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  • #2254870

    Is only some offensive speech ok?

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    by jdclyde ·

    In this politically correct world we find ourselves in, where you are suppose to pretend you care about hurting someone else’s little feelings, who decides what is and what isn’t acceptable?

    We have discussed flag burning, and it is a hateful and intentionally inflamatory (pun intended) thing to do. Yet groups like the ACL will praise that as a brave and noble thing to do.

    “Radio host Don Imus, suspended for two weeks for calling the Rutgers female basketball players “nappy-headed hos.””

    Now all the leading racists of the world, including Jackson and Sharpton, are calling for him to be fired, after over 20 years of his being “mean” to EVERYONE he talks to or about.

    I personally don’t enjoy his show, and didn’t even know much about this until the leading racists made sure everyone could get a chance to hear the comment and potentially be offended by it. How many of you knew he said this until the protests started?

    He has apologized. Is that good enough?

    He says he is not a racist, but if he were, is he entitled to be stupid? If he were a racist, he could always get a job in the future as a Democratic Senator I suppose.

    Is everyone just too sensitive?
    Is this no big deal?
    Is this ground shaking and should shock us to the core?

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    • #2538725

      OPINIONS – – OPINIONS

      by mjd420nova ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Don’t we all have opinions?? Aren’t we all entitled to voice our opinions?? 99.9999 percent of us don’t have radio or television talk shows, so no one but us and our close friends know our opinions. Does that mean we aren’t racists or have racist leanings?? Who knows and who cares?? I think that those who are in the public spotlight or feel they have fallen out of the spotlight need to piss off someone to get back in the spotlight and increase our value or boost our visablity to make our next contract negotiations more meaningful. 15 minutes of fame and all that aside. Don Imus’s rantings would have had no impact at all had he been an African-American. Is that racist?? The door swings both ways. How does specific slang terms change meaning when the skin color is taken into account??

      • #2538721

        Speaking of racist…

        by jdclyde ·

        In reply to OPINIONS – – OPINIONS

        How is it not racist and condescending to imply that all blacks are from Africa? That just amazes me.

      • #2539356

        The duplicity of our age

        by protiusx ·

        In reply to OPINIONS – – OPINIONS

        I agree. If a black comedian says the ‘N’ word no one lifts and eyebrow. BUT, let a white comedian say that word and his career is over. What?s right is right and what?s wrong is wrong. Or is it what?s right is right and what?s left is wrong? Oh well they both are essentially the same.

        • #2539295

          :) are both essentially the same ?:|

          by rob mekel ·

          In reply to The duplicity of our age

          so “right = left = wrong” then :^0 😉

          In essence you are right, if a human from a certain race type insults that same race type it mostly isn’t considered racism. It still is an insult and should be treated that way.

          In a broader perspective: discrimination, whether this is on race, believes, man <-> woman, should be treated the same regardless of whom it is coming from.
          As example: if an Afro-American is allowed to insult fellow Afro-Americans and non-Afro-Americans are not* then that is discrimination on basis of race there for that is racism.

          Rob

          * on basis that they do not belong to the group of Afro-Americans [i]can’t think of any good reason why that should make a difference[/i]
          [i]edited for @#$%$# emoticons[/i]

    • #2538701

      I don’t know, so I’ll ask

      by tonythetiger ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Were there black players on the Tennessee team (the ones he said were cute)?

      • #2538661

        Now I know

        by tonythetiger ·

        In reply to I don’t know, so I’ll ask

        There seem to be a comparable number of black and white players on each team.

        That would seem to indicate that the remarks weren’t racist.

        I think the saying “Never attribute to malice what can easily be explained by stupidity” applies.

        • #2539556

          Just using teh “lingo fo the day”

          by jdclyde ·

          In reply to Now I know

          Go listen (if you can bear it) to any of the rap/hip hop that is in the top ten and tell me they are saying anything as MILD as what Imas said.

          But of course, that is free expression……

        • #2539511

          Of course,

          by tonythetiger ·

          In reply to Just using teh “lingo fo the day”

          Just like Jackson and Sharpton are worse than any of the “racists” they point out. After all, don’t they profit handsomely from the misery of those they claim to care about?

          Oh, and stay tuned… it’ll come out that this isn’t a “race” thing, it’s an “ugly” thing.

        • #2539476

          Racism in the US MUST be on a deline

          by jdclyde ·

          In reply to Of course,

          If the two “great civil rights leaders” have nothing better to go on about for a few days than some old white guy that no one listens to anyways…..

          If this is the worst racism has to offer today, I think we have indeed come a long way baby!

        • #2539445

          Al and Jesse

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to Racism in the US MUST be on a deline

          It would be nice if Al, Jesse, etc., worried a little less about what whites are calling blacks, and a little more about what blacks are calling (and doing to) each other. They’re still fighting the old battles. I’m opposed to having a Confederate flag on the S.C. state house grounds, but I wish the NAACP would concentrate on issues of substance instead.

          Ever notice that Jesse and Al are reactive, not proactive? It’s not that this is the only sign of racism left. But the real work remaining doesn’t get these two carpetbaggers any time in the spotlight.

          Bill Cosby is dead right on this one. If it’s not right for outsiders to call your group by a name, then it also isn’t right for you to use that name for yourself either. Try the writings of Leonard Pitts of Miami for another sensible viewpoint.

        • #2539418

          pitts

          by jdclyde ·

          In reply to Al and Jesse

          he is syndicated in the detroit free press, so I have read his editorials.

          I rarely agree with anything he has to say.

          He rarely stands like Cosby on the issues, calling for blacks to stand up for themselves instead of sit down and cry “i’m a victim”.

        • #2539342

          Reflection of the mainstream, perhaps?

          by tonythetiger ·

          In reply to Al and Jesse

          [i]But the real work remaining doesn’t get these two carpetbaggers any time in the spotlight.[/i]

          I alluded to the fact in another thread that more people seem to want to [b]appear[/b] to be doing something useful than want to actually do it.

        • #2519201

          but jdclyde…that is the crappy double-standard…

          by jck ·

          In reply to Just using teh “lingo fo the day”

          Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson will jump all over someone white for saying a black girl is a “ho”, even if she’s on a team with white girls.

          But, they will go to someone like Ice Cube or Chuck D. or 50 Cent and say “Listen, my brother…you don’t need to be putting the women down like that…” etc etc…

          I don’t know if it’s because of race…or…because rappers would just beat the crap out them, where an old codger like Imus is lucky to beat eggs with a blender…

          But, it is a double-standard…anyone who belittles a woman like that…just is sexist. No matter what their race…

          Same applies for racially derrogatory terms…

          Or at least…it should…

    • #2538688

      There could be come good to come from this

      by jdclyde ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      maybe they will BAN from the radio, ALL use of “b1tches and hos”, which would eliminate about 90% of all RAP and hip hop from airing every again.

      Maybe, just maybe, if this is so wrong, shows will not be allowed to glamorize pimps and hos?

