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Recommend a music service, please

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I'm about to stick my toes into the murky waters of online music services. I have no experience with music on computers or over the net, so I'm looking for recommendations on where to start.

At this point I'm interested in a service that will allow me to download songs for burning to CD. While free would obviously be nice, I have no objections to paying on per-song or per-album basis. Would this require software other than a basic CD-burner app like Roxio? I'll be using a WinXP Home box on DSL for this, if that makes any difference.

I don't have an .MP3 player and am not interested in buying or using one. I'm also not interested in streaming files to various output devices.

Thanks for whatever feedback this generates.

25 replies

by tig2

At iTunes. The significant one loves it.

I seem to recall that there is an Open Source equivalent. I will hunt down the URL.

by charliespencer

And that it wasn't accessible from non-Mac system. I guess that shows my level of ignorance. That's why I'm asking the questions...

by tig2

iTunes is an application that integrates with iTunes online. It is available for Windows. You are allowed to make up to five copies of any song before it is considered to be out of compliance. His whole iPod is backed up to CD.

The iTunes application is a nice music library tool that allows you to create playlists, and organize your music. You can select what you want to burn and away you go.

No such thing as a stupid question, Palmetto.

by ontheropes

Some of my friends have bought music online from Wal-Mart. They've burned them to CD using Windows Media Player 10. It was all pretty easy once you figure out how to navigate Wal-Mart's site.
Their site isn't friendly with FF, you have to use Internet Explorer.

You can buy a Wal-Mart gift card and put some cash on it. That way you don't have to give out your credit card number. You can even renew the gift card at a machine at the front of the store.

by charliespencer

I understand this has something to do with legal ownership, but that's about it. What's the impact on a guy who wants to buy music to burn to CD?

Thanks.

by mjd420nova

They stream music for free, just choose the genre and you get assorted selections. I use the smart recorder that's part of the Creative software that came with the Creative Audigy sound card in my computer. You get maybe ten cuts and then a 30 second advertisement, then back to selections. I save them as .WAV files, 16 bit, 44kc stereo, then I burn directly to a CD. They'll play on any CD player in that format. Most all radio stations have a stream of what they broadcast and are free.

by charliespencer

I thought "streaming" was an unsaveable (sp?) feed similar to receiving an over-the-air broadcast. I don't know if I have a way to record a stream feed; I'll have to look when I get home.

Also, what's "16 bit 44kc"? Is that good or bad?

I don't think I'm interested in what radio stations are broadcasting. I get the impression I would have to be listening to the feed, waiting until I hear a song I want, then start the recording, stop the recording, etc. I believe I'd much rather purchase what I want outright. But I completely new to this; please correct me if I'm wrong.

by oz_media

As more an mroe sounds require 24 bit recordings, the 16 bit is a bit too lossy for a straight CD burn.

The 16 or 24 bit refers to the amount of data that can be read, a sample or segment. THink of it as similar to a graphics card resolution ability or a monitor resolution. 640X480 was good, but with high resolution graphics you now want to use much higher screen resolutions.

Sample rate: is how many of these bit rate samples are read each second. So the common 44.1 reads 44.1 segments per second.

Imagine if each 'segment' is 16 bits being read at 44,100 segments per second per second, compared to each segment being 24 bits, being read at 44,100 or even 96,000 segments per second. The 24/96 will offer FAR greater sonic reproduction/resolution to your sound.

With MP3's that bit rate is lowered, by compressing the music (averaging sound, dropping similaar and duplicate sounds etc to make the overall file smaller).

You end up with a small file, but the resolution is lost, detail betweeninstruments, small nuances and background tones are completely dropped, resulting in a similar sounding yet flatter/muddier sounding file than the original.

by charliespencer

What do we mean by "five copies"? Do you mean to CD five times? Why would I want to do that more than once?

"Organize"? I'm a rather simple soul; to me, "organizing my music" means sorting the CD's by artist...

by tig2

The only five times rule is how they duck the copyright thing with music. They tell you that you can only transfer it to disk five time and you agree to live with that restriction.

