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  • #2181908

    What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


    by rattyratt ·

    Hi all,
    first time I have posted here, but I wanted to ask people’s opinion on an issue that I am having at work, and really would like to hear guidance from others.
    1. When I arrived I became the IT person for the whole organization I work for, this includes acting in all capacities (IT, security, helpdesk, server…etc, you get the idea!) Now during that time, some people took a dislike to me (something personal on their part – didn’t have much to do with them) and one of them, before going on extended leave actually made an official complaint about me to the managing director (they are buddy/buddy.) Now, I have had all my training suspended, am having to detail and document all my daily activities (down to the minute,) have been told to raise my ‘attitude’ and have been told that I am ‘affecting everyone’ with the way I do work. (That everyone is unhappy with me… in a 50 person organization.) Now, when they sat down with me, I gathered that something was going to come up – but I had not seen this coming.
    2. Since that time, I have had to do this – ie: let it lie, and just work with them – blow over quicker…. BUT: Now I have been told that it has escalated from a simple one on two with me, a HR person & my immediate manager – to one on three with the addition of our Executive Manager being involved. (Talk about escalation!) Frankly I am becoming very unnerved about this all, and as much as I am trying not to get it down – it is starting to affect my work. COnsidering that the person who made this complaint (unspecified, but I KNOW who it was) has left, it is extremely aggravating that this is being ‘carried’ by others, to do this original person’s dirty work. (The person who left disliked me I believe because I had to ask them to cleanup their PC, in accordance with our company policies, I think…)
    3. What do I do about this? I just saw the EA for our Managing director quit, when something similar happened to them. (no listening to their side, just guilty = punishment!!! END!)
    They quit – since they couldn’t work for someone who was like that (in that close a proximity.) In my case, I have been trying to stick it out to see the end of it – but now it is becoming bigger (Escalating, involving more people – becoming threatening to my job!!!!)

    Comments anyone?

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  • Author
    • #3172031

      find a new job

      by gralfus ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It isn’t easy, but twits like that have to be left to their own devices, in this case literally.

      • #3191908

        Depends on your personal beliefs…

        by richard.bennett ·

        In reply to find a new job

        It may be a case of a past employee getting their revenge, but some one should have seen thru that along the line. If its gone this far then you need to confront your accusers with a supervisor and have them out line your deficiency’s. Create an improvement plan and re-evaluate that plan each month. This is what a professionals working with professionals would do.If this is not the most professional place to work, you have to make some difficult choices.
        Depending on your personal beliefs, you may be there for a reason. This could be a tremendous challenge to your character but you have the opportunity to be better because of it. No one every has an easy place to work, but you always have the opportunity to show strength of character and demonstrate your values. You never know who will see your example.
        Lastly, if you do leave make sure its on good terms. You will need to put in writting your intentions, give an appropriate notice and possibly help train a replacement.
        Remember, doing the right thing is not always easy but you will never regret it!

        • #3191827

          Most Excellent Advice was offered by . . .

          by kenedi ·

          In reply to Depends on your personal beliefs…

          Most Excellent Advice was offered by richard.bennett and timnash! Combine these approaches: i.e. don’t hide, but confront in a professional manner; offer your suggestions as well as solicting and incorporating those of your boss and the complainers re: what to do to address the perceived shortcomings in your performance and indirectly help overall company morale. DOCUMENTATION “Create an improvement plan and re-evaluate that plan each month” with your manager, but also keeping in the loop those upper level managers who have piled on and therefore gotten themselves involved.
          I personally know someone who turned such a situation around by this kind of direct and honest approach. You must do this sincerely, and not resort to lashing out with sarcasm or counter attacks on others; again don’t try to redirect, avoid or ignore; address it head on with sincerity and genuine surprise that it has grown to such proportions.
          However, you must be prepared to leave if you do not get a professional response and cooperation in working toward a solution.

        • #3191777

          Warning: Your Mileage May Vary!

          by cloakedrun2001 ·

          In reply to Most Excellent Advice was offered by . . .

          If the employer you work for is just misreading the situation, then attempting corrective action MAY work. However…

          If this is an environment where politics is rife, and where no good deed goes unpunished, then NO AMOUNT of planning and proving “how much better you are doing now” will do a bit of good!

          If the main managers “have it in for you”, then you are already “on the skids”, and it is only a matter of time.

          I have seen the situation you describe. I watched a perfectly competent manager get fired simply because the CEO did not like him. Within days of his being fired, one of the CEO’s unemployed buddies landed the job without so much as an advert being placed to fill the job with any of the many qualified people that were available at the time!

          The tell-tale sign here is that even when you thought you addressed the situation, all of a sudden there is “escelation” by management. This, my good fellow, IS the writing on the wall in my direct observation. Also the fact that those complaining are “un-named”. Whenever management is unwilling to name names, then it is likely that by doing so it would become obvious that the complainant is one of the crowd that is on the inside track, and is likely brown-nosing in no small way. Management in your company either does NOT have the balls to tell you outright to get another job, or there would be serious legal ramifications to just canning you without at least first building a case against you! Where I live, this is called “constructive dismissal”, and it is against the law. Having said that, it is VERY DIFFICULT to prove, and costs THOUSANDS of dollars in legal fees. There are no lawyers that will take it on “contingency”, so it is cash up front. And even if you have the cash, count on it taking 2 to 5 years to complete the case – and then possibly not “winning”.

          BTW, where I live, if you are dismissed for “cause” you also cannot collect any form of government assistance other than “welfare”. And believe me, your current emplyer is building a case for “cause”. It is, IMO, just a matter of time before they have the final nails to put in your coffin.

          And as for “DOCUMENTATION”, well you betcha! You start keeping a journal of incidents! You document the living crap out of everything! The written word is objective evidence. Watch for documents and files that incriminate your employer as to what they are up to. If you find them, make copies and take them OFF SITE (home). Covering your behind is NOT unethical. You have NO intention of publically disclosing anything. These are items that will ONLY be used if your employer decides to fire you and attempt to smear you in the process. You need EVIDENCE. And as the IT person, you might be in a unique position to get it.

          The bottom line is that if your employer wants you out, you are out – all laws notwithstanding. The difference, however, is that if you have enough “dirt” on what they have been trying to do to you, then getting rid of you is going to cost THEM – not you. Keep in mind that if they have to go to court, it is going to cost them big money in lawyers fees, and if you have good evidence, then it will potentially damage their reputation as well. It would likely be much cheaper for them to give you a “severance” package than to face the music in court.

          Just some thoughts. As I have told others, and will tell you, cover your ass because NO ONE ELSE WILL.

          For the sake of your sanity, just go get another job while you still can. It is easier to pick and choose while you have a job, rather than be stuck taking what you can get while unemployed.

          Get out, now – while you still can.

          Good luck.

        • #3192493

          You have rights!!

          by hjohnston8 ·

          In reply to Warning: Your Mileage May Vary!

          The next time you have one of these “threat sessions” you have the right to have someone of YOUR choice go in with you. While this will not get them to back off immediatly, it will keep them from geting out of line. If your unnamed accuser is gone, it falls to management to give you SPECIFIC information as to your performance. They must tell you that “You have violated company policy by doing…” whatever it is. They cannot say “You are affecting the performance of everyone” and not tell you how you are doing this. If they refuse your request of an observer on your side, there is more than bad performance on your part. At that time you either contact the labor board of your state, or the easier thing find a new job.

          Good luck, I hope everything works out for the best.

        • #3192436

          Did anyone consider this……………..

          by reverend_shifty_greenbacks_ii ·

          In reply to You have rights!!

          Maybe this guy is a damn serial killer. I dont know what caused his problems but i dont think people just naturally aspire to hate someone without some reason. Jason….. clean your tools.

        • #3192457

          May be you’re being ‘chewed and spewed’.

          by williamtg ·

          In reply to Warning: Your Mileage May Vary!

          Take heart r.young. It sounds like you ARE young and that’s a good thing. Working in a small office like you are is difficult. You have to have some of the political skills of a CIO while also doing all of the grunt work. It’s good experience, but no level of effort will suffice if your job was targeted for termination the day you took it. This practice was all too common in the early 1990’s here in the states. Short sighted company managers would get the idea that they could hire someone to come in and clean up the IT mess that had been building for many months or even years and then, when everything is humming along nicely, WHAM! You are no longer needed. Some of your statements fit this mold pretty well. Venture a look at your overall situation and try filling in some gaps. Does it pretty much look like this?

          1) Even though it was a tough job market, you were offered very decent pay for the job description. Once you started work, you found out management scammed you on the details of your duties.

          2) You were promised the chance to enhance your career skills at company expense, only to see that opportunity vanish before it began.

          3) Management admitted upfront that they had ?a few problems? with the network / infrastructure. You were told you would have a fairly liberal hand in modernizing equipment / software / management tools, but every penny you request is scrutinized like it will break the bank. Or, perhaps, your budget has been frozen altogether.

          4) You were tasked with implementing the company’s computing policy but, from day one, management was not on-board. Not even a company wide e-mail declaring an executive directive supporting your efforts (next time, insist on this).

          5) When you do something un-popular to the computing environment management sits back and lets everyone believe it is your idea, though in reality you are following the orders given to you.

          6) Aside from the obvious personal harassment about your ?attitude?, you sense there to be a pervasive, if subtle, feeling by management that your work product and output is not up to speed. That you aren?t getting enough done fast enough, though you know you are doing a good technical job given what you have to work with.

          7) The business you support is in the accounting, finance or other bean counter industry. These people are notorious abusers of IT staff.

          This is the most un-ethical and abusive sort of employment practice that there is, but it happens. The ethical thing for a company to do is to let a contract for the work that needs to be done. That way, everyone knows the score and gets a fair deal.

          Remember, as you slide down the banister of life this job, at worst, is just a splinter in your ass.

        • #3193098

          Cloake has a point

          by christineeve ·

          In reply to Warning: Your Mileage May Vary!

          I have experienced what you’re going through. It’s horrible. If everything is right about the job, then fight for it. The suggestions about documenting, following up, and proactivity will help. You’ll never forgive yourself for giving up.

          However, if the job really isn’t where you see yourself in 5 or 10 years, maybe it’s time to let go.

          Sometimes it is personal. But don’t personalize it, because as we’ve all learned people see things through their own motivations and filters. So, unless you’re intentionally jerky and unreliable, it’s not your fault and do not take the blame.

          This happened to me two times in my career, once I was able to fight it out and win. It was worth it. The other time, the job just wasn’t right and I was beating a dead horse. I went on to better things.

          Good luck, and I really mean that!

        • #3191760

          I agree . .

          by gentlerf ·

          In reply to Most Excellent Advice was offered by . . .

          I agree with Ken and the rest and would add only one thing. When in the presense of you accuser(s), singly or together, ask this question: Do you think, if this were presented in a court of law, the allegations would stand up?

          Asking this question has defused a number of situations in the various workplaces I have been. The only times it hasn’t stood up have been when the argument is irrational and the response on the order of, “No, but that is not what I believe!” Fact based allegations are one thing, emotional arguments can never be won.

        • #3192725

          It didn’t happen unless you have the paperwork…

          by overcharge ·

          In reply to Most Excellent Advice was offered by . . .

          Let’s face it, computers are fun…you wouldn’t be here unless they were at one time–maybe not now.

          As the new IT guy, you probably closed some gaps, blocked some porn, put security measures in place, and in short: limited their fun. Now you just have to justify it, on paper, to your bosses.

          You probably took away Johnny’s favorite wordprocessor–pirated. Suzie’s spreadsheet (not compatible with the company’s standard) went too. Bill’s on-line slots…and so on. Well old son, itemize: costs for pirated sw (how many x fine), tech support time for calls on compatibility issues, instances of spyware, etc.

          You in a sense have to prove the value of your policies, and fast, I would say. And, you have to prove that you have been the ultimate team player, but that your team is the company.

          And sharpen up your resume if that doesn’t work…

        • #3192584

          Good advice!!! Keep your resume up to date; always.

          by sleepin’dawg ·

          In reply to It didn’t happen unless you have the paperwork…

          You’ve landed yourself into the midst of a corporate kaffeeklatch and being the fresh face have acquired the role of scapegoat. This happens far too often in small closed environments; the new guy is the one to be dumped on. You’ve probably riled them up by instituting proper practices. You may be right but you aren’t going to win this one. [b]Don’t wait!!! Start floating your resume around and get the hell out of there before they tie a can to your tail. Ultimately, these people are small timers or losers; you don’t need them!!! Get while the getting is good!!![/b]

          Dawg ]:)

        • #3191645

          Paperwork Won’t Help

          by deesy58 ·

          In reply to It didn’t happen unless you have the paperwork…

          Documenting what’s really going on in the organization won’t help at all. It would only serve to emphasize management inadequacies. If you can’t verbally discuss these kinds of matters with your boss, then you have no chance whatsoever for success in this organization. Get out before you are asked to leave. Make sure you are in control of the timing of your departure. Also, do not overlook any other opportunities because of a misguidaned notion that you somehow owe this organization any kind of “two week notice.”

        • #3192476

          Great Advice from all the able

          by senior program analyst ·

          In reply to Most Excellent Advice was offered by . . .

          Yes I would have to Agree with ken that you need to bring this out and find out the exact nature of the problems. Don’t assume that the first person had it in for you (may or may not have been the case) but since others have taken the idea even if it originated from the person who left; they apparently do see the same issues. Its often difficult to see ones own nature the way others are viewing you. Ask them to be specific about what you did or are doing. What specific changes can you make to change. If they feel you are too Forward/Demanding or Pushy about the policy, it could be the person handling the policy before let things slide and all of sudden they are getting hammered for things that have been ok in the past. Maybe you should start sending reminders and notify everyone that the specific policy will be enforced by such and such date. (be sure to verify with your management that they wish this to be enforced and document what thier answers are in written form (emails etc. If they dont want you to enforce a policy this brings the responsibility to them). Protect your backside, but Go at the issues facing forward and get specifics and if you don’t have a solution find out from them what they would suggest as the solution.

        • #3191791

          On track for firing

          by greenpirogue ·

          In reply to Depends on your personal beliefs…

          Not sure how your organization is, but it looks like you are on the firing track – not that you will be fired, but if things don’t change, they will have collected the evidence to pull the plug. I once had an employee that I put on the “firing track” and before I left the organization, I actually promoted him because he responded well. I am not saying your career there is toast, but you are battling up hill and the “stink” of this may stay around for a while even if you succeed/improve.

        • #3192281


          by gary.crispens ·

          In reply to On track for firing

          You might have had a chance when it was just you and HR and boss. BUT when they pull in the big gun, it is time to wise up and beat feet for the door. No matter what you try to do or how much you try to improve, the decision has already been made and they are just running the clock out and putting the finishing touches on the documentation.
          Next time go with a larger company where you are not the only IT guy. Also the buddy buddy good old boy system is strongest in small companies where they have know each other for years. It is tough being the “new guy” in this situation.

        • #3191733

          North Korea Method

          by spadata ·

          In reply to Depends on your personal beliefs…

          1 . .”confront your accusers with a supervisor and have them out line your deficiency’s.
          2 . “Create an improvement plan and re-evaluate that plan each month.

          That is the methods of the “re-education centers”

          He probably has NO deficiencies other than he is better than those whiners that he is exposing for what they are. They are afraid of being seen as less, so they attack without the provocation.

          I have a feeling this is occuring in a unionized workplace where the rule of the day is “It’s not my job” and “don’t work too hard, you’ll make the rest of us look bad”

        • #3192439

          Interesting…. that method.

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to North Korea Method

          Hi Spadata,

          You are essentially correct on that. I do admit that with everything there is always a small kernal of truth, (Even my own boss has pointed that out, and I am in agreement with him.)
          In terms of 1. The accuser left the organization after firing this parting shot (probably because I pi&&ed them off by enforcing the Policies of the organization) but 2. is what they said they were going to do – but it has spiralled out of control, with the weighing in of my executive manager. :-/ I suppose that is typical.
          Ahem, however you are wrong with the unionized workplace – what union?? 🙂
          Most people here are whiners and unfortunately very loud whiners. I suppose that is the problem of it all, even my boss said that to me. 🙂
          There are 3 people who are practical/pragmatic and realists in this place, and they include the dbase admin, my manager (IT) and me. Everyone else runs around in the clouds… 🙁

        • #3193235

          Get the cheque and go…..quickly

          by g.m.bakker (cne, self employed) ·

          In reply to Interesting…. that method.

          Hunt for a new job, and if found, take it. Then
          I’d wait my month’s pay cheque to arrive, presuming it is to arrive before the end of the month (here in Holland we get paid halfway the month for the whole month), work through the end of the month, go to your boss and tell him you have health problems and can no longer work in such a hostile environment, and therfore have decided to quit immediately. Give him the letter of resignation shake his hand and pi&& off. Next day, new job, however never discuss the previous group of a&&holes in your new work environment, and never discuss where you worked before (@ the a&&hole plant). Too bad no severance, but hey, no heart attack either, that compensates it all

          My 2 and a half cents!

        • #3191644

          Not Just North Korea

          by deesy58 ·

          In reply to North Korea Method

          I’ve seen the same kinds of “conflict resolution” techniques used in the US. Particularly by those US companies that are owned and managed by Europeans. Never again!

        • #3191518


          by gazoo ·

          In reply to North Korea Method

          I work in a unionized workplace, and this sort of thing doesn’t happen without the union weighing in. Unions are good for you, not bad. I have seen one fellow who was wrongly fired getting a settlement of circa 140000 dollars, because he was a member of a union. Of course, I live in a terrible socialist country where unions are accepted instead of combatted.

        • #3192686

          Been there but on the

          by djohnson in calif. ·

          In reply to Depends on your personal beliefs…

          I had something very similar happen to one of my user support techs. (I have the luxury of a staff)

          People were complaining about his attitude, his dress, and I had problems with his lack of documentation and communication with me.

          He never saw it coming when I spoke to him.
          He rebelled after agreeing politely to improve.

          Second meeting with my manager, me and him. Face to face, friendly none threatening and “off the record” (no paperwork) instructions to improve.

          He agreed but never changed. Soon we had an attendance problem too.

          Eventually we worked up an official outline of problems with expected improvements over a specified length of time with monthly meetings to check and adjust progress.

          This guy thought the world was out to get him!! Nothing we could say would convince him that we were only trying to make his life miserable. Polciy was in place but he refused to interpret any of it in the manner in which it was intended. It was all an elaberate scheme on our part to terrorize his mind.

          This guy was a great tech but he had a problem with others telling him how things should be done. He just wanted to be left alone to “get my work done” without anyone getting in his way.

          From THIS side of the fence, be careful not to get too paranoyed and be sure to ask for a road map to improvement and follow it. Ask for regular meetings to go over your progress to see if it’s satisfactory. Be humble and respectful and realize life isn’t fair it only has to be profitable.

        • #3192435

          I see your point… however..

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to Been there but on the

          One issue that although I can see some potential parallels, it goes a bit off the rails when:
          My own boss is supporting me in the fact that I have been doing my work to a high standard, performing my tasks in a excellent manner, and frankly has exceeded all his expectations. This organization has had a run of bad IT Admin’s (or atleast ones that are not totally with it…)
          My probation report had a string of ‘good’ and ‘excellent’ markings. My boss has over 47 years in work environments, including the military and he frankly is pi$$ed as hell over these younger executive types coming in and just ‘totally ignoring’ him when he is my direct manager and not them.
          I suppose the crux of the issue is that they have stopped listening to him totally.
          We did go down the path you metioned above, (although based on accusations that ‘may or may not have had merit’) but things have gone from bad to worse.
          My immediate boss (whom I respect greatly) had to sit in a meeting with these two ‘persons’ (I use that term loosely) and listen to them arguing over how to escalate this to the point where they can fire me. Tell me, is that rational?? He had to go bat for me, by slapping them in the face verbally (he’s due to retire soon, so he doesn’t care who he pi$$es off anymore.) They wanted to kick me out that day, and he hit them over the head first off with the moral obligations of that, “how can you fire someone on the grounds you have, which is nothing when his wife is expecting a baby in a few weeks, and he hasn’t done anything to deserve it. Also it contravene’s policy.”
          Unfortunately, I think they heard the bit about ‘contravening policy’ only. 🙂 Now they are trying to do it within the policy guidelines.

          🙂 I am trying not to get paranoid – but it is hard. 🙁

          Frankly I am worried that I will accelerate the situation if I tried to go directly to these people – especially since I was not ‘officially’ supposed to know the contents of that meeting.
          For that I am grateful to my boss, that he wouldn’t keep any secrets from me on this.

          I measure my time here in hours and days…


        • #3192402

          too many chiefs

          by dugga6 ·

          In reply to I see your point… however..

          Sounds like your workplace has a case of “too many chiefs, not enough indians”. All these junior executive manager types p**sing on everything to mark their territory. I’ve seen it before and eventually it all ends in a management restructure. Life is too short to spend in a crappy workplace – you deserve better.

        • #3174323

          Who’s the boss?

          by steve_it ·

          In reply to too many chiefs

          Is there a board or single owner you can approach to circumvent this issue?

        • #3193233

          Just get out of there

          by g.m.bakker (cne, self employed) ·

          In reply to I see your point… however..

          Hey, read the responce I gave shortly, and just get out of there, don’t wait till you go flipping paranoia, find another place, businesses are picking up again, so there will be a job picking period arriving. And when you leave give em all a carrot to stick up there a&&!

        • #3192307

          Goods words from Richard

          by akujenga ·

          In reply to Depends on your personal beliefs…

          I think that’s a very good approach that Richard recommended. Not to offend anyone but I think he should have just plainly said, “If you are a Christian…” I personally feel that’s the best way to go!

      • #3191892

        The slippery slope of politics

        by reinhardt ·

        In reply to find a new job

        Most definitely. You are NOT going to “win” the hearts and minds of those who have already judged you guilty, probably most without much more than the office rumor mill to support their ideas.

        I don’t know why you would want to stay in such an environment but if you are honest with yourself you will see you really have no choice.

        Move on and learn from this experience.

      • #3191863

        Take the High Road

        by timnash ·

        In reply to find a new job

        My suggestion is go to your immediate boss and share with him/her your concerns and how this negative information is circulating. You are concerned about the impact it might have on the company and you would like to offer some positive solutions and/or feedback such as a suggestion box, newsletter, team building program, etc. You will never go wrong by offering solutions to improve moral in the interest of the company. If they are not receptive to these suggestions, maybe you should look elsewhere.

        • #3191801

          Joe vs. Volcano

          by rush2112 ·

          In reply to Take the High Road

          WATCH or REWATCH this movie.

          LIVE your life.

          If you are being DRAINED…go where you can LIVE.

          Why stress. Life it short, then you die.

          That situation may not change in your lifetime, let them learn on their own.

          On the other hand, if you have some character issues which make them dislike you, perhaps you could address those prior to going somewhere else.

          This place is probably going to be your BASEMENT OFFICE for the rest of your Tenure. EVEN IF you do get reception from the higher-ups on improvement strategies.

          People outside of tech/geek-dom do not understand the “WHY” in the policy, or the reason behind the word “no, don’t do that” They only see…what they perceive.

      • #3191741

        If you don’t have support of supervisor…find a way to get it!

        by beoweolf ·

        In reply to find a new job

        When it gets to the level that everyone is jumping on the bandwagon. You either have poor people skills or you are not getting support from your management.

        In a system environment that was previously more like that Wild West, where there was little enforcement of standard…generally acceptable business practices; you can and should expect resistance to change. Children resent it when take away their candy or put them on an allowance.

        But, if your manager hasn’t stepped in to quash this yet…it is possible there may be some degree of merit to the general rebellion? Many times all it requires is communication, about what you are doing, why you are doing it, the expected benefits, etc. Most thinking adults can understand the need for controls to be put in place. However, If the feel you are arbitrary, capricious in formulating and enforcing rules…you end up with rebellion.

        At this stage of the game you need help. Either get your manager on your side, find out if there are excesses on your part, if he is satisfied with your job performance? Unfortunately, especially if you are much younger than most of the other employees or brisk, as many IT are perceived to be by the general public (they can?t seem to wrap their minds around the idea that you may not have time for extended hand-holding, non-company related ?gratis? configuration, repair of personal computers?) so they take offence. Your manager, if he supports your efforts, should have stopped this a long time ago?or at least done his job of giving you hints on how to get the user community on your side.

