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background checks

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In a recent article, Gartner recommended that background investigations should be required for all employees-including system and security administrators-who will have access to sensitive information. What's your opinion of this?

30 replies

by generalist

Personally I favor background checks.

Unfortunately, I can see a major problem with them, especially as identity theft gains momentum.

The problem lies with the accuracy of the information in the background checks. If a background check is required as part of the pre-hiring process, a job hunter could unfairly lose out on a lot of prospects if their background data is inaccurate.

Now if there were a process by which the job hunter could review the background check results and have them corrected, I'd feel a little better about them. But, unlike the credit reporting industry, such a process doesn't appear to exist.

by guruofdos

...and the Data Protection act in the UK are there for this VERY purpose!!!

Any data held on any individual must, by law, be accessible to the individual. Any erroneous or innacurate information must, by law, be corrected!!!

by generalist

According to one background check group, the Fair Credit Reporting Act provides the guidelines for reporting and corrections.

Now it would be nice if background check organizations took a page from the credit reporting groups and provided 'combined' reports for those people who want to know what will be reported before it is requested by a potential employer. When job hunting, I would rather not be blindsided by inaccurate reports caused by forces beyond my control.

by jkaras

I understand the need of that policy, however to me there is no justification for it. If your being employed for a job it should be determined at hiring whether your trustworthy or not. Any past indescretions that happened when you were younger weremistakes you made when you didn't know better. If you made any of these mistakes previously and you dedicated your life to doing the right thing, then why should you be passed over for something? What incentive does that give someone to strive to correct their life knowing that the strike in their past will always prevent them from success. That is why our system cant rehabilitate our criminals. If you paid your debt to society then it was paid and move on, dont discriminate. Also if you were in a bad relationship and you got arrested for a domestic dispute, the woman always wins regardless of the truth. Police always take the man away to avoid the possibility of reoccurance, and is noted on record. Is that fair? The laws are not all written well that get exploited by people that use these for revenge or jilted love. What's your opinions on this?

by lordinfidel

With domestic abuse (and all other battery and abuse cases)

If person A who is abusing person B calls the police and says that Person B is abusing A, the police will take person B to jail.

It is all about who calls the police first.

And notonly is it about who calls the police first, the Police, when called in for domestic disputes, by law must take someone in.

Generally it is the guy because he is the one generally doing the abusing.

If the woman is being a bitch and just callsthe police without warrant, the guy still goes to jail because it is not the police's place to make those types of judgement calls.

If it is later found that the woman was not in danger or made up the story. The state will usually drop the charges on the man, and prosecute the woman for wrongful imprisonment.

(My wife works for the state attorneys office so I get all of the good inside stories/information)

by tomsal

But like you said your wife has the inside scoop because of her job,

everything you said is also what I heard from the half dozen cops that are in my extended family and that doesn't include the three state troopers that are friends of the family-- everything you sayd is 100% true.

by tomsal

Your point has a glaring flaw in it.

Everything you say is going on the assumption that other people are supposed to know that you have made changes in your life to correct your wrong / criminal past.

How is an employer supposed to know you are a changed person? Take your word for it?

I don't see background checks being a problem, except - like someone else said - I am concerned about identify theft playing a part with background checks. And that's my only hang up with it.

As far as the laws not being fair - welcome to life. ;) I agree wholeheartedly that the US legal system has some completely off the wall logic behind it and in many causes I feel our laws actually put more burden on victims of crimes than the offenders.

Rehabilition should be completely thrown out of max security prisons, death row should be made way more efficient (start throwing the switch!!)...

Only minimum security prisons should even offer rehabilition programs.

by jkaras

I see what your saying Tom, but like I said debt paid is debt paid, you are a free individual granted the right to pursue fortune and happiness. The check you wrote to pay that debt didnt bounce, it cleared, but society refuses to accept that. It shouldnt matter about the past. A past mistake shouldnt be a nail in your coffin or no one should strive for a better tomorrow and give up to become a garbage man or return to crimminal activity. An employer isnt the cops or the government, and yes I understand liability issues, but come on. Our society hasnt grown in some time due to this outdated principle. And yes I agree and support death penalty if they are proven to be guilty and not to promote someone's career which has been the case lately.

by guruofdos

'Recommending' background checks?!!!