A playlist is a group of songs that you want to play. I have my iTunes on my Mac. I can select a playlist of music that I want to listen to. I can also create a playlist to organize music that I want to burn to CD. We're creating a playlist of music specifically for the 3 Day. All of that music is stuff people enjoy while walking.

by oz_media

Walk this way - Aerosmith
Walk of Life - Dire Strights
Walk On The Wild Side - Lou Reed
Gangsta Walk - Snoop Dog
Walk Away - Alanis Morissette
Walk- Pantera
Dead Man Walking - Judas Priest
Dead Man walking - Bruce Springsteen
Dead Man Walking - David Bowwie
I Walk the line - Johnny Cash

Okay, I know you actually meant tunes with a good walking groove, Iron Maiden and AC/DC do that for me, just an incredible bass line that does nothing but make you wanna strut.

by oz_media

Not sure if it is accessible in the US, but I would think it is anyway. FutureShop has a bonfire download service, the RAW file quality is fantastic, well beyond most free downloads or i-Tunes downloads.

I just checked Best Buy, and they also have a DRM free service, meaning you can do pretty much what you want with the file.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=pcmcat130600050000&type=category

Now if you are talking free, as in P2P. YOU can download the UTorrent client http://www.utorrent.com/, it will allow you to search a half dozen torrent sites. Torrent is just a file name for the download file, the actual music files will be in mixed versions, mostly MP3 but some FLAC etc.

Just search for the file you want, find a copy with the most seeds (people with a full copy to share) and your good to go.

If you decide to run this way and have questions, PM me anytime. It may take a bit for a reply because I don't monitor that account. You can always prompt me here if you need to.

by charliespencer

What's "bonfire"? Is that a service name, a download technology, or something else entirely?

What do I do with a RAW or FLAC format? Can I burn that to CD and play it?

I don't think I'm interested in P2P. Maybe my ignorant fears of compromised security are outdated and unwarranted, but I still think of P2P as opening a door to my system and letting all the riff-raff in.

Thanks.

by oz_media

Yes, is just a serivice offered by Future Shop. As posted, Best Buy offers a similar service on a pay per tune basis that does not require DRM licence files.

FLAC, stands for Fully Lossless Audio Compression, in other words, you get the sae sound same fidelity with half the file size.

It will probably only play in your PC (you can download a free FLAC player or CODEC ((converter)) plugin for Media Player.), but the main benefit is high quality at half the size.

RAW was my overaxaggeration of a plain ripped file stright from CD no compression, just like FLAC is fully lossless.

CD for car audio etc, most burning software (Bero, Ashampoo etc., have a "burn straight to CD") shortcut. This will create a WAV file that anythingcan play,no loss from th eoriginal but large files, such as a sroe bought CD where you can only fit 15 tunes or so per CD.

P2P, yup, some old paranoia there. I can appreciate it, if you are not aware of what's there you can't be sure of it. Not to be confused with Kazaa and others, which were full of bugs and garbage, for teh most part Torrents are pretty good. THere are sites that will tell you which are legit files etc, so you don't download junk or dead files too...if ya ever get real brave, let me know. :)

by mjd420nova

16 bit with 44kc sample rate is the best for most players and 24 bit won't play on most players. 24 bit is really good, I use it on cuts I wish to play on the computer but won't work on car or portable/boom box players.

by oz_media

24 bit does require a fairly high end player, most decent home players are fine, some high end car decks will too, but not too many, as you had noted.

The key is to use a higher sample rate, 44.1 is okay but 96000 is going to be FAR more detailed and will offer a better soundstage.

YOur right in that medium for the average CD player is to use 16 bit at 44.1 kHz. If you want decent quality you should run 16 bit at 96kHz to really get the detail and imaging from the recording.

Or for a PC only, just use the FLAC format, completely lossless, perfect copy at half the file size.

by charliespencer

Right now I just shove a store-bought CD in and let it go. If I think of putting a stack of 45's on the turntable, will I have a good analogy?

by tig2

Back in the days of singles, when we chose a stack we were creating a playlist. When all the records had played, we would do it again.

Playlisting is a digital stack of 45s. By creating them, you get an hour of music by multiple artists that you want to hear. So I have a playlist that I pray with, a playlist that I like to clean the house to, a playlist for when things get freaky on TR. I don't have to choose the songs each time because they are already grouped the way I want to hear them.

by jamesrl

Think of it this way....

A good Italian chef may have thousands of good recipes up his sleeve. But at any one time, he wants to concentrate on a dozen or so for his menu.

A playlist is like a menu - it can consist of any number of songs that you have on your player. You can have one song on a number of lists. Lists can be long or short.

James

by oz_media

When Tig said she was putting together a playlist for the walk, I listed a heap of different tunes with WALK in the name.

