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IT EGOS

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by fluxit 1 view

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One of the things I have observed over the years is that IT has a considerable number of testosterone driven societal misfits. For example, IT people often give themselves wierd alias names that provide insight into thier psyche. Moreover, when you get a room full of semi-experienced guys each of them know better than the next. Many IT guys go home and play internet games until the wee hours of the morning and develop these huge guts.

How can IT improve the character of the IT professional? Send the away to Dale Carnegie training?

44 replies

by chip4

That seems a little harsh there MrMiami. Yes IT folks tend to be a little different than the mainstream professional norm, but is that really a problem?

I'll give you my answer anyway, though I don't think it applies to most readers on this forum. I manage a franchise of IT professionals, each running their own business, so it's my job to help them improve their business which sometimes means changing bad habits. For example I think there's a noticeably higher percentage of the IT population (including myself) who have punctuality problems. What we do here is really emphasize why this is a problem (from the customre perspective) during training, and we reinforce this training with continual newsletters, meetings, and conferences. Maybe in your case you could arrange for your IT guy to get subscriptions to, I don't know, maybe some professional management magazine like Inc or something (or my personal favorite, Entrepreneur, but that's probably not what you want him/her thinking about). Maybe send him/her to conferences that are beyond the typical techie stuff.

But really I think some compromise is going to be needed here. Techies are Techies, and there's nothing wrong with them being different as long as it doesn't affect their job performance.

My $.02.
Chip

by dwdino

Has to be noticed with a grain of salt. Close to 50% of IT work is done at "non-peak" times. This means, that when everyone else goes home, we go to work. This means that vacation is simply working from a different location.

The reason I come in late sometimes is because I was up till friggin 2 A.M. finishing the web revisements required by the VP!

Thankfully, I have an understanding employer who see the fruits of my labors and remains flexible with me.

by lordinfidel

I'm not sure how I feel about that....

I actually like the stereotype of the social misfit. It gives me some sort of pleasent ease to know that my high school geekiness and shunnage by the cool crowd was not went thru in vain.

When done right it can work to your advantage, we get to dress how we want, we can tell people no when we need to with very little argument, and it allows us to be unorthodox thinkers.

There are 3 schools of thought on this;
1 school says aliases are bad, you should take credit for what you say. You should not hide behind a alias. -- I can accept that argument

another says that having a alias is cool and helps with my on-line persona (geared for the teeanger and on-line gamer)

The school I prescribe to when it comes to releasing my name is: Security thru Obscurity.
The same sites and newsletters that we read, hackers also read. Why give away who I work for and what I do. In my opinion, people who use their real names are only using them to either Impress someone or gain recognition for the comments.

I really don't care about either,- don't need to impress anyone. If I want recognition for a exploit then I will post it under my real name. But for posting purposes here or anywhere else, an alias is used. It gives me the freedom to say whatever I want with little or no repercussions to my profesional name.

by tomsal

...

Let me preface what I say with this...the last week hasn't really been that great in my world -- from personal life, relationships and work..the whole ball of wax...so if I offend with my bluntness take into consideration that a few days ago I wanted to pound people into the ground.

Anyway...IT Egos?

No. People have egos people are the ones that get bent out of shape, shallow, arrogant, upset, etc.

I don't much like the labeling thing. We aren't our jobs , and if you really ARE your job -- that's a sign you need a life in a major way.

Hey I enjoy the IT biz, why do you think I'm in it? I'm certainly not rich. But its what I like to do.

I don't mind getting tagged into the un "cool" crowd if that's what we are implying here.

Most people who act like they are so "hip" so cool

are soo full of it!

I'm human, I have strengths. I have weaknesses. I have no problem admitting I'm not perfect, so why the hell do others?

As for egos -- I'm one of the most modest folks on the planet.

And for aliases...A) I'm just not that paranoid, and B) I just was lazy.
lol

thanks for allowing me to vent.