        Bottom line: get it together, take step to address the problems and work on them. Or get out. There is no need to continue working in a toxic environment, no matter what. Yes, it may be more difficult to let go of the vine and grab for another job, in the current market?but its better to leave on your own terms than to hold on to the last minute and possibly get fired, or burn all your bridges. Sometime its better to retreat than to fight a losing cause.

        • #3192485

          get it in writing…

          by ctos ·

          In reply to If you don’t have support of supervisor…find a way to get it!

          overall, I agree with most that has been said. You *need* to confront them ammicably, but to the point: give me in writing what the problem is, or at least what you think I have done/not done to your liking. You will then follow through with it.
          If they are fair and really have a complaint, then it will go well. If they are just making up trash about you (possibly they dont like your personality and want you to leave), they will have nothing to give you.
          Point out that you need direct comments to work on to improve your performance. Keep the “blame” on your side (though I believe that it is NOT your fault), so you do not come across as attacking them. It should work out that way, but if not, then move on to a better place.
          A work environment can NOT be tolerated that is stressing you out so greatly that your nerves and quality performance suffer. Overall, if you move on before to much damage is done to you and your personal beliefs, it is worth it. If you stay and take the harm, sooner or later you will start believing that you are not any good. Also, if you can leave on fairly good terms, you will have less damages when they give a reference for you.
          Glad I’m not in your position any more! Good luck!

      • #3191721

        I completely agree..

        by carol ·

        In reply to find a new job

        If you’re the optimistic type, you may think staying in your integrity and doing the right thing means you will prevail. Wrong! The corporate culture (which doesn’t sound too healthy in your case) will prevail over individuality. So if it’s sick, you stay healthy and get out while the getting out is good. Best of luck to you…

      • #3192692

        No point in staying

        by jwm.mckay ·

        In reply to find a new job

        The only reason for staying is to get your salary and use it as a springboard to a new job. There is NO way back from these events unless perhaps the other people leave… just work within the boundary of your job, don’t do overtime, don’t assist more than you need to…. and leave them to it! Take pride in yourself and stand by your beliefs!

      • #3193203

        Exactly… job search

        by ChrisP547 ·

        In reply to find a new job

        There is really nothing you can do that will not further imperil your job and make daily (work) life more miserable. I would start looking for another job, and when I had one, lay you whole scenario out for whomever it is most appropriate and then explain to them why they can kiss your ass (probably best done in polite terms tho )

      • #3193116

        A similar situation…

        by lord-of-the-token-rings ·

        In reply to find a new job

        A similar situation happened to me, where the General Manager’s brother was the Art Dept. Guy, who in the eyes of the owner (an imigrant to Canada During the War era, with no education) is the most talented person, and if the art guy has to go home early to “clear up his mind and find his muse” kinda crap, then it’s okay.

        But I digress, One day this joker decided to pull the scam of the century. He had been given a specific task about 3 months ago to complete a catalog of parts, and he had been doing his personal stuff, without completing the task. when the managing director approached him, he decided to go down the path of “I can’t find the files I put on the network, maybe the Network guy (me) would know what happened to it”. The GM decided to have a “talk” with me. The very next moment I was up in the MD’s office with evidence of the art guy’s internet activity, gathered through the Proxy server logs, his email activity through our spam filter etc. the 40 page report was a shocking revelation! The MD ran all the way to the GM’s room to have the guy fired on the spot… BUT>>>>

        The GM again decided to have another talk with me. This time the tack was on a different track. He opened up with, I know that you dont like “X”, and you have formed an opinion about him. I decided to let fly. The reply was, “I protected him all this time because I respect you, but he stepped over the line when “X” decided to point the finger at me when he had not even started on the project. I also snuck in “evidence” through different kinds of “Network Reporting Tools” that allows me to “figure out” if “X” ever even started on the Job. Well “X” is still here, because he’s very “talented” and he would be an asset to any company out there, and at this time, letting him go would cost the company more, because to retrain a new person to do a catalog would take more time..

        My Advice??? As most people mentioned. Gather evidence ETHICALLY!! you are within your rights to do so as the company’s Network guy, as it may be required by the HR Dept. Take a duplicate of this info home. It WILL save your ass, or atleast make sure the company will not just fire you with “Just cause”.

      • #3191496

        Comes with the Territory!

        by phattius ·

        In reply to find a new job

        Option A-Change is good, often times we become complacent to a steady paycheck. If you ask most people why they leave a job, its not because they couldn’t hack the work. They just couldn’t take the B.S. anymore and cut to greener pastures. If you really like a challenge, start your own business.

        Option B-Stay and DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT!!! You should have already been doing this. If you had record of everything going on it would be hard for people to make accusations. Comes with the territory. Just remember your number 1 goal as an IT professional is to keep the customer happy. That doesn’t just mean keep their computer running. Talk to them, make alliances, companies have a unique culture and if you don’t fit in, either conform or find a different job. The key is honesty and communication.

    • #3171996

      Look Elsewhere…

      by black panther ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hang in for a while and look for another job in the meantime ( as long as you can keep your sanity ).

      • #3171971

        Yeah, just annoying.

        by rattyratt ·

        In reply to Look Elsewhere…

        Thanks Black Panther,

        I suppose I have been trying hard not to think of that option – since I have been working here since october last year, and it is annoying to sometimes find a job in Canberra. 🙁
        Too many IT people and not enough jobs.

        Will keep it in mind though, and start looking.

        • #3171935


          by black panther ·

          In reply to Yeah, just annoying.

          I was in a “different” but “similiar” position years ago. 15 months went by in the job whilst i was looking for another job – but I found another job in the end and it all worked out well.

          You will even start to feel better as you know you will not be there forever. However, some miracle may happen and by luck the Management might change in the meantime – you never know 🙂

          I have a friend in Canberra who works for TPG 🙂

          good luck 🙂

        • #3171295

          What would Dr Phil say?

          by avinesan ·

          In reply to Yeah, just annoying.

          These things come and go. Life goes on. OK I don’t know whether you’re that desperate but thats how you come of. Don’t allow them to exploit you and on the same token value your job, as you said there are’nt many. Hang in there!

        • #3171270


          by avinesan ·

          In reply to What would Dr Phil say?

          A matter of interpretation
          When I take a long time – I am slow.
          When my boss takes a long time – he is thorough.
          When I don’t do it – I am lazy.
          When my boss doesn’t do it – he is too busy.
          When I do something without being told – I am trying to be smart.
          When my boss does the same – that is initiative.
          When I please my boss – I am creeping.
          When my boss pleases his boss – he is co-operating
          When I do good – my boss never remembers.
          When I do wrong – he never forgets.

          Rules of work

          It doesn’t matter what you do, it only matters what you say you’ve done
          what you’re going to do.
          When the bosses talk about improving productivity, they are never
          about themselves.
          Everything can be filed under “miscellaneous.”
          Anyone can do any amount of work provided it isn’t the work he/she is
          supposed to be doing.
          If it wasn’t for the last minute, nothing would get done.
          The last person that quit or was fired will be held responsible for
          everything that goes wrong.

          How to delay paying your bills.
          Wait until they send the bill the third time then write. (Never phone,
          use e-mail – writing is slower) and ask why you haven’t received an
          Demand a written reply for your auditors.
          Ask for an itemised account but don’t explain what you mean by
          When you receive the invoice, write back saying that it was not what
          you had
          wanted at all.
          Send a cheque with figures not matching words. When they call to
          send a corrected cheque – but omit to sign it.
          Send a copy of their invoice with a torn corner of cheque stapled to
          This will start a frantic hunt for your missing cheque. When you
          hear from your supplier – delay further while you check with your bank.
          all the time they’ll be apologising to you!
          Tell them that your cheques require two signatures and the other
          officer is on prolonged sick leave/sabbatical/silver anniversary cruise
          the next month.
          Send a cheque for the wrong amount made out to a completely different
          (fictional) company. When they call, promise that you will sort it out
          – but
          will have to track down how the mistake occurred and contact the other
          company to get the cheque back.

          Helpful Hints
          1. If you’re bidding on a job for UPS, don’t send your bid by FedEx.
          2. If your computer says, “Printer out of Paper,” the problem cannot be
          resolved by continuously clicking the “OK” button.
          3. If you want your refrigerator’s ice maker to work, you need to hook
          it to
          a water source. Air doesn’t make good ice unless it is mixed with
          4. No matter how much data you add to your laptop computer, it will not
          5. A bad place to store your emergency backup diskette is on the
          of your desk drawer, secured by a large magnet.
          6. It’s okay to use the Polaroid Land Camera on a boat.
          7. When the PC says, “Insert diskette #2,” don’t do it immediately.
          disk #1 first, even if you’re sure you can make them both fit in
          8. When your PC says “You have mail,” don’t go to the company mail room
          look for a package.
          9. The French version of Netscape Navigator doesn’t translate English
          language web pages into French.
          10. If you’re in the armed services, and it’s April 1st, and you get an
          e-mail message to call Colonel Sanders for new orders, don’t.
          11. If you go to the computer store to buy a mousepad, you don’t have
          specify whether it’s for a Windows or a Macintosh.

          Kind Regards

        • #3192437

          Dr. Phil would say

          by sjeffreys ·

          In reply to What would Dr Phil say?

          Dr. Phil would say – “You teach people how to treat you.” He would also advise you to have a plan or strategy in place detailing what your goals are and how you are going to handle these situations the next time they occur. There has been some great advice given…decide what your goals are and apply the applicable advice – Maya Angelou says “When I knew better I did better.” Make it work for you – turn it around or find a new job – whatever you decide find the lesson you were to learn and learn it.

        • #3191946

          I had something similar

          by sherry320 ·

          In reply to Yeah, just annoying.

          I had something similar happen to me when I worked as an IT trainer, I had a girl come on two of my courses, but she only came for about a third of them, funnily enough she failed both course, she couldn’t do the practical or theory exams. She put a complaint in about me which was completely unfounded and her friends backed her up. I fought it all the way, if you’ve been working there for a long time the onous is on that person to prove thier case, especially if your held generally in good regard I don’t think you’ve really got much to worry about. Remember that even though supply of IT staff might outstrip demand you know the systems, which means your more value to the company than some unknown joe bloggs. Get the union involved if your a member.

          Keep your chin up

        • #3191836

          Get The Union Involved?

          by minjrb ·

          In reply to I had something similar

          There is an IT union? If so, where? What is it’s name? How do I join? Help me, pleeeeeeeeeease!!!

        • #3192432

          IT Union…

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to Get The Union Involved?

          There is no real IT related Union in Australia – there are unions that are close, but I think for IT, the Industrial union is the only real option.
          Unless you are a public sector employee, then you get the PSU to cover you, (regardless of speciality, since you are PS member)

        • #3186940

          APESMA – The Union for IT Professionals

          by mharris ·

          In reply to IT Union…

          APESMA, the Association of Professional Engineers, Scienists and Managers Australia (APESMA)represents many professional employees in the IT industry. Find out more at or

          The IT Professionals Association (ITPA) is a special interest group within APESMA set up to represent the interests of IT employees.

          We are currently active in a number of workplaces, including EDS Australia. You can visit the campaign website at

        • #3191742

          I had something like this happen

          by waltjones40 ·

          In reply to I had something similar

          I worked at a hotel for a few years and started having problems after about three months. I started receiving verbal and written warnings about my “attitude.” When I asked who was complaining, I was told several people on all three shifts. Since there were 53 employees in the hotel and I dealt with only tweleve, 2 of which were on the grave yard shift with me, it was easy to figure out the source. I then went through her emails and found that she hated men in general and men in authority even more. The key email was one she sent to her girl friend promising her a job as soon as she finished me off. She was so foolish that she even listed her targets (by position and shift, not by name) and how she was going to “get” them. One happened to be a close relative of the owners. I was able to use that and start protecting myself. When I left the hotel 7 years later, they became my first customer.

        • #3192430

          Quite possibly the case here…

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to I had something like this happen

          I am very careful in workplaces, especially these days with harassment cases all over the place. I have once had someone accuse me of verbal harassment (last job I had) but nothing came of it, since when it came out, it was a disagreement that they called verbal abuse. Go figure.
          Since then, I especially do my job and stay out of issues that could infringe on anything in the harassment areas…
          HOWEVER, I had a feeling (nothing more though) that the person who took a dislike to me was of the same ilk as the girl you mention, that she hated men also. I know she was pregnant and that she left to go on Maternity leave (one reason why I suppose I should leave especially before she returns… 12 months…)
          🙂 Considering that she was on the opposite side of the building from me at the time of the complaint, and that I may have passed her desk a few times a week, (but had not much contact with her…) it is more plausable to believe she just took a dislike to me for her own reasons, not anything I could have done. (I keep records of all jobs I do, so looking back at jobs in her name – da nada!)


        • #3191787

          We’re not getting the entire story here?

          by joe ·

          In reply to Yeah, just annoying.

          I noticed that you didn’t take the time to respond to anyone who suggested the professional approach of confronting the accusers but rather responded to the person suggesting you leave. I’ll be the first to admit, since I don’t know you or the situation at all – actually, I don’t believe any of us really got the full understanding of your situation – I’m making an assumption here but my feeling is you’re not telling us the entire story.

          Anytime I hear, “they just don’t like me” it’s never that simple. “I think” he doesn’t like me because you told him to do something? We usually know exactly the situation that caused the problem – my feeling is you didn’t handle it well, perhaps made the suggestion with the best of intentions but when the employee responded negatively the situation escalated?

          Here’s my thought. If the situation is truly as you describe it is indeed time to either confront or go. I would suggest that when you leave, you think and reflect for awhile on how you may have handled the situation – or if perhaps the perception and impression you left may have been misunderstood and how you can work to avoid that in the next workplace.

          Many people, let alone IT professionals, are simply not outgoing individuals and many IT admins or professionals I’ve worked with directly do not mix well outside the server room. This is simply a fact of life. The attitude is often ‘me against them’, and it takes a great deal of energy and effort to handle the IT job as well as be the outgoing face of the department to the upper echelon.

          Be honest with yourself, which kind of person are you? Introvert? Extrovert? If you’re not the outgoing type, you’ll want to seek a position at a company where you won’t be the one man IT department, but rather part of team where someone else can take on the role of ‘company representative.’

        • #3191725

          Good Response and advice

          by ealexander1 ·

          In reply to We’re not getting the entire story here?

          I agree with “joe” in that there may be more to the story that r.young may not know about. It sounds like he is earnest in his work and wants to stay, but usually work problems that grow to this proportion are based on more than “they don’t like me.”

          I came into tech work from a background in psychology and have found out that technical people are some of the worst communicators around, but can also have the largest egos. This is not a good combiniation for some work environments. Some tech people have to work hard just to listen and understand where their co-workers are coming from and this may have notheing to do with computers. When issues come up, even if you are not in the wrong, approaching the antagonist (or supervisor) in a spirit of humbleness can do wonders for the situation. If you can get at least one person who will actually listen to you and your side, this can eventually turn others around.

          On the other hand, if you are just not a good fit for this company, don’t feel bad. Not everyone is right for every job or every company and in the end it’s really no one’s fault (least of all the employee who was interviewed and hired). It’s the same thing as trying to get a square peg through a round hole, it just won’t work.

          Take heart r.young, by working it out at this company, you may become their greatest asset or there is another job that will be better.

        • #3193114

          Yikes!! not another one…

          by lord-of-the-token-rings ·

          In reply to Good Response and advice

          During tenure with the last company I worked in the states, I had the pleasure of a Psyhc Major who had turned “tech” (Built a couple of pc’s in the basement, got a couple of certifications by reading the press books etc.,) He would analyze everything to death, without trying to finish the job on time. We finally decided to loan him out to a Client because we didn’t have the heart to fire him.. Boy, was his Freudian slip showing 😉

        • #3191722

          Look within yourself

          by tlyden ·

          In reply to We’re not getting the entire story here?

          I think Joe is onto something. Having been within the industry for over 18 years, I have encountered many personality types. Since you have sought input, I am going to share some constructive thoughts. I have met many IT prefessionals who have what I call the “God” mentality. The proverbial “I know more than you and I am better at everything than you.” It does not have to be directly communicated to still carry that air of egotism. Still, I am only going off of your version of events.

          You appear to have quite a base of knowledge. Is it possible you were too blunt, or your request was more like a command? When you made the request, did it come across as patronizing or condescending? Voice inflection and choice of words are sometimes vital to establishing a solid foundation of interpersonal communication within an organization.

          Some employees can just take things personally. Is it possible this individual resented your position? Are they older than you?

          Maybe take a seminar on relationships in the work place. Talk with your employer. I am not clear on employment laws outside of the US; however, has your employer made constructive suggestions to provide you with guidance in your role (relative to the corporate climate)? It sounds as though they have placed you in the fish bowl. A true HR department should offer support or career counseling before escalating matters in such a negative fashion. Do they have a job requisition out for your position?

          Whether this issue is you, or is a flaw within this company’s environment, learn from this. Take this experience as a growing process for you professionally. I feel if you work with the organization and demonstrate a genuine desire to improve (even if you feel it is not you), should you be fired, or quit on your own, it will help you move on in your career without second-guessing what you did wrong.

          Last, but not least, I assume you did not speak negatively about other individuals within the organization? Even if your thoughts or feelings were shared with someone in confidence (outside of HR), never rely on that. If someone in HR has done a disservice to you, that is something you may never find out. If that is the case, it is unfortunate and very unprofessional. I recommend Dr. John DeMartini. His website address is He conducts seminars and has many books and tapes that will provide you with a wealth of clarity about this matter. Don’t just walk away without giving this your all. You will take something positive from this. It may just not be evident at this point. If this has taken a toll on you physically and/or mentally beyond what you feel is worthwhile, then look for other opportunities. Good luck and blessings in your career endeavors. Tlyden

        • #3192535

          I Compleeeeeeeeeetly agreeeeeeeeeee!

          by apcyrino ·

          In reply to Look within yourself

          I agree with most of what you said
          and I would like to add some thoughts.
          As an “old” IT pro I’ve already been in a some
          similar situation.

          I’ve learned that this kind of “climate”, well,
          it DOES have much to do with interpersonal

          But, there’s an aggravation when people disagree
          BEFORE you start to talk (or before you start to
          act), even when you’re looking at the questions
          practically by putting down on paper the pros and
          cons of each solution and – by doing so – taking
          ego consideratios out of the equation.

          The thing is WORST and SYMPTOMATICAL when you don’t have the necessary support from the company
          in order to deal with such kind of attitudes.

          Im trying to say that sometimes there’s nothing more you can do, unless you have the will to
          become a therapist. 😉

          Sometimes the corporate environment itself is a
          LOST CASE and you must to be intelligent enough
          to discern.

        • #3192424

          To some extent, true…

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to We’re not getting the entire story here?

          🙂 Yes, to some extent I have had to abbreviate the story – and while I can write excellent documentation – I know that putting up my story here means that people could identify the organization if I went into too much detail.
          You are correct in that there are many facets to a problem, including this one that I face – I am not infalliable, and I know my faults. In fact, I won’t deny that within this entire episode – there is a small germ of truth to some of the accusations that have been thrown at me. At the first meeting between my boss, the HR manager and myself – we discussed that, and in turn I emailed my boss afterwards with my comments to all the accusations, being brutally honest. (He prefers honest people… and so do I!)
          Out of that, I recogised that I can be prideful, as many can in IT, and this can sometimes spill into a touch of arrogance that my users see. I continuously work to improve myself and overcome faults as I find them (and get them pointed out to me.)
          The only problem with this, is that it went from perhaps a ‘semi-sane’ start to totally irrational on the parts of some of the players of this horrible game.

          This shows in the 2nd meeting with my boss & the HR manager, when they said that in response to the first meeting my work excellence level peaked so dramatically high, it was an incredible improvement. (reading between the lines from my side: I stressed that I was not even making ‘acceptable’ and over achieved to try to get through this, verging on burnout!)
          NOW: here’s the funny (or not) part. When I said that to the HR manager, in my response to her pointing out the fact that I was gradually coming down to a more reasonable pace to do work, HER response to it was: But Why Don’t You Stay Up There?
          (Now, both my boss and I had pointed out that it is difficult to sustain that kind of excellence, without burning out….) When we pointed that out again – she still didn’t get it. She expected me to perform to a standard… erm, for example:
          Response to all problems coming in: Instantly.
          If not instantly, then the problem must be given next priority. The person who has the problem however must be ‘instantly’ informed, including when it will be fixed.
          I must respond to problems quickly, resolve them quickly, (hell, I have even been told to powerwalk between jobs!!!) All work must be done quickly and efficiently, as fast as possible.
          (hmm, you think – that doesn’t sound so bad…)
          The organization I work for has 50 people in it, on the one floor. This means that I have to prioritize a server failing – on the same level as changing bl88dy toner in a printer. However, the toner takes priority if it is the HR Manager’s printer. Oh, hang on… if it is the mail server, that should take priority too…
          hmm, perhaps both should be fixed at the same time…
          LOL, this kind of thinking is what they expect. (And it was told to my face. My manager heard it too, and after the meeting told me that it was the biggest load of crap he has ever heard.)

          Anyway, back to work –

        • #3193216


          by g.m.bakker (cne, self employed) ·

          In reply to We’re not getting the entire story here?

          Yes I agree, I’m the guy that can give a user shit for messing up the network (extrovert), But….I’m also the guy that will help them recover…and hey, it only happens once! And that’s because I gave ‘m hell…but I never get shit back, because I helped to get the show on the road. And I’m just protecting corporate data and infrastructure!

        • #3191646

          Too Simple

          by deesy58 ·

          In reply to We’re not getting the entire story here?

          Joe@’s analysis is overly simplistic. Sometimes, it really is true that “nobody likes me.” If a manager doesn’t fit into the esatablished organizational culture, then he/she will be distrusted and feared. The result will be attacks that might be either personal or professional. Confrontation will never work! It is a bad idea! It could result in unexpected termination and unfavorable employment references. Don’t do it!

          The solution is to start looking for another position immediately. Keep your head down and hope that the timing of your departure from this flawed organization will be of your choosing, rather than theirs.

        • #3192366

          Hang in there mate

          by gardnermandy ·

          In reply to Yeah, just annoying.

          Hang in there mate, at least till another job materialises.

          Having worked for Aust DoD (and nearly going postal b4 i jumped with a lil johnny redundancy package), I know how damn frustrating it can be.

          It took me many years to get over the mental repercussions of 7 years working for our govt.

          remember, it’s not paranoia when they really are out to get you.

          best of luck

      • #3171895

        You are skilled

        by coder_for_you ·

        In reply to Look Elsewhere…


        you are a skilled person. you cna eaisly get a new job. May be u can go take a break and durignt hat time look for another job. Just dont put papers in your current job.

        See everyone durign one time or the opther goes thru a situation like this in IT , Its just the way u handle it.

        Some people get so frustated and leave the job , which actually the company wants. Or others they just crib about it till they r fired or somethign drastci happens. They r not thinking….

        I would suggest u to sit down and take note of the options u have. May eb for temporpray basis u would liek to do freelancing.. or would liek to gather up yourself, give some certifications and apply for jobs again..

        Life is not goign to end whether u r in this job or not.

        Apply a carefree approach and u ll succeed.


      • #3191779

        It’s easier…

        by anothercio ·

        In reply to Look Elsewhere…

        to look for a job when you have one.

        I’ve always counseled employees that to take responsibility for their happiness and I’ve taken my own advice on several occasions. “If you aren’t happy with your situation, do something about it.”

        Since you don’t appear to have a good handle on the source of your problem(s) and it has escalated to the point that your executive and HR are involved, your situation is serious. In my opinion it seems unlikely that you can manage your way to success in this organization. You might also ask yourself if it’s the kind of organization you want to be part of.

        From my perspective your energies might be better spent finding a work situation that better suits you. Life is too short to spend it some place you can’t enjoy.

