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by kees.valkenswaard

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TechRepublic is a nice site for people who want to know more about ICT and get answers to their questions.

However, in its selling policy TechRepublic is in my view discriminating against people not living in the United States of America.

Most CDs will be shipped free of charge within the United States of America. I fully understand that international mail is more expensive. But why not grant also a rebate to international customers? They would have to pay the difference between the two mail charges for instance.

I have been mailing TechRepublic many times about this issue. They just reply after several weeks that international mail is more expensive, avoiding to address my concerns.

Please forward your comments regarding thisissue. I believe it has a lot to do with the image and success of this site.

I will leave this question a few weeks open.

41 replies

by dmiles

Your concern may only be a matter of opinion
What TechRepublic may offer here in the states as free of charge,is not the case of other countries.

You are getting a free hosted site to share,so at what cost are you willing to pay to have this service passed on to you?

Nothing is free these days,even when it is advertised you pay for shipping cost,so a small fee I donot think constitute discrimination,even when there is a fine line.

by dmiles

Yes,the maintainence and entrance to users are free,and the cost is passed on to third parties,with so many sites beginning to charge to get info.
So, why do you think it would discrimination to charge Int'l shipping

by kees.valkenswaard

Your answer is probably one of the best I received. It contains a genuine and honest observation, without any hostility as some likely ignorant people have voiced. I would love to award you more points than any of the others, which does not seem to be possible.
Anyhow you have learned me to look at this issue from a different perspective. This does not mean that I fully agree to the policy of many companies based within the United States of America. However, my views may become somewhat milder.

by ann777

Many companies will not "sell" overseas.

It's not only that it is more expensive... it is also the fact that it is impossible to track when something goes wrong. Even in the US, mail gets lost/destroyed/stolen. Companies usually lose out when this happens.

There's also the financial side of exchange rates.

All of this costs $'s and TR may (like a lot of companies) just decide it's not worth the time and effort to go beyond USA.

by kees.valkenswaard

I already mentioned that I would pay in dollars, so the exchange rate issue would not apply. I am not that well informed about the delivery system inside the United States of America. In my country especially small packets would be a very safe medium which will very rarely go astray.
In principle it is possible to use a tracking system and receive as sender a compensation when something would get lost. I did not ask to get it for free, but to get some discount as well.
TechRepublic probably wants to sell overseas as they send me at least once a week an e-mail message with a form already filled-in to order one of their CDs. So if they think it is not worthwhile they should stop those messages. Or would they consider it not worthwhile to filter foreign addresses? That would really be a bad habit towards people living elsewhere.
Anyhow, thank you for your observations.

by blaine moore

I don't get why this is a question, should be a discussion. Either way, I think that your position is silly and that there is nothing wrong with TRs policies. Yes, I live in the US, so I'm not affected negatively as yourself. Sorry.

by kees.valkenswaard

Agreed, it should have been a discussion rather than a question. In order to get attention and using the capitalist mind of many people living in the United States of America I thought it would be better to award points. At least you seem to understand that there are negative aspects towards the TechRepublic policy. Thank you for your contribution.

by kees.valkenswaard

Answer #1
I am wondering what you are referring at. The entrance to the site is free. The site is probably popular because people get answers to questions they can not get easily elsewhere, at least not for free.
The interest of TechRepublic is the possibility to advertise for third parties, next to selling their own publications on CD-rom. I have looked at several example chapters which did not give me the conviction that I should immediately order these CD-roms.
However, I would be prepared to give it a go. An additional $ 12 or more just for shipping and handling is quite a lot.
When I see a waiver for people inside the United States of America I get, just like you, the feeling that it is already included in the price.
That is exactly what gives me an uneasy feeling. If I would have to pay the difference between the home rate and the international rate I probably could convince myself and still buy the CD-rom.

