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  • #2272462

    Some very important questions (at least to me)

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    by maxwell edison ·

    Why are there people who want to prevent others from becoming entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?

    Why are there people who resent others who want to become entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?

    Why are there people who want to kick others when they’re up?

    Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re limited in what they can achieve?

    Why are there people who want to believe they’re victims of just about anything and everything?

    Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re victims of just about anything and everything?

    Why are there people who insist on remaining in their negative world?

    Why are there people who want to drag others down into their negative world?

    Why is it that many people see me as “the bad guy” because I ask these kinds of questions and want to live a life, and encourage others to live a life, of self-responsibility and self-sufficiency?

    Why is it that I consider myself one of the most generous people I know, with my time, money, and encouragement, yet I’m often called greedy, selfish and uncaring?

    Does anyone else ask themselves these kinds of questions?

    Has the world always been like this? Is that why people sailed the oceans and traveled across the prairies, with absolutely no chance of ever returning, but not really wanting to return?

    I must admit, I do wish, from time to time, that there was an ocean or a prairie for me to cross to get away from a lot of things. But alas, there’s no escape, is there?

    Or is there?

    Excuse me, I’m gonna’ take a break from these discussions for a while and listen to an old record album.

    Why do we never get an answer
    When we’re knocking at the door
    Because the truth is hard to swallow
    That’s what the war of love is for.

    Between the silence of the mountains,
    And the crashing of the sea,
    There lies a land I once lived in,
    And she’s waiting there for me,
    But in the grey of the morning,
    My mind becomes confused,
    Between the dead and the sleeping,
    And the road that I must chose.

    I’m looking for someone to change my life,
    I’m looking for a miracle in my life,
    And if you could see what it’s done to me,
    To lose the love I knew
    Could safely lead me to,
    The land that I once knew,
    To learn as we grow old,
    The secrets of our soul.

    (Edited to add a question.)

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    • #3144540

      As far as I can tell

      by jdclyde ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      [i]Why are there people who want to prevent others from becoming entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?[/i]

      These people use the learned dependance of others as a way to achieve power.

      [i]Why are there people who resent others who want to become entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?[/i]

      Because you will make the dependant people see that it CAN be done, an you might make them feel bad because their lives are wasted.

      [i]Why are there people who want to kick others when they’re up?[/i]

      Easier to bring others down than it is to lift yourself up. It is someone elses fault that you are the falure is easier to deal with than taking responsibility for ones own actions.

      [i]Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re limited in what they can achieve?[/i]

      Keeps them dependent.

      [i]Why are there people who want to believe they’re victims of just about anything and everything?[/i]

      It is made to make it so it isn’t their fault that they are useless and will never bother to amount to anything.

      [i]Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re victims of just about anything and everything?[/i]

      Keep the power.

      [i]Why are there people who insist on remaining in their negative world?[/i]

      Easier to sit around watching cartoons and drinking beer all day than to work hard to achive anything of value.

      [i]Why are there people who want to drag others down into their negative world?[/i]

      Misery loves company. Helps to validate themselves.

      [i]Why is it that many people see me as “the bad guy” because I ask these kinds of questions and want to live a life, and encourage others to live a life, of self-responsibility and self-sufficiency?[/i]

      Because it is politically incorrect to say something that might hurt someone elses feelings, even if it is true. Actually, ESPECIALLY when it is true. To think that you would expect to work hard to achive something, and actually KEEP what you earned? Not while there is a politician around that has votes to buy with your money.

      [i]Why is it that I consider myself one of the most generous people I know, with my time, money, and encouragement, yet I’m often called greedy, selfish and uncaring?[/i]

      Because people don’t see what it is you choose to do to help people. It is just when you talk about the corruption that allows the redistribution of wealth, that people are shocked that someone would say (let alone think) such thoughts.

      [i]Does anyone else ask themselves these kinds of questions?[/i]

      I try not to, because I know that I won’t like the answers.

      [i]Has the world always been like this?[/i]

      No, but it is steadily getting worse, not better.

      [i]Is that why people sailed the oceans and traveled across the prairies, with absolutely no chance of ever returning, but not really wanting to return?[/i]

      That was a different time, and a different set of people. People once had a sence of pride in themselves and in their work.

      Also, 20, 30, 40 plus years ago, there were a lot of people that were good people, but they were poor. They were proud and worked for what they had.

