Death

how long would it take our resident rocket scientist to realize that :D

Did you try out your star wars name?? I started out a Friday Yuk .. Join IN ..

https://www.techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=8&threadID=185514&messageID=1895956

]:)

P.S ... I will torture you in to taking my pink fluffy slippers (earmuffs??) .. They really want to see the sun, you know

or Nevada where the sun shines 345 days a year. I've done a lot of humiliating things in my time but donning pink fuzzy earmuff slippers would be a new low. The torture part would be fun though ;) so you'll have to think of a different tactic to coerce me into coming within 10 feet of anything pink and fuzzy and wearable.

My Star Wars name: https://www.techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=8&threadID=185514&messageID=1896309

I read ur initial question with much interest, but my reading of a lot of the discussion reavealed a shallow depth which should make one sad.

I read somewhere that our idea about death can define to a large extent our beleif in life and how we live it.

When you think of death and the fac that your current existence must end, should trigger the question of why you had to exist in the first place. And if you allow your self some thought to this, then you may comee to realise that, there must be a purpose and we are not just to live, be mery and die...that, i must say is the elixr of fools

When you then get to this stage, you may find it comfortable that if you can find a real purpose in live, attempt to achive it, then the fear of the and will not be too criplling...even though u may grive for the loss of a lost one, the fact that a life well live should bring you joy that, there must be something more (better) COMING AFTER after......

I am a male who lives in Romulus, Michigan. I am 58 yrs old, and on my fourth marriage. (I'm not braging)
The subject of DEATH is more or less a final thought, that revisits us from time to time, and to some is unhealthy to dwell on. At this stage of my life, if death should come soon, I would be disappointed, and feel that I have failed in my venture. My venture being to find a woman to adore, love, and be my best friend.
Love, friendship, and sex, with that special woman, has always been, and still is my deepest desire since I can recall.
That is the only thing I truly wanted out of life.
Weather it is imoral, unholy. or unacceptal, I'm still looking to fill my my deepest desire. You only go around one time in life, and it's really not that long of a time span. For some reason I've always wanted an oriental woman, to share my life with.
Call me crazy, but to have death knock on my door, before my desire is filled, would be a very unhappy being.(razor1947@comcast.net)

I know there is a God, and he's the biblical Christian God. I know I am heaven bound. I know that death is just the end of our brief physical existence and the start of a spiritual eternal life.
I hope you all make the right choice 'cos it's too late once you're gone.

Lost my wife a few years ago, and my take on it is that I don't have a choice, if there's no God then there is no hope for us at all, we're all just carbon life forms sucking up time & space. To me that's both preposterous and scary. If there is a God, then the whole theology goes with it, and even though you can't explain all those bad things that happen in this world, what you do get is hope and tools to go on, and that alone is evidence to me of God's existence.

Good lesson from your daughter. I don't necessarily want to hurry things along to go see Jesus myself, but I understand the point behind it: death simply loses its sting, and that goes back to hope, and I'll take a positive outlook over a negative one any day.

If we believe that we are eternal, then is death a reality?

My personal belief is that this life is a training ground for the next phase of life. There is no reason for the thought of "death" to affect my mortality or personal identity as I do not believe I am mortal.

As for my my priorities, values, and spirituality; those are the focus of my training. The sooner I learn my lessons, embrace my life, and achieve the ability to be non-judgmetnal the sooner I will be out of here and on to the next experience.

Live Life Like You Are Dying...(Tim McGraw) because we all are! Good luck on your journey!

Each day you live is one day less you have to live (here anyway)

My faith (Christian) tells me that there is much more promised than this life has for us. (especially if you are stuck working on computer systems as I am!)

Of course, coming to grips with your mortality is a good thing (rather than living in ignorance of the fact that you will indeed die).

This causes me to ask some tough questions that need to be answered...

Does my life have (server) any purpose
Why are we here?
Where do we go when we die?

I've seen many answers listed here but I have to say that many seem far too derived from "human" knowlege that may comfort but decieve.