Answer #2
I can see that probably you are not very familiar with international trade. To many countries the delivery by international mail or other carrier is normally safer than just dispatching within the United States of America.
In addition I would have to pay with a credit card. So the problem of exchange rates does not exist.
If a company believes that the home market is sufficient they even would not offer their merchandise to other countries at all. If companies in other countries would have had the same attitude your home market would not have been flooded by Japanese cars.

by kees.valkenswaard

Answer #3
You may be right that this should have been a discussion rather than a question. However, as you are living in a capitalist country most people will only react when they can earn something, even just the TechRepublic points. As far as I am aware they still do not have any real value, notwithstanding several announcements that they were looking into the matter. Maybe I could give-in some points in order to get the same waiver as you get.
You state that you are living in the United States of America and therefore are not affected by this policy. At least you are very honest in that respect. It only helps to reinforce the image of the Ugly American.
Perhaps I am silly in trying to ask for understanding by people who believe thatthey can interfere everywhere in the world but do not accept an international court.
Anyhow thank you for your comments.

by jkaras

Are you French? Ok... cheap shot from the "ugly American" :). I get your point, but all companies reserve the right to conduct business that benefits profitability. Nobody works for free, all things cost money. If the role was reversed I to would bemiffed but doubt I would use the excuse of discrimmination. That is an ugly word that has malice behind it and I seriously doubt that this site hates any nationality, it's just unfortunate that there isnt a way to please eveyone and that all benefits cant be distributed to all fairly. Maybe there hasnt been a huge demand internationally for the products that you desire? There are always more than 1 side to every coin, so to speak. Who knows maybe after this thread they might make it possible?

by kees.valkenswaard

I am still puzzled why I should be French. Just a cheap reaction from an ?Ugly American? who has no real knowledge of the world outside his own little village? Just following your president in his: who is not with us is against us, being a simple mind attitude? Hopefully not. However, if you would have a little bit international knowledge my e-mail address would likely reveal my country, although I agree it is no proof today.
I already pointed out that they, TechRepublic, desire to sell to me rather than the opposite way. Discrimination is not used as an excuse by me. It is a very hard feeling. However, as you pointed out there are two sides to a coin. Perhaps your understanding of our position will raise as well. Thank you for your cooperation.

by jereg

I understand your point, and perhaps your concern. I live in the US, so I don't have your problem. My question would be; how does the rate TR charges to ship international compare with other companies? Are they charging more for CD shipment then other companies? My only experience has been purchasing a few books from Europe, and I was charged a bit more then if I had purchased them here, however, the books werenot available in the US. Are you paying more only at TR, or do you pay more from any US company?

by kees.valkenswaard

It is not uncommon that one has to pay more for international shipping than for domestic delivery. As such I have no real objection to that. However, offering to wave the domestic rate and still charging fully the international rate was the issue I did not like. As some pointed out the rate is anyhow somewhere calculated in the cost of the product. That would mean that I will have to pay twice.
In general I agree with you that international rates may be unnecessary high, either way. Thank you for your contribution.

by swat3commander

I hope you know your question you posted is worth 7600 points wow. Anyway I been a member here for 3 years and only have 2153 points. That's all I had to say.

About shipping alot of companys don't ship to canada MSNBC.com does not ship. Theres tons more around. This site is more then free it's useful, helperful. It's awsome. But for points around here kills me lmao I wonder whos got the highest points around here and how lol.

I'm really not a big time active user around here that could beone. Come and go you know.

by kees.valkenswaard

I explained already in one of my comments above that I have a lot of points because I answer a lot of questions which help to make this site popular. However, the same points are rather useless. That is why I offer a small part to others who occasionally visit this site. To be fair, I do not look every day myself as well. The few times I browse through the lists there are sufficient questions for which I believe being able to provide a useful answer.
By the way what would you call the reactionof your president towards France? If that is not discrimination I am completely lost.
Good luck with the points and your visits to the site.

by maxwell edison

I just spent about twenty minutes to write, what I considered, an excellent answer to your question, about 3000 total characters. I even gave you some suggestions on how this could be overcome.

Before I posted that answer, however, I finished reading all your comments, which went on to criticize America and Americans. And to think, you posted that dribble on an American owned and maintained Web site.

I just hit the “yes” button to delete my document.

If you think that little of us (U.S.), then I just wasted 20 minutes of my time.

by kees.valkenswaard

I would have loved to see your 20 minutes answer. Very often you have very good advice. You still can mail it directly to me. I would appreciate that. If I really would think that little about people living in the Unites States of America I would even not have bothered to post a question.
It is because there is still some hope that a general international cooperation would also be pursued by people living between the Atlantic and Pacific Ocean that I bother to react. I have visited many countries around the world. Therefore I know that there are other (and sometimes better) systems than the American way of life.
I am awaiting your excellent reaction by e-mail.

by timwalsh

The simple answer is that this is free enterprise at work.