      Oh wait, I forgot. That would be freedom of expression and should be covered…..

      I hate the ACLU and NAACP more and more every day for the damage they have and continue to do to our society.

    • #2539540

      Free speech and responsibity

      by jamesrl ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Maybe I’m too dense, but I don’t get it.

      Don Imus, has no protection from being suspended or fired by his bosses for saying something stupid, whether its racist or not. If I defame my employer, they will not even think twice about my rights to free expression.

      Sharpton et al, as much as I disagree with them, have every right to protest what Imus said, and if they want to pressure Imus’ employer, well thats their right too.

      If Imus says something nasty about George W Bush, and you want to lead a drive to pressure his employer to get him fired, thats your right.

      Yeah, its racuous and rowdy and not neat and tidy, but democracy isn’t neat and tidy.

      James

      • #2539469

        Crediblity is not on their side

        by jdclyde ·

        In reply to Free speech and responsibity

        There are far worse things being said in what passes for songs everyday.

        Where is the protest on the top 10 rap/hip hop “songs” that talk about beating and bang’en their hos?

        Of course Sharpton CAN cry about this as much as he wants, but to DEMAND anything?

        And like I said to Tony, it is a great day in America when the worst thing in race relations is what Imus said.

        Oh, and Imus has been against the war and many Bush policies all along.

        Imus has done more for charities that help underprivilage kids (including black and hispanic) than Sharpton does.

        I am not a fan of his, and if people don’t like what he says, they won’t listen.

        Wasn’t that the same argument about Howard Stern? Change the channel if you don’t like it?

        People that are looking to be insulted will find a reason to be. I will bet that not one girl on that team was insulted by him because they weren’t listening to his program. When the “gotcha group” started going on and on about it, THEN they got insulted.

        It wasn’t until yesterday that I even knew what he had said.

        I hear “rich white guys” thrown around all the time, intending it as a bad thing.

        Sorry, but all the oversensitivity and hypocrisy really urks me.

    • #2539458

      Not the words, but the target. – EDITED.

      by charliespencer ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      It’s not so much what he said, it’s the circumstances under which he said it. The basketball team was verbally dope-smacked for the apparent crime of playing in the NCAA finals. Unlike politicians, entertainers, celebrities, and other spot-light seekers, they did not seek a public forum (other than to play their sport well), and had no bully pulpit to conduct a defense.

      If Imus was a licensed boxer, he’d be perfectly justified in climbing in the ring and slugging a contracted opponent. He would not have the right to walk down the street punching people with no warning or provocation. While his conduct was not physical, it was the verbal equivalent: a licensed broadcaster calling out a talented, undeserving group for no reason other than he could.

      Someone made a comparison to the language used in popular music. Rarely is that language aimed at specific individuals other than other popular figures in the entertainment industry. This isn’t in the same category with one rapper calling out another. The team isn’t competing with Imus for an audience; most of them probably didn’t know he existed. This isn’t like making (stupid, misogynistic) generalizations. Imus was commenting on ten individuals.

      Unlike male basketball players, these individuals will probably never make big money off their talent; they actually have to use their scholarships to earn degrees and not to gain experience for a professional sports career. They achieved all they could hope for in their sport, and are denigrated for it by an “entertainer” with an national audience. Who does he pick on next, Special Olympians?

      Are there better things to worry about? Sure. But if you ask that question, be prepared to answer why Imus wasn’t talking about them. Instead he chose to characterize the personal behavior of a specific group of athletes he’d never met. That’s his First Amendment right, it’s Al Sharpton’s right to call for his firing, and it’s his employer’s right to sit him out for a couple of weeks for his actions. Imus is not being censored or deprived of his freedom of speech; the network has simply chosen to exercise their right to not provide him with an outlet.

      EDITED extensively all afternoon, but I think I’m finished 🙂

    • #2539372

      Way too sensitive

      by av . ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Don Imus’ comments were really nasty, but he’s a shock jock and thats what he does. Is it fair to the Rutgers female basketball players? No. Its despicable.

      His big mistake was being white and insulting blacks. There is a zero-tolerance policy from the likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and others who are just waiting for moments like that to bring up the same old black inequality argument again. God forbid anyone should ever say the “N” word. Just ask Michael Richards.

      This is totally blown out of proportion. I’ve never even listened to Imus, but I think a public apology is enough and everyone should move on. He is going to be suspended for 2 weeks and has lost his deal with MSNBC. Enough. I’m personally sick of hearing how the black girls on the Rutgers team were so demoralized by the comments. Imus is an a**hole, move on.

      Obviously, that’s not going to happen because Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have alot of time on their hands looking for white people that say the wrong thing. They should be looking at the black rappers and gangstas. Their song lyrics are disgusting and they are certainly no role models for young black people. I guess thats ok with them because they’ve never said anything about it.

      I think its an opportune overreaction by the likes of Sharpton, et al. Shock jocks shock. I’m a woman. Howard Stern demoralizes women everyday. I don’t really care.

      AV

      • #2530748

        Thank you for speaking up!!!

        by djcobp ·

        In reply to Way too sensitive

        I too believe not only blacks, but everyone right now is waaaaay toooooo sensitive. For God’s sake, lighten up! And I am so sick and tired of hearing from Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. They are both media mongers, and racists themselves. You are right, they are looking for every little thing they can find to jump on a white person, and call them racist.

        There is no doubt it was blown way way way out of proportion. He should NEVER had lost his job over this. I think we all agree it was a stupid thing to say. (He Agrees!) So life goes on. I think the Rev Sharpton and Jesse Jackson need to look inside and ask themselves if they have ever made a mistake and/or said anything wrong in their lives. I think we all need to ask ourselves that before we persecute others. We are all human, and we have and always WILL make mistakes. Let’s remember that! What happened to being able to joke around? The good old blonde jokes, polish jokes etc. We don’t mean them in a mean way, but in a joking way. Let’s all lighten up and have some fun!

        Furthermore, let’s clean up OUR OWN backyard first! Let’s get the rappers to stop using those “words” especially if the whites are NOT allowed to use them. Why can blacks joke around using the N word, but if a white says it, he/she is a racist? Why? Black people can’t have it both ways. There is a TRUE double standard right now. You can’t have a Miss Black America Pagent, if whites can’t have a Miss White American Pagent. See what I mean? I see it everyday. In Pontiac, there is a Black Police club.. What if the Whites decided they wanted to have a White Police Club (they would be racist)! So equality means just that, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. PONDER IT!

    • #2539368

      Imus is toast

      by techexec2 ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      .
      Advertisers are dropping out like flies and now MSNBC has permanently dropped the cable TV simulcast of the Don Imus radio show, effective immediately (1). Given the frenzy and the full-court press from black leaders, I cannot imagine that CBS Radio is going to continue the radio show. Watch for the cancellation to be announced soon.

      After 36 years, Radio Hall of Fame inductee Don Imus’ “Imus in the Morning” show is toast.

