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  • #2277590

    Some needed advice

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    by starbury ·

    Hi;
    I am a recent college grad now in the work force. I work for a small company (70 users). I was hired to help the one man IT show, and am currently handling much of the help desk tasks, he handles everything else. I am very eager to assist and take on other responsibilities as delegated but he doesn’t want to give it up. My experience isn’t immense as i am just beginning but i do possess the skills to learn at a quick rate. It is frustrating sometimes because i’m just sitting there at times with nothing to do and he has a sleu of network projects that need to get done. I occupy myself by reading my study guide for CCNA, I would rather be working on more complex stuff. He is good at training and explaining concepts, but he does not want to delegate. He takes all the projects and works on them till he finds the solution; after that he has me deploy. I would much rather be working on the project myself, that way i have more hands on and learning. Is this normal? Am i too eager ? Should I be more patient about this? What do i do about my situation. I want more complex tasks. This is my first “real” job in the field, so i dont know if this is how it goes. Please advise
    Thank You

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    • #2708774

      don’t tell me, tell him!

      by lizina ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      If you want to do more you should tell him, don’t pretend you know more than him, just ask if you can look and learn while he is working on one of his projects. If he agrees, then observe and unless he ask for your advice SHUT UP don’t comment on anything, don’t try to be smart … just watch! When the project is complete trust me he will want you to be there for the next one.
      Be patient and keep an open mind, it’s not easy for him to let go because it’s his job and he loves it, besides you are younger and faster and is more up to date with all the new technologies.
      Hang in there, he will come around!

      • #3292703

        Reply To: Some needed advice

        by starkj ·

        In reply to don’t tell me, tell him!

        > besides you are younger and faster and is more up to date with all the new technologies.

        Did I miss something?

        Are you assuming things?

      • #3291231

        you are clueless

        by deathtoliberalism ·

        In reply to don’t tell me, tell him!

        >besides you are younger and faster and is more >up to date with all the new technologies.

        I’m sorry, but this is just hilariously stupid. I can tell you that some joe straight out of college is most definetly not more up on things than a guy who has been out in the workforce maintaining a real network.

        more up to date with the latest P2P software and warez sites maybe.

        • #3291214

          P2P

          by starbury ·

          In reply to you are clueless

          That is funny…..It is true the savy network admin will have more knowledge at first, but that is just because he has seen more. The younger network admin, brings fresher ideas to the arena. Many IT people get caught up with themselves and what they know, thus they start thinking they are above everyone else. I think it’s more of job security, you, which is understandbable too. But don’t assume all we know is p2p and warez, you might be fooled

        • #3291177

          you make no sense

          by techniquephreak ·

          In reply to P2P

          Of course it is because the truly savvy network admin has seen more. Our shop is located very close to one of the premier computer science dept’s in the country. Every single recent grad we have employed has proven to not only NOT have the latest, freshest ideas, but also to be incapable of keeping up with the latest and greatest because they are locked into one mode of thinking. If you don’t have a true passion for IT, no amount of college can compensate that. Savvy, experienced network admins spend more time keeping up with the latest technologies than your run of the mill college grad who may have read an outdated book while throwing back a few beers with his frat brothers.

          If you want to give real advice, tell the newbie the truth: he was hired to do help desk, so that the more ecperienced network admin could focus on important projects. He isn;t getting the more exciting projects because the small company he works for cannot afford to have downtime while he fumbles his way through it.

        • #3291165

          Lighten up people

          by ravenhawk ·

          In reply to you make no sense

          The orginal post was that the college grad wanted to learn more, and do more so he could become the all-knowing, all-powerful Orcle of Knowledge such as yourselves. Get some social skills since you have mastered everything there is to know about networks. None of us who have been in the field for a while started out as admins. You do need to pay your dues and work your way up. But if you feel capable of learning on the job instead of just answering phones then ask for the chance to watch and work under supervision. There is nothing wrong with that. Just keep in mind you are being paid to deploy systems, don’t think that’s above you at this stage. But don’t let others with a god-complex tell you your worthless for anything other than being ticket pushers.

        • #3291049

          Have to agree…

          by 3kl ·

          In reply to Lighten up people

          I have to agree. A large number of these posts sound like some of the people I work with. They may have started out intelligent, but have since spent so much time guarding their job that the company suffers and the employee’s skill level has gone down hill. Young admin doesn’t equal better thinker and old/experienced admin doesn’t equal smarter or more talented. However, arrogance generally does indicate a person who is intimidated by others skill sets and hides behind a wall of secrecy so others cannot take their job.

          I agree with the other posts for the young admin, tell your senior exactly what you said. And be prepared to be told to stick to your job as helpdesk man. Many of us started there and had to work our way up as well. And do your users a favor, don’t turn into the arrogant know-it-all that gives all of us IT workers a bad rap. Customer first, always.

        • #3290949

          i have a solution

          by jahhbone ·

          In reply to you make no sense

          there is a place down the street hiring ditch diggers that will be happy to let you experiment with the work equipment (a shovel). You should be picking up as much knowledge and experience from your boss as possible..your time will come and you better be ready when it does. If you know of a problem on the back burner figure it out and come to him with a solution. In the mean time be the best help desk tech they ever had.

        • #3314221

          Another point of view

          by cybergoyle ·

          In reply to i have a solution

          I am an admin and one man IT show for a small company myself (200 users). When I first took this job 6 years ago, my company had no one performing IT duties – they believed they didn’t need anyone, and their solution to fixing problems was to buy new hardware/software!

          My employers were not aware of the risks and liabilities in todays electronic world; I assumed that responsibility and instructed and trained our staff.

          Over the years I have had several hotshots come and go, many with some pretty good skills. But that is part of the problem; they come and go. Since I am singularly responsible for not just network security, but our customer databases and financial systems (and all the liability that goes with that), I do not allow access to just anyone.

          This of course has a limiting effect on some of the work that can be performed. Since I am by myself (mostly), I’d prefer not to change my security schemes, access accounts, etc. everytime I lose an employee. There are many approaches to security; I have taken mine simply because I quite literally have a zero budget; any expenditure must be approved by our owners on a case by case basis.

          As a side note since I know some people will be thinking “what happens to the company if YOU leave?”, long ago I created a ‘transition’ plan. Included are schematics of our network, all access username/passwords to servers, devices, etc., an explanation of my designs – all the info a competent admin would need to immediately handle our systems the day they take over my job. Both our company chairman and his two partners have copies of this document, and I update it twice a year.

          Clearly my employers could replace me at their whim armed with this information; however, a network admin is a position of extreme trust – companies (especially small ones with limited resources) cannot afford to have their business disrupted by staff turnover, outages, or worse, security breaches.

      • #3291228

        Tell him what you told us

        by drew.mcbee-tradesmeninternational ·

        In reply to don’t tell me, tell him!

        Just talk to the man and tell him you want to help and learn from his infinite wisdom ( it helps to schmooze a bit – people are more inclined to give up precious tips/tricks when you schmooze).

    • #2708763

      Same situation

      by itgirli ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I am recently hired as well to help the one man show around here. He’s an independent contractor. He’s very into himself and doesn’t want any help with the problems. So he started coming less often to work and now he’s only on call to set up the last of our servers (which I can do in my sleep, but he thinks it’s complex. He also has admitted that XP is beyond his experience.) Once he finishes this last little bit (which he is doing every other weekend) He’s gone. My thoughts are that this guy may be threatened by having you there. You might be there to replace him or he might think that’s why you are there. Ask if he needs help. If he doesn’t want you around, go around him. Ask your boss if there is anything in addition to doing what your doing that would be productive, then throw in the “such as… (whatever project the loner’s currently on)”. Go out there and get it.