      • #3192503

        Move On

        by tigertim ·

        In reply to Look Elsewhere…

        If they have already made judgements against you, without proper cause, then you have already lost. If it has happened before, it will happen again. Look for another job while still employed and then move on. Small companies like your current employer will eventually destroy themselves. I’ve seen it happen before.

    • #3172483


      by skidoggeruk ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You are in an abusive relationship. You will continue to be abused. It’s as simple as that.

      Escape with your dignity and self-respect intact.

      I could be wrong, but it sounds like you were getting dumped on from the start. i imagine that anybody that has worked with this company will recognise them for what they are, so, no shame in leaving, before it turns even nastier.

      Good luck

      • #3191956

        Sounds all to familiar

        by hescominsoon ·

        In reply to Leave

        With the massive exporting of IT jobs the ones you can find are often abusive ones. Hang into that job but start looking for another one. Barring that if there is a market for it think about starting your own consulting business. I have done that and while it is going slow it is growing slowly as i have found a niche to get into and am expaning from that.

      • #3191871

        I agree …

        by noorman ·

        In reply to Leave

        with Skidoggeruk,

        If they can’t or won’t appreciate you or your work you should get out.
        It won’t get better, it can only get worse !

    • #3172406

      Try to be cool

      by gene.fellner ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      First off, you’re not alone. Millions of people have truly horrible jobs, many of which are worse than yours. They have to feed their families and pay the mortgage, so they have to work.

      Some of them stew about it all the time, bring an air of depression home to the dinner table, and let it ruin their lives. Others have the ability to suck it up and not let it affect their personal lives. Others have found zen or something like that and sit there serenely not being upset. Others can’t stand it and get desperate, taking the first job they can find, which often turns out to be not better but just different.

      You can’t change who you are but you can at least figure out who you are and determine which of these scenarios is going to work for you.

      Not everyone can find a new job, at least not quickly. You may have to stick it out. I don’t know what the job market is like in the Antipodes, but here in the U.S. it’s not good. There are opportunities in a few specialties, but offshore outsourcing is slowly nibbling away at our economy and the long term prognosis in IT is abysmal.

      It seems quite unlikely that things at your company are going to improve. In fact they seem to be slowly deteriorating. You’ll probably have to leave eventually.

      But do it prudently. Start looking now, be rational instead of desperate, and hang in until you find a job that looks attractive on its own rather than simply better than the purgatory you’re in.

      May this be the worst fate that ever befalls you!

      Good luck.

      • #3192552

        Some ideas to keep on going

        by aapjanaya ·

        In reply to Try to be cool

        Take it easy, only best adapted survive.
        Ask yourself, is it worth to keep this job?, am I making good money out of it?, is it a good site to gain experience and later get a better job elsewhere?.
        How about your temper?, isn’t it a problem?, are you having similar problems elswhere?. If you are the problem, don’t worry this is quite common, for sure you can improve your behavior.
        Think about the loved ones, relatives and friends, are decisions yours or are there other biasing your judgment? They don’t know much about your environment, their advise may be valuable, but be cool, only you have the right picture.
        Is the just unemployment ghost eating your soul or is there something else?. Do you owe a great deal of money?, how about your mortgage?, are you supporting a kid in college? these are good reasons to fight for your job, no matter what.
        Sometimes things are not as bad as they seem, you just must cope with them without loosing your pride and selfsteem. Here comes a routine I practice often.
        Try making a list of the problems you must face, and the people behind each one. It won’t be too lenghty, maybe less than 20 items, if it grows beyond that make a deep review, remember that one problem can be related with several persons, maybe several cause the same problem. If your list keeps lenghty its time to find another job.
        If your list survives, tag the most critical problems and group them, you should come with less than 5 or 6 items. If most of your problems are critical its time to go elsewhere, you are not the problem.
        Sort problems by person and your headache sources will show up. Some possibly need you, helping in solving their problems may improve your status. Those just causing attitude problems are your actual rivals, worry if this population grows or varies on the next list.
        Don’t forget natural human attitudes, as a good quotation says, “Do a hundred things right and one wrong, people will recall you by the wrong one”.

    • #3170390

      Time to look for a new job

      by jcritch ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Now is the time to get that resume out and about. I think the cards have been stacked against you.

      remember, finding a new job while employed is easier then when you are unemployed! Start networking with other people you know. Good luck, tough situation to be in, but I do not see much future in that organization.

      • #3170279

        Yes, start looking

        by mjd420nova ·

        In reply to Time to look for a new job

        Get the resume out and polish it up.. however, don’t let anyone know, or they may escalate.
        I had the same thing happen, and it turned out that it was just a poor perception by one
        worker who expressed this to another, and away
        we go. Documenting was my isea as a solution, and after two months I was able to show that
        I was doing more than was in my job discription and they decided to leave me alone. Two months later I left and they cried..Too bad.

    • #3169647

      be Professional

      by bhima ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      be Professional, look to the company security policy for guidance (and Ammo), If this company is that small , and they have you doing that much, and are not backing you up, then move on. The company is sick from the top down!

      • #3169625

        Cover your rear end but be professional…

        by nidogski ·

        In reply to be Professional

        Jobs just don’t fall into your lap unless you are extremely lucky and with good skills and contacts.

        If they had anything concrete to go on for your “issues” then you would be on garden leave by now.

        They’ve actually done you a favour asking you to document everything you do as this gives you the proof of what a good job you’re doing, and you can steer it completely in your favour

        Adhere to all company standards, policies, procedures in your role – in effect becoming a bit of a jobsworth but doing what the powers that be have dictated

        Let the fact that this has gone on slide by, just totally ignore it – you seem to be on the moral high ground so back it up with documented evidence

        Also, make notes of anything people say, when they say it and who was invovled in the meetings. by rights i believe you are allowed your own representative in any HR involved meetings so pick someone you can rely on and ask them to document their thoughts on the matter

        They can’t get you out the business because one person has slated you for mentioning their secret stash of MP3 and xxx, however it sounds like they’re trying to manage you pout the business

        It will annoy them more you doing what they say and just getting on with it as there’s nothing they can do

        Bear with it and come out smiling!

        • #3169604

          Been There

          by onwynn ·

          In reply to Cover your rear end but be professional…

          This has happened to me in several areas of business – not only in IT – where my working environment was poisoned from without in an attempt to get me to quit. Funny thing is that, no matter what “issue” came up, I was never fired and only relieved of duty once – which backfired on them as the 2 people they put into place to take over botched the entire exercise.

          I agree with the document everything approach. Every thing you find that contradicts company policy, what people say (about you or your work only – do not become the corporate stoolie), anything you are asked to do that is outside of your normal duties. You have the right to request copies of any formal complaints against you (unless the Access to Information Laws are different where you are) and a copy of any filed notes or messages in your personal file.

          I requested these in a formal letter, and surprisingly, nearly every accusation and assesment meeting was subsequently dropped. There are some pieces of information that they do not have to show you – find out what he differences are and have it go through legal channels if needs be. If you really want to keep this job, then showing that you are not going to put up with this garbage by playing completely appropriate hardball might make them realize that you are not the pushover they seem to think you are. Know your rights and exercise them – you might get branded a trouble-maker, but you will also maintain your integrity as well.

        • #3191833

          Don’t Give up Yet

          by mcstonerms ·

          In reply to Cover your rear end but be professional…

          I can completely understand your situation, as I have been placed in a similar situation in the past. I ended up leaving the company rather than fight for what is right.

          I can only assume that you have a chain of command, you need to walk up the chain with your concerns, until you receive a posisitive response. You may also want to contact a labor attorney, as they will be well versed in hostile environments.

          Most importantly, make sure that you do every thing they ask within reason of course. Show up on time and don’t take any time off. If they are looking to replace you then it may already be to late, however try and make it work for you, please cover your rear.

    • #3169613

      Time to Move on

      by bricci ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I believe that you would be best suited to start looking for your next job before it becomes an urgent matter. There is no use trying to fight the perception that your company has of you now. It is obvious there is another issue here that no one is talking about. The company probably believes as these systems mature that they could save money by either outsourcing or replacing you with a much cheaper body. We are in a new age. The age of what did you do for me lately. I would suggest you read the 7 habits of highly effective people and perhaps the 8th habit.

      • #3171193

        once you find a job

        by dtsonly2004 ·

        In reply to Time to Move on

        Once you find a job and have left, turn in the old company for any unlicensed software. Also check the overtime laws in your state.

        I was required to work overtime but I did not make any hiring decisions or money spending decisions so I had a nice chunk of money coming my way. Make sure you have a copy of the company handbook.

        Revenge is not usually healthy but it is sweet.

    • #3171198

      don’t quit

      by dtsonly2004 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Unless you have another job. They don’t pick up and quit. Give notice.

      If you quit without another job you will have problems finding a job. Been there done that. Keep a low profile and do what is asked of you.

      Hold your head up high, smile, especially at the rat. It will drive them crazy. I had this happen to me. I was threatened each year with the loss of my job for not doing my job. For an entire year no work was assigned to me. I had to come in to work, sit and stay awake. During that time, I read books, learned how to program in Perl and Python.

      They are probably trying to force you out. Does your company fight unemployment claims, if they do, stick it out.

      • #3191927


        by bill.beckett ·

        In reply to don’t quit

        That all sounds pretty but reality is you are in a difficult situation. I’m not going to give you the rah-rah speech and say stick it out, keep your chin up, things will get better, etc. However, I will say that I wouldn’t quit until I had something else lined up but I would definitely be seriously looking and making plans to exit gracefully.

        • #3191865

          Time to update and publish your resume

          by tom.howarth ·

          In reply to Colored

          from what you have said, your position is becoming untenable. I suggest that you update you cv and send out the the agencies, however whilst at work, keep up the professional manner and do not under any circumstances leave under bad terms. the IT business is still small enough for a bad reputation to stick, no matter how untrue it is.

          the best thing is to attend the interview, get the job and give your notice in with adequate notice.

          You could attempt to deal with the greviances at your current workplace but from the intemation gleaned from your post, they do not appear to be open to listening and negotiaton.

          just my two pence worth

    • #3171173

      Maybe time to look elsewhere, but…

      by wayneb4 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I was in a circumstance where a coworker was trying to shuffle blame onto me for their problems (ie: programming problems filling a file system, delays in the project, etc.). Luckily, I recognized the symptoms before things got to the VP level and had documented every conversation I had with this person, down the exact time the conversation took place. The VP called a meeting to discuss the problems, the programmer tried to throw the blame onto me, I produced my notes, the programmer was replaced and I was complimented for my efforts. The reason I say all this is that any supporting evidence you can collect to make your side of the case should be presented to the Managing Director. If you have none, try to get support from coworkers who may have also had issues with the person that left. Even if you manage to turn this around and salvage your current position, I’d start the process of finding other work. You have a situation that indicates a company that will keep you tied up in covering your behind rather than doing your job. The reason for salvaging this before leaving is that you can then be a little more selective about your next position while you have a job that pays the bills (that’s what I did).

    • #3171136

      Something to think about……

      by rgimple ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      The first thing you have to ask yourself is…aside from this issue,do you enjoy your job, do you like what you are doing for this company? We all spend a large part of our day at work, with our co-workers, and if you are not happy during these hours you are wasting a huge part of your life. I spent years at a job that made me miserable and unhappy and it wasn’t until I had a job I truly enjoyed did I realize the huge chunk of my life I wasted
      The next question is… Do you really have a downer attitude? Every day is a choice and you have to decide if it will be a positive day or a negative day. Only you can make that choice. If you are affecting others by your negative attitude, this situation is perhaps an eye opener for you. Do you want to be the negative person?
      You should also ask yourself if you really want to deal with this every day. If the job is important I would suggest that you do meet with all three supervisors and ask that they help you work on your attitude and talk about what they believe the problem is. It is possible that the problem is the work environment and not you, but I think that any chance for your own personal improvement is worth the effort. If you find that the biggest of the problems is the workplace and/or co-workers than you should find a better environment. I always like to remind myself that is is not necessarily what we say, but how we say it that tends to scratch others the wrong way. Maybe you are not saying or doing anything wrong, but the way that you say it or the way you handle a situation is a negative manner. You may think “Well I did exactly what I was supposed to when I told this person to clean up their computer to comply with company guidelines.”, but maybe it was the way you had them clean it up that upset them. I think that talking it through with your supervisers will show them that you are serious about your job and that you are the better person for trying to make the situation better. GOOD LUCK

      • #3191938

        Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

        by paul ·

        In reply to Something to think about……

        I see most people say to quit, I suggest that if one or more peopel don’t like you that you have to have a look what is it that they are complaining about Like Rgimple just mentioned, are you having atitude problem? Are you saying the things to other people in a offencive way? You may not think so, but consider that IT is very un-nerving to most other people because they don’t really nderstand and do not like to be reminded of it. Be more diplomatic and do not judge them for not knowing. They job is to do other things, not to understand IT. That is your job, job to make it as easy as posiible for those working on other projects you may not understand. So what I am trying to tell you, don’t think they dum and stupid, your job is to make IT work for them so tey can go on with they jobs. Going and finding another job means you will face the same problem again. Do not thim=nk of the one complaining about you as been as—s, they are giving you wonderfull opportunity to look at yourself and find how you interact with society. Fight and flight is not a good outcome from anything. I wish you luck and lots of humble pie my friend. Face life with smile on your face and welcome challenges. T

        • #3192414

          Do a self evaluation and move on…

          by ivy clark ·

          In reply to Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

          I’m sorry to hear about all that you’ve been going through. Your situation reminds me of exactly what happened in one of my unfortunate employment experience. To cut the story short, I joined a creative team in an IT Solutions company, and there were a couple of trouble makers. Sad to say, they were the 3 senior members. I’m still not sure what they got from discrediting everyone else, as when it came to the crunch and work needed doing, they always had some excuses to get them out of it. What made it worse, was they were close friends with the team manager, so when the time came for a performance evaluation… well, you can guess what happened. I received one of those… “i’ve received numerous complaints about you” talks. I challenged my ex-boss and he crashed under the pressure as he never expected me to question the claims, one of which was: “team members are saying you are offering help, just to show off what you know”. What a load of nonsense! I was hoping for an increment, and i got it alright… $50. I was insulted. My boss proved his inapt by basing his evaluation on hear-say instead of my actual performance.

          I stayed on for a couple more years, as I refused to give up and let them win. During that stressful time, I only offered help when people approached me directly, and I kept to myself most of the time. I also learnt that the fault didn’t lie with me through assurances from other team members, some of which joined after me, and was just as shocked my the attitude of the 3 seniors. Then I decided to leave, as that job didn’t do my morale any good. I was a more confident person before that job.

          Looking back now, i feel rather stupid to have let that bring me down. That was the only job in which i encountered the problem. I was happy and appreciated in previous jobs and jobs I took on after that. Nevertheless, I learnt from that experience, and am a more patient and tolerant person. =)

          I think it’s a good idea to do a self evaluation. If this is the only job that’s been giving you such problems, chances are the problem doesn’t lie with you.

          So, now it’s time to move forward. Not quit. NO, you’re moving on, and forward to the next phase of your life. Hey, good luck with your job hunt.

        • #3192411

          just to add…

          by ivy clark ·

          In reply to Do a self evaluation and move on…

          oh yes, I forgot to mention… my ex-boss left the company eventually, and ended up in another job, in a lesser position. And that company suffered losses and couldn’t bear the costs of the creative team, so everyone got retrenched eventually. I heard that the trouble makers had trouble finding jobs for a long time, serves them right. If they had been nicer, perhaps the rest of us would have helped to recommend them something huh. For their sakes, and those who have to work with them, I hope they are better people now.

    • #3171057

      It’s REALLY time to go!

      by thelittlebrit ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hi r.young:

      This is a situation that is not going to improve. I believe some of the other responses have given you the same advice but in a 50-person company and with several of your “superiors” taking the offensive against you, there is no hope of a career in that place. Small companies can basically do what they like in terms of HR-related actions. So, my advice is to start immediately, but very professionally, looking for a new position. Identify the folks who support you and keep those contacts for references. Any time you spend in the current situation will be wasted time.

      Also, you should take a close look at the complaints that are being directed at you and ensure that you don’t get into the same situation in any new position. As unjustified as the compaints may seem, there is usual some behavioral kernel of truth that needs to be addressed. None of us are perfect.

      Another approach is to win the lottery, buy the company and fire the folks who don’t like you.

      Good Luck.

    • #3171055

      If they want you gone…

      by jason_whiteaker ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I wish I could offer some positive spin on your situation. However, I’ve been in a similar situation and the outcome wasn’t positive. The bottom line is that if management wants you gone, it won’t matter how much harder you try to become the “model employee” they claim you’re not pursuing.

      In my case, information was fabricated by my manager, and, I had documented proof that the information was a lie. I was told by HR that it didn’t matter. There was colusion, plain and simple. Problem is, I live in an “at will” state and workers generally have no rights. I even consulted an attorney…he basically said that in my state unless an employer can be proven to have fired a worker for something that violates civil law, then there’s not much chance of fighting the harrassment. In his words, “…if they want you gone, you’re gone.” The good thing was that the state determined that this company didn’t prove their case, so unemployments benefits were extended.

      I appreciate the other posters who are trying to advise you to make the best of the situation. I would suggest that you follow that advice, be professional, improve the things you can control, document-document-document, BUT LOOK FOR ANOTHER PLACE TO WORK! I don’t know about employee rights where you work, but the bottom line is that is sounds like you’re at best a lame duck at your present employer. The fact that other’s seem to have left for no apparent reason/similar reasons should be a red flag that your company has severe management issues. I’ve also been in the situation where the “rats were deserting the ship”, and again, I’d advise you to get out.

      I wish you well!

      • #3171050

        Oops, one more thing…

        by jason_whiteaker ·

        In reply to If they want you gone…

        Be sure that you do some SERIOUS self-evaluation. Despite the fact that my previous manager did what he did, I still recognized that I wasn’t without my blemishes. Do consider the complaints, and make sure that they are not completely without merit. Even though some may be out to do you harm, at least consider the idea of what they say. If the statements are complete fabrications, so be it. You might even check with your allies/friends and ask them for constructive criticism in the particular areas of concern.

        Again, good luck!

    • #3170914

      You’ll Be Fine

      by jrl21 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Man, that’s quite a situation you’re in. If you’ve decided that you want to stay with this company, you may want to do several things to regain your manager and co-worker’s trust (not approval). You may want to evaluate the way you work. If there is something terrible you’re doing I’m sure you can notice it and correct it. If it’s an attitude problem, It’s not something that just comes natural to you, it’s something you developed. The way to break bad habits is to replace them with new good habits. So if something annoys you try not to look at it negatively, do something positive to replace the negative thoughts. But I’m sure you will make it through if your heart is set on continuing your carreer with your current company. Another word I give you is not to worry at all about what others are thinking of you. When people chat behind your back it is best to ignore it, not to dwell on your faults for one more second, and forgive those who are. For a negative never produces anything positive. My best hopes for your career.

      • #3191923

        nose around or break someones nose

        by pivert ·

        In reply to You’ll Be Fine

        make up what you want to do: stay or quit. get some background info, you’re the it admin, you know where to look. If you stay, they won’t get you by surprise. If you quit, you’ll have some interesting things to tell the people that stay. If they fight dirty, kick back. perhaps they’re used to people that run when the first shot is fired. don’t forget: if you feel bad it affects not only but also the ones at home and your friends. so: man or mouse? what can happen? if they’re going to fire you, their mind is already made up and you’ll walk out knowing you fought back (and probably be a legend in the eyes of your fellows). If you stay then it’s because something has changed because you stood your ground. I’m a really nice guy but they had me down on a project once (couldn’t do anything good) until I hurt my hand on a diy. next day i said something about having had a fight with someone that had me pissed off, broke his nose. you should’ve seen their eyes! went from zero to hero in abt 1 sec. had no problems afterwards. it really can be something that silly to have them look at you with different eyes.

    • #3170877

      Be Proactive

      by dtaylor ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      If you like the job, campaign for it. I would also address the issue directly. Ask the powers that be, “What got us to this point and what can be done to get back to golden times?” What was your track record before the complaint? If it was great, make them aware that you performed well above satisfaction. If this is just one instance of a complaint that happened as a result of two buddy’s talking, this is certainly an abuse of a position. Unfortunately, this practice will continue on for generations. But I would also make HR aware that you have always strived to be professional and that you have a policy to always carry yourself forthright and would never abuse your position by jeopardizing someone else’s position unnecessarily. I’ve been a victim in this instance and I’ve learned that the prolonged abuse comes when one doesn’t stand up for themselves. Also, remind them of how you adapted without warrant to the changes that they proposed. Feel free to contact me directly if you like.

    • #3171480

      Thanks all… update

      by rattyratt ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hi all,

      thanks for the help, it has really been appreciated. I have been pretty much made known where I am at when my immediate supervisor felt that he and I should have ‘coffee’ offsite. He said to me that he went to a meeting with the HR Manager (who he called a blunt edged instrument) and my business line unit manager, and had to sit there while they discussed ways (strategies) to get rid of me. They were all for firing me on the spot, (which would have been fun, since that is unfair dismissal here in AU, and we can have a field day with that!) They decided on a more sneaky approach however, where they are going to set some arbitrarily high requirements for me to meet in a formal warning letter, and give me a month to meet them – once I can’t (obviously) then I will be given my 4 weeks notice. 🙂 It’s nice to have my boss on my side, since he wasn’t allowed to open his mouth in that meeting, as they ignored him totally. BTW: He is ecstatic about my performance, he was the one who hired me and has never regretted it. He even offered to put his own job on the line to defend me – and I had to sadly say that I didn’t want him to waste his work there, when they are determined to get rid of me. Poor guy looked so ashamed of this entire thing.

      Anyway, the gist of it is that I asked him should I be looking and was there any hope – he basically said that I need to get another job, since other people are going to soon make my life unbearable here. 🙁

      So that’s it. I noted some of you all said the same thing – and I had started prospecting, but I think it has hit the fan – and you know there’s a problem when they don’t even consult my immediate supervisor for comments on my work performance.
      LOL, however as my boss said, we have an incompetent HR manager, a rotten at the top (attitude: guilty until proven innocent) Managing Director, execessively wasteful executive managers, and a institutional policy that says pay rises for the executives is more important than work ethos.

      It’s time I left. I suppose there is others in this situation (or similar) out there. Feel free to add to this also. U ain’t alone!

      • #3171415

        Do it by the book

        by jleather ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Now that you have decided to look elsewhere, be sure you do it by any and all rules at you present company. Talk with you immediate supervisor about documenting anything your replacement will need (with in reason), prepare a formal resignation letter, give adequate notice, etc. The last thing you want is to have them complain you left them in the “lurch”, leaving unprofessionally, and what ever else they can come up with.

        Of course they may (will?) still come up with something but at least you will know you did your best (and have documentation to prove it!).

        GOOD LUCK!!!

        • #3191907

          I agree JLEATHER

          by romerosphere ·

          In reply to Do it by the book

          I agree, KEEP YOUR DUCKS IN A ROW! However before you decide to leave, try taking the offensive by focusing on your customers as well as the well-being of your business. Anyone who doesn’t like the way you do things will usually fall by the wayside by means of their own ignorance….either through attrition, or by just shutting up and letting you do your job.

      • #3171369

        Good Luck

        by pg05 ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Thanks for your post, and I had learned a lot from it. Just like my boss said to me before, the system is ok but people are the treble.

        • #3171320

          Feck ’em!

          by callplus ·

          In reply to Good Luck

          Mate, ur immediate super has just admitted that you are going to be hounded out of your job for no fair reason. Go see a solicitor and have the bastards!

          As for setting standards that u cannot possibly hope to meet go look at ur employment contract and see how thier targets fairly fit into that. If they try and force ur hand by getting u to sign something beforehand, refuse! Not until u’ve consulted with someone such as an employment lawyer. I have worked in Aus and am pretty sure they cannot alter ur contract like that without u having gotten consultation first.
          In the meantime be as good as gold. No free browsing, sending jokes, dossing off, even swearing! Hold doors open for people all that kind of thing. If possible monitor the complainers if u know how. What mails they send between each other and take a printed copy off site.
          Work the hours you are contracted to but no more. Again check ur employment contract on how much free if any OT they can expect out of u. Check what the employement rights are and unfairs dismissal act, that kind of thing.

