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Liquid cooling..coolant.

By thunderfish ·
Hey Guys, Gals.

I have a Zalman Resorator 3 setup installed on my Intel, It;s has been in place for a little less then a year, and it works flawlessly without incident. I was wondering weather or not anyone knows of a viable alternative coolant solution for this rig outside of the funk-blue smurf blood?

Its already well surpassed the pifling warranty, and I guess as long as the substance wont eat the powder coating off the inside of the cooler, or melt my lines, eat everything in sight (no hydrochloric acid unfortunately, or fluorine) It could be thrown in and benchmarked.

I maintain about a 25:1 ratio of distilled water and Zalman Coolant. Checking the level monthly. No bacteria to report...no ick smell and it states in the manual to flush and change it annually, and that date is coming up on the 11th.

For those who are not familliar, The cooling tower or torpedo is basically a powdercoated/anodized aluminum heat sink, with a fish tank pump, nylon lines, anodized aluminum water blocks, with an exception to the cpu block which is a combination gold plated brass, bolted to an anodized aluminum manifold with a rubber o-ring to keep it from drooling all over. No fans in the machine, silent as a mouse, with heat sinks on the drives and it is as clean as when I put it together a year ago. :)

I have theorized a few different ideas for coolant, but I wonder what all of you have to say about it.

This is my own rig, so I always love testing wack-ideas on my own stuff (I have heard of break fluid, mineral oil, hydraulic oil, and a few others)

please, please opinions suggestions. I want to know what mad scientists are out there in tech republic land..

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what is the chemical components of

by Who Am I Really In reply to Liquid cooling..coolant.

the "Smurf Blood" as you call it

if it's any combination of chemicals normally found in normal automotive coolant / antifreeze
then normal or even heavy duty vehicle coolant should work

However, brake fluid and other petroleum based products should not be used,
as they could toast any rubber / nylon / plastic parts in the cooling chain


the rubber hoses used in brake lines are chemically treated to resist the effects of the brake fluid,
but I doubt that any of the plastic / rubber / nylon etc. parts in this case are

if the "smurf blood" is a glycol / alcohol based product then definitely Automotive coolant should do the job if yer looking to save money

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"Smurf Blood"

by thunderfish In reply to what is the chemical comp ...

Part Number: ZM-G100
Type: Anti-corrosion coolant for cooling computer systems.
Composition: Ethylene glycol & anti corrosion agent (chemical corrosion inhibitor my guess)
Vol: 500ml
Freezing point: -9deg
Effective duration: 1 year

How to use:
-Prepare 2 liters of distilled water
-Dilute 500ml with 2L of prepared distilled water. ratio is 2:8
-pour coolant into cooling system
-when exchanging the coolant, empty the existing coolant before re-filling.

Right. Thats what it states on the back of the bottle. The price for these suckers is about $20 to $28 US a bottle, likely much higher in stores. Automotive glycol runs for about $15 a liter, and it has aluminum and alloy corrosion inhibitors in it as well, some of which comes pre-mixed.

Regular Ethylene Glycol automotive does sound like a good replacement. Plus I have two colors to choose from, instead of "blue-blood"

'Who Am I REALLY', dually noted. I was thinking about the chemical detergents in brake fluid and realized that I would have to do further modifications to incorporate stainless steel lines, and a brush less pump with metal non-corrosive (likely stainless as well) housing..adapter blocks..etc..would also have to be made with the same materials found in a hydraulic setup or automotive brake setup

It would be noteworthy, and neat to show others but likely I would have to recruit a professional machinist CNC and get the parts custom tooled.

Likely along with those complications there would be heat dissipation variance with the materials, and I have no idea what the 'heat tank' of brake fluid is, but weather or not it 'sheds' heat the same, slower or faster then a ratio mix of Glycol and water..I dunno.

Dually noted, tho.. definitely a chemist/metallurgists professional opinion would come in handy for the hybrid cooler.

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Well I can answer some of those questions

by OH Smeg In reply to "Smurf Blood"

Brake Fluid can be either the Mineral or Silicon Type.

The Mineral Type commonly used absorbs water and hence needs to be replaced every year or you start to have Corrosion in things like the Master Cylinder and Brake Lines.

part of the Job of Brake Fluid is to move some heat away from the Hot bits of the Brake System the Wheel Cylinders and Calipers. The Calipers being the hotter parts as Disc Brakes generate lots of heat and originally where believed to be unsuitable for Automotive work but Ideal for Aircraft as they provided better braking but had long times between uses.

While Brake Fluid does transfer some heat it's main role is to move the Pistons in the Working parts of the system and if not changed regularly the water that it absorbs boils in the system causing loss of brake pedal pressure. So while it can transfer some heat it's not ideal and it's much more vicious than Water so you would need a different type of Pump. One with gears in mesh and not a simple Impeller like what is used in the system you have.

Silicon Brake Fluid doesn't attract moisture and can be left in place a lot longer than the Mineral Based Brake Fluids without any corrosion occurring in the Brake System. It's also considerably finer than the Mineral Based Fluids and can leak past the seals in systems that are not rebuilt before it gets used so it can induce Brake Failure in an otherwise stable system.

