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TechProGuild Feedback Forum: John Sheesley

Welcome to my TechProGuild Feedback Forum! What are we going to discuss here? You tell me. Windows Server 2003... NetWare... Linux... Professional Wrestling... The Presidential Election... (Not to confuse the two.)

You pick the topic, and we'll talk about.

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That's a great part of the problem though

by Oz_Media In reply to Talk about extreme?!

Although many of us claim to be ethical and want to do the right thing, there is such thing as grassing-up, ratting people out, snitching, etc.
and this will deter many from speaking up.

No you shouldn't HAVE to be FORCED to inform the authorities, but it seems that not everyone will report a crime. Even those that are VICTIMS of a crime will not speak out in many cases, to have an innocent bystander get involved is another issue.

In an ideal world, we would all be able to govern our own actions, but unfortunately SOME people don't care and others suffer because of it. The whole one bad apple thing.

So until we can actually get our citizens to stop ignoring issues and to actually take a stand and become involved, we will need to PUSH people to act accordingly.

What I don't understand; if you are the type of person who actually DOES report these actions, why would it matter if you were told you had to?

Ok everyone is paranoid about the government taking this to an extreme level but you have all supported the US becoming a police state over the past few years, it's all or nothing guys, not pick and choose.
The only people who should be concerned about new criminal laws are criminals.

The only people who should be concerened about being forced to take action are those who don't take action.

As for everything else being policed too, lets look at these issues one at a time instead of placing a blanket attitude to it.

You must also remember, YOU voted for your government, there's more to a good leader than just the ability to destrot another country.

Perhaps that's why I always say there is such a difference in our political views, we elect a leader based on issues such as this. REAL issues that effect us in our daily lives. The US seems to empower their president based on his military track record and might, then just ***** and whine about civil liberties and Constitutional rights when they are stepped on.

Perhaps the focus of your vote should be turned toward what he/she is going to do that actually effects your daily lives, within your own country.

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Got to disagree with you Oz... So whatelse do you expect

by JimHM In reply to Talk about extreme?!

It is not the roll of the State to Socially engineer the masses to the way it thinks they should think - that was called fascism (Nazi Germany - Remember that). Where the government began with the indorctranation of the children in the Hilter Youth.

That worked pretty good didn't it - what a little over 6.5 million died in the camps (good soical engineering). Mentally challenged, Jews, Eastern Europeans, Peace protesters, politicans - or anyone that didn't follow the doctrine of the state.

Interesting that you profess the same type of roll for the state, just because man can not follow simple rules of common sense of reporting on someone. So we will have the "State" make a law that will make people do it - isn't that social engineering?

Then you call the USA a Police State - I don't know any states in the US that has a Law like BC to were you have to stop or call the police if you witness an accident. Canada or at least BC sounds more of a police state than we do. (The US does have some social engineering laws and the liberals contiune to try and get more past but they have been failing).

Then you go off on some wild attack of our political system - stay on the subject (oh thats right you hate america so back you can taste it).

If you want a police state stay in BC - where they write those nice little social engineering laws you want everyone to live by.

You aren't making sense again - but according to you I am blinded and a fool ... I think I see things pretty black and white -

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Unfurtunately seeing black and white is the problem here

by Oz_Media In reply to Talk about extreme?!

No I don't live in a police state. No I am not under arrest for driving past an accident. In BC there are MANY laws that just don't go enforced but are there simply to make one feel obligated to help, which everyman should when his fellowman is down. Remember the army Jim, brotherhood, looking out for each other? Why is it we can only expect this mentailty form SOME citizesn? For you to NOT feel this way goes against everything you are supposed to stand for as a soldier.

Basically Jim, you can call our government whatever you want, personally I 'COULDN'T CARE LESS' (hee hee) as I probably call them much worse than you ever could I also call a spade a spade and don't pretend I have to suport my government when they F-up like every other government, they ALL SUCK!
One thing my government doesn't do that you feel they DO do, is play a role in my daily routine. I do whatever the **** I want, when and where I want and have never had the government say I couldn't. Again, only tha major laws are enforced and most are just paperwork from some bored legislator that go unnoticed, we are left to live morally.