      Now, if you don’t have that flashy car, big house, and all the toys that go with it, it is somehow unfair and a bad thing.

      When did being “poor” turn into a derogatory statement?

      If you want something, earn it. If you don’t earn it, you don’t deserve it.

      Example I see in my life. My ex-wife is dead broke, but she won’t get rid of her blazer that costs her the same as my house payment. Her dumb pride and sence of needing to validate herself keeps her from improving her situation. Sad to see someone go under just because they are too stupid to let go of dead weight.

    • #3144539

      Escape

      by mjd420nova ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      I’ve asked those questions too, of others and sometimes of myself. When it begins to get to the point that I’m asking myself “Do I really need this??” “What if I get what I want and it turns out that it wasn’t what I was really after.” Well, I’d say it’s time to get away, and here in a large metro area it isn’t easy. I grab my pole, and my fishing bucket and head for the lake. A short drive of 10 miles, and a 5 mile bicycle ride and I’m in heaven, far enough from civilization that I don’t hear anything but nature. The birds, squirrels and an occasional splash of a fish in the water is all I hear. No trucks, cars, crying babies and squabling kids. I’m alone to ask those questions and search within for answers. I may not find the answers and I may not catch any fish, but after 4 hours, I’ve reached an inner peace that can’t be achieved in the hustle and bustle of the world. I return after 8 hours fulfilled and refreshed, usually lasting about a week, when I again start mulling those questions. I don’t think I’ll ever reach the point where I won’t need these retreats from life, and I can’t imagine a week going by that I wouldn’t miss them. The answers are in reality summed up in one word PERSPECTIVE. I only have two eyes and they both see the same thing. This must be tempered with a small amount of self pity, and loads of prayer.

    • #3144525

      Arrrr…. the search for happiness

      by cmh_datec ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      Hard to resist this one. Cynic mood in full swing here. All we hear in Oz is the American judicial system which rewards people for being stupid and irresponsible. Over here, we reward people for being useless, unemployable, bad tenants, serial solo mothers etc.

      Why are there people who want to prevent others from becoming entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?
      <>

      Why are there people who resent others who want to become entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?
      <>

      Why are there people who want to kick others when they’re up?
      <>

      Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re limited in what they can achieve? <>

      Why are there people who want to believe they’re victims of just about anything and everything?
      <>

      Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re victims of just about anything and everything?
      <>

      Why are there people who insist on remaining in their negative world?
      <>

      Why are there people who want to drag others down into their negative world?
      <>

      Why is it that many people see me as “the bad guy” because I ask these kinds of questions and want to live a life, and encourage others to live a life, of self-responsibility and self-sufficiency?
      <>

      Why is it that I consider myself one of the most generous people I know, with my time, money, and encouragement, yet I’m often called greedy, selfish and uncaring?
      <>

      Does anyone else ask themselves these kinds of questions?
      <>

      Has the world always been like this? Is that why people sailed the oceans and traveled across the prairies, with absolutely no chance of ever returning, but not really wanting to return?
      <>.

      I must admit, I do wish, from time to time, that there was an ocean or a prairie for me to cross to get away from a lot of things. But alas, there’s no escape, is there?
      <>

      🙂

    • #3144519

      Very important answers

      by mjwx ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      [i]”Why are there people who want to prevent others from becoming entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?”[/i]

      People don?t want to be responsible, It?s natural to blame others for their problems and misgivings. You quiet often blame your government (the left side in particular) because of programs you don?t agree with. You must also remember that entire self-sufficiency is a myth. We have been dependent upon one another for thousands of years, first we formed into groups for protection and to hunt larger animals from here we evolved into tribes and eventually communities. Community is something I feel we have lost.

      [i]”Why are there people who resent others who want to become entirely self-responsible and self-sufficient?”[/i]

      Once again this total self-responsibility and self-sufficiency is a myth. People look for someone else to blame (Democrats, Terrorists). The simple fact is we are not solitary animals so we do depend on one another to simply survive let alone to form civilizations. This is by far the biggest contribution to our dominance as a species is the ability to work together at all levels.

      [i]”Why are there people who want to kick others when they’re up?”[/i]

      Is it better to kick others when they?re down? When you kick someone don?t be surprised when you get kicked back.

      [i]”Why are there people who want to convince others that they’re limited in what they can achieve?”[/i]

      Simple, Control. This is part of the fear mindset. There are two ways to lead, through fear or hope. This is part of the fear method, limit someone and place yourself as their superior.

