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Trustable Computing

By Deadly Ernest ·
Just finished reading the posted Gartner article on Trustable Computing and thought I would throw a few thoughts out for disintegration by the experts here.

Gartner holds that the market forces (ie users) will decide how well this goes. I wish this was so, but greatly fear the big corporations will remove user ability by making the hardware and software options automatic.

My biggest concerns with the Palladium concept, and its brothers, is that all the experts concentrate on the corporate/government user market. They ALWAYS assume that everyone will be updating their PCs every 3 - 5 years and thus everyone will have this hardware and software within a few years. This assumption is so false it is frightening.

The majority of my work is maintaining computers for private individuals and most of the equipment is 4 - 8 years old. With a few exceptions (games and rich people) most private individuals, ie the majority of the home Internet users, do NOT replace their home computers until they no longer provide the capability for which they use them; in most cases this is basic word processing and Internet access.

Thus any changes to institute Trusted or Trustable Computing environments outside of the work network MUST, in my opinion, allow for access and use by people without the hardware and software capability and also for those who choose not to activate it.

How do you people feel about this and do you think the industry giants will allow the establishment of a dual operation system? Call me paranoid but I expect Intel, Microsoft, RIAA and co to push for mandatory use of this hardware and software.

If they do I hope there is a major loss of share market by them.

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This is a different name for an old concept

by HAL 9000 Moderator In reply to Trustable Computing

Sony many years ago insisted that they would not licence the technology to manfacture BETA VCR's to anyone but them selves as they has a superior technology everyone would want a Sony Beta Com VCR well the others in the indusr=try came out with the VHS format and now where is the Beta that was so great?

If the technology can not be impelmented by the majorty of the makers or the major market suppliers then it will fail just as surely as the lattest CD Copy Protection has.

Now Trustable Computing while a nice idea is still a long way off and I think that the more secure that things like Windows are made the more weaknesses will be found that show just how much like a sieve it actually leaks. Now From my memory Microsoft anounced that they where starting Trustworthy Computing in all their products and went into a great deal of detail when 2003 Enterprise Server was released, but at the time it was hitting the shelves Microsoft already knew that it had major security problems and chose not to tell anyone until they had worked out some kind of fix that would cure what they already knew existed.

From what I have seen of this proposal by all concerned it is a nice idea but will never happen because no person in Big Business is ever going to come out and say we have a problem and all of our equipment has to be replaced/repaired now.

This doesn't mean that they aren't going to try harder to stop any problems when they are writing the basic code or whatever but it does mean that the people intent on breaking in are going to get smarter and exploit existing unknown flaws. It will end upo ljust the same as Virus protection you are open to attack until the bit of malicious code is first found, then dismantled and understood and then finially something is written to prevent it from doing any more damage. This is a bit like a dog chasing its tail and just going around in circles. The more that holes are pluged the more will be found and this applies not only to Microsoft but any company who produce any piece of software but it is mainly concerned with companies who make opperating systems as most of the security flaws happen at this level. However as a sign of the times more holes are being found in applications now that previously never came in for a possible methoid of entry so as things go on no matter how much any company would like us to believe that they have the most secure piece of whatever possible that is all that they are talking about At present we have the best security available but next week that could all be different.

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Not strictly true

by GuruOfDos In reply to This is a different name ...

Sony DID licence Betamax technology to at leat 14 other manufacturers. I still have Beta VCR's at home as the quality is still better than ANY modern VHS machine! I have a Sanyo and a Pye!

What ACTUALLY happened was that the Victor Company of Japan (JVC) ,who invented VHS, did two deals. One with the film companies, providing them with cheap transcription equipment to allow them to transpose film to video, and the second with the video rental outlets providing them with subsidised equipment to rent out to end users. When people who had rented VCRs went on to purchase outright, they already had libraries of VHS tapes, so stayed with the format they were tied into. There was a third format, V2000, produced jointly by Philips and Grundig in Europe, which was far superior to Beta and VHS, because it had the capability of recording at three different speeds (like old reel to reel tape decks) and had double sided tapes. You could record 4 hours per side at best quality, 8 per side at 'good' quality, and 16 per side in 'lomg play' mode so for recording long programmes it beat the others hands down. E240 (4 hours) VHS tapes didn't come out until about 6 years after the format had become established.

Trusted PCs will be a similar story. Microsoft will get into bed with Intel and AMD will be excluded from the deal. The Microsoft format will run on Intel hardware and if you don't run Intel, you will be locked out.

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Ok I did forget about the V2000

by HAL 9000 Moderator In reply to Not strictly true

But then again it was never very big on this side of the world so it hardly rated a mention and was only talked about by the professionals who where then using open reel format video tape from Ampex. TV stations and the like as I had to repair one that kept wearing its heads out in a very short time. So they did at least exist but they where expensive and out of the range of home users.

Also you are correct about BetaMax being far superior to VHS but then again I think that I said that as well but it was the licencing that was the main problem as Sony wanted too much and only let so many different companies build the equipment once it was apparent that they had lost the race and VHS was the way the home user was going to go. I can still remember Vedio Rental outlets having seperate sections for VHS and Beta until very recently now they have replaced the Beta with DVD which is the way to go over VHS but it still lacks the ability to be easily recordable so VHS will still be with us for some time yet. Incidently I should mention here that most TV Stations still use BetaMax now because of just how good it is but it has had its day in the home market and is now restricted to niche markets where there is sufficent money to make it worthwile to still make the things but this will pass eventually as well.