I beleive that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God and he created all, and has a plan for us - who acknowlege him.

You may not agree, but you do have to deal (wrestle) with this idea.

In the last 12 months my sister-in-law lost her mother, and my partner lost an uncle, 2 aunts and his cousin. The death of his cousin was particularly hard - they were both the same age, and he died after a painful battle with cancer and leaving a 12-year-old daughter.

I'm still grappling with my own spiritual beliefs, so I don't believe I have any word of wisdom to offer on that score. However I do believe that the death of a friend or family member servers as a reminder to us that our time here is limited.

It's so easy to get caught up in the day-to-day business of living that we forget to actually live. When was the last time you showed your best friend how much they mean to you, whether by your words or actions? When was the last time you danced around the living room with your partner, not caring about how you looked or who might be watching, but just for the joy of it?

Embrace your loved ones, express your feelings, do those things you've wanted to do forever but have been putting off until the "time is right". Your time is here now!

Only the ghost can understand the nature of death, because only the ghost have really experience of the word called death. It has a document show the way to find out, and how to understand the death appearance, here

http://groups.msn.com/Mentalenergy/theghostpart1.msnw

It appear to have a lot of interesting documentations and atleast it show some way to prove the mysterious of the mind.

For those who participate and hold to the Christian Faith: it suggested to me once that there are three parts to us. One, of physical body; two, our soul; and three, our spirit. They suggested that our soul is our consiousness--that which we think and feel (within our "heart"). It has also been suggested that our spirit is that which God has made and will return to Him. Also, that which communes through the Holy Spirit.

Our soul is the New Man that we become when we become new in Christ. Our Spirit is renewed daily through the Holy Spirit.

Yes, that who we are is "along for the ride" in this body and we make our choices for where we will be in eternity. As someone stated earlier, I hope that each one makes the right choice.

It is sad when we lose friends and loved ones regardless of what our belief systems are. It is something we just have to go through. However, instead of surrendering to grief you might try to think of rejoicing in having known the person and celebrate the times and pleasure that your knowing him brought you.
My condolences to you and yours on your loss.

[b]Dawg[/b] ]:)

Lavoisier was a French chemist (1743-1794) who stated in the Law of Conservation of Mass:
"Nothing has been created, nothing has been lost but everything has been changed".
I think that death is not an end but a change.

I would like to thank all of you for sharing your own personal experiences and offering help by suggesting books, your own beliefs or simply words of comfort.

I am moved by the way we all reached to each other

Thank you all and my condolences to those who like myself have lost a love one.

I read 'Saved by the Light' in 1994 and since then I have personally witnessed the passing of two of Dannion Brinkley's visions.

The first was his vision of DNA being used in microchips. In his vision he states he witnessed a Middle Eastern scientist combine DNA with a microchip. This actually happened since I read the book and the process has been documented in Nature magazine. The scientists that made the breakthrough were from Israel.

He also saw a vision of nuclear submarines rusting off the coast of Norway spilling contaminants into the sea. Again, I have read about this since the book was published and I believe it may even be an international environmental issue now.

If you take into account that his visions were documented from 1975, and none of them had actually come to pass when the book was first published, then you have to ask - how did he know this?

There is no doubt that the guy died (he was clinically dead - he has a death certificate to prove it) and some of his visions have definitely come true.

So, if he didn't visit the afterlife to get this information, where was he when he was dead?

I don't believe that God causes us to be persecuted or to suffer. I fully believe that the suffering and persecution comes from Satan (yes, I know that will probably open up a whole other can of worms)but God causes good to come from all things. We may not be able to see at the time. Case in point, one of my teenage girls had cancer and went through the complete treatments. I fully hate to see kids suffer. However, because of this girl there are several hundred, and possibly over a thousand teens who have been helped because of what she went through. It was her faith in God that allowed her to teach many young people and adults alike how to deal with this. She never gave up in her faith and hundreds of us prayed for her. She not only made it to remission but has participated in a couple of beauty pagents and other public things.

