vista is a DUD ! (wham baam thankyou maam!)

Locked

THE DEATH KNELL OF VISTA HAS ALLREADY BEEN SOUNDED!!!!PROVING I WAS RIGHT ALL ALL ALLONG.To prove i’m right just look at the Amazon prices & you will see xp home $10 dearer than vista home.It has derfintely turned ugly!
With so many members of the elite!! at tech republic etc giving vista the thumbs up when in fact they were merely speculating.Please look at the evidence don’t take my word & you’ll see i’m right!!

Well Guys & Gals SORRY to dissapoint you all, recent testing has shown VISTA to be outperformed by XP by a whopping 15%!!A lot of it due to the way the op system is designed & it’s non functioning as an op system.As predicted vain attempts to rewrite source code at the last minute or lack of & reports of positive spin did not help the lame system. Recent release of vista has proven to a lot of people that it is a complete waste of time.VISTA=DUD!Guys & Gals i have been totally vindicated as my thread has tried to tell you the truth.While Other threads are simply speculating at tech republic.
MS have pretented to show by using terms like vista ready & packing features that people don’t realy need & using catch words like “killer product” with complete abandon when in fact it has been a complete DUD!
There are no real benefits attached.Compared to xp it is much slower.Heaps of people have tried the os & have gone back to XP just as i had predicted!
Microsoft also has attempted to cut
Support Time for Some Vista queries…
Vista will go the way of Windows ME and I think Microsoft knows it that is why they have allready announced a … Gee, do ya THINK MS knows Vista is a dud? …
When compared, test results actually show vista to be outperformed by xp.
Hey guys MS has finally admitted that VISTA IS A complete FAILURE !!!
Well,Well Heh Heh I have been totally vindicated!!!!!!!!!!!
Well hell nothing short of total vindication for me ,Bill Gates
admitting to vista failure & him stepping down due to vista being a DUD!
You have Acer chief admitting to vista being a failure & refusing to partake of it!
You also have people like Dell,Hp,& others refusing to use vista due to stability & security issues.Dell vista sales have been drastically curtailed as the company & others do not openly recommend use of vista in new systems.
Vista critical issues have not been fixed as redmond procrastinates.Sales of vista have been dwindling.
Vista performance testing is still woefull
as the”lame” system is licking it’s wounds
the death knell has allready been sounded!!
Well ,well we are now in january 2008 &Recent aussie lab testing has confirmed that comparison tests between vista & xp have been shown to be 15 % now it has been checked & can be as bad as 22%.Why a lot of it in the way the source code has been put together like wham bam thankyou maam!!
Guys i’ts April 1st 2009 we are waiting for
the next windows win 7 need isay more about vista its all been said bfor.
ta mick

ta mick

Topic

What beta builds have you tested?

In reply to vista is a DUD ! (wham baam thankyou maam!)

“vista is a crap system why because it is a resource hungry system”

No, Vista utilizes the hardware you already have more efficiently. The 512 MB minimum is the recommended minimum memory. That extra RAM is used to boost performance with things like SuperFetch but Vista will actually load on much less RAM. Vista is taking advantage of modern systems with 512 MB ram or more and doesn’t just let that RAM sit their idle which disk seeks slow the system down.

“it crashes moreas to compatibility issues”

What can I say, it’s called a beta.

“it is not backward compatible.”

It’s often the very same complainers complain that Vista didn’t drop legacy support and should have been written from scratch.

“it has also security holes more than you can poke a stick at.”

No, it’s much more secure than any other desktop operating system with the new security model.

“it is much slower in multi tasking than xp”

No, it’s really not.

“whereas vista requires basic i gig of ram,100 gig hard drive,dual processor core at least 3 gig processor.”

No, it doesn’t. But it can exploit modern hardware like never before to deliver a better user experience.

“compatibility is a big issue.A waste of money why bother as there aren’t too many functional reasons to buy.”

No, compatibility is as good as it can be. As for a waste of money, that’s for individual users to decide.

“Obviously therare problems with stability as the kernel is not fully capable of working in the 64 bit chip architecture comfortably.”

Again, see definition for “beta”. But 64 bit is fully supported and “comfortable”.

So tell me, what beta builds have you tested? Or are you just speculating?

Speculating?

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

We call it “trolling” around these parts here.

vista won’t make the mark

In reply to Speculating?

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.
well you got ms stooges like michael hereid
snr beleiving all is well with vista can’t accept the enevitable that ms has produced a crap system.

Im sure you have…

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

HeHe…
I was running beta 2 on my one-year-old laptop for a month as a test. By the way, its only got a 1.5 Celeron m, was running with 348 mg ram, after 128 was split to graphics and a 40 gig hdd. And, by the way, it ran ok. Driver support was good; in fact all drivers not already part of the system were downloaded in my first windows update!
Of course its still a little shaky, but as everyone else has pointed out, its still only a beta! I see vista as a step forward for Microsoft.

no one said you can’t run it at all

In reply to Im sure you have…

the problem is when combining motherboards ,drivers etc with software etc that it causes problems.i did not say it’s totally
unusable!
ta mick

a few programming software not supported by vista

In reply to no one said you can’t run it at all

Which Microsoft development environments will be supported in Windows Vista?

Not the ones you might think.

SUPPORTED: VB 6 ? ah, my old friend
NOT SUPPORTED: Visual Studio .Net 2002
NOT SUPPORTED: Visual Studio .Net 2003
SUPPORTED, BUT WITH ?COMPATIBILITY ISSUES?: Visual Studio .Net 2005
Good grief.

So, forcing the upgrade path for those older .Net versions? Or is it that they just can?t be bothered making it all work?

Meanwhile, Australian pricing for Vista is out. $751 for Vista Ultimate?! Yowch. Mind you, who really pays for a full version of Windows? Most people would be getting upgrades from previous versions, or OEM copies. Like Office, the full pricing is always exhorbitant.

ta mick

problems abound

In reply to a few programming software not supported by vista

There are still plenty of glitches. If you move the data folders out of the user profile and onto a separate partition, for instance, the search index doesn’t get updated, and some programs (including Windows Live Messenger) still look for data in the old locations.
thanks mick

i was right!

In reply to Im sure you have…

yeah i was right!
ta mick

well news for you i was right

In reply to Im sure you have…

i was right all all along.
Ta mick

still right ,you’ll say i’m still wrong

In reply to well news for you i was right

if you look at what’s happening you’ll agree.

ta
m
i
c
k

your wrong i have proof i’m right

In reply to Im sure you have…

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.
well you got ms stooges like michael hereid
snr beleiving all is well with vista can’t accept the enevitable that ms has produced a crap system.

ta mick

well look how wrong you are & i’m right

In reply to Im sure you have…

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta mick

there’s heaps of software that was supported under xp no longer supported

In reply to Im sure you have…

by vista & a plethora of compatibility problems.No one gives a damn at the moment.Heaps of people are stuck with an os
that does not perform to expectations :result all are going back to xp.
ta mick

why vista is defective by design

In reply to there’s heaps of software that was supported under xp no longer supported

Why Vista is defective by design
14th February 2007 Ashton Mills Internet, Kernel Knowledge, Vista, Windows
Vista’s DRM features have been drawing ever more criticism, but it’s just the latest step among many that takes liberties out of the hands of users and into the media megacorps. So what are you going to do about it?

Even Vista is, of course, just the most recent example in a litany of anti-consumer devices designed to protect monopoly distribution for the media cartels and, most certainly, Microsoft at the expense of the you, the customer.

In his recent column on Forbes, Bruce Schneier covers off all the essential arguments, including Microsoft’s interest in implementing DRM, which I couldn’t have said better myself. In my piece on 10 reasons not to get Vista, some of the comments in response suggested that the point about the inclusion of DRM in Vista was unfair, that Microsoft’s hand was forced by Hollywood. Which is, of course, a gigantic load of wombat poo. As Schneier puts it:

“It’s all complete nonsense. Microsoft could have easily told the entertainment industry that it was not going to deliberately cripple its operating system, take it or leave it. With 95% of the operating system market, where else would Hollywood go?”

But the problem didn’t start with Microsoft. Copy protection, and its newer perverted cousin DRM (Digital Rights Management, or more accurately Digital Restrictions Management) has been around for a rather long time now. And it’s not that products shouldn’t be protected, it’s that frequently these protections comes at a cost to the very people who it isn’t intended for — those who legitimately buy the products.

The problem is that, while piracy is real, Hollywood and ilk make the assumption that everyone in the entire world is guilty until proven innocent. Apparently it’s all too hard to do the right thing, so why not just treat everyone as guilty and be done with it?

It doesn’t matter if you legitimately purchased your DVD or CD, it doesn’t matter if you wish to format shift this product you own to another device you own, and doesn’t matter that you routinely go out and buy more music and movies to enjoy — you’re a criminal, deal with it.

As DRM has absolutely no use to the end user, and in fact hinders their experience of a purchase, DRM infused products have been termed ‘Defective by design’. Because lets face it, they are. There’s even a website for it.

And why should you foot the bill for a copy protection mechanism that doesn’t apply to you? Eric Raymond put it best in the Jargon File with his definition of copy protection:

“copy protection: n.

A class of methods for preventing incompetent pirates from stealing software and legitimate customers from using it. Considered silly.”

Decades from now our children will look back be in awe at the irony this period of human history produced. Lets cover the facts shall we:

Fact: DRM and copy protection doesn’t stop piracy.
We’ve had these in place for decades now. I can remember playing games on a Commodore 64 that came with a ‘code wheel’ to prevent anyone without the wheel from playing. Today there is Safedisc, Laserlock, Securom and others to prevent games being copied.

Yet games are still pirated.

For DVDs we’ve had CSS and CDs all manner of perverse copy protection systems — one of which could be bypassed with a felt tip pen, while another installed a rootkit (both courtesy of Sony).

Yet DVDs and CDs are still pirated.

Even Vista’s DRM has already been broken.

Fact: DRM and copy protection hinders legitimate users.
Since DRM and copy protection is applied to the products on sale, naturally it’s the people who buy the products who end up encountering it. Pirates? They rip it out and the pirated versions of software, DVD and music have no usage restrictions, and no hindrance.

It doesn’t get clearer than this: The only people who experience copy protection are same people who support the product by buying it.

I can already hear the children who will inherit our legacy laughing.

Fact: DRM and copy protection has cost billions.
Between Hollywood, Sony, EMI, and the gaming publishers I can’t imagine the volumes of money sunk into these schemes. Yet piracy still occurs. It doesn’t take a genius to realise this is dead money that — here’s a crazy idea — could have been spent actually producing products that people want to buy, and turn a profit.

Unfortunately, it also adds to the cost to produce these products, so the end user ultimately has to foot the bill for the paranoia of the media and entertainment megacorps that see the world through pirate-coloured glasses.

So let’s summarise…
DRM doesn’t work, it hinders legitimate use, and it has exorbitant costs through which ultimately users foot the bill.

And we only need to look to current events for yet another example of how pointless and expensive the pursuit of copy protection and DRM really is. As this Boing Boing blog describes, the AACS copy protection system that forms a part of both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray has already been broken (just like CSS before it on DVDs), and puts it succinctly like so:

“AACS took years to develop, and it has been broken in weeks. The developers spent billions, the hackers spent pennies.”

So why does the Hollywood mentality still persist?

Because the industry just doesn?t get the future that’s bearing down on it. The RIAA and MPAA especially are a middleman the world no longer needs, and they are fighting tooth and nail to hang onto the past. As legal, downloadable, music and TV distribution has shown the future is an on-demand online market where content producers sell direct to the consumer. No one needs the MPAA or RIAA anymore, but they don’t want you to know that.

Finally, all of this could be averted if the flawed reasoning that people are inherently criminals was actually thought about for a picosecond — if the majority of people really were thieves, there isn’t a business on this planet that would still be standing.

The fact is, while piracy is real (and is real eveywhere — you can bet the local fruit shop loses a few apples a week), that the majority of the human race will buy products rather than steal them, because we all have an understanding that the world just wouldn’t work otherwise.

Hollywood, for one, wouldn’t have got as big as it has if this wasn’t true. Where did all those profits come from, even in age before digital restrictions where people could still copy VHS tapes? Funny how Hollywood didn’t collapse. Instead, it’s bigger than ever.

So here’s the message to the big content producers of this world — stop trying to protect your B-grade products from being stolen (have you seen some of the shit movies that make it to DVD?), and start investing money in making A-grade products people want to buy. Economics will do the rest.

Heck, for a teeny tiny fraction of the millions of dollars wasted that’s been wasted so far, I could give you the next Star Trek franchise.

And what can you do about it? Be vocal. Let them know. Don’t buy DRM products, and when you see them on the shelves fire off an email telling why you didn’t buy it. Help them to understand that keeping you happy is in the best interests of their profts. When there’s enough noise, change is inevitable.
ta mick

tom s hardware benchmarking supports that vista

In reply to why vista is defective by design

is a complete flop in performance gaming.
check it out for yourselves.This should put any ideas that ms has given us an improvrd system to xp rather a big bloat.
ta mick

Article frome extreme tech .com confirms that vista is much slower than xp

In reply to Im sure you have…

xp wins hands down.Confirming all allong what i have said as far as needing to upgrade they recommend a clean install.
Once again time is on my side all my years of testing etc etc has confirmed that vista is one giant flop!!
ta mick

vista is one giant flop

In reply to Article frome extreme tech .com confirms that vista is much slower than xp

vista is one giant flop

security is not strong enough

In reply to vista is one giant flop

on vista

drivers or lack of is big problem

In reply to vista is one giant flop

lack of drivers is aproblem with vista

well reflecting now it’s nice to know that

In reply to Im sure you have…

i was right & all those fence sitters were
wrong.
ta mick

my opinions are so worthwhile they are being used everywhere

In reply to Im sure you have…

from yahoo answers to google find it etc.I’m so pleased of the outcome.

a 90 day report card shows vista to be

In reply to my opinions are so worthwhile they are being used everywhere

a complete failure i was right all allong.
Where’s that ostrich dope michael hereid jnr now. Head in the sand.

from computer world nsw govt considers vista os

In reply to a 90 day report card shows vista to be

unsuitable to use in govt day to day business & recommends a stay with xp!!

recent posting from zdnet australia confirms the worst

In reply to a 90 day report card shows vista to be

most people are not ready for vista.They have to be kidding.
Here is your Vista, says Microsoft

Oh well, it is a publicity machine after all.
Just wait, in 6 months the analysts will have turned on them and will be asking why Vista is such a dud.
WinXP is good enough for most Windows users out there and that’s how it’ll stay.
just confirms what adud vista is.

recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

In reply to my opinions are so worthwhile they are being used everywhere

about vista security flaws.As a matter of fact xp is more secure than vista.
Microsoft partner: Vista less secure than XP
By Tom Espiner, ZDNet UK
19 March 2007 06:31 AM

Security company Kaspersky claimed that Vista’s User Account Control (UAC), the system of user privileges that can be used to restrict users’ administrative rights, will be so annoying that users will disable it.

Natalya Kaspersky, the company’s chief executive, said that without UAC, Vista will be less secure than Windows XP SP2. “There’s a question mark if Vista security has improved, or has really dropped down,” she said to our sister site ZDNet UK at the CeBIT show in Hanover last week.

Kaspersky provides one of the scanning engines in ForeFront, Microsoft’s business security product.

Arno Edelmann, business security product manager for Microsoft, said that Kaspersky’s claims were surprising. “We have a thriving community of partners, and Kasperky is one of our best partners,” Edelmann told ZDNet UK. “I find their statements a little strange because they have one of the best insights into Microsoft security products.”

After being roundly criticised over its security strategy in the past, Microsoft has done a lot of work to improve its approach and has been touting Vista as its most secure operating system. But Kaspersky confirmed that her analysts had found five ways to bypass Vista’s UAC, and that malware writers will find more security holes.

Kaspersky also added her voice to Symantec and McAfee complaints that PatchGuard, designed to protect the Vista kernel, is hindering security companies’ work.

“PatchGuard doesn’t allow legitimate security vendors to do what we used to do,” said Kaspersky.

Symantec has claimed that PatchGuard is hurting security vendors more than it was hurting malware writers. Bruce McCorkendale, a chief engineer at Symantec, said: “There are types of security policies and next-generation security products that can only work through some of the mechanisms that PatchGuard prohibits.”

Eugene Kaspersky, the company founder, said last Thursday that while vendors had to interact with Vista legitimately, hackers were under no such constraints.

“Cybercriminals seem not to care about Vista licensing,” said Eugene Kaspersky. “They don’t need to follow regulations or be certified by Microsoft — antivirus vendors do.”
The fact that ms was spouting news about a killer os that was the most secure system ever is a joke.Ms hoped to thrive on the sheer ignorance of people.
ta mick

i did say that vista was crap & there were more security holes to poke

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

a stick at.

proceed with caution is one recommendation if

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

installing vista.Upgrading to Vista? Proceed with caution

“More so than ever, the operating system is just such a small piece to the user,” says Stan Foster, research fellow and Microsoft specialist at Hewlett-Packard’s service division, which helps HP customers manage rollouts and provides additional services such as managed desktop outsourcing. “It’s the applications that are important to the business people. All these components [Vista, Office 2007, Exchange 2007] have individual benefits, but combined — that’s where the action is.”

And though it may not simply be a matter of whole-hog deployment of the Microsoft trifecta or nothing at all, from a planning perspective, it’s certainly easier to consider Vista, Office, and Exchange as a holistic combination rather than starting over from scratch each time.

Both Office 2007 and Exchange 2007 offer significant, new, user-facing features that could well influence management buy-in far more than Aero’s pretty face. Figuring out the right feature combination means charting the best course to ROI, and that, in turn, is the best path to getting management on board — a path that requires identifying the combination of these three platforms that will offer the most to your user set and then building your rollout plan around those features.

Fortunately, this is one area where Microsoft has done a considerable amount of work — especially from an eat-your-own-dog-food perspective. “For us, deploying Vista definitely meant deploying Office 2007 simultaneously,” says Ron Markezich, vice president of managed solutions at Microsoft, and formerly the company’s CIO. Microsoft at present already has 64,000 Vista desktops deployed and previously had 107,000 Exchange 2007 mailboxes rolled out. Markezich cites the new Windows Imaging capability that’s included with Vista as a key driver for the decision to perform both product upgrades at the same time.

“It’s just so much easier than with previous imaging packages,” says Chad Lewis, Microsoft’s Vista deployment product lead. “Remember, we don’t just deploy Vista or Office once, like our customers. We’ve had to deploy several builds of both at regular intervals. The ability to keep our WIM [Windows Imaging Format] file library small and easily tailored has made the whole process just so much easier.”

Microsoft has configured its upgrade process to allow certain users to upgrade their own machines at their own pace when going from Windows XP/Office 2003 to Vista/Office 2007. But once on the new platform, Microsoft uses a forced SMS (Systems Management Server) 2003 upgrade process to make sure that users on Vista stay current with new builds. “The nice thing is that we can use the same WIM library for both operations,” Lewis says.

proceed with caution is one recommendation ifers put the bite on vista

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

Hackers test Vista defences

Computer hackers are off and running trying to find vulnerabilities in Microsoft’s new Windows Vista operating system, putting to test the software maker’s claim that it is the most secure Windows program ever.

The new version of Windows, the computer operating system that runs over 95 per cent of the world’s computers, became available to consumers on Tuesday after five years of development and a number of delays to improve security.

A high-profile new product like Windows Vista draws interest from the entire spectrum of the computer security industry, ranging from hackers trying to exploit a breach for criminal means to researchers looking to make a name for themselves as security experts.

“For sure, people are hammering away on it,” said Jeff Moss, the organizer of Defcon, the world’s largest hacking convention. “If you are a bad guy and you find a problem, you have a way to spread your malware and spyware.”

Most security experts see Vista as a more secure operating system than its predecessor, Windows XP, but even Microsoft acknowledges it’s not impenetrable and attackers will undoubtedly look for a way in.

Attackers can use spyware programs to monitor a computer remotely and collect personal information on a user. They can also control machines remotely to attack websites, send spam email or defraud online advertisers.

Vista’s comes with built-in anti-spyware software, and new account controls curb the ability of users to unintentionally install harmful programs. The high-end versions come with a feature called BitLocker that encrypts a computer’s hard drive in the case of a lost or stolen machine.

“We know from the outset that we won’t get the software code 100 percent right. No one does in the entire software industry … but Windows Vista has multiple layers of defence,” said Stephen Toulouse, senior product manager at Microsoft’s trustworthy computing group.

Windows Vista runs over 50 million lines of software code and Microsoft invested $6 billion to develop the first new operating system since it released Windows XP in October 2001.

Microsoft’s ability to protect Windows from attackers is seen as a critical litmus test for a product that generated more than $US10 billion in sales last year, especially to large institutional customers who are extra careful.

Another key element in Microsoft’s plan to combat attacks will be automatic Windows updates sent to Vista users to patch up vulnerabilities and changes to its anti-spyware products.

In the past, attackers honed in on vulnerabilities in the core Windows operating system, but those types of attacks are being cast aside for attacks from email, instant messaging and applications downloaded from the Web.

“In the past with XP, they could attack the operating system itself to infect you. Today the OS is stronger but threats can still get on your system,” said Oliver Friedrichs, director of emerging technologies at security software maker Symantec Corp.

Johannes Ullrich, a cyber security expert at the SANS Institute research group, expects hackers are working furiously to win recognition as the first to find and publicise a security hole in Vista.

He also cautioned that hackers would still be able to launch attacks by taking advantage of vulnerabilities in Internet Explorer and Microsoft Office, and warned that criminals would hold off on exploiting holes until more users adopt Vista.

“Being the first to write an exploit for Vista is something a lot of people would like to do,” Ullrich said in a telephone interview. “But ultimately any exploit

proceed with caution is one recommendation ifers put the bite on vista

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

Hackers test Vista defences

Computer hackers are off and running trying to find vulnerabilities in Microsoft’s new Windows Vista operating system, putting to test the software maker’s claim that it is the most secure Windows program ever.

The new version of Windows, the computer operating system that runs over 95 per cent of the world’s computers, became available to consumers on Tuesday after five years of development and a number of delays to improve security.

A high-profile new product like Windows Vista draws interest from the entire spectrum of the computer security industry, ranging from hackers trying to exploit a breach for criminal means to researchers looking to make a name for themselves as security experts.

“For sure, people are hammering away on it,” said Jeff Moss, the organizer of Defcon, the world’s largest hacking convention. “If you are a bad guy and you find a problem, you have a way to spread your malware and spyware.”

Most security experts see Vista as a more secure operating system than its predecessor, Windows XP, but even Microsoft acknowledges it’s not impenetrable and attackers will undoubtedly look for a way in.

Attackers can use spyware programs to monitor a computer remotely and collect personal information on a user. They can also control machines remotely to attack websites, send spam email or defraud online advertisers.

Vista’s comes with built-in anti-spyware software, and new account controls curb the ability of users to unintentionally install harmful programs. The high-end versions come with a feature called BitLocker that encrypts a computer’s hard drive in the case of a lost or stolen machine.

“We know from the outset that we won’t get the software code 100 percent right. No one does in the entire software industry … but Windows Vista has multiple layers of defence,” said Stephen Toulouse, senior product manager at Microsoft’s trustworthy computing group.

Windows Vista runs over 50 million lines of software code and Microsoft invested $6 billion to develop the first new operating system since it released Windows XP in October 2001.

Microsoft’s ability to protect Windows from attackers is seen as a critical litmus test for a product that generated more than $US10 billion in sales last year, especially to large institutional customers who are extra careful.

Another key element in Microsoft’s plan to combat attacks will be automatic Windows updates sent to Vista users to patch up vulnerabilities and changes to its anti-spyware products.

In the past, attackers honed in on vulnerabilities in the core Windows operating system, but those types of attacks are being cast aside for attacks from email, instant messaging and applications downloaded from the Web.

“In the past with XP, they could attack the operating system itself to infect you. Today the OS is stronger but threats can still get on your system,” said Oliver Friedrichs, director of emerging technologies at security software maker Symantec Corp.

Johannes Ullrich, a cyber security expert at the SANS Institute research group, expects hackers are working furiously to win recognition as the first to find and publicise a security hole in Vista.

He also cautioned that hackers would still be able to launch attacks by taking advantage of vulnerabilities in Internet Explorer and Microsoft Office, and warned that criminals would hold off on exploiting holes until more users adopt Vista.

“Being the first to write an exploit for Vista is something a lot of people would like to do,” Ullrich said in a telephone interview.

more vista issues

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

A high-profile new product like Windows Vista draws interest from the entire spectrum of the computer security industry, ranging from hackers trying to exploit a breach for criminal means to researchers looking to make a name for themselves as security experts.

“For sure, people are hammering away on it,” said Jeff Moss, the organizer of Defcon, the world’s largest hacking convention. “If you are a bad guy and you find a problem, you have a way to spread your malware and spyware.”

Most security experts see Vista as a more secure operating system than its predecessor, Windows XP, but even Microsoft acknowledges it’s not impenetrable and attackers will undoubtedly look for a way in.

Attackers can use spyware programs to monitor a computer remotely and collect personal information on a user. They can also control machines remotely to attack websites, send spam email or defraud online advertisers.

Vista’s comes with built-in anti-spyware software, and new account controls curb the ability of users to unintentionally install harmful programs. The high-end versions come with a feature called BitLocker that encrypts a computer’s hard drive in the case of a lost or stolen machine.

“We know from the outset that we won’t get the software code 100 percent right. No one does in the entire software industry … but Windows Vista has multiple layers of defence,” said Stephen Toulouse, senior product manager at Microsoft’s trustworthy computing group.

Windows Vista runs over 50 million lines of software code and Microsoft invested $6 billion to develop the first new operating system since it released Windows XP in October 2001.

Microsoft’s ability to protect Windows from attackers is seen as a critical litmus test for a product that generated more than $US10 billion in sales last year, especially to large institutional customers who are extra careful.

Another key element in Microsoft’s plan to combat attacks will be automatic Windows updates sent to Vista users to patch up vulnerabilities and changes to its anti-spyware products.

In the past, attackers honed in on vulnerabilities in the core Windows operating system, but those types of attacks are being cast aside for attacks from email, instant messaging and applications downloaded from the Web.

“In the past with XP, they could attack the operating system itself to infect you. Today the OS is stronger but threats can still get on your system,” said Oliver Friedrichs, director of emerging technologies at security software maker Symantec Corp.

Johannes Ullrich, a cyber security expert at the SANS Institute research group, expects hackers are working furiously to win recognition as the first to find and publicise a security hole in Vista.

He also cautioned that hackers would still be able to launch attacks by taking advantage of vulnerabilities in Internet Explorer and Microsoft Office, and warned that criminals would hold off on exploiting holes until more users adopt Vista.

“Being the first to write an exploit for Vista is something a lot of people would like to do,” Ullrich said in a telephone interview.

;

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

ghghgh

honey moon is over with vista

In reply to recent confirmation about vista security confirms that i was totally right

ms is not coping well with vista problems

Falling into the vista trap!!

In reply to Im sure you have…

Falling into the Vista trap
By Tim Weber
Business editor, BBC News website

Microsoft promises to wow people who are upgrading from Windows XP to its new operating system, but with the joys of Windows Vista comes plenty of pain.

Computers look complicated, but are easy to upgrade

Vista video roundup

I know, I know, I’m a sucker for technology.

The shiny new Vista disk was sitting on my desk, and I just couldn’t resist giving it a try.

Even though I fell for Vista’s promise – more security and certainly much more fun than tired old Windows XP – I tried not to be stupid.

I knew my four-year-old PC might have trouble coping with Vista, not least because of its wheezing graphics card.

When I bought it, my Dell Dimension 8200 was fairly state-of-the-art (a few stats for the experts: Pentium 4 processor running at 2GHz, 384MB of RAM, a 64MB graphics card, and a Creative SB Live audio card).

Since then I had added memory (to 768MB), a second hard disk, extra USB ports and a Wifi card.

A blunt message

But this was probably not enough, so I downloaded Microsoft’s Vista Upgrade Advisor.

Out with the old, in with the new computer memory

Microsoft’s message was blunt but useful: Yes, my computer could happily run Vista, but it would need a few crutches and new body parts. Step-by-step instructions told me how to avoid problems:

Get a new graphics card with at least 128MB memory;
download new software for the Linksys Wifi network card, to sync my PDA with Outlook and to make good use of my multimedia keyboard;
download the latest version of my Kaspersky Antivirus software.
With a few minor exceptions, the rest of my set-up was given a clean bill of health, including my webcam and printer.
It turned out to be tricky to find the right graphics card. Most shopping websites were useless in providing information on Vista compatibility.
At least a dozen times, I discovered in the small print on manufacturers’ websites that there were no Vista drivers for that particular piece of hardware. I finally settled on a Nvidia GeForce 6200 with 256MB memory.

Now here is the dirty little secret of all the expensive PC helpers out there. Upgrading hardware is really easy.