      • #3291240

        Don’t go around him!

        by xtrainer ·

        In reply to Same situation

        First rule of dealing with any supervisor is you don’t go around him/her. His/her boss doesn’t want to hear it and will back your supervisor up – if they really understand management.

        If you have time with “nothing to do” look for something.

        I’ve never had a job where I couldn’t find something to do. Is there something he doesn’t have time to do? Routine maintenance tasks often don’t get done as often as they should. They’re never interesting, but they are essential and taking them on shows that you take your job seriously and are committed to keeping the systems running well.

        Are you getting consistent questions about certain aspects of the technology? Write an FAQ about them, or see if there’s something you could do to make them easier for your users. Look for patterns, find the problems and solve them. Believe me, if you start to do this, he’ll notice and value your problem-solving skills.

        • #3291211

          Good response

          by starbury ·

          In reply to Don’t go around him!

          Actually, the situation has changed since I first posted. I started doing little things you suggested like an FAQ. I can see that I am starting to be depended on for a lot more. There is still much more I can learn from this experience, but I am more humble now. The communication has got much better from 2 months ago. I think he realizes that I am capable of handling certain tasks.
          Thanks for the response

        • #3291202

          Look for New Job

          by rfleer ·

          In reply to Don’t go around him!

          I was in the same situation right out of college. After 6 months I left for another job with better pay and opportunity. Later on in my career a I worked for a boss whose motto was “If you want to get ahead then train your replacement.” I was fortunate to be the replacement.

      • #3292331

        nothin like a knife in the back

        by arleenw ·

        In reply to Same situation

        Maybe the guy is just not good with training people. It’s a production environment, not a learning lab. Some projects require your undevided attention. I personally can’t stand somebody standing over me talking when I’m doing certain projects – that’s why I come in when no one is here.

        I agree with the posts that you should ask if you can watch and learn, mind your help desk and do whatever the guy asks you to do. Prove yourself. Everybody’s got to climb the hill to get to the top!

    • #2708730

      From the other side

      by highlander718 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      here’s my opinion as a “One man show” myself, although I don’t have a “helper” :-). I think you actually are a little to eager, at least it would certainly bother me to have someone who’s sticking his nose everywhere right from the beginning :-). I think you should take it gradualy, after you have the proper image of the business.
      From my part, I would love to delegate at least some of the tasks, after I make sure the person is trustworthy, meaning I would do one project/task at a time together and if I’m comfortable, let him do it from then on. Don’t see a problem in that. Also it makes sense for you to know at least part of his job, in order to be able to do things when he’s away (vacations ..etc). But give it some time, I’m not sure how long you’been working there. If it’s not 6 month yet, it’s definitely too early to jump in.

      • #3292674

        Work around it

        by krlayne ·

        In reply to From the other side

        Having been on both sides of the fence of which you speak, let me give you a little advice. Once you have been a one man operation, and accustomed to doing things yourself, it is very difficult to relinquish that. There may be the mentality to just get it done, and done quickly. He may know that the company’s overall environment may be one that demands quick fixes or else. It takes time for the “running around like a chicken with the head cut off” syndrome to lessen. Patience and smarts are the key here. When he is going off the fix a problem, ask if you can go with him. Not so much to be intrusive, but enough to show interest and to learn. Ask plenty questions concerning what he is doing. Take a notepad and write notes. When he is solving a problem, refer to your notes to see if the problem occurred before. Remember, don’t be intrusive, but eager. Also, you will learn much of your company’s environment by just trailing your supervisor. What is whispered while he is solving problems? What is being said when his back is turned? You have a golden opportunity to learn not only IT related work, but also the world of work as a whole. Congratulations on your job, remember to work around it!

      • #3291170

        Patience is a virtue…

        by ctluddite ·

        In reply to From the other side

        Take your time – there are a million tedious tasks that always need doing. Show initiative and take on whatever scut work – cleaning crap, bench testing – ask your supervisor what you can do to make his life easier. Establish a solid reputation for reliability and never undercut your supervisor’s authority or rep. – make him your mentor, not your adversary. As your relationship develops, he should be willing to involve you more. In the meanwhile, learn as much as you can, both for your workplace (learn the peculiarities of your particular network [and there are always oddities!]) and for your own benefit (building your skill sets makes you more valuable to the organization, as well as makes you more marketable should things not work out where you currently are).
        Above all, give it time. Use the opportunity to ramp up, and enjoy the honeymoon. Believe me, you’ll soon have more to do than time to do!

      • #3292546

        One man show NO MORE..

        by railis ·

        In reply to From the other side

        After being a “Department of ONE” for the past year and a half, I have hired a technician for the IS department. While he is just out of school, I look forward to delegating some of the everyday assignments to him. I WILL bring him along on new projects and let him learn and will look forward to his “NEW” insight, and he may challenge some of my OLD ways of thinking. I figure that by passing along my some of my skills to him, we’ll both be better employees for the company.

    • #2708634

      Be Patient

      by black panther ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      As the cosmic wheels of the universe turn you the time will come when he is sick, on leave etc etc — They will then call on you to assist and you should find yourself slowly gaining more experience and doing other tasks.

      You may even get ‘swamped’ with work.

      Good Luck!

    • #2708629

      Been there….

      by sparkie_ig ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Well, I think perhaps the issues within the industry as a whole may have em scared to let you have too much .My case,I created the manuals to teach the folks the applicaiotns I built,the data bases etc….but I went to another company where I thought I could advance my knowledge base and it doubled my salary. well, 2 months into the job they moved my department to florida. SO I have been searching for a job for 9 months now. I have exhausted my unemployment$, have had many interviews…but no offers. And I can tell you that my last title was Senior Business Systems Analyst and Developer. So, having someone come in to help…..may frighten him. at this point I think it would me. be patient

      • #3292687

        From a one man show

        by tadams ·

        In reply to Been there….

        I am a one man show for a company about the same size as yours. From personal experience, I can tell you that it is real difficult to “give up” anything to the new assistant, at least at first. I remember feeling very threatened, insecure and the need to validate that I was smarter than the new guy was overwhelming. Be cool for now and let him work this out. He will eventually come around as I did and realize that you are a valuable resource. I finally came to terms with it by reasoning that the new guy was a good resource for fresh ideas, not my enemy, but it took a while. I agree with some of the other responses that you should not “volunteer” solutions. That will make things worse. Be cool and patient and you will win the race.

        • #3292665

          Another perspective

          by really918v ·

          In reply to From a one man show

          One possibility is how secure does he feel his job is? Downsizing and looking for people willing to do more for less is the corporate manta these days. Did he approach management for assistance or did they hire you on their own without his input? Right now, he has the keys to the kingdom. Maybe he feels if he shows you too much, he’ll put his own job in jeopardy.

    • #2712578

      This is a common complaint in all fields.

      by tbragsda ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      It takes time to really learn anything. The experience you gain will show, and your admin will start working you into project. Unless he/she is a control freak, he wants you to help.

      Ask for some part of the system. Usually tape backups, logs, stuff like this. You get your hands on a couple of these sort of things and learn them. Also, when just starting out, your first job may not last too long. Get some experience, and move to the next level with another company. I don’t like skipping around much, but did when I started.