      [i]”Why are there people who want to believe they’re victims of just about anything and everything?”[/i]

      Victimism is ego. Now I know I?ve been talking about ego a lot but some people can only define themselves as the victim to place them above others. Victimism is really a western concept, Buddhists for example believe that suffering is good and an experience that can teach a lot about ourselves and our world.

      [i]”Why are there people who insist on remaining in their negative world?”[/i]

      The same reason people insist on remaining positive. People are different, some negative, some positive and some neutral. Max, now this is not an attack but you need to remember that there are a lot of different ways of perceiving things especially positive and negative. For example I expect the worst so anything better is a pleasant surprise.

      [i]”Why are there people who want to drag others down into their negative world?”[/i]

      Why not, no one likes being alone. You would wish that others share your views. You vehemently argue with others (Neil and myself) when we have a divergent opinion.

      [i]”Why is it that many people see me as “the bad guy” because I ask these kinds of questions and want to live a life, and encourage others to live a life, of self-responsibility and self-sufficiency?”[/i]

      It’s all there (here on TR) in black and white. It is not the questions but the way you ask and the way you treat others who give you what you view as the wrong answer. You are rather narrow minded and have little patience for those who believe differently. You are also quiet arrogant and offensive (rude, insulting) at times. You treat your way as the only way and this gets up a lot of people as you want respect but don?t respect others who believe differently.

      [i]”Why is it that I consider myself one of the most generous people I know, with my time, money, and encouragement, yet I’m often called greedy, selfish and uncaring?”[/i]

      People perceive you as such. Spend time looking at what you have written on TR and you might find out why? There is a Parallax error between what we see ourselves as and how others see us as.

      [i]”Does anyone else ask themselves these kinds of questions?”[/i]

      Yes all the time, I often don?t like the answers but I could be worse if I were not be trying to change. I treat each of these questions as true and then attempt to disprove them beyond doubt.

      [i]”Has the world always been like this? Is that why people sailed the oceans and travelled across the prairies, with absolutely no chance of ever returning, but not really wanting to return?”[/i]

      Are you talking about running from everything or just escapism. Escapism is easy, you just have to know how to block things out. I can be in a crowded room but to me I can make that room empty if I needed to, it?s all in your mind. If this is beyond your capabilities than there is physical escapism, leave the city, leave the car and go into the Rockies or up to Alaska or the north of Canada where not another soul can be found. You can easily escape but you must always come back. If you only want to run I’m sorry but you can?t. You?re here now and if this world is too much of a problem your only way out is to put that pistol to you chin and get it over with. This is a cruel answer I know, but it is not untrue.

      I can guess that you won?t like some of my answers but if you can?t handle it don?t ask hard questions.

      A good set of headphones can help you get away from it very easily. I prefer bands like the foo, nirvana or the offspring. Songs like breakout, everlong and gone away.

      • #3144337

        Community is something I feel we have lost.

        by tonythetiger ·

        In reply to Very important answers

        Some may say it was stolen rather than lost, but I agree that it’s nearly gone.

        Related things that have become lost, forgotten, changed, or diluted (I will expand on some of these at a later date):

        (In no particular order)

        Commitment.

        Loyalty.

        Trust.

        Perserverence.

        The difference between forgiving and excusing.

        The difference between dependence and co-dependence.

        The difference between dependence and reliance.

        I’ll probably think of some others….

        (to be continued 🙂 )

    • #3144432

      Off to the Yukon

      by stress junkie ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      For decades when I’d get into one of those moods like the one you seem to be in I would think that one day I would move to the Yukon hundreds of miles from the nearest person. The only real problem with that is that I don’t like cold weather. Unfortunately places like Hawaii already have a lot of people. Ideally I would move to Hawaii, but hundreds of miles from the nearest neighbor.

      I have one answer to all of your questions: People are a$$holes.

    • #3144424

      A simple answer..

      by maecuff ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      People suck.

      Individuals can be wonderful, but people(as a group), for the most part are self-indulgent, panicky and self-righteous.

      Of course, I exclude anyone who posts here. 🙂

      • #3144418

        Aaahhh. I love the simple answers :)

        by rob mekel ·

        In reply to A simple answer..

        Special the exclusion 😡

        Simple answers are mostly correct as live can be simple if taken some rules in to account like:
        don’t do to others that you don’t like being done to you.
        or
        Be open and honest, what is actually an abstraction from the first.

