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Has libertarianism reached its peak?

By jardinier ·
The war in Iraq has caused me to divert much of my attention from local issues to international matters.

As I pondered over social mores in various countries ... especially Western democracies ... I realised that we have become to a great extent a dissolute society. Consider things which are now accepted as "normal" such as a high divorce rate, leading to single-parent families; the universal acceptance of homosexuality as "normal," even to the extent of allowing marriage between partners ofthe same sex; the escalating problems of drug abuse and juvenile crime; the "everything's acceptable" attitude expressed in movies and TV series; and so on.

We are seeing fundamentalist religious views gradually replacing the more liberal views to which we have become accustomed.

Is the pendulam starting to swing back to a more conservative overall approach to life?

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He said libertarianism...

by jhooten1 In reply to Media Follows?

...not liberalism...HUGE difference.

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Has libertarianism reached its peak

by qamar In reply to My rant

Frankly speaking this topic has enough scope for openning our eyes regarding the moral or otherwise values we as a modern race heading. Human has comparitively talent built for observing, expewrinecing and keep learning from the environment and history. Even then the individulas tend to learn more by their own experience many a times at detructive cost. IRAQ is going through colonization apart from the history of world wars of librations. Sex and other cultural liberalization is also going through the changes well tried earlier before this civilized world. It generally appears the race is destined on a fixed orbits, repeat of path of civilizations.

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Libertarian Decadence

by PPALIJ In reply to My rant

What you are talking about is progressive cultural and moral decadence. When people stop caring about what others do to themselves and to others then society is fragmenting and it is all about 'me'.
What Hollywood and the media are doing is gradualy breaking down the the framework, rules if you like, that we all live by. Suddenly rules that we take for granted arn't rules any more. I once saw an interview on TV where a man described a TV as having sewer into your living room, then I thought hewas crazy, but now.....?

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Libertarian vs. Liberal

by TheChas In reply to Libertarian Decadence

The libertarian philosophy is for MINIMAL government intervention into the lives of the citizens.

This does not mean that anything goes, or that the government should fund a lot of needless programs.

Many libertarians have very conservative ideas and life philosophy. They just want the government to leave everyone alone.

Extreme Liberalism on the other hand can extend that any viewpoint or action should be tolerated by society.
Liberals also call for heavy government intervention in our daily life. Along with a LOT of spending for government programs.

A Libertarian and a Liberal are 2 very different individuals.


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Interesting Topic

by TheChas In reply to Has libertarianism reache ...

As I see it, the swing toward "Traditional Values" by many religious groups is an attempt to hold onto the faithful.

Many western religions tried to be more accommodating and accepting in the late 70's and 80's. The result was a disillusionment of the "core" members of the faith, and a push for even more relaxed rules from the fringes.

Where I live, many 'traditional' congregations are loosing members to the point where they are often forced to merge or dissolve.

At the same time, we have several 'mega-churches' that seam to have no specific rules or faith affiliation.

Many people who left their birth faiths in the 80's and 90's are returning to church since they feel a need for a moral root for their families. Some accept thatthere are differences in what they personally believe and what their church teaches. Others cannot accept the conflict of belief, and search for a church that will NOT preach that what they believe is wrong.

If libertarianism is loosing ground, it is most likely because too many people would rather see rules that increase perceived security rather than preserve personal freedom and liberties.


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by Oldefar In reply to Interesting Topic

First, can we determine if the discussion is about liberalism or libertarianism? The first supports social causes generally sympathetic to the "downtrodden" and "oppressed", typically preferring to do it with government action funded by tax dollars. The second is a political movement that believes the best government is the least government - fewer laws, fewer government workers, less government involvement, and lower taxes. I suspect that the Libertarian Party has lost much of its potentialsupport from disgruntled Republicans in the US due to this confusion in terms.

As for whether the social norm is swinging from liberal to conservative, I think that this comes about more from the aging process than anything else. The baby boomers are now hitting late middle age and early seniority, and their views are becoming more conservative.

Rises in fundamentalist religious beliefs and strict social value groups follow social uncertainty. This occurred during the Great Depression, and to some extent during the current economic slump. Its a search for stability and direction in troubled times. A worrisom trend, since facism also grew out of the hard economic conditions.

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Good Point

by TheChas In reply to Liberalism

While the Title says libertarianism, the body of the root post speaks more to liberalism.

I went with the body of the root.

Perhaps Julian will add a post to clear up his intended direction.


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Definitely libertarianism

by jardinier In reply to Liberalism

I looked the term up in the dictionary to make sure, and also included in my posting the phrase "a dissolute society" to emphasise my intended meaning.

I find your reference to "Libertarian Party" interesting, in that I once knew a Dutchman who voted "Liberal" in Australia, because he was unaware that our "Liberal Party" is actually our conservative party.

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The joy of semantics

by TheChas In reply to Definitely libertarianism

In the US, when you say libertarian, the immediate reference is the libertarian party.

The party is considered to be on the fringe of the political spectrum.

From my CD version of the OE
Libertarianism: an extreme laissez-faire political philosophy advocating only minimal state intervention in the lives of citizens.
Its adherents believe that private morality is not the state's affair, and that therefore activities such as drug use and prostitution that arguably harm no one but the participants should not be illegal. Libertarianism shares elements with anarchism, although it is generally associated more with the political right (chiefly in the US); it lacks the concern of traditional liberalism with social justice.

So, by the definition, with the current political climate in the world, libertarianism is definitely past it's hay-day.

Far too many people are willing to allow the government to take control of any situation in the name of increased security.


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For the record

by Oldefar In reply to The joy of semantics

Here is the link to their site -

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