          Document everything! Get logs, times u logged in, clocked in clocked out that kind of thing. I know lawyers can cost money, see if there are any trade union reps u can talk to. And consider why u didn’t vote LABOUR last time out if u didn’t! As it was Johnny Howard’s shower that wants to erode ur employment rights.

          If a lawyer has no hope for u then f*ck ’em ya know? Come in late, don’t do a tap, download all the music and movies u can.
          Rat out the bastards for licensing and having unlicensed copies of movies and music on their PC’s laptops servers etc. See if u can get a log of who actually downloaded it too and dob them in to RIPAA or whatever they are called.

          U have one main advantage on ur side in that they don’t know u know.
          An unfairs dismissal suit will scare the bejesus out of them *esp* if u can get ur super to stick up 4 u.
          fight the good fight, power to the people!

      • #3171242

        what you described

        by jck ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        is the general business ethic in corporate America, r.young. As long as the executives get their big checks, it doesn’t matter who they fire or what they sell off.

      • #3191935

        You really want fairness?

        by ex-military nut ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Take a lawyer with you to any stated meeting.

        From what I’ve read in this thread, they have YOU on trial! Who is representing you? Your supervisor, although you say he’s on your side, will most likely “cut bait” if it comes down to him or you. Look at it this way: He sticks up for you; they let HIM go. You are the target! From the way it sounds, they are going to fire you anyway! Thank your immediate boss, but don’t put him in the pinch, also.

        Take a lead from “them” – document everything! If they have policies in place that THEY aren’t following, show how and when the infractions occured and what was done by those who are supposed to enforce policy. Pardon my franknes, but CYA!

        I agree with others in this thread – look for another job now! Go on interviews and tell the truth. However bad your current situation is, NEVER EVER degrade your current employer! Just talk about the facts without embellishments. If your prospective employer calls to verify your reasons for leaving, he/she will see that your ethics are intact even while you are in the hostile environment. That alone speaks louder than anything your resume could ever present.

        Bottom line, Mr. Young: You keep on doing the right thing. People will talk; things will happen. But, always remember that your integrity is all you have at the end of the day. And always keep it professional! Never get personal.

        • #3191876

          And let the company keep acting that way??

          by mpschoo ·

          In reply to You really want fairness?

          If this “company” has investors or a board I would let them know the truth about the way their company is being run. If there are no investors then I would let the customers know what is going on. In America they invented a couple of great ideas. One is called worker’s rights and the other is called a union. I would definitely involve a lawyer. Ex-military nut is right in stating that your integrity is important but allowing people to continue to treat other people this way is more of a crime. Those people need to be put in check. Do not walk away without putting up a “fair” fight!

        • #3191829

          And let the company keep acting that way!

          by ex-military nut ·

          In reply to And let the company keep acting that way??

          Sometimes it’s not what you do or say, but how you do or say it.

          Thanks for the vote, but the company is already on a self-destructive path and no matter what is said or done, honest, productive change will come from the top. R.Young’s saving grace is that he will already be the expert. If he’s still there (or more accurately – if the company is still there!), he will be in a position to affect the greatest changes. Ultimately, it is Mr. Young’s choice – stay; go; fight; roll – take your pick. Just make sure it’s what you want and be ready to face the results. And as always – good luck.

      • #3191910

        Word of caution………..

        by sysadmin/babysitter ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Please get your references in writing BEFORE departure. A similar experience, where my immediate supervisor appeared to be my ally, changed dramatically once I left.
        He became THE problem after departure – giving a bad reference to inquiries. H.R. was giving more acceptable references that my former immediate supervisor!!
        Have a neutral party call for references (then report them back to you)…………

      • #3191891


        by dbrown486 ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Now why would your boss give you this information when it could probably be used against the company if you filed suit against them? Interesting…

        I know this sounds like it could be a hassle, but I would probably wait for that “impossible job” to get assigned. It would be an interesting challenge wherein if I completed it, I could not only put it on my resume, but also document it and use it against the managers who assigned it to hurt me.

        I like challenges I guess…

      • #3191887

        What to do now…..

        by bill.affeldt ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Get your resume out there QUICKLY.
        Get a letter of reccomendation from your immediate supervisor and at least on peer.
        When they set the arbitrarily high performance objectives – Document exactly why they cannot be met. Use your daily work log as ammo against them and make sure you keep copies OFF SITE.

        Do NOT sabaotage anything ( you don’t sound like a person who would do this anyway)
        Do not rant but be firm.

        I was ‘blacklisted’ once in an because I took an ethical path over my bosses CYA path. It took me over 3 years to finally get off that list.

      • #3191785

        Workplace Bullying

        by gryfon ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Is the term for what you’ve been through. It usually happens to the best and the brightest, those who stand out for some reason, and those who unintentionally incur the wrath of a bully.

        For more information on symptoms, tactics to cope, etc., visit this website: The folks who run it have both been victims and were completely bamboozled by what was going on at the time.

        After affects of these types of situations can be very similar to Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome, depending on how long this has gone on.

        I’m of the opinion that IT folks are more at risk for this as we tend to be loners (work long, odd hours) and highly intelligent. Intelligence scares the heck out of a lot of bullies and they do their best to get the upper hand with folks they find threatening.

        Good luck with this, and to any others out there who have just read this and went… “Aha! That’s what’s going on!”.


      • #3191771

        Wouldn’t be the first time…

        by indianacadadmin ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        In 1st Samuel 18, King Saul asked David to go collect the foreskins of 100 Phillistines hoping that David would die in the attempt. David returned with 200 foreskins and won Saul’s daughter to wife.

        Sometimes when people ask you to perform unrealistic tasks, the accomplishment of those tasks by any means necessary can be the undoing of those making the request.

        Just a thought.

      • #3191748

        Writing on the wall/Make the best of it.

        by captg ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        Sounds like the decision is made about your job for you. My wife went through a very similar situation last year here in the US, so some of my advice may not be applicable because of the differences in labor law.

        My suggestion is, first request a copy of all files regarding your employment, if there isn’t documentation of the complaints against you there may still be a case for unfair dismissal. Then after you receive your written warning give your resignation letter detailing the conditions of your departure (unreasonable performance demands, non-specific complaints etc.) & file a copy of both with your local labor commission, union representative or whomever is responsible for fair labor practices where you work. This may allow you to collect unemployment benefits which may not normally be available in the case of voluntary termination.
        Best of luck to you, & remember, this may be a chance to make a career move you wouldn’t have made if your job was secure.

      • #3192658

        Been there!

        by ltheodoru ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        10 years ago my then immediate supervisor left for another position and someone else took over. To my surprise, it became quickly clear to me that this new person had it out for me. Previously, I had won company awards for my work. Suddenly, my performance appraisals were horrible! I learned that the client (I was working for a consulting firm) had wanted me to get the position, not her. I had not even applied for it. Needless to say, I got another job. It actually worked out to my benefit. My salary and opportunities increased greatly and I have only regreted staying as long as I did.

      • #3192635

        Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

        by oldmainframer ·

        In reply to Thanks all… update

        I must admit, when I first read your post, I was wondering what you had done to make a bad name for yourself, and was going to suggest some real soul-searching… That still might not be a bad idea… But….

        I think that they have it in for you and that no matter what you do, in a short while, you will be gone.

        My wife had a similar event recently (not in the IT arena). She was hired to be a third person in a two-person crew. The two had been tight forever. In the morning, she’d be told one thing to do and by afternoon, what she did was not right, although she had followed instructions.

        In an earlier job, I made a mistake. I’ll admit that I did that, but it was not all THAT bad. In fact, my manager had made the exact same mistake a week or two before… They put me on a performance plan and on a Wednesday a couple of weeks later, they said I was on track and they expected me to pull through. On Friday I was gone. For a long while, I thought that it was me, but I found out that they canned the nex-most senior person the following Monday. Hmmmm.. Someone had another adgenda.

        So, find another job and go. I’d give short notice – say a week. They are probably already looking. And like someone said, don’t sign anything without great care. They may offer a termination letter. Be very careful. Don’t admit any wrongdoing or cause for termination.

        “I understand that my employment is being terminated today and in consideration I will be paid the sum of $1000.” Something like that is kind of bland and is probably OK.

        Good luck.

    • #3171863

      some ideas for you…

      by megabaum ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hi, I’m an IT consultant and deal with the political banter and buddy buddy system on every new project so I can feel your pain. I always live by the rule that people do not remember what you ‘say’, they remember how you made them feel… From your note it sounds like you just rubbed someone the wrong way and that person is jibber jabberin around the office way beyond what is needed. As to the management’s response… taking your training away, that is ridiculous and ineffectual to mentoring an employee, really! If they want you to improve in any facet including technology or communication skills, they should show a committment to you and help you to improve. It’s also pretty silly that they make you documnent what you’re doing down to the minute and if anyone made me do that I would for sure leave. See once it comes down to that level of nit picky It’s hard to maintain the good attitude they want. Start looking for jobs, better jobs, with more sophiticated IT technology opportunities and better HR development skills 🙂

      For now, bide your time, go in with a smile, know that it’s going to work out for you and keep that good attitude that you need to have fun at work and looking for new jobs! One last thing I would do is have a meeting with your manager and any other managers in charge of the training budget and ask them if they will pay for you to attend some ‘communication’ and ‘soft skills’ training and call them on their b.s., see if they are willing to invest in! If they say no it will show you that you are stuck in a political game with a company that does not know how to handle internal HR issues… just get out. If you have IT skills, there are plenty of jobs, consulting and employee positions to go around! Good luck dude and hang in there.


    • #3171857

      Get rid of the gray areas

      by darinhamer ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I sympathize with what you are going through and admire your desire to make this work. If you can stand it, it would be better to try to succeed in this environment than to just jump ship.

      My advice would be to sit down with your manager and find out what his/her expectations are and map out how you can meet those expectations. You don’t need to ask what the complaints are against you. It sounds like you’ve already heard all of that and that puts you in a defensive mode. The important thing is to look forward and develop a plan for how you can be successful. Forget about what “has been” and look at what “needs to be.”

      Have the steps bulleted or numbered and then keep track of your accomplishments. If your manager isn’t agreeable to telling you what the expectations are and what steps you can take to be successful, then put some down and get with your manager and ask if the steps you have will lead to your success. If the manager approves, follow up with an e-mail summarizing the meeting, documenting your action plan.

      Doing this gets rid of the gray area, shows that you are striving for excellence, and truly makes you the good guy. But, I also recommend that you document everything. Document every conversation you have with your manager, every e-mail, every time you get chewed out, but more importantly, every time that you are successful at meeting an expectation, document it!

      If your manager is any good at all, he/she will appreciate the effort you are putting forth. If the organization is truly as dysfunctional as it sounds, then you will at least have something to defend yourself if it ever hits the fan. Document the contents of conversations as well as dates, times, places, etc. I have had to take disciplinary action with employees, and I guarantee you that I always have plenty of documentation. When the employee protests, they generally only have their recollection of things to defend themselves. They could be much more effective if they also had documentation of events.

      This doesn’t sound like much fun, but I think it is the right way to go. If you can stick with it and turn around the attitude of the people in your work environment toward you, you will be much better off. Not only will it make you more marketable, but it will mean that you can withstand working in a number of environments and you will build the “people skills” that are becoming more and more valuable in the IT field.

      Good luck to ya!

    • #3171561

      Don’t sign anything

      by debfow ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Having gone through almost the same sceanrio, I suggest that you continue to document everything and keep copies for yourself. DO QUIT. If they fire you and you have good documentation, you may have some legal recourse. Also, don’t sign any papers without reading them completely because they may really be resignation papers. I wouldn’t sign anything that they write up on you either without a witness.

    • #3191959

      Tried asking?

      by myron_s ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Have you actually tried asking someone to “define the problem”? I did that where I work, found out the issues which all ended up being trivial, gave satisfactory and honest answers and explanations and now everything is peachy.

      Communication . . . Don’t under-rate it.

      If communication does not work then you are working in a hostile encironment and that will not be good for your health. Your friends and family will also be affected. They’ll pick up on your body language.

      In that case, resign.

      Health and family first. Work second. Always!

    • #3191957

      Is that you John Wayne…Is this me???

      by rdufrene ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      We all have to relalize that the company is not about IT. Without the company we have no job and no function. Therefore, our job is to support the users. Know the company policy, show them how to clean up the PC and always be positive. Never, ever say “I DON’T KNOW”. Another tid-bit. Don’t quit a job until you have a job.

      • #3191949

        Be careful!

        by frank askins ·

        In reply to Is that you John Wayne…Is this me???

        As others have said, been there & have the T-shirt. I didn’t read all the inputs so someone may have already mentioned “Employee Relations Attorney”. Both my neighbors are in the profession so I know they exist to represent the employee as well as the company. Key to your situation is: document, document, and document! Dates, times, conversations, etc. It could be a pain in the butt now, but prove very valuable in the down the road.

        I’ve worked for two “mom & pop” companies in the past, but never again. I’d rather sell blood for food or dumpster dive to live. No matter the outcome, you will never be successful where you are. It’s definately time to move on, but be sure to protect yourself and your reputation. Don’t go around bad-mouthing the company or it’s employees. Remain professional and it will pay off later.

        Good luck.

      • #3191918

        and without IT

        by halonsx ·

        In reply to Is that you John Wayne…Is this me???

        and without IT the company makes no money and is not competetive…as i have seen.

    • #3191955

      Stick It Out

      by lutterwortht ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      If you’re good at your job then stick it out and let your work speak for you. Like you, I do everything in the I.T. field and we had a new Executive Director who appeared to have the task of getting rid of me (I was able to confirm this through seeing email correspondence). I stuck it out and eventually he realised who keot things going and who made things happen. We now get on great, I no longer have restrictions and get praised for almost everything I do!

    • #3191954

      I Feel Your Pain

      by roboknee ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Nearly two years ago I became the only IT person that my department had exclusively to themselves. Going in, everyone knew how much I would be earning which became an issue for them. As time went on, certain users had their own personal opinions and ideas about me which they used as a valid reason to make me feel highly unwanted. I was made to feel that I was on some type of never-ending probation. No matter how hard I worked and did what I was supposed to do, there were still complaints. To combat this, I would voice my discontent to one of my few (2) trusted coworkers. By being able to vent to someone other than those at home (which I also did!), I was able to go to my supervisor and the head of the department for which I work, and discuss this with them in a more level headed way. What made matters better though is the fact that my supervisors are good people. My immediate supervisor is a wonderful boss and person, and having been in the trenches and still sporting the battle scars, he was able to give me positive reinforcement and direction. Not everyone is as fortunate to have a boss who will stand behind them and guide them as needed. Some bosses take a hands off view and just sit back and watch you crash burn. And then just look on as the natives come out to celebrate your employment demise.
      My suggestion to you is this: if you don’t have open dialog with your boss, then definitely start getting your resume out there and find a new home. Don’t give the natives anything that they can work with. Sure they may make up stuff, but so what. At least it can’t be proven! And no matter what, find something to laugh about everyday, because once you lose your sense of humor, you’ve lost the battle. Be secure in your knowledge of your abilities. They can only take away what you give them – give them nothing! Good luck. If it weren’t for our ability to lock out accounts at will, I do believe that IT persons would top the list of disgruntled employees. We’re justa hair’s length behind postal employees. They have no outlet.

    • #3191948

      Look in the mirror

      by admin ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      One must look in the mirror before worrying about anyone else. The job carries is burdens and baggage. The other folks have a similar opinion about their workplace and responsibilities as do you. One can only control their own behavior. In the case of IT, it is simply to do your job.

      • #3191783

        Zen is fine, but it doesn’t help w/ Office Politics

        by bargod101 ·

        In reply to Look in the mirror

        That’s all well and good, but most people who play office politics don’t look in the mirror.

        I spent over 5 1/2 in a fortune 500 IT shop where IT personnel were used as pawns for political gain. I kept my nose clean and daily worked to keep on the right side of the line. Then I left when the opportunity was right..

        My advice is to find a new gig. With what you have describe, I don’t believe you will be able to ever recover your political capital in order to be happy in the position.

        my two cents…

        good luck

    • #3191947

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by dnitz ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      ryoung, many of us have our battle wounds from crap like this that occurs in the workplace when a bunch of folks gang up on the new guy/girl. Maybe you got a job someone(s) on the inside wanted. Maybe you started enforcing policies that those before you did not. I know this is not what you want to hear but… this job is dead for you. You need to move on. It’s a sick company, rotten at the top if your managemnt is not supporting you and I don’t see things getting any better. Better for you to find another job and leave gracefully than to be fired and have that on your work record.

      Good luck and we care.

      • #3191920

        Interesting delimma…

        by ex-military nut ·

        In reply to Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

        Do what’s right; take heat; quit before getting canned.

        Do what’s right; take heat; get fired.

        Honestly, MAKE THEM FIRE YOU! Legally, they have to document why your were fired.

        If (When) you are fired, have it reviewed by a lawyer. Also present YOUR documentation (keep it as a journal if you like). If your termination is found to be an illegal action, you then have the option to refuse further employment with that company and they will be known in the business for what they are: A hostile employer.

        Either way, good luck!

    • #3191945

      Been there, done that, ran away screaming

      by tantor ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Okay, maybe not exactly. I was in a large IT department with a small IT director. He had something he could never figure out, and within a few weeks I had solved what stuck in his side for two years. He never got over that. Made the job tough. When he started to lean on my reviews and make my job tough, I decided it was time to roll.

      Do your job, don’t let it affect your performance. Keep your chin up and find something. And as much as you may not want to, when you find another job, give and serve your two weeks. Life has a funny way of circling around and an ounce of good will now may pay off two or three jobs from now. As the saying goes, don’t burn any bridges.

      Good luck.

    • #3191944

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by david.moss ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Formal complaints are an annoying part of supporting government. They are an all-too-common part of the power politics in a bureaucracy.

      Normally formal complaints are withdrawn soon after they are initiated. This avoids the complainant having to justify the complaint, but leaves subtle black marks on the record of the target.

      After a rash of such complaints, and hints from my manager about there being fire where there was smoke, I put my foot down. I made it known that next time someone made a formal complaint I would insist that a full formal investigation take place, even if the complaint was withdrawn.

      I have not been made aware of any complaints since then.

      I find the people most likely to complain to management are insecure in their own positions. Advice that may lead to a change in work practice causes them to become agitated. When it is necessary to ensure advice is recieved and understood, some people believe they are being personally attacked and retaliate through the complaints process. In private enterprise most managers listen to the complaint and drop the matter, the public service has to follow things through however.

      My advice: up the ante.
      Insist the next formal complaint is thouroughly investigated even if it is withdrawn. Once word gets around the bureaucracy you wan’t see another complaint for a very long time.

    • #3191943

      Up the ante

      by david.moss ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Formal complaints are an annoying part of supporting government. They are an all-too-common part of the power politics in a bureaucracy.

      Normally formal complaints are withdrawn soon after they are initiated. This avoids the complainant having to justify the complaint, but leaves subtle black marks on the record of the target.

      After a rash of such complaints, and hints from my manager about there being fire where there was smoke, I put my foot down. I made it known that next time someone made a formal complaint I would insist that a full formal investigation take place, even if the complaint was withdrawn.

      I have not been made aware of any complaints since then.

      I find the people most likely to complain to management are insecure in their own positions. Advice that may lead to a change in work practice causes them to become agitated. When it is necessary to ensure advice is recieved and understood, some people believe they are being personally attacked and retaliate through the complaints process. In private enterprise most managers listen to the complaint and drop the matter, the public service has to follow things through however.

      My advice: up the ante.
      Insist the next formal complaint is thouroughly investigated even if it is withdrawn. Once word gets around the bureaucracy you wan’t see another complaint for a very long time.

    • #3191940

      Kick back

      by jg_maxwell ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Start looking for a job but in the meanwhile stop trying to do everything. They pay you but they don’t own you. When I was in that situation, I did a bartleby(movie where the guy was polite, nice but would not do anything). Thank you but I’d prefer not to. Do your 7.5 hours but not a minute longer. Smile.. enjoy.. the place sucks.. you know that and you can’t change that. So have fun with it. Joke with it. Tweak them .. I’m sure you probally have found another person there that you can bond with and use as a reference. Hang with that person somewhat but not too much (wouldn’t want to infect them;)) and other than that go in, shut the door, come out when you need to and then go home. Live for thursday, friday and the weekend. What’s the worse they can do.. KEEP YOU.. Once you develop this attitude, you are free!! You take the power away from them and you have it back. I have to work but I don’t have to work for jerks. There’s always a job for us old IS people (DOS 5.0 was good .. remember DoubleDOS ?) we’re the bomb and we don’t have to take crap from anyone (unless they’re paying fist-fulls of cash) .. So smile .. Don’t let them get to you.

    • #3191939

      Learning experience

      by deniskc ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I have been in similar vindictive situations but not quite escalated to that level. It sounds like in a quest to take on new and exciting activities as an adjunct to your role, you have left yourself open to be a scapegoat. Nothing new, not even in aussie companies.
      I would heed the advice of others who suggest start making plans to leave, and protect your benefits (holiday pay, super, etc), salvage what you can.
      I would advise against any sort of revenge, the whole karma thing … Remember, your current organisation becomes your first reference for the next place you work, whether you like it or not.
      Maybe you shouldn’t be afraid to look further. I left Melbourne for Sydney after I left uni and now I’m in London. However, regardless I think you should consider a possible 3-6 months to find what you want (maybe much quicker). You have to be fussy and consider what you learnt from this situation (firstly – protect your back, people are bad, nasty, greedy, selfish).
      Network, sell yourself, get your CV out there, be aggressive, contact agencies, get the Weekend Australian, SMH, The Age (or their websites).
      When you have your leaving interview, be careful about letting on the real reasons. It’s OK then to put on your mask and talk about career objectives, etc. Remember, it’s a bit of a game and you don’t want them to think they won over you. Revenge, in this situation doesn’t really pay. Remember the karma thing.

      Best of luck!

    • #3191936

      Welcome to the Jungle

      by smarks74 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      When you are an IT leader, it is seldom about the technology. Here are some things to think about:

      1. Maybe the problem is you didn’t have much to do with them and they feel left out. What is their history with your department/predecessor? Does their department feel their needs are being met?

      2. How strong are your relationships with your boss? Their boss?

      3. How much time have you spent building allies in the organization? Have you built a relationship with the head person?

      4. How visible are you? Do you ‘walk the floor’? Do you vist key people when they are having a problem? Do you visit after to see that they are satisified? Do you then stay a minute to see what else they need, let them know about inititatives?

      5. And finally, have you had any of this kind of situation before? If you have, look to yourself. If you have not, what you think your job is and what the organization thinks your job is might not be the same.

      There is a sea change going on in technology management. It used to be about the technology. Technology is now a utility. The IT Director/CIO’s job is to be a connection between technology and the business – developing business need into technology products and communicating between both sides.

      It may not be too late (not enough detail) but you have to do something different to resolve the problem – FAST.

      Hope this helps,

      Steven Marks

      • #3191928

        Well said

        by paul ·

        In reply to Welcome to the Jungle

        I must say – very well said samarks@….
        IT personnel are in any business the link between people and technology. As I mentioned elsewhere, IT guy is in company to make IT technology as simple to use for the non IT as possible, not to think they are silly because they don’t understand it. We don’t understand most of the time what they are doing also. Changing jobs by running away from problems means running forever. These problems run with us and we meet them in our new job again. So please work out what happened and perhaps than you can go. Once again – good luck.

    • #3191933


      by suzanne.l.brown ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I have been where you are. In my case, I decided that the stress was interfering with my personal life and bailed and never regretted it. If you are determined to turn the situation around, though, there are alternatives. One is to contact a conflict resolution service and have them mediate discussions with yourself and other staff members. I would begin with your peers and upper management as you need their support to change the attitudes of employees.

    • #3191931

      Time to prepare to leave on the high tide.

      by andeanderson ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Yeah, it is time to start talking with some head hunters, other company IT Managers and maybe even some temp agencies.