As long as you make sure the new hardware fits into the slots that come with your computer and does not overburden its power supply, it’s usually just a case of carefully lifting out the old and slotting in the new piece of kit.

Do check the manual, though, to see whether you need to install the driver software for your new equipment before or after putting it in.

If you are still worried, go online. You can find plenty of videos and manuals providing step-by-step guides on how to do it.

Then I followed the task list drawn up by Microsoft. The Upgrade Advisor even provided direct links for downloading new drivers and other software.

Taking one more precaution, I made a full back-up of all my documents to an external hard drive.

A good start

Finally I was ready to go.

I had read somewhere that a Vista installation would take 20 minutes. Not if you upgrade from XP.

HAVE YOUR SAY
Vista looks snazzy, but functionally, there isn’t enough to warrant the price of upgrade yet

Andrew McKendry, Stockton, UK

Send us your comments
After three-and-a-half hours of churning, at long last the Vista logo filled my screen.

It was the beginning of a day of anguish.

At first sight, everything had worked fine: All user accounts, complete with documents and software, were present and accounted for.

Vista looked slick. Its user interface was clear and set-up seemingly easy. The XP gobbledegook had disappeared from dialogue boxes.

Installing the new wifi driver and anti-virus software was a cinch.

Software worked straight away – whether it was Microsoft Office, Firefox or my very old copy of Photoshop Elements.

Feel the pain

But soon the problems began to mount:

Where was the internet? I could see my router, but nothing beyond – even after a full day of tinkering with various network wizards. My BBC laptop proved that this was not a problem with my router or ISP.
Why did my Philips webcam refuse to work? The Upgrade Advisor had explicitly said it would.
What hardware was responsible for the three driver errors flagged up by Vista? One seemed to be the sound card – oh yes, why did I have no sound? But which mysterious “PCI input device” was lacking a driver? And what was the “unknown device” flagged up by Vista?
Why did I get a “disk is full” error message every time I tried to install my keyboard’s new Intellitype software? Why did Vista refuse to uninstall the XP-version of Intellitype?
I knew that Apple had failed to make iTunes Vista-ready, so I didn’t even try.
But why did Microsoft’s successor of Activesync, called Windows Mobile Device Center, refuse to hook up Outlook to my trusty old Pocket PC?
Fiddling around with Vista’s settings, I soon found myself deep below its slick interface.

And the deeper I got, the more the look and jargon of dialogue boxes took me back into the world of XP.

The Vista interface is slick and easy to use

It took me one day to get online. The detail is tedious and highly technical: reinstalling drivers and router firmware didn’t work, but after many trial and error tweaks to Vista’s TCP/IP settings, I had internet access.

Once online, Creative’s website told me that my sound card was a write-off. No Vista support would be forthcoming.

Grudgingly I ordered a new one. After installing it, the hardware error messages disappeared; the three different errors flagged up by Vista were all triggered by my old sound card.

I also realised that my computer really needed more memory. Annoyingly, my Dell uses an unusual flavour of memory, called RDRAM, which is rare nowadays.

Two lost and one successful eBay auctions later, I installed one extra gigabyte of memory.

So far the upgrade to Vista had cost me about ?130.

Not cheap, but probably fair value, as it will have extended the life-cycle of my PC by about two years.

Bearing a grudge against Philips, Dell and Microsoft

But a few problems refuse to go away and are both expensive and aggravating.

VISTA PC SPECIFICATIONS
VISTA CAPABLE
800MHz processor
512Mb memory
DirectX9 capable graphics processor
PREMIUM READY
1GHz processor
1Gb memory
128Mb graphics memory
40Gb hard drive
DVD-ROM
Internet access

My Philips ToUCam still doesn’t work, and plenty of angry forum debates are testament to the distinct lack of Vista support provided by Philips.

Even worse, Vista still refuses to talk to my Dell Axim X5 Pocket PC, which is a mere three-and-a-half years old.

I like my PDA. It saved my bacon when my laptop died on a reporting trip. Over five days, I filed 14 stories using the Axim and its foldable keyboard.

I don’t want to buy a new one – at least, not until I find an affordable smart phone that is both slim and has a slide-out keyboard (what’s on the market right now is too bulky for my taste).

But my Axim uses the Pocket PC 2002 operating system, and Microsoft has decided that Vista will work only with Pocket PC 2003 and higher.

A top Microsoft executive, who does not want to be quoted by name, tells me that “the refresh rate on [mobile] devices is typically 18 months, from our research – hence the view that most Pocket PC 2002 devices would no longer be in use.

“Our view (which may be incorrect) is that those people using the latest Desktop [operating system] would potentially also be using later devices as well.”

Well, I have a surprise for Microsoft: They are wrong, not least judging from the discussions on various forums I’ve been to while hunting for a solution.

While Microsoft leaves me out in the cold, Dell is no help either.

Delving into a Dell support forum, I realise the company practises tough love. Very briefly, a couple of years ago, Dell offered X5 customers an upgrade to Pocket PC 2003. Not anymore.

So I can either throw away my Axim and invest another ?200 or ?300 (for a PDA and webcam), or roll back to XP and wave Vista goodbye.

To Vista or not to Vista

I find myself caught in the Vista trap. Quite apart from the pain of having to reinstall XP, I do like Vista.

It’s slick, it’s fast, it is very user-friendly. I like its applications – for example, Windows Picture Gallery, which could become a serious competitor to my favourite image browser, Faststone.

However, there are still plenty of wrinkles. The Windows “sidebar” may look nicer than Google desktop, but it crashes regularly and infuriates me because its “gadgets” can not be customised.

I’ve had two Vista crashes so far – not a blue but a black screen – and that really shouldn’t happen. I can’t even remember my last XP crash.

And everywhere I look, there are blogs and forums full of people who have problems with software drivers and suffer the poor customer support of the hundreds of hardware and software vendors that make up the Windows ecosystem.

So would I do it again?

The answer is no. Do what I originally had planned to do. Wait for half a year until the driver issues are settled and then buy a new PC.

Once that’s in place, you can upgrade and tinker with your old machine, to give to your parents or children.

You will probably enjoy Vista, but there’s little reason to do it the hard way.

Update 20 March 2007:

After four different attempts to solve the problem with my keyboard’s Intellitype software, a Microsoft engineer sorted the issue by crawling for 75 minutes through my Registry Editor.
Last night I finally found a driver in an arcane corner of the Philips support website that I could force to work under Vista; the driver installation did not work out of the box, though, and I had to jump through several hoops to force its installation; Philips now say they hope to release a set of Vista drivers in April
I’ve given up on the crash-prone, resource-hogging Windows sidebar, and I’m back with the Google desktop sidebar.
Vista still refuses to speak to my handheld computer, and Microsoft says that this won’t change; I now use the Windows XP computer at work to maintain and sync my calendar and address book, which is a huge inconvenience.
Well at the risk of sounding like a church bell i told you so!
ta DR Mick

BIll hails digital decade

In reply to Falling into the vista trap!!

Microsoft boss Bill Gates has outlined his vision of the connected future, telling experts in Las Vegas: “The digital decade is happening.”

Mr Gates was speaking on the eve of the world’s largest hi-tech conference, the Consumer Electronics Show.

He told delegates that “connected experiences” were now the most important part of new technologies.

“Young people spend more time with their Windows PC than watching TV,” he said.

People want to do things with their content across multiple platforms

Bill Gates

In a speech with few concrete announcements, Mr Gates outlined how his firm’s latest operating system Vista would be the tool to connect people.

“People want to do things with their content across multiple platforms,” he said.

He said the hardware and content had been put in place “and the key thing missing is the connections”.

As part of the keynote presentation, Mr Gates invited other Microsoft executives on to the stage to explain how products connected people.

Justin Hutchinson, group product manager, demonstrated a range of new features in Vista, many of which seemed designed to counter arguments from some observers that Apple was the home of creative computing.

IPTV pledge

New features unveiled included a document back-up tool called shadow copy, a new DVD photo gallery tool and a piece of software which corrects mistakes in digital photographs.

Robbie Bach, president of entertainment devices at Microsoft, revealed that the company had sold more than 10.4m Xbox 360s by the end of 2006.

TOMORROW’S WORLD BLOG

Bill’s speech talked of connected experiences, but it lacked a bit of zing

Darren Waters,
BBC News website tech editor

Read Darren’s piece in full
Mr Bach told delegates that Microsoft’s work in developing IPTV (internet protocol TV), which allows programmes to be delivered live or on demand over an internet connection, would soon come to Xbox 360 games consoles.

By the end of 2007 partner companies will be offering IPTV services to Xbox 360 owners, he said.

Mr Gates also unveiled a new product in conjunction with HP which lets people store all their data on a central device and access from any number of Windows-connected products, including the Zune portable music player, the Xbox 360, PCs and phones.

The Windows Home Server is a storage system which can hold more than one terabyte of data.

Last keynote speech

Photos, music and videos can be saved to the system and accessed from many other devices in the home and even remotely via the internet.

HP is launching the first product designed around Windows Home Server software, called the HP Media Smart Server.

A range of new PCs from third-party companies using Vista were unveiled at the show, including a white, round media centre PC from Sony designed for watching of movies and music playback in the living room and a touch screen PC from HP.

Mr Gates also confirmed that next year would see his last keynote speech at CES as he steps down as head of Microsoft.

He said he had offered to come back the following year but that he might “talk more about infectious diseases than software”, referring to his philanthropic work.
What Bill didn’t refer is how in the last decade ms has really flopped & got things arsedup!! Could spell the deathknell for ms as others may clamber for the op system production.
tata mick

Business suffers with vista problems

In reply to BIll hails digital decade

Windows Vista “causes problems through industry” says Tiscali

Phishing Trap Dear customer, you probably weren’t expecting this

By INQUIRER staff: Saturday 31 March 2007, 11:39

A READER HEARD from Tiscali that all may not be rosy for the world+dog because of incompatibilities caused by Vista.
The firm told its customers… oh to heck, here’s what it said below.

From noreply@uk.tiscali.com
Dear Customer,

Important: Windows Vista and your Tiscali service

Microsoft have launched a new operating system called Windows Vista. If you are thinking of upgrading your system to Vista, please read the important information below.

The introduction of Windows Vista has caused some problems throughout the industry. These are due due to incompatibility issues with other software. If you are upgrading to Vista there are scenarios where you may experience problems, such as being unable to connect to the Internet. This is due to incompatibility issues with your existing modem software and Vista.

Most other ISPs are experiencing the same difficulties, and Tiscali is working hard (along with our modem supplier) to ensure full compatibility with Vista. We expect to have a complete solution in the next few weeks. We suggest you wait until this is ready before purchasing Vista.

However, if you are still thinking of upgrading your PC to Windows Vista before that time we recommend you click on the link below to install the relevant new drivers for your modem to avoid being disconnected from the Internet.

Please check your modem to see if it is a SpeedTouch or a Sagem modem, and click the link below to download drivers and get advice on how to install them.

Get drivers and installation advice

vista the sheer arrogance

In reply to BIll hails digital decade

Vista – Arrogance & Stupidity

Microsoft Invades Accounting
Upgrading to Windows Vista has been banned by the U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT), the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST), the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), technology giant Texas Instruments and other corporations and government agencies (V1, V10, V11). These organizations are evaluating their options, but overseas it’s turning into a stampede to get out of Microsoft software (V15).

School districts in the U.S. are starting to move entirely to Linux rather suffer the cost of upgrading Windows. Examples are the Windsor Unified School District in Northern California and the Bexley, Ohio high school district. Schools making this move have been surprised how easy it is and how much money is saved. (V6, V8)

Leading computer maker HP is reporting “massive deals for Linux desktops” with corporate clients (V4). Runner-up computer maker and long time faithful Microsoft ally Dell has been overwhelmed by demand and has started developing Linux desktop preloads for their notebook and desktop computers (V9).

Even that great bastion of the status quo, the Wall Street Journal, has published an article under the title Linux Starts to Find Home on Desktops (Business Technology, 13 Mar 2007).

Small business and consumer demand for computers with Windows XP is very high, but Microsoft has moved swiftly to make sure they can’t get it. No sane person wants Vista, so Microsoft is making sure they have no choice.

It’s becoming clear people are going to be holding on to their XP machines as long as they can. Chip manufacturers in particular face a damaging glut of memory and CPU chips because the anticipated Vista upgrade demand isn’t materializing. One gigabyte of RAM memory is the practical minimum for Vista (except Home Basic which will run in 500 megabytes).

What went wrong? Basically, Vista was designed with almost no consideration for the needs of Microsoft’s customers. James Allchin, co-president of Microsoft’s Platform Products and Services Group wrote an internal memo saying that Microsoft had lost touch with customer needs and if he didn’t work there he’d buy an Apple Macintosh (V12). Allchin retired the day Vista shipped.

Vista and its companion programs, Office 2007 and Internet Explorer 7, offer precious little Windows users want beyond what’s in Windows XP, but plenty they don’t want.

A confusing new user interface. Vista actually reduces user productivity according to a consulting firm’s study (V7).

Blamed for so many security problems, Microsoft has placed security responsibility right where it doesn’t belong, squarely on the shoulders of the average user. Confusing security pop-up dialogs are so common users get used to just hitting “Yes” automatically to everything, including malware.

Most existing software is not compatible with Vista. You will have to purchase upgrades to almost all the software you run and many programs will never be upgraded to Vista.

It’s an exercise in frustration to try to upgrade an XP computer to Vista. Few Vista drivers are available except for new devices designed for Vista, and manufacturers don’t plan any.

Even many current printers don’t have Vista drivers, and many never will. Developing Vista drivers and getting them approved by Microsoft is just too expensive.

Vista is effectively a Windows price increase. Vista Home Basic, shipped with lower cost consumer market computers, is rather minimal, This often forces a $79 upgrade to Home Premium (equivalent to Windows XP Media Center) or Ultimate for $139. Vista’s built-in Anytime Upgrade handles that – have your credit card ready. Actually all versions are on the machine but must be “activated”.

Vista Activation is a hassle and failure prone, but Microsoft says they’ll be turning the screws down even tighter due to rampant piracy already taking place. This does little harm to the pirates, just to legitimate users (V5).

Vista Activation, should it fail or be aborted, phones home to Microsoft with enough details to identify your computer and possibly your location (V3).

Vista’s much ballyhooed security has already been shattered in various ways, and Microsoft’s One Care, intended to protect Vista from malware, has scored at the very bottom in independent tests of anti-malware programs (V2).

Microsoft’s draconian DRM (Digital Rights Management) features not only interfere with your enjoyment of entertainment media you have purchased, but force you to have a much more powerful and expensive machine just to achieve XP level performance (V14).

Windows Update is now mandatory. What’s wrong with that? You have no defense against patches that break other stuff. Worse, Microsoft has promised the media moguls they will cripple your computer if any DRM problems are found with your computer’s hardware or drivers – this by Windows Update, of course (V14).

Microsoft president Steve Ballmer said Vista was so good a service pack would not be needed. Service Pack 1 went into “critical” development even before Vista’s public release at the end of January. There are flaws aplenty.

Why did they do this? Most new features originally planned for Vista were dropped in favor of one: a draconian DRM (Digital Rights Management) scheme. See my editorial Vista – Broken by Design for the details. All other features were of lower priority and the needs of customers were disregarded if they conflicted with DRM.

Microsoft hopes to parlay secure DRM into a monopoly on distribution of so called “premium content”. Once they have lured the studios into the deal and established the monopoly they can dictate terms to the studios the way Apple dictated terms to the record companies based on the iPod success, but on a much larger scale.

Microsoft is depending on the unbounded greed of the media moguls to pull this off, but word is the moguls are starting to wonder if DRM is a good idea after all. It is causing them a lot of trouble, has done nothing to stop piracy, and has caused tremendous ill will and bad publicity.

Clearly ill will is of no concern to Microsoft. A recent patent filing reveals they have a whole lot more pain and expense planned for you in the future (V13).

What should Microsoft do? Their most basic mistake is “one size fits all”, holding that an entertainment device is equally suited for business. This is now obviously and painfully false. Microsoft should immediately develop a version of Vista for business with DRM completely stripped out. Perhaps they could disable playing of “premium content” entirely if they could do it cleanly – “premium content” has no place on business computers anyway.

Will Microsoft do this? No. Instead they will “stay the course”, increasing PR expenditures, working on ways to kill Windows XP to force Vista adoption, and ramping up their misinformation and FUD (Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt) attacks on Linux to “full rabid” shrillness.

What should you do? Every business should be taking a long hard look at moving to Linux. Yes, there will be costs involved, and employees will gripe initially, but those who have done this find an overall cost savings.

eComStation (formerly IBM’s OS/2) is another good alternative for general business, but lacking specialty applications. I find it hard to recommend Apple – applications are limited and it’s a closed proprietary environment run by a person of proven greed. It seems like jumping from the frying pan into the fire.

I understand that many small businesses are dependent on specialty software the publishers of which support only Windows – even if it’ll actually run on Linux. It’s time to start pressuring them for Linux versions and/or support. Remember, there’s worse to come (V13).

If you happen to be such a software publisher, it’s time for you to take a good hard look at producing Linux versions yourself. Microsoft has already killed a huge segment of the commercial software industry and you are on their list. Sooner or later it’s your turn.

– Andrew Grygus

Additional Reading
V1 – Information Week – Microsoft Suffers Latest Blow As NIST Bans Windows Vista
V2 – CNet News – Microsoft’s OneCare antivirus fails another test.
V3 – Inquirer – Windows piracy hunt tool phones home if aborted.
V4 – CRN ChannelWeb – HP Sees Huge Linux Desktop Deals.
V5 – Inquirer – OEM Vista crack gets round ‘phone home’ activation.
V6 – SearchOpenSource.com – Microsoft Windows ousted at California school district.
V7 – The Register – Vista makes people less efficient than XP did.
V8 – DesktopLinux.com – Ohio school district upgrades to Linux, saves $412K.
V9 – Direct2Dell – Dell to Expand Linux Options.
V10 – Information Week – FAA May Ditch Microsoft’s Windows Vista And Office For Google And Linux Combo.
V11 – Information Week – Microsoft Hit By U.S. DOT Ban On Windows Vista, Explorer 7, and Office 2007.
V12 – Seattle Post-Intelligencer – Jim Allchin’s Mac message: The full text.
V13 – ars technica – Microsoft files for patent on “modular operating system”.
V14 – Andrew Grygus – Vista – Broken by Design.
V15 – silicon.com – French MPs pick Ubuntu for Linux switch.
V16 – Microsoft – Microsoft Unveils Windows Vista Product Lineup
Well guys any ideas this basically sums it up
ta mick

i was right wasn’t i?

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

Ms still hasn’t fixed their os.
it still is crap!
ta mick

it’s now end of march 2007

In reply to i was right wasn’t i?

ms has not made much of an effort to fix their faulty vista op system.

ram chips problem with vista

In reply to it’s now end of march 2007

Faulty RAM issues surface in move from XP to Vista
Serdar Yegulalp, Contributor
01.30.2007
Rating: -4.00- (out of 5)

RSS FEEDS: Expert advice on Windows-based systems and hardware

With every new iteration of Windows comes?what else??new growing pains.
When I upgraded from Windows 95 to Windows 2000, hardly any of my existing hardware drivers made the cut; I had to do without a few key pieces of hardware (like my sound card) until the drivers were issued.

Now some people upgrading from Windows XP to Windows Vista are discovering that a machine that ran XP fine will throw up a Blue Screen of Death in Vista. The code for the BSOD is usually the type that comes up when faulty or cut-rate RAM is installed in the computer.

If it never happened in XP, why would this happen in Vista? Is Vista doing something differently with memory than XP (aside from needing more of it to install)? The short answer is yes, and the reason for this is somewhat surprising: Vista uses memory more completely than XP.

Vista uses a memory allocation technique called address space layout randomization as a pre-emptive defense against common exploits such as buffer overruns. Each time the system is booted, the OS loads its code into different segments of memory. This makes it more difficult for an attacker to predict where a given piece of code will be loaded (and thus subvert it). Many of the BSD OSes and some commercial varieties of Linux?Red Hat, for one?have had this feature or a variety of it for a long time.

This technique is no cure-all (nor is it intended to be one), but it does make it all the more difficult for an attacker to do this sort of thing casually, and it also helps provide a bit more defense for products that Microsoft is not directly responsible for.

But it means that a machine that ran XP without a problem but has a faulty RAM module somewhere may very well choke under Vista. This should be a sign that it’s time to replace the offending RAM, since it may very well have contributed to silent memory-corruption issues in XP (i.e., the odd random crash or application fault) without you ever knowing about it.

If you’re running Vista and you encounter something you feel to be a memory problem, there’s a way to test for this in Vista itself. From the Start menu, type mem in the Search box to bring up the Memory Diagnostics Tool. When run, it will reboot your computer and run a series of aggressive tests on your system memory, then report the results back to you. If there’s a problem with a particular memory module, it’s better to know about it and deal with it immediately than to let it linger silently.

Another memory-testing tool that comes in handy is MemTest86+, a utility which burns to a CD and boots as a standalone program. If you suspect a system has faulty RAM, you can set this up to run overnight and see if it turns anything up. It will run in an infinite loop by default, so you don’t need to do anything except boot it and let it go.

By the way, regarding ASLR, I should point out that it is only enabled for binaries that are specifically compiled to take advantage of it; Vista’s own system components are of course compiled to do so.

And on a personal note, I’d like to add that it’s issues like these that have compelled me to spend the extra money on memory (and systems) that support ECC?error checking and correction?as an extra level of defense against generic memory problems.

ta mick

faulty app error with vista

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

Faulty app Error loading Vista – 02-12-2007, 11:41 AM
permalink

——————————————————————————–

Monday, February 12, 2007 Application n Error Faulting application
setup.exe, version 6.0.6000.16386, faulting module kernel32.dll, version
5.1.2600.2945, fault address 0x00012a5b.

Hi, the error above is what I receive trying to install Vista….

Running WindowsSP SP2
Before I even purchased it I ran the vista upgrade advisor, only one issue
with my scanner,no biggie.
So I purchased Vista Home Premium upgrade
Backed up files I needed
Cleaned out any malware/adware using 2 different programs (none)
Ran a complete virus scan (none)
Deleted temporary files and cookies
Searched for tmp files and deleted them
Ran a window washer program
Reboot

After reboot I created a new restore point, disabled the virus program, put
the Vista cd in and got that message. I tried several times in both drive
bays.

more vista problems

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

The business case against migrating to Vista

Bernie Klinder, Contributor
27 Nov 2006 | SearchWinIT.com

There are many valid business reasons to migrate to Windows Vista, and Microsoft spends a lot of time and effort laying out the rationale for doing so as soon as it is available ? or as soon as humanly possible. What Microsoft won’t proactively say is that there are many legitimate reasons not to jump on the bandwagon and rush to migrate to Vista. In my previous article, The business case for Microsoft Windows Vista, I discussed some of the positive aspects of Vista. In this one, you’ll ..
don’t look back
ta mick.

more vista problemserrors

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

The business case against migrating to Vista

Bernie Klinder, Contributor
27 Nov 2006 | SearchWinIT.com

There are many valid business reasons to migrate to Windows Vista, and Microsoft spends a lot of time and effort laying out the rationale for doing so as soon as it is available ? or as soon as humanly possible. What Microsoft won’t proactively say is that there are many legitimate reasons not to jump on the bandwagon and rush to migrate to Vista. In my previous article, The business case for Microsoft Windows Vista, I discussed some of the positive aspects of Vista. In this one, you’ll ..
don’t look back
ta mick.

more vista problemserrors

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

Too stupid for a beta OS.

When you help someone like this they will just be back in a few more
days with more stupid question.

This group is being flooded with moronic questions:
How do I get a product key
Where do I get a driver for xyz hardware
Won’t install on my lapotop
Won’t install on my computer circa 1968
My crappy video card won’t run aero glass (the sky is falling)
My crappy sound card doesn’t work
Can’t figure out how to activate
Will my 16 bit program from 1992 run on Vista
How long can I use Vista Beta
How do I dual boot
I NEED STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS HOW TO GET XP BACK
cannot delete windows.old file

Ignore them, children should only listen to adult conversations, not
be incouraged to join in.

more vista problemserrors

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

The activation system is faulty. I’m not sure if the build is correct. When I
>try to activate (Its been 14 days) it gives me the following error:
>
>The following information was found for this error:
>
>Code:
> 0xC004E003
>
>Description:
> The software licensing service reported that license evaluation failed.
>

too stupid for comment

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

You know what? I found a bug that I’ve been trying to fix. I’ve done phone
activation, changing the product key, asked all my freinds, but yet, the same
errors,
code 0xC004E003 and Confirmation ID not valid for the installation ID. Did
you ever think that its a bug? I was directed here by the msdn online
concierge!

too stupid for comment

In reply to ram chips problem with vista

You know what? I found a bug that I’ve been trying to fix. I’ve done phone
When you help someone like this they will just be back in a few more
> days with more stupid question.
>
> This group is being flooded with moronic questions:
> How do I get a product key
> Where do I get a driver for xyz hardware
> Won’t install on my lapotop
> Won’t install on my computer circa 1968
> My crappy video card won’t run aero glass (the sky is falling)
> My crappy sound card doesn’t work
> Can’t figure out how to activate
> Will my 16 bit program from 1992 run on Vista
> How long can I use Vista Beta
> How do I dual boot
> I NEED STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS HOW TO GET XP BACK
> cannot delete windows.old fil

still right

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

i’m still right no one i’ve met are ready to ditch their op system & vista still sux!
ta mick

Your still wrong

In reply to still right

Right now I’m using Vista as my main OS. I also know of a few 100’s thosands of others doing the same thing. Of course you know that as I have told you this before.
Mike

just like giving candy to a child!All you can say is i’m wrong

In reply to Your still wrong

The simple truth is you are all so easily pleased with the crap that’s spewed from ms.On a recent trip overseas Bill Gates was asked on when will vista be finally released he stated that he did’nt know.The whole thing has been a giant coverup of the major problems ms has been having.At the moment people like me who have taken time to test ms vista crap rc1
have been ex[periencing countless freezups & equipment malfunctions.This non commital of ms spells disaster & trouble.
ta mick

the fact is that ms admits it got it wrong

In reply to Your still wrong

I’m sorry, but to defend Microsoft here isn’t right. They’ve acknowledge that they didn’t do things right. They’ve acknowledge that they aren’t where they want to be. VS.NET is plagued with the same slow release problems – though it’s something we’ve been told is going to improve (remember when we didn’t even know there was going to be a major fix to VS 2005/.NET 2.0?)
Microsoft quotes:

“… we will never have a gap between Windows releases as long as the one between XP and Windows Vista; count on it.” (http://dotnet.sys-con.com/read/246707.htm)

“We tried to incubate too many new innovations and integrate them simultaneously, as opposed to letting them bake and then integrating them, which is essentially where we wound up.”

“We’ll never again do a Windows update this big,”

(http://www.informationweek.com/software/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=191600952)

I could find a lot more…especially on blogs.msdn.com or other microsoft-like blogs (mini-microsoft).
Well guys with ms stooge michael accepts everything that ms gives him without question even in the face that vista is & will be a crap system he can’t accept the inevitable.Michael we know you are a
stooge for MS$$$$
ta mick

But by reading the whole paragraph instead of just a sentence and putting

In reply to the fact is that ms admits it got it wrong

Your view on it always proves you wrong-this is from where you took the statement from
“Windows Vista, IE 7, Office 2007: These are big releases. You could say in Vista’s case a long time in the making, if you want to, and I think that’s probably a fair statement, a long time in the making, but absolutely a blockbuster release. I think it’s probably important for me to tell our partners to rest assured we will never have a gap between Windows releases as long as the one between XP and Windows Vista; count on it.”

“I could go through the history of how we got here; just count on it, we will never have this kind of gap again. But what we have is absolutely a phenomenal set of products, and frankly really together the whole is bigger than the sum of the parts.”
Mick you need to add the whole thing not just what you want to see.
Ta,Mike

mike at the moment current expose is that vista is not strong enough

In reply to the fact is that ms admits it got it wrong

to cope with malware.This has been proven in testing labs & out on the field that unlike xp, vista is pretty weak when dealing
with malware.Whil’st this has been presented to ms many times they have no intention to strenghthen the kernel in time for release as it would waste more time and money.This one has been left on the backburner so to speak.Ms is not consulting with anyone thank you.
ta mick

i was right & you were wrong as you have not done your homework

In reply to Your still wrong

despite you being a tester you havent tested
vista like you should.The results speak for themselves evidence that i was right,
ta mick

Not tested right -let’s see

In reply to i was right & you were wrong as you have not done your homework

Vista runs 24/7-I have recorded tv shows/movies while burning a movie to dvd. Using a word processor and downloading off the net-all at the same time with no problems.
How’s that for testing. I do this nearly everyday.
Mike

well michael you seem to know evertything vol109

In reply to i was right & you were wrong as you have not done your homework

current news on vista is thatit is not good enough or better than xp:
Vista is here!or is it???from RAN ONE BUILDING BETTER BUSINESS VALUE!!!

