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Tyranny of the offended

By MirrorMirror ·
I am looking for understanding, not flames. Seriously. I do not know any Muslims who can explain things to me. My son is putting himself in harms way to help bring freedom to Muslims. I have a serious stake in understanding what is going on.

Muslims around the world are offended by cartoons and are making threats of boycotts and violence. I have been watching this unfold, wondering where it would lead and am very dissapointed at the reaction from the Muslim world.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11097877/

If the media and the world gives in to the insane Muslim response then we will all have a much more difficult time in the future defending ourselves from anyone else who makes demands because they are "offended". Lots of things offend me, but I know that I cannot go around threatening people and governments over them.

Let me state that I do not believe that the Muslim reaction that is being shown in the media is the norm. However, where are the moderate Muslims denouncing the extremists? Someone, please, give me something to show me that there is reason and tolerance in the Muslim world.

When Pat Robertson stuck his foot in his mouth not too long ago with his insensitive remarks about Ariel Sharon, Christian moderates all over denounced what Robertson said. Is is possible that most Muslims believe that they should kill someone over a CARTOON? Take a look at the signs on Michelle Malkin's site...http://www.michellemalkin.com/

I do not understand how Muslims can seriously demand tolerance for themselves but will not tolerate anyone else. That is just plain delusional. All I can say is, support the Danish and anyone else who is not cowering down to threats.

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It's ridiculous

by Dr Dij In reply to Tyranny of the offended

threatening to kill people for making fun of your religion threatening to kill people is simply re-enforcing stereotypes of many (not all) muslims as vicious intolerant terrorists.

the taliban spread their cause in afganistan by terror: join them and get rewarded with a wife and a couple acres, don't join them and die!

this is the yoke of religion using the common people. so in essence it is the fault of the mullahs in whipping up hatred. In the US we have separation of church and state. In the muslim world I'm hoping they can separate church and HATE!

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Remember a few years ago

by DMambo In reply to Tyranny of the offended

I'm too lazy to look it up, but there was an artist who depicted a crucifix in a vile of urine. This guy had received money from the National Endowment for the Arts. There were demands that the NEA be abolished. That's about it - calls for the government to stop funding an agency. No fatwah, no asassinations.

Religion should be about love, not hate. I know next to nothing about Islam, but your questions about who's calling for calm and tolerance are right on the mark.

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I remember that

by MirrorMirror In reply to Remember a few years ago

It was called "**** Christ". That was offensive. But, it was called art and protected as freedom of expression.

I am having a hard time believing that Islam can be twisted to be so hateful. I have a harder time believing that so very many people in the world will stand by and allow extremists to take over their religion.

I am really hoping that there are sane Mulsims out there. Will they allow the world to be forced into conflict because they refuse to reign in the negative forces in their midst?

I know that you, DMambo, cannot answer my questions. But, I just have to ask them otherwise I will never know.

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Islamofascists

by Dr Dij In reply to I remember that

They are not 'offended', they are simply brutal 'Islamofascists', which is I think the best word for them I've heard.

Radical clerics have been on a campaign of spreading agitprop lies to whip up support. The rioting was well planned, hardly 'spontaneous'. The radical clerics made up cartoons in addition to the 3 showing Muslim's prediliction for violence. And also spread lies such as saying the Danish don't allow Muslims to build mosques.

There have been hundreds of depictions of Mohammed including a Mohammed jokes book which we hardly heard a peep about. This is just made up BS, apparently an 'at will' re-interpretation of the Koran as other sects and at other times in history their prophet has been depicted many times. Instead it is really about hitting a nerve: the cartoons depict the reality that the radicals ARE very violent. Bizarre how threatening to be-head tourists would convince us otherswise.

The libertarian think-tank, CATO institute (cato.org) has an article where they see this as simple totalitarianizm rearing its ugly head.

Many Muslim country govts are very corrupt and brutal. But replacing them with brutal radical sects, whose idea of a fun day is lobbing grenades at priceless buddha statues, representing a religion that has never killed in its own name, is outlandish.

the moderates are spooked by the extremists. some have fled countries where they are likely to be killed simply for speaking their thoughts and calling for moderation.

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Lets be fair

by JamesRL In reply to Tyranny of the offended

In no way do I support anyone killing anyone, or issuing a fatwah or whatever for a comic.

These cartoons are inflamatory, no doubt. And they do nothing at all to contribute to generating understand and tolerance between Islam and other groups.

If you want to turn moderates into radicals, keep publishing this kind of thing, and you will succeed where are the terrorists have failed, by isolating western progressive muslims and making them identify more with their radical brothers than with their Christian next door neighbours.

And the Artist image is not an apt comparison - publishing a cartoon in a newspaper reaches potentially millions, and after it has been republished, tens of millions - and that does change the impact to the Muslim community.