Base point: People are people. In any profession you have egos, because its NOT the profession -- its the person.

by jkaras

Well put there Tom. I have worked in every form of retail and service throughout my careers (except the food industry, most people say how lucky I have been not being in there). This is my first introduction to the "cubical community" and I find it far more unprofessional than any stint in retail. What I have gathered is that everyone has a mundane job that they hate to do or feel unchallenged or unfulfilled of their expectation in what the job would do or mean to them. As a result they engage in backstabing, gossip, and ego grandstanding to give them some excitement in their boring mundane day of 8+ hours. I dont feel that these are bad people but the reality that their life isnt the exciting/interesting lifestyle seen on tv and movies or portrayed by sports or rock stars has them needling others to feel alive and that they are someone rather than a cog in the machine. This I have seen in all jobs so maybe its the put downs and jealousies of our past when younger and didnt fit in or went with the crowd to be liked when we new it was stupid. Everyone is obsessed with keeping up with the Jones since it proliferates our entire existenance. If you have power you will weild it to establish dominance one way or another so people can take note of you, that their is validation in your life of existence.

Off the soapbox back to the point; aliases to me are escapism to re-invent the persons individuality to gain confidence of equality or superiority amongst others. I tend to laugh at peoples aliases due to the obvious names dont reflect their actual self but who they want to be and cant. Some I find absolutely inovative and neat. I dont see really anything wrong with it except that in some ways it re-enforces people that their is something wrong with them that they need to be ashamed or felt inferior compared to others that they will never measure up, kind of like labeling youths with ADD needing medication telling them at a young age that they are defective when they are just being a kid. Have one or dont have one but ditch the ego, ego and professionalism dont exist in the same sentence. People need to stop reading into mission statements and work mantras of professionalism and just act like the normal human beings we are all supposed to act like, you know, adults.

by maecuff

The aliases, quirkiness, whatever does not bother me in the least. However, what I would like to see is more IT professionals who do not condescend (Think Nick Burns, your company IT guy). What we do is a job, granted it's not flipping burgers, but it is a skill that can be learned by just about anyone who has the desire. I can't tell you how many times I've heard other jobs dismissed as 'just a clerical position'. Well, some of those jobs can be pretty complicated and I'm sure none of us could just fill those shoes any time we wanted because we're IT. (smarter, brighter, gifted, whatever). I have a network guy who loves to call user problems ID10T. He doesn't anymore (at least not to me) If these people knew how to fix their own problems, he wouldn't have a job. We're supposed to be knowlegable, it doesn't make us better. And if it weren't for the users, where would we be?

by tomsal

LOL Maecuff ^5....

that was great..

Thanks for the laugh.

Have a great weekend.

by lmchays

I may not be totally qualified to respond to this since I am not a guy but what the heck, I am frequently "one of the guys".

I think the image of the obsessed wild-eyed geek appeals to most IT people. When I first got into network administration I told my sister that I was morphing into one of those people I used to make fun of. I still make fun of them but now I say WE instead of THEM.

I don't have a weird alias, but I think they are fun - sort of like role playing! I have a built-in image of some people just based on the alias! It would probably be totally wrong if I ever met them, but what the heck on the Internet you can be whoever you want to be.

I don't think most IT professionals go home and play Internet games until the wee hours of the morning. I would like to, but most of the time I am using Remote Server to check my servers, to update operating systems, to be sure email is moving smoothly - in other words WORKING! Most other net admins I know are doing the same thing. Yes, I check my email when I get up to use the bathroom and have been known to spen the next hour responding while wishing I was capable of just saying this can wait until 6 am when I get up!

I find most other IT people to be like the rest of the population. Some are fun, great team players and an additional resource while others are total jerks that you wish would just shut up and go away!

So I guess when you get down to brass tacks - the stereo-type seems to have more fun than reality!

by mallardtooxx

I think maybe someone dropped a load in someone's cheerios.

I am firmly of the opinion that the IT "persona" you are inferring here is BS. Most every IT pro I know is hard working and dedicated to their jobs. I know there are exceptions to that but it is that way in all professions. I cannot speak for everyone here but personally I have never had time, between work, Family, and continuing education, to do much of anything but move around between my bed and my job.

As for the Alias, I gotta nod to Lordinfidel here, I am not here for accolades, I am here because this is a good site. I don't care whether I get credit for what I say or don't say because this is the Internet, what will it earn me? I use an alias because it is a personification of my personal character not because I am afraid someone will show up at my home and refute something I have said. I guess the IT people you have met have not been all that great MrMiami but I think you are making a VERY broad speculation about something you seem to know little about.

-duck

by jellybeenz

You might as well be talking about "sales egos", "management egos", "engineering egos", etc. All of those professions have their stereotype. Actually, the IT stereotype has always benefited me because I'm not what some people usually expect from a programmer. I've had many users over the years comment about how I "don't talk down to them" and "speak in actual English, not acronyms". This makes them more appreciative than they may have been otherwise.