The difference I see, is Canadians are for Canadians, no matter what, we support each other BEFORE we suport our government and that's what every elected leader knows, he MUST apease the people and leaqve us alone to live our lives.

In the USA, although you think it is the opposite, I see you placing your government WAY above the people and the people supoprt the government before looking out for each other. The government says you HAVE to look out for one another and you start ranting about civil liberties and the Constitution and crap. Why can't you just nod and let it go, kowing that you would look out for your fellowman anyway, with or without a law.

The reason I joked about being police state is because of all the scandal saying American government is behind organizing these terrorist attacks (well documented too, but just as easily discounted by the other side)in order to have the people support America becoming a police state.

Now I know there is some heavy left wing bias there, even if from a former Repubilcan, but it does make one think (or at least it SHOULD make you think)about the real intent of the US government, especially when it lines up so right with all of the actions and unexplainable decisions to sign certain documentaion by US presidents, like Bush ordering the release of known Iraqi terrorists from FBI grasp.

So not to insinuate that the government has a hidden agenda (like all governments do except the in the USA where it is a good government). All I am saying here Jim, America'sgovernment and leaders are just as screwed up as any other government on the planet, there is NO WAY you can say it is better, there is NO WAY I can say it is worse. It is just a bunch of silver tounged con men with a public job. (remembered the L that time;-)

You see ANY action of the US government that actually involves the people's input as NOT your business. Well that is the problem Jim, everyone expects the government to run the country, keep the bad people away, praise the good people etc.

Where do YOU come into all this, what role do YOU play (apart from once fighting for your country). Where does Jim start to accept responsibility? Why do YOU think your country needs you if you don't want to play a role in making it safer place to live? Sometimes it takes tyhe people of a country to enforce change, not the government, if the people don't act, how can you expect your government to work for you?

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It's sounding another quack -

by JimHM In reply to That's a little extreme

You - say it is illegal to not call the police or stop if you witness an accident in B.C. right?

How do you determine - which is a higher priority - you driving to a phone to call the police or stopping as a witness?

Is there a law in B.C. that you must rended first aid to the victims of the accident? Is everyone in B.C. trained as a first responder or advanced first aid? Do you have to carry a first aid kit in your car?

See all the questions those stupid laws bring up - yes it maybe immoral to pass an accident or not notify the authorities - but to write a law saying you must stop - is pure Socialistic in nature (Social Engineering) - another Quack..

So what other laws are on the books up there - do you have to call the RCMP if you see someone spit on the street - or rob a bank - to you have to aid someone having a heart attack - do you have to help grandma across the street... aren't those things your mommy and daddy should of taught you to do - and not mandated by the government - then maybe you don't like blood - or seeing dead people on the road - or maybe your in fear of your life reporting a robbery..

How are those handle - that's what I am talking about with the Gastapo - If I choose to report fine -it is my choice not the governments place to tell me ...

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YOu are so blind Jim, I mean BLIND!

by Oz_Media In reply to It's sounding another qua ...

You see everything SO literally that it REALLY explains how and why you take the political stand you do.

It is ONLY common sense and logic that would dictate HOW you react when you witness an accident. If I could see that the people in the accident needed help that I couldn't provide myself, I would use my cell phne to call for help, or drive to a payphone to make the call.

No it is NOT alright to administer first aid, should th eperson have a kneck or back injury and you create mor edamage by moving the person, YOU COULD be sued for negligence by their insurer, although it RARELY happens.

It is not an ENFORCED law either, many just drive by and don't get chased down by a team of helicopters and cop cars. It does make people feel that they SHOULD help though.

A few weeks ago, down the highway, there was a family in a pickup that had an accident and the truck burst into flames. Two men driving by stopped and after suffering second degree burns themselves, had pulled a father, Wife, 11 year old son AND a 6 month old baby from the wreckage. Not because they had to, but because they knew they should. If people didn't feel oligated to help, these people would certainly have died.

I am certidied in industrial first aid and will always stop and help where I can, MANY won't though.

But to get back on topic here, we are NOT discussing what to fo when a life threatening accident is seen, this is about finding a pedophile while doing you daily duty.