The highly anticipated Microsoft Vista has been getting IT professionals, reviewers and computer geeks hot under the collar since it was a mere babe in Microsoft?s womb. After a 5-year development cycle (one of the longest in Windows? 20+ year history), and after many false alarms, Vista has finally arrived − available to businesses on November 30. read on

Why might you buy?
Aside from nifty tricks and slick good looks, Vista lists amongst its new benefits for businesses better, more efficient search functionality, connectivity improvements designed for a mobile workforce and reduced deployment/installation costs.

But the big one, the real draw card for most businesses is likely to be the improved security. The operating system has been designed to shut out spy ware, introducing important changes at the heart of the operating system, as well as to Internet Explorer, and include Windows Defender, an anti-spy ware tool.Security with vista is a huge joke!!

Reasons to cool your heels
Foremost, obviously, cost.
Estimated US pricing information is as follows:

Windows Vista Home Basic: $199

Windows Vista Home Premium: $239

Windows Vista Business: $299

Windows Vista Ultimate: $399
too expensive fior an upgrade

Furthermore almost any major upgrade or new operating system has hardware and software implications, and Vista is no different. Running basic Windows Vista requires a computer with a minimum of a 800MHz processor and 512 MB of system memory. To use Windows Aero, which features a much more sophisticated graphical interface (i.e., it?s a whole lot prettier), will require higher specs again. To access the system?s full range of tools and features will, for most, mean upgrading hardware, raising the upfront Vista total-cost-of-ownership substantially.

Bugs and compatibility
During its years of development there has been, and is, ongoing testing. However it is inevitable that there will still be a few bugs here and there to be discovered and eliminated. Whole lot more than meets the eye!!

For businesses that make a gradual move, hosting both XP and Vista machines, it?s possible there may be interoperability issues that weren?t discovered in the testing. Compatibility is likely to be a serious issue if you are using software that is custom-made or no longer supported. Well i thought compatibility was the biggest issue & it still is!!
Despite the hype, the impact on businesses will depend largely on the nature of the enterprise and, for the majority, there may be no need for immediate action: delayed action may even be the appropriate response. Whether this is the case or not, it is perhaps a timely point at which to consider how forward?looking and strategic your organization is in terms of emerging technologies and IT generally. Exactly what i have been saying all along!!
ta mick

what testing/eh well michael here it is:

In reply to i was right & you were wrong as you have not done your homework

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta mick

no micheal you wrong as i have the testing on my side

In reply to Your still wrong

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta ta mick

So WHAT???All the bench marks show is XP is only marginally

In reply to no micheal you wrong as i have the testing on my side

faster. As I have said before Vista will seem to a non-gamer as running at the same speed. Also some of the benchmarks show Vista as faster than XP.
Mike

So WHAT???All the bench marks show is XP is only marginally

In reply to no micheal you wrong as i have the testing on my side

faster than Vista. In fact some of the benchmarks show Vista is faster, but so what-only gamers will really see a differance in speed.
gsaravin you need another way to show that VIsta is crap-this does not work.
Mike

So Why?

In reply to no micheal you wrong as i have the testing on my side

If it appears that there is no great advantage to Vista in speed OR reliability why waste the time or the money to buy one. If XP is stabile and reliable, always working well, of what possible reason could one have of changing what works. As the old saying goes if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

So Why?

In reply to no micheal you wrong as i have the testing on my side

If it appears that there is no great advantage to Vista in speed OR reliability why waste the time or the money to buy one. If XP is stabile and reliable, always working well, of what possible reason could one have of changing what works. As the old saying goes if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

still right

In reply to Your still wrong

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

yep still right
mick

obviously you have gone into hibernation

In reply to Your still wrong

thanks for your “continued” contribution.
Keep up the good work i’m proud of you son.Mustn’t use up the reserve fat we need it for the spring time!
ta mick

you are either wrong or right

In reply to Your still wrong

in the final analisys ms is the one who got it al wrong!
ta mick
we don’t get anything but headaches from ms.

oj you are wrong (ostrich Jerk)

In reply to Your still wrong

yes oj you are wrong &don’t know what you are talking about. stick your head in the sand again!!

you are using or was using the dud os

In reply to Your still wrong

& you fail to admit that you have gone back to xp

OJ you are using or was using the dud os

In reply to Your still wrong

& you fail to admit that you have gone back to xp

ye gullible people will use any free beta system

In reply to Your still wrong

do they realise it’s crap that’s another story!
they probably don’t have the smarts to figure it all out.
ta mick

well oj i’m still right & you are totally wrong

In reply to Your still wrong

you have done no testing,ie run various benchmark testing etc I have currently found that vista is at least 10% slower than XP.Or xp is faster than vista by 10%%
do you comprehend that is a waste of time.
Testing has shown that vista is a poor performer in gaming too.
ta mick

well well what a load of crap vista is

In reply to Your still wrong

its 22 % slower than xp.

taken from anandtech.com this article cofirms

In reply to still right

what aflop 64 bit is telling people that it’s ready when it’s not.
Vista x64

One of the major changes on paper for Vista is that x64 now becomes an equal platform with the x86 version, as using the Vista compatibility logo on any hardware or software requires that the item in question works under both the x86 and x64 versions, but the reality of the situation is not as rosy. Along with the other limitations of the OEM versions we listed above, only the retail versions of Vista are shipping with x64 and x86 together; the OEM versions are only sold in an either/or fashion: you can either get the x64 or x86 version, but not both at once. It’s possible that this will be trivially easy to work around, however it’s something that should be kept in mind if you’re purchasing an OEM copy.

As for how well the x64 versions of Vista work, in our first article we called x64 the black sheep of the Vista family, as it was clearly behind the x86 version in terms of compatibility and performance. While we had hoped that Microsoft would remove the gap between the two versions, in our testing this has not completely been the case. Vista x64 is still the product of all the compatibility problems of Vista with all the compatibility problems of a still-young 64-bit platform.

This is not to say that Vista x64 hasn’t improved; if anything it has improved more between Beta 2 and now than the x86 version did, if only by virtue of having more ground to cover. The performance gap we initially saw between the x86 and x64 versions has dissolved away in most cases, so x64 no longer means taking an immediate performance hit in benchmarks. However we can’t shake the feeling of Vista x64 still being slower, even if the benchmarks don’t show it. We’ve had multiple editors use multiple machines, and general performance in particular just feels slower. At this point we still are unsure why this is, but it’s a very real condition that hurts Vista x64.

On the positive side, driver support for the x64 version seems to be about as good as the x86 version (although more testing will be required to completely confirm this). The biggest problem as far as support goes is the applications. Not every application is happy working under the Windows-on-Windows (WoW) compatibility environment for 32-bit applications, and this is on top of the applications that don’t work with Vista period. There are very few major applications available with x64 binaries, so without 64-bit applications everything still remains in the 32-bit world for now. Furthermore, as we will also see in our graphics tests, having a 64-bit application doesn’t necessarily mean we won’t see any performance issues.

At this point Vista x64 is certainly usable if you need it, but we wouldn’t recommend it unless you have a specific reason to go that route (i.e. applications that can use more memory). Except in a few cases where 64-bit code is clearly faster, the primary purpose for Vista x64’s existence is to resolve the problems of 32-bit addressing space, and we’re just not at the point yet where even most enthusiasts are pushing that limit. Once applications begin to push the 2GB addressing space limitation of Win32 (something we expect to hit very soon with games) or total systems need more than 4GB of RAM, then Vista x64 in its current incarnation would be a good choice. In the meantime, Vista x64 shouldn’t be used until it’s needed or SP1 comes out – whichever comes first. The black sheep isn’t ready to rejoin the flock quite yet.
I don’t think so it needs to get it’s 32 bit in order & maybe later.
My God what a complete flop.
ta mick

tests confirm that i was right about vista network performance

In reply to taken from anandtech.com this article cofirms

once again what a flop:

Networking Benchmarks

Just to get a quick idea of what these new features can do, we ran our usual networking benchmark suite on a pair of ASUS P5B-Deluxe motherboards using both the on-board PCI and PCIe connected gigabit network controllers (Marvell 88E8056 and 88E8001 respectively). We used two tests for this, a multiple small file transfer test consisting of about 450 files totaling 600MB, and a large file transfer test consisting of a pair of ISO images totaling 3GB. In order to keep the load on our D-Link Gamer Lounge router consistent, we also had the WMV-HD version of Terminator 3 streaming in the background. We tested Windows XP SP2 for a base score, followed by Vista with Compound TCP switched on and off.

Unfortunately for Vista, neither test is particularly favorable. Compared to XP when Compound TCP is disabled, Vista is anywhere between 25% and 50% slower than XP in terms of the total time required for these tests. Without the ability to separate Vista’s networking stack from the drivers for our NICs, it’s impossible to tell if this slowdown is the fault of the networking stack being worse for this situation, or if the Vista drivers for this line of Marvell NICs are not quite as tuned, so as a comparison to XP this test is inconclusive. Either way, for this particular setup Vista ends up being slower at file transfers than XP.

The one bright spot however is that when enabled, Compound TCP is clearly having some effect even on our low-latency network. The 5% or so boost in Vista’s low scores won’t bring it back above XP, but it clearly proves that Compound TCP does have a real-world effect on performance.
ta mick

article confirms vista is a waste at this time

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

Bookmark With Del.icio.us
Digg This Article
Search With Technorati
Print This Article Date: January 25, 2007
Author(s): Rob Williams

Does performance suck on Vista when compared to XP? That’s what I was set out to find out. I was worried at first, since the performance in Beta 2 was quite bad. While there is indeed a performance decrease, it’s quite minimal as you’ll find out.

Last summer, I wrote an article entitled “Windows Vista Beta 2 Performance Reports” which attracted a lot of attention. In fact, it proved to be our second most popular article of 2006, so it’s clear that people who are looking to purchase Vista truly care about whether or not they will lose a good deal of performance when making the move.

Well, that article was more for fun since it was indeed based on a beta operating system. I noted there that when the RTM became available, I would revisit all of the benchmarks mentioned there and come up with a more appropriate conclusion. I received a lot of criticism for that article, but most people didn’t seem to see the “Beta 2” in the title. I was completely aware that the performance seen there did not reflect the actual performance differences in the final release.

I will admit one thing, the RTM is -far- superior to Beta 2… there is no comparison. I have been using Vista Ultimate RTM full time on my Windows rig for over two months and haven’t run into any serious problems, except for a few of my favorite applications that still do not function. I’ve found the system to be much more stable overall and speedier as well. It still has lingering issues, but I mention most of those in my rant article from this past Tuesday.

Back to performance. This article will not go into depth like the other one did. In fact, it will be split into two articles. There is a gaming performance article on the way, but we are still awaiting final drivers from NVIDIA before proceeding with it.

Testing Overview & Methodology

For our performance testing today, I will be using my Intel dual-core rig. The goal of the article is to show the direct performance decrease you will experience when making the move. Take note though, that the difference on your system may vary from my results, especially if you are using an older machine. I chose to use a “midstream” PC to benchmark with, as most people reading this may have a similar setup. If you use a computer that’s more than 2 years old, with a small GPU or one that has only 1GB of ram, you can expect Vista to not run that seamlessly.

I will be comparing the performance from a freshly formatted machine with both an XP Professional and Vista Ultimate installation. I will be using a variety of synthetic benchmarks and also real world benchmarks that touch on multi-media tasks. All tests are performed on machines that are -not- altered for the best performance. Normally when we benchmark memory or a CPU, we disable many services and close needless programs before doing so. This will not be done here, as realistically, this is not what people do prior to crunching a video file or playing a game. No post-install third party applications will be left running though… just default system services.

Testing System
Intel E6300 Dual Core @ 1.866GHz
ASUS P5N-E SLI 0307 BIOS
Corsair 2GB PC2-9136 @ DDR2-1066 4-4-4-12
ASUS EN7900GT 256MB
Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 320GB
Corsair HX620W Power Supply
Corsair Nautilus 500 Water Cooling
LG 18x DVD-Burner
D-Link WiFi Card
NZXT Apollo Case
Prior to benchmarking, the system is “cleaned” up. Needless scattered files on the desktop are removed, and post-install applications are closed down if they are running in the background.

Throughout all of these charts, you will see many deltas. These symbolize the advantage or disadvantage Vista Ultimate has over XP.

SANDRA 2007

First up is SANDRA, one of my favorite benchmarks.

XP Professional
Sandra Arithmetic
MIPS: 17116
MFLOPS: 11906
Sandra Multi-Media
Int: 102632
Float: 55427
Sandra File Systems
Avg. Read: 63MB/s
Latency: 8ms
Sandra Memory
Int: 5773
Float: 5775
Vista Ultimate
Sandra Arithmetic
MIPS: 17037
MFLOPS: 11905
Sandra Multi-Media
Int: 102281
Float: 55338
Sandra File Systems
Avg. Read: 61MB/s
Latency: 7ms
Sandra Memory
Int: 5782
Float: 5717
.
Delta
– 0.46%
– 0.008%
Delta
– 0.34%
– 0.16%
Delta
– 3.28%
+ 14.8%
Delta
+ 0.16%
– 0.66%

There’s very little difference here so far… less than 1% all around.

Cinebench, Sciencemark, 3D Mark 06

The same goes for here with Cinebench, but I started to see even larger differences with Sciencemark where the delta was closer to 3.5%. Super Pi also proved 19 seconds slower under Vista.

XP Professional
Cinebench 2003
Single Thread: 312
Multi-Thread: 581
Sciencemark 2 (Lower is Better)
Mol Dyn: 83.72s
Cipher: 15.39s
3D Mark 06
4907
Super Pi
32 Million: 25m 0s
Vista Ultimate
Cinebench 2003
Single Thread: 312
Multi-Thread: 579
Sciencemark 2 (Lower is Better)
Mol Dyn: 86.58s
Cipher: 16.06s
3D Mark 06
4693
Super Pi
32 Million: 25m 19s
.
Delta
– 0.00%
– 0.34%
Delta
– 3.41%
– 4.35%
Delta
– 4.56%
Delta
– 1.27%

The 3D Mark score is about 300 points lower on Vista, but please don’t take that result too seriously at this point. NVIDIA is working around the clock on final Vista drivers, so the performance may improve when they are finally out the door.

Hard Drive Benchmarks

Overall with the disk access benchmarks, the only tests that had a rather large differences was with the burst and minimum speed tests. In both HD Tach and HD Tune, the Avg. MB/s proved no different at all, which is good to see.

XP Professional
HD Tach
Burst Read: 134.5MB/s
Avg. Read: 66.2MB/s
Latency: 13.4ms
HD Tune
Min: 30.6MB/s
Avg: 62.3MB/s
Max: 76.3MB/s
Latency: 13.4ms
CPU Usage: 2.6%
Vista Ultimate
HD Tach
Burst Read: 120.7MB/s
Avg. Read: 66.2MB/s
Latency: 13.4ms
HD Tune
Min: 36.6MB/s
Avg: 62.3MB/s
Max: 76.5MB/s
Latency: 13.5ms
CPU Usage: 7.7%
.
Delta
– 11.43%
– 0.00%
– 0.00%
Delta
+ 19.6%
– 0.00%
+ 0.26%
– 0.74%
N/A

The only thing that stands out to me here is the fact that HD Tune required over 5% more CPU power during usage. This could be the result of Vista forcing a Windows XP program to function. By default, it did not function in Vista, but adjusting the compatibility fixed everything.

Real World Benchmarks

For some light real world testing, I chose a few programs to conduct multi-media recoding. For Sony Vegas, I took a 50MB .divx file, recoded it to a high-definition profile and added a watermark. For Nero Record, I took a DVD from Volume 4 of the Family Guy collection and recoded it to fit on a backup sized DVD (4.5GB). Lastly, for LAME, I first ripped Voodoo & Serano: Cold Blood to a single .WAV file. Then I ran than through a “lame -b 320 vns.wav” command.

XP Professional
Multi-Media Recode (Lower is Better)
Sony Vegas: 18m 38s
Nero Recode: 9m 56s
LAME Recode: 3m 59s
Vista Ultimate
Multi-Media Recode (Lower is Better)
Sony Vegas: 18m 21s
Nero Recode: 10m 31s
LAME Recode: 4m 07s
.
Delta
+ 1.5%
– 5.87%
– 3.34%

Interestingly enough, Vegas proved a touch better under Vista, but it fell short with the other two tests.

Final Thoughts

I don’t necessarily recommend Vista to anyone at this point in time, simply because it’s not needed. In the two months that I’ve been using it full time on my Windows machine, I’ve run into too many weird bugs that I would have liked to have avoided. This ranges from applications not working, quirky UI glitches or hardware drivers not working as well as they should.

That aside though, it’s no secret that many out there are dying to install it on their system, which is fine. As we have seen from the performance results above, should you stick with XP to save on performance? Hardly… there was not much of a difference between XP and Vista overall, I’m actually quite impressed.

As I mentioned earlier though, if you run an older machine, you probably will see a greater slowdown than I did. My test rig consisted of a nice processor, midstream GPU and 2GB of ram. If you run a last-gen CPU, low-end GPU and 1GB of ram, chances are good that you will have a sluggish running system.

What should you take away from this article? The fact that Vista actually isn’t -that- bad performance wise, if you have a decent machine. It’s leaps and bounds above the performance I saw in Beta 2, so I have no major complaints. In the months to come, companies should be continually releasing more Vista-friendly drivers, so the stability/performance side of things should get even better.I thought it was better??
ta mick

Tom’s hardware.com support what i have stated all

In reply to article confirms vista is a waste at this time

Windows XP vs. Vista: The Benchmark Rundown
Patrick Schmid, Achim Roos
January 29, 2007 09:16

Is Windows Vista Faster Than XP?
Our Windows Vista coverage began with a hands-on diary by MobilityGuru’s Barry Gerber, followed by an assessment of gameplay under Windows Vista by graphics presidente Darren Polkowski, as well as a complete feature rundown of Vista. Barry took the new operating system and its look & feel with a grain of salt, while Darren was disappointed because OpenGL support was dropped along the way, meaning that Windows Vista currently offers horrible performance for graphics applications utilizing the Open Graphics Library.

We are sure that mainstream users will appreciate the improved usability of Windows Vista, and the average office/multimedia user will likely never notice the lack of OpenGL. However, a chapter on the overall performance of Windows Vista requires more dedication. In particular, two things require an in-depth analysis:

Basic Windows Vista Performance
How does Windows Vista perform compared to Windows XP? Will applications execute equally quickly, or will they even run slower due to the new features and the AeroGlass interface?
Windows Vista Performance Enhancements
With SuperFetch and ReadyBoost, Windows Vista introduces two features to make use of today’s technology in order to improve the user experience. This means that more application data should be actively cached into all available memory (SuperFetch), whether that is physical RAM or a USB Flash memory device (ReadyBoost). Microsoft’s goal was to create balanced performance by removing delays in everyday work.
This article deals with basic application execution under Windows Vista Enterprise, which is representative of the other editions. We put together a high-end test system and performed a comprehensive benchmark session both with Windows XP Professional and with Windows Vista Enterprise to see if there are differences. And indeed, we found that there are some…

Software And Vista
Although the main Windows Vista core has undergone lot of modifications, many of your applications will work with Vista. There is, however, no guarantee. You should definitely try any essential software on Windows before you upgrade.

Process scheduling and thread pooling have been improved in Vista; a deadlock protection mechanism and hardware partitioning for virtualization support were added, together with many more features.

We tried lots of different programs under Windows Vista Enterprise, and came up with a list of software that definitely works.

Games
Call of Duty 2
Far Cry
F.E.A.R.
Unreal Tournament 2004
Applications
Adobe Acrobat 8
Adobe Photoshop CS2
Autodesk 3DSMax 8.0
AutoGK 2.4
Hamachi
KeePass 1.06
LAME MP3 Encoder
MainConcept H.264 Encoder
Miranda Messager 0.5.1
Microsoft Office 2003
Microsoft Office System 2007
Mozilla Firefox 2.0.0.1
Mozilla Thunderbird 1.5.0.9
Nokia PC Suite 6.82.22.0
Ogg Vorbis 1.1.2
OpenOffice 2.1
Picasa 2
Putty
Skype 2.5.x and 3.0
SmartFTP 2.0
Sungard Adaptive Credit Risk Calculation 3.0
SonyEricsson PC Suite 1.30.82
SQLyog 5.22
Symantec AntiVirus 10.2.0.224
UltraEdit 32 12.10
WinRAR 3.70
XviD 1.2.0
Benchmarks
3DMark 06
Cinebench
PCMark05 Pro
SiSoft Sandra 2007
SPECviewperf 9.03
In other cases there were some issues.

We found Vista updates for the Futuremark benchmark programs 3DMark and PCMark, as well as the popular data compression tool WinRAR. Lots of video-related software such as DivX could no longer be installed; new versions are required. The popular audio player WinAMP 5.32 throws up an error at startup, yet it works properly. Quake IV can still be executed, but the installation program did not work. Applications that run their own memory management won’t benefit from Vista’s SuperFetch function. For example, Adobe Photoshop takes care of creating a temporary work file every time it launches – Vista has no access to this process and cannot speed it up.

There are some types of software that you should only use if they have been specifically designed for Windows Vista: firewalls, anti-spyware and anti-virus software needs to be Vista-Ready.
ta mick

well definitely right there all along!

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

with so many people staying with xp you would wonder what all the who ha with vista was about.
But if anything like the response in this thread with lame responses from people like
oj (ostrich jerk) michael.& poor responses like Hal 9000 & then going into hibernation.
I would have expected a more healthy debate.
I just rely on the testing of what i have done & others which is in agreement with my opinion.
If anyone likes to make a healthy response rather than poo poo this thread.
Well i have been right all allong!
ta mick

well this proves if anything that i was right!

In reply to vista won’t make the mark

Microsoft says ‘EU version’ of Windows Vista a dudBy Paul McDougall 22 May 2007 14:12 AEST Operating Systems A A A

Company officials say no PC manufacturers have chosen to license the special editions of its operating systems, which are available only in Europe, that lack the Windows Media Player media playback software.

A senior Microsoft official said the company has had few takers for modified versions of its Windows operating systems built to conform to European competition requirements. David Heiner, Microsoft’s deputy general counsel, said “not a single PC manufacturer has chosen to license” the special editions of its operating systems, which are available only in Europe.

The software, Windows XP N and Windows Vista N, lacks the Windows Media Player media playback software, which ordinarily is integrated into Microsoft’s operating systems.

EU regulators ordered Microsoft to unbundle Media Player from some versions of Windows available for sale in Europe after charging that the bundling gave the company an unfair advantage over media player products created by third-party developers. advertisement

Microsoft, however, was allowed to offer standard editions of Windows for sale in Europe alongside the N editions, allowing consumers to choose between the two.

Speaking in March to officials at the US Federal Trade Commission, Heiner said European consumers have opted en masse for the full versions of Windows. The N versions, he said, “sit on the shelf.”

“PC manufacturers and consumers in Europe can now choose to get Windows with or without its media playback functionality. They have chosen the full-featured version of Windows, as might be expected,” said Heiner, according to a transcript of his remarks obtained by InformationWeek.

Heiner was speaking to FTC officials to urge them to adopt anti-monopoly measures that promote competition rather than restrict consumer choice.

He said Microsoft’s consent decree with monopoly watchdogs at the Department of Justice is a good example of the former. As a result of the deal, he said, “new Windows PCs come loaded up with software from Microsoft’s competitors” without limiting consumer access to Microsoft’s own products.” By contrast, the EU’s decision to order Microsoft to strip out its own media player technology from some versions of Windows has hurt both Microsoft and its European customers, Heiner said.

“Costs have been imposed, but there is little apparent benefit for anyone,” he said.

Microsoft continues to butt heads with European regulators over the prices it charges to competitors for interoperability protocols for file and print servers.

Microsoft last month dodged – at least temporarily – European Union fines of up to US$4 million (A$4.8 million) per day by submitting an 11th-hour response to allegations that it continues to overcharge rivals for the tools they need to make their products compatible with the Windows operating system.

The company told the EU that it needs “greater clarity on what prices the commission wants us to charge” and called for more talks on the issue, according to a statement released last month by the software maker.

In his comments to the FTC, Heiner blasted the EU for inserting itself into talks between Microsoft and third-party product manufacturers.

“Whether firms choose to take a license, and what kind of products they build with those licenses,” Heiner said, “is of course entirely up to them and outside the control of either Microsoft or any antitrust agency.”
I know i’m right because i spoke the truth!

vista banned

In reply to well this proves if anything that i was right!

DOT bans Vista upgrades By Staff writers, TechWeb 5 March 2007 08:06 AEST Operating Systems A A A

CIO cites cost and compatibility issues.

Citing concerns about cost and system compatibility, the CIO of the US federal Department of Transportation has put a hold on DOT upgrades to Microsoft’s Windows Vista operating system, Internet Explorer 7, and Office 2007.

The agency has an “indefinite moratorium” on upgrades because “there appears to be no compelling technical or business case for upgrading,” CIO Daniel Mintz says in a 19 January staff memo obtained by InformationWeek. In addition, there are “specific reasons not to upgrade,” he says, referring to compatibility with software apps, upgrade costs, and an upcoming move to a new headquarters. The ban applies to 15,000 DOT computer users who now use Windows XP Professional. The memo indicates that a similar ban is in effect at the Federal Aviation Administration, which has 45,000 desktop users.

ms has stuffed it again

In reply to vista banned

Microsoft: OneCare should not have been rolled out
Tom Espiner, ZDNet UK

17 March 2007 09:07 AM

Microsoft has said that its Live OneCare security suite has “a problem” with the underlying antivirus code, and admitted that security is just “a little part of Microsoft”.

Speaking to our sister site ZDNet UK exclusively at the CeBIT show in Hanover, a senior manager for the software giant said that its consumer security product is far from perfect and that pieces are actually “missing”.

OneCare has been dogged by controversy since its launch last May. Signs that the software was not up to scratch came earlier this month when OneCare failed to achieve certification in an independent test of security products. Shortly before that, it emerged that the product did not sufficiently protect users of Microsoft’s Vista operating system against malware.

But the latest and most serious problems arose in March this year after the product mistakenly quarantined and even deleted Outlook and Outlook Express files for the second time.

Microsoft apologised for the problems and has issued an update that has now been automatically pushed out to OneCare customers, to halt the false positive identification as malware of Outlook .pst and Outlook Express .dbx files.

Asked about these problems, Arno Edelmann, Microsoft’s European business security product manager, told ZDNet UK last week that the code itself has pieces missing.

“Usually Microsoft doesn’t develop products, we buy products. It’s not a bad product, but bits and pieces are missing,” said Edelmann.

The problem lies with a core technology of OneCare, the GeCAD antivirus code, and how it interacts with Microsoft mailservers. According to Edelmann, the Microsoft updates and mailserver infrastructure do not harmonise.

“It’s a problem with the updates, and it’s a problem with the implementation,” said Edelmann.

If mail is received from a server running Exchange 2007, users are unlikely to encounter problems. However, if mail is received from servers running Exchange 2000 or 2003, the likelihood of quarantining is high, said Edelmann.

“OneCare is a new product — they shouldn’t have rolled it out when they did, but they’re fixing the problems now,” said Edelmann.

According to the security manager, security is only a small part of what Microsoft does.

“Microsoft is not a security company. Security is important, but it’s just a little part of Microsoft,” said Edelmann.

Security vendor Kaspersky said that it was not acceptable for two Microsoft products — such as OneCare and Exchange 2007 — to be incompatible, especially as Microsoft has market dominance.

“All in all it’s a bad thing,” said Eugene Kaspersky, the founder of the company. “It’s not acceptable for Microsoft products to do that. Microsoft dominates the market. If they do that it creates a big noise, many affected people, and happy lawyers.”

This is not the first time Microsoft has had a problem with OneCare and Outlook. In January OneCare also erroneously quarantined Outlook files. However, Kaspersky said that although the problems then and now were the same, the cause of the problems in January was different.

“They fixed the first false positive, and now they have the next one,” said Kaspersky.

Kaspersky said that false positives are not just a problem for Microsoft, but for the whole antivirus industry. He said that about one percent of Kaspersky records were false positives, but they were almost totally stopped by the company’s test robots. He added, however, that sometimes false positives are released by Kaspersky

spanner in the works

In reply to ms has stuffed it again

A spanner in search engines
SEARCH advertisers will need to quickly find a way around Microsoft’s recently launched Vista if they don’t want their messages being bypassed.

Vista’s inbuilt search engine, with its ability to cut out the likes of Google and Yahoo, could be a serious problem, the head of internet search advertising specialist DoubleClick, Rick Bruner, told yesterday’s ad:tech conference in Sydney.

Mr Bruner also said it was still difficult to read what impact the emergence of new operating systems, social networking and online videos would have on internet advertising.