        Rob

    • #3144391

      Why?

      by old guy ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      Because some people are greedy, selfish, and self-centered. I say some because most of my friends whom I choose and who choose me are not like that. Most of the folks I try to hang out with really try to help others. They encourage instead of discourage, they lift each other up instead of trying to push them down, etc.

      I used to say the ones who are the greedy, selfish folks are small in numbers but you only hear about the bad stuff. I’m almost to the point that I can’t say that anymore because it seems like those folks are beginning to out number us.

      However, there are still a lot of us out here who are good and helpful and caring. You just have to find the ones around you. And, we must be one first.

      Edited to add comment.

    • #3144377

      Two answers,

      by tonythetiger ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      One of which will likely answer all.

      People who live and promote self sufficiency are a threat to the status quo.

      Many people feel guilty and get defensive when your words or deeds highlight their shortcomings.

    • #3144211

      The easiest answers in the world : [i]FEAR and JEALOUSY in conformity.

      by sleepin’dawg ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      People fear those who do not conform to the [i]eastablished norms[/i] and are jealous of those who succeed because of their nonconformity or despite their lack of conformity. They fear to step beyond the pack mentality of the common herd and are jealous of those who rise to leadership, either financially or politically. All quite simple, really. People are afraid to stand up and/or stand out because like a protruding nail, they fear they may get hammered down.

      Thankfully that permits those of us who choose not to conform, to get ahead. Would you prefer being the engine or the caboose? Remember what they say about the silver medals; that’s what the first of the losers receives. What else can I say?

      There are always going to be those who will be satisfied with silver or bronze medals or even no medals at all. It helps if your dreams exceed your ability to grasp. It helps one to continue to strive. The day you start to feel content with your achievements will mark the first day you are content with failure and the status quo.

      There are two kind of people in this world; those who take and those who are taken. On the whole, it is much more preferable to be a taker, rather than a takee.

      [b]Dawg[/b] ]:) B-)

      • #3144203

        Addendum

        by sleepin’dawg ·

        In reply to The easiest answers in the world : [i]FEAR and JEALOUSY in conformity.

        Many times I have been told I should not embark on some project or other because of the severity of competition. I love being able to point out the reason I [b][i]chose[/i][/b] my courses of activity was because in many cases the presence of that comptition meant, to my limited or focused way of thinking, that there was money to be gleaned from it. Yes people, especially those without any, will tell you money is the root of all evil and can’t buy happiness. Well, I’m in there rooting and you can take it from me, the only thing money can’t buy is poverty. It will definitely increase the level of the quality of your miserable environment.

        [b]Dawg[/b] ]:)

        • #3144179

          Profit

          by jdclyde ·

          In reply to Addendum

          is also made to seem like a bad thing, of course by people too lazy to MAKE a profit.

          We then get dishonest MILLIONAIR politicians going on about “the rich”, as if it were somehow BAD to be rich, and completely forget to mention that they, the politician ARE RICH.

          The main thing the poor poor should keep in mind is that poor people do not PAY wages to emplyees, rich people do.

          The poor poor don’t benift from a straight tax cut as much as the evil rich, because they didn’t pay much to start with. Yeah, turn down that $200 just because someone else might get $2000. Show us how stupid you really are.

          The less money paid into taxes, the more gets spent on toys. Buying toys keeps the toy makers in business, so they can in turn buy whatever they need. gets more people working, and more people making a living.

          dangit! you got me worked up on a friday afternoon. Oh well. Tomorrow is last day of soccer for the boys, and they are undefeated! Woowoo! B-)

        • #3144176

          Enjoy all your time with them for as long as you can.

          by sleepin’dawg ·

          In reply to Profit

          They grow up too damn fast these days.

          [b]Dawg[/b] ]:)

        • #3144173

          Ah, but then there are grandchildren

          by tonythetiger ·

          In reply to Enjoy all your time with them for as long as you can.

          They’re better… you can give them back when you’re tired of playing with them… And you get to give them the noisiest toys for Christmas 🙂

          My Granddaughter is 18 months and a blast. I just taught her how to blow a whistle 🙂

        • #3143315

          And I’m certain just how grateful her parents are to you for that. :^0

          by sleepin’dawg ·

          In reply to Ah, but then there are grandchildren

          Imagine going through life without being able to blow a whistle; a fundamental need for every child, male or female. Give her a toy drum set for Christmas. You have no idea of just how grateful her parents will be to see her taking an interest in music(?).