There are many other stories that once you look back at it you can see how God used that to help other people, or to help that person.

Yes, God does discipline when we need it--just like a father does his children here. I really don't think God hurts His children but loves us and hurts for us and works to turn that to good. Even if we don't understand all the time.

For the skeptic, there is never enough proof; for the believer, proof is not needed.

But, I must admit, I really admire this guy and such supporters as yourself. Of his prophesies, most [b]have not[/b] come true.

Dannion was "given" the prophecy that America would be economically bankrupt by the year 2000. Ooops! [b]That didn't happen[/b]. That doesn't put his supporters off, whose logic goes:

[i]"Since this prophecy didn't occur, we can conclude that something prevented this prophecy from occuring."[/i] Well, I'm following this so far. [i]"The purpose of prophecy is never for it to be fulfilled. It's purpose is to change the future".[/i] Hello! I can follow this, So Dannion did something and saved us all? [i]"Somehow this prophecy given to Dannion was diverted by some unknown factor".[/i] Oh, so not Dannion? [i]"All we know for sure is that this prophecy was successful in that it didn't come to pass".[/i]

Wow! I'd like to get me some of that! Dannion has an NDE and meets the Gods and to prove it he makes some prophesies and around five percent come true. Then he writes a book and makes a fortune out of mugs like you. Then, when he misses a real biggie like the one above, we get "This prophecy was successful in that it didn't come to pass".

OK, I think I'll try that line on my boss.

ROTFLMAO

Neil :D

Yep I misunderstood your reference to one of your "kids". Doesn't matter too much. I will assume that she had family members and/or close friends (including you, perhaps) that suffered along with her.

And my turn to clarify. Of course Jesus is the most important person in Christianity. My reference to Paul was as the most important living person at the time. Another note about Paul. He had been a very evil fellow who persecuted, tortured and killed Christians. This evil guy was hand-picked to do some pretty extraordinary things.

You gotta give ol' Satan credit for one thing. He doesn't give up. I guess his only goal is to take as many people with him as he can. Aren't the end times preordained? Not specifics but generalities (assuming the interpretations of Revelations is reasonably accurate. No disrespect but John's writing of Revelations seems like a description of an LSD trip.).

Learning that a heart condition would cut my life expectancy drastically has certainly changed my life.
How does it affect the idea of our own mortality?
Not in the least, but then I have been a Metaphysical Minister since 1981. My belief system is based on do no harm and a strong belief in Karma and reincarnation and free will.
How does it alter our priorities and values in life?
My priorities have become doing what I feel is important to ME! Things I can leave behind for other's benefit and education, things that make me feel good - reading a good book when the laundry needs doing, eating what I please instead of following all the propaganda about eating for good health (I do eat a lot more healthy than most people on these fad tracks because I like healthy foods). I have given up trying to please others all the time and focus on me more because if I am happy and not stressed I have more energy to give to those who appreciate it.
The impact on our spirituality, for those who hold beliefs? A major reaffirmation. The miracle of my continued existence long after my prognosed death and an actual improvement in my left ventricle long after it was considered medically possible has made my faith stronger. It has also given me much less tolerance for the religious right and their ever escalating "My way is the only Right way!"
How does it affect our own "personal" identity?
It has strengthened my sense of self, converted me (mostly because of severe financial & energy limitations)I dress for comfort (no tight stuff it impedes circulation, no fashionable winter wear only WARM, no sun dresses or sleeveless stuff - digitalis and sun guarantee sun stroke and poisoning. I no longer can be elegantly coiffed, hair in a semi - Gibson girl or long French braid, no makeup. Keep things simple. It is difficult for me to go visiting. I must keep my feet elevated or blow up like a balloon and turn purple and rush to the cardiac ward! If people want to see me they provide a foot stool or come see me! I am stronger emotionally and not as patient with ignorance and rudeness. I fight for what I want and need rather than hope my efforts will bring their own reward.