      [b]”Thanks” go to Revs. Al and Jessie[/b]

      “Thanks” go to Revs. Al and Jessie for whipping up an overreaction to Imus’ outrageous stupid insensitive hurtful remark that I also condemn. Let’s see if they now put a similar effort into permanently eradicating the far more outrageous unrestrained racist, sexist, misogynist, and otherwise offensive language and behavior from rap artists and black comedy shows such as “Def Comedy Jam”, “The Bad Boys of Comedy” and others.

      Rev. Jessie picketed in front of the NBC office in Chicago and got Imus canceled. Let’s see him picket in front of Death Row Records until they stop publishing their disgusting rap music lyrics. Note to Rev. Jessie: This may not be as safe as picketing NBC. Just ask Biggie Smalls and 2Pac.

      My prediction: The hypocrisy will continue unabated.

      Unlike those who overreact, I won’t spend ANY of my time picketing the offices of these shows/artists. I just change the channel and don’t buy the CDs. Novel concept, huh?

      [b]Remember this about Don Imus[/b]

      During the insult comedy portions of his show, 66 year-old Don Imus was an outrageous, cantankerous, curmudgeonly insult comic who thoroughly enjoyed it when he himself was the target of the insult joke as he often was. He behaved in an outrageous way that I never would.

      Imus also has a big heart and gives very generously with his time and money to many charitable causes, including those of particular interest to black Americans. Last year, he was a major supporter of Harold Ford’s U.S. Senate campaign in Tennessee. In case you don’t know, Harold Ford is black. No vile racist would do that. Getting him thrown off the air is an injustice. He just made a very stupid mindless offhand remark in the context of ill-conceived humor.

      [b]Hypocrisy, oversensitivity, and overreaction[/b]

      I am sick and tired of the hypocrisy, oversensitivity, and overreaction. Without “leaders” whipping up discontent, this would have blown over very quickly. What is most hurtful to the Rutgers student-athletes is not the remark that they never directly heard, on the radio show they have never listened to before, by the radio personality they have never heard of. What hurts them is everyone telling them how badly they have been insulted. This doesn’t excuse it in any way. It doesn’t take ANYTHING away from the hurt felt by these talented young women. They did not deserve to be made a joke of and insulted. Imus should have been severely disciplined for his stupid mistake. He should not have been destroyed because of it.

      So, Reverends, is that what Jesus would do?

      ————————————–

      (1) MSNBC drops simulcast of Don Imus show
      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17999196/

      • #2539097

        CBS fires Don Imus

        by techexec2 ·

        In reply to Imus is toast

        ,
        As I predicted yesterday, CBS has fired Don Imus.

        My other prediction was that the hypocrisy would continue unabated. Let’s see what happens to the racist, sexist, misogynist rap music. Let’s see if I’m also right about that. I’ll bet I am.

        This is an outrageous injustice.

        • #2539047

          I agree with you. I think it’s outrageous too.

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to CBS fires Don Imus

          I can think of at least one or two more important issues that our beloved Brethren and the media could focus on. For example, what’s Paris Hilton’s take on all of this?

          This whole incident has raised another couple of questions with me. Is it spelled hos, ho’s or hoes, hoe’s and will we see the mall Santas getting kicked out for HoHo-ing in mixed company? I’ll take bets on the last bit.

          Edited to add “?”

        • #2539018

          If you think RAP Music

          by w2ktechman ·

          In reply to CBS fires Don Imus

          is on the hit list, I think Comedians will be as well.

        • #2539014

          Butter or no butter?

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to If you think RAP Music

          We’ve got George Carlin toast coming right up.

        • #2519198

          I agree

          by jck ·

          In reply to CBS fires Don Imus

          If Sharpton had any integrity at all, he would demand that every rapper who has ever called women “hos” to quit rapping, give up their career and contract with their record label and the money that comes along with it…just like he did Imus.

          Of course, the rappers would just laugh at him and say “Shut your punk a$$ up!” or something…

          Maybe that’s what Imus should have done? hahaha

      • #2519187

        I have to comment on the one paragraph, Tech…

        by jck ·

        In reply to Imus is toast

        [b][i]Imus also has a big heart and gives very generously with his time and money to many charitable causes, including those of particular interest to black Americans. Last year, he was a major supporter of Harold Ford’s U.S. Senate campaign in Tennessee. In case you don’t know, Harold Ford is black. No vile racist would do that. Getting him thrown off the air is an injustice. He just made a very stupid mindless offhand remark in the context of ill-conceived humor.[/i][/b]

        A political campaign…a charitable cause in the interest of blacks?

        Just seemed funny…you know…

        Actually…it’s more like welfare. Just look at Sharpton and Jackson…they’ve been living off the charitable monies of the black community for years.

        BTW…Jackson definitely broke a commandment (Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife) when he had that affair and illegitimate kid while married.

        What a man of Christ, eh?

    • #2539358

      I agree with Tom Delay

      by protiusx ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      He wrote a fantastic piece for Townhall.com

      http://www.townhall.com/Columnists/TomDeLay/2007/04/11/tom_delays_action_points_if_the_left_takes_imus,_we%e2%80%99ll_take_rosie

      It comes down to this – Liberals are hypocritical communists who can say anything the want about Gandhi (al la Comrade Hillary) or about the Chinese (al la Rosie O?Donnell) or to make racist remarks about Jews (al la The Reverend Jesse Hi’Jackson) and no one says a word. Let a conservative say something off color of out of sorts and WHAM! The vermin band together like rats and light the poor blighter on fire.

      I am disgusted by the whole affair. I don?t know Imus and I didn?t listen to his show but I can tell that he was conservative by the onslaught that the left is pouring out on him.

    • #2539022

      I work with a man

      by tig2 ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Who is African American. He shared this with me-

      “I think of my daughter. She is 11. She is a miracle child with everything in front of her. She is racially mixed.

      “I suppose that means that she can “pass” for the rest of her life. I work with Indians and Mexicans who are darker skinned. And maybe that should be enough for me. I suppose I should know my place.

      “But why is it not okay to tell her about the rich culture that I came from? And why should I encourage her to be anything other than who she is? She is such a miracle to me.”

      On the walls of his workspace is the value this man puts in his 3 children. You cannot miss it.

      Don Imus’ comment was so hugely out of line that I find it hard to believe that he still has employment. He took dis-respect to a new level. Rutgers is a major university and well respected. Those women deserved to have some respect for their accomplishments as scholars and as athletes. Don Imus simply proved once again that he is an ass.

      • #2539020

        From my understanding

        by w2ktechman ·

        In reply to I work with a man

        Now this is from limited knowledge on this, as I have never heard this person, nor care to. But from what I have read, this is NORMAL for him, not out of the ordinary. This is something that he does over and over again. His fans do not care about what he said, only those that do not listen to him at all, and then they were told what he said.
        Who is the next target, Howard Stern? I am not a fan of Howard Stern either, but they have their personalities on the air, and they have their own fans.
        If this person was just racist, yes, fire him, or worse, but if he does this to Everybody Regardless, then it is a normal thing and the station should have known that some people could get offended.
        just my 2 cents (or less)

        • #2519051

          Howard Stern

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to From my understanding

          This is why Howard isn’t on the public airwaves anymore. Howard took his act to satellite, where he’s not using the public airwaves and the audience has to actively seek him out by subscribing to a service. Like pay-per-view cable TV networks, there are different standards when you’re not using broadcasting. Don Imus will probably find satellite to be his next career move.