However I don't think that M$ will ever be capable of writing code that willonly run on Intel or for that matter AMD as they still can't get their Flagship program Windows to work in a stable manner so do you honestly think they will be able to only make use of the instruction set for one brand of CPU? Enen then this would be confined to a specific CPU family as Intel has released different instruction sets with different CPU familys. I would bet that 2 minutes after Microsucks released there "new" software someone would have a "patch" available so it worked on the AMD or if it was writen for AMD then the Intel would be the benifecary of a "patch."

Lets face it Microsucks has been attempting to get their specalised file system up and running since before NT3.5 and are still attempting to get it to work currently they are hoping for it to be available with whatever Longhorn enventually ends up being called when in production but there is no word of how this is going and even the copy the was released across the internet still used NTFS which even Microsoft admits is nothing more than a stop gap file system until they can get their brain child to work. If they still can't get something as simple as a file system to work do you honestly think they are capable of writing code for one CPU Family Instruction Set?

Anyway G.O.D. lets for one minute forget about the video formats and get tothe guts of the issue as this was only an example and I should have done better but I was in a hurry and it is still 3.30 AM here now so I wasn't at my best either but I still think you got the general idea and are only knit picking into the bargin as you have failed totally to address the main thrust of what I posted and have only skirted around the edges over trivial matters.

Anyway answer this one G.O.D. I still think you'll like it!


Dating Rules


Simple Rules for Dating My Daughter


Rule One:
If you pull into my driveway and honk you'd better be delivering a package, because you're sure not picking anything up.

Rule Two:
You do not touch my daughter in front of me. You may glance at her, to show a respectful amount of attention. If you cannot keep your eyes or hands off of my daughter, I will remove them.

Rule Three:
I am aware that it is considered fashionable for boys of your age to wear their trousers so loosely that they appear to be falling off their hips. Please don't take this as an insult, but you and all of your friends are complete idiots. Still, I want to be fair and open minded about this issue, so I propose this compromise: You may come to the door with your underwear showing and your pants ten sizes too big, and I will not object. However, in order to ensure that your clothes do not, in fact, come off during the course of your date with my daughter, I will take my electric nail gun and fasten your trousers securely in place to your waist.

Rule Four:
It is usually understood that in order for us to get to know each other, we should talk about sports, politics, and other issues of the day. Please do not do this. The only information I require from you is an indication of when you expect to have my daughter safely back at my house, and the only word I need from you on this subject is "early."

Rule Five:
I have no doubt you are a popular fellow, with many opportunities to date other girls. This is fine with me as long as it is okay with my daughter. Otherwise, once you have gone out with my little girl, you will continue to date no one but her until she is finished with you. If you make her cry, I will make you cry.

Rule Six:
As you stand in my front hallway, waiting for my daughter to appear, and more than an hour goes by, do not sigh and fidget. If you want to be on time for the movie, you should not be dating. My daughter is putting on her makeup, a process that can take longer than painting the Golden Gate Bridge. Instead of just standing there, why don't you do something useful, like changing the oil in my car?

Rule Seven:
The following places are not appropriate for a date with my daughter: Places where there is comfortable seating, or anything softer than a wooden stool. Places where there are no parents, policemen, or nuns within eyesight. Places where there is darkness. Places where there is dancing, holding hands, or happiness. Places where the ambient temperature is warm enough to induce my daughter to wear shorts, tank tops, midriff T-shirts, or anything other than overalls, a sweater, and a goose down parka -- zipped up to her throat. Movies with strong romantic themes are to be avoided at all costs; movies which features chain saws are okay. Hockey games are okay. Old folks homes are better.

Rule Eight:
Do not lie to me. I may appear to be a balding, middle-aged, dimwitted has-been. But on issues relating to my daughter, I am the all-knowing, merciless God of your universe. If I ask you where you are going and with whom, you have one chance to tell me the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I have a shotgun, a shovel, and five acres behind the house. Do not mess with me.

Rule Nine:
Be afraid. Be very afraid. It takes very little for me to mistake the sound of your car in the driveway for a chopper coming in over a rice paddy near Hanoi. When my Agent Orange starts acting up, the voices in my head frequently tell me to clean the guns as I wait for you to bring my daughter home. As soon as you pull into the driveway you should exit your car with both hands in plain sight. Speak the perimeter password, announce in a clear voice that you have brought my daughter home safely and early, then return to your car -- there is no need for you to come inside. The camouflaged face at the window is mine.

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Trusted Computing Base Concept

by Deadly Ernest In reply to Ok I did forget about the ...

The base concept of the trusted computing idea is to incorporate a special chip in the motherboard that will only allow the system to work with software with proper codes and then check them against a database somewhere to get a new digital signature which will then allow the system to interact with other authorised systems and not interact with unauthorised systems.

I think the system will not survive long, but those pushing it have enough money to make life **** for everyone for a few years; Microsoft, Intel, IBM, HP, RIAA etc. They have enough collective cash that they may be able to force the issue in their favour on the basis of 'it is this or no computing' and too many corporate and govt honchoes wont fight, then many individuals will just give up as too hard.

PS like you dating rules.

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Actually I fogot that I placed

by HAL 9000 Moderator In reply to Trusted Computing Base Co ...

Those there but as we are currently standing around the water cooler as someone else has alread said on another thread it is good to have a laugh evey chance we get isn't it. God only knows how bad work actually is particuarly for someone like me who has to come in fix up the mess after the inhouse guys have failed so I try not to take things too seriously when ever I get the chance to sought of relax and watch all these blade servers do their thing.

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