      • #3292716

        Normal??

        by richards_unsubcribe ·

        In reply to This is a common complaint in all fields.

        You asked if this is normal… yes it is… normal for a fearful insecure employee who is always looking over his or her shoulder. Always wanting to be the “hero”, the all-knowing Mr. Fix-it who wants to look as good possible in management?s eyes. These kinds of people will never delegate responsibility. I once worked for someone like that and believe me it was a pretty frustrating experience. You sometimes feel neglected, underused and useless and you sometimes wonder why the hell they hired you in the first place?

        Hopping jobs isn’t always the answer either… There’s always some risk in that with the possibility of the HR people wondering what was “really” wrong with you? That reference phone call looking to get the skinny on the new employee…and the “I’d prefer not to comment” answer…guaranteed instant death. It costs money, sometimes lots of it to train a new employee into “our way of doing things”. Once they get you ramped up in a new position they tend to want you to stay a while.

        Advice? Tough it out as best you can, always look for ways to improve yourself… the job “experience”, such it is, always looks good on the resume if at some time you finally do decide to jump ship. In the meantime try to get your certs? maybe your current employer will even help with some of the expenses … sometimes they do…especially the larger companies that may have a broad policy of education and job related upgrading. If you do decide to look for another job, whatever you do, don’t whine and complain about how you didn’t receive a decent shake while at your last job. .. that may be true but a new employer wants to know about your strengths and successes… not failures, even if your not responsible for them. Good luck!

        • #3290960

          Take notes

          by hal698 ·

          In reply to Normal??

          Write it down, because it all matters. Every situation is a little different, and you will find that out as you progress. If you want to start with FAQ’s great. Also make a list of the solutions you’ve come up with. These are good for resume’s, and those occasional talks with the boss. You took notes in school, take situational notes about the day to day things that happen. Especially the things that don’t seem quite right. They are an excellent way for you to get a good overall sense of the whole picture. Doing your job is only one part of being a good employee. Develop interpersonal skills, and keep taking courses.

      • #3292678

        Its your problem

        by narahari ·

        In reply to This is a common complaint in all fields.

        It may annoy you if I say this, but its your problem. As tbragsda rightly says, “The experience you gain will show” and will force people to accept you and use your expertise. May be you are very enthu but dont show much promise explicitly. As some one said, it is not enough to be fair and just, one must also appear to be fair and just. This is not to discourage but try to see facts as they are and not as what they seem to you. Try to probe into the mind of your boss by indirect hints. All the best

    • #2721162

      thanks

      by starbury ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      thanks for the advice everyone
      it’s always good to have an alternate point of view… it helps me understand the other side
      thanks again and i will incorporate as much as i can from your suggestions.

      • #3291225

        From former one woman show

        by bugzapper ·

        In reply to thanks

        I used to be the one woman show for this company. When I got my first assistant I had tough time letting go of many things, and sometimes still do. Much of it has to do with being the ‘all knowing’ computer expert / hero. But a great deal of it has to do with the fact that no one does things like I would. I would suggest beginning by becoming a researcher for your supervisor. Offer to gather information on different technologies your supervisor is working with or considering (you can recommend but not insist on choices at first), then gather quotes on his/her selections. Gradually, you will be the one who knows as much as your boss on specific areas and he/she will come to you for assistance on these areas. As you show your ability to learn and grow, you should be given more leeway and responsibility in other areas as well.

        Be mindful, though that your supervisor may feel threatened as you begin to grow more independent, and offer to ‘bounce things off him’ to keep him in the loop. As things slip from his control, he may feel relieved and/or threatened by the experience. I currently have 2 people working with me, and as long as I am in the loop on what they are doing, they are free to work independently on projects and I am free to take a vacation without worrying about what happens if a system crashes.

        • #3290999

          excellent advice

          by bethany_l ·

          In reply to From former one woman show

          We all start at the beginning, and you have to earn the trust to progress. It is not what you say, but what you do that earns this trust.

        • #3290972

          Completly agree.

          by romerogt ·

          In reply to From former one woman show

          You are right, we all started at the bottom, the researching idea is good, in fact I guess is how I got where I am…

    • #3292726

      You’re not telling the full story …

      by arthurp ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I don’t believe that you’re telling the full story.

      You say that, “I am a recent college grad now in the work force”, however you do not say just how long you have been in the workforce – 2 weeks or 2 months.

      From where I’m sat, it looks as though your boss may have this right; you start at the bottom and prove your efficiency; only then do you progress.

      Once you have proven your ability to search through a problem – Not a project – then the possibility is that you will be given more task to complete … but it looks as though this guy is maintaining the reputation that the department has built over a period of time with the additional 69 members of the company – good on him

      Meanwhile instead of using this system as a whinge site, I suggest you grow up and begin living by the proverb “Don’t run before you can walk”; or apply for a position upon the staff of the local fast food joint – or Quickie mart

      Youthful exuberance will either cost the department it’s reputation, or the company a bundle of money

      • #3292721

        Enjoy the Honeymoon

        by robertmi ·

        In reply to You’re not telling the full story …

        Right now you are a babe in the woods. Your degree is something, but not a guarantee of knowledge or quality. It will take time for your oppo to learn how much he can trust you with the systems that make the organisation tick. Be grateful for the opportunity to experience a gentle induction. Many new chums get thrown in the deep end and drown, or at least have a life warping intro to the workforce. Be willing, be silent, breath through the nose when you think you know the answer to a problem he is having. Offer your solutions humbly, always remembering that he is the lead dog. You will get your opportunity to pull your full weight soon enough. Ask him for advice, not necessarily because you need it, but to signal to him that you are not a know it all upstart who is going to change the world starting with his little empire.
        You have many productive years ahead of you, and you might well end up as lead dog yourself some day. IT is kids stuff compared with getting on with people in the workplace. I remember being young and keen and knowledgeable. It was more than 40 years ago but I still blush to think how little I really knew.

        • #3292677

          same Boat

          by bsymons ·

          In reply to Enjoy the Honeymoon

          I was in the same boat when I started about 3 years ago. Things started off slow, but as time goes on more and more responsibilities are given to you.When the higher ups have confidence in your work you become included in decision making and money issues. My best advice is enjoy things now because you have those days or weeks when you wish there was less going on.

      • #3292714

        Cruel!

        by nickw_uk ·

        In reply to You’re not telling the full story …

        You have been rather hard of him. He is asking for advice and not overly whinging.
        You may have been in the business for years so you know that many people are very keen to learn when they enter the business. So maybe a little more constructive advice and less ‘battering’ would be good.

        • #3292691

          maybe I was a little hard

          by arthurp ·

          In reply to Cruel!

          Maybe I was a little hard upon him but we tend to have a different work ethic … and also talk straight with the boss …

          I know that you can’t gain experience without exposure, but you also need to prove that you know the basics

          Maybe a different approach is worth considering … “can I take a look through a problem & see if I can find the answer, even as a technical exercise ?” … or “sorry boss how do I gain experience without actually having the experience?”

          My personal experience over the past couple of years is that too many University Graduates seem to want everything handed to them on a plate, and they often enter the workplace to bleed knowledge off everyone else before running off to another job, leaving you to start the whole training process all over again – Frustrating I know … & I do agree with you …
          Arf’s

        • #3291128

          How long can we continue?

          by ladi.suberu ·

          In reply to maybe I was a little hard

          For how long can we continue to do everything when we can share the the load to those who can assist even if it means guiding them. I know it could be painfull if you get these ‘greens’ trained and at the end of the day they move on. The benfits derivable from sharing out the loads is higher. In conclusion, the this young chap should move closer to his boss, watch what his doing and ask question. He will learn more by watching his boss doing whatever he is doing. You know, you can buy experience.