      But, Do NOT quit unless you have accepted another position with another company. One HARD lesson I learned after leaving the Air Force and I’m still paying for it.

      You are in a no-win situation and unfortunately it is a common theme in a lot of small companies. The bosses buddy can do whatever they want – regardless of policy and law.

      • #3191922


        by old_et_man ·

        In reply to Time to prepare to leave on the high tide.

        It’s time to take a step back and really, truly examine what’s going on around you. Whatever physical activity that helps you release the tensions of the day is a great outlet to re-examine your whole situation.

        Is it the entire staff or is there a ringleader – someone looking to replace you with a relative. If the problem is one person, document everything that’s not proper but always within published company guidelines. A simple “memo for record” in many cases will provide enough ammo for use later in confronting the ringleader through your boss.

        If it’s the entire place, then deeper reflection is in order. Several other posts already outlined what needs to be done in that case.

        Either way, Good Luck!

    • #3191926

      Why is all this happening?

      by dbrown486 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I’m not sure I’ve got an accurate picture of why this is happening to you. You say its because of some rules you enforced on one person, and now EVERYONE hates you?!?!? This just doesn’t make a lot of sense. There’s a general rule about there being more than one side to a story and I’m not sure we’re hearing both sides of this.

      But anyway, lets assume you do work in an insane and hostile environment. Don’t quit; quitting makes it harder to get unemployment. Stick it out as long as you can and try to work it out. Keep good records of your work; use sign off sheets with each user oriented task so that your work, and the quality thereof is documented. The company is making you document things for their use: ammunition. Do your own docs to cover your ass and make sure that they jibe.

      In the meatime, look for another job. If you can transition from one to another without losing income, do so. It’s much easier to find a job if you have one.

      If possible, get some reference letters from people at this job who still like you.

      Good luck!!

      • #3191879

        I have to agree

        by raul62 ·

        In reply to Why is all this happening?

        I don’t mean you’re lying or hidding details. But the way we make contact with other people can damage seriously your relationship with your colleagues. Think about this, beyond your current particular job, because you are probably moving to another place, and you’ll go there with your own way.
        The ideas from dbrown can sound a bit basic, but you don’t mention to have taken them: Document your work (always), get user/boss acceptance for your completed tasks, be gentle.
        It’S a pitty that your direct boss can’t talk for you. This must be a precedent to take into account in your search: Try to “smell” the internal relationships in the places you visit. This could be a good index for a decision.

        Good luck!

        • #3191780

          Workplace Bullying

          by gryfon ·

          In reply to I have to agree

          Is what this is. It sounds weird, everyone hates you, but when a bully picks a victim and starts the gossip at the water cooler, believe me, it CAN happen.

          I posted about this further up the thread, but wanted to answer these two posts as well as this is the EXACT reaction that folks who’ve never seen this situation have when they first hear of it. They often think the victim has done something to ‘deserve’ it or that they’re hiding something.

          For more info, visit:

          Best to all,

    • #3191924

      Whoa, Whoa, Whoa!!!!

      by debon ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hello r.young I can honestly say that I understand how you feel as a similar thing has happened to ne previously. Let’s take a look at your situation and as usual its best to start by looking at yourself. You haven’t said specifically what the complaints about you have been for and I get the feeling that you are saying it is all THEIR fault and NOT MINE. Again I understand how you feel but you need to do some soul searching to see if it possible that at least some of the blame can be attributed to you. Only you can answer this question though. Try to get specifics as best as possible because only then can you begin to address the issues regardless of whether or not they reside with you. I would not feel too badly about having to document daily tasks because this can also be used to your advantage as it is verifiable proof of your value to the Company. It is very difficult to give specific suggestions in the absence of the reasons for the dissatisfaction so all I can say is try to stick it out and as I said earlier, try to get specifics. You really don’t want to leave right now as it would seriously affect the kind of recommendation that your current employer would give to a prospective employer.

      • #3191815

        Remember Recommendation!!

        by pcpapa ·

        In reply to Whoa, Whoa, Whoa!!!!

        I apologize if somebody already posted this, I haven’t read thru the whole thread. Since your immediate superior seems to be the only one aware of the quality of your work, ask him to write you a recommendation letter. That way you can use that as a reference since you can’t count on the company to give you one, especially if he leaves.

    • #3191921

      Think before you quit.

      by lsa ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Someone wrote about challenging the complainers by asking for a hearing; good idea. It may sound good to say leave, but you may regret it because of lost wages, projects left undone, and perhaps some missed friends there. Work through this mess by using the system.
      These complaints may be small, time-consuming and nonsensical, so fight them and show the people there you’re made of sterner stuff.

    • #3191919

      Workdescription could help…

      by kai.lindegren ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      It sounds to me that your organisation dont understand what you in your role have to do to support the organisation business goals, are you trying to maintain company poilcys without any formal workdescription or policy ?…you should adress this with your manager and make sure he/she understands your workload, what are expected of you as a start, if that dont get things better, think of quiting, maybe then it is on a personell level and that is something else.

      Good luck…

    • #3191915

      Request meeting – get specifics of complaints

      by schristo ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      In an effort to turn the situation around, I would request a meeting with HR and my immediate boss – in a neutral location – not in the managers office or the HR office, use a conference room or some other neutral territory. I would get specific information from them about what the complaints are. Try to use the meeting as a way to let them know that you are interested in the company and working with the other employees. Come up with a list of questions about the complaints. YOU lead the meeting. Take charge of the meeting and let them know you want to improve yourself (whether or not you feel you need to). Don’t get defensive – try to keep emotions out of it. Once you find out more specifics of the complaints, ask their opinion on what they think you need to do to improve or correct the situation.
      Make sure you document the meeting. The documentation might come in handy later.

      Just my 2cents.

      • #3191900

        Good Advice:

        by nonamepipes ·

        In reply to Request meeting – get specifics of complaints

        If Schrito’s advice doesn’t turn out good for you consider voting with your feet. Since your the only IT person you have some weight in your corner since they need support. I’ve ran into a similar situation with manipulative bosses before and they can be unworkable. It’s time to consider moving on. I would also be as professional as possible and try and keep your job in focus and not the current complaint issue.

        Good Luck.

      • #3191873

        Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

        by get lost dave ·

        In reply to Request meeting – get specifics of complaints

        The only things I’d add to what has been said here are:

        1 Never describe the problems/issues as being with your colleagues! Your problems are with the response to you attempting to implement company policies and the lack of management backup. The solution that you should attempt to present to your company is that the problem is either with the lack of management support for the company policy and either the policy or the level of support needs to change.

        2. Try to make friends with HR. You will be surprised how similar IT support work and HR work is in terms of the fact that the work that you can do is endless, and that any work that you do will be misrepresented and underappreciated!

        Finally, I?m not sure if your managers advice is the best. You need to find out exactly what people have against you, and probably the best place to do that is with HR, rather than your supervisor.

    • #3191914

      Something Similar

      by the verne ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I am the only IT Tech in my company, we have two sites, miles apart and I’m expected to sort out all the problems on both sites.

      On the main site this isn’t such a problem, I’ve had plenty of time to sort out the little problems and even been able to build some computers and had a goodlevel of general support.

      On the satellite site however, problems seem to be happening with computers. These are little problems, but they seem to be happening with increasing frequency. They all seem to be based around the manager, who does nothing but complain about me.

      The best part is I set up a wireless network, which due to bad communication and a complete lack of technical knowledge on their part meant it took me way too long to set up. They even had the broadband internet installed for two month and hadn’t bothered to buy a modem, or even get the one that the company was giving away free with the installation.

      After a lot of complications and to-ing and fro-ing, I managed to set up the wireless network and have the internet shared on all the computers. A week later the entire network came down. Of course this was all suddenly attributed to me, who had been nowhere near it since getting it all up and running. It turned out that the computers had all been moved, including the one that was routing the broadband. Admittedly that shouldn?t have affected the signal too much. However, when I checked all the computers I needed to re-install all the software, for some reason it had all disappeared, and the best was yet to come. Sure enough, as I?d been told, the internet was no longer working. I checked the connections, it was all fine. But had to re-install the modem, that software had mysteriously disappeared also, along with the wireless software. So, installing the wireless software it transpired that the wireless network card wasn?t installed. Looked in the back and sure enough the card was there. So thought, right, take it out, put it back in. Took the side off the computer and all the expansion cards, the internal modem and the wireless network card were hanging loose. The move had made everything jump out. This was suddenly my fault also. I had nothing to do with the computers being moved and only found out after the fact. This didn?t stop a sudden whispering campaign about how bad an IT Tech I was. I now refuse to touch two of the computers down there, as they aren?t really part of the company?s equipment.

      I?m currently looking for a new job and getting seriously depressed in my current one. I find though, if I give them EXACTLY what they want they have nothing they can complain about. After all it?s not my fault if they don?t know what they?re asking for.

      • #3191897

        Start some logs Verne

        by breadtrk ·

        In reply to Something Similar

        In your situation Verne, you need to start some logs on the one troublesome user’s machine. If he is sabatoging your efforts, you can document them. Chances are very good that if that manager is a jerk to you, he is also probably a jerk to those who work for him. Document his misdoings and get him canned, or better yet arrested.

        • #3191874


          by the verne ·

          In reply to Start some logs Verne

          cheers for the advice man.

          Everything that goes wrong down there since the first time I figured someone was tampering with the machines has been documented. One time, when the director was down, I showed her what would have had to be done wo stop the computers from talking to each other, and it’s not the type of thing where a button can be accidentally impressed. the main problem was that the IP settings had all been changed. I really looks like the computer has been rolled back to a previous time, and I said this to the manager, who totally denied everything.

          thankfully though, the director’s really cool and sides with me. the manager is a known troublemaker anyway and may be getting moved sideways in the company to get her away and stop her from doing any more harm.

        • #3191764

          Folks like this ALWAYS do harm

          by gryfon ·

          In reply to cheers

          No matter where they’re moved. It’s a pity these people are seldom fired.

          This’ll be my third post today on this topic in this thread, but chances are you may read this, Verne.

          You may be the victim of workplace bullying. I’ve provided a link to more info in the other threads I’ve popped up in. I’m harping on this subject as it hurts me to see good folks get screwed over.

          More info: (non profit, no one makes money if you visit, this is NOT spam).

          Good luck!

        • #3191665


          by the verne ·

          In reply to Folks like this ALWAYS do harm

          thanks for the link, doesn’t feel like I’m being bullied though, just that the manager doesn’t want people “invading her territory”. Got my own little bit of revenge coming up though, gonna be running a few wires from her office, and maybe even taking the internet control away from her

      • #3191643


        by deesy58 ·

        In reply to Something Similar

        Sounds like deliberate employee sabotage to me! And, it is being countenanced by management. I had a similar experience about thirty years ago with an IT installation for a major Eastern US railroad. The union employees believed that their jobs were being jeopardized by the installation of computers, so an active program of employee sabotage began. It was frustrating, but those of us responsible for the installation were able to take comfort in the knowledge that railroad management knew what was going on, and they handled it in a responsible, low-key manner. Unfortunately, you don’t seem to have that luxury. It’s time to get out. You can never win in such a “sick” organization.

    • #3191912

      Divide and conquer

      by dtrejo ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Not really! But you have to find one or two “old” staff who are willingly to listen to what solutions and ideas you have to offer. Once they get to know that you “aren’t that bad” they could pass the word around. I once worked for a boss who came and stirred things up aND the ENTIRE IT department hated him. He had brought from from another organization so I knew he was a GOOD guy. Slowly I walked around and made new friends and they got to know me and the new boss and found that we were not there to “destroy” the organization. It was not an overnight thing, took about 6-9 months, but after that we had(still have) the best IT department anywhere. So stick it out. GOOD LUCK.

    • #3191911

      Check yourself first

      by donford749 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      My first piece of advice is really be certain that you are not at fault in some way. It is always easy to see what the other person is doing wrong, but difficult to see our own errors.

      Next listen to everything that you are told about what you have done/are doing wrong. Repeat step one.

      If you find that you are at fault in any of the issues/problems, figure out what you can do to correct them and work your hardest to do that. It doesn’t matter whether you are only 5% at fault, if there is anything you can do to resolve the problem, you should do it.

      If after honest self assessment and talking with a very objective third party you find that the complaints are without basis, find another job.

      If you start with “find another job” and the real issue is something you are doing wrong, you will have similar problems everywhere you go.

      Don’t let pride, fear, or anger stop you from fixing any part of the situation that you can. Remember, you are not responsible for the actions of others, only your own!

      • #3191856

        Yeah, maybe you screwed up.

        by delbertpgh ·

        In reply to Check yourself first

        I can’t tell from your letter what the nature of the complaint is. It’s easy to imagine lots of things a person could do to aggravate others. It’s easy to imagine how others could get picky and start complaining unfairly about you, too. I can’t take a stand.

        However, you do seem to have a lot of managers paying attention to your case, which suggests either they have noticed problems with you, or that your complainant is exceptionally well-connected. Maybe it’s you.

        Suggest you sit down with a manager, and ask what the problems are. Ask: is it a particular issue, or is it my approach? If there’s an issue, how do I defuse it? If it’s me, what are examples of situations where nerves get frayed? How can I better do my job?

        If the manager’s any good, he is primarily interested in helping the firm make money, avoiding risks and distractions, and keeping a happy environment. Your squabble with a person or persons (you suggest it may be several) sounds like it is becoming a big distraction, and he will want to see it fixed, and preferably without him having to wield the heavy hand.

        If it is somehow your fate to annoy lots of people with personality issues you just can’t escape, then get a job that doesn’t involve support.

      • #3191641

        Good Advice?

        by deesy58 ·

        In reply to Check yourself first

        Is this your very first job? If so, then perhaps the offered advice might be good. But, if you have worked in other organizations and not experienced these types of problems, don’t waste your time with a lot of useless soul searching. It isn’t worth it! Get out of that “sick” organization and go someplace where your abilities are needed and will be appreciated. Such organizations really do exist. You just have to find them.

    • #3191906

      Kill them with kindness

      by dstaub ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I have worked in several hostile environments. I was once in a Union shop where I was a minority and seemed to have no support from management, as they wanted to keep the majority happy and more importantly “working”. Once I realized management would not confront the trouble makers I decided to handle the situation myself. I observed the conduct of the workers who were trying to drive me out and found they were waiting till the last second to report problems so as to have me look to be slow to respond to their needs.They would not wait one second to call the manager and complain that I was preventing them from being more productive. So after a couple of fruitless complaints from me and being reprimanded for not helping these “innocent” workers. I adopted the “He with no reason, cannot complain.” approach. I made it my highest priority to service these ingrates to the highest posible level. I made absolutely sure they had what they needed to do their jobs and was always looking for trouble they might encounter. This approach worked perfectly for me. They now were complaining that I was being too thorough. It turned out that these folks just didn’t wish to be productive because they do not get paid for extra work. After a couple of weeks of hyper vigilance on my part I discovred that they found themselves in the managment spot-light with almost no excuses to defend themselves. 🙂

    • #3191903

      The Art of the Game

      by i,technician ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Well, r.young, you have hit the big’s, a good post that tons of folks are passionate about. As you sort through this cornucopia of posts, remember that it is only the Art of the Game that matters. Forget technology for a moment and consider that our personal and professional lives revolve around, indeed require, other people in order to be made meaningful. The Game is always being played and you must master it or be trampled by it.

      Far too many technicians believe they are on the payroll to fix things, but that is not entirely true. Technicians must also be competent at the (people) Game. Your resume? might have gotten you the job, but once begin inhabited the world of the technically challenged all bets are off. There are countless technically savvy men and women out there that can?t keep a job because they have not learned the Game. Sadly, too many technicians are self-righteous about their technical prowess, believing that if they can fix anything, they will never be outsourced. A misconception that will leave a mark if they management gets tired of their pushy ways. These people live, think and speak another language. They are different that you and I. As proof I offer this, have you ever seen the head of accounting drooling over the latest LAN tester or the HR manager thumbing through a copy of Embedded Linux Journal? NO!

      So, r.young, you must now decide whether you will or will not walk away from this fight. If you decide to stay, do it with all the conviction you can muster. Do your work quietly, patiently and with a sincere kindness in your heart towards those you serve. Then read every people book you can get your hand on and learn the Game. I recommend The Art and Skill of Dealing With People by Toropov. If you decide to walk away, fine but you must do it with class, style and dignity. Communicate with management about why and when you will be leaving, get your affairs in order, give a detailed turnover, say your good-byes and hit the street.

    • #3191898

      A flag has many colors

      by derek.shotwell ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I just recently left my last job for the same situation. Although this company was in the fortune 500 and had many more employees, one person who had seniority over me, made my life miserable, it affected my health. Now, I’ve found a better job in a very small company managing all their IT, Phone and security needs. Never happier, best decision I ever made. Although that may not be your best solution, it wouldn’t hurt to look outside and see what you can find, they may be waiting for you to do just that before the axe finally drops.

    • #3191893

      Back off and build rapport…

      by joekool24601 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I started working for an office a year ago that had been spoiled by their previous IT person. She would work 120 hours a week, and would take on many responsibilities that belong at the user level, not at the admin level. There is only one IT position at this office, and now I fill it. Based on the temperment of the people involved, getting this office to conform to company standards very easily could have landed me in your position- except I have the unfair advantage of a new boss dedicated to getting us there without causing too much tension between the offices or between our office and me. That being said, here is my advice to you:

      Don’t focus too much on getting each person to adhere to company issues. Instead, focus on a specific resource. If people think they are being singled out, they will attack back, but if a group of people has a problem with something you are doing, you can bring them into a meeting with the appropriate backing and explain that other groups of people have no problem following the policy in question. For now, lay low and stay in maintenance mode and do as those in authority command- but document everything and, if someone gets ornery, show them that you are treating them the same way as everyone else. Good luck!

    • #3191888

      evaluate your position

      by engineertroy ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      r.young, you firstly need to understand all of your rights. there are certain procedures that need to be followed now that hr is involved. review the corporate hr policy to ensure YOU are in compliance. you should have the opportunity to write an official rebuttal and/or explanation of events.

      secondly, aside from a paycheck, what are you gaining from this position? are you gaining valuable technical and/or business skills? what is the upward potential? do you have creative freedom? how often are you happy on the job? etc.

      i think if you answer those questions, you can determine whether you should stay or get another job. if you decide to stay, look at a way to change the way you work. get to “know” and “understand” how the organization works and what the relationships are among your co-workers. ensure you rise above mediocrity and perform you duties not just technically well, but build positive relationships. above all, always be PROFESSIONAL even if they’re not!

    • #3191883

      While shopping your resume…

      by cwjoines ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      When I first came on board in my current position, my primary focus was a Corporate change in software applications that, of course, changed the way everyone was doing things. This along with a directive from our Coporate office to fully implement the Corporate standards and practices did not help in my “popularity contest” either. However, 7 years later, it is my “fan club” that is gone and my network is running at 99.7% for over 3 years and I take great satisfaction and pride in that.
      Keep in mind, that all people are reluctant to change. some more than others. I think that as long as you are standing on company policy, that it shouldn’t matter what anyone thinks about you. You should always do your job to the best of your abilities and as long as you are following company policy, they really don’t have a leg to stand on. If you are terminated for following the rules that they made, then I would think that you would have grounds for some type of action.
      Make sure you stay in the guidelines of policy, document everything and if you are really uncomfortable, go ahead and keep your resume updated and in circulation.

    • #3191882

      Protect yourself for a new job

      by dericos ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Bosses can protect you or harm you. This one seems dangerous.

      1) Be Pro-active and Protect yourself!
      Keep all documentation off site.
      Get email verification of verbal discussions.
      Keep a log, always good protection.
      (Ask for a written summary of their grievances against you?)
      Make a time-line of the events of this situation; it will put things in perspective and give you a feeling of being in control.
      Find out what recourses you have (Union, Gov. Labor, Labor Attorney) and discuss it with them.

      2) Find a new job!
      Tell the prospective employers that you’re unhappy without detailing the bad situation.

    • #3191878

      What to do

      by paulyvee ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It seems to me that you hve the answer in your post.
      Go to the HR people in your organisation and explain the whole issue as far as you are able. If they can’t resolve it then, given that it is affecting your work you say you have no alternative but to resign. After all the work you do and your reputation are more important than where it is done.
      Try to get a member of higher management on your side so that you can get a decent reccomend for the work you have carried out after all if it is as bad as you say with senior executives getting embroiled in arguments between staff members these same executives are not about to write a decent reccoment for anyone who they see as rocking the boat.

    • #3191872

      Carry the Flag

      by poppawookie ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      The Good Ol’ Boy system at its best… You have several options.

      1. Find a new job. Not always the best or easiest solution.

      2. Do the job required as they tell you to do it and prove that your attitude is not “low”.

      3. Remember, Info Tech professionals are the most loved and most hated individuals in almost all companies. They love us when all is going well, and they cuss us when something is going wrong. That is the nature of the beast in our industry.

      4. People hate change, especially in the technology field.

      I wish you luck in your endeavors.

    • #3191870

      Regroup, Improve, Fire if necessary…

      by mfblankenstein ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Meet with problem individuals, work out the problems, and set up an improvement plan. If that doesn’t work, fire them. If that isn’t an option, find a new company to work for.

    • #3191869

      Get out of there

      by jeffrey.schneider ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I’ve had a similiar situation happen to me, and regardless of whether or not you’ll lose your job, there probably isn’t a good chance you’ll be able to move up anywhere. I’d bail out now.

    • #3191867

      Protect your six

      by oconnortw ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You have my sympathies over this situation.

      My advice would be to gather any supporting evidence that you have of these allegations being made.

      Ensure that everything levelled at you is put in writing.

      Investigate what grievance procedure there is in place to invoke.

      Seek outside advice (I am not certain what the labour laws in Australia are like) possibly from a employment law solicitor or through any equivalent you may have of Citizens Advice.

      Make sure you meticulously record events as and when they occur.

      And unless this really is a dream job, not the nightmare it seems to be – get another, your health and happiness are not worth jeopardising over this.

      Good luck


    • #3191862

      Been there also….now consulting

      by technicallyright ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I should have paid more attention in the Organizational Behaviour classes in college.

      I too have been down that road. I tried to stick it out but in the end they got rid of me (redundant position).

      What I found after was that it was difficult finding a new job. I made down to the final two in my first three interviews, after the reference and former employer checks I was sitting on the curb. I am very competent in what I do, I generally have a good attitude. Starting my own business was my only way back into the field.

      I guess what I’m trying to say is find something else soon before they quietly sneak up and kick you in the rear! Sticking it out obviously doesn’t always work and from what you have told us, it isn’t working for you either.

      Best of luck!

    • #3191859


      by alan ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I learned the hard way you can’t change management. You end up fighting each day with them and it only gets worse. Take my advice and look for another job. You’ll be better off in the long run and can sleep at night with a clear conscience.

    • #3191855

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by not_me ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      1. You might want to ask for specific issues or instances, this will identify the exact issues that people are reporting on you.

      2. Consider if this position is worth the investment of your emotional strain and energy.

      3. You might want to seek legal advice.

    • #3191854

      What To Do…..

      by rmaer ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Your at a small company. They don’t like to fire people because their unemployment insurance goes up. They would much rather try to get you to quit.

      So, take your time, start looking for a better position. Your post indicates that the place has a history of battering people (the EA), so don’t blame yourself for the situation. Your just stuck in a crapy company culture. It also sounds like your immediate boss is a wanker. Apparently he wouldn’t or couldn’t deal with the situation when it first occured. Now it’s out of control. Move on, when you want and on your own terms.

      But just take your time to find a better opportunity. Even if twelve of them take you in a room to try to get you to quit…….that unemployment insurance sure does make small companies twitch : )

    • #3191853

      The same thing happened to me.

      by ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I had an extremely similar experience that you are going through. I was targeted basically because I refused to join the “old boys” network. I was accused of calling a customer a very unsavory name (supposedly by a co-worker) which absolutely never happened. I don’t even know who that particular customer was. When I asked who my accuser was I was told that it was none of my business. I let them know that if I wasn’t allowed to confront my accuser then they had no base for action and until I was informed of who accused me that they had no case. I also took this incident immediately to my boss (who happens to also be THE boss) to make sure I didn’t get blind-sided. Well, that was almost 8 years ago and I’m still here and the jerk who refused to tell me who my accuser was has since left. I hope your situation turns out for you. I know how tough it is.