As far as my alias goes, not a lot of thought went into it. I got that from my daughter's stuffed Easter bunny saying "I luuuuv jellybeenz!!!".

Hope I didn't ruin my image here! ;-)

by dc_guy

The inflated ego is something our people can get away with because of a stereotype that outsiders have of us. The exceptionally intelligent, technically minded person, lacking in the social graces, but necessary to keep the computers running.

That stereotype is many years out of date. There are still people like that working in the commercial software houses, and every large IT shop has a few of them handling the really difficult problems. But programming today is nothing like it was 40 years ago, when it required the IQ of a nuclear physicist, the attention span of a cat waiting outside a mousehole, the ability to sit for hours without moving the lower body, and absolutely no people skills.

Today's programmers actually understand the business their software supports, can be trusted to have a pleasant conversation with end users and show up for it in clean clothes, and can't understand assembler language or read a memory dump.

But stereotypes die hard, and the few "geeks" that write physical-level code have a high profile in the imagination of both the public and the IT profession, and they keep this stereotype alive. Every TV show about fighting crime or terrorism has a computer geek and he's a hero. Marshall on "Alias", Birkhoff on "Nikita".

Every IT professional dreams that he or she is Birkhoff, with an ego to match.

As for the pseudonyms. Some of our employers have dicey policies about using our workstations. It's OK as long as we don't say something that reflects badly on the company. The best way to guarantee that is to be untraceable.

by oz_media

Well that's interestnig, I used to teach the ale Carnegie course and the DC sales course. I don't think it would help IT staff perhaps the How to Win Friends and Influence People, which is the basic "be a better speaker" course.

I find the people who are the best techs are just the guys who read page 2 of the manual. In most cases, staff give up before finding the right answer, most useful techs of ANY level of cert etc. are just guys who know HOW and WHERE to find the answers asw oposed to those who just know.

Just as a mechanic needs the right tools, a tech needs the right resources.

As for egos, in the case of computing (in MANY cases but not all of course) techie people are people with a massive lack of social skills and therefore become eclectic prima donnas who all of a sudden are important for the firsttime in thier lives. this is where most of the egos cmoe from, people who have always been popular or had positive social behaviour are usualy less excited about being needed and accept thier knowledge better as they don't have to prove ability to be accepted.

by pgm554

There are times when a techie is put under an inordinate amount of pressure by the job.

If you manage a large corporation IT dept and down time is measured at $10K /minute, and you are measured as to how well you manage that down time,this is something very few people can or are willing to do.

So saying that IT is something that any person off the street can do well is reaching to say the least.

IT is a varied skill set and requires IQ ,ego ,and determination.

Yeah ,there are characters in IT,but ditch diggers have there share of them too.

by oz_media

that is another thing I see too much of. It staff expecting to be overvalued for thier responsibility. As a sales manager, the stress and responsibility was tenfold what I get in IT.

As a sales rep, the same pressure is on you each day. Sales reps live hour by hour, they never know when that bad month is gonna come or if the slump is going to end before they lose thier job, IT is much more secure in that respect.

A receptionist has phenominal amounts of responsibility, as does the CO, CEO, CFO, CTO, etc. I think this is where a lot of the 'arrogance' tag stems from. Most people are used to thier job being high pressure and high responsibility, in IT it is relatively new to be lumped with these responsibilities to the company and having a direct relation to company revenue, therefore many peolpe put themselves on a pedestal for living up to the expectations.

I didn't say anyone could be a good IT staff member, I said ANYONE can learn IT and most are learning at a much younger age than we did as it is becoming commonplace to have IT skills.

I hold an MCNE, many people would feel esteemed by it, to me it's just a piece of paper to keep the boss happy, it doesn't mean squat regarding my abilities or experience, just a rag that some hold dear.

I have been in several position where massive amounts of money were placed on the line and I was responsible for the outcome, it doesn't make me more important in anyway and is not unique to IT. Responsibility is a part of life, in your case if hardware fails, you are not responsible for the losses, you are responsible for determining fault and replacing the hardware. In a sales position, if you sell below margin, the loss is directly your fault, if you don't make your numbers it is also directly your fault. As a manager, if your sales reps slump this is also directly your fault. IN IT, unless you pulled the plug you are not responsible for losses, just reducnig the lost amount by rectifying a problem, you didn't cause the losses though so the pressure is not even remotely similar. I have worked for major corporations, I have sold, I have managed sales reps, I have run my own business several times in several completely different fields, in comparisson, IT is a cakewalk with a fat paycheck at the end.