Now if you can't say that after pounding the living **** out of the guy, you wouldn't turn him in, then I suppose you truly are showing your true colors and how you would completely ignore a potential threat to your fellowman, but support war due to a POTENTIAL threat to our country. You put your country ahead of your neighbours, nice one.

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Sort term memory loss Oz - You don't reread your own posts

by JimHM In reply to It's sounding another qua ...

Lets see you said - "Well in Canada (BC anyway) it is illegal to witness an accident and not stop or call the police. "

So now it's optional - and you land blast your friend with about not stopping... Who's Blind and whos just to stupid to remember their prevous post. Get you head out your Arus -

You Initial statement it is Illegal to not stop or call the police ... no all of a sudden it is optional - I see the way those laws are - only enforced when it fits the need - otherwise don't do them -

OK - Well - Call me silly - but thats BS in BC - either there is a law you have to stop - or not - so which one is it...

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Go to Disagree with you Oz

by JimHM In reply to It's sounding another qua ...

It is not the rule of the State to Socially engineer the masses to the way it thinks they should think - that was called fascism (Nazi Germany - Remember that). Where the government - indorctraned the children in the Hilter Youth.

That worked pretty good didn't it - what a little over 6.5 million died in the camps. Mentally challenged, Jews, Eastern Europeans, Peace protesters, politicans - or anyone that didn't follow the doctrine of the state.

Interesting that you profess that because man can not follow simple rules - of reporting on someone that the "State" should establish laws that do. Then you call the USA a Police State - I don't know any states in the US that has a Law like BC to were you have to stop or call the police if you witness an accident. You all sound more police state than we do.

Then you go off on some wild attack of our political system - stay on the subject (oh thats right you hate america so back you can taste it).

If you want a police state stay in BC - where they write those nice little socialism laws you want everyone to live by... so then if that was the case you name would already be at RCMP for hate speach about America and President Bush... Oh thats right America has that little thing people don't like - Freedom of Speech.. hum - I guess one day we should get ride of that ...

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They need a new Forum software - post belongs above

by JimHM In reply to It's sounding another qua ...

They need a new forum software - this one suck ... post belongs above..

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You'd disagree withyourself if you could, well you have already.

by Oz_Media In reply to It's sounding another qua ...

Well Jim, I know you just don't understand Canadian politics and BC laws so I will just ignore your comments as they are neither accurate nor valid.

As for laws not being enforced, dno't tell me this is a new concept to you. We have TONNES of laws that aren't enforced. our government passes laws for the purpose of having something to fall back on, not something EVERYONE must follow, if it is we simply don't.

Such as, no drinking in a public place. Well everyone in Canada drinks in public places, when you can consider half of Canada's wilderness is a public place, it simply can't be enforced. UNless a group of kids are making too much noise or being too rowdy near other families, then the police can pull some law on their side and shut it down, but it's not a heavily enforced law, unless needed WE ARE LEFT ALONE TO DO OUR THING!

Can't smoke in bars and restaurants, well most bars and restaurants in BC wil hand you an ashtray IF you ask. They would rather take a POSSIBLE fine than turn away customers.

You are supopsed to report any accidents you witness (not neccessarily play **1 and save the damsel in distress), but if you don't nothing happens. If the occupant died and you were seen slowing down and then driving on without reporting it, 1) You are an a**hole, 2) You deserve to be hurt and left lone to suffer 3) get the **** out of here But you are not going to jail. You have broken a MORAL law, not an enforced one.

So STOP seeing black and white, you need to use personal judgement (God help you) to decide what is right or wrong. You should NEED the government to make you, but if you won't act like a decent citizen by yourself, then someone should make you or ask you to find a new country.

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"we can't stop, we have an appointment!"

by jardinier In reply to That's a little extreme

Not exclusively a "Christian" attitude. One evening I was walking along the main street of Kings Cross with a company of people which included a Buddhist monk.

The monk pointed at a man lying in the gutter, apparently drunk, and said: "That's his karma," and walked on.

So we rang the Sydney City Mission (non-denominational Christian) which brought a van to pick up the unfortunate fellow.

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