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I'm Not a Pirate, But I know A few ARGGH

By MallardtooXX ·
This is something that has been festering for a couple of weeks now so I am gonna let it dump here. There was a discussion about Piracy and the fact that it is a bad thing, which it is I concede. The part that frosts me is this, everyone was talking about how it is morally and ethically wrong to Pirate, how it costs companies billions in rev. Blah blah blah. No one stops to think that the software we are suing right now be it windows or mac was, initially, Pirated from IBM. I dunno, if not bill and steve would this be a unix/linux world?

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Someone is bucking for a raise.

by MaxPower1111 In reply to Generalizations, Generali ...

Let me guess. Ether you are the CEO, or your CEO reads TecRepublic. LOL
On a serious note. I agree that not all CEO's fit that profile, i.e. the one that runs my company (I could use a raise too). High-level corporate administrators in general do tend to put more emphasis on the company's well being than the employees. Whether it is a conscious behavior or just loosing sight of the fact that the employees are the company is debatable. Surely you must see how some people can feel the way so many do about the American corporate Emperors.

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To This I must agree, however =)

by MallardtooXX In reply to Generalizations, Generali ...

Road-dog You are right. I think you hit your mark on this last post. But I am going to also say this. I have sat on both sides of the fence, I have been a cubicle peon that druges his day out in hopes that the clock will somehow speed up. But through hard work, a little luck and a lot of risk I jumped the wall and defected to upper management. I must say, there is a very skewed image of the untold masses. I got to the point where I found myself defending the "minions" more often than the "slavedrivers" In my way earlier post I missed my mark, I think it is unfortunate that so many bright and gifted young tech people are forced away because they are overworked and under paid. I also concede that it is not fair to paint everyone with the same color here. For every Kenneth Lay there are 20 good guys/gals in the drivers seat. YOur point was well made, well taken and greatly appreciated. Sometimes the threads seem to get a little tangled.

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True enough.

by madroxxx In reply to I'm Not a Pirate, But I k ...

One thing that kind of skews the figures is when companies assume that everyone using pirated copies would buy the product if pirating wasn't an option. Not true, software packages are so expensive that many would do without rather than buy.
WhileI agree software for business use should be purchased, I really don't feel guilty about installing a pirated copy of windows on the computer I gave to the poor kids down the street. It didn't cost Bill anything. If anything I might have just createdsome future customers for him down the road since these kids might now grow up computer literate.

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I agree with plight but you are wrong

by TomSal In reply to I'm Not a Pirate, But I k ...

Two wrongs don't make a right, as the old as dirt saying goes.

No one said being ethical, moral or just generally being above the "crap and BS" that is the vast majority of corporate society these days --- is easy. If it were easy than no one on earth would ever stress about doing the right thing.

That said -- I fully agree with the points raised about the a$$hole CEOs and how executives take full advantage of their employess who in turn bust their arse 50-60 hours a week (average) and get walked over and shafted on their end of the deal.

That enrages me like you wouldn't believe actually. But again, stealing - and lets call it what it is...its stealing. The terminology of "piracy" only helps aid in de-sensitizing the real crime. Finally that's the fundamental wrong with it -- as long as its AGAINST THE LAW, it shouldn't be done - especially in corporations. That's just blind stupidity if you ask me.

Personally, if you go to my house right now and look through all the software you'd find not a single piece of stolen software. Oh I mean "pirated". I have made audio CDs - but guess what they are all songs off CDs I own anyway.

95% of all the hard nose arguments FOR pirating are just excuses if you ask me. Yeah the world of licensing and copyright laws and the way we the IT workers get shafted sucks like a hoover in the middle of a hurricane - that's life. Deal with it.

Cry to someone else.

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Dont Get Me Wrong cont...

by jkaras In reply to I agree with plight but y ...

Also it's been our computer history that computer technology is held back to insure maximum profit telling the consumer that what they bought a year ago is already obsolite and need to upgrade to run anything. Everyone in this time lives with the struggle to make ends meet and strech a dollar to provide any kind of future for ourselves as well as our families while dealing with this greed inflation and lack of quality. Think about the 3rd world countries that work for these companies paying them sweat shop pay, outsourcing support to phone centers that wont help you. (had that job too!)Morality and business dont work together in our dog eat dog world, call me a pessimist, I prefer realist. So if this is stealing then we are all thieves guilty of stealing. I'm proud to be a thief then and I will brag about it like I'm one bad mutha from prison, lol!!!

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Dont Get Me Wrong

by jkaras In reply to I agree with plight but y ...