I'm sorry, but I assumed this was already a matter of fact in ANY work environment, and especially in the USA right now where paranoia is working overtime!!!

I work for the UK Police, military and various other security forces worldwide. I potentially have access to VERY sensitive information, purely because of the locations I have to work...my background is thouroughly vetted every time I go to a new location!

I would also assume that if someone applies for a job, and produces certificates, diplomas, degrees etc, that checks would automatically be done to verify that the paperwork is for real! If you read on an app form that someone attended, say, Southampton University and was awarded a BScin Electronics, one quick phone call to the University should be able to verify that fact!

As far as personal background is concerned, one fax to your local police department should be able to genrate a 'criminal history' if there is one.

Youwouldn't employ a childminder to look after the kids if they weren't registered with the local authority and been vetted by the police! Here in the UK, teachers now have to be PV'd by the police before they can work in schools without supervision.
So 'advising' that companies perform checks seems crazy! I expect that's why there have been so many scandals (Enron, Anderson, MCI etc.)in the USA...perhaps over there pre 11/09/01, no one bothered to check!!!

by lordinfidel

Here in the US, if background checks were done on the exec's, there would be no one to run the public companies.

I think that you are a english terrorist bastard still bitter that we took over your colony. And you want our society to collapse bymaking sure our heads of businees are not criminals.

Damn it man, does capitalism mean nothing to you.

by guruofdos

Damn! LordInfidel did a background check on me!!

That's my plan for global domination shot down in flames!!!

by guruofdos

Hmmm...thinking here.

Who's Bush about to kick the shit out of?

Iraq.

Who was responsible for '9/11'?

Al Qaida.

Excuse me, but in the English Language (and most other languages including French and Spanish), I understand that the letter Q is ALWAYS followed by a 'u'. As in Queen, queer, quirky, quill, quest, question, queue etc....and in Spanish, Que?, queso, quatro...and in French, quelle, qui, quelque, and so on.

The only place it is used without the 'u' is in Arabic names/words...

As in Qatar, Al Qaida, Iraq...etc.

Oh, and COMPAQ!

Does this mean that this company, along with Saddam Hussein and North Korea is part of the 'Axis of Evil'?!!

Jes' wonderin'!!!

:-)

by maxwell edison

I’ll get on to addressing the question at hand after I remove my qiviut lined jacket, removing my qintars from the pockets first, of course, and get busy pounding away on my qwerty keyboard. I like to listen to my “best of the qin instrument” CD, so let me put that on. I hope my nonsense, but with real words, won’t escape you like a twig floating through a qanat, or get lost like a pine needle among qats.

What was the question? Oh yea’.

Does the letter U always follow the letter Q?

I’m not sure.

by maxwell edison

The way you asked the question indicated that it was "...recommended that background investigations should be required for all employees-including system and security administrators-who will have access to sensitive information."

The key words here are "should be required".

I have to wonder, which "big brother" is going to "require" (i.e. force) some autonomous business to do it? And how will that "big brother" enforce such a "requirement"?

And who will define "sensitive" and/or determine those gray areas that may be considered sensitive to some but not to others?

by guruofdos

Don't do the crime. Surely the fact that you are going to put a black mark in your history and know that this will affect your future should be enough incentive to not do wrong.

The system in the UK for motoring offences means that penalty pointsstay on your licence for three years. Earn 12 points on your licence and that's it....revoked for 12 months. I could commit 4 speeding offences in the same day at three points each and lose my licence, or I can speed once every 364 days and then lose my licence three years minus one day after my first conviction. The end result is identical....I still lose my licence. Doing it in one day means that 12 months later I get my licence back and three years down the line, it is 'clean'. Doing it the second way means that I will have penalties on my licence for 6 years, and be banned for one year.