“It is too early to say whether these things are going to be an interesting development for the future or if they are just a passing fad and are going to go away,” he said.

“I think some aspects may be faddish, but for example consumer generated advertising is something some advertisers have reached out for in the last year, getting consumers to create ads for them. It was fun and funky, but I don’t see it being around in five years

pirates offer vista

In reply to ms has stuffed it again

Pirates quick to offer Vista
AS MICROSOFT kicked off the global launch of its long-awaited Windows Vista, the software giant’s new operating system also hit the streets of China – in pirated form.

In an electronic market in the southern Chinese city of Shenzhen, scores of sellers were offering the brand new software for as little as 10 yuan ($1.66), along with Microsoft Office, anti-virus software and others.

The sellers said Vista was available several weeks before its launch, although they would not say how they got hold of the version.

Described as the “official version of the new generation operating system” on its cover, the pirated copy offered an identification code at the back of the disk for downloading the software

big problems

In reply to ms has stuffed it again

Apple?s iBook G4 may have ?serious consequences worldwide? says Danish CCB
Written by Darren Yates
Tuesday, 08 May 2007

Danish Consumer Complaints Board finds power failures due to design fault, orders Apple to correct. More to come worldwide?

After discovering faulty solder joints within Apple?s iBook G4 notebook computers, the Danish Consumer Complaints Board says the discovery of the design fault could have serious consequences for Apple worldwide.

The problem started when several Danish users of the iBook G4 had made complaints, finding the screen going blank after little more than a year?s use.

While processing the complaints, Danish researchers had found iBook G4 notebooks around the world suffering the same problem. The Danish CCB?s suspicions were aroused at this point and decided that these notebooks deserved some in-depth examination.

During that examination by independent electronics lab, Delta, they discovered that several solder joints around a voltage regulator (a device designed to set a particular voltage) were of poor enough quality to deteriorate over time and cause the fault.

“It is a bit like a person dying a little bit every time he breathes because the cells break down. In the same way, the computer dies a little every time you turn it on and off”, says Frederik Boesgaard Navne, the Consumer Complaints Board lawyer who has been dealing with these cases.

The faults were discovered using a combination of microscopy and X-ray microscopy around various components and solder joints.

Consumers around the world had developed creative solutions such as placing a cardboard tubing or ?shim? around certain parts of the notebook (http://www.coreyarnold.org/ibook/). While this process is certainly not recommended, it is often a commonly used solution to similar problems where solder joints are the fault.

Apple had continued to deny that any problems were the result of design faults and that the notebooks in question were outside of Apple?s one-year warranty and were therefore not covered anyway.

However, armed with the new evidence, the CCB has ordered Apple to make repairs to all Danish iBook G4 notebooks exhibiting this fault.

The CCB has also not been backward in coming forward to attack Apple?s stance on the problem concluding the initial part of its statement with: ?The question now is whether Apple is going to go on denying that there is a design fault in the same type of computer in the world outside Denmark?s borders.?

For now, no other consumer complaints authority around the world has issued any statements regarding the iBook G4 so it will be a wait-and-see case for many owners as government consumer complaints bodies either look over the Danish results, wait for consumer complaints to start rolling in or for Apple to do the right thing and acknowledge the problem and order a product recall.

If your iBook G4 is suffering from screen blank/power failure problems, it?s important you don?t open it up and try some of the remedies being suggested on the internet, even if the warranty period has expired. Many of these solutions actually make the problem worse by flexing the notebook?s circuit board.

Your best option is to contact Apple in your country or failing that, contact the official consumer complaints body in your country.

i have tested vista beta

In reply to Speculating?

vista beta whil’st it’s beta leaves a lot to be desired but in the actual testing it leaves a lot to be desired.with hardware functioning & software.there are problems

What kind of testing have you done?

In reply to i have tested vista beta

I have tested the last 2 builds at our firm and found that it runs better, smoother, and faster than XP. I admit it doesn’t like some 6 year old PCs, but then again neither do I. What products have you tested it against?

Also what universe do you live in when you say users are going to give up on Microsoft’s OS? Maybe the few IT-savvy geeks (like me) will move towards Linux or alternatives but the average Joe User is still running ME or XP and is very satisfied.

If you don’t like MSFT, that’s fine. You’re entitled to your opinions- but before you predict the demise of a market-dominant product in the real world you need to offer a viable alternative– which currently doesn’t exist. Yes, I know Macs are better… Yes, I know Linux is more stable.. but until Macs break through the $600 price point they won’t take on any major market share, and until Linux looks and operates like Windows with full compatibility it won’t either. Criticize all you want, but the market has spoken and it likes Windows- and spare me the conspiracy theories. I have 2 words for you: Xerox and Polaroid. If the market didn’t like it, it wouldn’t be there. Fast food burgers are horrible for you and there ARE alternatives available, yet people still buy them by the millions– so they must be offering value to the public, much like Microsoft is doing. When the cost outweighs the benefits, and that day will likely come as it did for US Automakers, electronics manufacturers, etc. but it’s not here yet.

Again, you are entitled to your opinions.. but they would hold much more water if backed up with facts. What products aren’t compatible? What drivers aren’t available (and that is more vendor’s faults than MSFT’s- it is THEY who create device drivers for their products)?

It requires more memory? So what? Are you still planning on running a box with less than 1GB? My daughter’s PC has that much and all she does is surf the internet and type reports for school (on OpenOffice, I might add).

I understand the animosity that exists in the world towards Microsoft- and some of it may be justified- but any well-written critique should include specific facts to support your thesis.

i just have major reservations

In reply to What kind of testing have you done?

whils’t a lot of people have minor reservations i have major ones.I don’t think the current hardware is capable of handling the full capabilities as people will make do with what they got.If you must know i don’t prefer windows based systems.i prefer a linux but i woul like unix the most as it is the stablest of all.
i’m not anti this or anti that i’m trying to stimulate a bit of discussion.There is no wrong or right answer it all depends on the circumstances.
i have tested every beta i know it will take time
i hope they fix things on time rather than wait later.all the best

Reservations

In reply to i just have major reservations

Then don’t buy it when it’s released. I would think someone with a “masters in computer science” would be able to write a cogent, factual statement as opposed to “Well, I just don’t like it nyaaa nyaaa nyaaa…”

You show your abject ignorance

In reply to Reservations

If you bother to read ALL i have written you will see
that i’m qualified in Masters in computing plus I’m a PHD in the field of operating systems. My experience in IT has been 30 years.I was playing with punch cards when you were in nappies!.Also you suffer from selective seeing as you fail to understand that vista is totally crap as most of the good things of vista have been canned.Also if vista
ever comes out it will be like XP plus bloat.
I have quite a number of contacts at ms that i have known & they say that vista is all washed up as far as an operating system.

ta Dr MICK

well looks like you belong in a reservation

In reply to Reservations

you are wrong results prove i’m still right
Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta mick

well i was right & jerks like you are like sheep that

In reply to Reservations

just tag along.
mick

well in answer to your question i have done heaps of testing

In reply to What kind of testing have you done?

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.
Well guys & Gals Recent testing using good old aussie know how has revealed what a slow trooper vista is it is a dead slow 15 %
I have been totally vindicated!!
I’m definitely proud of myself

ta mick

RE: You show your abject ignorance

In reply to well in answer to your question i have done heaps of testing

I find it interesting that “Dr.” Mick has gained a Ph.D. between early July and the end of August.

In the world of MMORPGs, we often find people who will “invent” new expertise to suit their arguement at the moment. We call them trolls. I think we simply have a case of the same here, especially given Mick’s propensity for re-posting the same set of data over, and over, and over… as well as his utter disrespect for Levy in the above posts.

I agree, Lev. One would hope that any Ph.D. holder would be better able to defend a thesis, right or wrong, given the wealth of data available.

you comments are crap

In reply to RE: You show your abject ignorance

my testing wheres yours:
Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.
hey man GET A LIFE don’t be a pesky pest!
being insulting won’t get you anywhere.

ta Dr MIck

well how wrong you are look at the evidence

In reply to RE: You show your abject ignorance

i claimed vista was useless as an os i presented the evidence that Vista is slower
than xp by 10 % that is a lot & now i’m right.Ms was mean’t to unleash a “killer product”.A history making event & thrown billions to produce it & it is a giant flop.
That’s where i have a phd & you don’t.I know in advance of what is going to happen.
& i’m right!
ta mick

Well Vista is slow & dangerous

In reply to well in answer to your question i have done heaps of testing

Vista: Slow and Dangerous
The security program in Microsoft’s new version of Windows is so annoying you’re likely to turn it off. And that’s risky
by Stephen H. Wildstrom

Related Items
Podcast: Vista’s Slow, Annoying Ways
Story Tools
post a comment
e-mail this story
print this story
order a reprint
digg this
save to del.icio.us
When I write a column, I almost never feel I have had enough time using the product under review. Even in the rare instance in which deadlines aren’t bearing down, I often realize later on that I’ve missed a fair amount. In the case of Microsoft’s Windows Vista, flaws that I thought would grow less annoying with extended use have actually become more troublesome.

Most of the time I spent testing Vista was with sluggish pre-release versions. I expected things to improve when I ran the finished software on PCs configured for the new Windows version. I now realize that Vista really is slow unless you throw a lot of hardware at it. Microsoft (MSFT) claims it will run with 512 megabytes of memory. I had recommended a minimum of a gigabyte, but 2 GB is more like it if you want snappy performance. This is especially true if you’re also running resource-hungry Microsoft Office 2007.

The most exasperating thing about Vista, though, is the security feature called User Account Control. UAC, satirized in an Apple (AAPL) ad as a security guy who constantly interrupts a conversation, appears as a pop-up asking permission before Windows will do a number of things: change system settings, install programs, or update antivirus software. UAC may well be necessary to block malicious programs from secretly installing themselves or hijacking your browser settings. But Microsoft has designed it to drive you nuts.

Turn-Off Temptation
A recent experience demonstrates what I mean. I was working away when Windows OneCare, Microsoft’s extra-cost security program, suddenly popped open a window asking me if it should give a program called wercon.exe access to the network. To begin with, this is a question that would mystify nearly everyone. (It turns out wercon.exe is a tool that sends error reports back to Microsoft.) When I clicked O.K., UAC asked me if it should let OneCare proceed. You would think Windows would be able to figure this out for itself and that these different security components would work together. But Vista leaves it all to the user to sort out.

There’s a real danger here: UAC is such a nag that many folks will just turn it off, which Microsoft has made quite easy to do. Disabling UAC is especially tempting if you have set up limited accounts for your children that let you restrict the sort of Web sites they can visit, the programs they can run, and the amount of time they can spend on the computer. With limited accounts, the kids will have to find a parent whenever a UAC window pops up. But if you give them unlimited accounts to deal with UAC requests, they can undo any restrictions.

Unfortunately, turning off UAC severely weakens Vista’s defenses. In a study of Vista security, Symantec researcher Orlando Padilla found that without UAC, Vista’s resistance to hostile software was similar to that of Windows XP. Before Vista, Windows promiscuously let programs install new software and make system changes without any notice to the user. UAC goes way too far the other way, requiring intervention for many innocent actions. The version of UAC in Mac OS X works much better, rarely popping up except during a software installation or upgrade.

Immediate Pain
As for general usability, I still have trouble finding once-familiar features that have been hidden in odd places. For example, unlike XP’s My Network button, an item on Vista’s main menu called Network does not give access to any network settings.

Things don’t have to be this way. I’ve spent as much time with the redesigned Office 2007, and it feels quite comfortable. I’m sure I’ll get used to Vista’s quirks, Microsoft will smooth out the rough edges, and, in time, Vista’s many attractions will outweigh the drawbacks. For now, though, it’s a pain.

Wildstrom is Technology & You columnist for BusinessWeek. You can contact him at techandyou@businessweek.com.

vista the slow way

In reply to Well Vista is slow & dangerous

Vista: Slow and Dangerous
All Reader Comments
page 1 of 10

Albert223

Jun 6, 2007 7:56 PM GMT
The Vista project had a vision which due to a mid-course correction just ran out of time. Get it out of the door was the mantra. Well they will pay a big price for this down the road as the company stock is reflecting. Vista is not flying of the selves where I live. XP is selling strong and at a premium. This is not like XP. Vista demands upgraded hardware and the consumer is spending their money on other things.

xp stillleads

In reply to Well Vista is slow & dangerous

Smarty Pants

Jun 6, 2007 3:43 PM GMT
Annnnd you people are surprised whyyy?

slow poke to boot

In reply to Well Vista is slow & dangerous

BummedSon

Apr 29, 2007 3:57 PM GMT
I recently bought a low end computer for my mother and all I could quickly obtain was Vista. Today “low end” means 1 gig of memory, a core duo processor and basically good hardware. But Vista is SLOW, and the screen is so busy with eye candy, that it is really annoying. Mind you, however they removed such clutter as title bars for things so you can’t tell what some windows are for, and they added the most annoying UAC I’ve ever seen. Nothing is easy to find and … ugh, I can’t go on. If you are getting a new PC, search for one with XP.

ms no idea in what they are doing

In reply to Well Vista is slow & dangerous

Chris Nielsen

Apr 28, 2007 10:02 PM GMT
I had to buy a computer last week to replace mine. I was running Windows 2000 because I never liked or needed XP. I really tried to like Vista, and with 512 it was not that slow on my 3.3GHZ machine. But it was like working with a MAC in that you are kept from the OS and the UAC was driving me crazy. Sure it’s kind of pretty, but not much more than XP and who needs it? Anyway, when I installed Office 2000 and found that Outlook would not work correctly, I decided to make a backup of VISTA and install win2k again. I was going to make TWO backups of my VISTA OS, just in case, but after the first one, I was informed that I was not ALLOWED to make a second one. WTF? I’m now looking into getting a machine and running Linux so I can learn it and prepare for the day when my Win2k no longer works for some reason. This is the worst upgrade I have seen from Microsoft and their failure to produce a version of Linux just tells me that they still don’t have a clue.

.

well in answer to your question i have done heaps of testing

In reply to What kind of testing have you done?

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta mick

after all the testing that’s been done vista still lags

In reply to What kind of testing have you done?

heaps back than xp.So why would anyone waste their money on an os that doesn’t perform.At the moment some people that have upgraded have found that there aren’t many benefits attached to vista as predicted there are huge tecnical hurdles & as much time as 2 years to get things right!
ta mick

still the same

In reply to after all the testing that’s been done vista still lags

yes it is

registration causes freezups

In reply to still the same

as you are trying to register freezups occur.

well Bob i can tell you that xp performs 10% faster

In reply to What kind of testing have you done?

than vista.That means vista is a lame duck & ms has not done anything to improve the system.
ta mick

call it what you like but

In reply to Speculating?

i was right.
Ta mick

defintely on the right here

In reply to call it what you like but

current evidence showsWindows code is too complicated. It’s not the components themselves, it’s their interdependencies. An architectural diagram of Windows would suggest there are more than 50 dependency layers (never mind that there also exist circular dependencies). After working in Windows for five years, you understand only, say, two of them. Add to this the fact that building Windows on a dual-proc dev box takes nearly 24 hours, and you’ll be slow enough to drive Miss Daisy.
Windows process has gone thermonuclear. Imagine each little email you send asking someone else to fill out a spreadsheet, comment on a report, sign off on a decision — is a little neutron shooting about in space. Your innocent-seeming little neutron now causes your heretofore mostly-harmless neighbors to release neutrons of their own. Now imagine there are 9000 of you, all jammed into a tight little space called Redmond. It’s Windows Gone Thermonuclear, a phenomenon by which process engenders further process, eventually becoming a self-sustaining buzz of fervent destructive activity.

Let’s see if, quantitatively, there’s any truth to the perception that the code velocity (net lines shipped per developer-year) of Windows has slowed, or is slow relative to the industry. Vista is said to have over 50 million lines of code, whereas XP was said to have around 40 million. There are about two thousand software developers in Windows today. Assuming there are 5 years between when XP shipped and when Vista ships, those quick on the draw with calculators will discover that, on average, the typical Windows developer has produced one thousand new lines of shipped code per year during Vista. Only a thousand lines a year. (Yes, developers don’t just write new code, they also fix old code. Yes, some of those Windows developers were partly busy shipping 64-bit XP. Yes, many of them also worked on hotfixes. Work with me here.)

Lest those of you who wrote 5,000 lines of code last weekend pass a kidney stone at the thought of Windows developers writing only a thousand lines of code a year, realize that the average software developer in the US only produces around (brace yourself) 6200 lines a year. So Windows is in bad shape — but only by a constant, not by an order of magnitude. And if it makes you feel any better, realize that the average US developer has fallen in KLOC productivity since 1999, when they produced about 9000 lines a year. So Windows isn’t alone in this. [KLOC data comes from ?Worldwide IT Trends & Benchmark Report 2001?, produced by META Group (now acquired by Gartner)]

The oft-cited, oft-watercooler-discussed dual phenomenon of Windows code complexity and Windows process burden seem to have dramatically affected its overall code velocity. But code can be simplified and re-architected (and is indeed being done so by a collection of veteran architects in Windows, none of whom, incidentally, look anything like Colonel Sanders). Process can be streamlined where inefficient, eliminated where unnecessary.

But that’s not where it ends. There are deeper causes of Windows’ propensity to slippage.

Cultured to Slip

Deep in the bowels of Windows, there remains the whiff of a bygone culture of belittlement and aggression. Windows can be a scary place to tell the truth.

When a vice president in Windows asks you whether your team will ship on time, they might well have asked you whether they look fat in their new Armani suit. The answer to the question is deeply meaningful to them. It’s certainly true in some sense that they genuinely want to know. But in a very important other sense, in a sense that you’ll come to regret night after night if you get it wrong, there’s really only one answer you can give.

After months of hearing of how a certain influential team in Windows was going to cause the Vista release to slip, I, full of abstract self-righteous misgivings as a stockholder, had at last the chance to speak with two of the team’s key managers, asking them how they could be so, please-excuse-the-term, I-don’t-mean-its-value-laden-connotation, ignorant as to proper estimation of software schedules. Turns out they’re actually great project managers. They knew months in advance that the schedule would never work. So they told their VP. And he, possibly influenced by one too many instances where engineering re-routes power to the warp core, thus completing the heretofore impossible six-hour task in a mere three, summarily sent the managers back to “figure out how to make it work.”? The managers re-estimated, nipped and tucked, liposuctioned, did everything short of a lobotomy — and still did not have a schedule that fit. The VP was not pleased. “You’re smart people. Find a way!” This went back and forth for weeks, whereupon the intrepid managers finally understood how to get past the dilemma. They simply stopped telling the truth. “Sure, everything fits. We cut and cut, and here we are. Vista by August or bust. You got it, boss.”

Every once in a while, Truth still pipes up in meetings. When this happens, more often than not, Truth is simply bent over an authoritative knee and soundly spanked into silence.

The Joy of Cooking

Bundled with a tendency towards truth-intolerance, Windows also sometimes struggles with poor organizational decision-making. Good news is that the senior leaders already know this and have been taking active steps to change the situation.

There are too many cooks in the kitchen. Too many vice presidents, in reporting structures too narrow. When I was in Windows, I reported to Alec, who reported to Peter, to Bill, Rick, Will, Jim, Steve, and Bill. Remember that there were two layers of people under me as well, making a total path depth of 11 people from Bill Gates down to any developer on my team.

This isn’t necessarily bad, except sometimes the cooks flash-mob one corner of the kitchen. I once sat in a schedule review meeting with at least six VPs and ten general managers. When that many people have a say, things get confusing. Not to mention, since so many bosses are in the room, there are often negotiations between project managers prior to such meetings to make sure that no one ends up looking bad. “Bob, I’m giving you a heads-up that I’m going to say that your team’s component, which we depend on, was late.”? “That’s fine, Sandy, but please be clear that the unforeseen delays were caused by a third party, not my team.”

Micromanagement, though not pervasive, is nevertheless evident. Senior vice presidents sometimes review UI designs of individual features, a nod to Steve Jobs that would in better days have betokened a true honor but for its randomizing effects. Give me a cathedral, give me a bazaar — really, either would be great. Just not this middle world in which some decisions are made freely while others are made by edict, with no apparent logic separating each from the other but the seeming curiosity of someone in charge.

In general, Windows suffers from a proclivity for action control, not results control. Instead of clearly stating desired outcomes, there’s a penchant for telling people exactly what steps they must take. By doing so, we risk creating a generation of McDevs. (For more on action control vs. results control, read Kenneth Merchant’s seminal work on the subject — all $150 of it, apparently).

Uncontrolled? Or Uncontrollable?

We shouldn’t forget despite all this that Windows Vista remains the largest concerted software project in human history. The types of software management issues being dealt with by Windows leaders are hard problems, problems that no other company has solved successfully. The solutions to these challenges are certainly not trivial.

An interesting question, however, is whether or not Windows Vista ever had a chance to ship on time to begin with. Is Vista merely uncontrolled? Or is it fundamentally uncontrollable? There is a critical difference.

It’s rumored that VPs in Windows were offered big bonuses contingent on shipping Vista by the much-publicized August 2006 date. Chris Jones even declared in writing that he wouldn’t take a bonus if Vista slips past August. If this is true, if folks like Brian Valentine held division-wide meetings where August 2006 was declared as the drop-dead ship date, if general managers were consistently told of the fiscal importance of hitting August, if everyone down to individual developers was told to sign on the dotted line to commit to the date, and to speak up if they had any doubts of hitting

if you bother to read the latest evidence

In reply to Speculating?

you will see i have been right.
ta mick

you are fucking hilarious

In reply to Speculating?

here’s my results on vista i’s a fucking failureVista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results
Vista & to XP Professional Compared
cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.
ta mick

Acording to the benchmarks you posted there should be a very noticable

In reply to you are fucking hilarious

differance if you ran XP and Vista on nearly identical pc’s. Well guess what I have done that-in fact the XP pc has a 3300+ AMD Athlon while the Vista has a AMD 2800+ but the fact of the matter XP is only slightly faster that Vista. In some cases Vista is faster.
Mike

the answer has to do with stability & compatibility

In reply to Acording to the benchmarks you posted there should be a very noticable

Have you not read george ou’s latest blog where he says he will not use vista as a main
op system.Because vista is still not as stable as people think & along with associated problems still not resolved by ms.
I think say xp is much better as it’s more stable & runs applications better.
ta mick

hardware

In reply to the answer has to do with stability & compatibility

Well he has hardware problem and other problem none other have now.

GReetz

well with vista there are huge complications

In reply to hardware

some are hardware related ie motherboards,hardrives etc some are software realted when the whole thing is intermixed you have got one immense problem.I wish it was sipmle & could easily be solved.But the whole thing is what do people want from vista or they happy with xp.
ta mick

accordingto the ostrich jerk he feels he has no problems

In reply to hardware

but there are huge hardware & software problems &failures that either ms or anyone
has even attempted to solve.Unsigned drivers
etc is a pain in the butt.

huge hardware problems still abound in vista

In reply to hardware

there are huge printer/ scanner problems.

vista sux

In reply to hardware

Hi,

I recently installed the newest drivers with Alchemy for my Audigy 2, following all the instructions on this forum.
After that I tested the speakers and it seems that when I use the Creative speaker settings to test my speakers front/rear right and front/rear left are both output on the front speakers now. If I test my speakers in the Vista control panel everything seems to work fine.
In the Creative speaker settings I’ve unchecked the sync with control panel.

Does that mean my speakers work for now or are they completely screwed up?

I’m using the Inspire 6700 speakers from Creative which are actually 6.1 speakers, but 6.1 obviously doesn’t work anymore in Vista. Might this be the reason for my speakers acting weird?
10-02-2007 02:35 AM

Add This Message to My Bookmarks
Add This Message to My Subscriptions

Subscribe to this message’s RSS Feed
Highlight This Message
Print This Message
Print to End (Max 50)
E-Mail this Message to a Friend

Jump to Page: 1

vista sux

In reply to hardware

Unable to open saved project in Movie Maker, HELP!!
I recently (last month) bought a new HP Pavalion a1730n with Windows Vista
Home Premium. I have been using Movie Maker and DVD Maker wihtout any
problems until today. Suddenly I am not able to open a previously saved
project file in movie maker! Here’s what happens….I open Movie Maker, click
on File, Open, and double click the file. It begins to load the pictures that
are in the file (they show up in the storyboard), and then apparently just
stops. The mouse spins in its little circle, and the only way to close movie
maker is through task manager, end task. I’ve even waited up to an hour to
see if maybe it was just taking a super long time to open my project. It is
not a large file – only 100 photos which total about 8 min long. I have also
tried opening other projects that I had previously saved. It will not open
those either.

I called HP tech support and they can’t help. They wanted to transfer me to
someplace where they’d charge me for it! Microsoft is closed until Monday. I
need to get working on this project now! And instead of spending the last two
hours working on the project, I’ve been searching the internet trying to find
a way to open my project!! If you have any suggestions, I would really
appreciate it.

Maybe Microsoft recently updated something in vista that screwed it up? Is
anyone else having this problem?

vista is well & screwed

In reply to hardware

Posted by typemismatch // Fri, Nov 9, 2007 3:10 PM

So we all know that networking in Vista is screwed up and I am amazed that 1 year after release it still doesn’t work. What happens to me? well after about 8 hours of use most applications loose their internet connection (wireless and lan) – Most? you ask … yes – things like outlook still get/send mail, IE/FF stop working, chat stops etc. maybe office just “wishes” the data over the air

So I need to reboot to get back my connection – great, here is the problem. After getting the “logging off” and then “shutting down” for an un-determined amount of time my machine just blue screens … awesome.

That means for one I can never “shutdown” as the blue screen causes a restart. Now lets compound this – if I resume from Sleep or Hibernate I get an ACS (acs.exe??) crash and guess what – no internet. So I need to do the above BSOD sequence – (left eye twitching).

This is Vista certified hardware from Lenovo – “certified” I guess means Vista will run … what it does while running isn’t “certified” but at least I know my drivers are pretty good.

So once or twice a day I must force a BSOD to keep surfing, I can’t resume,sleep,shutdown or restart with a BSOD so installing updates is fun.

vista is well & fucked

In reply to hardware

People always claim Im in a hurry to show affection for Bill Gates and Windows Vista. Well with Bill, I admire the guy. Instead of taking his billions and running around like a 19 year old with a permanant erection like some CEO?s we know; Bill is quick to try to help humanity, cure diseases and generally try to make it bearable for those who find the world unbearable. But enough on Bill, lets move on to Windows Vista. As with any product I use I have my likes and dislikes. here is my list of Vista dislikes.

1. Editions ? Way to many editions of Windows Vista. There should only be one, maybe 2 but definatly not 6.

2. The blue pearl ? While I like the idea of the blue pearl I hate the fact it extends up and beyond the taskbar. Shrink it a bit.

3. Desktop search ? While I like the desktop search function, I hate the implementation. They should have gone with something similar to Windows Desktop Search and put it in the taskbar.

4. Driver support ? Some of my printers and scanners are unsupported on Windows Vista, a true shame and since Microsoft changed the Device driver model its unlikely to change any time soon as companies wont see any need to update their drivers.

5. Windows Calendar ? Even though it is said to be iCal compliant, it isnt. I can go from iCal to Windows Calendar but not vice versa.

6. Application support ? Some of my favorite apps like Virus Sheild, yes Cybermagellan this is a hint for YOU, GAIM, Frostwire and Adobe Audition dont work on Vista, GAIM and Frostwire for me refuses to connect.

7. Theme support ? Still no support for 3rd party themes. Inexcusable.

8. Price ? Yep, very expensive but worth it. I may buy a couple of copies and replace the rest when I replace the PC?s

9. Hardware support ? yeah I do wish it would support older hardware, particularly Video and sound cards and printers and scanners.

10. Driver signing ? It will be interesting to see how this one works itself out. Whether device driver developers will have to belong to an exclusive club. But its about time Microsoft addressed the security issue.

no xp is much faster than vista

In reply to Acording to the benchmarks you posted there should be a very noticable

vista is slower than xp

lack of drivers for vista

In reply to no xp is much faster than vista

it’s taken much too long as not much drivers are available.

vista complaints

In reply to lack of drivers for vista

Operating Systems

Brampton Factor: Vista complaints
It’s not ‘green’, it’s pricey – and what does it say about modern software development?

By Martin Brampton

Published: Tuesday 20 February 2007

Martin Brampton sounds off on the ways Windows Vista fails to live up to its promise – and what it tells us about the stagnant state of software engineering today.

Windows Vista has arrived and if you buy an off-the-shelf PC you will almost certainly get a copy. Vista has been described as the biggest software development ever attempted. I’ve been puzzling over what that might imply.

But before getting down to some programming issues, let’s digress to consider the environment. There seems little hope of IT being able to make ‘green’ claims so long as new software makes existing hardware obsolete. Yet again, Microsoft is launching an operating system version that will not run on many existing systems. There will doubtless be token resistance but it will inevitably be difficult to avoid the move to Vista.