If you find it so hard, just think yourself lucky you didn't enter a really demanding career path. my aim isn't to reduce the importance of IT, it isn't to demean IT staff, itr's just that I'm tired of IT staff thinking they should be treated like professionals (doctors, lawyers etc.) you're not, bottom line. You're needed but so is the mailroom clerk or warehouse manager. You can be replaced just as easily and just as fast though as thousands with like skills, if not even better, are lining up for YOUR job.

A neurosurgeon is a lttle harder to replace than an MCSE.

by generalist

The subset of the IT population you seem to be focusing on tends to be the geekish types that are not the jocks or the socialites of a typical high school. During their 'formative' years they tend to be on the fringe of the so called normal population.

In many instances, they are a heck of a lot smarter than their peers when it comes to math and the sciences. But this specialized intelligence is rarely rewarded and often used as a way of 'shunning' by the more social set.

Sometimes these 'geekish' types have problems understanding the social side of things because it is illogical. Other times they have problems because being 'smart' from an academic viewpoint is trivial compared to being a top jock or the most popular person on campus.

To further complicate things, high school students can be very cruel to those who are on the fringe. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that a lot of the societal misfits were further alienated by their so called peers. It is a viscious cycle.

Given this, if you want to improve the character of this subset of the IT population, start in high school or earlier. Praise the 'brains' as much or more than you praise the jocks or the socialites. Support the idea that intelligence can be as important as sports.

Also support the idea that people have different abilities and that it is better to praise them for what they can do rather than cut them down for what they can't do.

Be kind to others, not cruel.

I suspect that there would be a lot fewer school shootings IF society shifted from the 'put down' culture that appears to dominate and went to a 'praise and tolerance' culture that some groups have.

There would also be fewer societal misfits of ALL types, not just the IT types.

by oz_media

You're right and that's how I see it. For some it is a new thing to be needed or wanted or responsible for others directly. You get to play hero and people look at you in awe as you 'zip' through rebuilding them and getting them online again, the feeling of accomplishment and praise is only human just as a top sales rep feels when he closes a big deal, a manager shows the pres the best numbers yet, etc.

When I attended school, there were nerds, jocks and headbangers too. The need fr segregation is automatic in such a largely populated environment just as we have sovial classes (is this also due to the sparation in school perhaps?).
Anyhow back on track,

As far as school today, yes there are some really nasty kids, there always was, is and will be. I don't think beig a geek is such a minority anymore because even the jocks and 'homies'(?) (man I'm getting old! 35 Tuesday)are using computers. EVERYONE has a compuer now i think, Ethiopian kids are going to be profiting in e-biz in no time! I don't think it is such a bad thing anymore, I used to laugh at the dork who sat home making his nme scroll on his Vic20 while I was at an Iron Maiden concert or partying at some bash. Now the geek is AT the bash too, he is running the digital video and playback systems, keeping the PC running etc.

I think tomorrows geeks will be the mainstream and others will be secluded, the same way we have these forums and chuckle at our users (nerds).

by fluxit

I read through the responses. Many seem to think that the IT pro is stereotyped or misrepresented. Others seem to think that the IT pros are intellectually superior to others hence advancing the EGO point. Some seem to maunder over a variety of disparate ideas.

A little background. I made this posting beacause I AM in a IT position as a programmer lead developing a web based application. I have been given a rag tag team of misfits who have various programming abilities. Yet one thinks he knows everything and is more than willing to express his off center views. Another one is proficient and constantly steps up taking over issues that are not his. Then he points out he is knowledgable and made the right decision despite the fact he just stepped on 10 peoples toes. Today five of them sat around discussing thier gaming feats, systems equipage, and the gaming teams they have put together. All of them have the worst eating habits and they FART all day long. In fact, each desk has a can of some kind of air fresher and when a FART flies they get in to spray wars. I cannot help but laugh. LOL.

I have seen many things and one thing I know is that many IT people are a little off base.

I attended Dale Carnegie training myself and found it to be annoying. In my mind, I was there because my company had lost focus on the real issues. In my group, was a Senior VP of a large company - he asked me why I was there and he felt that my skills were beyond the course. Whenever, I remotely applied myself I found that I commanded the class since many of the activities were the same as I did in boot camp. Only in boot camp I bellowed and had DI's screaming at me.