      • #2519107

        Yep.

        by tonythetiger ·

        In reply to I work with a man

        I was offended by Imus’ statements… and he was fired.

        I was even more offended at the statements of Jackson and Sharpton… Are they being fired as well?

        • #2519049

          Firing Jackson and Sharpton

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to Yep.

          They’re self-employed.

          Boycott the media outlets that give them an audience (and an audience to Brittany, Madonna, O.J., etc.), the same way they encouraged others to boycott Imus’ sponsors. Yet another reason I don’t look at any form of televised news; too much fluff and sensationalism.

        • #2518937

          I agree with you

          by tig2 ·

          In reply to Firing Jackson and Sharpton

          The only way to fire them is to insure that they are ignored.

          Hmm. Not going to happen.

          Or speaking out against them in neutral terms with no personal gain. Good luck with that.

          They involved themselves in this because it got them press. Nothing more, nothing less. They are as much an anathema to the African American community as they are to everyone else on the planet who came pre-equipped with a brain cell and a clue.

          I cannot defend Imus’ poor choices. He’s an ass and has always been an ass. The fact that he makes a living being an ass changes nothing.

          The sponsors do not want this kind of mud on their nice shiny brand. It just doesn’t look good.

      • #2530740

        Don Imus

        by djcobp ·

        In reply to I work with a man

        Once again i must ask YOU (TiggerTwo) to look inward! Have you ever said something you have regretted? Have you ever done anything you have regretted? Did you have your life pulled out from under you for making those mistakes? He has appologized, isn’t that enough? For God’s Sake… the is AMERICA!!! We have the right to free speech. We also have the right to believe the way we want to.

        We all have to learn to tolerate others. We have to allow them to their beliefs. You don’t have to agree with them, but you have to agree that they have the RIGHT to say what they beleive, and believe what they believe.

        Complain about Don Imus all you want, but don’t end his life! I hope most of you in American who blew this way way out of proportion can live with the fact that you distroyed a mans life. I don’t believe for a minute it has devistated those players from Rutgers. Infact if the media hadn’t blown it out of proportion, they would never even have known out it. Jessie and Rev Sharpton!!! 🙁

        The equality pendulum has swung way way way too far the other way. It is not equality anymore!

        And most blacks are not “African-American” , unless they truely are from Africa. Most aren’t! I hate that term! Blacks are Americans…humans. We don’t called Jewish people Jewish-Americans, or Irish…Irish-Americans. Give it a rest! How about just American.

        Enough with the over sensitivity to everything, or we WILL lose all our comedians, dj’s, singers etc. If they have to be sooooo careful about what they say and can’t joke about anything, what’s left???
        I ask you, what’s left?

        • #2530701

          Hello friend…

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to Don Imus

          .
          I agree with you about Don Imus (1). He should not have been fired. That was an outrageous injustice.

          But I disagree with you about TiggerTwo. Tigger is right. Don Imus often behaves like an ass. I cannot imagine behaving like Don Imus behaves. And, I hope you can say the same about yourself.

          Even so, I thought his show was a must-see/listen. Don Imus did not take his “assness” seriously. People who “got” Don Imus did not take his “assness” seriously either, including myself. Nobody who does SO much good for other people is a complete ass. But, he was clearly a partial ass, and he was way over the line in the Rutgers case.

          [b][i]”…We all have to learn to tolerate others. We have to allow them to their beliefs…”[/i][/b]

          This is not about tolerance. Don Imus was over the line in the Rutgers case. We should not tolerate people publicly “attacking” teenagers, not even in the context of an ill-conceived joke.

          He should have been disciplined, he should have apologized, and that should have been the end of it. He should not have been destroyed. You’re 100% right about that.

          [b][i]”…And most blacks are not “African-American”…”[/i][/b]

          I disagree. There is a reason why many blacks in America think of themselves as separate. Unless you walk a mile in their shoes (it’s very clear you haven’t), you do not have any idea what they go through every single day of their lives. Example: Just look at what is happening to the Rutgers basketball team. They are receiving hate mail! They are teenagers who did nothing to deserve this! There are some real bastards out there. Have YOU ever received hate mail? Lots of it? And, this is just the tip of the iceberg. I think you need to work on your understanding of this.

          Does this mean we must constantly give huge amounts of special treatment to blacks in America? No. We should insist that everyone behave in a reasonable way (with latitude), including having equal opportunity (room to work on that), and including not being overly sensitive about things (room to work on that too).

          ————————————————–

          (1) My posts on Don Imus
          http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=102&threadID=218232&messageID=2210780
          http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=102&threadID=218232&messageID=2211329
          http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=102&threadID=218232&messageID=2211723
          http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=102&threadID=218232&messageID=2211930

          (…just another post from the “Gang of Four”…inside joke…)

        • #2530903

          Hello Back…

          by djcobp ·

          In reply to Hello friend…

          “…And most blacks are not “African-American”…”

          I disagree. There is a reason why many blacks in America think of themselves as separate. Unless you walk a mile in their shoes (it’s very clear you haven’t), you do not have any idea what they go through every single day of their lives.

          Well there lies the problem, they think of themselves as separate! We need to think of ourselves as humans or, if you want, Americans.
          I do “NOT” know what blacks have gone through, (at least not personally) but I know it was and still is hard. All I’m saying is the pendulum has swung way to far the other way. You can’t have equality if you want everything your way. There has to be compromise to find the middle ground. There has to be “common sense”. All people with black skin are NOT African-Americans, unless you want to say we all come from Africa. How far back do you want to go? If you want to live in American, then why not be an American (PERIOD).

      • #2530739

        Don Imus

        by djcobp ·

        In reply to I work with a man

        Once again i must ask YOU (TiggerTwo) to look inward! Have you ever said something you have regretted? Have you ever done anything you have regretted? Did you have your life pulled out from under you for making those mistakes? He has appologized, isn’t that enough? For God’s Sake… the is AMERICA!!! We have the right to free speech. We also have the right to believe the way we want to.

        We all have to learn to tolerate others. We have to allow them to their beliefs. You don’t have to agree with them, but you have to agree that they have the RIGHT to say what they beleive, and believe what they believe.

        Complain about Don Imus all you want, but don’t end his life! I hope most of you in American who blew this way way out of proportion can live with the fact that you distroyed a mans life. I don’t believe for a minute it has devistated those players from Rutgers. Infact if the media hadn’t blown it out of proportion, they would never even have known out it. Jessie and Rev Sharpton!!! 🙁

        The equality pendulum has swung way way way too far the other way. It is not equality anymore!