The way free enterprise works is: if you don't want to pay what a company is charging for a product, go to a competitor. If there aren't any competitors, you are pretty much stuck paying whatever a company wants to charge. The same goes for shipping and handling.

Without specifics as to how TR is actually shipping things, there is no way to determine if what they charge for International customers is reasonable and fair. Chances are that TR can't use the same method for International as they do for domestic shipping. Therefore, they can't offer the same price break. Or the volume for domestic shipments is sufficient to make up for shipping costs where international voume isn't.

You have to be careful using the descrimination word. It has too many unfortunate connotations. Of course, I'm sure there are absolutely NO companies in the Netherlands (or the rest of Europe) that offer the same type of price break for domestic shipping (vs. international).

by kees.valkenswaard

Yes, there are many companies offering a discount on both shipping rather. In the United States of America there are several companies who offer to send the fourth CD for free no matter what the destination is.
As regards the CD, I believe I would be able to buy an awful lot of the same category products around the world, including my own country. I tried to explain that I do not have a must-have feeling. Just being curious if the product would be worthwhile. Some of the tips offered on the TechRepublic site are nice and helpful. However, several times I have sent an e-mail message that there are better tips for a given situation or even that there were errors in the tip. I never received an answer. That is the reason why I felt that the unbalanced shipping costs was the limit.
You have taught me that I should accept the systems of so called free trade. Thank you for your contribution.

by thechas

While customer service is giving you a 'pat' answer as to the higher cost of shipping, I suspect that there are a number of other costs involved, and the volume of foreign orders is not high enough for TR to absorb the extra costs of doing business overseas.

In addition to the higher cost of international mail, TR likely has to maintain an export license, or work with another firm that handles the export issues.

The US government has many rules in relation to exporting computer software, hardware and information.

In order to keep the site free, I believe that TR is under-staffed in relation to handling user complaints.

As to the free shipping for US customers, it is more likely a marketing decision, than a benefit to US based users.

Giving something 'free' is a very common marketing tactic used to lure consumers in the US.
Another, is the 'loss-leader'. A company sells a product below cost to bring in customers in hopes of the costumer buying other items that make a profit.

If you can find similar information from other sources that is lower in cost, or has free shipping to Europe, that would be the best way to make your case to the staff at TR.

Chas

by kees.valkenswaard

Your answer is likely the best I received. In a very clear and concise way you address about every issue I may have overlooked. However, I feel it is not fair to award no points to others. If I could freely divide myself you would get the bulk.
Just a remark, free enterprise is advocated in the United States of America. At the same time there are many regulations and restrictions. Perhaps still a one way free enterprise?
Thank you very much for your wise worlds.
By the way. I love very oftenyour good advice for technical issues.

by kees.valkenswaard

OK.
Perhaps I look a bit harsh towards people and companies in the United States of America. I want to apologize for that.
However, at least once a week I receive from TechRepublic an e-mail message urging me to buy one of their CDs, like Learn Access step-by-step. When I follow the link I see the advertisement concerning free shipping and handling within the United States of America., while all my details and my foreign address are already in the form.
I have to assume that TechRepublic wants to sell something to me if they continue to send e-mails.

Some people may argue that they don?t bother about those few foreigners which also get their adds, but actually they do not want to sell abroad. Decent companies make it clear right from the beginning to whom their offers apply. I have seen many sites and e-mail messages with a phrase like: ?Sorry, offer only valid for (legal) residents of the United States of America.? In that case I know I do not need to waste my time in reading all those glorious texts.

Somebody asked how I did get so many points? Well, just by answering many questions which help TechRepublic to make this site popular. In the past they suggested that we would be able to do something with all those points.
If I could trade these for getting also some rebate on the shipping I would be happy.

I pointed out already that I am not convinced that the CD is worth the money. However I would be prepared to give it a try. Just to pay another $ 12,95 extra is at least for me a little bit too much.

I keep looking for good suggestions.

by cyn

I'm not sure I understand the problem. Shipping is never really "free", it is always just included in the price. If you are being charged additional shipping how do you know that charge is just not the difference between US charges and internationalcharges?

Do you know the actual shipping cost in the US to be able to compare?

I feel the main purpose of the site is to provide answers and forums for anyone who has questions plus providing excellent articles. The merchandise offered certainly doesn't affect the content of the site.

