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An antivirus software conspiracy?

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What do you think about the potential antivirus software conspiracy? Do you agree with Jonathan Yarden that at least 90 percent of computer users are ignorant about how computers work? Share your thoughts about a potential antivirus software conspiracy, as discussed in the Sept. 29 Internet Security Focus e-newsletter.

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17 replies

by paul.beaudoin

On a single point I am inclied to agree - there is unlikely a consiracy purposfully creating an industry. As to ignorance - I woould agree the principle but not the target. The ignorance lies wholly with the creators of the software that is vulnerable. That software can be hardened and made far less vulnerable has been shown time and again by authors outside Microsoft. Surely you don't expect the purchasers of Ford and GM products to be mechanics do you? How well do you understand your dishwasher? Read the advertising for PCs in any newspaper. The promisses implied there do not reflect the entire experience and it is the manufacturer making those promises. There is a finger to be pointed on this issue but blaming your customers after enticing the money out of them is indefensible.

by cory_444

I have a feeling that 90% is a low number. Some of the things I see and hear scare me and make me think that there aren't many people out there that actually know what they are doing.

by gnx

It's over-education and lack of common sense for most users that causes problems. The same ones at my company seem to keep openning the emails that contain a virus despite a warning.

As for the virus writers: Come out of your parent's basement and get a date!

by paule54600

If I remember the percentages right, about 30% of people don't use antivirus software or don't maintain the updates properly making their computers part of the virus highway. Another percentage I've read is that up to 40% of computers surveyed already have some type of virus or trojan. This percentage has probably increased due to shareware since I read the article.

by rmaer

I would agree that there is no conspiracy / collusion between virus authors and companies that produce antivirus software. But when it comes to the money trail I have heard no discussion of securities investigations. With pre knowledge of the release of major worms or viruses the distinct possibility of "Insider Trading" occurs, and by that I am not referring to antivirus company personnel. Has any agency ever investigated investor trends for these companies? Has anyone repeatedly made extraordinary profit on these companies over the years? Maybe not, but I have not heard that such an investigation has been conducted.

Rich Maer

by todd

I have a friend I'll be forwarding the article to and see if he wants to comment. He did a paper for college on exactly this issue. His researched showed that something like 80% of all viruses (original versions) were actually written by someone who was either in the antiviral community or entered it, because of a "I have no idea how my virus got released!" attitude.

The main reason it is masked so well, is due to imitators, ?script kiddies?, etc.. who take the original virus and modify its code 5-10 times. So now instead of one virus, you have 10 to worry about.

The funny thing about it is, these antiviral companies have no problem taking your money for subscriptions to definitions, etc...to stop the viruses they created, whether they released them or not. I would think, if they were truly outraged, they would either offer this service for free and/or work with the computer & software manufactures to eliminate the ?loopholes? that allow viruses to flourish.

by ctalk

I hate to say this, because it reflects badly on the industry, but in 1997 or 1998, there was at least one example of an Israeli company that was offering a free all expenses paid trip to Israel for virus authors as part of a contest. It has been quite awhile ago, but it has been done before. So, saying it never existed is revisionist history at this point.

What we need is for American companies to accept something like CARO and behave ethically. It seems almost no one in America even heard of the Wild List or CARO or a whole lot of what they should know in that regard.

So, there are like what 5 *nix viruses (a lot of trojans and exploits though if you don't patch and watch closely) and something on the order of 55,000 Windows PC Viruses, Worms and Trojans.

Truth be told, watching the wild list gets most of it done though.

But let us not say that there never was a connection - there have been in the past, and there are probably still some today. Most of what you have in the AV force though is reactive today and not proactive enough.

Just my two cents.

by steve

For so long I have wondered about a conspiracy with the release of Viruses and the reliance on a product who's sole purpose is to eradicate them.

To say that there is no evidence of a conspiracy is to stick your head in the sand. Less evidence than this saw the US invade Iraq!

An entire sub industry has sprung up from combating Viruses and there is no denying that without regular virus releases that this industry would lose it's market. Why would we renew our subscriptions to virus software if we didn't hear regular warnings in the media of another threat?

There may not be any evidence to date, but I think it's the AV industry being very careful to cover it's tracks rather than this being evidence in itself of there not being a conspiracy...

If it looks like a chicken and sounds like a chicken, then chances are it is a chicken!

by schepens

I agree with Steve's comments and would like to add that those who create anti-viral signatures and work in understanding these little beasts are probably in the best place to build and spread them. I say this because their experience most likely gives them an understanding of how law enforcement pursues virus writers, how to create these viruses, and how to avoid detection.

The idea that a money trail would show up is pretty weak, in my opinion. If antivirus companies were doing this, they'd most likely use internal employees with expertise(I'd argue that it's more difficult to write the AV sig than to write the virus) in the area than to contract it out to a third party(although I'm not sure if this is what Jonathan is implying).

The bad english and shoddy cosmetics of most viruses almost seem intentional. If a malicious code writer were truly trying to hide their identity, these types of tactics would suit the job.