        And most blacks are not “African-American” , unless they truely are from Africa. Most aren’t! I hate that term! Blacks are Americans…humans. We don’t called Jewish people Jewish-Americans, or Irish…Irish-Americans. Give it a rest! How about just American.

        Enough with the over sensitivity to everything, or we WILL lose all our comedians, dj’s, singers etc. If they have to be sooooo careful about what they say and can’t joke about anything, what’s left???
        I ask you, what’s left?

        • #2530653

          Opinions are okay as long as they agree with yours huh?

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to Don Imus

          “We all have to learn to tolerate others. We have to allow them to their beliefs.”

          Edit: Change “have” to “should” and I couldn’t agree more.

          I’m just curious, did you join TR just to post a reply in this discussion? To me it looks like you have other unresolved issues.

          In response to the rest of your reply:
          I personally don’t know anyone who cares too much one way or the other about the “nappy headed ho” comment. You’re right that it was over-blown by “the media”. It’s my opinion that Racism is continually perpetuated by “the media”. “Black man shoots two white girls during robbery attempt” or “White power rally takes place in Toledo – More at 6:00.”

          If you ask me, ignoring “color” is an adult and educated “thing”. To me it’s not any more of an “issue” than what Paris Hilton got arrested for lately, what Tom Cruise, Britney Spears, Don Imus or Jesse and Al are doing. If you choose to think that race/color is an issue I suggest that you believe too much of the crap “the media” puts out as news. They’ll sensationalize anything that will sell advertising space so media bias will continue.
          BTW-I don’t have to do anything. Neither does anyone else and I’m holding out hope against it but if you’re a good example of “what’s left” we are in deep shlt!

          Edited to make more sense. You get the idea.

        • #2530897

          responce

          by djcobp ·

          In reply to Opinions are okay as long as they agree with yours huh?

          You can edit a letter and pick it apart if you’d like, and have you own opinions…it’s a democratic world.

          I don’t particular care for your comment … (“BTW-I don’t have to do anything. Neither does anyone else and I’m holding out hope against it but if you’re a good example of “what’s left” we are in deep shlt!)”…but then there are all kinds of people out there.

          What do you mean “What’s Left?” And what do you mean “we are in deep shlt!”

        • #2530160

          Response

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to responce

          I really care what you think and feel that I need to explain myself to you. Although you may never see any evidence of that in any shape, form or fashion just know that I really care.

          Really.

      • #2531090

        Were the girls of Rutgers insulted?

        by jdclyde ·

        In reply to I work with a man

        No, they had no idea how insulted they were until someone told them repeatedly they had been insulted.

        If wasn’t for people like the unhonorable racist Sharpton, it would have never bothered these girls in the least.

    • #2519204

      Imus…racist?

      by jck ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Ya know…I think he’s a blundering idiot…an old coot who wouldn’t know “cool” if it hit him in the arse with a sledgehammer…and his show has been crap for years.

      And I’m in no way defending his comment…but…

      However…calling him a racist is off-base.

      Why? Here’s why…

      His comment, in regards to the Rutgers University Women’s Basketball Team, was:

      [b][i]That’s some nappy-headed hos there. [/i][/b]

      For anyone who hasn’t seen the Rutgers Women’s Team…there are 8 black girls, 2 white girls. So if this was a racist comment…he’s being racist against his own race too in his comments about the team.

      If you exclude those white girls from the picture, then you’re discounting their participation in the program. Is that racist of you?

      Particularly, Don Imus made a stupid, insensitive, incredibly [b]sexist[/b] comment…for which…he should be on his knees begging those girls for forgiveness.

      I don’t care how illustrious his career is/was. I don’t think Don Imus ever attended Rutgers University or any other prestigous university or attained any notable status before his professional career.

      In fact, Wikipedia states that Imus stated in a Vanity Fair article that he was a school dropout.

      So…if those girls are “hos”, then at least they are well-educated and respected “hos”…

      And Imus? Well, he is a loser…and now, he’s proven it beyond the shadow of a doubt.

      So to answer your questions, jd…

      Q: Is everyone just too sensitive?
      A: No, just the people who want attention or are living in the past.

      Q: Is this no big deal?
      A: No, it is a big deal. He is an idiot who, because of his out-of-line comments, deserves punishment for belittling them.

      Q: Is this ground shaking and should shock us to the core?
      A: Not to the core, but if it doesn’t disturb you to some extent that a man in this day and age still disparages women of accomplishment for their looks at any age…then…perhaps you might be a bit undersensitive. I mean…how would you feel if that was your daughter on that team he was commenting about?

      Anyways…he’s no racist for commenting against a group of mixed racial ethnicity….but, he’s a friggin sexist moron…and a dweeb extraordinaire.

      just my 2 cents…

    • #2519139

      I’m not going to miss him. In fact, they should fire more.

      by delbertpgh ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      Imus got fired not because of some hypocritical double standard. He got fired because the advertisers didn’t want their brands associated with him, and pulled their money. It’s just business. Money was the air under his wings, and if it was still there, CBS would have found some way to live through it and continue, however reluctantly, to receive all those checks.

      I used to enjoy Imus, back in 1977, driving around New Jersey. He did skits. He prepared topics. His point was to be funny first, and shocking second. His shock was his impiety: to pull the robes off of revered public figures and show that there was a fallible man underneath, and to show up hypocrisy: either that his victims’ pretensions, our desire to overlook their faults, was the basis of a lie. He also played with stereotypes, including racial ones, and showed how much lying was going on. But, he always used humor to drive the needle to the nerve.

      Imus gave up on funny a long time ago. Like every other highly paid radio jerk, his game is to say a bunch of bad crap, and stimulate an audience too jaded (or too dumb) to appreciate actual humor. I miss the Imus of 30 years ago, but I won’t miss the insulting fool in his shoes now.

      I wouldn’t cry a minute if nobody ever shoved a microphone in front of Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton again, either. Like Imus and Stern and Limbaugh and Hannity, they make a living by exploiting and deepening the divisions in American life.

    • #2519135

      This was about [i]MONEY![/i]

      by techexec2 ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      .
      Imus was fired over money. This was a “lynching”. This was not about decency. I’m not surprised by this. I’m just speaking about it and setting the record straight since it is pretty hard to find the friggin’ media doing so.

      [b]Advertisers pulled out when they were threatened by economic loss[/b]

      Are the advertisers doing this for moral reasons? No way! This is all about money. They are deathly afraid of how their own financial interests will be adversely affected by pressure coming from black interest groups picketing, boycotting, all the bad press, etc. The adverse affect of this could last for many years. They simply cut and run (and were smart to do so).

      This is just my opinion. I have nothing to back this up. No advertiser has come out publicly and admitted this (no surprise).