The up side of Silicon is that it's finer so it wouldn't need as powerful Pump and it may get by with the Impeller type that you currently have but you would need to increase the flow considerably because it cools differently and unlike water doesn't heat up evenly. It heats like Oil in Layers so you can have what is in contact with the Heat Exchangers hot while what is furtherest away remaining cool even possibly unheated. To get around this you would have to redesign the Heat Exchangers on the CPU, GPU and so on to swirl the fluid as it goes through them and ideally the lines as well.

Of course the Down Side of Silicon Brake Fluid is the price. I'm currently paying about $40.00 a Liter though once filled it wouldn't simply disappear without leaks like water does.

The Automotive Coolants come in different colors green being the most common but Toyota use a Red version of the same thing both of which are formulated to prevent Electrolitic Decay between dissimilar metals. Think of this as Alloy Corrosion if you like where the Allow looses structural Integrity over time by passing electrons to the other metals involved.

Anyway the reason why Zalman use Blue is just to make it different otherwise it's identical to Automotive Coolants and in this case is principally designed to prevent Algae and Bactria growth not for it's antifreeze proprieties. But the Blue Gunk increases the Boiling Point of the Water and lowers the Freezing Point as a side effect which doesn't hurt at all, particularly after the nasty freezing conditions in parts of the US and Europe recently. It's possible to remain indoors and get colder than if it was outside under adverse weather conditions particularly if the electricity is taken out for several days/weeks.

Under those conditions this would help the coolant but even still I would recommend draining the system. After all no power means no computer working.

Anyway there are numerous fluids that can do the job but they are all more expensive than the Water Mixes which have been made for cheapness even though the Toyota stuff costs $35.00 for a 500 ml bottle and you need 2 of these for the smaller Tojo's. That's their idea of cheap.

Any Oil would have to be of the Light Type and ideally the best and lightest is what is called Petroleum/Petrol which is most defiantly not something I would recommend for an application like this. It's way too flammable to be safe in a system like this even Diesel has the problem of Algae growing in it so I would personally stick with the Water Mixes.

Though if you want to have a play around you could mix your own Cocktails of Additives to make your own Water Conditioners. Incidental De-mineralized Water can still have Algae growing it in if left long enough. Most Bottles that you see in shops are also treated with something to kill any organic matter that remains in the water hence the extra expense. Normally this is UV or Ozone Treatment but chemicals can sometimes be used.

Col

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But still... one could do a UV treatment module...

by AnsuGisalas In reply to Well I can answer some of ...

A tank of the stuff designed to have long runthrough time, with mirrored inner walls and a strong UV irradiator. If the dye in the stuff lights up in UV the feed and exhaust tubes could be fun looking, too, if transparent.

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You could also

by OH Smeg In reply to But still... one could do ...

Setup a Ozone Generator to feed Ozone through the Reservoir/Colling Tank to get the same effect.

Feed enough of that into the Fluid and it's going to kill anything that is attempting to grow in the liquid.

Col

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It is fortunate that...

by SmartAceW0LF In reply to Well I can answer some of ...

You covered this in the detail evidenced here. I would still be working on this far past my appointment with the shop in the morning. :-)

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Do you need more though?

by AnsuGisalas In reply to "Smurf Blood"

Far as I recall fluid cooling is usually operating under capacity, component temps staying in the green at all times. What internal temps are you getting now?

If it works with glycol, do you have a need to try something different just for the **** of it?

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Temps at idle, Runup

by thunderfish In reply to Do you need more though?

Temperatures right now:

Room temperature: 73 F (22.7C)
Core temp at idle: 93.2 F (34 C)
Mobo temp: 93.2 (34 C)
Laser Thermometer on reservoir body: 68F (20.2C)
Laser on Coolant through top of res: 73 F (22.7C)

2.5 liters of 20:80 mix coolant (9.6e+3 Cubic Centimeters)@ 2.5L a min

Run up stats:

Initial spike after 15 seconds: Cpu = Mobo at 111.2F (44 C)

After 30 seconds: Cpu = Mobo at 116.6F (47C)

After 5 min: CPU = Mobo at 117.5F (47.5C)
Cooler body temp at: 68F (20.5c)
Coolant at 74.1F (23.4C)

After 10 min: Cpu = Mobo at 119.3 (48.5C)
Cooler at: 70F (21.1C)
Coolant at 78.6F (37.6C)

After 15 min: CPU = Mobo at 120.2 (49C)
Cooler body: 72F (22.2C)
Coolant at: 80.7F (27C)

After 20 min: CPU = Mobo at 122F (50C)
Cooler body at: 75F (23.8C)
Coolant at: 81F (27.2C)

Room temperature: 73F (22.7C)

Temperatures will plateau in about 15mins, allowing the system to remain at and or around 51C and hold for as long as the room temperature doesn't change. If it does get colder in here, a degree or two effects the system by 3 degrees. Hotter/colder.

The thing is really cool. (no pun intended)

What do you think?

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Let me know

by santeewelding In reply to Temps at idle, Runup

When you get it down to single-digit Kelvins.

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Sounds cool enough

by AnsuGisalas In reply to Temps at idle, Runup

But... do you have a fan on the reservoir?

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