Mark, you sound like a very nice, as well as educated gentleman. If it brings you comfort to beleive in such, I understand, and I'm not trying to change your mind. Hind sight is 20/20. I just cannot bring myself to justify the torture, misery, and death associated with it. Mark I know nothing of your personal life, but if you did have a large family, could you put your love ones through such an ordeal?? Why of course not. That is your family, your children, your loved ones. You would try to do everything in your power to make them happy.
I was always told that God was a loving God. To have a higher power, or God if you wish, put his own creations through such means, does not make sense in my little human mind, especially when we aew told that the reason it all started was a woman eating the fruit from the tree of knowledge, so to speak. For the most part, the whole idea was weaved into one book very cleveraly. It does have several issues that are unbeleivable to say the least. When questions arise on such issues, your told that you need faith to beleive them.
A higher power, or a God is all knowing of all things to come, and all things in the past. Infinate wisdom and knowledge. I would imagine that would be rather uneventful to such a being.
Are we made to go through all of this, to make things interesting to watch, or break up the boredom of such beautiful, and endless wisdom ??

If it all was made up over time (The Bible) & (Relegion), and all these millions upon millions of people did not have to be put through such misery, pain and death over it, I would say that is was closer to a true, and beautiful belief.

How about the big question Mark??
Where did God come from ??
Will things still fall under the same teachings on other worlds in our galaxie?
So much to know, and understand, but there are no definate answers. (HAVE FAITH)

I like, and do understand the old saying, which has a great deal of understanding, and truth in it.
(GOD HELPS THOSE, THAT HELP THEMSELVES)

Here we go again. Have faith brother. Comforting to know that that you were there when all this happened. For a moment, I thought you were going to tell me to have faith, or the bible told me so.

I guess you have to take what you need, and leave the hard facts behind. Simply amazing.

How does it affect the idea of our own mortality?
- This is always scary, uncomfortable, it is a guantlet for Christains such as myself. Reward on the other side, but not wanting to go through it.
How does it alter our priorities and values in life?
- I number my days, prepare for the end and those that will survuve me. It is a driver for building wealth to benefit my family afterward.
The impact on our spirituality, for those who hold beliefs?
- The sting of death is gone with Christ. Once death takes you it has no power over you forever. Your spiritual body then lives forever with Christ and the father.
how does it affect our own "personal" identity?
- It shapes who I am to the extent that I am equal with all. No matter who you are or your greatness, you die. It is the great equalizer for me, I cannot feel superior to those less fortunate and cannot feel inferior for those more fortunate. For we all have a casket awaiting us. The eternal coatman snickers and awaits us.

There has been some great discussions and ideas presented here. I truly appreciate the thoughts and feelings that have been expressed in this discussion.

I think that sometimes we dwell on just getting to the end in order to begin eternity, which is a great goal (actually, the ultimate goal), that we may overlook or not expound on why we are here.

A couple of folks have said that they enjoy their life here and that's good also. There are a lot of bad things that happen here on earth, personally and globally. However, there are a lot of great things that happen here. My wife & children are my greatest blessing here on earth and I am overwhelmed by their dependence on us while growing up. I'm also overwhelmed by the love and care of other people that they have personally now that they are beginning their adult lives.

Having worked with teens for the past 20 years I have been blessed even more. I have seen more evidence of God in the lives and faces of these kids than most people get to see. Helping young people search and find the meaning for their lives and helping develop their own faith is tremendous.

I have been blessed beyond measure with some of our friends and the love and caring that they have shown us and that they have received from us.

Yes, living in this world, loving God, and living the Will of God through Jesus, with other people of like minds is a fantastic experience. Being able to share with other people their happiness, their joys, and yes, their sorrows and helping as many people as possible to find their way to Christ is about the most fun I can think of here on earth--at least for me and my family. It also helps when the bad things do happen to be able to have these resources to stand with each other?laughing, crying, encouraging, growing in faith.