      [b][i]”…And so yesterday, I found out after the fact that some of the advertisers had started to pull their money away. Those types of reports don?t land on my desk immediately. And honestly, that is not what is behind this. This is about trust. It?s about reputation. It?s about doing what?s right…”[/i][/b] — Steve Capus, President, NBC News (4)

      Baloney! I don’t believe for one second that the many millions in advertising dollars lost had nothing to do with NBC canceling the Imus simulcast. If this executive is really that disconnected from his own business, HE should be fired. I don’t believe it. I’ll bet his boss knew! :^0

      The sequence of events was: 1. Two-week suspension. 2. Advertisers pulled out. 3. Imus simulcast canceled.

      Furthermore: Does this sound like a guy who has the authority to make this decision on his own? Hell no! He’s just the front guy who gave the interview. Nobody who operates by waiting for things to come to his desk has any real authority to do anything.

      NBC and Don Imus have had a contentious love-hate relationship for years. Imus made lots of money for them, but he also made many disparaging remarks about many NBC shows and was a jerk to many of the NBC people on the set of the MSNBC studio.

      [b][i]”…The Rev. Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson met with [CBS President and CEO] Moonves on Thursday to demand Imus? removal, promising a rally outside CBS headquarters Saturday and an effort to persuade more advertisers to defect…”[/i][/b] (3)

      After watching what happened to advertising on MSNBC, and getting this direct threat from Al and Jessie, CBS caved in over concerns about its own advertising revenues. This was not about decency. It was about money. If it was about decency, Imus would have been fired in the beginning, not given a 2-week suspension. Do these people REALLY expect us to believe this crap? :^0

      So… When are Al and Jessie going to stop giving lip service and stage similar protests in front of Death Row Records (et al) to stop the disgusting, racist, sexist, misogynist rap lyrics? Never… Count on it. They could have done it at any time in the last 10 years.

      [b][i]?…Something happened in the last week around America, It?s not just what the radio host did. America said enough is enough. America said we don?t want this kind of conversation, we don?t want this kind of vitriol, especially with teenagers…?[/i][/b] — Bryan Monroe, President of the National Association of Black Journalists (3)

      Baloney! All one has to do is check the online polls to see that this is false (1)(2). Nobody (almost…there ARE some vile racists out there) condones Don Imus’ remark about the Rutgers student-athletes. But, it’s a leap to say that “America” has called for Don Imus’ head. Some may complain that these online polls are not scientific. Well, they speak a lot better for “America” than this one man does. He does not speak for “America”. He is just someone with an agenda that a small minority of Americans agree with.

      [b][i]?…He says he wants to be forgiven. I hope he continues in that process. But we cannot afford a precedent established that the airways can commercialize and mainstream sexism and racism…?[/i][/b] Rev. Al Sharpton (3)

      Since “Rev” Sharpton is a “man of God”, what exactly is he doing to assist Don Imus, a child of God, in being forgiven and redeeming his soul? I think he is a very poor excuse for a “Rev”.

      [b]The punishment did not fit the crime[/b]

      You have to REALLY do something heinous to be fired and thrown off the air in the middle of your own charity radiothon, raising millions of dollars for several important charities, one of which you run yourself. Does the punishment fit the crime? I don’t think so. This was about money! CBS’ money.

      [b]We should not teach our children victimhood[/b]

      I applaud Vivian Stringer, Rutgers women’s basketball coach, for being a great coach and for doing a great job of helping to put focus on the accomplishments of the smart, talented, young student-athletes. But, she has also done them a great disservice. She helped to cement into the minds of these young women that they are VICTIMS, and has shown what you can “get” by being one. This is going to be very hurtful to them. There was a better way to handle this. She should have told them that they should NEVER be a victim no matter what anyone else does. It appears the problem is that she is overcome with her own personal experiences in being black and being victimized in her own life. If we want our children to rise above adversity and not think of themselves as victims, we cannot project our own victimhood onto them.

      If she ran Whoville when the Grinch stole Christmas, she would have had a sad remembrance gathering the next day and spoke about how the Grinch stole Christmas once when SHE was a little girl too. By contrast, the Who’s in Whoville wisely celebrated Christmas just like always without skipping a beat.

      But, I don’t want to be overly critical of her. I think she is an [u]exceptional[/u] person. Truly.

      [b]Who has handled this best of all?[/b]

      The people I am most proud of in all of this are the student-athletes of the Rutgers women’s basketball team. They handled themselves in a far far better way than any of the adults. With young people like this, I know America will be in good hands in the future.

      ———————————————-

      (1) Poll: Did Don Imus deserve to be fired by CBS?
      Yes, he went too far, and for no reason: 26%
      No, the comment wasn’t that big of a deal: 23%
      The suspension was deserved, but firing him is an overreaction: 51%
      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18080360/

      (2) Poll: Do you think Don Imus apologized enough?
      Yes: 83%
      No: 17%
      http://www.cnn.com/POLLSERVER/results/31269.exclude.html

      (3) CBS fires Don Imus from radio show
      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18072804/

      (4) NBC News: ‘Only decision we could reach’
      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18063461/

      edit: typo

      • #2519054

        You sound surprised.

        by charliespencer ·

        In reply to This was about [i]MONEY![/i]

        Of course it was about money.

        From the other side of the coin, why was Imus employed in the first place? They didn’t give him a block of drive time air time because they though he was the Oracle of Delphi and his pronouncements should be provided to the world. They broadcast his show because he gave them an audience for the sponsors’ messages. In other words, he made money for the networks.

        His actions caused the networks involved to lose sponsors / money. From a business point of view, that’s his real crime. Apparently the networks felt they would not be able to replace the sponsors / money, so they dropped him. Networks drop money-losing shows all the time (what was that ’60s show with the spaceship and the pointy-eared alien?); this one is just more high profile than usual.

        Know why you don’t read about drug problems in auto racing? Your sponsor will drop you like a hot lug nut. Make the sponsor look bad, and you hope you can find another one to back you. If the team owner doesn’t think he can find anyone to back you, he has to let you go.

        • #2519052

          NOW JUST WAIT A MINUTE, MISTER!! :D

          by jck ·

          In reply to You sound surprised.

          Imus? Bigger than Star Trek?

          Or did you mean its cancellation?

          I guarantee…you show kids on a college campus Captain Kirk and Mr. Spock…then pictures of Don and Bernard…Star Trek would win hands down.

          As for the cancellation of Star Trek…well…just another example of how stupid executives can be.

        • #2519044

          Imus’ cancellation was bigger

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to NOW JUST WAIT A MINUTE, MISTER!! :D

          The story of Imus’ cancellation has been as unavoidable as gas after a Tex-Mex buffet. Why, it ran Anna Nicole’s kid right off the second page.

          As I recall, Trek departed without rippling much water. And after that last broadcast episode with Kirk and that woman swapping bodies, it might just barely, possible, maybe have been a good thing. Talk about chewing up the scenery. Most of the third season stunk like the afore mentioned flatulence.