    • #3191845

      Take a stand

      by agmiller05 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      There are times in life when you have to stand up for yourself and this seems to be one of them.
      Have you done anything wrong?
      Is your work of superior quality?
      Are you competent?
      Theoretically, you were hired because you met the needs of the organization. No one can go on a character assassination case without your consent. And by remaining quiet and acting cowardly you are feeding the fire; in essence you’re playing right in to their hands.
      Ask yourself what do I have to lose? then act accordingly.

    • #3191841

      You need your end-user

      by robertsomes ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I hope you are talking about the end-user you suppoert its been my Experience to let them know what you are doing make them feel part of so when working on the system end-user like to think and understand part of what you are doing and not making them feel Stupid buy acting better then work on your people Skills hope this will help I have 14 years of IT Field support

    • #3191837

      Forgive me, but it is you.

      by jnbtz ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I know this is probably going to be unpopular, but from reading your post, I think this falls on you. You blame the person who is no longer there yet you say it has escalated after they left. There is an art to dealing with people. Some IT people do it better than others. If this is truly somewhere you want (or need) to stay, I would suggest that you take an inner look at the way you deal with the people you are working with. You say you have to, “let it lie, and just work with them – blow over quicker…” Which says to me that you are angry and it is apparent to everyone. People are afraid to approach people that look and sound angry, yet you are in a position that people have to go to you, because it seems you are the sole IT person.

      My recommendation for you is to take a long weekend and start fresh. Go in with a completely different attitude on Monday. Go in with the attitude of I will be the most friendly and helpful IT person I can be, not just I am going to keep my head down and take it. Kill them with kindness, impress them with your skills, go the extra mile. Only you can change the minds of those who you feel are against you.

      • #3192441

        I’m gonna have to go with this

        by relaxdiego ·

        In reply to Forgive me, but it is you.

        R. Young,

        Are you sure you’re asking for advice, or are you just posting here to get uninformed reassurance.

        It’s rather rare for a group of professionals (50 at that!) to go against one IT guy simply because they feel like it. Check yourself first. Ask them for the exact issues and tell it to us here straight so that we can give you a better set of advice.

        • #3192392

          Not all 50…

          by rattyratt ·

          In reply to I’m gonna have to go with this

          Hi there relaxdiego,

          I was posting to possibly get both, I have noted all the advice and through that I have seen much concurrence (ie: agreement) and confirmation that I am doing the right thing by looking for work elsewhere and bailing out of this situation.

          Although I have been told during one of the meetings I have had “everyone has noticed…” and “we ‘all’ have felt that…” I sincerely have noticed myself that there is a undercurrent of satisfaction with my work from staff, and my own manager (for his own need) polls the staff to determine if I am doing my job to ‘his’ satisfaction. Either way, I have noticed some people have a tendancy to make an issue larger through exaggeration of the amount of ‘unspecified’ people who are unhappy with my work. This happened at the first meeting, and while I didn’t like hearing that ‘unspecified’ people were unhappy, I let it gloss and looked at the nuggets of information they were stating as the core of their argument. Some, were perhaps founded in truth (always there is truth in all things, u just have to find it.) And some in outright lies. My own manager worked on quashing the lies, but unfortunately I think that was when this HR manager had decided that my own boss was unreliable. (Considering he is one of the best bosses I have ever had, probably because he cares for his staff a great deal.)

          Everything went downhill from there.

          Taking that into perspective with my first post (and some subsequent update posts) the advice/information peope have been giving me has been excellent, and I have really been encouraged also. (And I really do need encouragement at this time. This is just taking a ludicrous turn every update I get… see my last post at the bottom…)
          So, it’s as straight as I can make it, (barring having to change a few minor things to avoid the organization and the ‘people’ being directly pinpointed = not very good thing!)


    • #3191828

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by the admiral ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      What I read in your post taking out all emotion is that it would seem that there is alot of miscommunication.

      First, I would ask for a committee where you are able to meet face to face with the complaintant. If they are unwilling to produce the compliaintant, then it would seem that the issue by the nature for that particular person needs to be dropped.

      Second, I would find another job. It seems that they are looking for a fall guy for not feeling like they need to be up to date on security, and that’s you.

      Third, I would consider taking the issue to the state, stating that HR refuses to share information pertaining your case, and it is a “Out on a rail situation”, and you believe that this particular process is creating a hostile work environment since there are unanswered charges against you and the entire company knows about them but you.

      Fourth, I would suggest requesting a resolution within a week if the charges are unanswered. If they can not do that, then the letter goes to the state.

      Fifth, I suggest you attempt to in all seriousness to drop the “I know who reported it deal” and act as if you are innocent, even though you are red faced and boiled over. I would also advise you to get an attorney as well and have him or her call your place of work to query the company for information pertaining your case.

      Sixth, Make sure your resume is updated and on Monster, Dice, Regional Help Wanteds and go to career fairs so that if the axe does come down, you can land comfortably on solid ground.

      If that does not work, then it may be time to bring up the “This has gone on far enough and I consider this first degree harassment” and when it is mentioned, look at the biggest executive there, and make sure you have the complaint to the higher executive ready to go. Then walk back, gather your things, hit send, and go to the employment office.

      If they are unable or unwilling to assist you in getting down to the bottom of the complaint against you, then you may have recourse outside. Print and save all emails regarding this issue, and transfer phone mail if you can to other media for later use.

      Now, if you have done the things that they have said, then perhaps it may be time to look into self-help or possibly counseling.

    • #3191826

      Write other things down

      by garridov ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Besides my IT work here, I am also in charge of supervising the HR department. I believe besides writing what they requested you to do, (which is not so bad when it comes to job performance reviews)you should write every incident that you have regarding this matter.
      Write down who started all this problem, your believed reasons, since when has your training been suspended, what your managers have told you about your attitude and afecting everybody there. Any comments people make to you.
      Keep doing that for a while, on your next meeting with your managers present all the notes they request, plus a notarized copy of your personal notes regarding this situation. Express to them that you are feeling that one person started this for a personal problem, and now even when that person is gone the problem continues for no justifiable reason. Tell them you believe this could be considered discrimination and harrasment and that you wish to see the problem end.
      In the meantime, take a deep breath everytime you have to assist somebody. Remember most people are technology-challenged, and feel bad about it. It’s not your problem, of course, but trying to show you are tolerant and comprehensive of their “problem” can help you get a better image and feel better about yourself.
      I used to get very upset when I was little and people used to push me around on the bus, and one time I got so upset I started pushing everybody else. My mother stopped me and told me, just because everybody else loses their education it doesn’t mean you have to lose yours. So just look above the situation and try to be better than it.
      If they keep annoying you I would suggest you to take all of your notes to a lawyer and present a harrasment complaint.
      Good luck!

    • #3191823

      You know your value

      by tomhood ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I worked at a large Southern utility and all of us in IT suffered a similar fate. Hey, YOU know your skills and you know that you bring value to the organization. While everywhere you work is going to have “office politics” it probably won’t be to the scale that you are going thru right now. Remember, no matter what happens, try to learn something from it that will make you a better employee wherever you end up.

    • #3191822


      by givemejava ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      This sounds like you report to a bunch of folks who do not have a clue about what you do and do not understand what it takes to do it. I would press them to be very specific about what they want from you and what the problem is and make them site specific examples. You may find that once or twice you blew off on someone who did not deserve it. On the other hand, it may just show you how clueless these folks are. Either way it is a learning experience and will tell you whether to get you resume out or not.

    • #3191821

      length of employment?

      by deamonardi ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      How long have you worked at this company?

    • #3191820

      Tough Position to be in…

      by grover99 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I’ve read a representative sample of the replies and I have to agree with most that on the one hand your managers have a responsibility to judge you fairly and work with you to come up with an equitable solution. Identifying perceived deficiencies and developing a plan of action to address them (with regular progress reviews) is a great suggestion.
      HOWEVER, you mention that you work in a small company with about 50 employees. In a larger environment you could “disappear into the static”, but working in your environment is like living in a small town–everyone either knows everyone else’s business or they think they do.
      If you’re not getting support from your immediate manager or your executive manager, it’s time to start polishing your r?sum? while you keep your head down and continue to do your job to the best of your ability. Don’t burn bridges–I’ve been in IT for almost 15 years, and even in a large metropolitan area (that encompasses three cities and about 1.2 million people) I keep running into the same people at different jobs. Leave a good impression where you can, and don’t worry about it where you can’t. GOOD LUCK!

    • #3191818

      Words of Wisdom

      by jhspepa ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It is unfortunate that these types of scenarios are played out everyday in all aspects of business. People that are not IT have no idea what it takes for IT to do its job. They just don’t have a clue. It sounds like your company has no official structure or policies in regard to pc’s. Suggestion, do your research, and present a proposal to remedy this. A good manager will be a better listener when solutions are presented to a problem, rather than a problem with no suggested solution. But just remember this…. “always take the high road”… this means, always stand for what is right… don’t stoop to the level of those causing you grief… use this experience to examine yourself thoroughly… change only if you are not standing on the “high road”… All of us, who are attempting to make a dent in this world, have had and will continue to have character building experiences… use this experience constructively to better yourself! In the end, you will be the one that can hold your head high.

    • #3191817

      Take it or leave it (the job)

      by cryosec ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Simply put, did you take the job for the money? If so, there are other jobs that make as much. Did you take on the job because you like what the company stood for? Then stick it out because it’s a matter of work ethic and integrity on that note. Finally, I’ll quote the saying that my dad used to tell me when he’d come home from a hard days work fixing fork lifts “The worst job that you can have, is the one where you hate pulling up into the parking lot, let alone even punching in on the time clock”…loose translation: If it’s that bad then leave because no job is worth that much money or flack if your not enjoying what your doing? Just my opinion, take it for what it’s worth.


    • #3191816

      High Road Travels

      by tmecimore ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Always try to take the high road. maintain a professional composure in hte work place. I have been in a similiar situation. I do understand the frustration and pain; however, how you deport yourself during this time will be the true determination of your character. People will talk and stir all kind of office junk. It took 2 years, but I left my previous company and took a better job much closer to home (10 minute drive vs 1.25 hrs). The person who had caused me so much trouble was demoted several notches, forced to take a drastic pay cut. Look for the opportunity to take emotion out of the equation. Use your common sense, and seek to be on the high road.

    • #3191813


      by jonathanpdx ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Has anyone given you specifics of what you’re doing wrong and/or why they’re unhappy with you or your work? It’s very difficult to fight or defend yourself against glittering generalities. Make them be specific. Document EVERYTHING that happens. Also, one way to defeat an enemy is to make them your friend. This takes work and time, but if you can start to get people in your corner, perhaps the tide will turn and it will be your detractors who will be on the defensive.

    • #3191812

      Just an idea

      by wrichards ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      First thing I would do is call a meeting with everyone involved with the dispute against me and find out there issues as to why they hate my guts. If it becomes to the point that this is not being resolved then I would tell them SEE YA LATER. You need to voice your opinion front everyone, put them on the spot, and get this out in the open to find out what te problem is. If they don’t like it then it is a personal issue with all those having a problem and they will get there JUST DO’S…

    • #3191811

      Saddle up, Pilgrim.

      by leftyfrizzell ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It’s time to load up the old pony and head west As a contractor, I’ve been on both sides of the situation and there’s really no good out. You’ve let this run too long to do much damage control. And, at 50 to one odds, I don’t see the situation getting much better. You can either hang on until they fire you or you can salvage some self respect and just move on. Learn from the experience and don’t make the same mistakes again.

    • #3191806

      Some Suggestions

      by arn_werks ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You may simply submit a resignation notice, stating that you can not work for the present company, based on ( here you have yo make a choice of how much you want to blast them, ) some reasonable and specific breaches of expectations of fair treatment in the workplace, but do give reasonable notice. If you have an attorney that you have used, have them run your letter past one of their para-legals to check it for reasonableness ( i.e., nothing for which you can be sued. ) If you do not have an attorney, look for one that specalizes in labor law. The local Legal Aid folks can help you with this search. Document everything ( !, ) and make copies of the time sheets that you have to keep. I have had jobs in which such time sheets were a requirement of the job, because a bunch of peoples or agencies were being charged for my time. That can be a reasonable request, but it is a PIA. If you do not want to keep working there, you must not give them cause to burn you on a reference, and must make sure that you can defend yourself against any such allegations as they may bring. The best way to do this is with a full and complete paper trail of all that you and they have done and diary of ALL interactions with the bad guys. Good luck, and remember that you will probably need to have competent legal representation at some point in this process, if and/or when it really gets mean and nasty. You may find an ally that you may be able to have assist you in the EA who can testify as to the conduct of the management of the company. Best of luck and do not do anything that can be construed as an actionable offense (Do not do anything outside your job nor cause any harm or dissension if you can avoid it. ) Best of luck, Red Bell

    • #3191804

      Leave the House

      by bhunsinger ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      My brother and I used to play a game back in the dark ages before cable. When a horor flick was on, we would look for the moment when the actors could kill the movie IE the house seems funny, leave the house.
      That’s where you are. You cannot tough this out. The culture of the company doesn’t seem to allow that. Find a new job.
      What is left now is how to learn from this
      From my own painfully gained experience, find out what you did/are doing that set this off. Attitudes creep into our actions without our knowing it. One possible scenario: Being the only IT person the idea that you are indispensible begins to creep into your attitude, leading to arrogance and dismissiveness in how you treat people. ‘I have more important things to do than…’ becomes a mask that you wear. It begins when you do have more important things- then you get abrupt, sloppy, quick and dirty fixes etc etc etc. and you don’t realize it.
      If you have some friends there, listen to them about how you treat people. They may agree with the load you’ve been carrying and been making allowances. Sounds like some people don’t.
      It’s a learning experience. To some people they way you works is as important as how much, how hard and how productivly you work.
      Finally, I can be in real denial about how hard and well I’m working.
      This is not an execise in self abuse. The people who you ttust there and have done good work for? Get there names and direct lines for references.

    • #3191802

      Move On

      by pka ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Sounds like a crummy place to work anyways. Move on.

    • #3191794

      You need relationship help not IT

      by dennis.irvine ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      This is a human relations problem not an IT problem. This kind of thing can happen in any carreer. You need advice on how to handle difficult people and how to deal with the people around you. check out some human relations forums, or better yet seek direct counseling.


    • #3191792

      RE: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by staceyfra0207 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It seems as though your organization views you as a concierge instead of a certified IT professional.

      The fact that you became the only IT professional is a definite sign this company wants more than they are willing to pay for.

      The meeting is inevitable, but be prepared to highlight your achievements and value to the organization. If your prior performance evaluations were satisfactory and you give 110%, don’t let the political posturing upset you.

      If you want to continue at this organization, you make want to ask for your job description. This gives you insight to whether this is a true IT job or an IT/Admin position. If it’s the latter, make plans to leave.

      From the sounds of things, this company is not professional in any of its’ dealing. Don’t be surprised if you are escorted out the door the day you resign.

      Best of Luck!

    • #3191790

      You’ve got to know when to fold.

      by davidg ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I was in a similar situation a few years ago. I ended up having training and travelling suspended, having system Admin privileges revoked, being shut out of a computer room etc. I held out for about a year, but mentally, physically, and career-wise the toll taken was not worth it – an IT specialist needs regular training and needs to be allowed to work without additional stress – look for another job !!!

    • #3191772

      Opportunity Costs of Quitting

      by lonnie.a.booth ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I would think that the situation can offer some real entertainment value. Analyze the behavior and personality of those who would like to think they are a pain in the assets of the IT folks.

      Frequently, I have been able to “use the force” and have the situation become totally reversed. Altho group dynamics suffer, so what. Its sad that productivity becomes the victim. In several incidences, productivity and dynamics have improved.


    • #3191767

      Time to clean house!

      by tc ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      if you quit for another job then it will validate all the complaints against you. it’s time to document everyone’s work ethics and file your own findings with HR and terminate everyone who is not performing up to spec. Then after you have the house in order it’s time to quit for another job because management clearly does not have your back in your current position.

    • #3191765

      Jerks ?

      by a.c ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Sometimes you just have to tell someone they are acting like a complete jerk, clear the air and resolve any issues.

      Only problem is, should you be telling this to your managing director, or should he be telling you.

      If you really are justified to feel that you have been wrongly accused, then argue your case, if they won’t tell you the exact nature of the complaint(s), then tell them to stuff the job, if they have so little respect for employess to not allow them to defend their actions, then they should look elsewhere for their IT support.

      Sometimes it is better to jump than be pushed.

    • #3191763

      It is time to concede that you are out

      by andrew martin ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      It is simply time to move on. My understanding is that there is a huge consulting field in Canberra at the moment (I am in the US and about to come back home after nearly 8 years) so perhaps it is time to work for your self rather than work for people who do not value what you do.

      We have all been there and done that and had managers that feel terrible about it. In the end you are responsible for the quality and wuantity of your work and for the way in which you do it.

      Learn the lessons – move on and go find something that you enjoy going to work for.

    • #3191746

      In my humble opinion

      by ravenpoem ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      When something like this happens, (if you truly are the professional you say you are) it’s quite simple…..Someone knows someone who wants your job. Period. End. If you really want to stay where you are not wanted it will be an uphill battle to regain your “street cred” at this point so document, document, document! And when you are fired you MAY have a case… or not.
      My advice, find another job-FAST! Because win or lose (the court case), you still lose because word gets around fast and unless you are truly at the top of your game, no employer will hire you if they think you possibly ARE a flake and will build a case against THEM! In my humble opinion.

    • #3191730

      Your company is sick

      by danetter ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Been there. Expect to be forced out. Find a new job. The company you work for is SICK. The managers are interested primarily in building their own empires, not so much in the well-being of the organization. I think the best you can hope for from the company is to be laid off. The most likely future for the company is to disappear, either from a collapse or from a takeover. Don’t be there when it happens.

    • #3191728

      This is NOT hard folks …..

      by bootp ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      … Ask yourself two questions:

      Do you REALLY want to work for this outfit?
      Do they REALLY want you as an employee?

      Now that the obvious is on the table, deal with it.

      Documentation, denial, and whining will buy you nothing but lost time. There are a number of routes you might take, but they all lead to the same place – out the door. So, PICK YOUR OWN EXIT POLICY, and do it.

      As for me – one suggestion for you – I hate working on the defensive. You might want to organize your thoughts and take them to the CEO. The following points should put you a bit more in charge of your own destiny.

      1. There is some bad chemistry with certain staff. You regret their handicap and wish them well.

      2. People of authority are denying you the resources you need to accomplish your assigned tasks.

      ~This is a bad thing.~ You can NOT do your job and the company suffers. The CEO needs to know that so that he can make an informed decision – allow the sabotage to undermine the IT function, or deal with his personnel problems. If HE wants you be a clerk and record your every activity – fine. Just don’t expect you to do the IT job as well. (It is a real-life thing. All the players need to face it.)

      3. You like the company. (OK -so it’s a little lie.) You would like to stay, but you can’t abide an environment that sets you up for failure and the company for bad service.

      ~Ask the CEO if he has any suggestions to enable you to cope with the unacceptable staff and management behavior.~

      …. I could go on. The point is, YOU like it here and YOU want to do a good job. You are trying to help the company by presenting the CEO with some REAL issues so he can do HIS job and make things work.

      Since there is a systemic problem outside your area of responsibility that guarantees your failure, then you need some real help with the real problem. THAT puts the problem in the CEO’s lap. (For real – you’ll be able to tell by his/her reaction if you need to worry about lunch that day or not.)

      Either the CEO will fix things – or he won’t. One way or another, things will resolve.

      Short short version: take control of your destiny. Get it resolved. Leave on your terms if that is the resolution. Either way, you are ahead of where you are now.

      Never any fun. Enjoy

    • #3191727

      If you want to stay – Document

      by trickdog ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      IF you want to stay, documentation is KEY! Put everything in writing. After each meeting send out notes of what was said, by who, and what is to be done, by who. Keep the tone “Just making sure I understand what was said. No need to reply unless I missed something.” Copy all parties (and at least one manager). I have found the BS stops when documented. Keep a positive attitude, meet/exceed what is expected and time lines,and keep documenting. Evaluate if this is were you want to continue working and polish up the resume should you need it. — Good luck.

    • #3191717

      A lawyer’s point of view

      by mejpsimard ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Just so you guys know, I’m first of all a lawyer, and IT guy for people and buisiness I personnally know, in Quebec, Canada…

      So here goes… Over here, this is a clear case of harassment, and therefore can be treated in a number of ways. I would think the the US would have similar “work” legislation to prevent and end such behavior.

      In any case, I must say that even if a legal action would shut most people down for a while, it is far from a permanent solution if you stay at that job. When people at work hate you, they tend to get creative on ways to get rid of you.

      In all, you should consider quitting, but not necessarely without compensation for the loss of salary and trouble caused by the harassment, loss of job etc… Also, the whole situation could be constued to be an diguised firing. Get an opinion from a local lawyer if you’re at all interested.

      If they wan’t war, you may be in a position to give them one.

    • #3191714

      screw it

      by steve v ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Just quit. Places like that are not worth it. Bide your time and look for another job and then quit.
      one thing that people have a hard time understanding is that you cannot change a person. If some one made some crap up about you they did it because they are the ones that have issues. IF that person is buddy/buddy with the boss then you are already at a disadvantage that will be hard to overcome.
      If you are doing your job right R.Young then you have notthing to worry about you can leave knowing that you did the right thing in relation to your work. When you get hired for a job you are haired to perform and get the job done. Imagine if you were mister wonderful attitude and all around team player, but didnt know a damn thing about IT; would they keep you just because of your sterling character? HELL NO.

      Go some place else that will show their appreciation for your efforts and know how.
      Don’t waste your time with trivial stuff.

    • #3191713

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by rick_b1 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      First of all, were you provided with official documentation regarding this complaint, or was it delivered via word of mouth? Was any proof provided to substantiate these claims? Were you asked or coerced into signing any company documents agreeing to these claims?

      Only you can determine how long you should “stick it out”, but one thing you should do is to document everything that is said and done to you by everyone in your work environment, no matter how trivial it may seem. Keep copies of all emails pertaining to your workflow and your work ethic.

      No job is worth stressing out over, especially if you have the experience and skillsets necessary to pursue your career elsewhere. With that said, update your resume and post it. There is no point waiting for the last minute.

    • #3191709

      Settle your hash with your supervisor

      by afleader ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Have a long sit down meeting with your immediate supervisor. Go to him/her with the attitude of “I need your support to make our department’s mission a success.” Give this person a little of a ‘hero’ role but then hash out the things that are detrimental to your career: 1. Improper escalation of issues to leadership (an open door policy doesn’t mean you bug the CEO when the copier is out of paper) 2. Improper use of personal relationships to affect outcomes (office politics with the boss but no direct contact with you nor being around for you to settle the conflict). Tell your supervisor that there have been two technicans to leave and you’ll be the thrid if things don’t change and these political issues aren’t put to an end.

      It sounds like the inmates are running the asylum there. Keep a good paper trail yourself and if they pursue your firing you should have fodder at the ready should they deter your attempts to gain further employment.

    • #3192737

      The whole WORLD is against me…

      by john99 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Oh yes. The problems almost certainly lie with the OTHER 50 people in the organization, not you. Whatever you do, do NOT waste time examining yourself and your behavior for the causes of this situation.

    • #3192736

      What to do? – isn’t it simple

      by geeen ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hey, what did you do, Fart in the wrong office or something?…lol Seriously, I had this same problem for a long time. But I liked the job for the most part so I let my work speak for itself. Then I started to be straight forward with people, letting them know that the reasons for their issues were themselves. And eventually, but with alot of sweat and tears people look at me much different now. But it’s either that or just go somewhere else… Go out drinking one night with a good friend and get a reality check on you, your personality and the world….

    • #3192728

      It depends upon Your MD.

      by tanvirlodi ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      Hope You and family are fine.

      Last year i was working in a school. In my interview they have told me that we want You becuase we want to change our team of teachers and upgrade our labs and to develop a new curriculum.