          Dimeji

        • #3291114

          You have to put in your time

          by cagedmonkey ·

          In reply to How long can we continue?

          I was the newbie to our IT department about 9 months ago and ran into the same situation. My boss was used to doing everything and just felt she had to do it all because she had always done it all. I was a recent college grad to Network Admin. My previous life was a engineer/programmer for 12 years.

          I just started out with small tasks and worked my way up in responsibility to prove to my boss I knew what I was doing. I knew in my mind I knew what I was doing I just had to prove to her by taking time. I knew I couldn’t be initially trusted with the keys to the kingdom. Over time things work out and you get more responsibility, you just have to be patient.

          What happens if you take on more responsiblity too quickly and end up screwing up a really big project then you lose a lot of credibility really fast. Then you get delegated to pushing the broom again.

      • #3291197

        full story

        by starbury ·

        In reply to You’re not telling the full story …

        At the time I wrote the post i was about 5-6 months.
        The situation is much better now… I can see what you mean with proving myself. I have no problem with that.

      • #3291196

        I could have written this….

        by cp7212 ·

        In reply to You’re not telling the full story …

        I have been in my job for about 14 months. My original manager had me put in a remote location from the main building to become a domain admin. He wanted to do this so I could take some of the responsibilities off of him and make his job easier. I have a MCP, A+ certified, and have a degree in networking. I had a little prior experience, but nothing in the industrial sector. He left and one of his employees took his position. Two positions have opened for which I went to school for and he didn’t even give me the benefit of an interview. The jobs were filled before I was even told they were filled! I asked him if I could go to the main building and benefit from his experience. He let me come up for a week. I sat at a desk trying not to go to sleep the whole time. I asked him if I could help him in some way and he had me go to a website to look for some software. My five-year old niece could have done that. I feel like I am wasting away in this job (Desktop Support) fixing people’s Word problems and explaining to them how to make passwords. Any time I have an idea or need help, I am ignored.

    • #3292723

      Create success, don’t be a thread.

      by geertjan.dirven ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      As I read it you’re invading his kingdom of knowledge and handling all of the IT. That may come across as a thread. Your eagerness could add to that. Don’t get me wrong; you should stay excited and eager. Nonetheless I think there’s two things for you to focus on: 1. make sure to measure your success. as you were added to the ‘team’ you must provide your manager with evidence that he did right in hiring you;e.g immense improvement in issue resolution. 2. Then, take a close look at your work; what issues are repetitive; what root causes should be subject to further analysis(ie. enhanced). By bringing on good ideas that would decrease the workload on the helpdesk and make the IT environment more reliable, you’ll define your own projects and create success for him, his confidence in you will grow and so will your job. Fot the future: always define your next step within your current role…good luck.

    • #3292718

      PATIENCE PAYS

      by bchirwa ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      You are a college graduate and you still have a long way to go. In every work place there is what is known as “Institutional culture”. There are ways in which things are done. I do not think your boss has any pressure on him at all so he is able to do all those tasks all by himself after all management has not even complained at all. As far as he is concerned, the workload is within his manageable limits. As for you, grow up, accept whatever assignments he gives you and do them diligently. Infact you have a bonus in that you even have enough time to study your CCNA. Let you boss overload you and you will be the first person complaining of the work load. Give praise where it is due. Sooner or later, your boss will offload some to you, a sign of more confidence. Meanwhile just do what he wants you to do or quit.

      Brian

    • #3292711

      Reply To: Some needed advice

      by jojo-1 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Starbury seems to be taking an unfair beating in some of your replies. Starbury has demonstrated his/her awareness of the whole situation and is obviously intelligent enough to be asking whether s/he is being too overbearing and enthusiastic.

      My advice is to keep up the enthusiasm (trust me – you’ll probably soon lose that after having been in work for a number of years!). Keep studying in your spare time, and only help out with the projects when asked. As you gain more experience, and demonstrate your competence, you’ll gradually become more and more involved in the job.

      I suspect your boss is being cautious and he needs to build up trust in your work over time. I’m sure he respects your enthusiasm but enthusiasm can’t always get the job done! Just imagine if your situtations were reversed – or imagine that you’ll be in your boss’ situation in a few years time. It is hard to hand over work which is your responsibility and when you know exactly what needs to be done and it needs to be done right.

      You’re in an excellent position to forge your career and to learn from someone whom is obviously a great mentor. Think of yourself as a jedi in training until your skills are honed enough to be a great jedi yourself. (Sorry – couldn’t resist the Star Wars analogy!)

      • #3292706

        Patience & hard work will pay off !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

        by debon ·

        In reply to Reply To: Some needed advice

        Starbury, I can sense your enthusiasm and your eagerness to jump in headfirst, however you need to be a little more patient. Granted you have not said how long you’ve been working at your job or how long ago you left college but I still think you may be a little over zealous. No disrespect intended but it is said “….there are very few things more dangerous than an over zealous but inexperienced person…” As JoJo said, try to see through the eyes of your boss, knowing the serious nature of the work to be done, would you delegate to someone who you may not be certain have developed enough to handle the assigned tasks? As I said before, no disrespected intended but just try to consider what it would be like if your positions were reversed. At this stage, the harder you try to ‘bust in’ the more determined he may become in keeping you out until he is sure you are able to handle the tasks.

        That said, I think you could try to get involved by asking to work on some projects WITH him, in which case he would still have final say as to whether he uses any information you may provide. You may not like this but it would at least be a start. At the same time, you should keep your reading up and ensure that you do the best job possible in ‘deploying’ as you state.

        Finally I think that you are a mature person to be assessing yourself as to whether you are too eager etc. just be patient and try to develop the best possible relationship with your boss as well as the users during the post implementation review of tasks that you have carried out. CHEERS and good luck!!!!!!

      • #3291195

        Thanks

        by starbury ·

        In reply to Reply To: Some needed advice

        By the way, I love Star Wars 🙂

    • #3292705

      Look for strengths.

      by delongj ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      What are your strengths? Are there areas within your scope that allow you to attend meetings that will enhance the workplace, workflow? Any meetings!

      Your boss: a mature and balanced supervisor wants employees who can and will take on the responsibilies he/she is tasked to complete. Maintain a presence and shore up his strengths and methology. Compliment his worths even if he can’t. Others will notice.

      Get to work early and notate your supervisor’s time, where he/she spends energy. Become trusted and visible in a suportive way. Wear the right clothes and jewelry or lack of jewelry, scent. As said before, learn the culture and do join in uplifting conversations. Don’t sit in or become the focal point of the negative issues. To your credit, stay in touch with the technology and tie in with others who are interested in engineering of the networks. Keep a smile on your face. Often men and women who are energetic and uplifting are given the whole pie and go from tinkering with the software/eq to running the whole organization. Good luck.

    • #3292699

      Refer all your work

      by dblundell ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Really bog him down by refer all your work through before doing anything. Then he may learn he needs help!
      Or maybe he can do it all and is time to move on

    • #3292694

      Reply To: Some needed advice

      by sullivan-1 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Starbury,

      A manager who is not willing to ‘give you up’ is a manager who is risking losing you all together. Being ‘too eager’ is enthusiasm, one of the best skills anyone can have.