And the message you placed came to my attention just now. It must have a reaon, justathought, that you asked this. Curious about the why.

The passed six-eight months a lot happened to me. I got the message that my nephew John took his own life, got one after the other problem to deal with, it just went crazy. I went to my doctor with oppressive complaints. It was due to a depression. Which is understandable if one knew what I was confronted with. I even made a list of my own miseries. Reading it I even got more dpressed...

SO, talking about death, I was ready to take my own life and let death make an end to this distress. I waited and waited.. not really ready to do it. Though the thoughts of it were active.
Frightening it was.

Lost my dad in '95. That was an impact, though I was secure, cause I had a good and integer band with him. My other brothers who lived more far away from home, had more problems. So thought I could cope with this kinda events in life. I truly loved my dad and of course it did hurt.

So, talking about it. I think that's good. it helps me put my thoughts to a medium. Don't really care if you're ready for my story. Cause I ain't ready with the whole picture yet. Sometimes I even get the thought, well John did it... can be done. So, I'm not ready with all of it. But it's good to write it down, considering it.

Some things are still active as I write. After 4 years of being unemployed and confronted that the working community is not waiting for a 46-year-old, so not able to get a proper job, I got depreesed in the first place. After a number of events following up one another that started 6-8 months ago, won't bother yall with details, I lost it complete. So I am on pills now, hate that but "like" the bottom-line it creates.

Understand my view on death? I guess I will not end my life... I guess I simply can't... seems there's somthing to live for to, like my 2 children. I am divorced and one of my problems is a legal dispute with my ex-wife. Which brings lots of troubles, thoughts etc.

Guess most of the members writing to this discussion are americans. I'm from the Netherlands, Holland. As I think of it now I think life sucks big time. It has a reason obviously that I think this way. Hope life, as it turns, will turn in favor of me and become more joyfull to live.

Just another view on death.....

I will agree with you, choosing life takes a lot of courage when things fall apart around us, and fighting to try and live is very exhausting but in the end there are still wonders to discover.

A year ago I could not even see any future and just making it through the day was such a struggle, but now I can in betweens the bad times find meaning to life.

Ray, Diane, justathought... thanks!!

Forgive me for opening up and tell some more. I got into writing and found this had become quite some text.. bare with me for that.

But I really mean thanks. Thanks for all the kind words... thanks for all the motivating talk.
I guess it's a start. Hope to hear more of you guys and dolls, cause I really need it. Need to contact and talk about this, as I said, i think it is good. It's so good of you justathought to start this topic. In my situation I could not resist to react, and what I find is being heard and being cared about, even when I don't know you all. That's nice and feel terribly good. So thanks for that too.

Then somewhat personally. Ray. I admire your way of handling things. Hoping I will be able to handle it that way. Looks good. Not ready for it yet at the moment, but certainly willing to get there. thanks for your advise. Btw, can't quitte smoking either and costing me a fortune and does not bring me any good.. just can't...like it too much.

Some addition; I divorced in '92 after almost 12,5 years of marriage. We broke up being friends, although hartbroken and were both willing to raise our 2 children in the best way we could after divorce. It wasn't easy I can say, cause she moved to another town with her new husband, which reulted in a lawsuit in '96. I was convicted to paying and fetch my children at the new place, which was so unfair... anyhow. Now that I am unemployed for 4 years and am not able anymore to contribute in the welfare of my children, she is demanding lots of money. She's going to far now and I have to make it stop. My children, bless their souls, are with me, not that I want this, but they fully understand my situation and don't understand their mother's actions. It pleases me and yes Diane, I have to leave it to god and my attorney to solve this matter.

Y'all know what my problem really is? I can't park my problems. I have a parking problem (as all my brother's and 1 sister have that btw) It means that when situations occur, in my case one after the other, I cannot be in controll anymore. I cannot park my problems, giving it out of hands, I still want to controll and handle it. So, my mind flipps and loses it cause it just gets overwhelmed with all of it, cannot cope. If I could just park it and leave it to be and would be able to trust the fact that there's nothing I can do more on it, it would be better. I am going to get... for four months now trying at least, get some psychological help in training to get there. It's a process where lots goes wrong... talked to several psychiatrists, but they only provide me with pills. I need methods to be able to handle things. Well, something is going to happen on that field soon i hope.