One might think the situation is saved by the lack of any obviously compelling features in Vista that would persuade people to upgrade. Unfortunately, life is not so simple.
Not only does the Vista technology place stress on systems, Microsoft’s pricing gives extra incentives to throw out perfectly usable computers. The retail price of Vista is exorbitant and the upgrades are not radically more appealing than previous versions of Windows while coming with irritating restrictions. To get a half decent price for Vista, the buyer is pushed towards OEM software, which is less than half the price of the equivalent retail version.

Taking Amazon prices as a guide, Vista Home Premium costs a staggering ?197, while the OEM product is just ?68. Doubtless the big PC makers pay a lot less than that, especially as we know that US prices are generally lower than UK prices. There are similar price differences for applications such as Office. All this means that Microsoft is giving strong financial encouragement to the scrapping of computers and their replacement by new machines.

One might think the situation is saved by the lack of any obviously compelling features in Vista that would persuade people to upgrade. Unfortunately, life is not so simple. Upgrade is likely to be forced as one thing leads to another. It only takes one vital upgrade of one application to a version that demands Vista to force the move. So it seems we need to suspend belief in the ‘greenness’ of IT at least until Microsoft issues a new operating system that works on all existing hardware and costs less as an easily installed upgrade than a new OEM deployment.

What about the actual development of Vista, though? It is widely believed that Vista contains something like 10 million more lines of code than XP. One commentator thought there are around 2,000 Windows developers, and so in the five or so years since XP, they appear to have each contributed only around 1,000 additional lines of code.

Others then contended that was a reasonable rate of production. Research from Steve McConnell, author of the book Software Estimation: The Black Art Demystified (Best Practices (Microsoft)), indicates annual rates ranging from 3,200 lines of code down to 1,600 per year, reducing with size of project. Someone else has claimed a national (presumably US) annual average of 6,200 lines, although no source was specified. The Vista figure was further defended on the grounds that operating systems are complex. That is an inadequate argument, given that only a very small portion of Vista is, truly speaking, an operating system.

All of these numbers raise another curious issue. When I was a young programmer, several decades ago, it was considered that the average rate of code creation was around 20 lines (tested and documented) per day. If we suppose 200 effective working days per year, that equates to 4,000 lines per year. That figure relates to third generation languages and sizeable corporate projects, above the size of McConnell’s smallest projects.

This puts computer industry hype into some perspective. Despite numerous ‘advances’ in both technology and technique, it would appear the creation of software takes just as long today as it did many years ago. There is no sign that any of the numerous expensive tools or the many heavily documented ‘new’ development methods have had the slightest impact. That is a sobering thought.

It could be argued that different development languages are now used, yet there is actually little real change. While moving from assembler to third generation languages undoubtedly made life easier and perhaps more productive, fourth generation languages failed to maintain that progress. Always too specific to particular kinds of problems, they inevitably ran the risk of introducing huge overhead into projects for which they were unsuited. So nowadays, we see most development in Java, C++, variants of Basic and so on. Little different from techniques used in the 70s, especially if we take account of the invention of Smalltalk during that period.

Another interesting consideration is that the usable lifetime for software may well have already peaked. Much of the code forming the so-called ‘legacy’ that caused such anxiety at the millennium was written in the 70s and 80s. It was kept in use far longer than its authors ever expected, and far longer than most software from earlier periods. The signs are that most software written today is scrapped after much shorter periods than the ‘legacy’ despite the fact there is little sign it is produced any more easily or cheaply.

Now of course I do know that lines of code is a very poor (sometimes contrary) way to measure the creation of software. Yet it is the one enduring measure that allows us to do very simple calculations. Those calculations are useful because they cut through the obscurity that otherwise surrounds a highly complex activity.

But getting back to Vista. Some more solid arguments in favour of the Vista developers’ productivity include the fact that some XP code has been scrapped, and even some of the code originally written for Vista was scrapped in the face of changing priorities. What is still of concern is that it is hard to see that Vista is a worthwhile result for the efforts of thousands of developers. If we have failed to increase productivity significantly over several decades, does it really make sense to devote such a huge resource to a mere operating system?

the only value of vista at the moment is to use

In reply to Speculating?

it as a coaster or hang it from the mirror on your car!
ta miock

No you are so WRONG!!!!!

In reply to the only value of vista at the moment is to use

I walked into Jaycar and bought a Back wards Clock Movement and fitted it to the M$ Provided Partner Demo Readiness Toolkit along with a stand. It confuses the hell out of everyone who sees it as they all think that they are going mad because it’s going back wards. 😀

They only supplied a RC2 Beta Version that was supposed to be provided in November and came in early February after the Production Version went on sale to the General Public.

Col

i know the clock we have jaycar here in sydney

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

perhaps ms could make use of such a clock with an addition of a cuckoo on it to remind them of their dud os.
ta mick

i’ll be honest i hardly go to ms for advice as they

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

give me the wrong advice at times.i don’t beleive you should pay for advice unless you go to a lawyer.
I usually consult with my colleagues & i go back to the manufactures.One has to reminisce on the early days of dos.They were sort of hectic by the seat of your pants survival days.I miss those days as now there’s hardly anything to do as it’s all automated.
ta mick

if the latest sales are any indication of what’s ahead

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

it’s a big mother of a flop.People are comparing it to millenium release.as everyone knows millenium was a hideous failure.Vista?s development cycle has suffered some serious, well-documented problems. Group projects with that many internal difficulties and delays rarely turn out well. To make matters worse, many features that were to be included in Vista, such as the WinFS file system, were cut. Add that to Vista?s high system requirements, and many users might decide not to buy the expensive new hardware needed to run an expensive, unproven operating system, especially one with such widespread developmental woes. The tech world has changed drastically since the days of DOS and Windows 95, and it may no longer be possible for a single company to enjoy near-ubiquity in all aspects of computing.What does that mean for Microsoft? If Vista flops, Microsoft?s monopoly will not vanish; sheer inertia alone will see to that. But it will erode at an increasingly rapid rate, especially if aggressive contenders, like Ubuntu Linux and Boot Camp-equipped Intel Macs, can make inroads. The failure of Vista would not doom Microsoft-Office alone would see to that-but Microsoft might well suffer a serious loss of power and influence.

So is Windows Vista a coming triumph for Microsoft, or a catastrophe in the making? Which potential future do you see coming
true?
ta mick

jokes aside current testing has confirmed ms woes

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

with vista os xp is 10% faster in the performance stakes than vista.This is huge
so with have here a complete dud!!
ta mick

well all evidence points to vista being totally

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

washed up.by the way where is your ostrich
friend michael hereid snr?
he doesn’t seem to be around.
ta mick

well when one weighs all the evidence

In reply to well all evidence points to vista being totally

regards vista youll see there are fundamental flaws of which Ms is totally ignorant & seems to ram on regardless.
ta mick

Well vista does notsupport div-x

In reply to No you are so WRONG!!!!!

Vista sings the DivX blues
Regardless of what you think of the operating system itself, there?s no doubt that Vista has, since release, languished under the shadow of compatibility issues.

In fairness, this seems to have had little to do with Microsoft. Many popular and regularly-updated applications simply haven?t caught up and been made Vista-compatible, despite the long beta and the two solid months between the release of Vista RTM and the consumer versions.

One major application which is still lagging behind is DivX. The latest version of the codec, 6.5.1, offers patchy playback support on Windows Vista and Media Player 11, and it?s officially unsupported.

When you install the DivX for Windows package on a Vista machine, it detects that you?re running Vista and gives a warning, outlining the various known problems of running DivX on Vista.

DivX – Vista Warning
The bundled version of the DivX Player (6.4.3) does work on Vista, but when you open a movie the Vista desktop will bomb back to Aero Basic ? this also occurs with the DivX Web Player. It?s not a complete desktop or explorer crash though ? the desktop switches back to Aero Glass once the Player is closed.
Well what more do we needto say.

vista incompatible in korea

In reply to Speculating?

KOREA: Vista incompatible with some Korean websites
Improved security of Windows Vista causes problems for users trying to access some websites

Korea Herald
Tuesday, February 20, 2007

By Hwang Si-young

Microsoft Korea launched Windows Vista, Office System 2007 and Exchange Server 2007 for home PC users on Jan. 31 this year, promoting the latest operating version’s enhanced security and three-dimensional graphic functionality. But despite much fanfare, the new system’s strong security features are creating problems in Korea.

“As Koreans do a lot of commerce transactions and download government data via the internet, the incompatibility between the Vista and internet sites has surfaced as a new problem,” said an official at the Information Ministry.

Internet transactions account for about 20 percent of the nation’s total commerce deals. Koreans downloaded 1.43 million government-issued documents last year. It is, however, not uncommon to see shaky screens when a Vista user wants to download data or view video clips on major portal sites as the content is all or partly blocked.

The incompatibility occurs as Vista is stripped of the “Active X” technology, a security tool used by most Korea-based internet shopping, government and online gaming websites. Microsoft Korea cited Active X’s vulnerability to vicious codes as the reason for discontinuing the technology.

Faced with resulting possible technical glitches, commercial lenders such as Shinhan Bank, Woori Bank and Hana Bank have taken proper measures. Users of these banks’ websites can expect normal services regardless of which type of system they choose. Other commercial lenders and brokerages such as Samsung Securities and Korea Securities said they will take steps no later than March this year.

Online portals including Yahoo, Naver, Daum, and Empas, and internet shopping malls such as http://www.auction. co.kr, http://www.interpark.co.kr and http://www.ticketlink.co.kr, are currently offering normal services. Lineage, a popular online gaming service, said it would make its program compatible with the new operating system by the end of February.

Meanwhile, experts have divided opinions about Vista’s future success in the Korean market.

“Windows Vista’s functional enhancement will lead to increased demand for more powerful PCs, more memory capacities, including flash memory and dynamic random access memory chips,” Chung Chang-won, an analyst at Daewoo Investment & Securities, told The Korea Herald.

“The launch will help boost the liquid crystal display market as well, which has been a bit sluggish for the past two years. Twenty-inch or bigger LCDs, considered fit for three-dimensional graphic and video clip viewing, will be in high demand thanks to the debut of the latest operating system,” he said.

Skeptics, however, said the launch will only have limited effects.

Chung Woo-chul, a software analyst at Tong Yang Investment & Securities, said companies will not go to the trouble of changing their existing office systems as long as they are not inconvenienced at work.

“Companies were willing to change software and IT systems in the past, but things are now a bit different except for new start-ups who have to set up all new software and systems,” Chung said.

Date Posted: 2/20/2007
ta mick

vista security overhaul questioned

In reply to vista incompatible in korea

The Register ? Security ? Vista security overhaul questioned
User Account Control: insecure by design?
By John Leyden → More by this authorPublished Monday 19th February 2007 12:40 GMTInterested in this story? Receive others like it on your desktop as they break. Security researchers have taken issue with Microsoft’s implementation of a security feature in Vista that is designed to stop users from routinely running systems in admin mode.

Users of Windows XP and older Microsoft operating systems habitually ran PCs in admin mode, which gives unrestricted access to the system. As a result, malware attacks carried the ability to take over compromised systems which wouldn’t normally be possible if a machine was running in user mode.

The User Account Control (UAC) security functionality of Windows Vista is designed to address this problem by obliging users to run their Vista PCs via a normal user account by default. Users are asked to switch modes and enter login credentials when they request a task requiring admin credentials.

White hat hacker Joanna Rutkowska discovered that users attempting to run an installation file need to do so in admin mode. That means users are confronted with the all-or-nothing choice of granting an installed program complete system privileges or abandoning an installation altogether.

“That means that if you downloaded some freeware Tetris game, you will have to run its installer as administrator, giving it not only full access to all your file system and registry,” Rutkowska writes, adding that Win XP gave her the ability to add permissions to her normal (restricted) user account that isn’t possible with Vista.

Mark Russinovich, a technical fellow at Microsoft, argues in a detailed response that the design of Vista’s User Account Control balances security and usability.

Rutkowska acknowledges that Microsoft has improved the security of its operating system with Vista but warns that the security shortcomings of UAC can not be so easily dismissed. “UAC is not perfect [but that] doesn’t diminish the fact that it’s a step in the right direction, implementing a least-privilege policy in Windows OS,” she writes.

Rutkowska takes issue with Microsoft’s contention that flaws in UAC controls don’t in themselves create security bugs. She points, by way of example, to a security bug she has discovered which allows a low integrity level process to send WM_KEYDOWN messages to a command prompt window running at high integrity level as among the types of problems she is seeking to highlight. ?

ta mick

vista raises the bar for flaw finders

In reply to vista security overhaul questioned

Vista raises the bar for flaw finders
But the battle’s not over yet
By Robert Lemos, SecurityFocus → More by this authorPublished Wednesday 31st January 2007 11:54 GMTReceive articles like this on your desktop as they break, click here. Microsoft launched its latest operating system – Windows Vista – on Monday, a move that will make finding easily exploitable vulnerabilities a lot harder, according to security researchers.

In a launch event in New York City, the software giant took the wraps off both Windows Vista and its Office 2007 productivity suite. Long awaited, Windows Vista brings together a number of security features, some aimed at hardening the operating system against attack and others designed to encourage users to make security a priority when using their PCs.

“None of the features in Windows Vista, either individually or together, are meant to be bulletproof,” said Stephen Toulouse, senior product manager for Microsoft’s Security Technology Unit. “But the defense-in-depth will significantly raise the security level compared to Windows XP.”

The launch of its latest operating system comes five years after the company restructured its approach to software security with the Trustworthy Computing Initiative. The revamped strategy – prompted by the Code Red and Nimda worms that struck a massive number of the software giant’s customers in the summer of 2001 – led to a massive push to educate developers and provide tools to weed out software bugs. In 2004, Microsoft refocused Windows XP Service Pack 2, making the update almost completely about security.

While other applications, including Internet Explorer 7 and Office 2007, have benefited from Microsoft’s secure development lifecycle, the development of Windows Vista was the first time the software giant’s consumer operating system was designed from the ground up with a focus on security. For example, the operating system enforces least-privilege rules of access, requesting the user’s password to execute certain higher privilege tasks. The software giant has also improved the operating system’s firewall and revamped the Security Centre to give more information to users. Internet Explorer 7 brings additional security enhancements, such as limiting ActiveX controls and significant anti-phishing features.

For security researchers, however, it’s what’s under the hood that matters. Three major features will make Vista more difficult to exploit even when vulnerabilities are found: Kernel Patch Protection, Data Execution Prevention, and Address Space Layout Randomisation.

The controversial Kernel Patch Protection, also known as PatchGuard, limits the practice of some software developers of creating add-on features for the operating system by patching the kernel, the core system software. Many security software makers have criticised the feature because it limits their software’s ability to modify the core features offered by the Windows operating system.

“This is especially popular among anti-virus products, which sometimes use exactly the same hooking techniques as some popular malware, like rootkits,” Joanna Rutkowska, senior researcher for COSEINC Advanced Malware Labs, said in an email interview with SecurityFocus. “This is not good, not only because it may have potential impact on system stability, but it also confuses malware detection tools.”

Such restrictions are good for the overall security of the Windows platform, but it’s not comprehensive by any means, Rutkowska said. PatchGuard only protects against modifications to code and static-kernel objects, what Rutkowska calls type-I infections. It does not detect modifications to dynamic structures (type-II infections) nor does it detect modifications to code running through hardware virtualisation (type-III infections), she said.

Track this type
ta mick

well bills made himself a jackass

In reply to Speculating?

The Microsoft chairman said, in essence, that the development world has changed with the advent of new Web technologies that give people any time, any place access to their data–a far cry from the PC-centric world of the past. “Everything we do now, we have to be user-centric, not device-centric,” he said.

Gates also pledged to bolster the company’s development efforts on Internet Explorer, which he said has lagged in recent years.

“In a sense we’re doing a mea culpa, saying we waited too long for a browser release,” Gates said. “I expect us to move very very rapidly there because we see great opportunities.”

Gates said that Microsoft is already working on the next two versions after Internet Explorer 7, which is due later this year with Windows Vista, a long anticipated update to Windows XP.

On Monday, Microsoft released several product updates, including a “refresh” of the Internet Explorer 7 Beta 2 preview, and Microsoft’s Atlas AJAX Web development kit will have an updated license allowing customers to run Web applications built with Atlas.

The term AJAX was coined last year to describe a combination of Web technologies, including JavaScript and XML. More and more developers are using these tools to build more capable Web applications that can replace older generations of “fat client” desktop systems.

This week, Microsoft executives will explain in more detail the company’s full arsenal of software and Live hosted services for building Web applications on a range of devices including desktop PCs, mobile phones, gaming devices and Media Center PCs.

The expansion of Web-connected software to a larger group of consumers is something that can’t be ignored, the company says. “More and more activities are happening online. Whatever industry you look at, that’s where people are spending time,” said Charles Fitzgerald, general manager for platform technologies at Microsoft. “Our latest Web technologies (can be used) to drive better customer connections online.”

Moreover, the popularity of “mashups,” which let developers combine parts of one Web site with parts of another, has driven a new way to look at Web sites. Increasingly developers can think about Web sites as “components” in their applications, Gates said. “This is a powerful idea whose time has come, and we’re really just at the beginning.”

Video: Mix ’06: Gates keynote
From the stage of Mix ’06, Bill Gates discusses building new online applications.
Gates on Monday also discussed the changes to Web usage that will come from the broader adoption of RSS (Really Simple Syndication) and related Microsoft-led initiatives, including Simple Shared Extensions for sharing calendaring information and Live Clipboard.

“You can think of RSS as the start of the programmable Web. As Web sites start exposing their APIs, amazing things happen,” said Gates.

Microsoft intends to build deeper RSS support in Windows Vista and Internet Explorer 7, allowing people to subscribe to Web pages as well as podcasts and photos.

The Mix ’06 conference is also an effort by Microsoft to attract more Web developers and designers to Microsoft products.

The company’s Expression line of designer tools is being built to foster better collaboration between technical programmers and designers. The tools are expected to be released later this year.

Now on News.com
Mortgage meltdown: Tech stocks’ gain?

Week in review: AMD’s scramble, Google’s gamble

Is the digital pen getting mightier?

Extra: Space cadet school
Overall, Microsoft is hoping to prove to developers that it understands the new realities of online development, ranging from things like AJAX to software-as-a-service development, pioneered by rivals such as Salesforce.com.

Adam Gross, vice president of developer marketing at Salesforce.com, noted that Microsoft has been very successful with traditional Windows developers. But it has not been as successful reaching “Internet developers.”

“Until now, Microsoft tools have been very Microsoft-centric. I’d like to see how they are really going to approach the Internet as a development platform,” Gross said.

The Bottom Line

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

The Bottom line with Vista is that unless a person “Actually has tried it out” they are in no position to talk.
From then on, all we get is what’s been said by someone else who didn’t try it and on it goes. I for one would like those of us who have NOT used the system to be the ones to read about it from the experienced user. Anything else makes no sense. So there’s no point in flaming, your blog tells us A-You’re angry and B- at something you know nothing about and do not understand.Get with the Program.
I would advise doing like the rest of us who Don’t have Vista and read.
You might learn something.
And for god’s sake, stop listening to the blathering fools around you who haven’t tried it either.
Good or Bad, I want to hear it from an experienced user and not a theorist.
At the very least, A Pro 😉
Regards 🙂
Aaron

I agree fully with Aaron

In reply to The Bottom Line

Unless you’ve dabled with the beta version,now 2,I have’nt,simply trashing Vista,is stupid.A good read is at longhornBlogs.com
I wont be installing Vista from “the off”,as I want to see what problems occur,and they will,due to the enormous mish-mash of configurations “out there”,but after a period of reflection,and a good look at one of the full release versions next year,in a home situation (family members have said they will buy),I shall dabble to my hearts content,and see what happens.
Read,review,but above all dont destroy with words,a product that is’nt out till 07.If you dont have the “bottle”,or chance,to be beta tester,or after a long “test” period of one of the final public release versions,then you can say you dont like it,or it’s not for you.Kicking Microsoft seems to be the norm.I often have a little dig now and again,but writing the code for a new OS is no easy task,and one which should be appreciated.Really.

Thank you Neil

In reply to I agree fully with Aaron

I’m glad you concur. There has been an incredible an absolutely incredible amount of hype and built up tension regarding a product that, for all intents and purposes, “Doesn’t Exist Yet” and yet all this back and forth between those loving it and those hating it.
It’s not Vista they hate, it’s Microsoft and they can’t wait to get in there and start looking or thing to go wrong, just so that they can rant and rave some more.
If ever there was an exercise in futility, this is it.
I think you’ll find that as time goes on, the rants/raves will die down and the truly intelligent members, will read up on what the “Experienced” Vista user think’s and why.
Many users, different experiences, should be interesting.
when you consider the line up of Pros and Experience that we have in our little Tech Republic Family.
It’s not going to be boring, that’s for sure.
Regards
Aaron

aaron you are right but i have tested vista through

In reply to Thank you Neil

vista is not going to make the line as there are major faults inherent in the system.
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

What builds have you tried.

In reply to aaron you are right but i have tested vista through

I have been running Vista since April on my machine, I have used Beta 2 and now am using RC1.
True it is beta software and sometimes there are a few gotchas but then thats what the testing program is all about. You report the gotchas to MS so they can figure what went wrong. You don’t apply a Beta and expect the finished product.

I haven’t met a software program that has balked at being run in Vista either natively or in compatability mode. So far I like it and will buy Ultimate when available.

All you are spewing is things that pro Apple and pro Linux commentators have been saying, no facts just spew. You obviously have no first hand experience as RC1 is not bloated and as Georg Ou stated previously it uses the resources available and manages them to give the best computing experience. I will declare that yes I am running Vista on hardware designed to take full advantage of Vista, but then again it is a real world test. You are convinced that there are major problems in the source code, but where is your empirical proof of such a statement. If there is a problem, point it out, you can’t because there isn’t one and so there is nothing for MS ot state.

If you wish to slag something, provide proof of your statements because from the general composure of your post you ain’t as bright as you profess to be. Unless your original language is not english, I don’t know a university that hands out masters to someone bordering on illiterate.

you just jealous because i’m right

In reply to What builds have you tried.

You just rambling on I have thouroughly tested all versions & i have done cost benefit analysis.At least i havean informed
opinion & i don’t make off the cuff comments.It’s now 28/11/06 & i’m still right vista is crap!!!
ta mick

i know what’s happening at microsoft

In reply to I agree fully with Aaron

the long delay is that they are having major tchnical
hurdles
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

Vista is going to be just like XP

In reply to i know what’s happening at microsoft

The frist time I used XP I had to go Buy New Printers That were compatable with it. I like the new vista. but it does have a big compatablty problems, most of my old program are not compatable. I am a tight wade so I still use dial up so far the only modems that work are us robotics. I think it will come around. I think they should have gone to the other software companys sooner so they could develope new drivers sooner. I think in a few months it will be a different story

There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

In reply to Vista is going to be just like XP

That is in the Digital Signing of software. To be able to install software on Vista MS is claiming that it will have to be Digitally Signed just like the Hardware is now on XP. The only problem here is that if MS Pushed ahead along the same lines as Hardware Digital Signatures the companies involved [b]Can Not[/b] provide any support for different platforms.

At first I think that you’ll be able to install unsigned software but when the second version comes out 4 years after the original product release of Vista things might be very different and you’ll be unable to install any unsigned software. From what was said at the last MS Partners Meeting that I attended you will be unable to use any unsigned Hardware on Vista this was touted as one of the new Security Features but there may very well be resistance from the hardware makers as to get a Digital Signature they must sign a contract not to support any other platform. And the same is going to start being applied to Windows Software as well. There could very well be some major Software Houses who write software for various platforms who resist this change and this could force some users away from Vista.

This is MS’s way of ensuring Market Share but I don’t know how well it will work and this depends on just how happy business will be willing to accept being dictated to by MS. Currently the stated aim is to only allow Digitally Signed Hardware to be used with the original Vista and as Vista is going to be the backbone of all MS Development for at last the next 10 years things could get nasty. As MS is saying they are expecting to release 1 major update 2 years after the product release and then at the 4 year stage a new OS. So if MS stick to this we’ll be seeing 3 major updates along the lines of SP2 for XP and 2 new OS in the next 10 years which MS is expecting business to adopt very shortly after it’s release so that companies no longer will skip an entire product range like many did when ME & 2000 was released.

Many companies just continued using 98SE as it was still on sale and it even outsold XP until it was removed from sale so MS saw many companies completely skip ME & 2000 and move from 98 to XP when they where forced to upgrade their computer systems.

I don’t know how well this will work for MS and I guess that [b]Only Time Will Tell![/b]

It could be a brilliant move on the part of MS or it could backfire badly and make the choice to move to a different OS a really good idea to a lot of Business. I’ll be looking on with interest.

Col

Pure Speculation

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

1) Please provide proof other than something you heard at a MS Partners Meeting. You say things like that alot. For one, I believe that would be illegal and they’ll rightfully get sued over it. And for two, it would be market suicide and therefore they won’t do it.

2) Perhaps retail sales of Win 98 outsold retail sales of Win XP for some time, however, only 10% of all OS sales are done thru the retail channel.

The vast majority of OS sales are done thru new PC sales and volume licensing. In that area, Win XP won hands down.

Once again, it is you spreading the FUD this time.

Rick if you where a MS Partner

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

You could visit the Partners Web Site at MS and download the slide shows for your self. As you are not it’s pointless me giving you the link as you can not get in there to see for yourself.

As for the legality of MS D demanding that and providers who Digitally Sign their products look no further than Creative Sound Blaster. if you look for drivers for an AWE 64 you can find Windows, Unix & Linux drivers but if you look for drivers for the Live or latter sound cards there are only Windows drivers available. The only thing that has changed in that time is that Creative has got a Digital Signature for their product to work with Windows XP.

Instead of picking on me join MS and see for yourself you just might be surprised at what is happening.

Also the sales of 98SE according to MS sources and a slide from a Power Point Presentation clearly show 60% as Win 98SE and 40% as XP over all not just confined to one group. MS make these slide shows available to their partners shortly after the Road Shows so it’s all there for anyone who cares to take the time and effort to join up and look. 🙂

Col

BTW

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

Just read an article in Windows IT Pro that only the x64 version of Vista will absolutely require digitally signed drivers. Not the x32 version of Vista.

The vast majority of purchases in the near term (2 years maybe) will be x32.

Well I can only repeat what the people from MS tell us

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

If they have changed their minds on what they will and will not have in their [b]Secure Computing Platform[/b] that’s MS’s business not mine.

I’ve never said at any stage that I am getting MS do do something or other but I do rely on what MS tells it’s Partners as to how they will be proceeding. The current reasoning for Digitally Signed Drivers & Software is to make sure that there are no new holes opened in the OS that is predominately used by the majority of people the world over.

If MS wants to back away from it’s [b]Trusted Computing Model[/b] that’s their business not mine but just like [b]Win FS[/b] which was supposed to be at the core of Vista they may have encountered technical or legal problems that the people at MS didn’t anticipate but till the product actually reaches [b]Production[/b] and unless MS says other wise I would tend to believe them rather than some other authority with no direct connection to the development team at Redmond.

Col

What are you talking about.

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

Digital Signatures don’t have anything to do with whether manufacturers can support other technology, that would be illegal in 70% of Microsofts marketplace. If you sat through a partners meeting you would know that Digitally Signed Hardware can only be obtained from Microsoft and is more costly to obtain than earlier liscences. Too many past security flaws and other problems were due to poorly written drivers, that won’t happen again. There is another option and that is to have your hardware use universal driver support built into Vista, which also means that some functionality could be lost.

I find it strange you say you are a partner but by the info you are claiming is real are saying that MS is going to break every monopoly law on the books. I have sat through partner meetings and never heard any of what you claim.

Well I’ll repeat it again just for you

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

At the MS Partner meeting in Brisbane AU on the 22 May-2006 the MS people said that they would be only allowing Digitally Signed Software to be installed on the next version of Vista.

This is not the first version of Vista that we will see but the next generation as what is currently known as Vista is the basis of all MS products for the next 10 years. They expect to release a Service Pack every 2 years and a replacement OS every 4 years. They where not specific if they meant that the Digitally Signed Software would apply when the Service Pack was released of the next generation of Vista.

If you look at the Digital Signing of Hardware for MS this removes all cross platform support for that piece of hardware and generally speaking any cross platform support from that Hardware maker. If you think that this is not already happening I would ask you to show me the place on Creative Web Site that has drivers for any Nix OS for an Augicy ZX2 or for that matter any other of their new products all of which are digitally signed for XP.

