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Maybe I'm stupid

By _Papa_ ·
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By not having sufficient force

by _Papa_ In reply to Maybe I'm stupid

to discourage robbery, theft, rape, kidnapping...name your poison.

There is a school of thought out there that assumes if you don't attempt to defend yourself, no harm will come to you. This school doesn't offer degrees, nor are it's credits likely to transfer. However, a certain class of persons is very familiar with this philosophy, and it gives them a great sense of security at the most challenging moments of their chosen profession: Mayhem and other crimes against persons. We wouldn't want to interfere with their lifestyle, would we?

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There's a big perversion hiding in that train of thought.

by AnsuGisalas In reply to By not having sufficient ...

Namely the perversion that one needs a firearm to protect oneself.
A firearm is not a necessary condition for successfully keeping oneself safe.
Sadly, a firearm is also not a sufficient condition for keeping oneself safe.

The measures used to keep oneself safe WITHOUT firearms apply to all situations, including ones where one has a firearm.
The measures used to keep oneself safe DEPENDANT on a firearm have little application outside of such a situation.

So many people talk about grizzlies. Learn to move in the forest so that grizzlies don't bother you. It will aid you in all your woodland pursuits.

Learn to move in the city so that bad guys don't bother you, and you will have an edge even if someone comes looking for you specifically.

The NRA sometimes stumble into predicating the firearm as a crutch. Let me tell you, you use it as a crutch and you'll fall on your ***.
Which is not good in the middle of a bad situation.

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Ah

by santeewelding In reply to There's a big perversion ...

You let on to the stick you hold behind your back all this while: necessity/sufficiency.

Can't go too far (wrong) with that.

The artifice has another use beyond, "safety".

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It's just footwork

by AnsuGisalas In reply to Ah

I am taking care

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Ansu, the point is that we are able to move freely...

by _Papa_ In reply to There's a big perversion ...

without having to continuously concern ourselves with avoiding potential danger. You can't do that in practice, of course, but you can minimize the lethality (to yourself) with a tool as an aid in your defense. A gun is a tool, much like any other. Properly applied.it will do the job better than any other. The secret is in wise application of the tool. You don't use it unless you must, but if it's not readily accessible, it can be almost useless. Your assailant needs to be aware that you have it and of your ability to use it. That is usually deterrent enough.
In this matter, even having a prop gun of some sort can be sufficient.

On to a pet peeve of mine: in some communities even showing your armament ("brandishing"), even if you are permitted to carry it, is illegal and and can get you time in the hoosegow. This does not include cocking, aiming or any actual threatening move. Simply making it recognizable is a violation. Somebody thinks this will deter robberies. Oh, yeah, sure it will. The robbery itself is an activity reserved for professionals!

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I don't actually argue against that.

by AnsuGisalas In reply to Ansu, the point is that w ...

Only trying to slash some dangerous ideas coming to light in the discussion.
I do understand that you've all been stuck in that argument for ... 50 years or so? That always leads to distortions on both sides - so I'm just trying to apply my outsider's perspective to help cure some of the distortions.

Even with a gun, you have to keep your wits about you. If you only notice the attack when a sap impacts your skull, you might as well have been unarmed. A gun is hard to use safely and effectively when engaged in a scuffle... so learning to shoot is ok, but should never take precedence over learning to gauge your surroundings and move in a way that let's you govern your own space.
Be a sovereign... or in my wording, be a pope

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I would try everything to not resort to violence, but

by AV . In reply to By not having sufficient ...

I want to have the means to protect myself if that doesn't work. My first reactions will always be non-violent.

Where I live in NJ, the criminal walks free and the victim is prosecuted if you defend yourself with a gun. The gun laws here are the worst. They'll send your a$$ to **** on technicalities. Regardless of my philosophy, thats a big consideration in thwarting a criminal.

AV

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So, survive and get prosecuted?

by AnsuGisalas In reply to I would try everything to ...

Best look for a third option, then.
"Don't be there" is best.
"Get out of there" is second best.

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Absolutely NOT

by BlueCollarCritic In reply to So, survive and get prose ...

No one should have to run or move as a solution to how to avoid being a victim. Its one thing to knowningly go into an environemnt (say a drug buy) where you know its shady and so if you come defensless then its on you and its another to find yoursefl in a mess not by your own making but simply by chance. The folks who were killed in various hostage sitautions should not be told that their first choice shodul have been to not be there in the first place. What a jerk.

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Nuh-uh!

by AnsuGisalas In reply to Absolutely NOT

"Don't be there" means - and I am so very sorry for having to twist this into neon lights - MAKE YOURSELF NOT TO BE IN THAT SITUATION.
That covers things like anticipating, pre-emptively denying ingress, leaving the scene before the **** hits the fan... etc. etc.

If you're really saying that people shouldn't run from danger, on a matter of principle no less, then the jerk is you.

Read the piece on "Life lessons learned on 9/11": Running is what we humans do best on an evolutionary level, and it's also one of the best things we humans do.

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