I think the IT character will only change as the IT industry matures. I strongly feel that the industry needs to be licensed like other professional services. Mainly to weed out the misfits and over population of the field.

by oz_media

You hiring more people? I LOVE fart wars, you just pack yourslef full of Chinese food (that's a nasty one!!)and smile proudly to yourself after each well planned conquest.

Mind you, I suppose we have a lot of online fart wars ourselves in these discussions. They accomplish nothing except making some people laugh, some people cry and others just take offense.

by voldar

a long thinking (not that long though), I want to say only this: your team members act as they have been used to act all their life long. It is not the IT specific, just a big lack of respect about the others. I am very sure that they would act the same even if they would be engineers/doctors/etc. It's about the "lack of the first 7 years of education".
IT people are not different than others; maybe they have only a "strange way" to express themselves (but not that different - give to an architect a pencil, he'll draw you the dream house, give hime the mic, he'll stair at it for some good minutes - the same is for the IT - they express themselves by their skills). I was and still am civil engineer (at least as background), but somewhere in my life I change my carrier towards IT. Not because of "it's fancy to be IT", but because I liked it more. That's the fact.
About ego's, I don't know what people you met, but I can assure you, IT people egos are far little than the architects/engineers egos.
As for the "alias", it's fun to have an alias. Haven't you had a nickname while in school? And mine is not even that "bright".
(poor english, bad typings, but wow, I did it :P)

by lordinfidel

We prefer a rousing game of ninja cd's.

(take your least favorite wall, draw out a couple
of circles with points on them and then hurl bunk cd's at the wall)

by oz_media

or get a nsty red line across the bridge of your nose (I had that one). We used to sit about 10' apart and simply fire CD's at each other. Flinch and you couldn't throw one back until you took a hit without flinching.

So in my everquest to stay the coolest guy in the office, I took a nice 2" slash across the bridge of my nose and into the top of my eye socket one day. Doh!, but I was still cool about it and laughed it off.

So if you're gonna chuck CD's just remember the guy with the sharpest edges wins, take some sandpaper to the office.

You should have seen it when I put a dart board up in the office, everytime someone put a hand on the board to remove thier darts, we'd let er rip.

You took a few perforations in the back of your hand but got really good at pulling your darts with one VERY quick motion.

Oh and then there was.....

You wonder why I work for myself now?
:-)

by tomsal

Becareful of saying in examples that "if this fails you aren't responsible for that" kind of stuff. How do you know? Do you know how THAT person's company specifically operates.

I can tell you with my company IT is held to the flame on every and anything technology related -- and this includes responsibility for loss as well.

If hardware failure occurs and we don't repair in timely fashion, if sales suffers because of it...I catch hell, as do my department associates.

Thankfully hasn't happened much in the 8 years I've been with this 9 1/2 year old company.

But my only point is I'm weary of saying how things are in other companies...unless we know how the company is run and the attitude of its senior management.

Me... well, I just do my work to the best of my ability, offer ideas and solutions to help things I'm apart of and then I go home each night and live my life.

by oz_media

"If hardware failure occurs and we don't repair in timely fashion, if sales suffers because of it...I catch hell, as do my department associates."

My point is YOU aqre not responsible for hardware failure, did you build it? NO. If it fails is it YOUR fault? NO.
YOU are responsible for getting it back online in a timely fashion, you are not responsible for the hardwaer failure and therefore loos is due to hardware NOT you. Now if you can't get thiongs up and running in a timely fashion, you are in the wrong indsustry. If you do get things back together quickly, you are usually "the king" but that's about it. You did your job.

The pressure of YOUR job is not to stop hardware from failnig, it is to notice problems, take preventative actions and if failure occurs, fix it. If a dead hard drive costs the company $40,000 for time lost, it is your job to minimize the losses and get things together again. You are NOT responsible for the drive failure or the money lost due to it. In other areas of business you ARE directly responsible for monetary loss due to incompetence or failure.

I've worked in many areas and had these massive responsibilities on me, they just don't exist in an IT world, unless you hand built the server components and convinced the company that your soldering job was better than IBM's.

It's like being a mechanic, you don't have the responsibility for the person losing a days wages when her car dies, if you can't get it fixed, it's your responsibility. The MAJOR pressure for a mechanic comes when you are repairing the simplest and most basic system, the brakes. If you fail, someone may die. many people write off brakes as something any backyard mechanic can do, I've seen hnudreds build them wrong though, no itr's not just swapping pads/shoes and turning a rotor/drum, especially with ABS or the load sensing brakes in newer pickups and SUV's.

