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MAC and PC's-Software Applications

By TechJunky ·
I come from a programming background. Therefore, I have always used PC's. A lot of folks in my family are artsy and/or musicians. So, I have been around MACs for sometime, but never saw any reason to own one myself.

Until Now...Now that MSoffice 2008 runs on MAC. And, I want to gain some web page and photoshop skills. And, I want to record music and use my laptop as a movie dvd player...Now, I am interested in MACs.

There are many incompatibilities between macs and pc's when it comes to software applications. I am also starting to see many similarities in Microsofts products that I have been seeing all along in Apple compat products.

I'm left with even greater comparisons when choosing new computers. Many times people will ask "what do you recommend". I used to have a quick and clean list of questions which produce clear answers. But now that Apple is supporting Microsoft products, I have noticed that I am considering Apple computers as much as I was considering and recommending PC's in the past. I never imagined that I would ever consider a mac. But, for entertainment type stuff and graphics development software. I favor the MAC over the PC.

I wonder what many of you think about the whole alliance between Apple and Microsoft...and how you invision the impact on how we buy PC's in the next 5-10 years.

I am still not ready to program on a MAC. But, after buying two MAC books, I have recognized some real benefits and advantages of having the MACS. Battery life, ease of use, quick navigation and compatibility amongst multiple applications, no virus issues to deal with, no freeze screen issues, great graphics and processing time,...It just seems like component-wise Apple does a great job with their notebooks for the price.

Laptops on the other hand, seem to pale in comparison on many (not all) of the attributes of the mac book. Unless you are willing to pay over $2000 for the laptop.

When I compare macbooks and laptops, it really isn't like comparing 'Apples to Apples'. No pun intended.

Keep in mind, I have never been a Mac supporter. So, for me to now see the advantages of the macs, it feels a bit like betrayal to my normal world. But, I have grown so tired of Micrsoft's crappy op systems, system errors, system vulnerabilities, expensive renewals, licensing rules and such that once MS office became available on mac & my desire to learn some of the Adobe CS3 stuff...I immediately took a look at the macs ability.

What do you think, will Apples approx. 20% of the market increase now that Microsoft office 2008 is available for the MAC? Will more people begin buying MAC over PC's?

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All Answers

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The difference between the two "PC and Apple"..

Well with a Apple Mac you can run a Windows platform (if you so wish). As for freezing and lockups, yes Apple does this to but not often. I have owned a Apple computer for a few years for testing purposes, many a times i had to re-install the operating system due to either the computer not wanting to read the disk to freezing up (applied more memory seamed to solve the issue in hand) or me just getting to know the system. The base line here is what DO you want out of a computer, keep in mind that there are viruses (though small in numbers in the Mac) to both. The question is do you want "Lock in" or do you want to have a choice between operating systems?. If something goes wrong with an Apple Mac (and they do go down) would you want to spend out a lot of cash to get it fixed?. There are pluses and minuses to both but we are not the jury to decide for you, it is up to you, it is your choice. Just my small token of "had it, used it". But i do not like a lock in system.
I will most properly get a bashing on this, but then we all have or own different systems working the way we like.

Please post back if you have any more problems or questions.

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Well there are a few errors in what you posted above

by OH Smeg In reply to MAC and PC's-Software App ...

Firstly Apple isn't supporting M$ it is M$ supporting Apple with the Office Package rewritten to run on BSD which is the basis of OSX.

Apple doesn't have 20% of the market because office can run on a Mac it is much more likely that the people currently buying Apples don't like or want Vista.

OSX as well as all OS that are currently available do have problems and they do suffer from Attacks from Virus and the like just at the moment not as commonly as a Windows Computer does but it happens none the less.

The main bid difference is in the OS that MAC uses from PC's as they do not rely on M$ and Windows they use a form of BSD which is in no way related to Windows it more closely is related to Unix but even then the connection isn't close. If you like to look this site has some BSD info

http://tinyurl.com/4tqw2j

Now normally you can not run an application written for Windows on BSD or vice versa as the programing and the way that the hardware is address is different. That in no way implies that you can not get software for the OSX Platform just that you need to look at different versions of the software like MAC Office 2008 not Windows Office 2008 they are different and will not work properly on the other platform unless some changes are made.

As to which is best that is like asking how long is a piece of string. They both have pros and cons and you really need to look at what it is you are doing. Windows is great for some applications and OSX is great for others. Currently there are very few Software makers who provide software for both platforms but that just means that you use something different to do what you used to do with Windows.

The advantages of OSX is that it isn't as much of a Resource Hog as Windows is and on the same hardware it's faster than Windows well compared to Vista at least it's considerably faster. XP is a different story though but it's old and past it's prime according to M$ at least.

