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Do I Have to Start Smoking Again?

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36 replies

by cupcake

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I relocated to the midwest after living in California for 19 years (I
know, that's a whole 'nuther discussion).

Anyway, one of the biggest shocks is not only the amount of people
who smoke, but the amount of smokers in technology fields. In my
group alone (about 15), there are 6 smokers! And the boss calls
himself a 'part time' smoker.

So the major pain is that most, if not all, of the smokers disappear
each hour for 10 to 15 minutes. I know it doesn't take that long to
smoke a cigarette (I've been a non-smoker for almost 20 years), so I
assume there is 'networking' going on. This leaves some issues open.

One, the rest of us have to pick up their slack. They aren't around,
they don't get the calls or assignments. Two, the discussions taking
place that involve work related issues don't get communicated back to
the non-smokers until most of the issues have been decided
(remember, I said the boss was a smoker). Three, I - and the other
non-smokers - end up working at least an hour to an hour and a half
more than the smokers and we're all on a 40 hour work pay scale.
Four - and this is a real issue - if the nonsmokers take a 10 minute
break in the breakroom and we're "caught", we're instructed to return
to our cubes.

I like the job and the people I work with for the most part. It pays well
and I believe that I have a future with this company. I don't want to
leave, but I don't want to feel that I have to start smoking again to get
in on the ground floor of projects and assignments and I surely don't
want to stand around with the smokers while they smoke! I don't really
mind that they disappear or that I end up working more hours, but I
hate the double standard.

I don't want to come across looking like a whiner or troublemaker, I
want to be the go-to person, but I feel like I might be missing
something by not having access to the "smoker's club" and the boss'
ear.

Does anyone else deal with this situation?

36 replies

by older mycroft

You definitely read like a whiner. [i](I don't know what you look like!)[/i]

Did you enjoy getting all that off your chest?
Did you find typing all this drivel therapeutic? Yes? - Good.

If not, try voicing your opinions in the traditional fashion. Are you a man or a mouse? ;)

by cupcake

Okay, I did not realize that was going to come across like
drivel... maybe its the new environment that I am in now
rather than the one I was used to in California. Perhaps
outside of that technology "bubble" the rest of the world
doesn't view smokers the same.

I'd appreciate some instruction here, Old Mycroft... ws is
the traditional fashion for voicing opinions?

BTW, neither a man nor a mouse... very much woman.
Does that make a difference?

by bfilmfan

I would say that if the smoke doesn't bother you, take the advice of joining the boss out there.

A lot of smokers just don't think about how their addiction can affect others when they are using. And being a smoker myself, but luckily not strapped to a desk awaiting the next assignment or phone call, so my cigarette is usually a chance to get away from the "Hey Jerr?" questions of people. A lot of them will just follow me on out to the smoking area and continue to pepper me, so I figure that potentially giving them lung cancer is a fair trade for their trying to see if they can push me into a psychotic fugue state! :)

Best of luck with that issue and keep us informed of how it turns out.

by jdclyde

Out side of California, the land of anything goes and where tolerance rules the land, you never noticed how intolerant your little circle was?

Most of the world does not look down their pointed little noses at smokers.

Sure, I refuse to be in a car with someone that is smoking, but in an open room or outside, I can deal just fine. Have sensitive lungs, so if there is to much, it causes me physical pain. I choose to remove myself from the situations instead of crying about people smoking.

I work/live in an area where there is a lot of manual labor, and shop workers are just the opposite where it is 3 to 1 smokers.

As for man/mouse, it is an expression.

Can you enlighten us the difference between a woman and "very much" woman?

by boxfiddler

and his smoking underlings. Doesn't mean you have to start smoking again, just go with them. Works that way at my place of employ.

by charliespencer

If they can hang out outside, so can you. Get a cup of coffee and stand upwind. Pass gas and dare anyone to say anything.

by jdclyde

you have a group of people, flicking their lighters, and you would stand up wind and let rip?

Can you say "KaBoom"? :0

by delbertpgh

Tell them, "Well, maybe it's a brain tumor, and you're just getting disorganized and forgetful. Alzheimers has been linked to smoking too, you know? I read that somewhere. Maybe you should get yourself checked out."

No reason not to have a little mean-spirited fun with the situation.

by ---tk---

I have to agree with the posts above, go with them, and stand up wind.

To give you a hint, from a smoker, about 85% of the time we don't talk about work related stuff... But then again, I don't go out every hour. I only go out once every two to three hours, and I make sure I am not out there for more than 7 minutes.