I am not saying there are no IT responsibilities, but IT staff who think they make the world go around can sit back down, companies ran on pen and paper for two thousand years, they could go back tomorrow if they chose, you are a choice the company has made, not a neccessity. A sales rep drives the business, a service rep protects the business, we just keep it computerized.

by lordinfidel

That's one way of looking at it; it adheres to the first school of thought, don't use them.

I perfer to hide my true identity, not because I am ashamed or am trying to inflate my own ego.

But it stems out of my need to protect myself by not allowing anyone to know my real name or company that I work for so as to not disclose/giveway my abilities or lack thereof.

Actually I have strict guidlines set down to the rest of my staff to never post anything anywhere using their real name or company e-mail address.

I also do not allow them to use out-of-office replies. No need letting the world know that someone from the security team is not in the office.

So while some of you may see aliases as a bad ego-centric thing, I prefer to look at them as a neccessary evil while discussing technical issues in open forums.

by oz_media

Now if my alias was bigusdickus or girthman I could agree with Tom's post, and I aqgree that in many cases that is the exact reason for an alias.

In most cases it's just because people know the internet and know better than to use a real name or even worse, EMAIL address as an alias.

myself, I prefer to protect my identity as I often have very controversial comments. Seeing as I represent some fairly public acts and am in charge of thier promotional success and image, I prefer not to be personally associated with my comments. If they come back on some band's bulletin board it could be detrimental to thier image which is hard formed these days. I am under contracts with these people and don't want any misrepresentation due to my comments associated with those I work with.

Now everybody has thier own personal reason for not sharing thier full names online, although many know me from peer mail as I haven choosen to share this with them.

OzMedia for example really is a company name, my OLD company/associate company name and also a nickname.

I think it is general courtesy to not question someone's choice of alias or to summarise thier reason for choosing an alias with some phschological GUESS as to why they do it.

Myself, I think people who use thier real names or email addresses for aliases on the Internet are insane or just naive. Perhaps these people have no reason to distruct the internet, maube they haven't seen what can happen if you use your real name and someone doesn't like what you have to say. maybe our kids using sandwichkid, popsiclepete, etc on chat rooms is a good thing. I sure as hell wouldn't want my son or daughter user his/her real name on the Internet. I've already lost one neice to internet predators.

by fluxit

Well today one of my guys was technically correct but put out an inciteful and abrasive email. Emotions spiralled out of control and it consumed 3hrs of my time away from productive activities.

Now we are having meetings with the contracting officer and there is a blemish on our contract performance.

Could this be another example of IT people being societal mis-fits?

by oz_media

or the guy could just be an A**hole, a knob etc.

I don't know if we can attribute it to IT staff in general, but just a new way of thinking.

I remember a time, when I wouldn't be caught dead in an office or business role where I wasn't in suit and tie, prim and proper etc.

Now I'll turn up in a Judas Priest T-Shirt with a big middle finger on the front that says 'ram it down, shove it up'. People don't expect much from people like us anymore but accept that we are a wierd bunch that like to color outside the lines. Companies that are not seeing IT for what it is are simply falling behind the times.

I remember seeing high profile stock brokers and CO's in 3-piece suits sitting in the courtyad at lunch smoking a joint. Now they don't stand out as they are wearing jeans and polo shirts.

Formality has dropped from many local companies (west coast lifestyle has finaly won) and has been replaced with younger, more productive environments that have pool tables in the office, basketball courts instead of lunchrooms etc.

EASports was the main pioneer for the 'new' age of business in Vancouver. Then companies like MultiAcive Technologies (Maximizer developers) jumped on the bandwagon by having a horseshoe pit on the 25th floor balcony in the middle of Vancouvers business district, until the cops said that a fallnig horseshoe from that height MIGHT hurt someone.

Either way, we are a laid back and very casual bunch now, we have laid back and casual employees, laid back and casual attitudes etc.

Basically the "I don't give a damn about your job and I'll get to it when I'm good and ready" attitude has prevailed. probably because nobody cares if they lose a job, they are easy to find here. If you can't (don't feel like) find(ing) a job, it's year of Employment Insurance while you fish and go dirt biking.

Some here wonder where I get my lad back, couldn't give a rats ass attitude, well it's pretty contagious when you are surrounded by it and people realize that no matter how you act or what you look like, you can stil get the job done as good or better as anyone else.