      Remember, it is all in the presentation. You need to step up to the manager, explain in a very positive manner what it is you want to acheive: experience, a better partnership, become a team player. If the manager is unresponsive, your next step is to suggest a meeting with him and his manager (do not go over his head). Explain what it is you would like to become in THEIR organization. No threats, no ‘this or else’. Just a straight forward business proposal. Again if you get no response, you need to move on.

      Managers that keeps their employees pigeon holed are often in fear of losing their positions. Good luck.

      Joe Sullivan

    • #3292685

      Have a Conversation

      by mastorey ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Starbury,

      Have you sat down with your manager and explained your concerns? Remember, your manager may be good at finding solutions, but still probably can’t read your mind, so get 30 minutes of his time and tell him what’s on your mind, and that you want to be more productive, and learn more at the same time. If, after making your point a few times, it may be time to start shopping your resume and “can do” attitude to shops that are willing to listen, and put you to good use.

    • #3292670

      The real crux of the problem…

      by mattk ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      After 20 years in the IT industry at all levels, this post illustrates what my experience has taught me: (1) The average IT person does not have a clear understanding of how business works; and (2) The average IT person has no understanding of leadership and management techniques.

      Starbury’s supervisor/manager should have a clear timeline of her training. If he/she is a true “assistant,” then his/her position description is the same as the bosses, preceeded with “Assist the…” She should know what that timeline is. If there is no timeline then he could always find a small project for Starbury to manage. This way Starbury would get the chance to show off skills, the manager would get the chance to evaluate skills and develop his/her own leadership skills, and both would develop a real working relationship built on trust. If Starbury does not have the skills, that would be the time to find out.

      Starbury should address this issue to the supervisor. If he/she knows what is on the projects list, Starbury could volunteer for one that is low priority, relatively small and does not detract from daily tasking. It is ok to be eager, but the basic tasks still need to be accomplished. The manager needs to realize that being responsible for accomplishment does not mean do it all.

      Understand the task.
      Delegate all or part of the project to the best qualified person.
      Supervise, train, and develop subordinates in the accomplishment of the task.
      Set clearly defined goals and checkpoints to evaluate accomplishment.
      Be responsible for and take ownership of the full scope of the job, including the performance of subordinates.
      Being “in computers” or “in IT” sometimes means letting go and trusting others.

    • #3292669

      Communicate and Serve

      by the_punisher79 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      This is a common problem, especially with IT people. We as IT specialists want to feel like we are in control, have the keys to everything, can fix anything and generally have a sense of ownership of the network. When you’ve been a one man show for the longest time, it’s hard to let go of the stuff that makes you feel powerful and gives you a sense of job security. It’s also a way to create a sort of pecking order to the staff. While none of these things are wrong, some of them can lead to exclusionism and lack of delegation skills. The old adage “If you want something done right, do it yourself” might be what your supervisor is thinking. He also might just be quietly observing your performance and skills before he hands you more responsibility. It’s funny, some people who step in the door fresh off the street think they need to be the rock stars right away. I didn’t get to be where I am today by working on the “sparkle” projects from day one. I spent years doing simple user support and assisting my team and superiors in whatever way they needed. The key here is to strive to make your supervisor SUCCESSFUL, not kiss butt. Once he knows you have his best interest in mind and are a competent worker, he is going to be more willing to hand over the reigns to you. I’ve dealt with this over and over again with students I have hired and with people over me. Just recently a high level network admin was hired and he came from a one man shop. At the outset he wanted to do everything on his own and it took a while for each of us to get used to the idea that we need to work as a team and communicate. Grabbing our collective network “rights” and running to our corners was not an option. I’ve found that if you work with and FOR people, make them successful, show them that you care even about the smallest details, they will respect you. Who knows, you might find yourself next in line for network administration if he leaves here in the future?

    • #3292661

      was in your shoes

      by kalpajen ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Hi

      I graduated College in December of 2004 and have been working @ the same place for over a year now. When I started here it was just my boss he was computer services and the network admin. Now he has me. At first I felt like he never let me do anything important but he just kept telling me to be patient if he showed me everything at once I wouldnt be able to handle it. Its over a year later and I now have lots of responsibilities. Still little by little he will teach me something new and It will become my new responsibility. My boss has been in this field for just about forever. So we have to be patient there is a lot we dont know and there is no way to learn it all real fast its a gradual thing. Just try to be patient and give all you got to what you are doing to show that your are ready and eager to take on more responsibility. Well good luck.

    • #3292655

      maybe he thinks you are a threat!!

      by degwell ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      i know sometimes we IT guys think since we have built asystem we know it best and no one knows how to love the system the way we do!! well well i share yo pain… i would suggest you talk to him put it in a serious but subtle way show him you appreciate what he is doing for you..
      and most importantly make sure he gets all the credit. that way you will have boosted his ego and you and him can live happily eva after.but make sure you take the big step and talk to him.
      And remember we are all where we are because someone gave us a chance to show them what we could do.

    • #3292648

      Take your time and prove your yourself.

      by toddah ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I have been the one man show and now have a team of 4 people working with me. I have been through the difficult task of turning tasks over to new people and watching them run with them, it is difficult first to trust someone else and second to see them make changes to make the task their own. I think you are off on the wrong foot here and you should be really working on how you and the “Old Dude” can form a team that works together to overcome all the things that crop up during a day in IT. You will need his help and he will need yours. The best thing I have found about having a team setting is I can sound ideas out with team members and get feedback or fresh looks at problems. Many times its not what you know or how smart or quick you are but your ability to look at the whole enterprise operation as you solve a problem or create a new solution.
      Most staff additions are the result of filling a need (help desk) so the Admin can concentrate more on administrative tasks. He may be playing catch up on many things that went undone while he was truly a one man show. Many times we are learning as we work with so much new technology being added each day and you may not have earned his trust to the point of him feeling good about letting you run with a project he cannot oversee and learn as it goes.
      If you truly have free time then use it to do some very useful projects like computer a inventory database, some form of helpdesk logging system with search features, finding solutions to those nagging problems that have been around for a long time. If you prove you worth in your own sandbox and show you are a thinking and capable team member you will be suprized how quickly you will become a fully trusted team member.
      Remember nobody OWES you anything! life is what we make it and we make it by earning everything we get. REFOCUS on earning instead of demanding!
      Good Luck

    • #3291248

      Delegation

      by donald.rawlinson ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      What a topic! After over 29 years in this field, I see myself in this posting. This could easily be a book.

      Here are some of your options: 1) Ask if there is anything you can do to help in the project; research the project topic/area that he’s working on (be knowledgeable and helpful not know it all), 2) Ask how you can help him the most 3) Be clear about your motives 4) Share what you find 5) Explain that you love what you do and want to be more of an asset to him 6) Show initiative 7) Be motivated and a self-starter 8) Jump in and be a part of the “team”.

      All of this depends on how well you can read the personality of your boss. If you’re a good study of behavior then you will know what to say and when. Choose your words wisely and timely. Be self-controlled and confident in your abilities to work through complex problems. Listen, understand and learn from his/her actions, reactions, and body language.

      Don’t ever quit; just come up for air.