Same offences....very different record!

The fairness comes in interpreting the history and making a judgement on whether or not to hire. One bossmight not employ someone because they have offended in the past, but have done their pennance and it was a long time ago, another may say that a few minor offences over a longer period of time is more serious.

Half the battle is not the contents of the report, but how it may be interpreted, and two different employers may have different values!

by mrafrohead

Personally I think background checks are bogus.

Those of us that were good at what we used to do didn't get caught. Which means you now look at a persons little piece of paper and say, "looks good to me" but you were actually blindsided because you just hired the biggest [enter word here] theif in the whole blasted county.

So they don't work as far as I am concerned. Not to mention, what Jkaras pointed out is beyond the truth. If you get busted for something, and some chucklehead making hiring decisions sees this on a piece of paper, more than likely you're going to be filed right in the round container.

It's a black mark that will FOREVER be there and they should not be able to be used.

They are completely inaccurate I would say in at least half of the cases.

That isn't fair to anyone. If you are in charge of hiring, that means you should be good at reading people's character. If you can't do it yourself and have to read a phr33kin piece of paper, then you shouldn't be hiring people. Being a judge of character is a very important piece of the hiring process, and there is no paper that can ever truly convey a persons character/aura/ethics/morality/etc.....

Mrafrohead

by zlitocook

Most folks who know how to do things that they will check for have done what needs to be done so that they will not be found with a back ground check! Some people were removed from list because of help given to our government. If a check of a personis done it will show a compleat nonperson or a person who has not been looked at. A person like that has a hard time in any position!

by oldefar

Most people have no idea what is being looked for with background checks. They assume its a general check on criminal activity which would then make someone unemployable.

In fact, they are looking for vulnerabilities as much as past crimes. Debt problems may make someone vulnerable to selling sensitive information. An old indiscretion may make someone vulnerable to blackmail. It isn't the teenage auto theft, its that this information is being hidden by the now model adult that makes it important.

Advice for this - be open about your past and the background check will not be a threat.

Exceptions are those with adult history of criminal acts. Embezzlement and fraud makes employment in finance unlikely. Child molestors are bad risks for companies dealing with kids.

Also, a past that is embarrasing to the employer is a killer for the applicant.

by mrafrohead

I like the reference of " Also, a past that is embarrasing to the employer is a killer for the applicant."

I find this humorous for one reason. And I do not mean that it's funny to hire someone that killed someone. I do NOT believe that is our place here on this rock we currently inhabit.

This is also why I feel background checks are crap.

I have a good friend of mine. My friend is now spending ten of his young years of life in prison. You see, my friend was out at a bar one night,and some schmuck kept trying to pick a fight with my friend. My friend kept trying to get the guy to leave him alone. Finally the guy hit my friend. So my friend grabbed his beer and hit the guy over the head with it. It knocked the guy to the ground. When the guy hit the ground, his head hit the floor overly hard and it killed him.

A few things about my friend. He's a peaceful guy. When I knew him, he was NEVER out to hurt anyone or cause problems. A few times, he was there to keep me inline.

The autopsy confirmed that when my friend hit the kid, that the hit didn't kill him. What did it was when his head hit the ground.

The judge in the case told my friend, "that what he did was not his fault, but that he was involved in a violent situation. For that I am making an example of you." My friend got ten years for this. Some schmuck starting a fight with my friend, my friend stands up for himself after trying to peacefully resolve the matter. Now he's in prison for TEN YEARS.

And that's just the beginning. Because now, every time a background check is done on him he's going to have problems. Will probably only be able to work at gas stations from now on.

by mrafrohead

Now reading this. Every one of you would probably not hire this person because of this dent on his record.

But here's my point. He's not a bad person. What happened was not his fault, but he was punished for it. And there is no piece of paperthat can convey what REALLY happened.

