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A great documentary I missed the first time

By Oz_Media ·
HAVE WE ACTUALLY MADE A DIFFERENCE IN AFGHANISTAN?

A detailed one hour look into the lives of Afghani women before and after the war, showed the results were not long lived.

Kandahar women must still wear a borqa anytime they are outdoors or else they will be beaten with sticks or anything people can find. Kandahar is still mainly occupied by the Taliban followers and operatives, even though there are schools for women, most are afraid to try and go to them, Others face armed thugs at the doors, instead of security, that often harass and humiliate the women publicly.

In the ?better off? areas of Afghanistan women flocked to Dr. Simi Samar, who I?m sure pretty much everyone is aware of by now, was the women?s affairs minister in Afghanistan until the interim government threw her out for suspected slurs against Islamic principals. She was forgiven for this after explaining she was misquoted by a Canadian reporter and then she was thrown from her position for showing her naked head in public and encouraging other women to do so.
She founded Shuhada Organization http://www.shuhada.org/ , ?a non-governmental and non-profit organization committed to the reconstruction and development of Afghanistan with special emphasis on the empowerment of women and children.?

She has been to the French consulate, The Russian consulate and British Consulates in Afghanistan and had no help in increasing security at these schools and hospitals, where Afghan women are trying desperately to build new lives. It?s seen as too expensive logistically. She met with personal friends of the US consulate and still was denied security funding or troops to support policing these areas where bombings are a constant reminder of the war with the Taliban.

When the female reporter visited Kandahar before the war, she was abducted and taken to a Taliban encampment, where she had ?one long sleepless night? with ?searchlights though my window every 30 seconds.?
In the morning she was released and thrown out of Kandahar.

Upon returning for the first time since the war the area is mainly Taliban occupied, DAMN scary looking place, not the usual bright sunny skies over top of little mud huts, but actually reminiscent of a red light district or underground. There wasn?t a woman in sight and the reporter was quickly shooed off by Taliban. This is AFTER the war.

While walking with what were supposed to be free women in Afghanistan, a group of local men were outside a small shop like building and were swearing at the women and waving sticks at them. When asked why, they said it is wrong that these women are showing their heads in public here, and criticized the reporter as a trouble-making infidel who was not wanted in their land.

The women do not have the freedoms we are lead to believe they have, the Taliban may be gone from the most populated centers of Afghanistan but for the most part, everyone still fears the Taliban in Kandahar. The general population still consists of Islamic fundamentalists

When Dr. Sumara was exiled from Afghanistan after being ousted from the Interim government (which was mainly filled with known Taliban supporters) she was ?rescued? by the UN and protected by them. She claims the UN is the most important force in Afghanistan now but are simply too few in number.

Very interesting story and it really makes you think. Will they actually survive the fight now and keep their heads above water or are they going to fall straight back into the same former repression they always lived under. Judging by the interviews with Islamic fundamentalists, and leaders and footage shown, I would say at this point it looks worse than it looks good. It IS possible I think to turn it around, but not with the current lack of restoration funding and troop support in the form of security and plain presence. Daily bombing still occur, ordinary residents still seek to harm the ?infidels? and Taliban operatives still have the majority rule in Kandahar.
Women are still not allowed to be in public without a borqa, they still get spit on and it with sticks in Kandahar.

Have we forgotten Afghanistan? I know we still have troops there but in such small numbers they are hardly effective. They are under funded in their rebuilding of infrastructure and providing security during the rebuilding and liberation phase.

As one woman said

?We are still a LONG way from freedom.?

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Too many balls in the air...

by mrbill- In reply to A great documentary I mis ...

We needed to finish this one before we started another. It is almost impossible to change the religious mindset of these Islamics. They have been oppresing women for about a thousand years, they are not going to change overnight. We need to start re-educating the young men into thinking of women as humans and not property, this will take years if not generations. `

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Very True

by HAL 9000 Moderator In reply to Too many balls in the air ...

In these places "Honor Killings" are still accepted as normal! We also need to not only educated the young males but also attempt to enforce these lessons as well, currently there are only troops in the main population areas in any numbers and these are fairly hamstrung as well. Most of the South of Afghanistan is still controlled by the Poppies growers and their masters where a deal was made between the COW forces and these people that allowed the relatively quick take over of the southern part of the country as the Talaban had tried for a very long time to stamp out this practice. Now they are back in full production.

What I do find really amassing is just how fast these people can revert to their previous mindset as prior to the advent of the US supported Talaban who fought the Russians when they attempted to prop up the then Afagan Government things where completely different though not perfect by our way of thinking. What had taken many years to bring to an almost reasonable level of understanding has disappeared in a very short time once the Fundamentlists came to power.

It worries me when I see things like this happening as I wonder just how "Civilised" we actually are and how quickly we could revert to previous thinking if the conditions became right.

Col

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It's not something these MEN can be taught

by Oz_Media In reply to Very True

We need to teach YOUNG men and women, we need to teach children. Many of the men shown last night were muddle aged and VERY set in their religious ways, they have had this mindset and it is accepted as normality for generations now.

The thing that got me was how these women had a thanks but no thanks attitude to the war. They ALL say we left too soon ad don't offer the support needed to ensure their safety while trying to liberate their gender.

Requests for fuding or troop support were quickly shot down. And the only help in sight is the odd UN tank, although many countries still hae some troops in Afghanistan, they are few and generally only in KEY security positions and do not hae the resources or logistical ability to provide safety for these women, who when they walk down the street are still treated in horrific ways and do not feel free at all.

They continue to fight for women's right in Iraq but are finding it a lost cause as they have no goverment representation or support.

They say it is no diferent than living under the taliban except the nightly home raids and rapes have ceased.

So what did we actually do there? Nothing really.

We should have stayed there and finished the cause, we haven't liberated Afghanistan at all, the governmet is still headed by radicals and the streets are lined with them, women are not free, it's not all education ad hapy families, they are too scared to go to schools or hospitals for training. They share a giant community well that was destroyed after troops left and then gerry rigged to pump some nasty looking water after that.


Yay coalition! I was actually behind the war in Aghanistan, I agreed thet the Taliban should be hunted down and hung by their short and curlies as people swung from their....

These men ARE world terrors, they DID accept proud responsibility for the WTC attacks.

We just didn't finish the job and got segued into some side bar conflict with Saddam.
Which was neatly timed with troops leaving Afghan early, getting some rest ad being shipped to Iraq. I think there was a predetermined conclusion for Iraq, convenient that US had so many troops available at the time.

just to think that we coyuld have still had full support for these women in Afghanistan and we went to another country while leavig them to retun to thei old lives as if nothing happened.

HOW MANY OF OUR TAX DOLLARS DID THE COALITION INSPEND AFGHANISTAN? And it made no diference?

Now we are expected to support the same elsewhere?

Whatever.

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OZ I think that the COW got carried away

by HAL 9000 Moderator In reply to It's not something these ...

With the relatively easy overthrow of the then Afghan Government they honestly thought that they could just leave the place and everything would be all right. Well it isn't and to make matters worse the Allies who where brought together against the talaban are just as bad as what was thrown out.

Possibly it is a case of political expediency but Afghanistan is now in a bigger mess than it was previously and it concerns me greatly what will spring up from there once things settle down.

For all of his faults Ben Laden did bring in hard currency which helped the then administration now the only production that is in full swing in that country is poppie growing of which the Government see no income. They are bound to collapse as they currently have no solid industry in the country and I can see a reversion to something like the fanatical religious leaders of the past in that area. Whatever they call themselves they will be no better than what we wasted so much money in throwing out.

Col

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