      Good Luck

    • #3291246

      I feel your pain

      by catfish182 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I dont blame you for asking. it is tough going in and some techs dont give up the postion of tech “god” very easy. im not thinking you would replace him but think of it from his side. a college grad who is very eager to help. that to him could be a threat to his job. so he may want to work to show he still has the “stuff” What you may want to do is scout around the office and see if you can hear of a up and coming project. then go to him and talk to him about it. you may have to cater to his ego a tad. kind of like the senior teaching the junior. I just got by a similar situation. I am not allowed to tough the server at my work. not for lack of knowledge but its a govt agency and they have thier own net techs. but i needed info from server and the tech wasnt coming off with it. i talked to him and im sorry to say i played “dumb” a little bit and allowed him to explain to me a few networking tips that i already knew. not the best thing im sure but i got on his good side and now he shares info with me when needed. and even sends me tips and everything. so maybe swallow a little pride of the “i can do it” and see if he will “help out the younger one”

    • #3291233

      don’t wait for an invitation

      by afram ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I was the only IT guy for a company that size until I hired a second person. Being used to doing everything myself, I was a bit reluctant to delegate as well – everything was set up the way I liked it and was a bit nervous that someone else might not do things my way. Sometimes the workload was a bit too much and it was just easier and faster to do it myself than to try to train the new person.

      I think you should consistently offer your assistance and anytime the other IT person is working on something, watch him and get involved…don’t wait for an invitation. Ask him for a few dedicated projects. When he sees what you can do, he will start to delegate more to you.

      • #3293477

        I Agree

        by zxladie ·

        In reply to don’t wait for an invitation

        >>Sometimes the workload was a bit too much and it was just easier and faster to do it myself than to try to train the new person.>

        All I know is that my one-man-show mindset was more one of network crisis management and deadlines and I felt I couldn’t take the time to train someone the minute they hit the door. I was ever grateful that help desk support was off my shoulders, and I could get to a point where I could train someone correctly, not trial by fire.

    • #3291216

      Re: Needing some advice

      by maverick73 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Starbury –

      Part of the issue in my opinion is the fact that you are helping out a 1-man show. He’s probably not use to having someone with him to delegate to. At the same time, being a new grad, it might be a trust factor too. Explain to him that you would like to help him deliver the projects successfully & that you think you could help. Not only that, two minds could possibly deliver it faster.

      BUT…… at the same time, he’s going to keep you at arms length for a little job protection. If he gives you too much & you complete it successfully, he doesn’t want you to be a threat to his position. Male ego will take over here. Explain to him that if you take some of the smaller projects off his hand, he can focus on the larger, more complex ones.

      Make your case for utilizing you to help him achieve his projects.

      Good luck.

    • #3291203

      Two thoughts from an old guy

      by sa team ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      1. There will be a certain period of time where trust is earned but you will eventually be given trust as no one wants to be a one man army.

      2. People in our business are “fixers” by design and have trouble giving it away. Learn everything he can teach you and find projects that he can’t get to and do them. Make yourself irreplaceable.

    • #3291144

      Maybe your not showing him system awareness yet.

      by tobias ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I have been on his side several times. I have trained a lot of fols who have advanced and moved on; and others who do not.

      When do I givew them projects?
      -when I do not have to clean up after their help desk work
      -when I find that they leave their customers with ful and accurate information rather than BS I have to un-explain
      -when they find some way to solve desktop problems w/o giving every casual user full admin rights
      – when they begin to realize that its all about business process rather than about technology

      and here is the biggest one:

      – when they make full and rapid confession when they are over their head or have messed up.

      The last one is important because if I see them covering up help desk issues, or lack of knowlege, than I can’t trust them to work on anything big or complicated where an occult problem will hurt the business for weeks before I figure out what they did.

      If you think you are ready, ask for a planning session. Ask to learn what the guy does to plan a project, including how he decides (almost more important than what he decides) what kind of contingency plans to make. This is a way to demonstrate higher level understanding of the issues, and the humility that you recognize that events may smack you in the face no matter what the plan, and that you will deal with those mistakes apropriately.

    • #3291140

      Another view from the other side…

      by drivendesign ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Having existed for a long time as the sole support person initially I had difficulty releasing control. I mainly had trouble because I didn’t trust anyone to get it right. Which sometimes meant my way. However, as saw others demonstrate both the willingness and capacity to handle the increased responsibility I began to delegate more. Sometimes the new perspective created new resolutions. I began with tasks I knew were suited to them and the skill level. I then moved on to others that would challenge them to excel. If you let him know that you are ready I feel confident that he will intrust you once he gets over his reservation(s).

    • #3291124

      He is threatened

      by itguyinde ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Most likely he feels threatened that you might ‘take over’ his job and then make his being there unnecessary. Remember, it may not have been his request to bring you on board, it may have been that the business side of things thought he either was too slow or too overloaded and things were not getting done, but he is still a knowledge expert and knows their systems so they don’t want to just get rid of him. That’s why they brought you on board, to get the jobs done.

      My suggestion – tell him point blank to give you one of the projects to take the load off of him so he can have more time to focus on ‘the more important ones’ (the ones he is more focused or further ahead on.)

      Once the ‘powers that be’ see your success in the project, they will ask you and not him to do the next big project…but don’t step on his toes or over him, then you could be getting into all sorts of political issues in the company. Don’t look at him as a supervisor, but as a mentor.

      Hope this helps.

    • #3291118

      He may be insecure

      by mgostovich ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      You just need to hang in there…it is not uncommon for people who have recently just had to hire what some people consider a “College Hot Shot”, to be a little insecure about their position and as a result hold on to way more than they need to. It may take some time but eventually he should relax a bit when he realizes that your not out to take his job.

    • #3291116

      Be Careful of what you ask for

      by usdoj ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      ALong with the interesting tasks comes the 2 am saturday morning “I cant get through the VPN ” calls that must be dealt with yesterday.. so before you decide you can do it all faster and better.. remember that we have been doing this stuff for over 20 yrs..It isnt a game. and if it is any consolation, we all started where you are now.

    • #3291101

      Give it time

      by vester ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Hi,

      Your boss reminds me of myself. I also work for a fairly small company and am the only IT person there. I’ve wanted to hire another person to support the users in the company for awhile now. Perhaps explaining my situation will help you. Since I carry the entire support burden and have been doing so for some time, I cannot focus my energy on the larger projects that I know will have a positive impact on the company. There was a large development project that we started last year and it could not get completed for various reasons, but one of the major reasons was that I was always putting out fires (typical user support stuff). I believe your boss feels that your role is to do the support stuff so he can focus on the “higher visibility” stuff. He may also feel that if he lets you in on the complex projects, and if you succeed, then you might supplant him. This may because he doesn’t feel he can trust you to support him and always watch his back.

      My suggestion to you is that you perhaps take him out to lunch and explain to him how you feel and let him know that you will always stand behind him and support him. Let him know he can trust you and that you aren’t the kind of person who would go above him. Trust takes time to build but doing and saying the right things will earn his trust in you. The other point I was trying to make earlier is that “higher visibility” stuff may be a way for him to show his boss that he is in the role he’s in because he can handle those complex projects. He wants to show his boss that they made the right decision in hiring him and letting him hire you as well.

      Give it time.

      Good luck

    • #3291100

      your boss is insecure

      by njcomputerpro ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I had a situation like this once. I think my boss was worried I was after her job. My advice is to look for another situation where there is room for you to grow. Maybe a company with a bigger IT department or a boss who is willing to be your mentor would be a better bet.