But from what I have been told by the people buying Mac's is that they don't like the way that M$ has treated them and they want out of the Windows controlling Environment so they switch to Apple. But there are other solutions which include the Open BSD and Linux which can be just as effective as either Windows or OSX. It really depends on what it is that you want to do. You should chose a tool that suits your needs and not buy into something because of the color or something as trivial as that.

Col

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Ms office 2008 for Mac

by TechJunky In reply to Well there are a few erro ...

Thanks for replies. Part of the reason I left things in my post very vague is because I wanted to solicit input from techy types that have used both MAC and PC's. I find that most have not. I also find that techy types tend to avoid Mac's all together. Usually bashing them, without having ever used them. We all hate the learning curve. Including myself, which is why it has taken me so long to actually purchase one.

At this time, I have used both. I have also installed Win XP and office 2003 on a MAC (via bootcamp). I would not suggest it. I did not mind it so much but my husband and daughter (both non-techies) did not like having to choose which op system to log into for what. (win xp or osx)
They wanted everything all in one place, in one environment. Therefore, I installed 'MS office 2008 for MAC' on their mac books.

Some other areas of concern...WinXP runs in a DOS environment, OSx runs in a UNIX environment. Apple folks would tell you that UNIX is the reason their OSx op system is so secure and that DOS leaves too many holes open to viruses and such. I have worked in both DOS and UNIX and I do agree that the permission levels in UNIX do make it a tighter and more secure environment. But, I do not agree that it is 'unhackable'. I believe Mac's are less of an interest to hackers, because there are less of them. Meaning, why hack less than 20% of the market when you can hack-impact 80% of the market. (about 80% of the market uses Microsoft)

That brings me to my initial point...how will this whole idea of running microsoft products on a MAC change how people buy PC's and laptops?

To clarify from my previous post, 'MS office for MAC' is owned by Apple. Meaning, Apple profits everytime we buy MS office for MAC.

So, for those of you who never ever considered purchasing a MAC because you were not able to use MS office (word,ppt,excel)...will you now consider purchasing a MAC? And if so, why?

That was my original point. I believe that Apple sales will increase and more people will purchase MACs now that they can use MS office products in a more compatible way. (I know you could use them in the past, but it was clunky and unpredictable)I have already seen my students purchasing Macs over pc's because of this.

I use 'ms office 2008 for mac' on a macbook and it works very well. Unlike when I installed winxp and office2003 on the back side of macbook via bootcamp. (Bootcamp is the software that comes with apples op system that helps you load non-apple software)

To get back to my topic. A lot of folks are irritated with Microsofts ways. Some have turned to Linux, Unix and open source software. I did that too. However, I now have it all on a seperate computer because there are certain programs that do not like that environment, or proved to work too clunky in that environment, or make working with my co-workers & family members a compatibility nightmare.

There is a reason why we are not using Linux, Unix, and open source software more than WinXP & MSoffice. Anyone who is working in a Microsoft controlled corporation will find that out very quickly.

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The problem with both operating systems are that they lock you in..

One my computer(s) (not Apple) i have a choice of platforms either i install Linux or Windows. With Apple you need bootcamp (unless i am wrong and you can install Linux on a bare Apple system). Linux i use but i have to use windows for testing purposes. Apple are nice but expensive to buy and repair. Then that is always the case with choice. A basic car that you can mod or a RollsRoyce?.

Please post back if you have any more problems or questions.

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linux

by Compman007 In reply to The problem with both ope ...

No you dont need boot camp yes you can run on ab bare mac linux (intel, power pc) and i think windows (intel)

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It would be inaccurate to say

by JamesRL In reply to Ms office 2008 for Mac

That Macs only now are getting MS Office.

Back in the day, while PC users were running MS Word (or Wordperfect) for DOS, Macs got MS Word (1985).

The first version of Excel was on the Mac, and preceeded the one for Windows by 2 years.

Powerpoint was first on the Mac, and then the creators were bought by MS. It was out 2 years before the Windows version.

So initially, MS kept Windows and Macintosh versions up to date, once they had brought the Windows version up to speed.

But later MS shifted to letting the Mac versions slide, giving advantage to the windows versions - during that period there were issues with backwards compatibility between platforms.

MS is now in a pattern where they make the new features in MS Office available to the Mac about a year later.

James

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Apple less than 20% of market

by TechJunky In reply to Well there are a few erro ...

Previous post by OH smeg: Apple doesn't have 20% of the market because office can run on a Mac it is much more likely that the people currently buying Apples don't like or want Vista.
Reply techjunky: I should probably clarify. Apple actually holds less than 20% of the market in computer sales. Most of their sales are made in the educational system and not the business industry. Microsoft has about 80% of the business computer sales. I agree with you, ms office on the mac has nothing to do with them having 20
% of the market. That was exactly my point. BUT, Now that msoffice can run on apple computers, I predict apple sales will increase.
Do you agree? If not, why?