I'm not saying that all antivirus companies are doing this, just that it would be very easy for them to do so. Worse things have been done when there's money to be made.

by chuckr314159

...of the modern computer and software is that it's so easy that users don't have to know how computers work.

When I started messing with PC's in the DOS days, I knew what every file was for on my PC and nothing ever changed without my knowing about it. Then with the advent of Windows, not only was it impossible for any one human to know, Windows and it's app software was designed to hide what was what on my computer.

That's all well and good, but then don't blame the virus problems on the ignorant users, when it was the IT pros that created this environment in the first place.

by danlm

The only conspiricy that I have read anything about that I actualy think has some validity with regard to virus's is with regard to various spamming companies hiring coders to write various virus's. I recently read an article where a black list (SPEW I beleive) that companies use to filter out spam was under severe ddos attack, and that there is serious consideration being given to the idea that the spam companies are hiring coders to create various virus's/trojens that can be used to infect machines to launch these ddos attacks from. Now, considering that I also read that the spamming companies are also fileing frivolous lawsuits against various goverment agencies concerning the restriction of their freedom of speach, it would seem that the hiring of coders to write virus's/trojens to be used in ddos attacks would seem rather.... Stupid? But, who ever said these individuals were brain surgens anyway.

by jhromish

...how about Empire? Look at who's software most of the AV programs are either for, or are written to protect. There's a multi-billion dollar industry built up for the sole purpose of trying to make DOS/Windows usable -- system maintenance software, helpful utility software and -of course- AV software.

If the Windows market share took a serious dive (as many wish it would), this parasitic "industry" would crash! It's therefore in the best interest of said industry to keep Windows propped up in the foreground; likewise, it's in Microsoft's best interest not to fix the broken code, as this would trash the support industry and harm their most ardent supporters.

On this ground, I believe there are two fallacies:
1) Microsoft is a monopoly.
- More of an empire, I think.
2) The conspiracy debunked (?) by this article.
- I think the virus authors & miscellaneous crackers have little to do with the mess (unless they work for the AV companies). The issue no-one seems to talk about is the synergistic relationship between producers of broken software and those who try to make it usable.

My $0.02
.jimh

by jkaras

the computer is a complex machine that has many possible problems, its not a vcr that is easily fixed. So the common person understands how to basically use a computer but wont invest the time to fully comprehend it unlesss wanting to get into the field. When I did tech support you wouldnt believe the amount of people that I talked to on a daily basis believed that when describing how to navigate on their computer thought that I could see their screen like it was in a movie. The introduction of viruses created a huge market for support that many corporations have cashed in on and will forever. What bothers me is the speed that they find a fix almost immediately a virus is spread. Have any of you ever reported a virus? Who supplies them with the virus? Do they posses the most rediculous email address to receive tons of spam? That kid on the blaster rewrite was the first person I ever heard of getting in trouble for viruses. The only conspiracy that I do believe is that these companies create viruses to ensure business because without it they wouldnt be needed. Sometimes the "geek grafitti" thats engaged today couldnt possibly support the amount of virus scare necessary to a billion dollar industry.

by brunob75

Conspiracy ? Yeah sure ! Just like home fires are really due to firemen and fire alarm makers, who would be totally unneeded and out of a job without them. Car theft ? Car alarm makers work. Crime ? Police and prison system men. Illnesses ? Doctors, drug companies, hospitals and huge health conglomerates. They no doubt are the ones maintaining them and inventing new ones like SARS. War and violence ? Arms makers. Peloponnesian wars and Roman Empire conquests were due to lobbying by sword and shield makers of the time, weren't they ? Rwanda massacres ? Machete and knife makers. Earthquakes and avalanches ? Those search teams with these awfully expensive-to-train dogs must have something to do from time to time. Hurricanes ? Well, Home Depot must sell their stuff !

C?mon guys, these ideas are all the byproducts of damaged brains.

This is just about as intelligent as saying 9/11 was really inflicted by America on itself so it would have a pretext to spread its military around the planet.

This is all just so dumb. Conspiracy theory is really what remains when thought breaks down !

by jellimonsta

Logic is a little flawed in the 'Fire/Fireman' rebuttal. Fires can be a deliberate arson attempt, accidental mishap due to children and matches, or an electrical or other power source failure. So stating that firemen would be unnecessary without them is a non point.
Computer virii are always intentional and unlike the biological strain are always man made. I can see where you are coming from though.

by jorlanddean

Just like the Oil Companies who bought up patents on Carburators that would give automobiles increased gas mileage in the 1960's,to protect thier profits. What's to keep the Anti-Virus companies from hiring cracker to write virus's,there would be no money trail cause they
were already on the payroll.Now Norton AV is going
to do the activation process on new buyers of the 2004 AV..and additional cost for extra computers..they are getting us all where they want
us, by the you know whats.

by mlanphea

There certainly is a conspiracy on the part of virus and worm developers, though not all of them conspire with all the rest. There almost certainly are terrorists who are conspiring to do their worst to wreak havoc on our way of life, including writing virii and worms. But, there does not appear to be any evidence that major anti virus developing companies are in collusion with the virus and worm developers. I agree with Jonathan Yarden.

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