General discussion


Vista is killing my staff

Over the last 6 months we have been trying to integrate Vista into our client?s environments with as little user/administration pain as possible. I must say that Vista is going to do 3 things for our industry.
1. Cause the administrators to dig in and enjoy their job security ? for the truly skilled IT professional?
2. Cause the average administrator to quit and move to another profession.
3. Cause the general IT population to really conceder moving to a Linux shop.

We have found supporting Vista to be twice the support cost of XP without the ability to retain the same reliability.
For the first time in 10 years my firm was ask buy a client to uninstall an OS ?Vista? and install an off the shelf purchase of XP pro. 60+ stations.

Every day I have to log into my Vista test environment I find myself asking:

?What was Microsoft Thinking??

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Vista grunts.

by symon.l In reply to Vista is killing my staff

Anyone who advises a company to migrate their client base over to Vista for what ever reason so early on is crazy. The prison service it self has only just gone on to XP which was a massive job if i hadnt already left I would the day they say its time to migrate to Vista.

Vista has a feature called Address Space Layout Randomization (ASLR)

you can read about it here

if it does this per process this causes all sorted of problems for shared applications as since Windows 95 all DLL's have been located in the same place every reboot. Now its just not the case. This and the introduction of the "user account control" this feature should be listed under "****".

I would like to say that our new customers can be fully supported but we have added a new section that has to ask what O/S they are using with a nice disclamer "WE CAN NOT SUPPORT VISTA USRES"

Anyways i have had my little rant.

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Details, please.

by CharlieSpencer In reply to Vista is killing my staff

"We have found supporting Vista to be twice the support cost of XP..."

What would you say is causing this? Lack of end user training? Lack of support staff training? Inadequate hardware for the OS? Application software not compatible with the OS? All of the above and more?

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Not finding out whether any of the above

by Tony Hopkinson In reply to Details, please.

would/may/could occur before they did it, would be my guess.

I know MS fanboys say it just works, but 60 workstations and an entire infrastructure, you'd have to be some sort of muppet.

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Vista support cost

by derek In reply to Details, please.

Why does Vista cost so much more to support? Because even doing simple tasks can take 2x as long in Vista.

Try this, try editing the hosts file on a Vista computer. Should take less than a minute. Adding printers, installing software...heck even copying files is slower on Vista.

I agree, Vista was designed for guys that charge by the hour

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Im not sure where you are going

by Dumphrey In reply to Vista is killing my staff

with all this.

But it sounds like you find Vista difficult to work with. I did as well at first, but after a day or two on the phone with Dell and MS to resolve an issue, I feel very comfortable with Vista. That being said, it still will not run our CRM software, or in otherwords, 90% of our buisness computing (Pre-Press design is 9% email 1%).

BUT, if it did support our CRm, I would be okay with Vista Buisness in our domain. I prefer XP to be sure, buy thats because I have a much larger comfort zone with XP. I see Vista being adopted here long befor server 2008. Which is a shame, becasue 2008 has more to offer up in terms of GPO, NaC etc... (XP SP3 will add serevr 2003 NAC support according to technet).

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Sorry but I'm not having that

by Tony Hopkinson In reply to Vista is killing my staff

Have you been hiding under a rock or something?

You thought it would just work, why?

Do you want to buy a bridge?

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If he

by Shellbot In reply to Sorry but I'm not having ...

buys your bridge, send em my one i want to get rid of!!

I don't know a whole lot about OS's. but I know enough that I would not actually use Vista for a real live business..I use it at home and it runs nothing..I can't even fathom the havoc it would cause...

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I'm on it now, have been for nearly nine months

by Tony Hopkinson In reply to If he

But some poor git of an admin, had to get me to the point I could, and while there were no insurmountable issues, there were a lot of very irritating ones.

Enterprise virus didn't work.
AD differences.
New hardware
wait for drivers
ghost problems
internal and external web sites not working with IE7.
Software tracking still doesn't work

We needed it in R&amp to make our products Vista compatible, so we got used as guinea pigs.

All in all it hasn't gone too badly, but I've worked at places where it would have been major heartache and seriously expensive.

I can't for the life of me of me figure out why anyone would think it would just work. That's not even a hack at windows, I've been involved in HP, VMS, Unix, Linux and windiows rollouts.

Only a complete eejit would go for the 'suck it and see' approach.

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Software downgrade - Vista back to XP

by jeremy_perkins_2001 In reply to Sorry but I'm not having ...

Has anyone heard about this NEC software that allows you to downgrade Vista back to XP - is it worth it?

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File this under "lessons learned"

by Locrian_Lyric In reply to Vista is killing my staff

You're likely to get flamed to high heaven, as Vista has been the laughingstock of OSes for some time.

I see you have listed your role as CIO/CTO, which will likely earn you more flames.

The reason for the flames is that so many of us are so frustrated with M$ **** being rammed down our throats by executives who have either ignored our warnings or never solicited our opinions to begin with.

At the risk of sounding rude, your post suggests that you have done just such a thing. In the future, solicit opinions from your staff before making a move, and visit sites like this one to get the general pulse of the industry. Arm yourself with information and be an advocate for IT. If you rubber stamp the whims of the other executives, you'll find yourself in this situation repeatedly.

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