A guy who owns a local racetrack (as well as a couple back east) is undergoing a 40 million dolar expansion to add slot machines. He offered me a job leading his IT department, my friend was at the table and chuckled "Yeah, he needs a haircut though". The owner laughed and said, "ANYONE can get a haircut".

He is also only 28 (took over the tracks from his father who passed suddenly)and understands that all the toppings and cherries in the world don't make the best sundae if the ice cream is no good.

to wrap this major segue up, I think we just need to learn that appearance and goofy behaviour play no part in a persons IT ability and must be completely ignored. Now if this is a B2B sales rep, it's a little different, you may want button up you pants first or even put on a clean T-Shirt.

by oz_media

Meds! Sometimes I wish I was still on the drugs I was taking during rehab. if the pharmacies wanted to move to the Dark Side, they'd put the crack and coke dealers out of business in no time.

by generalist

I once worked for a company who had a person who was VERY good on the technical side of things and VERY bad on the interpersonal side.

He was basically forbidden to talk directly to the customers. When his technical expertise was needed, he would log into the remote system and fix things while someone else handled the voice contact.

Perhaps you need to have some 'filters' like that. Find someone who may be technically adequate but is good at handling people.

by voldar

No, it is not. People reacts this way ? sending ?inciteful and abrasive e-mail? - when they feel they are disregarded, discredited when they do their work or when they lack of experience (nobody is born "all mighty knows everything").
I say that from human experience, I saw a few people reacting like this in certain circumstances.
When ?you? are always blamed that you "don't do that the right way", "when you grow up?" etc., ?you? start feeling angered, and when what ?you? predicted that will happen, it happens, well, ?you? really enjoy to show that THEY WERE RIGHT from the beginning, but nobody listened for them. It's some kind of ?I feel better now?.
But this is human nature; you can't change that in a blink. And it is not IT related only. I experienced this as civil engineer.

Just a question I have. Why do you think ITs are the worst? They are no more or less bad as a lot of other guys.
Two answers you may have:
1. you have bad experience with IT guys
2. you know only IT guys

A 3rd answer could be the following (and now, sorry for what I am going to say, but you started with "another day passed, another idiot did that" and that made me think about this thing):
- you are in a position to manage a team of some IT guys, but you don't know how to lead them, and you blame them for your lack of leadership.

by voldar

the above paragraph starting with :
>> When ?you? ...

should be read as:

>> When ?you? are always blamed that "you" "don't do that the right way", "when you grow up?" etc., ?you? start feeling angered, and when what ?you? predicted that will happen, it happens, well, ?you? really enjoy to show that "I WAS RIGHT" from the beginning, but nobody listened to "ME". It's some kind of ?I feel better now?.

(yes, English language is so fine, why am I posting here, to ruin it? :)

by fluxit

You are correct in assuming that he feels disregarded. The issue stemmed over policy. He was making clear the policy to the policy maker, our client. Not always a good move. He also labels himself on his calling cards as a 'frustrated genius'.

My experience is vast across alot of professions. If there one a single group I would call obstructionist and misguided it would be CPA's. I loathe CPA's. They are the cause for more failures than the other people who supposedly know nothing. I learned having worked for a corporate controller in a fortune 500 company and in a mid sized CPA firm of 30 people. By the way, both business's closed solely attritubed to CPA's lack of performance.

As far as leadership goes I am second-in-command and provide technical steering. When the Program manager is gone of course I am in charge. Coincidentally, I provided literally all the leadership to date moving this project forward. I wrote the Business plan, plan of action, technical specs and attempted to mentored these misfits. They are like trying to corral a bunch of wild jackals. They squeal like crazy. Especially, one who is a know-it-all.

Somehow if these guys would just sit back and listen, cooperate, plan, and think things through it would go alot smoother. I cannot change thier personalities nor did I have the opportunity to team build. They were given to me. So I have to make do...

by fluxit

One problem I will state is that communication is a problem. These guys are for the most part three-week-wonders having extremely marginal experience next to none. They know little about coding methods and techniques. Then resulting from the enormous gap in savvied knowledge, there is a ever present gap in communications.

In thier minds they can slap together text book solutions in a matter of days then move on to the next issue. However, I have observed that thier products are riddled with design flaws and latent issues waiting to rise up and bite us.