      I just did that. In 2 months time a lab with 20 commputers (network together). A new curriculum, a new method of paper (90% MCQs) and train some of the team members.

      End result they say in the end after all the work that the TEAM is not willing to work with You. OH we dont have any problem with your work but what we can do about the TEAM. The same team which was on the scale of 1 to 10 is below 4.

      So, next day i resigned.

      So, if Your MD actually wants you nothing can make you shake.

      Keep up the good work.

      Take care,

      Warm regards,


    • #3192727

      Have you examined your own behavior?

      by gherryt ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Perhaps the problem lies not in your environment but rather in your own attitude and manner. When 50 people complain about you it is easy to suspect a conspiracy, however, I would take a hard look at what I am doing to cause such a reaction. It is far too prevalent, in this business, to adopt a condescending style and alienate the very people we’re supposed to help.
      I don’t know that this is the source of your particular problem, but it is an issue you certainly need to examine.

      We often forget that the organization isn’t here to support I/T: I/T’s only reason to exist is to support the organization and its staff.

    • #3192726

      Wish I was a fly on the wall….

      by xt john ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      The tone of your letter makes you sound like a nice person. But I have to agree with John, can 50 people be wrong? I have seen all types of know-it-alls, fluent in geekonese, locking down everything and playing Big Brother. I’d love to hear the other side of this story from your co-workers.

    • #3192716

      Too much drama, move on.

      by asicstri ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      If you don’t look forward to going to work then it’s time to go. You have too much drama/politics going on there, ask yourself if you really need this crap. Unless your staying there because they’re paying you a boatload of money that you can’t get elsewhere you have no reason to stay. Also, your not doing yourself any favors by participating in this drama. Be a professional and find another place to apply your skill/knowledge at. In the end you’ll wonder what the hell you were doing at this circus.

    • #3192698

      Been in a similar situation… here’s what I did….

      by tcpip4u ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      For starters I really sympathize with your current situation.

      I was in a similar situation several years ago in a startup networking company with a huge potential.

      Like you situation the managment and the complainers had a history of long time professional relationship. I was the IT manager and wore multiple hats just like yourself. Really busted my chop to keep thing in order. Oneday I got a visit from my Managing Director wanting to speak to me about my work ethics and job performance. Just to give you a little background so that you can understand, I was the 15th employee to be hired in the company. Few month later, our VP of Engineering hired a bunch of people from a company that was going belly up which included IT, engineering, marketing and so forth. Just so happens that the HR manager used to work for that company and had past working relationship with all of them.

      Now going back to the story, the person who initiated the complaint was a guy that was doing QA and a little bit of IT support at his previous company that was going belly up. Since he was in good with the managing director he decided that he wanted to get out of QA and get into IT, so he did with the help from the director. He complained and complained but very candidly. To make a long story short. As stated by some of the other replies, I documented everything that went on. The meeting with my director and with HR in the meeting taking notes. We had an evaluation strategy in place and a monthly review of my performance. This lasted maybe 3 month before they took away my responsibilities and gave it to the QA guy. I was left with one responsibility, to desgin the company’s website. The thing was we had a contractor designing the site for us.

      What does this all mean? Well if they want you out regardless of who started it and why, they will get you out. The longer you stay they there it will be more miserable for you and your family. It will feel like they are looking down upon you and making you feel unwanted. If you can leave and find another job I would recommend that. My marriage was affected, my relationship with my friends, my physical and mental health and among other things that we really don’t think about. Its a losing battle. I even consulted an attorney and he said that this kind of case is almost impossible to prove in court because they are all from the same camp. I have many friends and contacts that work in HR in high positions but they said that the best soltuion for me would be to leave the company. I don’t mean to sound so pessimistic, but its reality.

      Through that experience I lost a lot of faith in the corporate justice and learned a lot too, its not what you know but who you know.

      I eventually left the company. as a matter of fact I left the state. the 8-9month of that was too much for me and my family to bear.

      Wish you the best of luck.

    • #3192678

      Managing IT means people too.

      by raven2 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You can have hardware chops in spades, but people are still an important part of the equation. Many an brilliant technical person has foundered on the shoals of managing people (this is true in almost any specialty). This is part of the “Peter Principal”.

      People management is a skill set that can be learned. My suggestions. Read “One Minute Manager”, “Who Moved My Cheese”. Find a mentor to help with this skill set, I.E. someone you can work with who can teach you this (does not need to be in your organization). Consider finding a qualified business / life coach. They can help you deal with improving your skill sets, dealing with difficult people, and other issues your find yourself mired in.

      Good luck, if you want some specifics email me.

    • #3192659

      Is every complaint unfounded?

      by jonf ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I have never seen anything this bad. I have seen this problem in IT but it is usually because the Admin or Tech acts as though they are above the standard employees and treats everyone like morons. Having employees clean up their own computers is a bad idea. You should send the policy out and let the entire company know that an audit is going to be done which will be followed by a house cleaning of apps and spyware.

      If I were in this situation and had no hand in peoples dislike of me I would not stick it out.

    • #3192655

      Similar Circumstance

      by cometsr ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Like Don Quixote, I have fought the brave fight in another company that seemed almost as bad as yours. They, too, tried to make it intolerable for me, and it was directed by a person seeking my jb, and who had been passed over for it.

      I documented everything, including asking for and receiving the taping of my last talk, then walked.

      They tried to get me back30 days later when things went to hell, and I agreed, at $300 per hour, 40 hour contract for one week. For some reason they didn’t go for it, but the smile on my face as I hung up on them was worth it all.

      By the way, I went on to better places.

    • #3192649

      CYA & do your best

      by acp2g ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      All you can do is continue to document EVERYTHING (CYA) & keep a copy of the documentation at your home. This way if anything does happen, you have evidence that you were let go unfoundedly.

      Continue to do your best at your job and START LOOKING ELSEWHERE.

      This way, you’re covered if you are fired and hopefully you find a job before your fired or you at least get some interviewing in before you are let go so you’re prepared to move on.


      Someone once told me, “Q-TIP”. “Quit taking it personal.” Although it sounds as if they are trying to make it personal, you continue to be the professional you are and everything will fall into place. The reason you do not need to take it personal in this case, even though they are trying to make it that way, is that this is THEIR ISSUE – NOT YOURS.

      Ok, I’m off my soap box.


    • #3192645

      What to do, What to do?

      by mgrice ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      I would get documented incidences of the specific complaints your users have against you. It sounds like just a bunch of lip service from all. If their is no specific cases they can state, where is the proof you aren’t doing your job correctly?

    • #3192621

      I had mgmt support and had a disaster!!!

      by bg6638 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I worked as a SysAdmin in a small company, mainly using Win98 workstations with an NT 4.0 server. I had a group of users who thought that THEY owned the computer that the company put on their desks. After a series of screen savers & desktop backgrounds, the CEO had me institute a common company approved screen saver and company logo background. Wow, the morning after the change was made, you could cut the tension with a knife! Also, we had users who would use company e-mail for their own purposes, including chain e-mails. This caused several virus attacks, costing hours of downtime! The HR dept sat these users down, and yet the next day they were at it again! We also blacklisted various internet sites, and they went to the CEO to complain! He told them that the MIS dept blacklisted the sites at his request, and that the computers were to be used for company business ONLY!!! That only resulted in further personal attacks toward myself and the company management. My “out” was that the company went bankrupt!!! And yes, they were furious over that too!!!

    • #3192615

      40% performance, 60% bull

      by john.deland ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      When I started for IBM in the late 60s, Chuck Brian, one of the old timers gave us a familiarization class. He started out saying that in his experience, most jobs were 60% bullshit and 40% performance. He went on to explain that our jobs would involve a lot more that just ‘fixin’ stuff and that we would have to deal with a ton of issues that had nothing to do with ‘fixin’. The ‘bull’ stuff included housekeeping, learning, paperwork, people and politics, towing-the-line etc.. ‘You’d better get used to it, cause it ain’t going away’.

      He also explained that the ‘bullshit to work’ ratio varied a great deal from job to job and company to company. In some jobs, there was so much ‘bull’ that the primary skill had to be ‘bull handling’.

      His point was that there was ‘bull in every job, and if it got to be too much, we might not be in the right place. Not everyone is suited to handle the ‘bull’ component of every job.

      So, get use to the ‘bull’ and handle it, or get out and find a job with a more suitable amount of ‘bull’.

      Sounds like the ?bull? level at your job is over the top. It might be time to move on!

    • #3192614

      Its You

      by sdmtnbiker ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I think with all that is going on, you are going to have to own some of this. be humble and ask what you can do to make thier job easier.

    • #3192599

      Direct Approach Works Best…

      by ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Your first impulse when someone disapproves, or even appears to be going after you, is to defend.
      Fight that, suck it up, IT is a service job, you do not survive unless you please most of the people most of the time. Walk up to the worst of them, and in your best humble voice, with a tear in your eye, ask why they are upset, and what you can do to be affective in their eyes. Often users are more upset if you appear to be doing it without them, than with them.

    • #3192583

      Do you work in an “At Will” state?

      by i386 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Does the state you live in define employment as “At Will”? If so, you may be trouble. Employers can find every little mistake and complaint (even if illegitimate) and use them as the reason for terminating you. That might not be the reason you’re given, but that might the reason they fire you. It could boil down to someone in management not liking you. But again, that’s not the reason you would get if you were to be fired.

      If I were in your shoes, I would seriously think about this. Evaluate yourself, your attitude, your personality and your actions. Compare them with the environment in which you are working. If they are indeed appropriate then you are most definitely being singled out for personal reasons or other reasons. Perhaps you have skills and knowledge that are a threat to those above you. In any event, you would be wise to begin a job search on a very covert basis. Do not let them know that you are looking for another job. But do be prepared to either quit or be fired. Have a plan.

    • #3192580

      Strength in numbers

      by Anonymous ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Would this person happen to be tall, clumsy, bald and has lived in the same area since being born? I think I know this person… and his many clones.
      This character has most likely made a few ennemies along the way. Find out who these people are and what their stories are. The complainer may have done this before and got favorable results. That tells you a lot right there of how inferior this person is. Someone will eventually point out his/her weakness, probably inadvertently. Then formulate a plan to pounce on that weakness. Go for the jugular vein and don’t stop till the last drop of blood has spilled. It is imperative that this species be eliminated now as it is spreading quickly throughout all forums and levels. If you can’t do it then hire me. I love the taste of fresh blood.
      Who cares if the whole thing goes sour and you lose your job? What you have right now is not really a job anyway. It is just a work in progress of an early grave. And, based on my personal experience, you will gain a lot more lasting respect from the other workers than if you cowed down behind a bunch of reports and meetings. If it’s important to you, get tough and do it. Otherwise, let me know where I can send my resume so I can be ready to take over.

      • #3059335

        What kind of advice is this junk???

        by rascal1981 ·

        In reply to Strength in numbers

        And while you?re wasting your time trying to solve what could be an irreversible problem, you might as well start planning for the firing portion of this downward spiral. I got a better idea (unless you are as *brave*? as Ron is here apparently?); start looking for another job. Why is this so hard to do? Take a look around on monster, career builder, etc? even contacting your local head hunter place wouldn?t be a bad idea but don?t try to make a fight with higher ups that is going to end the same way it started and that is, unfortunately with you on the losing end (if you had something going for you I would maybe say different but since you are already seeing a trend, what?s the point?). I know this may sound negative but think about your situation right now and tell me that finding a new job would be worse then living with anxiety and fear? I don?t know about you or Ron but I know what I would be doing; but as I said if you are that confident as Ron to run into the fire then I wouldn?t cry too loud if you get burned by the obvious?

    • #3192547

      Does not sound good!!!

      by ron.drew ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It sounds like you are in a loose situation. I think you had better start planning for an exit. No matter what you do you can not change how they think of you and if it has gone this far there is no turning it around.
      Sorry to be on the down side, but start looking for another opportunity.
      Just me 2 cents.

    • #3192540

      Its the beginning of the end….

      by mzx639 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It’s over, I would think about moving on.

    • #3192538

      Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      by son of light! ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You see fear make us believe something that is not truth..!!!. Make sure you have not made a mistake or hurt some one, if that is O.K. then work in look your self as understandable, friendly, honest, human, in other words you have to value people over performance, and put on the attitude of service, and offer help over and over again, and finally do not inquire for Why? or Who? no remember don’t fall into that game, if they had have anything againts you, by this time you hade some sort of Memo. Work hard and Pray to Jesus.

    • #3192488

      Beat the system

      by tundraroamer ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      If all else fails, get promoted.

    • #3192481

      If you were living in US

      by noc_noc ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I would say, find a new job. Bullying is not illegal in this country and if somebody decides to fire you they will do it for no reason. It’s sad but I have seen it happen ;-(

    • #3192477


      by abcalderwood ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      A small word of advice. Whether you are guilty or not make notes of any and all confrentations that you have with co-workers and higher-ups. It seems you are already forced to account for all of your actions anyway….. When all is said and done you will probably end up with a novel, but this is a good way of covering yourself in case legal action is taken on your part or otherwise. Also, any displinary actions against you, get them in writing. You are not requred to sign them if you do not agree. Check company guidelines to get a good idea of employee rights. But either way, LEAVE A PAPER TRAIL!. Best of luck.

    • #3192472

      Get Away From That Career Hole

      by business guy ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Run far. Run fast.

      Seriously, you cannot win. The corporate culture is familiar to me. It is driven by rumor, innuendo, and the whispered slander, not by written and applied policy. The longer you are there, the more this situation puts you in a defensive posture, and frankly, short of a court case, their presence on your resume will be to your disadvantage.

      It’s not fair. It’s not right. But you are in the position of looking like a troublesome employee and need a new job. Find it while still employed. You can make the claim that should they contact your present employer, it will be troublesome.

      Goood Luck! Hope I don’t run into that bunch of sleazoids.

    • #3192471

      Manage the situation.

      by ajalpha ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Talk to your boss and find out the exact nature of the complaint(s). If your boss can’t tell the exact problem, then let him/her know that the complaint(s) are baseless. If on the other hand the complaint(s) are well founded, then address each and every one of them with your boss and tell him/her how you are going to address them (the plan). Ask your boss for suggestions and set completion goals for alleviating the problems. If all of this doesn’t work, look for a job in a more useful work environment. Good luck!

    • #3192470

      Welcome to the Club.

      by mgordon ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      “am having to detail and document all my daily activities (down to the minute)”

      I document everything right down to the SECOND using a MySQL based, web-accessed database.

      computers tend to be invisible; that makes the people that maintain computers seem to be doing nothing most of the time. I.T. is most visible when things are not going well.

      I.T. _managers_ tend to be people that recognize the inherent disrespect and take some initiative to prove their worth, but it cannot be in geek-speak, nor can it be nebulous market-speak such as you often find on a resume.

      Other employees sometimes dodge their responsibilities by blaming their negligence on a faulty computer. It may even be so, at the time the director comes looking for explanations. A detailed, *believeable* record of your supports and services especially with that person becomes extremely valuable and turns a negative into a positive.

      With a 50 to 1 ratio and circumstance as you describe it, sounds to me like you are in a professional office (lawyer, doctor, things that have traditionally been called “professions”) and very likely they wish for you to come in the servants’ entrance and stay out of sight. If that is the case, dressing professionally is profoundly helpful and not often seen in geekier circles. One day I was in one of the tallest buildings in Salt Lake City, recently acquired from American Stores, inspecting the telecommunications infrastructure. Along came a small band of persons from a local TV station interested in leasing some space. The director was out of office at that moment. I was well dressed, wearing a tie and go-anywhere badge; I knew what was wanted. So I took them on tour. Their chief engineer had many technical questions that turned out I alone could answer. When we returned from tour, the director had returned, and I gave the party over to the director as though we had planned this tour all along. Be versatile, be professional, look and FEEL like you are worth something and others will tend to believe it.

      You use “dislike” too much. That suggests a bit too much “F” in your personality type (google MBTI). I don’t know if others like mor or dislike me — it doesn’t matter much; but I know who exhibits disrespect and that matters more.

      Companies are like animals; in Darwinian competition for survival. Ultimately only one or two persons set the tone for the whole entire company and it will succeed or fail. If they dismiss an effective I.T. person and replace you with someone less effective (but better “liked”) it will impact their bottom line.

    • #3192460

      Integrity, integrity, integrity

      by jsteger2 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!


      I wish you the best. I know EXACTLY how you feel as I went through a VERY similar situation. My advice to you (you are obviously not obligated to take it :)) it to move on and find another job. Unless you prefer to take the abuse, it’s not worth it. The company for whom you are working does not, based on what you wrote, present itself as a company with integrity. In those types of situations, regardless of what anyone else says, is a losing battle. You will, at some point, be put into a compromising position and be forced to deal with something that you would never have thought possible in a professional environment. To me, in my opinion, it’s not worth it. You sound like a person who has an excellent work ethic and someone who has integrity. Move on my friend. Some people would say you’re taking the easy way out. I say you’re not. I lost my job because I had integrity and later came to realize the company wasn’t worth it to begin with. I keep mentioning integrity because it is a VERY powerful word. It isn’t just a word though. It combines so many attributes of a good, honest, hard-working person, someone who strives to do the right thing no matter what obstacle is besieged upon them, someone who can lie in bed at night knowing they did everything they could and tried their very best to get the work done. Do not allow that company to compromise your values nor integrity. If you do, you’ll hate yourself for it in the end. Nice people finish last most of the time, but at least I’m not looking over my shoulder waiting to get fired for not exceeding the production quota nor quality of my work. Keep in mind you can’t change everyone’s viewpoint or opinion of you overnight. It will take time, patience and sacrifice. The question you have to ask yourself is this: Do you want to continue to subject yourself to this or not? I wish you the absolute best. Take care.

    • #3192459

      Roll with it, don’t sweat the small stuff, and document

      by mikebentley ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Roll with it. Everybody goes through what you’ve described, but you are letting it get to you, and that’s causing your attitude to change, and you’re becoming defensive, and that’s making you stick out more.

      Don’t act like it bothers you, do your job according to your job description, contact the board of labor and inform them of what is happening, and show them your documentation.

      As long as you stick to what you’re supposed to be doing, you should have no conscience of anything bad, and know that you’re doing what is right.

      Roll with it and document…….

    • #3192455

      I guess I’d have to ask

      by spetnagel ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Any idea about why… did someone get passed over and you got the job?
      Sounds like the company culture is screwy.
      If you’re being attacked and don’t expect any support from the organization, I’d say start the process of getting out of there.
      The grief and stress aren’t worth it.

    • #3192451

      Bad Corporate Culture! Get a new Job! Why suffer the hassle?

      by runmyowncompany ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      If they abuse their IT support staff, they get what they deserve … it sounds like a bad corporate culture / environment. Why stick it out? The job market is way better now. Get certified soon! That piece of paper makes hiring happen quickly. Get online and start looking so you don’t feel trapped. Need to explain why your looking? “I was told I would get x amount of training in exchange for a interim rate”. x months later still no training (they say they need to hire one more person before I can leave for training). I suggested them purchasing CBTs but they’ve refused. I like learning, I’m pursuing training/certification on my own. I’d like to work for a company with more potential for growth, and with more experienced workers from which I can learn.” This turns a negative into a positive. Good luck. Don’t take it personally. I mean have any of them taken the time to get to know you? … then how COULD it be personal. Sounds like the environment there is terrible. You might consider working for a “service” firm where YOU are their product. You usually get treated better, paid better, and they usually make sure to get you training/certifications as then they can bill more for you.

    • #3192446

      I Feel Your Pain

      by roboknee ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Nearly two years ago I became the only IT person that my department had exclusively to themselves. Going in, everyone knew how much I would be earning which became an issue for them. As time went on, certain users had their own personal opinions and ideas about me which they used as a valid reason to make me feel highly unwanted. I was made to feel that I was on some type of never-ending probation. No matter how hard I worked and did what I was supposed to do, there were still complaints. To combat this, I would voice my discontent to one of my few (2) trusted coworkers. By being able to vent to someone other than those at home (which I also did!), I was able to go to my supervisor and the head of the department for which I work, and discuss this with them in a more level headed way. What made matters better though is the fact that my supervisors are good people. My immediate supervisor is a wonderful boss and person, and having been in the trenches and still sporting the battle scars, he was able to give me positive reinforcement and direction. Not everyone is as fortunate to have a boss who will stand behind them and guide them as needed. Some bosses take a hands off view and just sit back and watch you crash burn. And then just look on as the natives come out to celebrate your employment demise.
      My suggestion to you is this: if you don’t have open dialog with your boss, then definitely start getting your resume out there and find a new home. Don’t give the natives anything that they can work with. Sure they may make up stuff, but so what. At least it can’t be proven! And no matter what, find something to laugh about everyday, because once you lose your sense of humor, you’ve lost the battle. Be secure in your knowledge of your abilities. They can only take away what you give them – give them nothing! Good luck. If it weren’t for our ability to lock out accounts at will, I do believe that IT persons would top the list of disgruntled employees. We’re justa hair’s length behind postal employees.

    • #3192444

      The company is in Trouble! That’s why…

      by susan ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      About 50 employees…harassing the only IT person. Hiden personal agendas are driving this train. My assessment: There are problems that are happening in other departments and there are looming layoffs. No one wants to look like the only incompentant person. You’re easy to pick on -you’re the only guy in your department, you probably don’t play politics so the politicos will have you for breakfast. There is at least one person who is misdirecting management attention towards you. Your best defense is a stiff upper lip. Do not smile at these people, look them not in the eye but right above the eyelid (establish dominance). If you are asked to sign anything remember you have the right to add any comments you wish at the bottom, strike out any statements you disagree with. Write “I disagree” and initial and date. Write at the bottom that you have been presented with non-specific complaints, management has repeatedly directed personal and professional insults towards you, meetings with management have not resulted in clear communication of the problems, and that you have completed your work assignments, and that complaints appear to be political in nature. That’s more than enough to ensure you will never hear from these people again, and that they will not complain about you in the future after you move on, which should be tomorrow.

    • #3192428

      I feel like Donald Trump!

      by grapevine-biz ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      As I read your post I could feel your attitude. Your attitude is 180 degrees out of sync with any kind of support position. Did you quit your last job as a waiter because the tips were so bad? Loose the ego! But until then, “Your FIRED!”

    • #3192423

      First, Look at Yourself in the Mirror

      by yanipen ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Sorry for the late reply.

      The way I see your problem, initially it has something to do with your relationship to your co-workers. Although it has escalated to something bigger, it still the underlying problem.

      A question first, have you ever thought about your interpersonal skills? It is a very good starting point on how you treat others in the workplace. Hey, I am not blaming you for what happened. I was in a very similar situation a few years back. Its just that it has a lot something to do with it.

      Next, stick and know your policy. And evaluate it from time to time. Times are changing fast for policies to be followed. So you must adapt your company’s policy to suit the situation. And, they must know that there are policies for a reason.

      In relationship with your users, it is like holding a sand in the palm of your hancs. Hold it too tight, it will still find a way out. Hold it too loose, and the wind will just blow it away. The way to do it is to hold it just about right.

      I was in one of the world’s biggest project a few years back. We have our own policies, common office envirentment and things like that. When you follow your policies to the letter, you may notice that a lot of the users are cracking up. Cracking up, up to the “C” level managers. Boy, we sure were swimming in hot waters that time.

      So what we did? We starting evaluating ourselves, our policies in place, and the rapport with our co-workers. Especially the rapport. People tend to follow once it is explained to them in a nice way. Even if they dont like it. And may I repeat, policies are there for a reason, it is matter of approach on how to deal with both.

      Eventually, you may have to re-establish your relationship with everybody if you want to see it through.

      Now, in any case that you want to move on, and make again a fresh start, my advice is still the same.

      I hope this helps.

    • #3192404

      get while the gettin’ is good

      by uberman ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I’ve been in your situation before many times. Sometimes I refused to realize it until the axe fell. Sometimes I saw it coming and got out of the way. Believe me it is must less messy if you do the later and get out of the way. It is also much easier to look for a job while you have one.

    • #3192398

      Universal bean counter language.

      by john_tillman ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Presumably people are unhappy because they don’t feel like they are receiving service.