          As regards stupid network executives, who knows? Maybe local independent radio stations will start airing Imus reruns. Conventions will spring up with fans quoting favorite bits of dialog and playing blooper tapes. Imus will hit the fan club circuit, signing autographs for “Donnies”. Books will be written about the fan phenomenon. The internet will abound with fan fiction about the broadcast team’s new exploits. After a decade CBS will realize there’s a huge market of nostalgic fans with ready cash and nowhere to spend it. They’ll make a two-hour special broadcast with fancy sets and updated production values but the same cast and stories. Next thing you know, Patrick Stewart will be on “Shock Jocks: The Next Generation”. Don’t look for Whoppi Goldberg to co-star…

        • #2519041

          How can you say that?

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to You sound surprised.

          .
          How can you say “You sound surprised”? I explicitly said [i]”…I’m not surprised by this. I’m just speaking about it and setting the record straight since it is pretty hard to find the friggin’ media doing so…”[/i]

          [b]I should sound [i]DISGUSTED[/i][/b]

          If you read my post a little more carefully 🙂 , I should sound DISGUSTED, not surprised. I’m disgusted by the way people came out of the woodwork from all over the place to lynch Imus like they did. And, I’m disgusted that they were successful at it. I’m disgusted at the way the media covered this. I’m disgusted that Al and Jessie were able to whip up unrest over this stupid remark. I’m disgusted that they are both hypocritical and less than honest about all of this. I’m disgusted that they have that much power to manipulate things. I’m disgusted that these so-called “Reverends” are promoting polarization of the races (Where’s the forgiveness and reconciliation? Is that what Jesus would do?). I’m disgusted (but not surprised) that everyone is out there talking about “decency” and “new dialog” and a “turning point” and all of the other crap when it is really all about the money. I’m disgusted that Harold Ford, Jr, who was almost single-handedly elected U.S. Senator in Tennessee because of Don Imus’ support, completely deserted his friend in a time of crisis (we need leaders with much more courage than that). I’m disgusted that the racist, sexist, misogynist rap lyrics will continue. I’m disgusted that all of the MANY people behind the scenes on the “Imus in the Morning” show will be seriously hurt by this firing (Don will be fine). I’m disgusted that they fired him in the [u]middle[/u] of a charity radiothon (how is this incident that important?). I’m disgusted that a contrite sincere apology, over and over, even now accepted by the Rutgers student-athletes and their coach, is not enough to put this to rest. I am disgusted that those special interest groups will settle for nothing less than destroying people and [u]intimidating everyone else with their power[/u].

          Did I say I am disgusted? I’m DISGUSTED!

          [b]There is something very wrong here[/b]

          Imus said it. But, none of the advertising dollars would have been lost without political pressure from black special interest groups. There is something very very wrong with that. That is a FAR more important thing that a stupid remark by a 66 year-old man on the radio.

          [b]On the other hand…[/b]

          On the other hand, none of this would have happened if Imus did not say it. It would not have happened if Imus were a beloved figure (who is immune to such political attacks) who just made a voluntary verbal mistake. And, it would not have happened if Imus did not behave like such a jerk to so many people. Even while doing far far more good than most people ever do, his personality was quite outrageous and rubbed a lot of people the wrong way, even me. There is no question that he brought this on himself. But, that doesn’t mean his firing is not outrageous and unfair, and that something else is very very wrong here.

        • #2519028

          C’mon, tell us how you really feel.

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to How can you say that?

          “…none of the advertising dollars would have been lost without political pressure from black special interest groups. There is something very very wrong with that.”

          What’s wrong with that? That’s how consumer advocacy works. Years ago a religiously conservative organization applied pressure to the Southland Corporation and had Playboy and Penthouse removed from 7-Eleven stores. A letter campaign from Star Trek fans kept the series going a third year after an announced cancellation; Cagney and Lacey fans did the same thing. OSS advocates are pressuring hardware vendors to pre-install Linux, and are boycotting closed source apps. Pepsi benefited when people loudly criticized “New Coke”, and Coca-Cola had to bring back the “Classic” product. Because of Christian Coalition complaints, Wal-Mart doesn’t carry “Parental Advisory” CDs. Ralph Nader almost single-handedly destroyed the Corvair, and a good thing, too.

          “That is a FAR more important thing that a stupid remark by a 66 year-old man…”

          Yes, it is. It’s important consumers know if they make enough noise and withhold enough money, corporations will listen.

        • #2519024

          You are still off the mark

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to C’mon, tell us how you really feel.

          .
          This was not about consumer advocacy. The people did not demand that Imus be fired (1)(2).

          Imus was fired because of political pressure and economic blackmail from a small group. The Imus franchise was big, but a small part of the NBC and CBS media empire. The networks moved to protect the REST of their business, and to avoid government interference. If Imus were more of a team player, none of this would have happened, even if he uttered the same stupid remark. He made himself vulnerable.

          Al, and Jessie, and black special interest groups are not the voice of the people. The problem is the political power that these TROUBLEMAKERS have. THAT is what is wrong here.

          ——————————————————–

          (1) Poll: Did Don Imus deserve to be fired by CBS?
          Yes, he went too far, and for no reason: 26%
          No, the comment wasn’t that big of a deal: 23%
          The suspension was deserved, but firing him is an overreaction: 51%
          http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18080360/

          (2) Poll: Do you think Don Imus apologized enough?
          Yes: 83%
          No: 17%
          http://www.cnn.com/POLLSERVER/results/31269.exclude.html

        • #2519015

          You’re making my point for me.

          by charliespencer ·

          In reply to You are still off the mark

          “Imus was fired because of political pressure and economic blackmail from a small group.”

          Go back and look at my examples in the previous post. With the exception of New Coke, all of them are cases of groups exerting pressure out of proportion to their size. In this case the special interest groups were apparently the voice of enough people and not enough people took action to show their support of Imus, other than voting in online polls. One group may be troublemakers (an opinion I disagree with), but if they are, are they worse than apathetic “supporters”? Where were the protests to keep him on the air? Maybe there weren’t any because no one cared as strongly about keeping him as the opposition cared about getting rid of him.

          I often wonder why gun control advocates don’t all join the National Rifle Association. They’d outnumber the current membership. They could vote in leadership that supports their positions and route the organization’s campaign donations to gun control candidates. The current NRA is not “the voice of the people”, but they’re active enough to get attention to their position, and the gun control advocates apparently aren’t.

          “This was not about consumer advocacy.”

          Okay, let me replace “consumer advocacy” with “consumer action”. “If you sponsor this man’s show, we won’t buy your products.” One man’s “economic blackmail” is another man’s “vote with your wallet”. It’s a perfectly legal consumer tool, and one I feel is acceptable to use. The sponsors felt they were losing enough potential customers to make continued support unprofitable. Sure the media companies were trying to protect their other divisions. That’s what stockholders pay corporate boards to do, protect their investments. The goal of a business is to make money, and Imus became a drag on the bottom line. I wish there were still NASCAR races at Rockingham, but since relatively few people showed up, they changed the schedule and moved to Texas and California. Just good business; Rockingham was unprofitable.