Any ideas?

by oz_media

Today I got an email from a telecom installation tech at one of my contracts. It asked that he be removed from the company's antispam system and he doesn't want to receive antivirus updates (I send them out as needed to remote workers)as he is now using a free service provided by Telus (local Telco), he went on to say it was his laptop and he will install what he deems neccessary.

My response was that I was unaware it was HIS paltop and was under the impression it belonged to the company (which it does). I said that if it was his laptop, I apologize and he is free to do whatever he chooses, BUT it can't be connected to teh company network unless it is running approved software. I added that if this was an issue he is best to take it up with the three administrators at his company as I am just enforcing thier policies, it is not my choice, I then CC'd not BCC'd his three admins (pres, controller, manager)so they were aware of the issue.

he then sent me a second email stating that it was wrong to send a copy of my response to his managers and that I had lost credibility with him (I don't even know the guy, have never met him), to which I was crushed (sure).

He said that his Telus AV was notifying him of viruses whereas the company's was not (it scans before the MTA and stops viruses BEFORE the desktop). He also said he gets no spam so he doesn't need his email filtered (?) and that he receives personal email and doesn't appreciate someone else possibly reading it.

Now what's wrong here: I want to use MY software on MY computer and receive MY mail as I choose.

Instead of: THEY (the company) can install whatever they deem necessary on THIER computer and I cannot receive personal email on THIER system.

Now this tech has also had NUMEROUS complaints by customers who think he's an arrogant prima donna. Some have refused to let him onsite and one has even had him physically removed from site. Yet the company employs him because APPARENTLY he knows what he's doing. Even though I got supported in moving to the Island because he couldn't configure a VoIP system for a major client and they wanted someone local who could.

So before we write off IT staff as the arrogant Prima Donna's of the tech world, just look at the other techs around. Just like plumbers and mechanics, they snicker because of what they know that others don't. But do they know, or do they just pretend to. Perhaps at one time they were top of thier field, but after building such an ego they feel they don't need to constantly retrain, perhaps they are left behind?

by voldar

That's my point of view also - every forest has its "bad trees" (I can't remember the exact word)
But I hope you'll understand :)

by oz_media

I just got email from his boss who is in his resort (he owns) in the Virgin Islands (bastard!).

He wants me to revoke the techs network access and for him to turn in his laptop for rebuilding. He will be allowed to use a desktop in the office and he has to buy his own laptop if he wants to do as he pleases.

I knew I'd be right. You develop some great diplomatic argument (not debating) skills at TR. What a prissy little Prima Donna pu**y. HA HA ! One more for Oz.

by oz_media

Your English trumps my typing English anyday. now I know that doesn't say too much but your points and comments are always fun to read, you have a great perspective sometimes, whatever you do, don't get discouraged by your English, it's actually quite good.

by voldar

that's a subject I can talk about for hours. The fact is that not the "communication" is the most important thing - talking to each other?s - but to be sure that you and your partner "get the idea" of what are you talking about! And at the end, you both agreed about the major "points" that need to be followed so that the project ends in optimal conditions.
I was witness for quite of few (read a lot) of discussions that ended with no result. Why? Because both "actors" were very sure that they had "the supreme truth", and the other one was "full of sh..t". And as always, the truth is at the middle.
When I was in the army, some long time ago, I heard the first time a saying like: "You do it by conviction or by constriction". I thought it was a BS, but well, life gave me reasons to reconsider it. Yes, sometimes, when all collaboration between the members of a team starts to fall apart, well, someone has to be the "iron fist", and take/make decisions. And BASTA! "You had the opportunity to say what you think, you had the time to prove you were right and you didn?t, well now, if you like to be part of the team, there are rules to follow. If you don't like, you are free to go!" And that applies for any "job", not only IT.
And yes, a good leader knows when to say "Stop!", and make the team work. My advice is, if you are in the position, start acting, don't let the team broke apart ? by convictions or constrictions :).

by voldar

send him to some "call-girls" (I bet "one" is good enough for him though, LOL), but not to stay there tooo much :D, because he has work to do. And once for all, say to him to let frustration apart orelse he'll get even more frustrated: "I had a job, I have it no more, how frustrated I feel!"
I am kidding, but, well, sometimes frustrated people should know that "frustration has a cure" :P.

by fluxit

IT professionals were like comedians? Can you imagine George Carlin or Robin Williams as a IT guy? Jim Carey instead of the 'Pet Detective' he was a 'Computer Helpdesk Tech'?

What would be even more interesting if Andrew Dice Clay were to be tech support to a bunch of accountants. LOL!

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