Again an addition: Lost my oldest brother in 2003. Strangely enough I forgot to mention him in my first reply to this topic. My view on the matter is that he drank himself to death. Still, also I consider he must have had the same probs as I and my relatives have. We come from a family that has a very complicated way of connecting, relating to each other. Many disputes have filled our lives. We all went from home living elswhere with fighting. Fighting loose from our parents. we all understand they did their best, but we are not thankfull of the way they did it.

So that's history. Now for the present. Well, you know about my nephew John. Spoke to him last summer on a reunion of the family and he was full of plans and, as I saw it, enjoying life. So it's such a big mystery why he took his own life.

My mother is 80 years old. As I am the son who lives nearby (my sister is living more close to her, but she cannot handle serious matter at all....) I am convicted in taking care of her. It brings lot of troubles and care. I feel the responsibility and am willing to take it. on the other hand I hate it, cause sometimes it's to much to bear. Cause she is chaotic, does not trust me in the things I do for her, cause she does not understand all of it anymore... just getting old. I cannot blame her for that but it makes it so hard to motivate myself to do it. Still I have to and ... well I have to.

Financial problems. Of course I have a dark view on the future for employment. I am trying now to start a businesss of my own, but it seems all works against me in getting there. Things seem to go the right way and then another thing posp up which makes it impossible. Well, hopes are there I can reach my goal...

Damage to my car. First of all, I can't really aford to have one, but now there's some guy which damaged my car and is not willing to pay for it, nor would he report it to his own insurrancecaompany. So I am stuck with a debt to a garage who fixed the problem and wants me to pay them almost 1400 euro's. Can't pay it.

The lawsuit to my ex. She laughs at my children when they try to defend my situation. She says to my daughter that she will get all she can get her hands on... it hurts. Buw well, we know how these things go, just mention it, cause it hurts and I cannot park this either.... it eats me up.

As does writing this down... so I stop for now. After I have said the following:

I read it takes a lot of courage to live your life. Thsi could indicate that one is a coward when taking his own life. I do not share this thought. It also takes courage to take your life... caus I don't have it. There's no cowardness (if that is correct spelling) however in taking your own life. It is my believe that depression and life-problems, and being alone as my nephew John, can bring someone to no other solution as what he did. On the other hand, I also believe that one really must not get to this point. But that's easy talking cause you simply cannot control everything that comes into your life... and when one has a parking problem as I described... it is near to become that point....

Thanks again. Hope to find out more and hope to be able to have contributed to this matter as find solutions to what I am coping with....

I read both of your posts. Well said.
There seems to be a lot of hurting techrepublic members. God is there for everyone all we have to do is turn to him and ask for help. Turning to Jesus does not make life go smooth or solve all of ones problems. What Jesus does do is help people through the hard times. We still have to try and persevere and he will do the rest.

I truly enjoyed your posts. I pray that Frehen keeps an open heart and starts to seek after the the truth that is Jesus.

I fully respect you old guy and appreciate your kind words. As I do others. I think it's tremendous and did not expect to find help or listening ears here at TR.
It is not common to put your misery online, still there are more TR-members whos have had their deal with life sofar.

I cannot help it, but due to experiences in my life sofar I fell of my believes, they were never mine in the first place. They were put upon us by our parents, kinda forcing us to believe. Putting sanctions on not going to church and stuff like that. And once in church I see those people ask for money for third-world countries, while they drink their wine from gold cups and have marmer altars. Even as a child I found the contrast to big. Also, learning more as I grew older, it brought misery instead of joy, so I could not act different as to turn away.