If your worried about working more, once they go out, surf the net, or read a book... till they come back.

by dixiedi

I haven't worked for just over 3 years now, but way back then, LOL we did talk business while having our smokes. We takled about everything else you can think of too.
I had quit smoking, I hate the cost, and started up again because I knew, if they have to go outside to smoke, so does the job, going out there with them, withiin 2 days I was right back at a pack a day... and I am still there! I hate the cost of the damn things.
If cost is why you quit may I suggest going with a cheep brand this time instead of a premium smoke. If it's all the health crap then don't stand in the middle and allow your fear to keep you from joining them in the ritual smoke.
If questioned about why you are standing out there with them but not smoking you can always say: "I enjoy this cold, crisp air or hot muggy air." OR "I enjoy the tar and nicotine you share with me, but I also enjoy the money I save by not buying my own." Anybody can respect that! LOL

by jdclyde

Think back, and which political party was seeking to save us from ourselves by working to ban smoking in the work place?

It is directly THEIR fault that smokers are forced to evacuate the building. And in most cases, it is more time going to and from, than actually spent outside.

If they were allowed to smoke at their workstation, it would never have become an issue. Is that preferable?

And yes, I have read about nurses and doctors STARTING to smoke after seeing the extra breaks that smokers get.

by tonythetiger

all those people who were complaining when smoking in the office was allowed still had the same complaints years after the smokers were cast out.

by tonythetiger

I've been trying to get that to work for years without much success. Whaddaya hafta do, drink gasoline???

:)

by jdclyde

whiners are to be ignored and shunned.

In Mi, they are trying to make it ILLEGAL to smoke in a bar. What is wrong, don't want to have your liver failure to have competition with lung cancer? :0

by boxfiddler

So far, they've had no luck. I'm thinking, give it a few more years, they will. The bars will go down, for sure.

by rob miners

to smoke just about anywhere. In front of buildings near doorways, Pubs, Clubs and Resturants. Although the Pubs and Clubs sometimes cater with an outdoor area.

I've been a reasonably heavy smoker (25)a day for 40 years and during the eight years that I had at schools I never succumed to lighting up. I always put it off until morning tea or lunch time when I had a chance to get offsite. I could have joined the other staff during breaks but it is illegal to smoke on school premises. When I was operating machinery with air conditioning I also refrained from smoking. If it had an open cab I was OK, unless it rained or there was snowfall. Now that will take your mind off smoking as you have to get the gloves off.

We don't go out very much anymore as I like to smoke with my beer and the atmosphere is completely different in a non smoking environment. The smoking areas that are provided are just somewhere to sit at a table with an ashtray. No jukebox, no pokies not even a BAR. And I thought that I lived in a free country.

They have taken our guns and our smokes but the stuff will hit the fan if they touch my BEER. ;)

by tonythetiger

They're completely overlooking another potentially dangerous health risk... Streets littered with the corpses of dead control freaks :)

by jdclyde

If the company would not have banned smoking in the first place, then the smokers would never have been TOLD to go outside and have a smoke.

If non-smokers hadn't been WATB's about people smoking at their desks, the companies would not have banned smoking.

It is the fault of the radical non-smoker who was trying to punish smokers, that you are now the one being punished instead.

Now, go slap a non-smoker and you will fell much better. B-)

by slart58

"A study found that people who were exposed to smoke in the workplace were 17% more likely to develop lung cancer than those who were not exposed. "

Almost a 20% chance increased that I will have a debilitating disease discourteously imposed on me?

WATB? Excuse me?

by tink!

- If you're worried about missing decisions made during the "smoker's meeting" then, yes do the cup of coffee thing and join them OR directly ask one of them if anything happened after the break.
- About the extra time and breaks try to get your boss to allow a 10 minute break for the non-smokers immediately following any smokers break.

by oz_media

Start smoking weed. Then when they all go out for a smoke, you have something better to do too, and you don't have to worry about taking up expensive cigarette habits again!

by xnavydk

its not fair and I am a smoker just so you know. You are not alone, a lot of non-smokers feel the same way. What would happen if your boss was a non-smkr. You would be seen as the one who's always on the job. And I bet the smoking club time would drop to a smaller few. I would also bet that only one or 2 would be gone at a time rather then all six of em. Its a double standard. I normally work with one or two people and I was the smoker and the supervisor. They always knew where to find me when they needed me to sign something...

I dont think your a whiner, everyone is allowed to rant. But I would say depending on the atmosphere, take a break with your non smoking cohorts and do the same when they get back. A few times of that will make some heads turn i think, but thats the passive agressive in me talking. <-)

by slart58

Hello, I had a few other posts on here but then I realized that my boss could simply google my screen name and find my rants that were supposed to be pressure release until I found a solution. Anyway, it's really encouraging to find a smoker that agrees. AND practiced courtesy. Just to know that there is one smoker out there that is courteous is relief. Thanks for your post.

by maxwell edison

If you can show that you work 10 percent (or so) more hours than the smokers, but yet you are compensated on the same scale, then you do indeed make a valid observation. But instead of trying to stop the smokers' behavior, try to negotiate something equitable for yourself. It might not be realistic for you to sit in the break room doing nothing for the same amount of time, which you probably don't want to do anyway, but perhaps you can use it as a negotiation point to get something extra for yourself.