We don't have to buy anything to use the site so really how do optional purchases affect the image and success of the site?

by kees.valkenswaard

Yes, I am able to see both rates as they are clearly advertised in the e-mails I receive very often and at the site itself.
I believe that the merchandise is very important for TechRepublic as the site as such would only costs them money. Only advertisement and selling products would allow them to make some profit. That is at least my believe.
It is because of the success of the site that I am even contemplating buying a CD. If is would have been just a site I would even not have bothered to look into the issue.
However, I feel the site is especially popular due to the people who post and answer questions. Some way of thanking those people could be contemplated by TechRepublic as well.

by alpha-male

There is more to this than just the cost of the "stamp". In shipping overseas, there is more work involved (customs declarations, taxes, tarriffs etc) and in many case more risk to the company involved (loss, reshipping etc). In the US, an American company has a lot of resources available to protect itself...outside of the country it does not. I for one would be glad that the product was even offered overseas.

We're not talking a lot of money here and to be honest, I find your issue to be somewhat petty. When I have ordered things from overseas TO America I have routinely payed very high fees to have them shipped here. I suppose though that because I'm in America that's perfectly acceptable to you? You obviously have a chip on your shoulder about Americans...even though I'm not one...I just live here.

Anyhow...it boils down to a simple matter of fact. There is a cost attached to the product. TR has assigned what it considers a fair cost and what all others outside of the US pay.If you want the product, pay the amount. If you don't think it's worth it, there are many European companies that offer products and consulting that may assist you. Good luck finding it at a price any where near what TR is offering.

by alpha-male

I'll tell you what...Buy the CD and have it shipped to me. I'll insure it, I'll pay the shipping and I'll mail it to you. You can be rude and insult the people and this great country all you want...but right here in this, one of these dirty miserable abusive capitalists is offering to pay out of his pocket to do something nice for you. Why? Because maybe it'll make you see that on TR there are nice and helpful people in America. Now you should take a look in the mirror at the cheap person who makes blanket insults at people he doesn't know in a place he is prejudice against...the problem with TR's discrimination against you sure smacks as a lot more palletable than your prejudices to me. I'm in the peer list. Contact me and I'll make sure you get your CD shipped at someone else's expense. Mine.

by kees.valkenswaard

Your answer is along the lines of several I received before and as such useful. However, in your comment you probably lost control about yourself. As I explained already above, I do not consider the case of the United States of America as fully hopeless. If I would really consider you and your fellow country people as dirty miserable abusive capitalists, I would not have bothered to post a question at all.
I thank you very much for your offer to ship the CD to me free of charge. Due to all thereactions and the commotion my issue has raised I believe I better will not buy the CD, as it was only out of curiosity [good marketing techniques] that I would order it.
I looked into the mirror and did not see what you, not knowing me, expected me to see.
However thank you for your reaction which added something to my view of people living at the other side of the Atlantic Ocean.

by ewgny

We ugly Americans support half the damn world. Capitalism has empowered us to do so. We should pull the plug on international welfare to all the ungrateful miscreant nations, and see how their attitudes change. If you can't afford the CD I'm sure you'll survive.

by kees.valkenswaard

Your answer is probably the worst I received. I believe you will have to learn a lot. I am not convinced that your country is only supporting half the damn world. Perhaps you would hope that half the world would be damned. International cooperation is something different than exploitation. I would advise you to travel around the world, learn a few foreign languages in order to really understand the people and after that reconsider your attitude.
Anyhow, my comments may have caused your unbalanced reaction. If that is the case, I want to apologize for that. Keep learning to understand others. I at least have learned that there are many sides to a coin.

by cactus pete

Is this what you saw?

YES! Please send my copy of XXXXX . I'll receive my book and CD-ROM at the special Member rate of only $XX plus $5.95 s&h ($8.95 s&h Canada, $12.95 s&h international). Bonus: Free shipping in the U.S. if I pay now! If I'm not completely satisfied, I can return my copy within 30 days for a full refund.

by cactus pete

You said:

"Decent companies make it clear right from the beginning to whom their offers apply."

I believe that the above shows they were quite clear. Before stating the discount for US buyers, they listed all the prices.