          There’s a local barbeque restaurant chain in Columbia, SC. Several years ago (2000?) the state legislature debated removing a Confederate flag from atop the state capitol, and from inside the legislative chambers. The owner of the restaurants is a strong supporter of the Confederate cause and was offended by the possible flag removals. When the University of S.C. supported removing the banners from the capitol, he stopped paying for advertising at the college’s football stadium and basketball arena. He voted with his dollars. He put Confederate flags up on poles at his restaurants beside the U.S. and state flags, and it became known he sold pamphlets some deemed pro-slavery in his flagship restaurant. The local groceries stopped stocking his barbeque sauces, costing him over 50% of his business income. The groceries voted with their wallets. He sued, although I don’t see how the groceries’ actions differed from his regarding the university. Neither did the state Supreme Court, which last week finally denied his last appeal.

          I think you already acknowledged that online polls are of questionable accuracy, especially the one on the website of a network that aired Imus’ program. I would have voted that he’s apologized enough too, simply because I’m sick of hearing about it. That doesn’t mean I think he should (or shouldn’t) be employed. I don’t have an opinion about firing him being an overreaction, but it doesn’t matter what I think. I’m not on the board of directors for CBS or NBC.

          Under no circumstances should anything I’ve posted here be interpreted as supporting misogynistic, bigoted, or dehumanizing Rap lyrics. I also do not support Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, or their organizations; I feel their short-term attention to Imus is at the expense of focusing of other actions detrimental to African Americans, many perpetrated by blacks themselves. I do support their right to express themselves, as I support Don Imus’ right to express himself, and CBS and NBC’s privilege to terminate employees for on-air actions detrimental to their business.

        • #2531809

          No, I’m not.

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to You’re making my point for me.

          .
          [b][i]”…You’re making my point for me…”[/i][/b]

          No, I’m not. I don’t agree with you at all.

          I also don’t agree that religious groups should be able to pressure stores to remove products they don’t like. I don’t agree that people with a religious objection to a legal magazine, or contraception, or the “morning after pill”, or the “abortion pill” should be able to intimidate stores to stop selling those products. Controversy is bad for business because it is ugly. These businesses are dropping these products to avoid controversy, not because the people have spoken. That is [u]interference[/u] with the business of others.

          It’s fine when [u]the people[/u] decide to stop buying a product. It’s quite another thing when some small special interest group intimidates a vendor to stop selling it regardless of what the people think. And, just because the people are not highly passionate about the loss doesn’t change anything. Just because they don’t protest strongly doesn’t change anything. The test of this is not whether the people start a riot over it or not.

          [b][i]”…I often wonder why gun control advocates don’t all join the National Rifle Association. They’d outnumber the current membership. They could vote in leadership that supports their positions and route the organization’s campaign donations to gun control candidates…”[/i][/b]

          You need to think past step one. I think that is also why you’re having difficulty seeing my objection to the Imus lynching.

          Hypothetically, if gun control advocates somehow got control of the NRA, gun freedom advocates would just quit, take their money with them, form a new organization, and be back to business as usual.

          [b][i]”…Okay, let me replace “consumer advocacy” with “consumer action”. If you sponsor this man’s show, we won’t buy your products.” One man’s “economic blackmail” is another man’s “vote with your wallet”….”[/i][/b]

          This is not about consumer action either. It’s not about the consumer. They were threatening to stage protests and create lots of bad press and TV coverage. They were going to tell lots of OTHER bad tales (true or not) about what these companies do that they object to. There is a huge difference between blackmail and “vote with your wallet”. I am surprised you would admit you don’t know the difference. The people never had a chance to “vote with their wallets”. The whole thing was over before it even started because it was blackmail. It was decided due to a single meeting between Les Moonves, Al Sharpton, and Jessie Jackson.

          I did not approve of Imus’ stupid remark. He should have been disciplined, he should have apologized publicly and to the student-athletes, and that should have been the end of it. He should not have been destroyed by it. “America” did not run Imus off the air. “America” did not protest. “America” did not think Imus should have been fired. A small minority of Americans used blackmail to force it to occur.

          Don’t even bother to continue this with me. I think you are completely wrong about this.

          [b][i]”…and CBS and NBC’s privilege to terminate employees for on-air actions detrimental to their business…”[/i][/b]

          Of course. But…

          This would not have been detrimental (enough) to their business without blackmail and other actions by black special interest groups, a small minority of America.

      • #2519019

        You might be interested in these links too

        by ontheropes ·

        In reply to This was about [i]MONEY![/i]

    • #2518925

      why listen then

      by keriss ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      no it doesnt bother me

    • #2518924

      why listen then

      by keriss ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      no it doesnt bother me

    • #2518923

      why listen then

      by keriss ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      no it doesnt bother me

    • #2531694

      Don Ho is dead

      by techexec2 ·

      In reply to Is only some offensive speech ok?

      .
      Don Ho is dead (1). Sharpton and Jackson held a press conference and deplored the continued use of the vile term “Ho” in America, but claim they had nothing to do with it. Don Imus apologized and said he had no comment.

      ————————————————–

      (1) Don Ho is Dead
      http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBIZ/Music/04/14/don.ho.obit.ap/index.html

      Don Ho…RIP

      • #2531565

        That was a bad thing you just did. X-(

        by ontheropes ·

        In reply to Don Ho is dead

        And if there’s a real Hell I’m going to be there eventually because I laughed. :_|

        I read the article half-expecting to see the Dear Rev.s mentioned too.

        You want smething that’s interesting instead of my drivel you say? Check this out: http://www.larryelder.com/ascrimes.html

        • #2531563

          New York Post cover headline: “Heave Ho”

          by delbertpgh ·

          In reply to That was a bad thing you just did. X-(

          above a full-page face shot of Don.

        • #2524960

          Pretty bad, huh?

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to That was a bad thing you just did. X-(

          .
          Pretty bad, huh? It’s too bad that honorable titles like “Reverend”, “Father” and “Cardinal” now say “watch out!”

        • #2530799

          Having one of those titles

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to Pretty bad, huh?

          might be the gig to have. Do whatever you want without much in the way of consequence, apology or guilt. :0

          There is that eternal damnation thing though. Hmmm.It makes you wonder, if they believe in Heaven and Hell, really believe in even the possibility of it… WTF are they doing?

        • #2530783

          Part of the problem has got to be…

          by techexec2 ·

          In reply to Having one of those titles

          .
          Part of the problem has got to be that infinitely renewable “Get out of Hell Free” card. You know, where they confess their sins and receive full absolution. Reset the ol’ damnation meter.

          Or, you might be right. Maybe they don’t really believe in hell at all. Wouldn’t surprise ME. X-(

        • #2530772

          Yep

          by ontheropes ·

          In reply to Part of the problem has got to be…

          The good ol’ boy God.

          Forgot about Him but… that’s OK. Alright!!! I’m back to zero on my Hellometer. How you doin’? 😐

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