I hope I got my point across alright.

Mrafrohead

by dclalic

Background checks is necessary specially if the business your in is highly/tightly competitive.

by jcritch

Background checks are very important. The corporation should notify a individual that a decision was made based upon historical record and should respond to the applicant where the derogatory information was found.

I recently was unemployed for5 months and some corporations where upfront that criminal, credit, employment history and reference information would be used to screen applicants BEFORE a interview even begins. I checked my credit reports on all 3 reporting agencies, plus the local credit bureau to verify accuracy of the information my reports contained. I knew I had no criminal background to worry about. This is a employers market and corporations need to protect themselves in this economy. The investment in hiring a candidate who will benefit your organization is less than the damage which can occur if you hire someone with a dubious background.

by jkaras

There is no 100% to determine whether someone will be completely trustworthy. The only difference that I approve of a backround check is for someone that is responsible for the care of children to ensure the safety and reduced chance for abuse and for people responsible for protection ex. cops ect... As for credit history? Come on that's someones business that doesnt effect how the business is run or how they do their job. I dont really know of anybody thats not in debt or hasnt bounced a checkor paid some bills late. Only job competency should be the concern, a manager needs to keep on top of its employees to reduce this eventuallity or their not a very effective boss that has no idea what his/her employees doing.

by jkaras

I get what your saying but, do you think someone guilty of a past crime would actually commit the same crime while employed with the company? Who do you think would be the first suspect? I doubt because you hire someone without a crimminal past thatthey wouldnt be tempted or commit a crime. I have taken psych tests to determine my mind set for a job before. The first time that I took it I failed it because I answered it honestly that I would tell on a fellow employee that was stealing, but I wouldnt turn my mother in for stealing pens displaying inconsistant behavior. I retook it and answered that I would turn everyone in and that I was the complete angel and got the job. Everyone has indescretions, secrets that could embarrass one's character, but doesnt make someone a bad person. People will choose to do right or wrong for what ever the reasons. It is fact(my experience working with loss prevention) in all companies that I have worked for that have shown me proof that majority of theft in a business is not from shoplifters, but from disgruntled employees getting back at the company for whatever happened to them. I have seen old people, management, among other people that had no real need or reason to do this, but did anyway.

by timwalsh

I feel a lot of you are missing the point of this question entirely and are concerned about non-exsistant issues.

Although I didn't read the referenced article, I think I understand the gist of it from the question.

This is not about "Big Brother." This is not about any Government body or industry organization needing to enforce any requirements. This is not about invasion of privacy or whether people with previous criminal history have paid their debt and deserve a second chance.

This is solely a question about an Industry Analysis and Research company (Gartner) making a RECOMENDATION that anybody hiring employees with potential access to sensitive information (personal, financial, proprietary, etc.) should require background checks on those employees. The extent of the background check is left solely to the company wanting the background check, based on their security concerns. It is only common sense that any company should conduct "due diligence" to ensure that any potential employee is not a potential danger either to the company or it's employees.

by jkaras

Hey Tim, dont ruin our little arguement/debate with that silly common sense stuff! We were having a perfect little arguement till you chimed in. For Christ sakes man, pick a fight! LOL

by timwalsh

I have this pet-peeve about blowing things out of proportion. Disregard my counter-rant. Continue as you were.

by larrycannone

Statisticly speaking it will be a true deterent to investigate new hires as you stated, inevitably there are those who posess the ability and the mindset of criminals but just have not been caught. In the end someone with a shady back ground irrelevent to the currrent issue has his rights to work trampled on by a fish net system that is imperfect and can be overly judgemental.

by mrafrohead

With the piece of shite machines that they put out, they're first on the list my friend. They are what keep the axis spinning;)

by guruofdos

Agreed...

Re-arrange the letters in Presario and get

I Pro Arse!

Well, these machines are the 'butt' of a fair few jokes!

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