hardcore independent, conservative (I'd be a Republican but they too like the Democrats have screwed everything up) I'd like to say "oh well, that's the free market".

But this is different. Poor people's lives are being screwed with. Imagine for a second (hopefully most of you are like me and aren't lower income, after all we are supposedly in a higher paying field). But imagine for a second that the one thing you can't do without (oil) is breaking the bank.

Imagine living in a city without a meaningful mass transit system. Imagine living in a city where your current home value has depreciated to the point where you can't move.

Imagine paying 20% of your income just to drive to work and keep the power on. Then, insult to injury...cereal, bread, milk...they all go up.

Imagine telling your son or daughter that there won't be any presents under the tree this year because all your present money went to some Saudi king.

What's next? Where's the next hurricane?

Imagine being a single parent with two kids making $30,000 a year. Imagine for a second.

What the **** have our "leaders" been doing for the last 30 years? It's time to kick them all out of office.

Where's the solar power? Nuclear? Where the **** is all the sources of power we need without paying the towel heads (sorry) all the money we give them so they can finance the guns, bombs and other crap to turn around and kill us?

I've had it. My ballot in November will be all write in's. No voting for the freaking Democrats or Republicans.

How did we get to this point? I'll tell you. We got here because all of our "leaders" are too busy being greedy, self serving and worthless. To them, it's not about what can I do for my country, it's about how many times they get get their ugly face on TV and how many special interest dollars they can get.

They need to stop talking and start getting something done.

I work my *** off for a living. I manage my house pretty darn well. All I ask is for our "leaders" to do the same.

P.S. Many books have been written about the next world war. It's not going to be about politics, nationality, race, whatever.

It'll be about resources. Prepare yourself.

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I didn't even post that time! LOl

by Oz_Media In reply to Again, double standards b ...

Oh no everyone, it's policeman Dan to the rescue. I don't know what these poor people without a voice would do without you. Just continue to send Tammy work, I am sure she thanks you for wasting her time.

I could go back and tag ALL of your posts as spam as you break rules in each and every one of them, but I don't want to inundate TR staff with work, they already know you are a loser and others don't bother with your BS anyway. Give me your worst, you are just wasting people's time and pi$$ing people off now, well done. I've seen this before, believe me crying wolf is not going to get you anywhere but eventually ignored for "Mrs. Posting", oops sorry, thats MISS posting to you.

Oh my god, you're an an easy one. I've seen far better here than you, you aren't even somewhat good at this.

But you just do what you feel is right for America and leave me out of it. Free the poor, helpless, voiceless people here from my wrath.

You being a moderator is as hypocritical and ridiculous as Firemarshall Bill giving fire safety tips. good luck with that.

"Offither Daniel! To the rethcue! Ith there a problem here, thir?" Yuk yuk yuk.

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You are taking this to far

by Tearat In reply to I didn't even post that t ...

There is no reason to keep poking someone

It is obvious you are doing it for your own sadistic pleasure
Time to stop the BS
Time to grow up

What you are doing lowers the opinion others have of you
Stop acting like a child

I know you can do better than that

Really some people
This is a public forum
There are other people reading this
The real subject is important

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Your alias is Techno Rat

by Oz_Media In reply to You are taking this to fa ...

Not TR.

If DanLM decides to follow me throughout every forum and comment on every post I make, whether with or against someone's comments, while telling me to fk off, calling me a bigot etc., he can take it right back on the nose.

I agree, nobody needs to read it and I also think he has gone way over the line, I oppose and agree to people's comments, that's what a discussion is all about, not simply being a yes man that agrees with everyone as he would expect one to be.

There are enough people here that know me, some like my comments and some don't. Those that don't just leave them alone and move on to what interests them. As for DanLM, he's tried speakling out for you and others as if it is his job, well actually he alrady said he would be the site moderator whether people like it or not.

Fine, want to be a moderator, I suppose I would be your best target.

I am not abotu to let someone re;eated;ly tell me to foff without any recprocal comment though, i am not one to walk away from taht crap.

I am honestly quite sorry that you had to get dragged into it, simply find other links to click I suppose and I'll let DanLM hang himself as he seems to do so well at it, I know where this goes.

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There is usually

by Tearat In reply to Your alias is Techno Rat

A reason for people the go off the hook

I find there is always something that has been done by both sides that sets the other off
Even if they don?t remember what it was

I have no intention of being moderator
So don?t start with the policeman crap with me

There are other people reading these posts
There is no need for them to sift through the garbage just to find something worthwhile

Yes I can be a rat if you like and I am not talking about rodents

I suppose I will get some smart *** or arrogant reply it would be typical

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Dan give it up

by Tearat In reply to Again, double standards b ...

He is not going to listen to you
I have to wonder if he respects anyone enough to listen to what they have to say

Chill out it?s not worth getting upset over something you read in a forum
Your taking it way to seriously

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Actually techno,

by Oz_Media In reply to Dan give it up

I respect a lot of people here, and I agree to disagree with them. Even in ties where I opose their comments, a efw posts later we generally find middle ground.

Maxwell Edison and I would go at it for hours and hours, thousands of posts. But I have a whole new respect for him since running into people like Dan. Max was at least very clever and kept challenging me with his replies, now when we get pissy with each other, we'll offer a few jokes about it and both walk away. Dan has chosen not to do that though, he has folloed my posts in other discussions and offered more of the same. I have no patience for losers like that at all and he can expect to get smacked for it.

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Resourceful

by Oz_Media In reply to Well you do have a good p ...

Nice to see that you find more in being resourceful than most do. Well done, you would fly through the 1 tonne reduction program by Suzuki.

