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Does IT really need more H-1B visas???

By sleepin'dawg ·
I think this is interesting. Does any one wish to comment. There are definite pros and cons to this.,1895,1958075,00.asp

BTW, 1AW unless you have something intelligent to say, without a load of sugar, please keep your opinions to yourself and have the common decency to stay away from a topic of which I seriously doubt you have sufficient experience or expertise to comment on.

Dawg ]:)

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Personal opinion? NO

by Tig2 In reply to Does IT really need more ...

Thanks for the link Dawg. It helps to have read the opinion that is beginning the discussion.

I have been watching the H-1B impacts on my profession for some time now. My question is why the debate?

The theory is that H-1B workers fill jobs that CANNOT be filled in the US. I take some exception to that. I just watched a company that chose to outsource their IT to an American company, choose to re-assign that contract. That's fine. If they think that sending the work to India is the best choice, so be it. But to imply that those jobs couldn't be filled by Americans or legal immigrants is wrong. Those jobs WERE filled by Americans until just recently. And those Americans are now on unemployment.

While I believe that any company may choose to off-shore, I also believe that there should be a required honest effort to home jobs in the US. If you want a Visa holder for a particular role, there should be a requirement to present that role here first. And my question is if rate alone can be a deciding factor. I know folks that would be willing to adjust their rate for the right projects. I am among them.

The issue has nothing to do with the arguement that there are insuffficient skilled IT workers in the US. It has EVERYTHING to do with wanting the skill set at a cheaper price.

Another side of the arguement is found in my friend Sriram. A very talented developer, he was required to return to India, thus disrupting his employment and his wife's education because his visa had run out and it will be a year before he will be able to re-apply. Sriram had been in the US long enough to understand US standards and practices, blended well with his corporate culture, and provided an excellent work product. But because the system of checks and balances manages to a specific time span, he was unable to avoid his return date.

The H-1B system has been broken for a long time. Before upping the ante, I should think that an in-depth analysis be done to define how it should work. Don't assume that developers are in short supply. They aren't. Don't assume that a time span (5 years) is sufficient. It is not.

Innovation can come from the US- if it is allowed to.

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You are definitely right about innovation but...........

by sleepin'dawg In reply to Personal opinion? NO

here's a question for you. There are parts of the country begging for IT help and none is to be had while in other parts there is a glut of IT help.

There seems to be a general unwillingness for people to relocate and there is also an almost total lack of information where the jobs are unfulfilled and going begging. Don't you think it would be to everyone's advantage if the government passed out better tax breaks for relocation, filling the jobs with natives, keeping people off unemployment and just generally improving the economy by having as many as possible employed. So far that hasn't been happening very effectively. N.B.: I said effectively not that there haven't been any efforts made.

In an age of information, some of it isn't being passed around very adequately. Sometime you'll have to get me to tell you of some ofthe problems I'm having finding adequate people. Going the H-1B route will be a last resort.

Dawg ]:)

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Good Points but

by Tig2 In reply to You are definitely right ...

Isn't it better to improve the communicaton around what areas are in need and solution from there? I agree that EFFECTIVE efforts have not been made.

While I know that there is a shortage in some places, a glut in others, I think that there are better answers than increasing the H-1B cap. Telecommunication and job balancing are two possible answers. I can't be the only person on the planet that is schooled to spend active time in front of a computer and work- on Monday as easily as Saturday- and provide a good work product. In fact, I dare say that I spend more billable hours in a telecommute environment becauses the distraction level is so much less. I get up at 5:00 a.m. and am in front of the computer by 5:30. I only need time to shower and get coffee and I am ready to work. I generally shut down around 5:00 or 6:00 in the evening- mostly because I have a couple of hours downtime about midday that enables me to do work around home and still be accessible. I can accomodate clients on both coasts this way.

I have a heck of a time finding clients that are willing to let me telecommute as opposed to sitting in an office.