Do the math: 10 minutes per break, times four breaks a day, equals 40 minutes per day ..... times 5 days equals 3.3 hours per week ..... times 50 weeks equals 165 hours per year. That's pretty significant - it's 20 days ..... or four weeks.

In your next review, or whenever it might be a good time, say something like this. [i]Here's what I've observed. The smokers actually work 165 hours per year less than I do. I wouldn't want to make waves by trying to put a stop to it, and I'd look rather silly taking a non-smoking break at the same time, but I still do work a significant number of hours more per year than they do and for the same compensation scale. I think it would be fair to bump my salary into a higher range, or maybe add an extra week vacation, or something. What do you think?[/i]

My guess is that it would probably make them realize how much lost productivity they're allowing.

If they're totally non responsive, then it might appear that you work for a company that has double-standards. In which case, you can live with it or....... well, you know.

Related information:

http://blog.lawinfo.com/2008/06/13/sucking-down-the-breaks-smokers-and-the-workplace/

http://www.jerryodom.com/smoke-breaks-second-rate-workers.html

http://www.vitabeat.com/study-average-smokers-spend-30-minutes-a-day-on-breaks/v/5806/

http://www.jointogether.org/news/research/summaries/2007/cigarette-breaks-absences.html

I think you have a valid complaint. The trick will be to discuss it with people who matter, and to do it in a way that doesn't sound like sour grapes.

By the way, the last time I worked in Missouri (1990), there were no workplace smoking laws, and I (a non smoker) worked in an office where several people smoked at their desks. I reeked of cigarette smoke every night. At the time, if I had my choice, I'd rather they took it outside. And on balance, I wouldn't have cared if they got extra break time.

As an afterthought. Whether it's dealing with kids, or employees, or employers, or whomever, one has to choose his/her battles carefully. Look at it as though you have a limited number of chips to play when you enter an argument or negotiation. If you play your chips too often, you'll lose more often. I try not to waste my chips on minor or insignificant matters. I'll save them for those times when I really want to win - for the big things.

P.S. No, don't start smoking again. My brother, a life-long smoker, was recently diagnosed with having advanced stage cancer. The doctors say it was, most likely, caused by smoking.

by slart58

Thanks for the reply. I really wanted to get a rational objective look and I knew someone on TR would be able to bring it. Thanks for the thoughts!

by jck

California has some of the most stringent no-smoking rules in America, jd. ;)

by jck

They cracked down on hourly-paid smokers, telling them they had 2 paid 15 minute breaks a day, and up to 1 hour for lunch unpaid.

If they took any more than 30 minutes worth of breaks for smoking, they would be docked from their time for it.

They had put in security cameras and all, and the interim director had the viewing software put on so he could glance in on occassion and see if someone had been outside a long while.

I hate that they are having business conducted in an environment where it is not preferred by others to be.

I feel for ya, but until the policy there changes...i'm sorry to say you're probably either stuck out of the loop, have to go down and tolerate the smoking, or start up again and join them.

by shellbot

Now thats a bit much, really..
I'm a smoker..
I have one on my way into office at 8.55, another at 11.00 (I take 15 mins while ALL others are on a 30 minute tea break in the canteen), then on lunch hour my business, then at 4pm I take another 7 min break for a smoke while everyone else is having a 15-20 min tea break.

So..I actually take less breaks than my non smoking co-workers..so if one of them DARED whine about my smoke breaks I'd raise heck!

Personally, taking a 10 min break every hour is ridiculous..but as the boss is taking them as well, what ya gonna say really..if the boss wasn't out there..they'd be quicker..

Its like going fo rlunch with the boss in the group..always longer because he dictates when we go and when we leave..

by tonythetiger

our complex is made up of six buildings... and it seems I often have an excuse to walk to one of them :)

by slart58

I suppose I would just remove myself from my desk where I am suffocating instead of "whining"?

It actually causes you physical pain and you just allow it? Like if someone was hitting you in the face you would let them until you could get away?

by cupcake

So since I started that discussion, lots of things have happened. Of the initial group of smokers, two have left and one quit due to a recent diagnosis. And the company had a re-org and my boss - much as I liked him - is no longer the boss for my group. We have a 'remote boss' who is a mother of two young kids and a non-smoker. Amazing how when the boss stops "advocating" (directly or otherwise) things change in suit. Now its the non-smokers' advantage to be available when she's looking for us.

In a weird way, the whole situation turned around and is now to the advantage to be a non-smoker!

Thanks to everyone who wrote with suggestions, comments and observations. I had totally forgotten about this thread until I seen it show up today!

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