I do not blame my parents, though due to their fearful way of handling their faith, they grew quite a distance between them and us children. The catholic church had put such pressure on people to make as much children as possible (so the catholic church had more souls counted to be followers to their faith). It was common here in those days that my parents were young that the leader of the local church came by and asked to get more and more children. My mother got overstrain being pregnant six years at a row and lost the first child being a daughter. I totally disapprove of such mehtods. I pitty my parents that they fell for it, though I understand in their view they had no choice. It put a lot of tension in my family, which causes us, children to have troubles with life every day. My parents were not able to make us ready for life. We all had to find out the hard way how life is organized. One would suggest that it would make strong people out of us. Nothing less is true. We were not capable to bear arms.

Other experiences learned me that faith is not my thing to hang on to, cause it would only bring pain and sorrow. So, their's no way I will ever be a man like you old guy. As said I totally respect your feelings and dedication to faith, I hope you can do the same for me. That's always the point with faith, I get people here at my frontdoor who try to push ttheir fait upon me. I can say no, respectfully, but they keep on coming again and again. So, respect is gone and I throw the door in their faces. They do not respect my feelings about tha matter.

If God and christianity is the path for you, fine, be happy with it as you are. There's no point in trying to make me believe again that faith brings joy, that fact is lost forever. Also I do believe, as stated before, that there are other means in gaining controll over ones life. Self-confidence, beleiving in ourselves etc etc.
If you cannot believe in other means than just God there's a kind of shortcoming in my view.

As said, I don't wanna argue about faith. There's no point as explained above for me to get into that matter. That will not be the path for me to solve anything.

Maybe, just maybe, if I found back myself and get the chance to look at life in a different way as I do now, maybe I get to a point where there will be space to some kind of believe or faith. From where I stand now this will never happend, but one never knows. It's not an issue I care about now.

So, again I say I totally respect you old guy and respect the hard work you did to get where you are now. I worked hard to get where I am too, in fact I can be satisfied with some things I did, there's a start. Although I miss some reasons to carry on, faith is not going to be one of the ways to get me where I wanna be.
Respectfully, Fred

First of all, my condoleance. It is very hard.

Did not react to this justathought. Still, how good of you to bring this issue up. It sure is helping me to ventilate and at least talk about it.

Pfiew, that's a hard isuue, losing your husband. Cancer is cruel, hope he did not suffer much and long. But for you life must move on and you had the same struggle as I have now. You still are struggling as I understand. So yes, bringing this up is good for talking, we have to have some laughs to to get our life on its feet again.

Life should be worth living, though sometimes as you and I and as it appears more TR-members are struggling at some point to hold on. Painfull, really down-bottom issues which brings us to the edge of handling/coping it.

Also wish you strenghth and wish you well!
Thanks for telling.
Respectfully, Fred

For me they do.
As staed earlier, I've had my deal of circumstances which brought me to the issue of death. I also lost my dog, called Lady.
And she was a Lady! She was beautifull !
Here's a link to a picture of her:

[URL=http://imageshack.us][IMG]http://img397.imageshack.us/img397/6115/lady3ig.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
Hope this works.
It was sad the day she died. Of course.
She was in pain. Run throught the garden, sank to her knees and was laying down. Than she stayed lying down. She could not get up again. So we managed to get her up on a cloth and carried her inside. I stayed up all night for something was not right. At 05:00 AM she began screaming for pain... I did not knwo what to do, so I called the vets. They came... well at 06:30 u.... There was nothing they could do as to get him to sleep... so as the vet went for getting the serenge (?) to get him to sleep I talked to her...
Man this was so bad... even as I write this down it gives me shivres....
Than she was gone.... I burried her in a wood, she loved to be there... went to visit her every 2 weeks.... since 16 june '03... and now... it has been over a year that I've been there... I am ashamed... loved her so much and already forgotten. There has been a replace, not a dog of my own, but from my girlfriend. Maybe that's why.
Still Lady takes a special place.

This new bloke, called bono, after the singer of U2... he's so funny. So he stole my haert. Not the place Lady got, but a new place....