And even from the stand of on-site presence, I have been able to manage projects across Canada as long as I had access to email and a cell phone. I could be on one site in Toronto and answer questions about another site in Winnepeg. And I lived in the US. I was able to manage to client need and expectations because I was willing to get on a plane or receive calls and email. I have a friend who does HIPPA project management. She lives in a VERY small town on a lake (some folks!) and commutes to CT Monday through Thursday. I have done similar. It isn't easy but not particularly difficult either. What makes it do-able is flexibility on the part of the employer- and desire from both the employer and employee. If I am viewed as a commodity instead of a resource or, even better, partner, the chances that I will be considered for an out of area role decline dramatically.

I do understand that finding well qualified people is difficult. And while I doubt that this is your problem, I know that here, part of the problem is the way that HR reviews available resumes. If I am talking to an HR rep, I KNOW that they are not likely to have a clue about what I do and what I am capable of bringing to the table. And I have had HR reps tell me that they can hire a fresh out of college for less than I bill. Probably true. But not likely that they will hire the same foundational knowledge, mutiplicity of skill sets, or work ethic.

As I had said, I think that the H-1B system is broken. I would love to see a shift in how the gov thinks that fixing it should happen. Or even IF they see a need to fix it. Cap increase isn't the answer. You are right- tax breaks for relocation, filling the jobs with natives etc is at least heading down the right path. Do I think it will happen? No. It is easier to do the same old thing than it is to find a better path.

Edited to fix typos.

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what country?

by Dr Dij In reply to You are definitely right ...

if you're in brossard, QC, which is Canada, are there parts of canada that are lacking in IT personnel or are you talking about US? You mention H-1B but that is a US program..?

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my country...

by john.a.wills In reply to what country?

is the world, my countryment all mankind. Thus the Liberator.

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I am referring to the US where the greatest portion of our operations are.

by sleepin'dawg In reply to what country?

Canada already has programs in place to offset much of this but the problem in Canada is not getting the unemployed or underemployed to relocate as it is in finding them in the first place.

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I agree with that

by dawgit In reply to Does IT really need more ...

I think that when used right it is one of the best tools we have to achieve an understanding in and with the rest of the world. Work and learn in the US for X number of years then a return to the home country with capital and a realistic understanding of the US. Now you can't beat that with forign-aid. I disagree with his point about the lowering of wages with the program. Illegals do that. Skilled or learning semi-skilled legal (as in the H-1B program) don't. I think in the long run it helps America.

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Yes - Absolutely

by maxwell edison In reply to Does IT really need more ...

We need to have unlimited H-1B visas so big business can grow even fatter with even higher windfall profits. In fact, we should offer bonuses to people who apply for the visas so we get even more. Who cares if the American worker is laid off? Not me. Let them all go, if you ask me, then big business can really rake in the dough. Why pay people a decent salary when we can get others to work for peanuts? Then, with all those unemployed Americans, we can tax the **** out of those windfall corporate profits so all the unemployed American workers can live off the dole. That's the new American dream, you know. So bring em' on!

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Despite Max's sarcasm, he makes the point

by DMambo In reply to Yes - Absolutely

Or maybe because of his sarcasm. It all about the money. But I think there may be another prism. H-1B's might help to slow or avoid off-shoring. If these visa's aren't available, then there will be more of an incentive for employers to go to the workers rather than bring the workers to them. I'd rather see the jobs stay in North America than take the whole kit and kaboodle, including the peripheral economic impact of good-paying jobs, to Hyderabad.

Stiil, to me, the bottom line is to make higher education in the US affordable. This will provide us with the labor force that can fill these jobs.

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H1-B experience

by john.a.wills In reply to Yes - Absolutely

I was once the token U.S. person in a team of H1-B workers. My salary, which I suppose was the same as theirs, was the highest I had had; indeed, it is only recently that I have reached that level again. I do not believe that the H1-B workers are undercutting the rest of us.

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