          Grandchildren : the ideal means to get even with your kids for all the trouble they caused you.

          [b]Dawg[/b] ]:)

        • #3144830

          And don’t forget the little plastic toy soldiers

          by tonythetiger ·

          In reply to And I’m certain just how grateful her parents are to you for that. :^0

          There’s nothing that brightens a morning more then walking barefoot down the stairs and stepping on one 🙂

        • #3144172

          Tell me about it!

          by jdclyde ·

          In reply to Enjoy all your time with them for as long as you can.

          I won’t be the parent that sits back and wishes I had spent more time with my boys. Let the EX have her many boyfriends. I personally find I don’t have TIME for a girlfriend right now. there will be time for that later.

          Next week is their play, and that is going to be a major drain on my time getting them back and fourth, even though it isn’t even “my week”. I get bonus time! Woo Woo! [i]happy dance![/i]

          Yeah, it won’t be long before they start to spread their wings. Thing two is already interested in girls, even though I TOLD him that girls have cooties! Wants to go roller skating with them…..

        • #3144174

          people too lazy to MAKE a profit.

          by tonythetiger ·

          In reply to Profit

          Or people who profit from others’ laziness…

    • #3143423

      I think those are the right questions…

      by ontheropes ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      Why do we never get an answer
      When we’re knocking at the door
      With a thousand million questions
      About hate and death and war?
      ‘Cos when we stop and look around us,
      There is nothing that we need,
      In a world of persecution
      That is burning in its greed.

      Why do we never get an answer
      When we’re knocking at the door
      Because the truth is hard to swallow
      That’s what the war of love is for

      It’s not the way that you say it
      When you do those things to me
      It’s more the way that you mean it
      When you tell me what will be

      And when you stop and think about it
      You won’t believe it’s true
      That all the love you’ve been giving
      Has all been meant for you.

      I’m looking for someone to change my life,
      I’m looking for a miracle in my life
      And if you could see what it’s done to me,
      To lose the love I knew
      Could safely lead me through.

      Between the silence of the mountains,
      And the crashing of the sea,
      There lies a land I once lived in,
      And she’s waiting there for me,
      But in the grey of the morning,
      My mind becomes confused,
      Between the dead and the sleeping,
      And the road that I must choose.

      I’m looking for someone to change my life,
      I’m looking for a miracle in my life
      And if you could see what it’s done to me,
      To lose the love I knew,
      Could safely lead me to
      The land that I once knew,
      To learn as we grow old
      The secrets of your soul.

      It’s not the way that you say it
      When you do those things to me
      It’s more the way you really mean it
      When you tell me what will be

      Why do we never get an answer
      When we’re knocking at the door
      With a thousand million questions
      About hate and death and war?
      ‘Cos when we stop and look around us,
      There is nothing that we need,
      In a world of persecution
      That is burning in its greed.

      You’re alright Max.

    • #3144776

      I think, Maxwell

      by tig2 ·

      In reply to Some very important questions (at least to me)

      Because you are capable of thinking and thinking critically, because you think in terms like “personal responsibility and self sufficiency, because your mindset doesn’t allow you to think in terms of others doing the heavy lifting, you are destined to ask these questions- probably for the rest of your life. You CARE about the answers, and that is not an easy place to be.

      When I got sick, the first thing that I thought about were the things I regretted- what had I gone through the first 40 years of my life being afraid of? What were the things that I hadn’t done? What did I want to leave as a legacy to anyone who bothered to look? I have spent the years since finding and LIVING the answers. I tell the people I love that I love them. And then I show them. I choose to be the change I want to see in the world. I take risks today that I would never have considered when I was younger and before I had such a clear knowledge that my time would be limited. I live outside of my comfort zone. And while there are times that I think that I really would rather not, what I don’t want to end my days with is regret.

      But I also recognise that I can’t convince anyone else. I have tried to share my insight with others. Those that get it, get it. Others don’t.

      And while it may not change the world or anything else, living this way has changed me. And I like to think that it has made my corner of life a bit nicer to be in.

      I wonder frequently why people make the choices that they make when there are better ways to live and more functional choices available. And then I remember that I find the answer simple- they may not see it at all.

      I believe that there are those people who are fundamentally good people. And there are others who are not. I try to be one of the good ones. And I think, so do you.

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