I understand your point of view and share them in the professional world that everything has to be by the numbers, that's business. However, all electronics that I have owned in my life time has had a record button on it from boombox to vcr to tevo to computer. The technology has always allowed it, only now are movies, software, and music companies are singin the blues crying over an injustice of lost revenue. If it is stealing then, when we record a tv program, music, etc... is it still stealing, are we all criminals then? Are we guilty of owning stolen merchandise (vcr, tape recorders), if then explain how Curcuit City is still legally in business? No, it's stealing only if we profit from selling the pirated product, then yes it's stealing. These corporate machines over price their product to compensate for loss variables, and the retoric used that the price you pay increases due to theft is the biggest lie. Trust me I used to be a manager for the biggest home improvement company and I'll tell you how much they cheat the customer while smiling in your face catering to your ego and takin you for a ride. ( it was my job) Dont take this wrong but I sincerley doubt that if I went into your house and looked at all your computers inthe house I doubt that you bought every os or software on all systems let alone the copy you gave to friends, family, and for some maybe not you used your copy to repair side customers(this repair point is stealing, conciede) or boss's pc.

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Nice strawman, just get him stuffed?

by pallan In reply to Dont Get Me Wrong

1. There are legal uses for a VCR, and a tape recorder, a CD burner, etc. There are also illegal uses. Recording a copy of a CD which you purchased legally is fine, unless you start distributing copies. It is legal to record TV shows for the purpose of time shifting. Your argument seems to ignore the legal uses of the above mentioned equipment. Using your logic, car dealerships are in the business of selling murder weapons.

2. Yes, much of what is sold to us is overpriced. How this justifies stealing is beyond me. We're not talking about stealing a loaf of bread to feed our families here, we're talking about stealing Windows XP, the latest PC game, or productivity software. If you think a product is overpriced - DON'T BUY IT.There are competing products that can often be legally acquired FOR FREE. Price inflation does not justify theft.

3. I bought none of the software I use at home. Everything I use at home is open source, and acquired legally. The only non-OSS software I use is the occaisional game, which I buy and play under WineX.

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You got me...

by TomSal In reply to Dont Get Me Wrong

You are right I did trade software with friends and family...shareware, free and demo CDs that come bundled with certain magazines I subscribe too. :)

But seriously, I'm not trying to be self-righteous or come off like I'm a saint...that would bea huge lie if I said that. Trust me.

I used to copy games left and right back in the days of the commodore 64, I cracked the games and copied then. I never sold them mind you, but at 8 to 10 years old, I used the excuse then that I didn't knowany better. Believe me, I know plenty hackers, crackers and guys who run warez sites - if I wanted to I could get a Win 2000 Advanced Server, the latest MS Office, I could get pratically any new game -- all for free. I just need to ask and it would be done. But I don't.

Trust me the temptation is there, but I just don't.

Now for your point about why record buttons are on VCRs and tape players..etc... I wondered that too at one time. Then a lawyer (met at a social gathering) explained thatthe difference is - if the broadcast is publically available (ie. Radio, network TV) or you pay for it (ie. premium TV - HBO, etc.) than the LAW says YOU ARE ALLOWED to copy it for your own private use/viewing/etc. But you can't (even though most people do) distribute it to anyone for profit or otherwise.

With software you can NOT compare the two - it is NOT the same as recording a show with your VCR. A cable show (or network TV show,etc.) doesn't have a license agreement before the show. Software does.

Your assumption is wrong - search my house you'll find no pirated software. If I do have a copy I didn't pay for, I got a copy from work - with a valid license. Call it a small perk of being IT at my company.

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No Offense

by jkaras In reply to You got me...

I appreciate and respect your opinion and mean no disrespect to your character or to anyone who differs from my opinion, if it came off that way then I apologize, I want no bad blood mearly stating opinion. But we both agree that having it is personally subjective right or wrong vs. making a profit is wrong was my point. My piracy is only for my personal use, not for gain much like any recording. I dont see the difference because a licensing agreement, I'll conciede that I maybe cheating, but not a thief or crimminal. I think everyone is guilty somewhere in their life of these petty indescretions, maybe not you, but most whether recording your favorite song off the radio rather than buying the over priced cd that has 3 songs worth listening. Worldwide consumers are rebelling against this all flash no substance that milk people of as much money as possible, unfinished products requiring patches/upgrades, 4 differnt dvd versions of your favorite movie etc.. The one good that has come about is the fear that these corporations are forced to realize that people wont stand for it much longer and hopefully a change can come through where everyone can play nice, it's a nice hope and one I hope to witness in the future.

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by madroxxx In reply to You got me...

"If I do have a copy I didn't pay for, I got a copy from work - with a valid license. Call it a small perk of being IT at my company."

So you would rather steal from your boss than pirate software?

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