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I don't see any reason for this to happen

by OH Smeg In reply to Apple less than 20% of ma ...

After all the Office 2008 for Mac is the same as Office 2007 for Windows not backward compatible to older versions of Office. So the ability to electronically lodge documents is reduced or at the very least not a Native job.

Apples Word Star if I remember correctly works quite well has a format that is compatible with Word so the ability to read or write documents in the M$ format is there with a few backward steps of Word Documents not being backward compatible through most of the word range of products. Word Perfect Open Office and so on don't have the same issues I can open a WP 5 or earlier Document in X3 without any problems & I don't loose any formatting. However I am unable to open a word 97 Document in Office 2007 or 8 and retain the formatting.

I just personally don't see Word or any of the office range of products as a Selling Point. The Legal Side of the business is currently avoiding Office 2007 because of compatibility issues as well as the medical side. I don't know about others but any business who deals with Government Departments are sort of in the same boat as well the Government Agencies archive Documents in the form that they where originally made and this is beginning to be a problem with Word Documents as most of the older ones can not be opened without losing formatting in the new product. Add to that the inability of the older Office Products to open or at least read documents from the New Office Suite of Products and there is a problem there as well.

I support Mac's for the Graphic Side of the business and those people use their Macs because they simply do the job better. They don't care about the supplied software so much as their core applications. As for Mac's market share I don't know what it is at the moment but it has increased dramatically in the past year or so since Vista came out. Apples problem here is that they currently lack the manufacturing capacity to supply Macs if they where to suddenly become the platform of choice with a larger proportion of end users. If the trend continues in the move away from Vista I can see potential problems in Apples ability in being able to supply demand. They would also be stupid in ramping up the supply without the demand being there first so the very popularity of the Mac platform could be it;s undoing as those who want one can not get them when they want them so they use the Windows Alternative and learn to like it eventually or at least live with it.

I don't know what will happen there but Apple Sales have defiantly increased substantially recently.

As for OSX being Secure if anything it's Security through Obscurity and that's not a good thing either. I can not help but point out to those Mac lovers that the very first case of Computer Hacking/Cracking whatever you like to call it happened in Melbourne Australia on a Unix Main Frame at Melbourne University long before it was even considered a Crime. The system is crackable but as there isn't currently a big enough market share they are ignored by the majority of Crackers unless it is in relation to something that is wanted. The case of giving away a Cracked NB recently brought about the Mac Book Air being the first one cracked not so much because it was less secure but more likely because it was a More Desirable unit to own by the successful Cracker.

I personally have problems with Apple from the prospective that they want to supply it all and control all their product just like M$ does with Windows. I would prefer to see more competition in this market but as the 2 Big Players are M$ and Apple at the moment any competition from Apple against M$ is good though I personally think that things could be better with Unix, Linux, BSD, and so on being more widely used. The really idiot thing here is that all the big financial institutions use Unix Servers or Linux Servers to control the money so they really are a target for those interested in stealing money but for some reason these Cracks either are not happening or go unreported. It could be that the reporting of Cracks in Unix/Linux are not reported to retain Confidence in the Banks and so on or they just may not be occurring. I'm not sure which it is s I've seen both over the years. Though the majority of the Unix Cracks have been internal from hired Programmers who want more than their fee for their work. But in that particular case it cost more to plug the hole than what was being taken so it was left in place till a new Application was rolled out about 2 years latter. There was only a fraction of a cent per transaction involved so it was left alone and considered as Not Worth the Effort. I'm not sure what happened with the new product as I left that place but I would assume that the hole was plugged and the Banks and so on returned to making record profits.

Actually I see Adobe CS whatever being more of a selling point to Mac Buyers than Office but then again maybe it's just the part of the business that I deal with.

Col

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Apples sales increase

by TechJunky In reply to I don't see any reason fo ...

Yes, you make some good points here. I agree that both microsoft and apple have done very little to make things convenient, nor less expensive for the consumers. But, then again, I recall thinking 5 years ago that Linux would be one of the leading competitors by now. And, that still has not happened.
If I did not work and teach in environments that required me to use and teach microsoft products, I would simply use other applications more often. But, I found when I did that my skills in microsoft and apple products were dipping and I was becoming less and less familar with the products that I was responsible to teach.
For example, I did not want to purchase MS office 2007 for my home office pc at all. I was irritated with having to purchase yet another version of microsofts software at a rediculous price. However, I found that if I do not use the products I teach on a daily basis my skills become clunky over time.
I did however find a pretty good deal on MS office 2007 Ultimate Edition. ($59.95) Theultimatesteal.com. This price is available to students only, but it is not a student-teacher version. It is regularly priced at $699.
Hmmmm, I guess microsoft figures these students will eventually be working in industry so why not stick their hooks in them now, that way they will continue to have them as customers later.

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