    • #3291098

      Walk a mile in the other guys birkenstalks…

      by keith ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I am an IT manager with many junior IT people working with me. I can say that enthusiasm is appreciated, and arrogance is quickly phased out. From my experience, a good way for new people to find out how the job works is to ask. Approach the manager and say something like:

      “I am enthusiatic about learning my new job and was wondering if you could help me get my goals aligned with your expectations”

      or

      “I would like to do the best that I can for you without stepping on anyones toes, can you tell me what tasks, projects and resonsibilities you see me taking on in the next year? I would like to begin to work towards those…”

      Your words would certainly be best, but I hope you get the idea, the key is to ask straight out, and be gracious, polite and constructive. I wouldn’t expect that you will be handed all the network resposibilites right away, but you can grow into them. Your manager will grow more comfortable with your skills each time you sucessfully pass a milestone.

      Good Luck

      • #3291068

        In other words learn to kiss *%$

        by jafa ·

        In reply to Walk a mile in the other guys birkenstalks…

        That’s right !!! No amount of schooling can prepare you for the success that a good brown nosing can bring. Don’t believe?? don’t fool yourself. I’ve seen plenty of it in my life and it has created positions and opened doors for people that don’t know crap.

        • #3290985

          Constructive Communication–Not Ass Kissing

          by keith ·

          In reply to In other words learn to kiss *%$

          Rather, I was trying to suggest that effective honest and straight forward communication would answer some questions about job description, and job expectations. When we hire someone for a specific job, normally the position we offer them is described in advance. Questions regarding delegation and task awarding are usually clarified during conversation…

          I find many people in this group to be suprisingly confrontational and negative…

          Maybe this is part of the problem between management and staff…

    • #3291086

      Get Proactive

      by jaymiller25 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I was in your situation when I got into IT. I was doing entry level work, but wanted to learn & do more. SO, I started building test systems, figuring things out, etc.
      Once you start doing this, he’ll see that you’ve got the ambition & aptitude to be assigned more involved tasks. Just sitting there and thinking you could do it all isn’t going to get you anywhere…take some initiative, do some things on the side in your downtime and how him… and things will get better for you.

    • #3291076

      Prove yourself, but not in production.

      by tired_of_mcses ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I’m a 12 year expierenced security admin in a company that has a seperate IT guy. To save money they hired straight out of school and gave him the keys to the domain.

      Now this is kind of backwards to your scenario, but this ‘eager beaver’ is not expierenced enough to do a ‘quality’ job. Users are NOT happy and wish he was gone. He spends his days pleasing management (and ‘da sisters’) so user complaints are viewed as trivial. I try and ‘guide’ this worthless pile, only to be ignored and bad mouthed by him behind my back. He makes foolish mistakes (like deleting the previous admins user/exchange account cause the president said so) and feels like he didn’t nothing wrong ’cause he was told to’. Too bad he deleted all warranty info and passwords on products purchased in the past 2 years (BRAVO). He didn’t do backups correctly so restoring is out. And it goes on and on and on.

      Junior admins need to be eager, but keep it out of production. Fresh out of school and tired of help desk work already, but you haven’t seen a fraction of issues that exist. What kind of network do you have at home to work on. Work on that. Acquire 4-5 systems and setup a ‘home production’ environment to work on and start proving yourself that way.

      The senior guy should find the solutions and the juniors implement them. Put in the time, cause you don’t know the 1/2 of IT (not a slam, just the facts)

    • #3291008

      Be a go get it person!!!

      by jwestern ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      In my experience, you have to go and get what you want. I have worked my way up to my current position by challenging some decisions that I felt were not right, by sticking my nose in a process and finding out not how to do something by why it is done. I always go to the top. Just because you work with an admin does not mean you work for him. But you have to be careful of your approach. You cannot sound like you have all the answers but you must express your skills and a desire to enhance those skills. In short, go to your boss and talk to him express your desire. After all nothing just happens you have to make it happen. School did not come to you, you went to school. Do you think Bill Gates waited for DOS to just appear, no he went and found it, took charge and made it work. Go get your job!!!

    • #3290993

      Be eager to help, but not to take over…

      by is girl ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Remember that there are 70 users and an entire business depending on your boss to keep the network running at all times. Even though this is a small company, their network was not set up for you to get more hands on learning experience.

      I suggest you pay careful attention to what you are taught, do it superbly, be the best help desk guy you possible can and look for ways to be more helpful to the users and to the IT guy. Ask for more responsibility and take what you are given eagerly. Eventually, the list of tasks that you are responsible for and capable of performing will grow enough that you can cover for him when he takes vacation, is sick. He may even be able to count on you to come in over the weekend to help upgrade equipment and other chores.

      It takes time to understand the quirks of an individual network and it’s users — be patient and don’t expect to get the challenging tasks out of the gate.

    • #3290992

      dont get discourage

      by psimaint ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Personally i have been on both sides of this
      Be pacient .This guy probably needs to be certain you can handle the position(there is nothing worse than spending alot of time training someone to just lose them)If you are pacient he will let you take on more resposabilities.And pay close attention and ask detailed questions.The reason I say this is someday he will not be there for whatever reason,sick,vacation,or like in my case he leaves.Then is your chance to show and prove.
      In my casee the man above me didnt want me to be involved in detailed work for his job security.
      Someone in another department rubbed him the wrong way and he quit.Everything then was then dropped in my lap.That was three years ago and I now have 5 people beneith me.
      I share knowledge to only the ones who want it .
      Good luck

    • #3290968

      Watch, Listen and Learn

      by jrisner ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      We have all been there at some time or another. The best thing to do is to Watch, Listen, and Learn. If you pay attention to what the other tech is doing and be there to lend a hand he may give you more tasks. Listen to what the Lead Tech has to say you might be suprised what you may learn. Continue to study your Tech Manuals it helps reinforce what you have seen and gives you some knowledge on things you may never see. When I first started out I was fresh out of college and it is hard at first because people are kind of stingy with knowledge. I literally learned a lot through trial and error and also lots of research. My advice to you is to earn his trust and learn skills that complement those he may have, there may come a day when he comes to you for advice.

    • #3292641

      Starbury

      by thirdx9 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      A couple of books you can look into are: How to Manage your Boss, Hegerty; Coping with Difficult Bosses, Bramson; or also, Coping with Difficult People, Bramson. These books has some good applications for any occupation, especially for new employees learning the relationship in a business. Good Luck.

    • #3292610

      FORCE HIM TO DELEGATE

      by tukurk ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      He may not be confinced that you can do it. Most bosses fear a failure. you have to convince him that you know it for him to let it go. Volunteer to get somethings done and make sure you do it right frist time. Gradually you will build the confidence. Surprise him by working extra hard to solve a problem that gives him head ache. such bosses need surprises unless they are simply wicked. Some of them lack self confidence and fear failure a lot.

    • #3292597

      Master your job before you master his

      by ratstud ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      I think you are not too eager, in fact… I would much rather be busy at work with something that will help the company than sitting back reading a CCNA study guide. You should be concentrating on making the tasks assigned to you so far better. There are plenty of things you can do in a helpdesk role to help the company. Think about PC/printer preventative maintenance, you can go around and open up the PC’s and blow the dust out of all the computers in your shop one week. Clean the printers regularly. Set up remote management for printers. Set up a system for logging helpdesk calls and identifying trends (This data will be useful for your supervisor in what future projects can be started). The opportunities are endless. One thing to remember is that you need to be the best at the job you are assigned, not at your supervisors. He will see that you are eager to help out. He will probably see you doing the crap work and feel a little bad, asking you to give him a hand on the more interesting stuff.