Col
Re here for more info as it was written closer to the day.

http://tinyurl.com/hjej2

hal i have been to lot’s of MS for partners

In reply to There is one very big difference between XP & Vista

meetings I have to agree with you totally.I have
spoken to mS who have said virtually tough titties
if you don’t have digital signage or compatibility
problems.They say the onus is on the hardware manufacturer & not on them.
In fact given the current situation we can expect
complete sales drop for MS.Compared to other OS releases Vista will definitely flop big time.
MS has been caught out by lying to the poor old consumer again.
TA mick
oi you are numero uno on this site hal congrats!
you also TALK A LOT OF SENSE!

thanks

In reply to I agree fully with Aaron

i don’t think expreassing an opinion about a product
is really knocking MS.I for one would like to see them be successful.Bu after evaluating all the betas i’m convinced that it wont’t make it in the 64 bit area due to major technical reasons.

From experience

In reply to The Bottom Line

I loaded the latest (beta2) on an HP-Compaq tc4200 notebook.
From previous versions, beta2 ran smoother and faster (but took longer to install). It eats up almost 80 MB Ram less than previous versions tested. I was much more comfortable with this release than previous versions.
That said.. It stil needs lots of work. System resources are more in control with it, but many drivers are still unavailable or cannot install. Perfect example, I could not get the pen driver loaded (tablet pc). It failed every time, but when I erased the drive, setup XP and installed the driver, then upgraded, it worked fine. So the driver worked, it just wouldnt install.
But I tested the BOOT recovery option again, I havent done this since the first build. It still does not work well. I moved ntoskrnl.exe and booted, it errored (expected), instructed me to recover, asked for the disk, and ran a process. After a few minutes it asked if I wanted to run system restore ???? for a missing kernal? I said no, and it scanned for another 5 min or so and told me that nothing was wrong with the boot environment???????? This really needs some work.
Then I tried the new search. Unless I am searching the cd drive or the directory that I am currently in, it will not find anything. This may be an option that was disabled purposefully, but it is one of the ‘highlights’ of Vista, so why would it be disabled?

I didnt go further because it still needs a lot of work. I played with it for a day and blew it away, just waiting for a better release, or at least one where I can search and actually find something.

w2ktechman you are right!

In reply to From experience

Microsoft has a long way to go let’s not kid ourselves i have really tested vista & it has major short comings not like the other predessessors. ihave recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

spoken like a true professional…

In reply to The Bottom Line

concise, polite and directly to the point:
excellent reply, you could give a course on discussion responses!

I get tired of reading flames, it’s nice to read something positive.

Thank you, it’s a good start to the day.

thanks unclerob

In reply to spoken like a true professional…

you speak a lot of sense when you say that,i don’t speakharshly it’s a fact.
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

the bottom line is you are unsure

In reply to The Bottom Line

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

Enough already!!!

In reply to the bottom line is you are unsure

We have read your illiterate remarks enough already. If you don’t have something new, or at least in genuine english, to say, then shut up and color (I am sure you still have your crayons close by.) I don’t have a master’s in computer science or a PHD but at least I can spell and know when I have already said the same stupid things several times.

where did you come from & go back to

In reply to Enough already!!!

your black hole You should change your name txtopgun arseabout.You know jackshit you can’t even spell Phd properly.You show no respect to your elders & you don’t deserve any jack shit!
Did anyone say ashit head like you can make any comment as you know buggerall.
piss off
Dr Mick

Elders?

In reply to where did you come from & go back to

I would venture to say I am probably your elder for that matter. I started working with computers in earnest around 1982. Can you post the link to your pHD (yes I did it on purpose dummy) so everyone else can have one for their wall too?

Verification of elleged credentials

In reply to Elders?

I asked him to post when he got these alleged degrees and from what university so that they could be verified, but he hasn’t. Hmmm… I wonder why?

you obviously can’t count or spell

In reply to Elders?

I started in IT in 1976,that’s 30 years ago.You obviously can’t count.Also you did not intentionally
misspelt PHD as it stands for Poor Head Dunce.
If you started in 1982 you dunce you would be 24 years. HA HA
Ta Dr Mick Phd
ps you can go suck eggs

Hey numbnuts!

In reply to where did you come from & go back to

You have become the laughing stock of this place. I don’t think you have any idea how stupid you sound. If you indeed have a PhD in any field whatsoever you have singlehandedly done more to damage its credibility than all your predecessors combined. I am truly amazed they let creatures in padded rooms have computers! Your idiotic posts are no longer worth my time.

that’s it go away

In reply to Hey numbnuts!

if that’s all you can do well you are wasting my time & everyone elses so
go away
piss off
Ta Dr Mick

you know numbnuts your wrong & i’m right

In reply to Hey numbnuts!

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

eat crap you pig!
mick

where did you come from & go back to

In reply to Enough already!!!

your black hole You should change your name txtopgun arseabout.You know jackshit you can’t even spell Phd properly.You show no respect to your elders & you don’t deserve any jack shit!
Did anyone say ashit head like you can make any comment as you know buggerall.
piss off
Dr Mick
ps your so perfect you don’t make spelling mistakes!!

“Spelling” Ph.D.

In reply to where did you come from & go back to

“You know jackshit you can’t even spell Phd properly”

And for someone who allegedly has one, it appears that you can’t either. It’s Ph.D.

And who in the hell are you to criticize someone else’s spelling?

i could say the same about you

In reply to “Spelling” Ph.D.

You are a dumb arse idiot go play with yourself somewhere else as you have nothing to contribute here.
Ta Dr Mick Phd

whil’st there has been some strong points

In reply to Enough already!!!

in the development on vista.There have been many vulnerbilities not reported in the media.The kernel is not really as strong as they claim.despite assurances of stability.
ta mick

Experienced User Reporting

In reply to The Bottom Line

Please note that the ramblings are to be regarded as an ?opinion?.

Loaded Vista build 5291
Installation: The installation is the standard 2GB+ DVD variety and takes a long time. The good thing about the installation is that now you have two progress bars. The first one is labeled to the effect that user input will be required till this bar has fully progressed. The second bar then resumes the process, and this is where Vista?s setup will tell you that your input is no longer required. All you have to do now is wait until the installation process is completed, and delve right into it. According to our test results, it took approximately an hour before 5270 was fully installed.
We were quite surprised by the amount of disk space the installer required. It needs a minimum of 8GB+ of free disk space, which goes on to show Microsoft’s capitalization of cheap storage. Personally, we think that 8GB for a mere OS is a bit too much to ask, but considering Vista is still in Beta, maybe the required disk space will trickle down in the final version. It might even go up, so if you have a 40GB hard disk, be prepared to spare 20 percent of it just for the OS.
The upgrade option is currently available only if you have Windows XP with SP2 (a service release we personally detest so we did a fresh install), or if you have a previous build of Windows Vista installed. We didn?t have that either. When making a fresh install, it will not format the drive but will simply move all current Windows files to a folder labeled windows.old (quite possibly, it simply renames the Windows folder to that). The downside to this is that during the boot-up process, you will see both options for the OS, and thus you won’t be getting a clean and thorough install, which is a pity to say the least. You can, however, change this by editing the Advanced System Properties, but unlike in Windows XP, where you can create modifications and change the OS name altogether, here you can simply choose the default OS from a drop down menu.
An interesting quirk that we came across was that at the login screen, the display didn?t cover the entire screen (we used a 15.4″ widescreen display), but just a small portion of it. This happens only at the login screen, but once inside, there are no issues whatsoever. Apparently Vista is having some issues with widescreen displays, but it’s nothing serious.
Also, the system did not automatically take the native screen resolution of 1280×800 but was stuck at 1024×768. We had to manually correct it. Normally in XP, the screen resolution gets set automatically (for LCDs). Perhaps this is another pre-Beta 2 quirk.

Personally I don’t think that the production

In reply to Experienced User Reporting

Release of Vista will take up less Disc space if you look at the actual install it copies all the install files to the HDD and then proceeds to install from there. Once the Install files are copied across the DVD isn’t accessed again during the install.

I did a clean install on a [b]Blank HDD[/b] and had no problems in formatting the drive actually I formatted it into 2 partitions each about the same size on a 200 GIG SATA Drive. The Upgrade option is at best a Nightmare to work with but what I found the most interesting was the inability to install quite a lot of software.

Even some new MS Software wouldn’t install admittedly it was a game but the latest Age of Empires wouldn’t load while some old 98 game installed without a problem though the graphics where lousy.

Personally I’m waiting for an AV product that will install before I begin serious testing. I’ve singed up for the Trend Micro Beta Testing Program and until that becomes available latter this month I’m only having a play at the moment.

Col

hal you are right7 are confirming what isaid!

In reply to Personally I don’t think that the production

The problems you have come accross is the the tip of the proverbial iceberg.When we later find out that either our hardware or software will not work either in the realm of 64 bit or 32 bit as drivers for vista are incompatible.So in essence people will be forced to buy new systems & new hardware.Don’t think that i’m anti microsoft & or anty vista far from it.We just are going to be at the mercy at whatever comes our way.Like many we’l be the ones suffering!
As i said i have done some core testing & i have found big compatibility problems & i know beta is beta but will they fix it in time for release.

So far…. I’m not impressed.

In reply to Personally I don’t think that the production

But again, it’s a beta. The graphics were nice, but I couldn’t get passed picking my drive. It would not detect it and it is a known issue that SATA v2.0 support lacks severly.

good on you juice

In reply to So far…. I’m not impressed.

for expressing your opinion! all the best
we want responses like yours!

Heaps of people refuse to takeup vista for

In reply to So far…. I’m not impressed.

compatibility & stability reasons guess which software they’ll stay with.
ta mick

Vista AV

In reply to Personally I don’t think that the production

AVG now will install under the Beta 2 of Vista, so there is an anti-virus option available.

there are problems in recognition of

In reply to Vista AV

sata drives.Ms has admitted that vista has problems detecting sata drives.
ta mick

delay on vista causes other delays

In reply to Vista AV

Delayed Vista, Laptop-Battery Mess May Quash Holiday PC Sales
ta mick

wikipedia infected

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

Read more…
Wikipedia: hacked and infected!
The German version of Wikipedia has been hacked to spread malware to unsuspecting users. Will the sneaky ?social engineering? attacks of the hackers ever end?
ta mick

austrian programmer sets sight on vista

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

Virus writers are working on ways of hacking Microsoft’s new operating system Windows Vista.
An Austrian programmer has published examples of malicious code that exploits loopholes in technology which could be part of Vista.

The viruses affect Microsoft’s command shell technology which is expected to replace the current command prompt.

Vista, previously codenamed Longhorn, is due for release towards the end of 2006, half a decade after Windows XP.

2004 warning

Finnish security company F-Secure described the malicious code as proof-of-concept viruses to highlight potential vulnerabilities in Vista.

In company’s blog, F-Secure’s director of anti-virus research, Mikko Hypponen said: “The case is interesting historically, as these are the first viruses for a totally new platform.”

The viruses target MSH (Microsoft Command Shell), the technology that Microsoft is looking to use in Vista.

Security experts had warned about the possibility of virus writers exploiting MSH in 2004.

But it is unclear whether the technology will make it into the final version of Vista.

“It has lately been rumoured that MSH might not ship with Vista at all,” said Mr Hypponen.

“Instead [it] might be part of Microsoft Exchange 2006 or something. We won’t know for sure until later.”

Microsoft’s flagship Windows software already runs on about 90% of personal computers worldwide.

The firm has promised that Vista will take what for Microsoft is a completely new approach to computing, with security not an add-on but an integral part of the operating system.
ta mick

windows vista upgrade coupons

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

Microsoft later this month plans to roll out an Express Upgrade program that gives buyers of Windows XP-based PCs a coupon for a free or discounted upgrade to Windows Vista through March 15. As part of the deal, designed to drive PC sales though the holiday season, Microsoft will include coupons in each Windows XP SKU that will entitle users to a free or discounted Vista upgrade when the next-generation operating system ships in the first quarter of 2007, industry sources said.

ta mick

ms bullish on vista business uptake

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

In the first year of Windows Vista’s release, Microsoft Corp. is expecting businesses to adopt it twice as fast as any other version of Windows, with 10 times as many Vista business seats deployed at launch than any previous release of the operating system. Despite this optimism, analysts still don’t expect businesses to begin adopting Vista in earnest until late 2007 or even 2008, with many waiting for the first service pack version before they consider an upgrade.

ta mick

high definition gaming

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

NVIDIA unveils extreme high-definition gaming
General Manager of NVIDIA GeForce GPUs, Ujesh Desai, introduces you to the NVIDIA GeForce 7900 GTX, GeForce 7900 GT, and GeForce 7600 GT bringing extreme high-definition gaming to multiple market segments.
ta mick

legacy coding problems

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

It really is about legacy practices at MS, which through their re-use of code in “new” products causes its customers to suffer the consequences. They remain more interested in getting what they consider a new product out the door to maintain a revenue stream with no regard for those that have to deal with the awful coding practices of then & now.

benq reveals new vista monitors

In reply to delay on vista causes other delays

BenQ unveils Vista-approved LCD monitors
BenQ Corp. unveiled some new flat-panel monitors Thursday that have been qualified to work with Microsoft Corp.’s upcoming Windows Vista operating system
ta mick

how unready 64 bit is really is as stated by ms

In reply to Vista AV

Unbounded changes to the operating system ?kernel? can lead to system instability as well as the complete compromise of all software programs and hardware resources on a system. Consequently, the operating system kernel environment needs to be the most secure, reliable and trustworthy piece of code in Microsoft? Windows?.
64 bitMicrosoft Windows Vista? is not only the next version of Microsoft?s operating system; it is also an inflection point for security and 64-bit computing. How these two critical ecosystem changes are handled in Windows Vista will set the stage for the long-term vision of Windows as an even more secure and reliable operating system.

But what do we see is all ready no it’s a huge damn mess.
ta mick

it’s not installation problembut…

In reply to Experienced User Reporting

When we later find out that either our hardware or software will not work either in the realm of 64 bit or 32 bit as drivers for vista are incompatible.So in essence people will be forced to buy new systems & new hardware.Don’t think that i’m anti microsoft & or anty vista far from it.We just are going to be at the mercy at whatever comes our way.Like many we’ll be the ones suffering!
As i said i have done some core testing & i have found big compatibility problems & i know beta is beta but will they fix it in time for release.
i have gone beyond & tested the core functionality in comparison to XP it is mere cosmetic changes but in trying to function in the 64 bit architecture i have found huge poroblems.I for one would not want to be critical as if it was as easy to install as is to function.

vista is no longer a beta it still has major problems

In reply to Experienced User Reporting

are you the one that’s upgraded & done your dough??
ta mick

No actually Vista is now the final Beta Version available from M$

In reply to vista is no longer a beta it still has major problems

You buy the thing and then pay M$ a lot of money to fix the problems in the OS because it doesn’t work right and M$ get paid feedback to what they need to start to fix.

This is typical M$ Product Release Strategy since the DOS days though now the problems are far bigger and far more time consuming to fix and consequently you pay M$ far more to be told that, that bit isn’t working yet call back in another week and pay us another Thousand $ only to be told to call back the week after that. 😀

This is the perfect Money Making method that M$ has employed since the beginning of their products and as they make so much money out of it they are unlikely to change things ever unless Laws are changed and they have to provide the support for free like they do in AU because under our Law they have to supply a [b]Marketable Product[/b] which currently Vista isn’t.

Col

yep they allways say do you have an account with us

In reply to No actually Vista is now the final Beta Version available from M$

Some of the advice i’ve had over the years
is not worth paying for.As for vista they are going to generate heaps of money because of all the associated problems.At the moment all my pcs & my client’s pcs do not use or recommend vista usage at at all until such time as it’s fixed.
ta mick

The last time that I rang M$ Support

In reply to yep they allways say do you have an account with us

I was asked to ring back when I had a solution to the problem and tell them how I had worked around the problem. That was with SP1 for XP.

I guess that shows just how much I ring M$ for help but it also shows why I don’t need to as I’m pretty much left on my own.

But my all time favourite was back in the DOS days getting an error message that Device 6 was missing. After spending hours on the phone to M$ I was eventually told that I had failed to fit the CPU on a P 90 so I asked how I was getting a screen display without a CPU? Their answer was I had forgotten to fit the CPU a wipe of the HDD and reload cured the problem as it was obviously a install problem but I still get a good laugh whenever I think of that one. 😀

Col

well you have just added more support to my

In reply to Experienced User Reporting

thread that there’s heaps of problems which
people “hope”ms will fix .Pity the people that have equipment with no proper drivers.
ta mick

Thanks, Aaron.

In reply to The Bottom Line

That’s what I want to hear, as well – what was experienced by those who have tested/are testing Vista. I’ve got Beta2 CDs sitting here on my desk at home, and I keep looking at it….!!!

good point but….

In reply to The Bottom Line

The current scenario of symantec v MS proves what crap system is vista.Ms has been caught lying to the poor consumer.Symantec has tested vista & it has major reservations that vista is crap.
At the moment Google Is challenging Ms to the fact that google want’s to lead the development of operating systems.
ta mick

My initial appraisal was that it is not good

In reply to The Bottom Line

But after playing with it for a few days, it’s not bad.
I’m running it (RC1) on an AMD Thunderbird 1100 MHz system with 384MB of ram, and it sure isn’t very speedy, but it does work.
I’d be the last person to say Microsoft is wonderful, even though my job depends on supporting users running it, but if you have a reasonably modern system, you might like it.

well starderup results prove otherwise

In reply to My initial appraisal was that it is not good

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

ta mick

Vista, a short test

In reply to The Bottom Line

Well I installed vista since my laptop hard-drive took a dive and over all I think MS may have a very good product in the works. That being said, drivers for specialty apps/hardware is almost non-existant (to be expected with beta)I like the new functionality but one thing that floored me is that they took out hyperterminal. When you look for it it sais to use telnet. /shrug I just downloaded the hyperterminal shareware app and it worked fine. The one thing that cut my test short was that it did not take the drivers for my aircard so I could not work. Just my two cents.

that’s ok

In reply to Vista, a short test

youv’e had you 2 cents worth but you have installed vista & uyou’ve had problems with availability of drivers & relly hyperterminal is missing & you think that ms could do more to improve vista.
ta mick

vista users face big problems with oz internet telcos

In reply to that’s ok

BigPond and Optus broadband slip on Vista
7th February 2007 Dan Warne Internet, The Invistagator, Vista
Customers of the largest Australian internet providers face a wait of a month or more before they’ll be able to easily connect PCs running Vista up to broadband.

The problem stems from the largest providers’ use of cheap USB broadband modems rather than the marginally more expensive Ethernet ones that don’t require drivers.

The drivers required for the USB modems aren’t yet available from all modem manufacturers.

In fact, Telstra is refusing point-blank at this stage to connect new ADSL or Cable customers if they’re running Vista.

An Optus customer service representative told APC it would not be able to connect Vista users to Optus broadband until 1st March.

Whirlpool.net.au News Editor Phil Sweeney said it was time for providers to stop using cheap USB modems and spend a couple of dollars more per modem for ethernet models.

“USB modems made more sense in the past when computers didn’t have Ethernet ports built in, but these days they cause more problems with drivers than they’re worth and they’re generally considered to be less reliable,” he said.

He advised broadband users to check if their USB modem had an Ethernet port on the back as well and use that instead. However, he conceded that people might not be able to get much help from Optus or Telstra in configuring the modems, as neither company provides tech support to Vista users yet.

However, the problem this time round is compounded by the fact that most new computers being sold at retail now have Vista pre-loaded.

Microsoft’s stance on the modem problem
A Microsoft Australia spokesperson said the lack of drivers for USB broadband modems “Microsoft does not develop specific hardware drivers for broadband modem or other devices. This is the responsibility of the hardware vendor to develop the driver to meet new rules for device drivers in Windows Vista. Most companies are offering updated drivers via the vendor web site for download.”

“Vista has been in development for more than 18 months and the public date for launch known for about 3 months previously. At launch more than 1.5M devices work with Windows Vista and more than 4,200 hardware and software products have been through the rigorous Windows Hardware Quality Lab and Windows software testing process and received either a Certified for Windows Vista or a Works with Windows,” the company said.

Microsoft Australia could not immediately provide a list of USB modems that Vista supports in its shipping driverbase, but forwarded the enquiry to Microsoft USA for response.They are still waiting.

What the ISPs are saying
Telstra BigPond has published an FAQ stating that it will not be able to connect new customers to ADSL or Cable if they are running Windows Vista on their computers.

“Whenever a new operating system is introduced, hardware upgrades are required across the board. The launch of Vista means ISPs worldwide will be beholden to their hardware/modem suppliers for Vista drivers,” spokesperson Bronwyn Winley said.

BigPond only has drivers for its wireless broadband card so far, and if you buy a new Vista computer and want to get ADSL or Cable connected, don’t call Telstra.

OptusNet said it already supported six operating systems but “only recently learned that Vista brings with it some problem elements that require us to change our systems.”

It is now “fast tracking” the training of staff to support Vista users and expects to have this completed in “coming months”. The telco said it would work with customers on a case-by-case basis if they had problems with OptusNet and Vista.

On request for further information from Optus on whether the USB modems it has distributed to customers have Vista driver support but it refused.

Netspace Managing Director Stuart Marburg said his tech support team would start supporting Vista in coming months, but needed to make sure enough members of the helpdesk team were trained in Vista before officially supporting it. He said Netcomm had supplied Vista drivers for some of its newer modems — NB5 and NB8W, but Marburg said he wanted the technical team to test the drivers further before officially supporting them.

iiNet said it had trained all of its senior tech support staff on Vista and put Vista machines into its call centres. However, it said ongoing training of all the rest of the tech support staff was ongoing, so it was possible that customers may initially reach someone not yet trained in supporting Vista. In such cases, the customer could generally be transferred on to a Vista specialist perhaps at some indian call centre.

Internode said its long-standing policy of supporting any operating system that included TCP/IP holds true with Vista. “Internode as a matter of policy sells and prefers to support ethernet based modems for ADSL due to their demonstrated advantages in terms of compatibility and lack of USB driver issues,” Internode Managing Director Simon Hackett.

What the modem makers say about Vista compatibility
Linksys told APC it was planning to support Vista on “select” devices and it has published a list of models that are currently supported or have drivers “coming soon”. An ominous footnote at the end of the page states “If your Linksys product does not appear on any of these three lists, there is no plan to support the product with Windows Vista.”

Linksys models listed as having Vista drivers “coming soon” include AG241 and WAG54G.

Billion Australia said the company had only ever shipped a small quantity of one USB modem at the request of a particular ISP, preferring instead to sell Ethernet models that did not require drivers. He said Billion Electric in Taiwan had not announced plans for Vista driver support for this model, BiPAC 7001, at this stage.

Belkin modem product manager Anthony Malone said “Our F5D5730au v3000 has USB drivers for Vista. We are in final testing and should have them posted to our web site by mid Feb.” Belkin will offer tech support on products the company has been able to qualify as working with Vista.

NETGEAR said none of its current ADSL modems or modem/routers include a USB port. However, some older single port-modems, the DM602 (discontinued in 2004) and the DG632 (discontinued in 2006) included a USB port, but also included an Ethernet port. “At this stage, it does not appear NETGEAR will be able to release Vista-compatible USB drivers for either of these devices. However, both devices do also contain an Ethernet port which does not require driver support, and will therefore work with Vista,” the company said.

“All NETGEAR’s router and modem products are administered using a web GUI, and are able to be administered from a Vista PC without any need for an update. NETGEAR is currently rolling out formal support for customers using Vista. In the meantime, support is being provided on a best-effort basis. ”

D-link said it was working ‘full steam ahead’ on Vista drivers for its USB modems and had added 20 drivers in the past day (including drivers for its current-model DSL-200 and DSL-502T USB modems) to its tech support site.

The company is offering tech support for customers having difficulty getting their modem working with Vista, and is currently in the process of setting up a dedicated Vista page on its web site to make it easier for customers to get drivers.

Netcomm said it had released drivers for the NetComm have released Vista drivers for the following products:AM5066, NB1, NB5 series, NB6 series, NB8W, NP542 / NP543 / NP544 and would have Vista drivers for other wireless and USB products “shortly”.

Draytek, Thomson/Alcatel and OPEN Networks were contacted but are yet to respond.

… and then there’s wireless broadband
Wireless broadband services that use PCMCIA cards for laptops are also beholden to their hardware providers writing Vista drivers.

Unwired said it had already produced new drivers for customers with the PCMCIA card and customers could either call in to get a CD posted to them, or download them from the Unwired web site when they’re made available in a few days’ time.

“Like most people, we’ve known about Vista for a fair while — we’ve been monitoring it for the last 12 months and been working with the developer for the last two months,” Unwired spokesman Tyson Bowen said.

Competitor iBurst said it had beta drivers available and expected to have final drivers available by the end of the month.

The Telstra BigPond Wireless PCMCIA card has Vista drivers available, however customers would need to download and install the latest BigPond Wireless Connection Manager software.
ta mick

nividia faces class action

In reply to vista users face big problems with oz internet telcos

NVIDIA owners threaten class action over Vista drivers (or lack of them)
6th February 2007 Dan Warne PC Hardware
Sprung: an NVIDIA video card with “Windows Vista Ready” labeling in-storeGPU giant NVIDIA is facing a possible class action by irate users who claim they were mislead by “Vista ready” logos on NVIDIA graphic card packaging.

The threatened lawsuit stems from the fact that NVIDIA is yet to ship final Vista-compatible drivers, while its arch-rival ATI released final drivers on the same day Vista was released to consumers.

A website — http://www.nvidiaclassaction.org — has been set up to collect the grievances of NVIDIA GPU owners.

NVIDIA’s latest beta Forceware drivers, version 100.59, work for some people but not others. The company has been struggling to get GeForce 8800 cards working properly under Vista, despite marketing them as having DirectX 10 compatibility.

An earlier version, 97.46, is listed as being WHQL certified and is not listed as a beta, however a bold disclaimer notes, “These NVIDA Windows Vista drivers are under development. This version is not fully optimised for full 3D performance and may not include all available features available on different operating systems. NVIDIA, along with the industry, is continuing to update its Windows Vista drivers to ensure maximum performance on 3D applications and add support for features.”

The company goes on to say, “These drivers are provided “AS IS.” NVIDIA MAKES NO REPRESENTATIONS OR WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND WHATSOVER AS TO MERCHANTABILITY, COMPATIBILITY, PERFORMANCE, APPLICATION OR FUNCTION, AND DISCLAIMS ALL SUCH WARRANTIES TO THE FULLEST EXTENT ALLOWED BY LAW.”

In other words, “they may not work — don’t sue us.”

The problem with that is that NVIDIA has been marketing many of its graphics cards as “Vista ready” for months, which, it could be argued, has influenced the buying decisions of thousands of people.

While NVIDIA may argue that “Vista ready” means something specific, consumer law generally uses the interpretation of the ordinary consumer to judge what an advertising claim actually ‘means’.
ta mick

it’s a disgrace

In reply to nividia faces class action

Logitech, Creative, NVIDIA driver disgrace
1st February 2007 James Bannan PC Hardware, Vista, Windows
OK, time to rant for a bit. Vista is out and I?d like to be able to upgrade my main home computer. I?ve got the software ? all I need to do is throw in the DVD and I?m away.

Why do I want to upgrade? Well, I?d like to be able to put forward loads of cogent arguments as to why Vista is such an incredible operating system for home users, but I?d need to ingest a few mind-bending substances before I could.

To be honest, other than some nice extra applications and a new look, I can?t think of a single, substantial reason for any home user to spend the bucks and move away from Windows XP.

I?m only considering it myself because I?d be letting myself down as an IT journo and desktop administrator not to.

And yet, I can?t upgrade. Why not? Well, I have this embarrassing problem of owning a Creative Audigy 2 ZS soundcard and a Logitech MX3000 keyboard/mouse combo.

They?re great products and I love using them, but apparently both vendors approach new operating systems with the same amount of trepidation as you?d approach a cobra.

The final, shipping version of Vista has been out for two months now to business and hardware vendors and now every version of Vista is commercially available.

And yet, Creative is still only offering beta drivers. Still, that?s better than Logitech, who aren?t offering ANY Vista solution for current devices using SetPoint at all. Actually, that?s not exactly true ? there is version 3.3 of SetPoint available, which supports a couple of the very latest Logitech keyboard/mouse combos, but nothing for other, reasonably recent devices. Guess there?s little benefit to being a loyal Logitech customer.

Considering the sheer length of time manufacturers have had to get their drivers ready for Vista, it?s nothing short of disgraceful to find two apparent industry leaders caught in such a position ? incapable of offering their customers a smooth transition to a new operating system.

Actually, make that three industry leaders ? NVIDIA won?t have their final-release Vista drivers out for about another month. AMD had theirs out the same day Vista was released. Intel had the vast majority of their final release drivers out when Vista RTM was released. Pay attention the rest of you ? it CAN be done! You?re just waaaaaay behind!