What more do you want?!

by kees.valkenswaard

I regret that I was not clear enough in my reactions to certain comments. I did not blame TechRepublic in being not clear concerning the rates. However, I receive an awful lot of e-mail messages and offers from other companies where I only at the end, after having gone through a lot of text and forms will discover that I can not use that glorious offer.
Your main reply is correct in showing the information.
Thank you for your contribution.

by ptaylor

The statement made "I have seen many sites and e-mail messages with a phrase like: ?Sorry, offer only valid for (legal) residents of the United States of America.?" sometimes have valid reasons. I once worked for a cataloging company as a System Analyst. The company marketed and sold products as a 3rd party, by selling name products such as Sony, Toshiba, Hitachi, Krups...etc. The software the company used that controlled these transactions did not have a solid way to ship and track overseas packages. We had to make major adjustments to conicide with shipping vendors in order to ship (I say ship, but all packages had to be ground service) to Canada. Our company then ran into tariff problems going into Canada. A customer would order a package, then when the package was held for tariff fees, the customer would back out and the whole shipping costs would be placed back on our company. We ended up losing money when shipping internationally.

TR has the best tech site that I have encountered. The fact that international shipping is offered at a slight cost increase is surprising to me knowing that they had to go through a lot of extra channels to make it happen in the first place.

by kees.valkenswaard

A few times I already ordered CDs in the United States of America. I did not get the impression that there was a lot of additional red tape. However, your inside information may be helpful. It shows once more that real international free trade is far beyond easy reach. The only problem I have may be that a lot of barriers are imposed by the United States of America while at the other hand they may ?punish? a country that does not ?swallow? their terms.
Again, I indeed may be prejudiced or biased. I will try to see both sides of the coin. May you guys do the same. Thank you for your valuable contribution.

by mallardtooxx

First of all I do not want your points, second of all you cannot make a statement such as you did and then try to recend it when ppl chaffe over it. You reinforce our notion of a American bashing fool who loves to cast rocks. You know until I readyour responses I was going to tell you how to do it, completely legal and legit and you would not have to pay a dime extra. You must learn the reason americans are cocky is because we can be. The reason americans do not except international court is because we do not have to and the reason american culture is so coveted throughout the world is because you cannot have it. DO NOT come on to an American site and whine because we do not have to pay shipping on our tech republic CD's. For the love of pete if you need the thing so bad then go to ebay. You wonder why American companies don't take international credit cards or charge extra? It is an A$$hole tax for people like you that want something for nothing. Get over it already. I do not care what this response garners from you or anyone else because I am tired of watching this happen. So keep your points, choke on them for all I care, and next time try a discussion because those are free just like you like it.

-duck

by kees.valkenswaard

You do not care what others think about your reaction. That is something I do not like of some people inside the United States of America. I had a certain view. When people point out to me that there is another side to the issue I am prepared to consider that. In your power play you call that I want to recend. As I am not from an English speaking mother tongue I tried to look up the word ?recend?. Yes, I used a dictionary printed in the United States of America, the new international Webster?s comprehensive dictionary of the English language. I also used the American Heritage Talking Dictionary. These are just a few of the many dictionaries I have as I am really interested in international relations. I assume you mean ?resent?? In that case I believe to understand your fierce words.
If you believe to be the strongest you do not have to obey international rules? That is only something for the week people? Is that your interpretation of real democracy. Poor people who fall into your hands.
I explained already a few times that I do not really need those CDs, with or without Pete. I sincerely hope that you still will learn a lot. Whether you like it or not you are going to receive my points. Perhaps you may want to cast them as rocks to somebody else. Anyhow, you have broaden my view on certain people living within the United States of America. Good luck.

by ewgny

How did I guess that this guy would offer all of these points get people to take him seriously, spend time to answer his question. Then never rate and close out the question.
I was fully prepared for a rejected answer, and now I'm prepared for two.But I had to vent to say this guy never intended to lay out a single point. Just like he doesn't want to pay for his CD. What a WEASEL !!!

by kees.valkenswaard

Your prejudice is very clear. May be I should have closed sooner. At the beginning I already pointed out that I would wait a few weeks. You are absolutely right if you feel that it has been more than a few weeks. However, you get your share as well.A pity that I do not know your hopefully interesting answer. I am not going to reject answer because it may not be 100% the way I would like it. I am at least prepared to accept different views. Anyhow, you get your points cheap. Good luck.

by kees.valkenswaard

In my reaction to #9 TheChass I meant wise words and not wise worlds. I assume this is for most readers clear.
Good luck.

This discussion is closed to new replies.