      Good luck, and put down the certification manuals…. you already have a job, get out there, help the company you work for the best that you can.

      Good luck.

    • #3292579

      here are my $ 0.02!!!

      by house ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Alright, I’ll admit that I didn’t read every post here and I might repeat what others have already said.

      I read a comment about drinking, p2p, and warez sites. I must have done it the hard way. I wasted a lot of years in a doped up slumber but when I decided to go to school, I played it straight…and still do. I’ve been playing around in the computer underground since the C-64 and 5.25 floppy swapping days and as much as you’d hate to believe it, it did help.

      Since I’ve broken into the IT workforce, I’ve been able to introduce some essential tools to some very experienced admins. Then again, I’ve always been a bit of a geek in that sense. I admit that there are more holes in my knowledge than in theirs, but I do hear “hey, I didn’t know that” and “you can do what?” quite a bit.

      As to your problem, I think that it is a two way social interaction between you and the sr. admin. He should be your friend and not your boss. If you feel like a tool then keep an eye out for a different job. If you think that’s below you – between contracts, I work for a local ISP listening to…and this might merit a new thread…
      “my email’s not working” – “which one is my phone cord?” – “I have the new ethernet acrobat virus thing” – “I deleted my ISP” – “ is not working” – “I need to reinstall? can you give me the cd?” – “that’s fn bs and fu… I had the money in the bank” – “what operating system? Samsung…15 inch…labtec” – “what version of windows? … m-i-c-r-o … Microsoft?? windows??” – “I like calling your tech support because mine really sucks…they put me on hold for hours” – and last but not least…RJ-11 from 56k modem to dsl modem – RJ-45 from dsl modem to laser printer – RJ-11 from wall into 56k phone port…yes this was all on one call…the person called me from the “other” phone because they couldn’t connect and we broke her phone beside the computer with our internet thing????

    • #3292576

      Reply To: Some needed advice

      by house ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Sorry for the double post…and sorry for the off topic crap…someone will appreciate this…

      I forgot to mention something that just happened earlier today. Me and a couple of guys from work decided to help out friend and service their PC (stupid RAMBUS crap). We open the case and there are about 30 cds and dvds inside. I guess they were shoving the disks in between the top of the dvd drive and the frame of the bay. They also told us that besides the fact that the computer wouldn’t work any more…their cds and dvds would only work half the time.

      You gotta love this job.

    • #3292439

      Here are my comments

      by cheridee36 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Starbury,

      I feel your pain. I am in your shoes although I have a masters degree and have held upper management positions for over 15 years. When IT crashed a few years ago, my business plummeted and I am presently working for someone very similar to your boss. I have the most education and my degree is in compliance with IT. His is not…and he hold a bachelors. This gentleman who has a 25 year military background say’s that he loves having smart people working for him, but at the same time, he does what your boss does. He has his hands in the tactical day-to-day part of the projects. Although he delegates projects to his team, he wants to do all the designs and prepare the charters to kick the projects off. It’s such a pain because when it’s time to present, you’re presenting his ideas and he will oftentime get very upset because he doesn’t want you to appear to be reading his work. In the end, I would advise you to offer your support on your supervisors projects. Go to him and present yourself as trying to lesson the load and add value by being a team player. The managers that hold on to everything are usually very insecure in their roles. The people that find it hardest to work with them are people like yourself, “educated”. Most of them are not as educated or their education is very limited to their roles. They usually get the role based upon who they know or the good old boy routine that’s getting old and costing corporations millions.

      Try that, and know that you made my day because I have been pondering on how to get over this madness and felt as if I was alone in this battle.

      I just had a co-worker tell me that I shouldn’t care as much since the company is paying me well. Just let him rock and roll until he can’t any longer…then step up to the plate. But I find it hard because I have a passion for my work.

    • #3294052

      THE HAIR

      by yanipen ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      A long, long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away……

      There was this padawan assigned for a job in a place where all of the jedi masters in there has long hair. Long hair. Nobody gave him much attention and delegating work such as fixing disputes and political conflicts. Although he strong in the force which is one of his good merits but still he wonders why. Is it because of his short clean cut hair?

      But as time passes, he did not noticed that he himself has grown his hair long. And the duties of the jedi knight starts to reveal themselves. Then he too after sometime has hair long, and has become a Jedi Master like his own master.

      You see, all of the other guys above have said are all true. just be patient. Do not rush into things.Duties and responsibilities will reveal themselves to you soon enough, and I hope maybe that time, you will be ready to face the challenges. And oh, good rapport with that one man IT show will greatly help. Count on it.

      I hope this helps.

    • #3294025

      Patience Friend

      by implementor ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Hi Starbury

      This is a common problem faced by many.

      The way to go is to do all the small tasks delegated to you efficiently and then you will see the trust in you going up, and assignments will come your way.

      Best of Luck.

    • #3291607

      Hi what you need to do is

      by zlitocook ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Sit back and watch and learn. I have worked with alot of consulting companys who have sent the best and the fresh out of school people to the job. I was normaly the old guy:) me being over thirty and I had a few gray hairs! Most bosses look at people who are just hired as temps, because you are there to help and when you are done you are gone. I have learned to watch, learn then, ask about. If you want to get ahead in a job do not go above your bosses, do not do what you think will work, do not fix something with out asking first and just do your job with a smile and let the rest come to you. If you want good things to come to you, get training and let your boss know about it. You will get bad bosses who will take or say your fixes or thiers but this will get back to you as the person who thought of it.

    • #3305027

      Advice given from Angola

      by kussi_bernardo2 ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Hi,
      People say that it is easier said than done. But I believe that you are just a normal young professional with lots of potential and with the normal lack of experience.Thus it is normal and not eager that you feel that you should be involved from the start up to the implementation of the projects because for sure that way a normal person learns a lot more and feels the belonging of the project.In most companies all over the world this is how it goes is not about being just your 1st job is about a working culture you have to be very lucky 2 find bosses who easily delegate. But you have to be patient and ask him to explain to you how he does, since he likes to explain and give training and after that start asking for more responsability one step at time, but you need to gain his trust and show that you are not there to take his job (even though if you can do his job will be cheaper for the company just 2 keep U!!!)

    • #3304915

      right there with you

      by cgbullock ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      My boss was is a very talented IT minded person, he is also a medical doctor. He acts the same way, There is 3 of us, in our IT department, myself who has completed Cisco training, and did a 1 year internship at a 5000 node network, a programmer that worked for Red Hat and IBM, and the consultant that used to do all the IT stuff before we were hired. since we have been hired the attitude of the boss is that we are only here to swap mice and keyboards, he does all projects and has us implement the final projects with no documentation. So we are forced to call on him when there are problems. Every comment we make about the organization and how sloppy things are handled we always get a reply of “it works doesnt it.” so my friend, I feel your pain, We have been at our job for over 2 years now and it seems to be getting worse.
      Good Luck

    • #3257200

      Hang in there…

      by railis ·

      In reply to Some needed advice

      Being a one-man IT shop is hard. You get into a rhythm of doing things solo. When you do get somebody in to help, it’s hard to let go and let somebody help.
      If you tell him you want to help more, he’ll probably be a little apprehensive at first, but if he’s any good as a manager, he’ll understand and let you start “spreading your wings”.
      Any new or first job requires a little give and take, so give it more time.

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