I?ve spent a lot of money on my system and I?m certainly not going to spend more on it just because a couple of manufacturers haven?t got their act together. Guess that Vista upgrade is just going to have to wait — either that, or I upgrade my hardware to something compatible and vow never to buy Logitech, Creative or NVIDIA ever .
ta mick

Nvida end users

In reply to nividia faces class action

think it time that someone files a class action suit against Nvavida for providing faulty software (drivers) to their end users for the hardware they sell. They provide little or no support and continue to provide faulty drivers for their hardware.
If anyone out there has legal expertise would like to assist, I am sure many end users would sign the necessary documents
Please feel free to contact me at wallballster@gmail.com
Larry Wall

My Aplogies George……..Aaron :D

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

I Meant to place this in the main topic line and not yours.
Sorry about the mistake.
Regards
Aaron

thats all right

In reply to My Aplogies George……..Aaron :D

i still say vista is a krap system!

thats all right

In reply to My Aplogies George……..Aaron :D

i still say vista is a krap system!

Monopolies

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

Microsoft is the perfect example of what is wrong with monopolies – Vista is reported to have 50 mil lines of code! No one at microsoft knows what is going on in the code – no one except the antichrist (Gates) has been there that long. Nothing with 50m lines of code an be stable (I say that having spent over 30 years in IT)- by luck of timing and stupidity on IBM’s part – Gates and company became a virtual monopoly on the desktop – and now we all suffer for it. Not only will Vista be full of security holes and a resource hog – but it will have many more “Big Brother” “features” built in. Just try to dup a new dvd with Vista. I for one have decided to begin learning lenux I stopped using Internet Explorer,& Outlook and always look for something other than Microsoft software for any application I want. You will not see anything good come out of Redmond until Gates & Co. have some real competition.

I couldn’t agree more

In reply to Monopolies

The bottom line is: If you want to be part of the world you will need
to use Vista at some point. I will get it when I’m good and ready
(and that will depend, in part, on when MS can get it together). I
don’t like the “Big Brother” features and MS getting involved in DRM
issues. All this just tightens its clamp on the OS business. I just
wish it was possible for PC users to have another choice other than
to use Linux.

MS doesn’t really have a choice on DRM.

In reply to I couldn’t agree more

The MPAA and RIAA wrote the DCMA and paid its way through Congress. If Windows pcs are to have access to protected content, they must support DRM. I don’t like it any more than you but I can’t write checks to compete with Hollywood.
As for other choices, there’s always Apple. Oh, wait. They have their very own DRM (FairPlay – well, fair to Apple in any event), don’t they?

Just say NO to ‘protected content’

In reply to MS doesn’t really have a choice on DRM.

Certainly we aren’t so addicted to Hollywood that we need DRM’ed content, do we?

For that matter, I still use W2000. It is far better than XP in most ways. Vista is a no-go for me. By time that W2000 won’t run on current hardware, Linux will have gotten good enough that we can walk away from M$ altogether.

already there..

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

someone will find a way around DRM, they always do. i have a copy of Win2k Pro, but i encountered stability issues with SP4 and it crashed out and i was presented with the BSOD. after being forced to reformat four times, i reinstalled XP w/SP2 and haven’t really had many problems since…so i can’t say win2000 is any better then XP. As Far as Linux goes, i’m already using it…in fact i’m using Ubuntu 5.10 “breezy badger” while i type this. I must say Linux has come a L O N G way in the last few years. now there is a way to read and now write to a NTFS file system under linux. WiFi is now supported. From what i hear Myth TV works quite well now. Linux is making some very nice advancements now…except grub…that never seems to change. There are a few Distros that are targeted at the expected migrating windows users. while some don’t support proprietary format out of the box, the codecs are in repositories for download, so with a little effort those coming from windows shouldn’t have too much trouble(given the great support of each respective linux community, and of course google 😉 ) i have NeverWinter Nights diamond edition v1.67 working under linux (and it hasn’t crashed once by the way), so i’m perfectly happy on linux.

you are 110percent right

In reply to already there..

i respect your right to use any system you want.
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

Don’t be so sure.

In reply to already there..

I’m not an expert on things like this, but from what I read, it probably won’t be possible to hack the new DRM measures for HD content. Just because the DVD standard was cracked doesn’t mean in the future it’ll be so simple.

Hollywood was careless with the CSS standard, it was weakly designed, they didn’t have any experience with that kind of thing before.

However, now it’s much more sophisticated. Not just the actual content is DRMed but all the hardware (many supposedly HD-ready monitors and video cards won’t be able to play HD content at full resolution because they didn’t include the HDCP drm). When the whole system is protected it just isn’t likely or possible.

Also, the new standard uses a much higher grade encryption than CSS. From what I read, it would all the computing power there currently is in the world more than like 100 billion years to crack, basically longer than the lifespan of the universe.

Finally, when Hollywood releases a new HD disk, they specifically program it so only devices with certain keys will work with it. So even if, say, an HDTV manufacturer’s key is made public, and then someone releases devices to strip the copy protection from them, they’ll just revoke that specific key so new DVDs won’t work with it anymore.

Again, if you care about things like fair use and your rapidly-disappearing digital rights it’s best to speak up now before they become history (the EFF is a good site to look at). This has to be widely opposed and the DMCA should be reformed or revoked.

Again, I’m not saying it’s impossible at some future point there won’t be a way around the DRM, however it’s probably naive to just do nothing and take for granted that hackers will solve this, just because they’ve done so at times in the past.

you arespot on!

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

in answe to jdwar there are means & ways people can work around

In reply to you arespot on!

the copyright protection.Just because the say it’s foolproof doesn’t mean it is.The more they think that they’ve solved the problem when they haven’t.You make a valid point but in due time everyone will be circumvent all forms of protection.
ta mick

Right On!!!

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

Dude – you got it! The ONLY (and I mean ***ONLY***) reason I’m running WinXP is for the LCD Cleartype feature. If I still had any CRT monitors, I would still be using Win2000. It is a FAR superior OS! No bloat, runs fast, and is more secure! I have every stupid animation/shadow/slow-your-system-down XP “feature” set to OFF. Anywhere XP offers a “2000-like” setting, I have it selected. XP sucks, plain and simple. Vista will be worse. Just wait until M$ starts deleting stuff from your hard drive, because they determined you don’t have proper rights to it. Welcome to Vista, and DRM-extreme!

As for XP security; Did you know you can walk up to any WinXP machine, feed it an XP boot disk, and be in? Try that with Win2K. Doesn’t work!

I have to agree… by the time I’m forced to run Vista, I’ll have all *nix systems. M$ will have no one to blame but their DRM-kissing selves.

Well…

In reply to Right On!!!

Use the sub-pixel smoothing feature in Linux and switch now…we don’t want whiny people using “our” OS.

You complain and complain about Windows but I’d bet you have used it since Win 3.1. So many people on TR complain about Windows yet most still use Windows and not Linux or they use both and not Linux exclusively. Put your money where your mouth is.

One man’s bloat is another man’s feature. Notice Linux is getting awful bloated lately?

Have you tried a beta version of Vista or are you just ranting again?

Who needs a XP boot disk? I can get into any version of Windows, including your acclaimed 2000, with a Linux CD.

About the only thing I can agree with you here is about the DRM. However, that’s being driven by outside forces as much as it is by Microsoft.

BTW, good luck with your W2K security.

your right on the bloat,the feedback i got was

In reply to Right On!!!

that 2000 is stable & people swear by it.So bloat is not the answer.Lean is mean.Also i have met heaps of people who refuse to use ms internet explorer & also ms products that ms can monitor.
ta mick

100 % right there son vista is not good enough

In reply to Right On!!!

We are all using XP until & if Ms get’s it’s act together it is a big flop.You can only use the dvd as an expensive coaster!
ta mick

you would expect that in the coming months

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

But seriously: You should expect a whole lot more of this “Windows Vista” coverage in the next few months. Note that none Of it will be negative and none of it will mention the features which should have made it in if Microsoft actually paid any attention to people outside their payroll.
Do you think that ms realy cares.
not on your nellie.
ta mick

vista is scrap

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

But seriously: You should expect a whole lot more of this “Windows Vista” coverage in the next few months. Note that none Of it will be negative and none of it will mention the features which should have made it in if Microsoft actually paid any attention to people outside their payroll.
Do you think that ms realy cares.
not on your nellie.
ta mick

Vista = crap

In reply to Just say NO to ‘protected content’

I stopped using windows at home years ago. I’ve been a Linux user since 1998 and I currently use it as my only operating system at home. Windows, in any variety, is a complete joke, and I cannot believe consumers and businesses have been misled by microsoft into buying it. It is the worst implementation of an operating system I have ever seen. Vista is just one more steaming pile by microsoft that consumers will have to put up with until the next version.

OK, will get off my soapbox now 🙂

Solution for the DRM problem

In reply to MS doesn’t really have a choice on DRM.

Run vista virtualized under an Linux distro….
I am currently doing that with xp pro. Or when its possible run something like DSL (damn small linux) virtualized. With a good system you can run both without a problem. And when something gets infested with DRMs reload them. Virtualization is so fun.

you arespot on!

In reply to Solution for the DRM problem

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

the spider is tangled in it’s own net!

In reply to MS doesn’t really have a choice on DRM.

The bottom line is that they were to release 64 bit & it has many shortcomings & the future is not rosy with DRM.
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

IF you have such incredible skills and you have “Done it”

In reply to the spider is tangled in it’s own net!

WOW – GEEZ — The Computer Buddha– I think we should all bow down, for this man has done it all.
First and foremost go back to school where you got yor masters and ask them to teach you to type.
Now if you can get over your self without tripping over your inflated ego take your much vaunted (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/vaunted) skills and develop your own operating system so I can install it on my computer systems, which would im sure would make me the envy of the computing world

MS vista is a complete failure employees have finally

In reply to the spider is tangled in it’s own net!

admitted.Microsoft employees in Vista revolt

Bring me the head of Monkey Boy

By Nick Farrell: Thursday 23 March 2006, 07:22

WHILE THE markets and the IT press are castigating Microsoft for releasing Vista late, it appears that Vole is suffering from an attack from its own staff over the decision.
According to an insider bog, the staff are up in arms about the move.

The blog is fuming that Microsoft will not only miss the back to school market, but will also now lose the Christmas sales period.

“Vista’s deployment is going to come from people buying CPUs with the OS pre-installed, not dancing down the CompUSA aisle as they clutch that boxed version of Vista to their loving chest,” the bog says.

The bog, which is backed by hundreds of similar comments from Microsoft employees, says that managers should be offering their resignations for the delay. Other comments called for the head of “Monkey Boy” while others said that it is time for a shareholder revolt.

“Vista is the biggest software development failure of all time, IBM’s office vision was the previous record holder, with $900 million spent? Vista has cost five or six billion,” the poster moaned.

However, one person, who claimed to work in the Windows department said that Vista simply was not ready to ship.

“If you had spent the last five years of your life grinding away to get this thing out the door, you would have realized the only thing worse than slipping the date, would have been to lay a turd in August. Those of us in the trenches (front-line L61 PM here, on a real feature set, not one of those useless COSD bureaucrats) see exactly what bugs are between us and shipping.” ?
well guys i’ve been saying this all allong
at the risk of saying what the hell i told you so.
ta mick

vista is a failure

In reply to MS vista is a complete failure employees have finally

RapidFire
Jan 27th, 2007 at 15:33
It is a failure, look at the reviews at download.com on that thing, it?s stupid.

And woah, $400+ for that thing? (check out my blog for an ironic pic on that price thing) So I spend what, 3 years mastering XP to make it stable enough so it doesn?t keep freezing over and over and crashing and so on, and now vista which users say has things moved around so that you have to rememorize where stuff is? Hell no.

Plus you can skin xp with all that stuff out there now. It?s too late for that windows tilting feature to get that much good use of it, there?s probably some freeware out there that has some more efficient way of seeing what window is where anyways, and with firefox and other tabbed browsers (besides IEcrap7) who cares about tilting?

And linux has some weird ability to not just tilt, but rotate windows in a cube form (like the borg, that was cool, heh).

Look world, forget vista, here are your healthy choices:

1. XP
2. OSX
3. Linux
4. Amiga

Bye vista, you?re 5 years late to class, F-.

2 CD
Mar 6th, 2007 at 7:42
Good for Landfill at the local tip, the shiny disc surface might scare some seagulls to relieve their contents on it.

3 Gordon Sutton
Mar 9th, 2007 at 22:01
VISTA = Expensive FAILURE

4 Gordon Sutton
Mar 9th, 2007 at 22:02
VIST – Latest ME failure

5 Jonathan
Mar 26th, 2007 at 11:09
I used Microsoft for the majority of my life. I am a Master level user, and only up until 5 years ago did I discover the wonder that is Mac OsX.

One of my good friends works at Office Depot as a salesman, and I said to him, ?so?How has Vista gone??

..and he just sighs out, rubs his face and says??I don?t even wanna talk about it dude?

Yeah? that pretty much says it all.

Leave a Reply
Name

Mail (will not be published)

Website

——————————————————————————–
? Back to driving ? damnI still got it? ?
——————————————————————————–

vista is a failure=dude

In reply to MS vista is a complete failure employees have finally

CD
Mar 6th, 2007 at 7:42
Good for Landfill at the local tip, the shiny disc surface might scare some seagulls to relieve their contents on it.

3 Gordon Sutton
Mar 9th, 2007 at 22:01
VISTA = Expensive FAILURE

Reply

In reply to MS doesn’t really have a choice on DRM.

They don’t have to. Whatever shady deal went on, Microsoft doesn’t (and never) object to it. Besides most computers run Windows, and Micrsoft is probably bigger than any singly Hollywood studio, so it could resist the pressure if it actually cared about the consumers.

Also, Fairplay is NOTHING compared to Hollywood’s standards for HD-DVD and HDCP. Many HD televisions, computer monitors, and graphics cards (even the latest ones) won’t even be able to play it, not because they can’t, but because hollywood won’t let them.

defintely right there

In reply to Reply

I’ts more of a push for the consumer to part with their money,whether it’s the right thing to do is another matter.
ta mick

Another OS?

In reply to I couldn’t agree more

“I just wish it was possible for PC users to have another choice other than to use Linux.”

Heard of BSD? It’s *not* Linux.

you are right

In reply to Another OS?

yes vista is another system…And with lot’s of shortcomings.You wonder why they are pushing it so hard i’ts themight $.
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

other than —

In reply to I couldn’t agree more

What about Mac??
Besides, the only real issues with Linux for beginners is installing apps, setup config, and app availability.
I am currently running Linux SUSE 10 on KDE and have gotten pretty good at the basic things. I cant play a DVD yet (trouble installing media players) but after 2 days of it I was able to get myself up and running with Thunderbird email, Opera and Firefox (and Konquerer) browsers (all 3 are working), dual screen on a notebook, setup background and some security, setup printers, figured out how to communicate with my XP boxes, etc.
In other words, it originally took me longer than that to learn Win 95. I can do most of my work with SUSE now, with just a few days of getting to know it.
However, I still wish for a better install system. I hate browsing for companion files and making 7 or 8 downloads and installing them all (in a certain sequence) to get 1 program working.

Linux for the masses try Linspire

In reply to other than —

I am using Linspire and have only had some minor problems with it. The best part is their software installation process. As long as you have a fast internet connection it works very well. They have many free products in their CRM warehouse and they install without much user interaction. The downside is that you have to pay for the OS and the service. When you consider value for the dollar though it is pretty cheap. For about $49.00 a year you download and install all of the free applications you want, including Open Office, Firefox, Opera, Realplayer, etc. The OS can be purchased for about $49.00 also.

Their tech support is knowledgeable and responsive, much more so than MS. When I needed them they provided support not a way to find support. The fix worked the first time.

If you are looking for an alternative give them a try. Until some OS other than MS starts getting paying users, they will always be second rate. Linux is a strong kernel and with some standardization and funding could put MS on the run. This would result in better MS products. Look at Intel; until they were pushed by AMD they made slow progress, as they felt it was profitable. When they started to get their butt kicked, they came up with Conroe.

As for Mac being competition, didn’t Gates bail out Mac not too many years ago? Does anyone remember the Godfather?

spot on you are right & microsoft iswrong!

In reply to I couldn’t agree more

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

Please learn to edit.

In reply to spot on you are right & microsoft iswrong!

For someone who is allegedly a code writer, could you please learn to edit your posts. It really is not necessary to keep posting the same thing over and over again. Please. If you want to get real adventurous you could also give spelling and punctuation a run.

point taken

In reply to Please learn to edit.

it’s more when you are on the fly,rush rush,keys on key board sometimes stick,kids spilling drinks.
point taken much appreciate it.
ta mick

Whatever

In reply to Monopolies

I don?t necessarily like everything MS does but you know what? Deal with it. I respect your over 30 years of exp. But instead of bashing do something about it. Get some business savvy and start pushing the OS of your choice. It wouldn?t matter who is heading up the best OS out there. The same bashers now would be the same bashers then. It doesn?t take a rocket scientist to do a search of other OS?s security flaws.

Oh and 80% of the time I use Linux.
Its just a favorite past time to bash the leader. Be a little more constructive.

BIG trouble with vista compatibility

In reply to Whatever

From zdnet forum by david berlind
Trouble in Vista paradise? Large software vendor warns of major compatibility problems and burdensome remedies.
Intuit, developer of one of the world’s most popular accounting applications used in small, medium and large businesses (Quickbooks), has notified its customers by email that Windows Vista is incompatible with some of the features of Quickbooks 2006. According to the email (see a complete image of it here) from Intuit senior vice president of QuickBooks Brad Smith:

You may have heard about the upcoming release of Microsoft’s new operating system, Windows Vista. Microsoft has made significant changes to how software runs on Windows Vista.

I’m sending you this important service alert because you are using a 2006 or earlier version of QuickBooks software.

Since QuickBooks 2006 and earlier versions were developed and released before the introduction of Windows Vista, these versions may be adversely affected when used on computer running Windows Vista.

This will impact Simple Start, Basic, Pro, Premier, Payroll and Point of Sale, as well as other QuickBooks products and services. We recognize that your QuickBooks software is an important business tool and apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.

Smith’s e-mail goes on to describe what action is required on behalf of Quickbooks customers. For example, if they’re not going to be running Vista, they don’t need to do anything. But, if customers are upgrading to Vista, then they need to spend more time figuring out whether or not they’ll run into compatibility problems based on what features of QuickBooks they use. To do this, users are advised to visit Inuit’s Web site where the software company provides very detailed information on the affected features and what the remedy is.

Unfortunately, for many of the features, end-users are advised that they must switch on Windows XP compatibility and run Windows Vista with system administrator privileges. However, one of the cornerstones of Vista’s security and a long-time recommendation of Microsoft is to run Windows (even XP) as what’s know as a lesser privileged user or LPU. When running Windows with system administrator privileges, the risk that malware could enter the system and damage precious system files thereby destabilizing or ruining a PC altogether goes way up. Malware would of course have to find its way into the system in the first place. But security experts including those at Microsoft have always urged extreme caution when it comes to running Windows as a system administrator. Doing so gives software that’s installed on a PC (including any malware) access to sensitive areas that it wouldn’t otherwise have access to (thereby increasing the chances of a catastrophic event). So, in essence, one remedy is to deactivate one of Windows’ most important security features.

Beyond that, there is still another list of QuickBook features that are incompatible with Vista to the point that even switching into the XP Compatibility and Administrator modes won’t help. Here, the only remedy is to upgrade to QuickBooks 2007.

According to Intuit spokesperson Rachel Euretig, QuickBooks 2007 was launched in the Fall as a version of the software that was designed to be Vista compatible. Euretig told me that prior to that, there wasn’t much Intuit could do on the Vista compatibility front since the operating system was still in development. In an effort to be as communicative as possible, Euretig says the company is still searching for potential problems and taking a proactive stance when it comes to notifying customers of its findings.

Still, ZDNet reader Al Chartier who was the first to tip me off to the problem says he’s not satisfied. According to Chartier, Intuit’s suggested remedy means that he must pay $200 for QuickBooks Pro 2007 (editor’s note: Right now, Intuit is offering the software at a $20 discount) Euretig says that QuickBook customers who purchased Quickbooks 2006 on or after July 26th are entitled to a free upgrade to the 2007 version. Euretig also said there is no special upgrade price for existing QuickBook customers. All customers (new or existing) must pay the same price. According to Chartier, ” I won’t be buying any more Intuit software.”

In the bigger picture, the problem with QuickBooks raises new and very serious issues for Microsoft on the eve of Vista’s launch. If the software title was a small and very vertically oriented program that falls into the category of collateral damage that Microsoft must accept every time it releases a major new version of an operating system, the damage would be minimal. But Intuit is a software bellwether and QuickBooks one of the most popular software titles in the industry (Update: Euretig says that at the time of QuickBooks 2007’s launch, there were 3.7 million active users of QuickBooks).

Not only should the compatibility questions and remedies cause small and medium business users to reconsider any plans to upgrade, enterprises may need to put the brakes on as well. Intuit offers an enterprise version of its tools (starting at $3,000) which means that any large business that’s a QuickBooks customer that’s thinking of moving to Vista may have to think again. Not only must they examine how many users within the business might be impacted, they also must (a) look at the cost of upgrading should that be the only other remedy and (b) wait to see if other software vendors begin to issue similar warnings. Based on what Intuit’s Euretig told me, the company is still looking for problems other than the ones listed on its Web site; a situation that can only mean that other software vendors are doing the same. In other words, the full x-industry backwards compatibility report on Windows Vista is still in flux.

Earlier today, my colleague George Ou posted a blog on how backwards compatibility problems between ActiveX and the new version of Internet Explorer 7 are causing most of South Korea to hold off on upgrading to Vista because of how incompatibilities could interfere with that country’s banking system.

Another fire this snafu is sure to fuel is rhetoric from the part of the Web 2.0 camp that offers alternatives to locally hosted programs like QuickBooks. For example, this problem with upgrades is exactly the sort of problem that NetSuite CEO Zach Nelson uses to justify his browser-based hosted solution over his competitor QuickBooks. With browser-based hosted solutions such as NetSuite, compatibility with the browsers is all that’s important (and something that hosted solution providers like NetSuite have plenty of time to resolve).

I’ve reached out to Microsoft for its take on the issue with the position that Intuit is indeed a bellwether software developer and how incompatibilities with its software could cause the entire industry to take a deep breath. Not only does this affect potential upgrades to Vista on existing systems, the problem also has ramifications for hardware vendors who are hoping to capitalize on Vista’s launch by offering a slew of new systems that are pre-loaded with Microsoft’s new flagship OS. I’ve yet to hear back.
Intuit, developer of one of the world’s most popular accounting applications used in small, medium and large businesses (Quickbooks), has notified its customers by email that Windows Vista is incompatible with some of the features of Quickbooks 2006. According to the email (see a complete image of it here) from Intuit senior vice president of QuickBooks Brad Smith:

You may have heard about the upcoming release of Microsoft’s new operating system, Windows Vista. Microsoft has made significant changes to how software runs on Windows Vista.

I’m sending you this important service alert because you are using a 2006 or earlier version of QuickBooks software.

Since QuickBooks 2006 and earlier versions were developed and released before the introduction of Windows Vista, these versions may be adversely affected when used on computer running Windows Vista.

This will impact Simple Start, Basic, Pro, Premier, Payroll and Point of Sale, as well as other QuickBooks products and services. We recognize that your QuickBooks software is an important business tool and apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.

Smith’s e-mail goes on to describe what action is required on behalf of Quickbooks customers. For example, if they’re not going to be running Vista, they don’t need to do anything. But, if customers are upgrading to Vista, then they need to spend more time figuring out whether or not they’ll run into compatibility problems based on what features of QuickBooks they use. To do this, users are advised to visit Inuit’s Web site where the software company provides very detailed information on the affected features and what the remedy is.

Unfortunately, for many of the features, end-users are advised that they must switch on Windows XP compatibility and run Windows Vista with system administrator privileges. However, one of the cornerstones of Vista’s security and a long-time recommendation of Microsoft is to run Windows (even XP) as what’s know as a lesser privileged user or LPU. When running Windows with system administrator privileges, the risk that malware could enter the system and damage precious system files thereby destabilizing or ruining a PC altogether goes way up. Malware would of course have to find its way into the system in the first place. But security experts including those at Microsoft have always urged extreme caution when it comes to running Windows as a system administrator. Doing so gives software that’s installed on a PC (including any malware) access to sensitive areas that it wouldn’t otherwise have access to (thereby increasing the chances of a catastrophic event). So, in essence, one remedy is to deactivate one of Windows’ most important security features.

Beyond that, there is still another list of QuickBook features that are incompatible with Vista to the point that even switching into the XP Compatibility and Administrator modes won’t help. Here, the only remedy is to upgrade to QuickBooks 2007.

According to Intuit spokesperson Rachel Euretig, QuickBooks 2007 was launched in the Fall as a version of the software that was designed to be Vista compatible. Euretig told me that prior to that, there wasn’t much Intuit could do on the Vista compatibility front since the operating system was still in development. In an effort to be as communicative as possible, Euretig says the company is still searching for potential problems and taking a proactive stance when it comes to notifying customers of its findings.

Still, ZDNet reader Al Chartier who was the first to tip me off to the problem says he’s not satisfied. According to Chartier, Intuit’s suggested remedy means that he must pay $200 for QuickBooks Pro 2007 (editor’s note: Right now, Intuit is offering the software at a $20 discount) Euretig says that QuickBook customers who purchased Quickbooks 2006 on or after July 26th are entitled to a free upgrade to the 2007 version. Euretig also said there is no special upgrade price for existing QuickBook customers. All customers (new or existing) must pay the same price. According to Chartier, ” I won’t be buying any more Intuit software.”

In the bigger picture, the problem with QuickBooks raises new and very serious issues for Microsoft on the eve of Vista’s launch. If the software title was a small and very vertically oriented program that falls into the category of collateral damage that Microsoft must accept every time it releases a major new version of an operating system, the damage would be minimal. But Intuit is a software bellwether and QuickBooks one of the most popular software titles in the industry (Update: Euretig says that at the time of QuickBooks 2007’s launch, there were 3.7 million active users of QuickBooks).

Not only should the compatibility questions and remedies cause small and medium business users to reconsider any plans to upgrade, enterprises may need to put the brakes on as well. Intuit offers an enterprise version of its tools (starting at $3,000) which means that any large business that’s a QuickBooks customer that’s thinking of moving to Vista may have to think again. Not only must they examine how many users within the business might be impacted, they also must (a) look at the cost of upgrading should that be the only other remedy and (b) wait to see if other software vendors begin to issue similar warnings. Based on what Intuit’s Euretig told me, the company is still looking for problems other than the ones listed on its Web site; a situation that can only mean that other software vendors are doing the same. In other words, the full x-industry backwards compatibility report on Windows Vista is still in flux.

Earlier today, my colleague George Ou posted a blog on how backwards compatibility problems between ActiveX and the new version of Internet Explorer 7 are causing most of South Korea to hold off on upgrading to Vista because of how incompatibilities could interfere with that country’s banking system.

Another fire this snafu is sure to fuel is rhetoric from the part of the Web 2.0 camp that offers alternatives to locally hosted programs like QuickBooks. For example, this problem with upgrades is exactly the sort of problem that NetSuite CEO Zach Nelson uses to justify his browser-based hosted solution over his competitor QuickBooks. With browser-based hosted solutions such as NetSuite, compatibility with the browsers is all that’s important (and something that hosted solution providers like NetSuite have plenty of time to resolve).

I’ve reached out to Microsoft for its take on the issue with the position that Intuit is indeed a bellwether software developer and how incompatibilities with its software could cause the entire industry to take a deep breath. Not only does this affect potential upgrades to Vista on existing systems, the problem also has ramifications for hardware vendors who are hoping to capitalize on Vista’s launch by offering a slew of new systems that are pre-loaded with Microsoft’s new flagship OS. I’ve yet to hear back.
Well that means there are huge issues with vista & it doesn’t look like they are going to get resolved.
ta mick

gsaravine-last time I Post here-You know why Quickbooks won’t work

In reply to BIG trouble with vista compatibility

and it is because Intuit is lazy and designed it wrong. But then genius that you are. You already knew that. Why do youy think that Quickbooks was never certified for Windows XP. It was because they took shortcuts to communicate via the registry which MS has said since Windows 2000 came on sale, was the wrong way to do that.
]The Korea news is just that OLD news.
Just let the thread die=I am.
MIke

i do setups for small businesses & chartered

In reply to BIG trouble with vista compatibility

accountants occssionally & none of them want vista on their systems because of the unknown.They can’t afford to loose money & time on vista.
They are quite happy to stay with XP.
Similarly i don’t know of any financial institution or insurance companies that are ready to take up vista now or in the immediate future.There’s too much at risk!
ta mick
Ps michael you were off for a while i thought you might be sick

The honey moon is over with vista

In reply to BIG trouble with vista compatibility

Vista’s honeymoon is over
March 19, 2007
Icon

Despite the fanfare at its launch, Vista has received a mixed reaction, writes Roulla Yiacoumi.