For example: You could have a total 300 songs (or as many as you want)and group/list/reorder them by artist name, or song title etc. as you have suggested, or you can create playlists (you just select a groupd of songs and save them as XYZ playlist. No fancy coding or burning needed, most players allow a free playlist generator system, or you can buy software for more complex management or categorization (is that a word?) of your music.

Any of the 300 songs can reappear in any playlist as many times as you want, it's just a list of songs grouped by category.

Such as "Walking songs", "Heavy Metal songs", "accoustic music" etc.

A song that fits all three catagories could be in all three playlists, but the original song only needs to be stored in your system once, the playlists are just a reference guide that groups music together,

by mordacity

Amazon.com has recently started an MP3 download program - the thing that truly makes it beautiful is you download an actual honest-to-goodness MP3 file, and what you do with that file isn't controlled or monitored by anyone. You can burn as many CDs as you want, you can move it around from computer to computer - anything. Being able to actually BUY music in MP3 format (and not just 'rent' it - which is what you do with iTunes) is a HUGE step. And you can get whole albums for under $5.

by oz_media

I see your point being iTunes are simple licence files and Amazon, as with several
others, offer a full download for you.

The comment is a bit misleading: "actual honest-to-goodness MP3 file" An MP3 file is hardly an honest-to goodness copy, nor is it an actual copy. MP3 compression destroys music to no end, you are right in that it is an honest-to-goodness MP3 file, but that's not a decent copy, ESPECIALLY if paid for.
I don't even think MP3 make good downloads for free, yet alone buying one.

The loss is ridiculous, entire notes and instruments are removedin an MP3 file, it simply removes all 'similar sounds' so you lose an entire instrument sometimes as it sounds 'similar' to another note in the song.

I also find that many, notall, MP3's are full of attenutation. As soon a the music hits +3dB the volume is decreased in case it distorts. This results in music thta is constantly changing volume as the peak levels are reduced.

For am MP3 player, or something where audoi quality isnot your first concern, nicesmal files sizes, it's okay for most people. When you want to hear a dynamic recording or as is the case here, reproducing old albums which would fit in a normal WAV format, your best off getting an original copy, such as with Bonfire or DRM Free downloads.

Your point was correct but a wee bit misleading as ot the quality of MP3's. :)

by charliespencer

It sounds like a concept more oriented to an .MP3 player or listening to music on my computer. Useful information, but I'm probably going to concentrate on burning CDs. My initial goal is to replace my vinyl LPs, hopefully at a lower cost than replacing them with retail CDs (assuming I can find replacement CDs).

When I'm walking, gardening, exercising, etc. around I listen to NPR on a walkman. Play lists sound like mix tapes, something I was always too lazy to bother with. I just stick the tape / CD in and let it go.

Thanks!

by oz_media

A big subject simplified: "Most media are protected by copyright, but have a fair use clause which allows for unhampered use in certain situations. All existing DRM (Digital Rights Management)technologies fail to adequately make concessions for fair use, leading many civil advocates to argue that they restrict the legal use of content."

Basically DRM limites the copies you can make and requries that a licence file accompanies the song. Such as the case when Windows Media PLayer searches for the accompanying licence file in order to play the song.

DRM free means fair use, it means you can burn it to whatever you want as many times as you want, you can tape it, store it in your PC or even share it with others as it is not licence restricted. Mind you, SHARING music files is nto considered "fair use" whereas copying it for your own cdplayer, car stereo, computer etc. IS fair use. This fair usage is exactly how Canadians get away with file sharing, a law was passed here to allow fair use of media, making it next to impossible to sue Canadians for sharing files.

It is legal to have the file, legal to make copies for FAIR use, and legal to store them on your PC, it is also legal to run file sharing software on your PC. So if someone enters your shared folder with your stored, legal music, through a legal portal, it's prety hard to sue them.

IF you manage to work around all those issues and still want to sue a Canadian, then the supreme Court justice has already declared that an ISP offeringuser information is a breach of Constitutional Privacy Rights, so the ISp doesn't cough up the info, they are better off facing a small fine from the RIAA instead.

When you look at how the MPAA (Motion Pitcure Association of America) has now used open source software and then distributed it illegally with hidden code to track university kids downloadign films, you know they are just going too far, grasping at straws etc. Now the MPAA has breached a copyright themselves by not providing source code to their spy projects, so they have been told to cease and desist the rollout.

More info on that here: http://www.audioholics.com/news/industry-news/mpaa-dmca-takedown-notice

Looks like nobody has a clue how to keep gouging the consumers these days.

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