      It sounds like the organisation doesn’t understand the true costs of running an efficient it infrastructure, but rather see it as a costly expensive exercise which doesn’t benefit the company much. They are blaming you for a company wide “our support sucks” kind of mentality, the userbase doesn’t know any better. You are probably busting a gut to get everyone serviced with insufficient resources and copping flak because the expectations are too high given the resources you have. So in your meetings Educate management
      Prove to them with concepts that they can understand. Show them real reasons why what they want is not what they get. Draw up a cost model of their approach to the IT service needs versus and show them why it doesn’t work explain in black and white on paper where the inneficiencies are. Introduce them to best practice concepts like ITIL and various levels of incident,problem,change management Provide them a high level understanding of the knock on affect of lack of process.
      Once the decision making kind of people in management start understanding the cost of providing the type of service and realise it’s not your fault then they will, I think be more trusting of you. I would imagine the whole responsibility of doing this should lie with your manager so Who knows they may turn on your manager and you go up the promotion tree.

    • #3192395

      Some more information as I have just been told….

      by rattyratt ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hi all,

      I am blown away by the responses, and i thank all of you for your responses so far. I am still trying to read through them all. 🙂
      A quick update that I am taking into stride, is that the HR Manager has upped the ante and is now getting the corporation’s legal team into this to make sure that the letter they give me leaves ‘no’ recourse and so they can avoid any kind of unfair dismissal. (Very lame of them of course!)

      I had to admit, when I heard this I was really really worried, but my boss said that they were not going to be doing anything more than making sure there were no loopholes that I could exploit in making a case (if I did.) Ultimately, he said that they (I am trying to be nice, but I see them as the opposition now) were really just hoping that I will find another job and leave. Solving their problem for them, LOL!

      I am looking, believe me! I have heard many of you saying to do that, and I completely agree. Despite the intricacies of this issue, I am not going to try and justify anymore to these people, for my position or myself. They have made up their minds, and they are taking steps to get rid of me. I suppose seeing the amount of people leaving over the last 6 months should have been a warning also. We just had someone become permanent from being temporary – and they quit only a month ago for reasons unknown.
      The real reason – their boss took their head off over a reported incident to their boss. And DIDN’T bother to listen or ask what happened with the staffer in question. (ie: one sided.)
      I am really understanding the ‘Guilty until kicked OUT!’

      Anyway, I won’t begin to spiral down, as I know I am better than that. I have to admit that it has been a learning experience for me, and certainly I have looked at my attitude to myself and others around me. I have heard some people here ask about that, and I believe yes they have have had hit some grains of this also.

      I don’t believe it to be right to campaign against an employee on the basis of something that should have been worked out at a ‘much lower’ level. Especially when I am happy to admit when and where I am wrong, and work to rectify that. 🙂 I am not up myself that I cannot work on self-improvement.

      Anyway, I am cleaning out of here as soon as possible. It is sad, as i wanted to stay here until around 2007, see our migration through and help with the 2003/XP rollout.

      Thus is thus! Thankyou again all for your inspiration, encouragement, constructive criticism and generally positive attitudes. 🙂
      It has been very appreciated in a sometimes (very much now) mad world.


      R. Young

    • #3192385

      RE: What to do?

      by loydfam ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Talk about your typical small business scenario. I have worked for several organization small to large scale (ie. Exxon, Phillips 66, Compaq/HP) corporations. No matter where you work, you are always going to be held accountable of your daily activities one way or another. Whether it by call tracking software or by day end reports, etc… No big deal right. We all have been there.
      Depending on how long this has gone on, I suggest sitting down with your managing director to get to the root of this situation. Worst that could happen is you loose your job which sounds like you are thiking about leaving anyway. Find out what happened and what you can do to rectify the issue. Hope everything works out.

    • #3192384

      Add some traps.

      by theohkm ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Please add some traps (legal ones) to whoever want to prosecure you.

    • #3192378

      what role you play in the organization

      by kyuso ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      In summary, it’s all about how fitting you are to the type of organization. No matter how smart or super-technical you are, people make decisions, not machines. It’s all about people, communicating with people.

      Usually they don’t want to fire you, but just want you to change to fit their organization.

      If you can learn non-technical skills, you can survive comfortably. There are two types of non-technical skills: managing skill, and leadership skill. If you adapt yourself to get along with those 50 people, then you got managing skill. If you can change those 50 people to fit you, you have leadership skill.

      If none of the above apply, the organization didn’t fit you and you didn’t fit them. The solution is to move on, or get a religion and pray that God changes either you or the organization or both to fit each other.

      For the ‘managers’ who think managing means telling people to do what they are supposed to do, that is not correct. Managers adapt incentives that fit the workers to be their best. Leaders are the ones telling workers what to do. Not all managers are leaders, and not all leaders are managers. Managers who try to act like leaders usually hire incompetent workers, and leaders who try to act like managers make workers lazy and incompetent.

    • #3192294

      been there

      by tmalandro ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You really don’t have a choice if this is escalating. What that means is they are looking for a sound way to terminate you. You would be better off finding another job and quiting.

    • #3192217

      We have all been there

      by pdalton1 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      You may not think this helpful but we have (many of us) been there too. Don’t fight it. Consider yourself fireproof by (a) finding another post quietly (b) arranging some references and then (c) quit before they fire you just for the hell of it. I have done it twice in London and I felt much better for it AND found there were much more satisfying jobs to do where I was appreciated.
      There is no way to fight bullies (legally) so be thick-skinned and leave them to it. If you keep going out of “hope” you could end up in severe depression and be too ill to work anywhere!!
      Get it right – always do what you know is best for YOU and move ass NOW.

    • #3193223

      Loving Co-workers

      by jim ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      First let me say I wouldn’t quit if normally you like the job and are just going through a rough period; your employer is large enough that they are under the rules of state and federal employment rules which are designed to give you some level of protection (I’m not a legal consultant but had filed a complaint many years ago against a firm who had illegal overtime policies; you learn a lot when you are put on the spot). If management is requiring you to keep a detailed log of what you do, make sure you also keep a copy for yourself in case they decide to fire you and you want to make a claim against them.

      However, I’ve been in the workforce for 33 years and have had on more then one occasion had to remind myself that as long as I wasn’t being asked to break the law or violate my moral values the job is still paying me. While that didn’t make the problem go away it did help me focus that I’m not here for social reasons but rather to make a living. It is nice to be liked and fit in (that’s management 101). Long term I found that if I continued to be an outstanding employee, regardless of how I was treated, I came out on top. Remember, you do not have control of other people but you do have control over how you act and react even if you are currently the innocent by-stander. That said, now that I am a small business IT consultant I get to see that in some businesses doing a good job is not as important as the political alliances. Since I didn’t grow up in the IT world and I’ve been on both the management and employee side of the fence I can honestly say that some employees felt they were “The Gift” when in fact they were only “Legends in their own minds.” I will also say that IT employees probably are in the same class as “Used Car Sales” and legal professionals. Some of that reputation is un-earned but I’ve been around long enough to see much of the reputation is our own fault in how we treat people.

      Bottom line? Technical people like us are often less in tune with the social aspects of the workplace then other professions. Too often I’ve seen the “network Nazi” come down on people like they own the operation when in fact we provide a support function to the business. Personally, in this support role (IT boss or not) I have never “told” end-users to do anything; I ask or suggest. If the person or department refuses to listen after a reasonable time and I think it could impact the company, I turn it over to their manager not in an accusatory fashion but as an FYI. I let them decide on the course of action and place the responsibility where it belongs, on management. I normally follow my verbal conversation with an email in case I ever get accused at a higher level of not doing my job.

      I’m sure you do great job and have a reasonable personality. But make sure you do a self-assessment occasionally to ensure you aren?t contributing to your own dilemma. If this kind of treatment is business as usual at your firm and it just so happens that it is your turn in the bucket, are you sure you want to work their? On the other hand if the company is a good place to be and it is just one or two individuals, do your job well and if they still fire you there will be nothing to feel bad about?besides, if possible you can take the time on unemployment to relax before finding that next perfect position. Good luck.

    • #3193380

      YIKES !! please clarify your responsibilities

      by john ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Sorry R.Y,
      Very sticky spot, 20/20 hindsite says that you weigh the situation….turn in a boss, warn him,
      touch his personal cpu. Have his equal (on your side speak to him) ..Tuff spot…
      What exactly was your duty ?
      Reporter or Enforcer ?
      And did you have the power to enforce it and
      if not enforced how much of a factor would it be.
      Circle the wagons and get together with the ones in your org that know and trust you and want to
      work with you and see your value and get the strongest one to stick up for you to address these unhappy users, boss to boss.
      Please blog this someplace with a steady report.
      I’d like to hear more.
      Good luck, be honest and tactful and always weigh your choices if there’s time.

    • #3193374

      Jobs are hard to come by

      by thewineman1 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I had a similar thing happen to me back in 1996. I went to a new job to find someone else working there who had worked for me previously. I was his direct supervisor before and we were now working together again, but in different departments. He went to management and described me as a dirt bag and problem child right after I arrived. The manager, Deputy Director of Operations, called me into his office and explained to me that he didn?t like me and didn?t want me working there. He went on to say in time he would have me replaced. I wasn?t given the chance to give my side or defend myself and I almost quit right there. Instead I went to work and did my job. In time I identified problems with operations and quietly made changes, developed an application to increase productivity, and all the while pushing credit off on others who needed a boost. Almost a year later the Deputy Director of Operations called me into his office. He apologized for jumping to conclusions before and went so far as to tell me that what he was told before was reversed and that he now wanted to work with me instead of against me. I thanked him for his honesty and told him that I wouldn?t accept his apology, that I didn?t need him, that his leadership skills sucked, and that he was extremely unprofessional. In all, the two of them turned several people against me and my first year in the company was a bitch. I stayed with the company for seven years in all and outlasted them both. Bottom line, jobs are hard to come by and sometimes you can turn it around a bad situation. Several times during my tenure the CEO told me to drive on and gave me free rein to operate how I wanted. I all it was one of the best jobs I have ever had.

    • #3193319

      Similar thing happened

      by gobs ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      A very similar thing happened to me. I tried to stick it out, knowing I was right and others were wrong. The result was not a happy one. Unfortunately, management started to believe the people against me and eventually they spun enough to force my resignation. They even got a court ruling preventing me going public! This happened due to management changes.

      I strongly suggest that you talk to the person at the top of your organisation. If they are on your side then that buys you time. Think seriously about finding another job. Those high up the tree will understand your situation and write you good references. If the Management is against you, or changing, look at bailing out as soon as possible. remember that your next employer will most likely contact your current bosses so try to leave on good terms.

      My situation ended badly, but now I am in a better job and my bosses and staff appreciate me. Should have resigned earlier before it turned to mud!

      It’s a very hard decision I know, but it will end well. All the best.

    • #3191649

      Personality and Character

      by deesy58 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      All organizations have both a personality and a character. These traits are influenced, but not always controlled, by senior management. It is clearly obvious from your stated observations that your present organization possesses a deeply flawed character, and a personality that is incompatible with your personality and value system. Top management is apparently not willing to deal with these issues, so it is not possible for the situation to ever improve.

      Acknowledge that you made a mistake when you joined this organization, and get out before matters begin to adversely affect your health. There is no shame in leaving an incompatible organization after only a short stint on the job. It is time to get on with your career, and your current employer is obviously not a step on the ladder upwards.

    • #3191614

      All Heroes are DEAD!

      by britontn ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Hey I think that problem has come on the lap of almost every IT tech pro.
      Some people take things personal when we implement the company policy which, I might add, we don’t make!
      IT has never been liked in almost every organisation I’ve worked for. They all think we are a mutant breed or something. If you don’t do personal favours for them(which compromise your job. Like allowing them to surf for porn or give them access to resources) you are Staff Enemy 01.
      I worked for an organisation where all the things you’ve described and a whole lot more happened to me. I did more paperwork than any clerk anywhere. I had to list what I did, when I started and when I finished. And when I left the office, the guard had to sign me off on a time sheet. If I put in extra hours because there is need to do so, I’d have to justify it in writing before I could hope to be compensated for it. then All those hours were converted to off days which I never got the chance to use because I would never be allowed to take an off day.
      Solution 1:
      Set up a meeting and have all the people to lay it out why they think you are not doing a good job and why they think you have a rotten attitude. But beware; if one of those people is up there then they are not going to like you for embarassing them by proving that they have nothing but personal problems against you.
      Solution 2(which i think you should take first)
      My mistake was I tried to fight it out and I lost. I still have a pending case in labour court! Very bad for my resume. companies won’t employ me because of it too. I’m out of a job. I’m not asking you to be a coward. I’m just asking you to be smart. Heroes die!

      • #3191404

        Reply To: What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

        by rsears ·

        In reply to All Heroes are DEAD!

        I’d get out while the getting is good. Get a new job and resign your position on good terms. Forget court. Forget revenge. Let it go and move on. Sounds like you are incompatible with the company.

    • #3193084

      The long road

      by erekose mcne ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      I have been down that like soo many others. It is tough to have to enforce policy. I took the blame for installing corporate wide antivirus software on the Owners machine afte the network was decimated by the nimda virus. The old man had a fit because he the group of us managers did what we were supposed to do. He just never bothered to read any of the months worth of emails that were sent to all users. When the software came down in a push, he freaked and ejected his laptop from the docking station. From then I, was famous because he was a tool. The moment the started paper trailing you, that was the time to find a new job. That is how the managers and weasels in HR operate. I realise that a new baby and job shortage makes it tough and I have been consulting on and off here in the US for 10 years. The key is to check out the place you work. Google for any mention of the company good or bad. Also remember to never truly trust anyone. AS IT you are a necessary evil and after all these years, the opinion never changes. You are the first to be blamed when it hits the fan and the las to bre praised when you do a good job because it is what is expected of you. RUN AS FAST AS YOU CAN FROM THESE LOSERS!!!! I would check to see if you can get anything in writing about what has transpired because you never know if a lawyer might take a frivolous pro bono case just to make the lives of these people as miserable as they have made you. After all you are IT and you should be able to find the trail of bread crumbs. User are dumb and they don’t delete incriminating information.
      I hope you find a company worthy of your skill.
      Hope you and family end up okay.

    • #3192951

      You are doomed. Get out, but first…

      by turbogeek ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Sad to say, but you are doomed. Somewhere, someone has it in for you and it might have nothing to do with you at all. It might be that the person who is in a snit had a friend whom they’d ‘recruited’ for the job and lobbied hard for and they didn’t get it, so they figure there’s another chance if they get you out of there. Perhaps your presence has put the brakes on some unsavory or illegal activity that was going on for fear that your access to various system might enable you to stumble upon it, so they are trying to get youout of there. Perhaps you are interfering with some extra-cirricular sleeping arrangements just by being there and they want you out.

      The best thing to do is counter-document and if there is anything that they are doing that could in anyway be discriminatory because of a potentially protected class of person you belong to, play that up so that they will be more likely to be more generous with a severence arrangement to entice you into signing an agreement not to sue them. And also do some snooping of your own to see if you can uncover any dirt. Given the way you described the situation, it definitely there, hiding someplace. You need to find what rug it’s under and make copies of it to have for ‘future reference.’

      You should accept the fact that the eventual outcome of this situation is going to be termination. You should start working on the attitude adjustment now so that when it comes, you can just laugh at them. Certainly work on your resume, review job posting, and start looking for something else as well. But don’t waste any more emotional energy in trying to salvage this situation. It’s already turned to poop.

      Oh, and one more thing. If that PC that the person you thought was behind this that they got annoyed about cleaning up is still around and hasn’t been reimaged, etc. Perhaps you might want to do a little ‘compliance checking’ and see just what they do have on there that was gumming up the works…. Never know what interesting things you might find.


    • #3192941

      cover your butt.

      by andrew_ockrim ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It may not be 100% “ethical”, but you need to find the root cause of the animosity towards you.

      All the good intentions and performance planning may not be enough to save you from a boss who has alterior motives.

      If you have access to the email system, i suggest you have a snoop around their accounts (as any good administrator would do when an employee complains of harassement). You may well find the underlying reasons for your harassment.

      I have had similar situations in the past. You will need the evidence for any future repercussions that this may generate, so covre your butt. They have obviously not shown you any loyalty – so why are your showing it to them?
      If they want you to document every thing you do – do so, even if it impacts your service – that is more supporting evidence for yourself.

      It may also be a good idea to send (via registered post) any important documents or information relating to this and not open it. If you end up in court over this it will be irrefutable.

      Good luck

    • #3192821

      Tough Situation

      by bwilkes82 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Dear R.Young, I feel your pain in this story but, realize you do have options. I believe, if you have been honesty and upheld your integrity that you can prevail although, you may feel like poopy when this is all over. One, stay and tough it out (be prepared to get battered and beaten). Two, start looking for another job. After getting out of the Army several years ago, I promised myself (if I could help it) never to work on a job that I did not like and was not having fun at. I have kept that promise to myself. I have gone unemployed a time or two but I now have the job of my dreams (not without some scares getting here). I believe, if you know your stuff your performance and record will speak for you and rebut any false accusations thrown at you. Is it for the principal of the matter or vindication that you want more? R.Young, hang tough.

    • #3174575

      Wow! I used to work for a company like this!

      by mikebentley ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      All very good replies. As long as you stay true to yourself, and understand that the company’s main goal is itself, and you keep your goals aligned with the company’s (as well as their mission), whatever happens, you will go to bed with a clear conscience.

      I know that doesn’t pay the bills, but as long as you pray, things will work out one way or another.

      I’m not pushing anything on you religion wise, because I don’t know what (if any) your faith is…..I just meant in general.

      Keep your head up! I went through almost exactly the same thing, and the company I worked for started fabricating a paper trail on me.

      I left the company, but only because of an outburst that I couldn’t control – at least I got to go off on my boss (he looked like he thought I was going to kill him!). I look back and don’t regret my decision, but if you see light at the end of the tunnel, don’t quit your job until you find something better, and by all means, keep your cool and don’t let them know they are getting to you.


    • #3173649

      Talk about carrying the flag!

      by kmf98 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Had similar problem a few years ago but in a larger organization. Had multiple compaints that I did not finish jobs and did not effectively communicate what solutions to the problems were. Finally used a form similar to what our maintenance department used when making repairs with a few additions. Maintenance had someone in the department to sign a form to validate that work on the existing problem was performed. I had a field for the date the problem was first reported, date I came to look at the problem, if the problems was taken care of, to give an explaination in their own writing of what I communicated to them concerning the problem and the fix and for them to date and sign the form. Withing a month and a half, all complaints had stopped.

    • #3173072

      More Money

      by pka ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Tell them if you gotta put up with all this new crap you need a lot more money because it wasn’t part of the job description you hired on to do.

    • #3187821

      Get out of Dodge!

      by rm3mpc ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      It’s possible you’re too focused on doing things your way instead
      of learning the company’s culture and fitting in. It’s more likely
      that they have decided (for whatever reason) to dump you, and
      this is simply going through the motions on their part.

      Get your resume up to date and start looking for another job.
      NOW. The suggestions to document everything are good, simply
      to protect yourself if you have to go on unemployment.

      Ask yourself if you can stomach working with these people in
      the future, even if you get past this immediate crisis. Odds are,
      you won’t be happy if you stay. Some situations simply aren’t
      worth dealing with, and you’d be a lot better off landing another
      job you like before the ax falls.

    • #3187767

      what the threat ?

      by theohkm ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      So called policy is something that is apparanetly built for better environment or in favor of their own rules of game.

      IT guy faces many people. Life is more than challenging. Useless staff start with the IT department to divert the attention of their own faults. It is a natural phenonmenon. (Everyone needs you no matter the strong one or the stupid ones) Some baseline must be kept to protect yourself.

      In fact, you are the most threatening to them (if you know their tacts). Their tacts reveal from time to time and will eventually become non-effective.

      If you know who looks scared when you pass by, it is a scene that they are shined by System Administration’s Holly Power. What Holly Power is that we do not stand by any side, we survive the whole system, the whole things up and running. The definition of up and running can be refined, depending the situation, target, atmosphere, time and in favor of most people. We let freedom, not without control.

      Starting from daily tasks, we face several level of responsibility. Although hard to be perfect, at least not too bad.

      Football has no side. People go off-side. People deny their fault and say it is ball’s fault – ball speed too slow at first and too fast after hovering on top of their heads ? Or ball doesn’t fall at either side, either direction.

      The judge, cannot judge, is threatened by the environment.

      Who know who will leave first ? Who know when leave, there is another better sky ? have seen the way of living of numerous useless people doing. In an Island, there are animals, don’t like them, still need to live with them.

      Let they smart, let they do, let they fall.

      It is not easy, not easy, not easy.

    • #3187645

      You replaced the worker who left 4 same reason?

      by dshisler ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Appologize and mean it, but same day make serious plans to go to another job ASAP! You need to ‘suck up’ just long enough to find another job. I’ve warned my sons to watch their backs. There are bosses and supervisors who are pleased to steal the credit for an employee’s hard work. There are supervisors that have absolutely no consciences. Sign and date your good work. Detail (in a journal) everything that you’re suspicious of, so that in your exit interview with an HR person you can hand over a COPY of your suspicions and concerns, complete with dates, times. I had a super who told me that the job is not done until the paperwork is complete; that the paperwork is more important to his boss, than the actual work. Be able to back up your activities with facts, in writing, not typed. When you are asked by your boss to restore files or fix the server, write it down, – (complaint and effective repair). Try to do it in the presence of the person that sits at that computer. Don’t whine or complain in the presence of anyone. The walls have ears, and you never know who’s listening. Also, there are hidden cameras and microphones everywhere, now. All e-mail is monitored! Be friendly, be a good listener, but don’t broadcast your own feelings to anyone. Keep your opinions to yourself. You are your own worst enemy. Remember this, because it is critical to your success…. Apologize to your boss. Be humble, and tell your boss that you’ve been defensive, that you appreciate your job, because it gives you a sense of accomplishment and stability, and that you really want to get all this behind you. Admitting that should immediately relax your boss. You accepted the job offer in the first place because you wanted to learn and advance when you got more experience, and what better place to gain that experience. Here is where you want to be. Meantime, keep your sights on opportunities. On your first vacation, scour the area for a new job. Learn all you can, when you can. Study in view of the door where your boss leaves for lunch. Don’t be obvious. Good luck from a veteran job-seeker. I once worked at a small company where I went to work at the same time that others did, except I did it for free! After awhile they put me on part time, then a year went by before they made me a full time employee. Software engineers overheard me discussing the complex design and behavior of electronic filters. One of them, and then others began to talk to me in more serious terms. They were astounded that I was able to teach the head Engineer about these things, and they were shocked to find out that I wasn’t an engineer at all. Hell, I never even got a passing grade past eighth grade high school!
      I hope that this revelation helped you. I hate to lose good people, and I hate it when people are so greedy that they’ll do a hostile takeover of a whole country, based on a pack of lies. You know who I mean.

    • #3183473

      Third Party Law

      by macdonald00 ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      Here is a quote from “How to Resolve Conflicts?”

      Such a thing would have to be some natural law unguessed at by himself.

      And there is such a law, apparently, that answers these conditions of being deadly, unknown and embracing all activities.

      The law would seem to be:






      It is very easy to see that two in conflict are fighting. They are very visible. What is harder to see or suspect is that a third party existed and actively promoted the quarrel.

      The usually unsuspected and ?reasonable? third party, the bystander who denies any part of it, is the one that brought the conflict into existence in the first place.

      The hidden third party, seeming at times to be a supporter of only one side, is to be found as the instigator.

      This is a useful law in many areas of life.

      It is the cause of war.

      One sees two fellows shouting bad names at each other, sees them come to blows.

      No one else is around. So they, of course, ?caused the fight.? But there was a third party.

    • #3190225

      You will be given a fair trial… then you will be shot!

      by user@# ·

      In reply to What to do? Talk about carrying the flag!!!

      The line about all people lighting up a room– some when they enter, some when they leave– has a corollary:

      All people eventually see the light– some when they arrive, some when they leave. All things being even, it’s time for you to look for the light– you won’t find it where you are.

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