Your comments:

"Dependence in any non domestic fuel is bad"
Is Canada really condsidered foreign these days?

anyway, I agree with most of yoru post, though the filling up less is not such a great idea. Keepign your tank topped up provides two benefits.
1) longer vehicle life and lower emissions. Running low (1/4 or less) on gas makes your vehicle burn sludge from teh bottom of teh tank, this harms your injectors, thorwing off the emission system and also kills teh fuel filter, gums up the fuels lines, fuel rail and makes the injector pins stick. Your vehicles engine works harder with a low gas level than it does pulling the added weight of a full tank.

2) Safety, if in an accident, your vehicle has a far greater risk of fire, or explosion with a low or near empty tank of gas than it does with a full tank of gas.

There is no real benefit to running with a full tank of gas, however there is a greater safety risk and damage to the vehicles emission control system by running lower on gas.

Cheap gas doesn't burn efficiently, so regular doesn't cut it, supreme has FAr too many additives for most of todays motors and especially really old ones (where the added detergents in the gas will actually start causing gasjket leaks) a mid grade is usually the best option, even at a higher price, you will benefit in teh long run and it will run a little better in the short term too.

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Is Canada really condsidered foreign these days?

by Tearat In reply to Resourceful

Yes
North America is a long way from NZ

Most cars are designed around half a tank I believe

So ? to ? is right for most cars
Good mechanics will check the filters regularly

?longer vehicle life and lower emissions?

You will have to explain that one
You would think a lighter car would use less fuel
Less fuel used would mean fewer emissions as a whole
Less weight would reduce the load on the vehicle components
But you may know something I dont

One other thing if you have sludge on the tank you may want to look at changing where you buy fuel

From memory
We have regulation that determine the level of impurities in fuel
So I guess you dont have those

Anyway a rough road will shake up the tank
Starting and stoping will cause the fuel to slosh around the tank
I think you may be a victim of a myth on that one

?Your vehicles engine works harder with a low gas level than it does pulling the added weight of a full tank.?

Well that makes no sense to me

?2) Safety, if in an accident, your vehicle has a far greater risk of fire, or explosion with a low or near empty tank of gas than it does with a full tank of gas?

Well it is impossible to keep the tank full but I guess safety costs like it always has
Again you may be a victim of a myth
Most of the time petrol needs to be compressed to explode

But overall the full tank thing is not that important
People can make up their own mind

One other thing OZ
Where does the fuel line leave the tank in your car?
Top or bottom?
Or if you like
At what level is fuel to low to be sucked from the tank?

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You will have to explain that one

by Oz_Media In reply to Is Canada really condside ...

Okay, longer vehicle life and lower emissions. ALL gas, whether high grade or not, gums up after only a short time in the tank, that's wjy stations try to never run dry and fuel trucks constantly keep gas stations over the 1/4 tank level. This gum, a result of additives in the gasoline such as detergents and anti-knock additives create a sludge in the bottom of the fuel tank. This is why manufacturers say to never run your car dry and if possible, refill at 1.4 tank. If you do run a fuel injected car dry, you should always replace the fuel filter as it becomes gummed up with that sludge, as do the fuel rail, injectors, valves etc.

As far as fuel contamination, Canada does have slightly stricter guidelines than the Us, that's why it has always been 'sketchy' or not recommended for Canadians to buy Us gas. Unless it is REALLY cheap, and yuo full with super, many Canadians would rather stick to our gas. It was more important during the days of the leaded gas vs unleaded but still stands today for some.

ALL gasoline has additives, these additives are mainly detergents and some anti-knock additives, supreme gas has a higher amount of detergents in order to purify the fuel by killing contaminants, however in older cars, the detergents can actually eat away at gaskets and seals that are reliant of grime to hold together (even on a 5 year old car). this obviously causes leaks and expensive repairs.

As far as better mileage. If you run yoru car low on gas for extended period of time, or as a habit, you will pick up grime off the tank. This then clogs injectors, burns hard carbon deposits on the back of the valves causing them to remain partially open, clogs the fuel rail and slows down/impedes the injector pins, this causes a sick burn which also results in a clogged PCV valve and hardened vacuum hoses due to excessive heat. This not only results in poor combustion and greater emissions, it also means that you get poor mileage.

"I think you may be a victim of a myth on that one"

Actually I am a licensed mechanic, alternate fuels certified and a member of the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE).


"Well it is impossible to keep the tank full but I guess safety costs like it always has
Again you may be a victim of a myth
Most of the time petrol needs to be compressed to explode"

Well your almost right. Fuel VAPOUR needs to be compressed in order to explode. You can toss a cigarette into a 5 gal pail of gas without the gas igniting, it will just put the cigarette out.

A quarter tank of gas running with a 7lb vapour lock gas cap is like a bomb waiting to explode. On impact it takes all of the cars millions of dollars in engineering to stop it from exploding. With a full tank, there is less vapour to compress and combust.

This is all high school automotive 101, thought, pretty basic stuff.

"Where does the fuel line leave the tank in your car?
Top or bottom?
Or if you like
At what level is fuel to low to be sucked from the tank?"

Depends on the car, but usually the pickup screen sits just above the bottom of the tank with one pump attached just above it. The pump outlet has spigot that fits through a locking cap that is usually at the top of the tank, though that again does vary by manufacturer.

As far as siphoning fuel, it depends on the restrictor placement and also if the tank is baffled In which case you'd need a robotic snake. Sometimes you can suck it dry but for that last 15 or so years, they have been getting better at thwarting siphoning.

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Well all I can say

by Tearat In reply to You will have to explain ...

Is you must have different type of fuel to us

Because I heard a different story from the auto engineers I talked to
But like I said the full tank myth is something people will have to make their own minds up about

No I was not talking about siphoning fuel
But it shows how you are thinking

detergents and anti-knock additives
Still using those are you

Ps qualifications don?t make you smarter
They just give you more things to be wrong about

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