Anyhow. What about it?

I must say.
I confront people in this forum with my situation... not only "Lady"-wise... also human-wise. It is not meant to hurt or annoy anyone's feelings, but I am ia kinda shape nobody wants...
and I may be rude which never is intentionally, i may be confronting at some point, but never meant to harm.
If so I did, I appoligize... though if matter being taken into circumstances I am in... I actually expect understanding.

All my statements, feelings, sayings, are from a certain kinda perspective I have now... as all people probably have when they write...

End of message.
Friendly greetings to all who's around.
Fred

Yes, the word 'mug' was mentioned .. by you:

Quote (neilb):

"Wow! I'd like to get me some of that! Dannion has an NDE and meets the Gods and to prove it he makes some prophesies and around five percent come true. Then he writes a book and makes a fortune out of mugs like you."

Your reasoning is interesting, but exactly how much information about future technology did Dannion have access to in 1975? He couldn't exactly access the internet could he, and his local library was unlikely to have volumes on the proposed binding of DNA with a microchip, or the threat of rusting nuclear subs off the coast of Norway. If anything, I would have thought the most likely 'predictions' woudl have been little green men from the moon invading earth.

And who in 1975 would have thought America could be in fiscal hot water? Nobody, but that's the reality today.

Further to my counterpoint, let's assume Dannion is (or was) a 'reasonably intelligent' person like yourself. Why would a reasonably intelligent person risk ridicule and humiliation on an international scale by publishing a book about their experiences in the afterlife, and making predictions based on that experience? Financial gain? Maybe. But what is Dannions true legacy? A charitable, compassionate movement dedicated to alleviating suffering in this life. What bad has come from his book? How is he exploiting anybody?

If his accounts are fabricated then to what end has this 'fraud' robbed anyone of anything? The truth is, it hasn't. For those who choose to believe, it gives strength, courage and hope and adds to their spiritual wealth. For those who choose not to believe it adds nothing, but then takes nothing away either.

It is a shame you have no spiritual belief right now because there will come a time in life where you need it.

To quote Gladiator:

'Death smiles at us all. All a man can do is smile back'.

Those of us with spiritual belief are smiling! :)

Are you?

Last post on this. It's getting boring.

If any rational person gives a charlatan money by buying his books or otherwise gives his views credence by not questioning then they truly hurt those people who are less easily able to pick out the reality of what is being done.

In no way do I denegrate anyone's spiritual beliefs. You are entitled to believe in anything you want. [b]But[/b]! I reserve the right that, if anyone with such beliefs posts - on a public forum - such as the "gospel according to Dannion Brinkey", to Google and then draw my own conclusions. Which I did - and then I posted them.

Really, you started the whole thing by posting your full-page advertisement for Mr. Brinkley. You put forward his "prophesies" as proof of the "spirit world". I treated your post as I do any other advertisement and I checked up on the product.

I'd answer your points if I thought it would benifit anybody but instead I'll just suggest that anyone who cares to can investigate for themselves.

Should the "Spirit world" exist then I will see you there whether I want it or not. So be happy!

Neil :D

p.s. As for where he got his prophesies from - "how much information about future technology did Dannion have access to in 1975". Do you think it was the dark ages? People knew things before the Internet. We had things called "Libraries". Read a few books, economics forecasts, political forecasts, science fiction. You could get plenty of material from there.

Hehe, aliens and true inhabitants [lol]. Right.

You're right, the love of animals is
unconditional, well in most cases. They behave to us as they are treated by us. And can be true friends.

Yes, she was a beautifull dog, irisch sheperd or
Lassie. Not even pure race, but that's no matter.
I had beautifull years with her.
Thanks!
Sincerely, Fred

That's right, well of course that's the case. She is in my heart and that will never change.
And it is not nescesarry to go to her grave all the time. That's true. As you say, life goes on.
Thanks for your kind words. If I think of it when dying I will put some milk-bones with me!
Sincerely, Fred