But, and its a big but, the bigger evil would be to impose such strict censorship on everyone in the west that would prevent such things from being published.

Frankly what I have seen in reaction is not much condemnation for publishing such material. I don't believe that those picture on Malkin's website represent the views of the many progressive muslims living and working in my community. But in publishing that as the "muslim response" you further generalize and marginalize all muslims.

I'm not going to support the Danes for publishing cr@p. But I defend their right to do it.

James

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Death threats for a cartoon?

by Dr Dij In reply to Lets be fair

I don't see how you can say this deserves an inflamatory response.

You are saying muslims 1) have no sense of humor, 2) it would turn moderates into radicals? only if they were really stupid or brainwashed. unhappily I see this reponse of violence to indicate that the radical muslims ARE brainwashed by oppressive religion (and oppressive govts as 45 of 47 muslim countries are considered dictatorships).

If someone published a cartoon about the Pope? So what! doesn't matter how widely it is read. I don't see catholics rioting or the country of Ireland asking for another country's apology.

To raid the danish embassy? really bizarre and stupid. Are the mullah's really stupid enuf to think the danish govt instigated this? or that denmark is a dictatorship like their country where the govt can force censorship (so as not to offend people)?

Get a life, radical muslims. If they tried to build their country as hard as they are trying to kill people they'd be happy people. Moderate muslims: rise up and stop these radical horrors from rotting your religion and turing it into a world war.

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Re Read

by JamesRL In reply to Death threats for a carto ...

I said I didn't support the inflamatory response, but nor do I think we should be publishing cartoons that are inflammatory in the first place. But thats a matter of taste, I don't advocate censorship either, but people have to understand and be responsible for their actions.

The publishing of an image of Mohamed is forbidden in the Koran. And Mohamed is not the Pope, he is closer to Jesus for them.

As for turning moderates into radicals, let me ask you - if you were part of a small minority in your country, and someone published cartoons mocking your religion, would you feel more or less likely to engage in a dialogue with those who are of the majority opinion. If you are honest and thoughful about it, you would feel isolated and not as much a part of the country.

I don't support raiding the embassy or calling for anyone's death, and I was very clear about that.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that Islam is organizaed like say the Catholic church, it isn't as hierarchical and there is a wide range of opinion in the different sects. There are no official spokespeople.

I've seen enough people here get enraged when someone makes a comment about Bush, this to them is far worse.

The more you harangue about Radical muslims, the more the moderates think you are slamming all muslims.

James

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Didn't publish it in their country

by Dr Dij In reply to Re Read

at least the bulk of those who rioted were in countries where it was not published.

and if you'd re-read my post I specifically harangued only radical muslims. so we should just ignore radical muslims, hoping they'll go away, because we might offend moderates? that is the 'tyrrany of the offended'.

anyway, if I was a small minority, and the cartoon didn't advocate violence against me, I'd think it was dumb and say 'so what?' didn't you ever hear 'sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt me?'

so there are equivalents here: images of jesus in art gallery in non-flattering way. Am I going to riot? no. We have blasphemy laws in some states and last person to be prosecuted was in something like 1933 and it was overturned (see wikipedia entry on this event with links to history of free speech, blasphemy laws, etc.

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Kill 'em all, Let Allah sort 'em out.

by shraven In reply to Re Read

Me, I AM slamming all Muslims. If the reasonable ones aren't going to stand up to the radical one's, then they're just fanatics without the balls to carry out their convictions. (If you're not a part of the solution, then you're part of the problem.)
Nothing is hurting the Muslim community more than the Muslims themselves. Yes, we know they all don't want to decapitate all westerners, but they aren't doing anything to fix the problem. As a result westerners are having to go over and fix the problem, which of course just stirs up the radicals even more.
Any group which will not tolerate free speach - especially when spoken outside their soveriegn land - and retaliates with violence deserves to wiped from the face of the earth.
The Muslims (at least the radical ones) cling to an Old Testament view of right/wrong and punishment. So be it. In the Bible, when nations went to war, they killed every man woman and child from the enemy nation or enslaved the rest. So let's get busy. There is no doubt who has the might, so let's follow the Bible and kill them all...
Unless of course, they'd like to take a more reasonable approach and join the rest of the world in striving for peace and prosperity.

Hopefully you will catch the sacrasm in my "solution" but the fact stands that there is no excuse for their actions and somebody needs to stop them. If it won't be the Muslims, then they're in for a long period of foreign occupation as the rest of the world works to put and end to the threat of the jihad.

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and there lies

by rob mekel In reply to Kill 'em all, Let Allah s ...

the problem. Muslims can't condemn Jihad "warriors" because of this lies within their believes. To them it is the same as condemning Bush for the operations at Quantanamo bay prison. (why is it that this prison is not situated within a state of the USA)

They can, however, denounce the terrorists/terrorism and that they should do.

Rob

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