AdvertisementIn one of the new “Get a Mac” ads on television, PC appears wearing a hospital gown, prompting Apple to ask if he’s going in for a check-up. “Well,” PC says, “I’m upgrading to Vista today, which is great, but I get a little nervous when they mess around with my insides.”

Apple fans may have a bit of a chuckle but early adopters who rushed out and bought Microsoft’s new operating system, Windows Vista, as well as more system and graphics memory, have failed to see the funny side.

Since Vista was launched on January 30, its creator has been racking up negative commentary.

“Utterly unimaginative, internally discordant and woefully out of tune,” was the verdict at Forbes.com . “Wait for half a year until the driver issues are settled and then buy a new PC,” the BBC instructed its readers. “Not yet ready for prime time,” USA Today wrote.

The blogosphere hasn’t been much kinder. Stories detailing lengthy installations, absent drivers, frequent crashes and overzealous “security” prompts are littered throughout the net.

One user angry at the limitations of Vista wrote a blog entry that struck a chord with hundreds of readers. Author and technology enthusiast Chris Pirillo of Seattle wrote “Vista: I’m breaking up with you” after installing and testing the operating system. He came up with a shopping list of problems he encountered including a non-functioning scanner, Windows Movie Maker crashing on a regular basis, Explorer losing settings and fax software that refuses to work under the new operating system. Pirillo has vowed to switch back to XP for his primary desktop machine.

“There are certain things I’m willing to deal with and live with,” he said. “But when it starts interrupting my productivity, my daily life, I can’t deal with it. I want to ask Microsoft to take stock of the situation. People who are buying Vista machines are having issues. What are you going to do about it?”

As the new operating system suddenly renders various peripherals and applications obsolete, Microsoft has moved quickly to hose down claims the operating system was rushed out the door in a less than perfect state.

Paul Randle, Microsoft Australia’s consumer audience marketing manager, says Vista has been received “phenomenally well” since its launch a month ago. “We completely refute the product wasn’t ready. Negative feedback has been in the minority.”

Randle says there are 1.5 million devices compatible with Vista and new drivers are constantly becoming available.

It’s too early for official sales figures but Australian retailers have reported strong activity. Rutland Smith, general manager of computers and communications at Harvey Norman, says the retailer will sell 50 per cent of all copies of Vista in Australia.

Smith says he’s been “thrilled” with Vista sales to date. There has been some increased demand for support, but this is normal, he says. “With the release of any new OS, you will see the occasional glitch.”

Given the increased hardware requirements, Smith says it’s important customers talk to sales staff to ensure they get the right version of Vista.

Even better news for Harvey Norman, of course, is that users will need to upgrade different bits of their PCs to get Vista working optimally. This year will be a very good one for hardware sales, Smith says.

Users should not be surprised better hardware is needed to run the latest operating system, says Martin Gilliland, research director at Gartner. “Microsoft has never tried to hide that fact or shied away from it,” he says. “If you want to get the new operating system, you will need to upgrade your hardware.”

Most consumers will avoid the upgrade route altogether and simply buy their next PC with Vista pre-installed. Gartner is predicting that by 2010, 72 per cent of machines sold to consumers will come with Vista.

And the rest? “Seven to 10 per cent will have Mac, less than 3 per cent will have Linux and the rest [15 per cent] will be people downgrading Vista to XP,” Gilliland says.

Sounds like a cue for another Mac ad.

MashUp Blog: What happened to the WOW?
Well there was no wow factor just as i had predicted performance has been woefull
& people by & large are pissed off with ms.
ta mick

Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

In reply to The honey moon is over with vista

Charging extra$$$ for an upgrade.
It is a woefull fact but.

Adobe Has No Plans To Make Current Products Windows Vista Compatible

Adobe says it has no plans to issue updates to the current versions of its products to ensure Windows Vista compatibility.

By Paul McDougall
InformationWeek

March 19, 2007 11:00 AM

Users of Adobe Systems’ digital publishing products, including Photoshop, InDesign, and Dreamweaver, will have to shell out for new versions of the software if they want to run them without glitches on Microsoft’s new Windows Vista operating system, Adobe says.

According to a statement posted on Adobe’s Web site, the company “does not plan to issue updates to current versions of those products for Windows Vista compatibility.”

That means users will have to pay hundreds of dollars to upgrade their Adobe software if they want trouble-free performance on Windows Vista, which is now preinstalled in virtually all new PCs shipping in the United States. That’s because the current versions of most of Adobe’s major products won’t work properly on the new operating system.

Adobe Photoshop CS2, for instance, requires users to register the software each time it’s launched on a Windows Vista PC, even if it’s already been registered. Dreamweaver 8, Adobe warns, will crash on some Vista computers when users browse for files. InDesign customers, meanwhile, may get a false error message indicating they do not have enough available disk space to run the product.

Adobe lists a number of other known Windows Vista compatibility problems for those and other products. Additionally, Adobe Acrobat 8 encounters errors when run atop the new Windows OS, but the company says it plans to issue a free patch in the first half of 2007 to resolve those issues.

The bottom line is that Adobe customers who are satisfied with the current versions of their software will have little choice but to pay for upgrades if they buy a new PC this year. Adobe says the newest versions of Photoshop, InDesign, Dreamweaver, and several other products will ship this spring and will be fully compatible with Windows Vista.

Tensions between Adobe and Microsoft may be partly behind Adobe’s less than warm embrace of Windows Vista, the consumer version of which launched in January. Adobe recently accused Microsoft of violating European Union trade laws, claiming that Microsoft’s bundling of Vista and the XML Paper Specification document creation application — a potential competitor to Acrobat — is anticompetitive.

Adobe officials were not immediately available to comment.
i knew this was going to happen as vendors aren’t willing to take the pressure from ms.Adobe isn’t so readily going to change.
ta mick

ongoing issues with vista

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

#1Latest DivX bundle causes Media Center to crash/hang

To my dismay, Media Center does not like DivX… Unfortunately, the only way to alleviate this would be to uninstall…

I’m trying to find a fix for this… hopefully I come up with something soon… or Microsoft (maybe)…
ta mick

ongoing issues with vista single drive vista installation

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

Single Drive Vista Installation

As it turns out, installing Vista Ultimate with more than one (1) HD connected is a No-No. You will receive an error message along the lines of…

“Windows is unable to find a system volume that meets the installation requirements”.

To get around this… just leave the drive that you are going to install Vista onto connected.

ta mick

issues with dial up modems

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

some modems supplied with dell systems is incompatible with . Dell has asked if I’d installed the old modem and when I told them I had they said I had to do a fresh system restore as Vista does not like uninstalling things. They also asked me to ring them to go through the new modem installation as it is not as straightforward as sticking the cd in, then plugging the modem in.
ta mick

ongoing issues with vista

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

1) My DVD-RW Drive (Pioneer DVR-710) isnt being recognized. Its just not there. I have spotted it a couple times but it goes away with a restart. (All cables are plugged in and it was functional with XP). This is highly irratating.

2) Creative Xfi Extreme Gamer sound card does not function correctly. This may be because it is a BETA vista driver, but any info out there helps put my mind at ease. My speakers are set at 5.1, but the surround sound satellites do not work correctly. Additionally, Vista was giving me only two options in control panel: Mono, or Stereo. I have 5.1…. why would Vista tell me I dont? Is it driver-related?
ta mick

Partners point out ten annoying problems with vista

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

Partners report 10 annoying Vista problems as conflicts dampen debut
By Paula Rooney, CRN Platforms & Applications

Vista users facing a higher than usual number of conflicts.

Partners are annoyed by the abundance of software and hardware incompatibilities surfacing as Windows Vista is deployed to more early adopters.

The software giant launched Vista and a companion update called Windows Vista Application Compatibility Update to the market on January 30.

That update, KB929427, handles some of the more problematic application incompatibilities, but the nightmare is far from over, partners say.

It’s typical for these conflicts to appear shortly after an operating system is released. The big problem with Vista is not only the number of incompatibilities with existing applications but also the lack of drivers for critical hardware components and hardware peripherals, partners say.

One partner said he is surprised by the lack of Vista drivers available for basic hardware components that keep a PC running.

“Customers upgrading Vista in place may find getting support for existing hardware very challenging,” said Phil Aldrich, North American Microsoft Practice Manager for Dimension Data North America, a US$3.1 billion solution provider.

“Tons of vendors haven’t done Vista drivers and that’s left a big hole in support. I can understand when it comes to printers and scanners, but when we’re talking about hard drives, chipset controllers and video cards, things that run the PC, it’s surprising,” he said. “It’s not just peripherals but primary component manufacturers aren’t ready, and that unusual compared to the previous releases of Windows.”

According to various solution providers contacted by CRN, here are the 10 biggest problems faced by early adopters of Vista out of the gate:

1. Lack of available drivers from ISVs causing application conflicts;

2. Lack of available drivers for existing and new peripherals and hardware components;

3. Buggy drivers;

4. New security feature often flags existing applications as suspicious and interrupts service;

5. Few applications aside from Vista and Office 2007 take advantage of user account control;

6. Customers are confused by Office 2007’s ribbon-like user interface;

7. The OS automatically recommends which Vista versions is best for each PCs configuration. This will cause small businesses to download different versions of Vista;

8. Benefits of Vista and Office 2007 running together are not obvious. Partners and IT staff need training for maximum ROI;

9. Deployment isn’t easy. Partners should use either Business Desktop Deployment tool, “lite” BDD no-charge tool or other tools;

10. Hardware doesn’t run Windows Vista well.

Some speculate hardware and software manufacturers have invested little in updating their current products because they expect most customers will buy a new and associated products to run Vista.

Aldrich maintains, however, that many installed PCs are properly equipped to handle Vista and Office 2007 and the idea that customers must buy new PCs is a myth.

Partners and IT pros are also facing problems with peripherals.

“There’s not enough drivers out there. Peripherals manufacturers are not all up to speed with Vista, so be careful what you buy,” said Anthony Rodio, chief marketing officer at Supportsoft, a Redwood City, Calif., partner that provides helpdesk support for Windows Vista to enterprises and consumers. “People want to use the functionality in Vista and there are some multimedia, video and sound devices that support Vista, but many peripherals have to catch up.”

He noted, for example, that Microsoft’s own recently released Zune is not Vista compatible. And he added that one of his technicians recently bought an up-to-date webcam for Windows Vista and it didn’t work.

The lack of available Vista drivers for existing software applications is a nightmare, partners say. They don’t understand why Microsoft and its ISVs have dragged their feet for so long in developing drivers for existing applications.

The Windows Vista Application Compatibility Update is a package of updates released on January 30 that fixes application compatibility issues with applications like Adobe Photoshop, AVG AntiSpyware, Google Desktop 4 and Roxio Easy Media Creator 7.,5.

But that Vista patch introduced problems with another version of Roxio one partner is using. He reported it to Microsoft but it hasn’t been resolved yet.

“So many things just don’t work and won’t ever work and that’s the problem,” said Brian Bergin, president of Terabyte Computer, Boone, N.C. “Smartphones, fingerprint scanners, video drivers and both ATI and nVidia’s cards are questionable at best, not to mention that many business applications don’t work. Microsoft did such a horrible job of working with vendors on legacy XP-Windows 2000 application-hardware compatibility that everything is up in the air.”

One of the beauties of Vista is the added security, but in order to use it, you must have updated hardware and drivers for applications,” said Aldrich. “And none of the large ISVs have done it.”

New security features in Vista are compounding the incompatibility issues, Supportsoft’s Rodio said.

“Windows security is nice, but it may interrupt some existing applications you are running, like a travel service or something that Microsoft flags as spyware and interrupts,” Rodio added. “It will likely disrupt stuff you’ve done in the past.”

Incompatibilities dominate the list of most common complaints registered against Windows Vista since it shipped on January 30, say several partners who support consumers and SMB and enterprise customers.

Many ISVs have pledged to release Vista drivers in the second half of 2007 but partners should expect a flood of support calls for customers who deploy this year, experts say.

Paul DeGroot, an analyst with Directions on Microsoft, a newsletter in Kirkland, Wash., said it’s not surprising to him that hardware manufacturers are not investing in new Vista drivers for older hardware.

Although some maintain that Vista runs happily on a Pentium 4 with at least 512 megabytes of RAM, he and others expect most customers will migrate to Vista through new PC purchases.

“I’m guessing that most of the hardware manufacturers will initially ship drivers for Vista only for new products that they’re shipping about now because there wasn’t demand in the marketplace for Vista drivers. In addition, Vista will be heavily related to OEM sales, and the OEMs may be selling compatible accessories with new PCs, so the aftermarket business will see less Vista-specific traffic.
Well guys i did say there was outstanding problems with vista did’nt i!
ta mick

5 deadly vista sins

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

The 5 sins of Vista
Since Vista was released to MSDN subscribers back in November I have started using it on my primary development laptop. I would love to run it in a VMWare session while I am developing, but it is still not possible to get Areo Glass to run this way (I need glass running to get our Remote Control Applications to work with it). After a month and a half of using it I have found a number of things that have irritated me, and only make me more angry as time goes by

It makes me angry because I am a big fan of Microsoft. In my mind, every version of Windows since 3.1 has gotten better with each release (I will kindly forgive them for Windows ME). Each day I feel that in many ways, Vista is a step back in the usability department.

I want Vista to be great, but there are so many issues I have lost count. I will limit my rant to the top 5 user interface nit picks in Vista. This is my top 5 – yours may be different 😉

Number 1 – The new file browsing interface is broken

This problem costs me time every day. I use notepad all the time. It is great for throwing together a script, or a to-do list. Text files work on almost every OS, so I can still read them when I am running Mac OSX. When I go to browse for a file I am shown this dialog.

Notice that when I clicked on the dropdown it shows me a bunch of websites. A BUNCH OF FRICKEN WEBSITES! No, not the usual tree of folders, and My computer so I can locate a file.

Sure, I can click on the left to one of my ‘Favorite locations’, but this takes much longer than the tree interface ever did. Oh yea. What happens when we select one of those websites?

Why show it then?

One other bone I have to pick with the new browsing interface is the difficulty in going back to the parent of the current directory. The new way makes going back up a few folders a much longer process. Simply stated there is no one button that will always bring you back up to the parent.

Keep in mind that this file browsing interface is in every new Vista aware application.

Number 2 – The new start menu sucks (Kind of)

When I first started using the new start menu I loved it. I usually have 100s of programs installed, and the new interface makes it much easier to navigate. But there is something also I do with the run command on the start menu.

If I want a specific folder to launch in explorer I just type it out. Click start, then run and type c: Press enter, and the folder will show up.

Not anymore. If you forget the trailing backslash it will launch a program that is the closest match to that word. So for me, when I type c: It launches Remote Desktop! Argg! I must still make this mistake about 10 times a day. It would be so easy for them to check and see if the folder exists before launching an application

Number 3 – Windows Networking is a mess

I need to go into networking options often when going from place to place with my laptop. Since some places need a static IP, others need dynamic, etc. When I go into windows networking I am greeted with this.

Look at all of the options I am given here. If you have never used Vista before – Quick tell me how to change the IP address on my wireless card! I think they could have split many of these options into totally different areas and made it much cleaner, and easy to use.

Number 4 – Windows Search Is Broken

Same as it ever was. Ever since they started messing with Windows Search in Windows XP Service Pack 2 I have hated it. It has fooled me so many times into thinking a file was gone, or nothing existed that matched by search criteria.

Now when I want a simple search for any file that contains the string ‘IntelliAdmin’ I can’t do it. Instead of fixing what they broke in XP SP2, they just took it out! I want a simple search program that will search for a file on my hard drive (Hint to Microsoft – Every file, not just the types you know about like Word and Excel files) that contains a specific string of letters. It can’t be done any more with windows search. I find myself going to a command line these days and doing a wildcard directory search to get better results. How sad.

Number 5 – Windows copying has not improved

Ever since the Chicago Beta was released to the world (You know it as Windows 95) I have hoped that the next version of windows would improve the file copying system.

Sure they have made the interface look cooler, a snazzy progress bar here and there. What about a robust copy? I absolutely hate it when my 5000 file copy gets killed half way through because 1 single file can’t be opened. Or better yet, how about when I start a copy to a remote file share that is not responding – and all of explorer locks up. Yes it still does this in Vista. I have had to kill explorer on a few occasions over the last month and a half. In this regard Microsoft thinks it is perfectly fine for the UI to become unresponsive when the network is down.

ta mick

vista issues slow vista

In reply to Adobe does not want to embrace vista without

Only one version of Java should be installed on a computer. Multiple versions will cause some parts of Vista to malfunction.

Platforms affected
Windows (9x,ME,NT,2000,XP)

Fix
All versions of Java should be uninstalled. Then, download and install the latest Java version available from: http://www.utas.edu.au/coursesonline/software.htm. ta mick

Amen

In reply to Monopolies

…and amen! I totally agree with ronaldchilcoat.

upgrade obstacles

In reply to Amen

heres a reply from avista user on it news Asus A8JP

NOW no longer a Vista virgin, I thoroughly expected the installation on the Asus machine, also with Intel Core 2 Duo processors, to be a walk in the park.

Wrong!

Although there is nothing on the Asus website or on the machine saying this particular unit is Vista-ready, it is easy to presume it might be.

However, when we tried to load our trusty Vista RC2, it was rejected very smartly.

The reason?

Recent though it is, the machine natively runs the Fat32 file format and Vista requires NTFS, so this led to a lengthy partition format.

Then, a further long interval ensued (at least half an hour) with a box reading: “Please wait while Windows checks your computer’s performance. Your machine will reboot on completion.”

So we waited, and we waited, and finally the machine booted into the new world of Vista.

The screen, however, looked pretty bland and the icons were huge.

In spite of the promise in a sticker on the machine’s wrist rest of “Video Intelligence Technology”, not only could we not activate the higher Vista functions, but we couldn’t budge the screen resolution from VGA.

A check of the snazzy new Control Panel again revealed just standard VGA graphics.

Also, because we had to reformat, the option of upgrading was not available, and this resulted in a clean install on the partition, with only the bare bones of the operating system.

Again, there is absolutely nothing wrong with this machine, as it is set up for Windows XP.

Just don’t expect it to run Windows Vista without a fair amount of pain and heartache.

uprade woes

In reply to Amen

this is from australian it news
Asus A8JP

NOW no longer a Vista virgin, I thoroughly expected the installation on the Asus machine, also with Intel Core 2 Duo processors, to be a walk in the park.

Wrong!

Although there is nothing on the Asus website or on the machine saying this particular unit is Vista-ready, it is easy to presume it might be.

However, when we tried to load our trusty Vista RC2, it was rejected very smartly.

The reason?

Recent though it is, the machine natively runs the Fat32 file format and Vista requires NTFS, so this led to a lengthy partition format.

Then, a further long interval ensued (at least half an hour) with a box reading: “Please wait while Windows checks your computer’s performance. Your machine will reboot on completion.”

So we waited, and we waited, and finally the machine booted into the new world of Vista.

The screen, however, looked pretty bland and the icons were huge.

In spite of the promise in a sticker on the machine’s wrist rest of “Video Intelligence Technology”, not only could we not activate the higher Vista functions, but we couldn’t budge the screen resolution from VGA.

A check of the snazzy new Control Panel again revealed just standard VGA graphics.

Also, because we had to reformat, the option of upgrading was not available, and this resulted in a clean install on the partition, with only the bare bones of the operating system.

Again, there is absolutely nothing wrong with this machine, as it is set up for Windows XP.

Just don’t expect it to run Windows Vista without a fair amount of pain and heartache.
ta mick

total mayhem is what’s happening with vista

In reply to uprade woes

Ms ain’t doing much in the face of lack of sales.A lot of people are totally dissapointed with vista.
ta mick

you arespot on!

In reply to Monopolies

monopoly is right!
have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

ronald i have to agree fully with you

In reply to Monopolies

I’m of the same opinion stability,compatibility,reliability these are still some of the unresolved issues.
Why do we bother using ms products because they have a virtual monopoly & the choice is
not that much.Allready virus makesrs have set their sights on vista & have proved how hackable vista is than previous versions.
THey have produced viruses for 64 bit versions.
ta mick

have you had a go & played with vista??

In reply to ronald i have to agree fully with you

what i have said still holds.
ta mick

it’s still a flop a lot of people at zd net thinkso!

In reply to have you had a go & played with vista??

heaps of people are switched after they have tried vista & think it’s aflop.
ta mick

typical user comments vista is one giant flop

In reply to it’s still a flop a lot of people at zd net thinkso!

Vista is a flop like Millenium
Hi,

I have been working in the industry for a long
time and this OS is not up to my expectations.
I believe it is a big flop just as the Millenium OS. It is bulky and not user friendly. Menus are to say the least awkward and when I tried to default to classic windows settings it took me some time to get there. All in all I rather stay with WinXp and keep upgrading ’till
the release of something better.

Sincerely,

David

well need we say more
ta mick

Mostly right …

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

George got it right except for this answer:

“it has also security holes more than you can poke a stick at.”

No, it’s much more secure than any other desktop operating
system with the new security model.
_______

Sorry, George. OS X still rules in this area. You can trot out your
list of “vulnerabilities” and you can claim “obscurity” all you want
– the “more secure” Vista being tested by <1% of the market
over the past year have been hit by more malware than the
"more vulnerable" OS X users (>2% of market) have seen in the
past several years … not that that’s such a difficult standard to
exceed.

Still, in the WINDOWS world, it is “more secure”. This is a Good
Thing.

yes vista is crap

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

have recently tried all versions & i’m convinced that there are major problems in the source code.I would hasard to guess they dare not
release vista just yet!Further to this as Hal haspointed out the major shortfall of the vista system is that it seems to be too bloated.There are not much drivers around,theres not much software around.For those of you who are asking
my background is I’m masters in computer science i specialise design,analysis of projects using new operating systems.You name the system i’ve done it.So far i’ve tested all versions of vista
& unless microsoft comes up with the goods ie if they can provide a water tight vessel(operating system) personally i don’t think too many people
are ready to ditch their operating systems.

most people at the ms launch

In reply to yes vista is crap

are not ready to ditch their systems until
they are convinced they are getting any tangible returns.so it wil take a while some said up to 2 years on the uptake.
ta mick

michael you should grow up as you only accept the ms stooges view

In reply to yes vista is crap

that is to swallow every word from ms hook line & sinker what ms dishes out to you .
I have the patience & i have shown you what methodology i have used in my research.Just because you can’t click on a couple of links doesn’t make me a liar.I tell you right now ms is having problems.Even it’s own software is not vista compatible:
Zune software doesn’t support Vista

——————————————————————————–
posted 8:30am EST Fri Nov 17 2006 – submitted by Brian Osborne
BLURB

It seems Microsoft might have missed something before it released its new Zune music player earlier this week. According to the company’s Zune website, the Zune software, which comes with the device, is not compatible with Windows Vista.
That has to be more than just a little embarrassing for Microsoft, which can’t release a product day one that supports its Windows Vista operating system
well need i say more
ta mick

Vista not even released yet but

In reply to michael you should grow up as you only accept the ms stooges view

I bet that by January 30th-which by the way IS the release date of Vista-Zune will work with Vista.
“you only accept the ms stooges view that is to swallow every word from ms hook line & sinker what ms dishes out to you ”
NO I don’t- I believe what I see and Vista is working(RTM) very well for me with no problems and as always if you have no answer all you can do is attack. By the way I said why don’t you grow up because I have challaged you several times and it seems because you have no real answer you choose to ignore me instead.
Mike

i’ve tested all of them

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

You people are attacking me instead of going out for yourselves & seeing first hand of what is really happening.Coupled with this you treat it as i have spoken too soon & i know i havent as i have contacts within microsoft.I know what a beta release is.I can also tellyou what vista is really tryng to bring is mostly cosmetic that won’t show much benefit.I don’t know how you can dissagree with me when you can see a lot of people have allready agreed on some of the problems.Also we are heading into a new grey area
64 bit architecture all i’m saying is that it is happening toofast without due regard for proper hardware or software to handle it.Not only this
people have said that the future will be with 128
bit.256 bit,512 bit up to 712 bit operating systems.I would like to see what operating system they have planned???.All i’m saying is i have examined the details & vista does not answer the needs of the 64 bit architecture as i have tested it thouroughly.
expect performance in the 32 bit area.

you can agree to disagree you are entitled to your opinion.My recommendation is i know i’m right!

Vista 32 or 64 bit

In reply to i’ve tested all of them

I agree that the 32 bit is fairly stable. I have tried several times to load the RC1 64 and it failed every time. I like the 32 bit version, with its interface. It is fairly stable (as musch as XP was at first). I do hope the final 64 bit can make it out of the box.

64 but stable too

In reply to Vista 32 or 64 bit

I tried the 32 bit Ultimate version and currently have RC1 of the 64 bit version installed. Clearly the Biostar drivers I’m having such a hard time with are never going to work from the CD on the 64 bit version, but they didn’t with the 32 bit either, so it’s no worse from that point of view. I find the 64 bit version perfectly stable.

i agree to some extent with the 32 bit

In reply to Vista 32 or 64 bit

with the advent of 64 bit i don’t think there’s too much drivers available or the equipment.Whatever testing i’ve done is limited to 32 bit.But in the years to come there’s no reason why 64 bit can’t be a reality.It’ll probably take off in few years.
ta mick

right there

In reply to i’ve tested all of them

Vista & Xp professional compared:mops(milliopsecond)test results

Vista & to XP Professional Compared

cpu interger math 50 vista,61 xp,
cpu floating point math 177 vista,202 xp,
cpu find prime numbers 212 vista,248 xp,
cpu-sse/3dnow!1440 vista,1465 xp,
cpu compression vista 1520,1711 xp,
cpu encryption 9.2 vista,11.4 xp,
cpu image rotation vista 242,277 xp,
cpu string sorting 1027 vista,1210 xp,
graphics 2d lines 64 (32 bit)vista,86.1 xp,
graphics 2d rectangles(32 bit) 34 vista,45.1 xp,
graphics 2d shapes(32 bit)19.6 vista,24.1 xp,
graphics-2d fonts & text(32 bit)65.2 vista,105 xp,
graphics-2d-Gui(32 bit)109.6 vista,159.7 xp,
graphics simple 3d(32bit)248.1 vista,284.3 xp,
graphics medium 3d(32 bit)35.2 vista,52.1 xp,
graphis complex 3d(32 bit) 5.3 vista,7.6 xp,
memory allocate small block 677.4 vista,1226.3 xp,
memory read cached1164 vista,1322.4 xp,
memory read uncached 942.1,1187.5 xp,
memory write 498 vista,625.8 xp,
memory ram large227.3 vista,326.6 xp,
disk sequential read(c: drive)32 .3 vista,34.1 xp,
disk sequential write (c drive) 23 .1 vista,30.2 xp,
disk random seek+rw(c)3.2 vista,2.15 xp,
Cd read 0.04 vista,0.02 xp,
cpu mark398.5 vista,438.7xp,
2d graphics mark vista 194.8,278.3 xp,
memory mark261.4 vista,348.7 xp,
disk mark198.2 vista,236.8 xp,
cd mark3.96 vista,1.10 xp
3d graphics mark93.2 vista,108.5 xp.

yep
mick

re vista beta testing

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

I’ve seen first hand & it is so bad that the amount of people that have said they have problems installing beta vista 1 & beta vista 2 this is on the MSN website.Also people that have bought new equipment hoping to install vista have come to grief as the equipment will not work with vista,coupled with this either existing software & more importantly new software will not work at all with the beta Vista 2.I know it’s beta time but it seems to be hit or miss with both the hardware & software as no one knows for sure.From my testing of beta 2
i found complete instability of the system.Where as others have found some stability
but experienced weird symptoms.

vista problems

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

Lately, I’ve been having some issues with my Windows Vista. Some driver isn’t doing so hot and is forcing my system to suddenly restart. Its beginning to happen more often now that I use the system more heavily.

I managed to get the Windows Media Encoder 9 Series loaded on Vista to take screencapture videos. Unfortunately the Encoder doesn’t do so well on Vista. I can usually take one good screencapture video then have to restart the program because it crashes. Correction: Vista restarts it for me.
One other goofy thing about Windows Vista so far: my CD/DVD-RW doesn’t work like it is suppose to. I cannot read any CD’s or DVD’s. It spins and then stops and freezes the explorer.exe. Then it gives me some ATAPI errors in my Event Viewer.

vista is a copy cat system of mac os

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

typical M$ they release something and only catch up. While most mac users have been using vista capabilitis for 3 years. Windows users suffer from the “beatin windows sindrome”. Like ei7 . The add for that should be “Look suckers we finally got it”. Vista wont even be fully functional till 2008, I develop on it,lol. Keep buying M$

vista tested on security

In reply to What beta builds have you tested?

The User Protection crap, after 10 minutes I had been warned 43 times about something that might be dangerous. Very handy, but will scare the crap outta someone who doesn’t know what it means. And after those 10 minutes I was ready to kill whoever came up with the idea to lock us out of the OS when the dialog box was up.